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D&D 4th Edition: 1 day until multiclassing Preview. (38)

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    GungHoGungHo Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    GungHo wrote: »
    As regards Prestige Classes one of the big issues is that Design Policy shifted about halfway through 3.5. There is no way you can say that Eldritch Knight and Abjurant Champion are balanced with regards to each other.

    Aren't they in the same book? Or is that your point?
    Uh...no? One is in the DMG one is in Complete Mage. They are apart by about 3 years of time and it very much shows.

    Also, first prestige class? Druid. 1st edition DMG. (Kinda)
    I realized that in the shower last night. I got it confused with the two "Eldritch" PrCs in Complete Mage and thought you were talking about the Eldritch Thaumaturge, specifically (which is, btw, completely insane).

    GungHo on
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    fadingathedgesfadingathedges Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    GungHo wrote: »
    I realized that in the shower last night.

    It's the little things make all the difference. :lol:


    here is the paragon article, for anyone else who is also deficient and has to google to find anything on the wotc site.
    http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4ex/20080423a


    This has me curious about multi-classing. I get the impression that if you need a paragon tier ability to learn "equip chainmail", then things are a bit more (realistically?) paced as far as what you can learn in the span of time the PC's go from 1-5-10-etc. It goes to follow that multi-classing might not be an option, at least as we have known it. Is there material on this out there?

    PS - this one goes to 30.

    fadingathedges on
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    delrolanddelroland Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    GungHo wrote: »
    Dammit, and I wanted to talk about alignment languages.

    Wow, I forgot about those... :P

    delroland on
    EVE: Online - the most fun you will ever have not playing a game.
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    GungHoGungHo Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    delroland wrote: »
    GungHo wrote: »
    Dammit, and I wanted to talk about alignment languages.

    Wow, I forgot about those... :P
    I speak Chaotic Good to strippers. The ones that reply in Chaotic Neutral aren't worth the trouble and will jack your car.

    GungHo on
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    LardalishLardalish Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I get the impression that if you need a paragon tier ability to learn "equip chainmail", then things are a bit more (realistically?) paced as far as what you can learn in the span of time the PC's go from 1-5-10-etc.

    Are you talking about that feat in there talking about Chainmail Specialization? Im pretty sure thats just a feat that makes you better with chainmail. It says "+1 to AC with chainmail, reduce check penalty by 1" which sounds to me like you already have proficiency, and you're just getting better with it.

    Lardalish on
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    IncenjucarIncenjucar VChatter Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Ohgod ohgod ohgod

    "Forgotten Realms 4e is three books, period, done, end of line: Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Player’s Guide to FR, and DM’s Guide to FR. All settings will be done like that, one per year, until they run out of settings. They mentioned Greyhawk, Ravenloft, Dark Sun, and Spelljammer as settings on their list! Eberron, of course, is the ‘09 setting release (same three books), but it will also get DDI updates starting in June."

    Gygax is in Celestia and he is smiling down on us.

    Incenjucar on
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Dark Sun.

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    IncenjucarIncenjucar VChatter Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Dark Sun.

    Dude.

    They're even going to do Spelljammer.

    If they'll do Spelljammer, who knows what kind of crazy they'll do.

    Incenjucar on
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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Yes. Dark Sun, Greyhawk and Spell Jammer all make DA happy. I'd like some Al ad Quim as well but that might take a while.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    Mike DangerMike Danger "Diane..." a place both wonderful and strangeRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Ohgod ohgod ohgod

    "Forgotten Realms 4e is three books, period, done, end of line: Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Player’s Guide to FR, and DM’s Guide to FR. All settings will be done like that, one per year, until they run out of settings. They mentioned Greyhawk, Ravenloft, Dark Sun, and Spelljammer as settings on their list! Eberron, of course, is the ‘09 setting release (same three books), but it will also get DDI updates starting in June."

    Gygax is in Celestia and he is smiling down on us.

    :shock:

    I just had a little shiver run up my spine. Please don't let this suck.

    Mike Danger on
    Steam: Mike Danger | PSN/NNID: remadeking | 3DS: 2079-9204-4075
    oE0mva1.jpg
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    HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Dark Sun.

    Dude.

    They're even going to do Spelljammer.

    If they'll do Spelljammer, who knows what kind of crazy they'll do.

    i was only in a spelljammer adventure once, but i remember it being wonderfully ridiculous

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
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    Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous Blame this on the misfortune of your birth. New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Ohgod ohgod ohgod

    "Forgotten Realms 4e is three books, period, done, end of line: Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Player’s Guide to FR, and DM’s Guide to FR. All settings will be done like that, one per year, until they run out of settings. They mentioned Greyhawk, Ravenloft, Dark Sun, and Spelljammer as settings on their list! Eberron, of course, is the ‘09 setting release (same three books), but it will also get DDI updates starting in June."

