Booth babes at pax?

spec

There is an interesting discussion going on in the irc channel about this. Let's get some discussion going here, too:

How does the community in general feel about Booth Babes? Personally I think they are demeaning and take away from the focus of community, comraderie and gaming. How do others feel?

What counts as a "Booth Babe"? My personal feeling is that a booth babe is someone who is dressed up in a skimpy outfit and has no knowledge of the game they are there to promote, and also no knowledge of gaming in general. If all they are there for is to attract young male gamers to the booth, and serve no other useful function, I think that they are a distraction to what PAX is about.

Did you feel like any of the women in the expo hall were booth babes? I don't know, what do you guys think? I didnt have the time or inclination to try to talk to any of the scantily clad ladies I saw there this year, so I can't say for certain if they fit with my definition of the term. I really hope that they were there to talk about the product and to help promote it by giving others knowledge of it, but I wasn't able to talk to any of them to find out. What do you guys think?

ariocksayssquee

Posted here originally:
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=6880012&postcount=17

c0d3h4x0r wrote: »

The few booth babes we saw were all in good taste.

Seattle Times wrote:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/entertainment/2008132156_pennyarcade24.html
"And to keep the focus on gaming, Khoo aims on being respectful. There are no "booth babes" — scantily clad models dressed as video-game heroines..."

I think booth babes in general are in poor taste.

Good Taste is having an attractive person who is a part of the team who knows all about the game and gamer culture.
Poor Taste is having a hired model who has been recently briefed on the game and knows next to nothing about the culture.

Of course, I sometimes like things that are in poor taste (South Park and Robot Chicken both come to mind).

But the kind of winking "no booth babes" nudge nudge seems like it's been getting more and more blatant every year, and at some point I think PA ought to drop the "no booth babes" pretense and be honest about not caring about booth babes, or enforce the rule and kick out the vendors who have a high model:developer ratio.

I don't care if there are half-naked booth babes or fully clothed booth babes or booth babes encased in weighted companion cubes or no booth babes at all, but shouldn't the pretense that there's something different here be dropped?

Altima NEO

A lot of the girls were really cute. I liked them. Though the girls in the back across the Brothers in Arms booth looked really bored (I couldnt tell what they were trying to promote, didnt look like a game) and were going off to flirt with the Brothers in Arms booth-boys. They were the cutest though.

The girls at the Midnight Club booth were really cool. I didnt talk to them about the game, but she seemed genuinely excited about getting people to play. She was cheering me on telling me to try and hit a jump near the end of the track.

But yeah, most of the booths are usually run by marketing types who dont really know much about the games they are promoting to begin with. Using girls to do the same plus attract attention doesnt seem that bad to me. And I dont find it demeaning, considering thats what these girls do for a living.

In the end though, I think most guys were too timid or shy to approach the booth girls. And most of the time I saw people passing the girls and heading straight for the games, minus the few guys trying to get a photo taken.

Nijhazer

It doesn't matter whether the presenter is male or female. When you, as a publisher, hire someone to represent your product that actually doesn't know or give a shit about your product, it reflects poorly on your product. This is especially true at PAX, where most of the attendees are there because they have genuine enthusiasm for the games on display. If you want to speak to that audience, bring in people who also have genuine enthusiasm for the games on display, like the folks at the Rock Band booth who were there all day every day playing Rock Band with the other attendees.

This is getting into a broader subject than this thread intended, but the concept of a "booth babe" is somewhat contrary to what most core gamers expect. Female gamers are becoming more common, but historically they've been so rare that whenever a woman is brought in to represent a game, we assume she doesn't actually want to be there, and our only response is to pity her-- not exactly what the publisher was hoping to achieve.

tr0tsky

I don't know about "more blatant every year". Last year there was the woman dressed up as a pirate for the game I can't remember...but I talked to her about it and she was awesome to talk to. I don't remember any from 06 at all, although that might just be my failing memory.

This year there was like...10-20 at least. It just seemed...I dunno...scuzzy. I will say though, that I didn't try to talk to any of them, besides a couple minutes with the "high elf" from the CMV (?) booth while she got back into her armour, but we weren't talking about the booth or anything besides how heavy armour is when you have to wear it all day.

