From my (admittedly limited) experience with DnDO I have to say that it felt very generic. I mean, if you look at it from a technical stand-point they basically took the idea of instancing to a physcotic level. What's worse is the fact that there's no randomization to the instancing, so once you beat something one time there's really no incentive to go back and do it again aside from farming for "phat loot" or cash. Of course, you could argue that many modern day main-stream MMO's do that, but still, there has to be something to do aside from running the same damn quest over and over again. It also doesn't help things that some of the more unique classes (Rogues/Thieves?) were pretty much rendered pointless once people knew the trap layout of the dungeons.
I'm suprised they haven't fixed the static nature of dungeons yet. If they can't fix the ones already in the game, they could at least fix the new ones. Though they did randomize the loot in an absolutely retarded way. Sometimes the rewards would be crappy starter-level stuff and then the next time it would be an Ass-Kicking Sword of Newb Bane +3. Though, I heard they nerfed it so that all the quests gave crappy rewards and basically crippled anybody who hadn't already went through multiple times to get good equipment.
It's not just that they need to fix, they really need to fix the environment of this game. Let's make a comparison between DnDO and Guild Wars, two games that rely completely on instancing. Guild Wars, while a free game, has massive, expansive environments that are readily available at any time. I can step out of LA and be in a huge wilderness zone created entirely for my enjoyment. In contrast to that is the claustrophobic corridors of DnDO. While it would work great for instancing if the atmosphere was pulled off properly, it wasn't. From the cookie-cutter hall-ways to the scripted encounters and monster attacks, it's glaringly obvious that i'm segmented off in my own little portion of the server. I'm by no means a fan of Guild Wars, but when I compare the two of them I can't help but notice that they're on a completely different level of quality environment-wise.
As for the loot/reward system thing, that just screams "incompetence" to me. Hell, they could do a dice rolling system (IE Player opens a chest, computer "rolls" a five, and the computer/server picks an item from the loot that's assigned to that number. You could even add secondary modifiers and variables to determine + bonuses and the like.) and it would at least look randomized.
Edit: I just remembered that one "outdoor" isle from the beginning of DnDO. If that's their idea of outdoor instancing then maybe it's for the best that they stick with dungeons. That thing was horrible looking, the textures bled together and there was no variation in the ground. It was basically a large green field with bumps (hills) keeping things seperated.
and it doesn't carry with it that pretentious, elitist "hardcore" mentality
Yes, yes it does. I can tell you that from first hand experience. I've been in those guilds.
olol since it happened to you it must happen to everyone m i rite?
I... what? Have you seen the official forums? That place is one big hate-fest of Raiders vs. Plebeian Masses, and I swear to god I don't know which side is more idiotic.
I don't think I'm interested in DDO. I played the free trial and found the interface obnoxious, the dungeons banal, the quests poorly planned, and the D&D rules warped and stretched to fit the EQ model v1000.1. Not that I object to common MMO gameplay, in fact I like that FFXII (for example) incorporates that sort of thing, and neither do I object to changing the D&D rules... but what they did here, that just doesn't work.
On the other hand, I do need to make time for NWN2. I missed the prime of the first one I think.
and it doesn't carry with it that pretentious, elitist "hardcore" mentality
Yes, yes it does. I can tell you that from first hand experience. I've been in those guilds.
olol since it happened to you it must happen to everyone m i rite?
I... what? Have you seen the official forums? That place is one big hate-fest of Raiders vs. Plebeian Masses, and I swear to god I don't know which side is more idiotic.
To be fair, I've seen the same, or similar, behavior on every single MMO forum in existence. The game is only a game. The community, however, is going to be a protoplasmic collection of nice people and complete assholes, regardless of what type of gameplay that the MMO itself brings to the table. Your experience will be affected by the kind of person you are and the sort of people you spend your time with.
That said, Wilford Brimley is invincible. Continue as normal.
Yes, well, I shouldn't have perpetuated that line of discussion in the DDO thread.
I support the comparison to Guild Wars. They're both the extreme of instancing, but the instanced environments in Guild Wars are good--really good, in fact, and I only wish they came with the freedom of movement and exploration provided by jumping. Damn you, invisible walls...
DOO is like the sewer level in an RPG, except that it is an RPG.
There are plenty of interesting quests in DDO, if you ask me. Not enough to sustain a subscription, but enough to make the game worth picking up for $20-$30ish and playing through. I intend to reactivate for a month every tw or three modules. Unless they make a retail expansion that adds an area that is not Xen'Drik. How hot would a Sharn expansion be?
There's a 10 day trial, too. Give that a shot if you want to see how it's changed since beta.
D&D Online had some great ideas, but was ultimately really poor. Admittedly, I only played the trial version, but I really got enough of the game by the end. It seems that they want to do something different in the beginning, but after the first few levels they just have a bunch of "throw 20 mobs at your face" type situations, and every dungeon I tried is based on Halo structure - i.e. a specific corridor repeated infinitely.
Also, the way they implemented the ruleset is utterly retarded. I don't know if it gets any better, but the trial surely convinced me never to touch the thing again. I don't like Guild Wars at all, but it was a lot better than this.
Cherrn on
All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
WotWC really needs to filter out some of the people they give licenses to. There are a few that got it right, but then there are those that completely miss the point of the game.
Spell casting, alignment restrictions and other components of the game seem limiting but they set a unique pace for the game. If you start taking that out of the game you get a watered down, generic experience, and though it's safer (god knows there's enough nerds to argue about alignment till the end of time) but it's what makes D&D unique and the reason why people choose to play it above others.
DanHibiki on
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
DDO is going to flounder and die the same way SWG is. Two great licenses just fucked and gone to waste.
DDO was no where near as badly raped as SWG.
See, here's the thing... you HAVE to make changes to the rules in order to make the game work on PC. For instance, you have to do something about combat, wether it means increasing hit points, making spells more flexible, or what have you. Video game RPGs are built around combat, with less RP (for obvious reasons), so you have to make some changes to support that.
All this hate... DDO was a great game, that simply needed more combat. And Turbine has added a lot of combat. That certainly gives them props over certain other companies, I must say...
DDO has added a lot of dungeons and variety since Alpha and Beta. True, you'll run into similar monsters in various dungeons, but what game isn't that true of? The last update added a lich, mummies, gnolls, marilith (?) and more.
It's fast paced combat that requires teamwork, especially on the higher levels and difficulties.
PUGs do tend to do things over and over to maximize loot/exp, but if you find a decent guild, you probably won't have that problem.
There is incentive to do each dungeon at all three difficulty levels to accumulate patronage from the various factions. Patronage gives you access to different things (ex., buffs, cheaper healing, extra bank space, device to make you run faster in town).
They've revamped the loot tables so that higher lvl chests won't generate nearly so much crap (quantity went down, quality went up).
Personally, I prefer instanced adventuring over non-instanced. No random ganking, no waiting for another group to stop camping, etc. As for the dungeons being claustrophobic--DnD has always been about dungeons and not about running around outside (although the last DDO module did introduce a rather large outdoor instance).
If you can find a decent group to play with, I'd say it's a fun game. If you're only PUGing, then I'd say your experiences will vary greatly. DnD is designed for groups, so they've consciously designed mostly for groups rather than solo play.
There are plenty of interesting quests in DDO, if you ask me. Not enough to sustain a subscription, but enough to make the game worth picking up for $20-$30ish and playing through. I intend to reactivate for a month every tw or three modules. Unless they make a retail expansion that adds an area that is not Xen'Drik. How hot would a Sharn expansion be?
There's a 10 day trial, too. Give that a shot if you want to see how it's changed since beta.
DDO had some really, really fucking good quests.
Shan To Kor, for example, felt like something straight from BG2, sidequests and all.
There are plenty of interesting quests in DDO, if you ask me. Not enough to sustain a subscription, but enough to make the game worth picking up for $20-$30ish and playing through. I intend to reactivate for a month every tw or three modules. Unless they make a retail expansion that adds an area that is not Xen'Drik. How hot would a Sharn expansion be?
There's a 10 day trial, too. Give that a shot if you want to see how it's changed since beta.
DDO had some really, really fucking good quests.
Shan To Kor, for example, felt like something straight from BG2, sidequests and all.
Not to mention the flaming room of spiky death.
The problem is that you figure you ought to be running quests like that every time you have a quest.
DDO was pretty good a year ago when I played, but me and some friends of mine recently started it back up again and its much much better. Awesome quests, Auction House, