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LOEG: Black Dossier

comicgeek77comicgeek77 Registered User regular
edited December 2007 in Graphic Violence
i just finished reading it today. i have kind of mixed feelings about the book as a whole but i wanted to say that the 3D chapter looks fanfreakingtastic. i remember getting some 3D comics as a kid and how the effect never really looked right and would just end up giving me a headache. so i was sceptical about o'neil using 3D in this book but it looks amazing. i think that bit of artwork alone makes the book well worth the 30 bucks.

what did everybody else think of it?

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    It's been pretty amazing so far, but incredibly dense. Walls of text are hard to keep my place in sometimes.

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    DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Yeah, I really need to get this some time.

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    ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2007
    i think the way it segues between the actual dossier and the story is absolutely brilliant.

    also brilliant- the fact that it's pseudo-illegal

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    Calamity JaneCalamity Jane That Wrong Love Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    wait, what?

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    ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2007
    it's only allowed to be sold in the states, due to copyright issues

    supposedly you're not even allowed to ship it abroad, but that much is just hearsay from the dude in my comic shop

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    silkypeasilkypea Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    I was really surprised to see it was released with such little hype. I just remember all the hype surrounding vol. 2. I thought it would be about the same. It made me question the black dossier.

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Well it was delayed quite a bit, no doubt partly because they were slow in making it but also because no doubt there was some lawyer-wrangling to see if they could in fact release it outside the US.

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    WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Allegedly the DC lawyers gave it the green light, but someone in Editorial said no to international sales.

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    AnEvilHypnotistAnEvilHypnotist Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    They're not selling it over here in England, and I can't seem to order it either.

    Good thing I'm visiting the colonies next month, I'll pick it up then.

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    ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2007
    They're not selling it over here in England, and I can't seem to order it either.

    Good thing I'm visiting the colonies next month, I'll pick it up then.

    yeah, a friend of mine and i were wondering- if it really is illegal to ship it over there (which it sounds like it might be), does alan moore not get a copy?

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    mattharvestmattharvest Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    It's illegal to ship it for distribution (which means retailers cannot ship it as part of a sale to the UK). However, like many items which are illegal to sell into the UK, it is not illegal (nor a civil tort) to ship it as a gift or gratuity.

    This means that an American could ship it as a gift to a friend in the UK, but you cannot arrange for it to be shipped as part of a commercial transaction.

    So, Alan Moore receives it as a "gratuity", but he couldn't order it from Amazon.

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    mattharvestmattharvest Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Oh, to clarify for people: the Black Dossier uses characters who are in the public domain (or otherwise subject to fair use in satire or parody) in the United States, yet are not in the public domain (i.e. are privately licensed) in the UK and other territories.

    This means that selling it in those territories violates the intellectual property rights of the owners of those characters.

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    klokklok Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Would I need to know a lot of back story in order to understand what's going on? Or could I just jump right into it?

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    klok wrote: »
    Would I need to know a lot of back story in order to understand what's going on? Or could I just jump right into it?

    I think it would be confusing, although the events of the previous LoEG stories are summarized in part of the Dossier proper.

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    WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Oh, to clarify for people: the Black Dossier uses characters who are in the public domain (or otherwise subject to fair use in satire or parody) in the United States, yet are not in the public domain (i.e. are privately licensed) in the UK and other territories.

    This means that selling it in those territories violates the intellectual property rights of the owners of those characters.
    Exactly so. With a bit of tweaking of some of the names they may well have been in the clear, but presumably they didn't want to do that.

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    AnEvilHypnotistAnEvilHypnotist Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    klok wrote: »
    Would I need to know a lot of back story in order to understand what's going on? Or could I just jump right into it?
    I strongly advise you to read the two volumes of League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Not only will they give you background for this book, but they are, simply, awesome. I think they're Moore's best work.

    Whatever you do, don't let the film affect your judgment. There's no reason to watch it at all. It doesn't have the same characters (sure, they've got the same names, but none of the characterisations are the same) and the story is quite pathetic in comparison.

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    mattharvestmattharvest Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    Wildcat wrote: »
    Oh, to clarify for people: the Black Dossier uses characters who are in the public domain (or otherwise subject to fair use in satire or parody) in the United States, yet are not in the public domain (i.e. are privately licensed) in the UK and other territories.

    This means that selling it in those territories violates the intellectual property rights of the owners of those characters.
    Exactly so. With a bit of tweaking of some of the names they may well have been in the clear, but presumably they didn't want to do that.

    Well, in theory it could have helped. One of the key issues is James Bond, and the owners made it clear that if the character was clearly identifiable as Bond (even if named something else) they would have protested. Besides, Moore had already established the Bond lineage (beginning with Campion) while also integrating the M/Q naming scheme (it's worth pointing out that Q was never called Q in the books...).

    Realistically, I think Moore made the right choice, as the book is much more interesting with recognizable characters. I mean, isn't it better to have Bond talking about having sex with Emma Peel, instead of just a bunch of allusions?

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    the water methodthe water method Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    I think half the fun with this series is trying to figure out all the allusions in the books. Storywise, this is the weakest of the volumes, I thought. Maybe because they were forced to dance around all the stuff involving James Bond, Emma Peel, etcetera...? The mock Shakespeare was great, but I thought the Kerouac pastiche was pretty weak. Like he was trying too hard. I still wasn't disappointed, though. How could you be? There's so much material.

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    comicgeek77comicgeek77 Registered User regular
    edited November 2007
    sections of the book were pretty hit or miss for me. i enjoyed the 1984 setting, learning about the french league, prsopero, and the fanny hill stuff was cool because it added alot of new information about the previosly mentioned lemuel gulliver era league. james bond was pretty funny but i wish they would have just left his scenes to the start of the book. some of the other bits like orlando and sal paradise kinda dragged along a little too long for my tastes. but overall i thought the book was a fun read and that the art/presentation style was gorgeous. the 3d art was the high point for me, but all of the little touches like the hand written notes on the pages of the dossier and the tijuana bible stapled in were really cool. apparently the book was supposed to come with a record and a secret decoder ring that would have been needed to decipher certain bits of the text but DC nixed those to save money which i think is a real shame. i think most readers would have gladly paid for those extra touches. i did read an interview with alan moore saying that they may be included in a future absolute edition. if so i might be inclined to buy the book again and maybe smuggle my copy over to one of our UK friends.

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    ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited December 2007
    i have to say, the combination of h.p. lovecraft and p.g. wodehouse is one of the funniest ideas i think alan moore could possibly have

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    WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Well, it's been done before.

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    ServoServo Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited December 2007
    don't make you eat my shorts, wildcat

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    WildcatWildcat Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    Do I get tabasco?

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    UndefinedMonkeyUndefinedMonkey Registered User regular
    edited December 2007
    I finished this last night. Holy crap the
    Yuggoth emissary

    was the best part of the 3D section. It was the first point in the section where the 3D glasses really seemed like a necessary thing. Also, I made a happy little screaming noise when I looked at the Dossier's table of contents and noticed a passage by the Rt. Hon. Bertram Wooster. I was hoping for a little more connection between Fink-Nottle, his prized collection of newts, and the Great Old Ones, but I'm not going to complain. And I could have sworn I saw a Thunderbirds craft at the spaceport. There was so much awesomeness in such a tiny volume.

    Anyone else think that Moore's depiction of Bond is a not-so-subtle jab at Connery for ruining the League movie?

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