FatimusPrime

Based on what I saw and over heard, some of them were actually there to promote and spread knowledge about the game. However, I didn't see a lot of that. Ive always understood the concept of the "Booth Babe" as being part of the "show" experience and to be there to give the game some kind of physical presence. That only works though if it makes sense. For example, the Resent Generation booth had a purpose to having those girls, but if you walked by say Bungie and saw that, it doesn't make much sense at all. Majority of the time, they are there purely for eye candy and understand it as such, at least I hope. xD But I feel that having them for the sake of having them is not very sensible. But having them there to give information and be the voice of the game is a much better way to do it in my opinion.

Misterioso

whats wrong with booth babes? I was kind of surprised that so many of the booth babes were just standing there looking pretty bored because nobody would approach them. I went and got my pic taken with judy nails, she was cool.

tr0tsky

The Reset Generation women were actually there playing the game with people and showing them how to do stuff. They were awesome. Women (or men, I saw a guy with a "Male Booth Hottie" sign and laughed) who are dressed up at their booth but there for a purpose are awesome.

jonxp

Misterioso wrote: »

whats wrong with booth babes? I was kind of surprised that so many of the booth babes were just standing there looking pretty bored because nobody would approach them. I went and got my pic taken with judy nails, she was cool.

The problem with Booth Babes is they bring nothing to the convention. They're there only to attract men to the booths with sex appeal. They don't know anything about the games, and give the whole enterprise a sleazier feel for those of us who are actually here for the content.

Buraisu

Like you said, as long as they know the game they are promoting and have knowledge of gaming culture, I think it's fine. Otherwise, it's kind of sad... sad for all parties. Though, I don't recall seeing anyone like that.

Mandarista

I too think booth babes are in poor taste.
Thing is, it all depends on where the focus lies: the game itself, or the "jiggle factor".

Honestly, PAX really is just about the only game convention that actually deserves respect as far as not going too far with the booth babe thing.

If the folks who run the booth happen to be attractive, and attempt to play that up, then that's ok.
But hiring some "babe" (subjective...) to just stand there in a skimpy costume and take (often suggestively posed) photos with people is just pathetic.

There's nothing wrong with attempting to make the game more appealing to gamers, but there seems to be a depressingly prevailing stereotype that the "target" gamer is an overly-hormonal teenage male.
Honestly, game devs/reps/whatever that continually seem to just not "get it" make me lose interest in their products entirely.
And I know I'm not the only one out there who is repulsed by the idea of sex selling a video game.
Hopefully those ones catch on and try to widen their appeal to a larger target audience.

PAX still seems to have a good family friendly atmosphere going on.
I strongly encourage its organizers to try and keep it that way.
I hope to god PAX never turns into the trash that is Leipzig (and formerly E3)....
That's not a game con. It's a porn con.

citius

Thanks for posting the quote from Robert, I knew I had seen that somewhere. I kept thinking about that quote every time I walked around the expo.

I'm not a fan. It's manipulative and reinforces the stereotype that gaming is only for sex starved 15 year old boys. Obviously I enjoy seeing the women. It's kind of in my genes. But I don't like being manipulated, so I make it a point not to visit these booths. Most of them look so bored that they're not all that hot, anyway.

Schrodinger

The N-Gage booth was probably the most interesting case example.

On the one hand, you had girls there who didn't know anything about the games, the characters, etc.

On the other hand, I saw one girl there who was so involved in the game that you could hardly pry her away from it.

I think that the Judy nails concept was that you challenge Judy in gameplay. So that was good.

I spoke briefly to the Flying Frog people, and from the sounds of it, the models are actually incorporated into the game itself. I think they posed for the game cards within the game or something (I don't play board games, so I'm not sure). So that would be equivalent to talking to the voice actors of a game.

Raptor007

I don't know why people would complain about cute booth babes. Are most gamers that uncomfortable around attractive females??

I will say, if they don't look happy to be there, they shouldn't be.

ShiNoKaze

I stood in line to play Saint's Row 2 for like 5 minutes before started playing and in the 5 minutes I was there like 10 different guys all tried various different approaches to the vacant eyed blonde at the corner of that booth. The only game insight I got from her was "Have you played the first one?" And I was like "No, that's why I'd like to see what it's like." I think her script ran out at that point. I chatted with her a bit about how many guys were trying to hit on her and she talked about some of the crazier guys, but nothing about the games at her booth. She mentioned she wanted to be an actress and that kinda made it obvious the fact most were just hired for looks. Maybe it was just that booth, but not from what people here are saying. Kinda disappointing.

angelkatie9

I am not a huge fan of using attractive, scantily-clad women to attract people to a game (unless that is the selling point of the game in the first place) . If people are interested in the game they will gravitate towards it anyway. And like someone mentioned before, some of the gamers just ignored the girls altogether and headed right for the demos.

I do agree that it would be better, if companies decide to implement booth babes, that they should know more than the basics about the games they are promoting. It enhances the promotion and gives them more purpose than just being eye candy for passer-bys.

That said, I rather enjoy seeing them there if only for the fact their costumes tend to kick a lot of ass. They are professionally made, and are not always two pieces of fabric stretched together.

For example, the girl at the Sins of a Solar Empire booth blew my mind. Her outfit was simple, but coupled with the creepy contacts she really pulled off the look great - AND she was playing the part. That was awesome.

Also, I do think it should be taken into account that a lot of these girls are cosplaying characters that are designed to be skimpy. The characters themselves are wearing barely nothing or ridiculously placed armor. It's not as though the girls themselves chose what to wear. They were paid to put on this costume and pose at this booth for pictures. So, if there is a problem with how scanty their clothing is it might be that the complaints could be just as easily directed at the game creators themselves. But that's a whoooole other subject.

And on a female-gamer note.....I wouldn't mind some more guys promoting games in costume. I only saw a couple...but some of the casual cosplayers ... like the Umbrella Corp Soldier.... were equally as awesome as the girls at the booths if not better!

ChangusMcCloud

spec wrote: »

How does the community in general feel about Booth Babes? Personally I think they are demeaning and take away from the focus of community, comraderie and gaming. How do others feel?

Demeaning, I agree. But demeaning to us, the attendees, not the girls.

Houn

My only stipulation is that they KNOW THE GAME. I don't care how skimpy your outfit is as long as you can pick up the controller and show me something cool.

Know the Product.

Druhim

I'm not a fan of booth babes either. I realize sex often sells, but I still don't care for companies that rely on them to draw attention to their product. Unless of course it's entirely fitting for the game in question, but most of the time it's not.

tr0tsky

Houn wrote: »

My only stipulation is that they KNOW THE GAME. I don't care how skimpy your outfit is as long as you can pick up the controller and show me something cool.

Know the Product.

LFT

SecCom

I met several attractive girls who were actually quite cool. The Ubisoft booth probably gets the most props for cute girls who were fun and a couple of them seemed to know what was going on with the games. I was more into the "booth babes" who were cute yet not like pronounced about being a booth babe, such as the girls at Razr and Ubisoft. I think it was the N-gage booth with the arcade machines that had all the really skinny girls in scantilly clad outfits...sure they were cute, but they seemed pretty bored with the whole thing...plus I wasn't really interested in that booth so I didn't bother talking to them.

Tip to companies designing their booths: just get gamer girls, they know whats going on, are much more fun to talk to, and many out there are very cute If you can't find them then don't resort to the hot girls that would rather not be there.

Schrodinger

I remember I was at the mall a while back, where there was a kiosk set up to display the nintendo Wii. There were two girls there (not Booth babes) who was demoing the games.

Anyway, I was playing the new Metroid, and I was completely stuck.

On the tutorial.

Yeah, I suck at games.

Anyway, I asked the two girls for help, and you know what? Neither of them knew what to do.

In the tutorial.

(Bangs head on wall)

Needless to say, I didn't buy one.

BTW, I didn't have time to talk to the Blades girl, but what did everyone think of her? Considering how much time they put into their minigame, it would be a shame if their model didn't know the product.

altmann

I'm going to be looking at the game regardless.

Why not have some hot chick to take a picture of?

That's about all they're good for. And they totally pose so it's kinda nice.

tr0tsky

altmann wrote: »

That's about all they're good for. And they totally pose so it's kinda nice.

...I don't really have anything to say to that...it's just too asinine.

Misterioso

jonxp wrote: »

Misterioso wrote: »

whats wrong with booth babes? I was kind of surprised that so many of the booth babes were just standing there looking pretty bored because nobody would approach them. I went and got my pic taken with judy nails, she was cool.

The problem with Booth Babes is they bring nothing to the convention. They're there only to attract men to the booths with sex appeal. They don't know anything about the games, and give the whole enterprise a sleazier feel for those of us who are actually here for the content.

How about all of the countless video games, covers and ads with big tittied amazons in their skin tighties ready to save the world with a camel toe? Was bikini-mail really as popular in the dark ages as I have been led to believe? Are we also protesting the never ending progress to improve realtime bouncing breast physics? has anyone never wasted some time messing with game camera angles to get a better peek at Peaches pink or Crofts crack? Installed "the patch" to see "a patch?"

Maybe we should collectively burn all of our Boris Vallejo shirts in protest next year when Morgan Webb arrives.

spec

altmann wrote: »

That's about all they're good for. And they totally pose so it's kinda nice.

Vile.

HotSake

I liked Fallout 3's booth babes, myself.

jonxp

Misterioso wrote: »

jonxp wrote: »

Misterioso wrote: »

whats wrong with booth babes? I was kind of surprised that so many of the booth babes were just standing there looking pretty bored because nobody would approach them. I went and got my pic taken with judy nails, she was cool.

The problem with Booth Babes is they bring nothing to the convention. They're there only to attract men to the booths with sex appeal. They don't know anything about the games, and give the whole enterprise a sleazier feel for those of us who are actually here for the content.

How about all of the countless video games, covers and ads with big tittied amazons in their skin tighties ready to save the world with a camel toe? Was bikini-mail really as popular in the dark ages as I have been led to believe? Are we also protesting the never ending progress to improve realtime bouncing breast physics? has anyone never wasted some time messing with game camera angles to get a better peek at Peaches pink or Crofts crack? Installed "the patch" to see "a patch?"

Maybe we should collectively burn all of our Boris Vallejo shirts in protest next year when Morgan Webb arrives.

Believe it or not, some of us grow out of that.

tr0tsky

Misterioso wrote: »

How about all of the countless video games, covers and ads with big tittied amazons in their skin tighties ready to save the world with a camel toe?

We're not talking about print ads and games in general. PAX has had a policy against having booth-babes solely for the purpose of being hot, at least that was my understanding. This year it didn't seem to be the case.

That's what we're talking about.

Haterot

Booth Bimbo = vacant eyed model hired to attract male demographic to the booth in order to entice them to buy said product.

Booth babe = knowledgeable employee/model dressed in character of said game who can tell you what you need to know.

I got no problem with Booth Babes, the other, meh. The PAX community sees through that shit, this ain't E3.

altmann

Trotsky... did i meet you in real life? I was hanging with a bunch of canadians. You all look alike so I'm not sure. But seriously, I saw your avatar like.... EVERYWHERE.

Astayonix

I personally have no problem with booth babes. Booth babes gotta eat too :P. But it was kind of wierd going into the ladies room in the Expo Hall on Friday afternoon and seeing so many girls in there adjusting thier ... costumes ^_^ in anticipation of the mad crush of guys. I didn't really care, but it was something that I'm just not used to seeing at PAX. I thought they had a strict no booth babe policy. If they don't, then yeah, they need to stop pretending like they do. PAX had a very different feel this year. Not bad, just different. Primarily because with the death of E3 more of the vendors want to reach out to their audience in a way that they're most comfortable with (which would be using women to get men to flock to them). If that's the way they wanna do it, good for them. I'd be a hypocrite if I complained about ladies showing a little skin. If they get paid to market using their looks, fine. Of course, it's a FAR better marketing strategy to send someone who KNOWS SOMETHING about your product, but it's their call.

angelkatie9

HotSake wrote: »

I liked Fallout 3's booth babes, myself.

OMG...they were so hawt

jonxp

angelkatie9 wrote: »

HotSake wrote: »

I liked Fallout 3's booth babes, myself.

OMG...they were so hawt

*rimshot*

trickycoolj

I'm not a big fan of "booth babes" or using scantily clad women to sell. If she's dressed like a character in the game that happens to be scantily clad I expect her to have lots of knowledge to offer on the game.

The girls at the N-gage (across from Brothers in Arms) completely distracted the guy in my group every time we walked by. He thought one of them was so hot. On Sunday he finally talked to one to get a picture, turns out she wasn't very knowledgeable about the game, didn't sound like she had much going on in the head at all, and barely spoke English. Had their costumes had more effort put into them so I could recognize that they were supposed to be from the game they were representing and they had knowledge of what they showed, I probably wouldn't have cared.

The Fragdolls at Ubisoft were cool. I didn't know who they were until one of my friends explained them to me (my first pax I'm a little naive still). I was glad to see respectable girls who kick ass at pretty much everything out there running a booth. I was also glad that when they handed me a raffle ticket and I asked what they were giving out and they replied a 250gb external drive that I got excited and they shared in my excitement. Who doesn't need one of those?!

Gwyddia

I saw the four booth babes who were dressed like Vegas showgirls in different-colored dressed undressing in the ladies' room at 5:30pm on Sunday. They were classless - covering the room with their shit, not ducking into a stall to change, and talking garbage about the con attendees the whole time.

Aliasunknown

One of the gals at the Astro headphones booth kept putting stickers on me, to the point where I had to say 'OK, that's enough, stop putting these damned stickers on me' to which she replied by placing a sticker on each of my nipples...


I don't know where I was going with that. Um, no booth babes please? Or at least no booth babes who deface your stuff with stickers? Yeah, I'm gonna shut up now.

BrokenAngel

I had this argument last year already so I will stick with this simple line: DO NOT WANT

tr0tsky

altmann wrote: »

Trotsky... did i meet you in real life? I was hanging with a bunch of canadians. You all look alike so I'm not sure. But seriously, I saw your avatar like.... EVERYWHERE.

Well, I did pass out 120 or so buttons, and they were fairly recognizable

Here's a pic of me (from Facebook profile..but it's all I have at work). Your name seems familiar, but I dunno. When were you hanging with the Canadians?

Schrodinger

I think that it's a two way street. Booth Babes need to be knowledgeable about the product.

With that said, guys need to be more respectful around them, and do a better job of presenting themselves. Shower, dress appropriate, and actually talk to them like a real person. Ask for her name, rather than "Can, I, uh... have my picture with you? 'k, thnx, bye." Assume that you're going to want to have your picture taken with people before you arrive, and prepare appropriately. Show that you're a better class of fan, who deserves a better class of booth babe.

The N-Gage girls tell me that they were hired the day of the expo. I'm sure they weren't the only ones. If the booths are going to use the booth babe as their main draw, then at the very least, they need to plan things a bit earlier than that, so that they can at least sit the booth babe down to play the game before they start.

Astayonix

Schrodinger wrote: »

I think that it's a two way street. Booth Babes need to be knowledgeable about the product.

With that said, guys need to be more respectful around them, and do a better job of presenting themselves. Shower, dress appropriate, and actually talk to them like a real person. Ask for her name, rather than "Can, I, uh... have my picture with you? 'k, thnx, bye." Assume that you're going to want to have your picture taken with people before you arrive, and prepare appropriately. Show that you're a better class of fan, who deserves a better class of booth babe.

The N-Gage girls tell me that they were hired the day of the expo. I'm sure they weren't the only ones. If the booths are going to use the booth babe as their main draw, then at the very least, they need to plan things a bit earlier than that, so that they can at least sit the booth babe down to play the game before they start.

I do remember seeing a flurry of CL ads for booth babes right before PAX, so yeah, that's generally how they're found. On the fly online.