    Gygax is in Celestia and he is smiling down on us.

    :shock:

    I just had a little shiver run up my spine. Please don't let this suck.
    dear god what's the source on that?!?

    Der Waffle Mous on
    Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: DerWaffle#1682
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    MaticoreMaticore A Will To Power Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=224516

    I like it. Three is simple and sweet without drowning you in content, but also gives a good amount of depth.

    Maticore on
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    IncenjucarIncenjucar VChatter Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Planescape has also been mentioned.

    <3

    This is so awesome.

    4E seems to be awesome in every respect except for the horrible writing and editing.

    :P

    Incenjucar on
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    NORNOR Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I'll take an official and updated version of Ravenloft please.

    NOR on
    Swehehehehehahahahahahahahahawhawhawhaw
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    DarmakDarmak RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I've never played D&D before but I love the Dark Sun, Planescape, and Forgotten Realms settings. If they get remade I'll be a very, very happy nerd. :D

    Darmak on
    JtgVX0H.png
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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You want to know how multiclassing works? For you, I give.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    Professor PhobosProfessor Phobos Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Oh man, if they just take Dark Sun straight out of the very first boxed set, and ignore the crappy metaplot and horrible second edition...

    Just that first boxed set, with that grim sketch of a world...

    Professor Phobos on
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    LeshanLeshan Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Planescape has also been mentioned.

    <3

    This is so awesome.

    4E seems to be awesome in every respect except for the horrible writing and editing.

    :P

    The new Planescape WILL be before the Faction War.

    The new Planescape WILL be before the Faction War.

    The new Planescape WILL be before the Faction War.

    Remember people, belief can shape reality; so as long as we believe it that's how it's going to be.

    Leshan on
    Character Sheet for Silver Squadron game: Kalen
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    OhtheVogonityOhtheVogonity Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You want to know how multiclassing works? For you, I give.

    Nice find.

    I think I like it. It allows a lot of dabbling. You can make the character that you want without having to negotiate arcane rulesets or waiting until 8th level or whatever.

    It's interesting that they've so strictly defined the roles and built the classes to fill the roles perfectly, but allow you to do what you like with very little restriction.

    That's awesome.

    Edit: Found this in the Paragon Paths preview:
    Alternatively if you wish, you can also select powers from a second class in place of a paragon path. That’s described in the information on multiclassing, and something we’ll cover in a future preview article.)
    Another way to multiclass but without burning feats, I guess.

    OhtheVogonity on
    Oh freddled gruntbuggly...thy micturations are to me/ As plurdled gabbleblotchits on a lurgid bee
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    zerg rushzerg rush Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Leshan wrote: »
    The new Planescape WILL be before the Faction War.

    What faction war?

    There was no Faction War. It never existed and never will exist.

    zerg rush on
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    LeshanLeshan Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    zerg rush wrote: »
    What faction war?

    There was no Faction War. It never existed and never will exist.

    Ahhh, I like how you think cutter. You have the dark of it.

    Leshan on
    Character Sheet for Silver Squadron game: Kalen
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    delrolanddelroland Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I wonder if they'll "one-book" the less supported campaigns, like Birthright, Red Steel, and Mystara.

    delroland on
    EVE: Online - the most fun you will ever have not playing a game.
    "Go up, thou bald head." -2 Kings 2:23
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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Well at 1 a year we'll be deep into 4.5 by the time they get there....

    DevoutlyApathetic on
    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    delrolanddelroland Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Oh, I also call dibs on the Giff character. :P

    delroland on
    EVE: Online - the most fun you will ever have not playing a game.
    "Go up, thou bald head." -2 Kings 2:23
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    HawkstoneHawkstone Don't sweat the petty things, and don't pet the sweaty things. Somewhere outside of BarstowRegistered User regular
    edited April 2008
    3.x was clearly lacking in the hippoman department,nice to see they recognized such a glaring oversight.

    Hawkstone on
    Inside of a dog...it's too dark to read.
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    GungHoGungHo Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Incenjucar wrote: »
    Ohgod ohgod ohgod

    "Forgotten Realms 4e is three books, period, done, end of line: Forgotten Realms Campaign Guide, Player’s Guide to FR, and DM’s Guide to FR. All settings will be done like that, one per year, until they run out of settings. They mentioned Greyhawk, Ravenloft, Dark Sun, and Spelljammer as settings on their list! Eberron, of course, is the ‘09 setting release (same three books), but it will also get DDI updates starting in June."

    Gygax is in Celestia and he is smiling down on us.
    Part of me is a little :( that Realmslore is going to be relegated to novels and, I guess, digital, but it may be easier on the wallet (and easier for WotC to QC). On the other hand, getting stuff for Dark Sun and Spelljammer again will be great.

    GungHo on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Also, do you really need all those FR books?

    I mean, shit, I bought the entire 3.5 FR line.

    The whole line. I got every single book.

    Did I need them? No. Especially the various regional books. If I didn't set a campaign there, or if they never went there during a campaign, they were pretty useless.

    Pony on
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    ToothyToothy Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Oh god, maybe I could play a Thri-keen without having stupid restrictions on my character. Do you guys think they'll keep muls with the decision to keep half-orcs out?

    Toothy on
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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    The more I think about it the more I think I approve of the "Hit and Run" campaign books. Give enough that you can easily keep going if a DM wants without all the heavy lifting of a building a setting from scratch then move on to publishing something else.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    I wonder how long before they release 4.5?

    Thanatos on
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    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Thanatos wrote: »
    I wonder how long before they release 4.5?

    Never, according to WotC. They didn't like how the 3.5 situation played out.

    'course whether they'll stick to that or not is anyone's guess.

    Undead Scottsman on
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    tastydonutstastydonuts Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    It'd really depend on the response to 4th. A lot of 3.5 was balancing/etc due to complaints and all.

    tastydonuts on
    “I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
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    fadingathedgesfadingathedges Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    You want to know how multiclassing works? For you, I give.

    Before I clicked this link, I wrote down three words and sealed them in an envelope. The words were "All My Dicks"
    Ok, multiclassing is done entirely through feats. You take one feat to multiclass and gain a power from that class, and then take additional feats to take more powers from the class.

    I was right.

    fadingathedges on
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    Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Now that I think about it, doesn't that contradict the info from the Paragon Path article?
    (Alternatively if you wish, you can also select powers from a second class in place of a paragon path. That’s described in the information on multiclassing, and something we’ll cover in a future preview article.)

    That seems like an alternative to doing it through feats, as you get powers as you would from a Paragon Path. Meaning multiclassing wouldn't be "entirely" done through feats.

    Undead Scottsman on
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    Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Yes, but one of those things is an article on Wizard's site and one of those things is a rumour some guy posted on a forum somewhere.

    I know which one I reckon will be more accurate.

    Mr_Rose on
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    GungHoGungHo Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Pony wrote: »
    Also, do you really need all those FR books?

    I mean, shit, I bought the entire 3.5 FR line.

    The whole line. I got every single book.

    Did I need them? No. Especially the various regional books. If I didn't set a campaign there, or if they never went there during a campaign, they were pretty useless.
    I still liked having them, even if they were useless.

    GungHo on
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    ToothyToothy Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    The thing that rubs me the wrong way, is this means there's going to be a bajillion base classes. Oh they did that last edition, too? Well, at least this means that in order to pick silly powers you have to lose something for it...although, what does this mean for retraining?

    Do you think if you pick a multiclass feat retraining doesn't care about it and you get a whole new feat? Or do you think they made it "lock you in" to that class and you merely choose a different power.

    Also, if the multiclass power doesn't really ever update, it'll suck by the time you get halfway through your tier, right? Questions, questions.

    Toothy on
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    Kin33Kin33 Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Toothy wrote: »
    The thing that rubs me the wrong way, is this means there's going to be a bajillion base classes. Oh they did that last edition, too? Well, at least this means that in order to pick silly powers you have to lose something for it...although, what does this mean for retraining?

    Do you think if you pick a multiclass feat retraining doesn't care about it and you get a whole new feat? Or do you think they made it "lock you in" to that class and you merely choose a different power.

    Also, if the multiclass power doesn't really ever update, it'll suck by the time you get halfway through your tier, right? Questions, questions.

    I think you just get 1 multiclass power per feat you take and if you retrain that feat you lose that power.

    Kin33 on
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    PonyPony Registered User regular
    edited April 2008
    Kin33 wrote: »
    Toothy wrote: »
    The thing that rubs me the wrong way, is this means there's going to be a bajillion base classes. Oh they did that last edition, too? Well, at least this means that in order to pick silly powers you have to lose something for it...although, what does this mean for retraining?

    Do you think if you pick a multiclass feat retraining doesn't care about it and you get a whole new feat? Or do you think they made it "lock you in" to that class and you merely choose a different power.

    Also, if the multiclass power doesn't really ever update, it'll suck by the time you get halfway through your tier, right? Questions, questions.

    I think you just get 1 multiclass power per feat you take and if you retrain that feat you lose that power.

    That's probably accurate.

    However, the initial multiclass feat (like, the opener one you take) should add proficiencies or one of the class features or something.

    Pony on
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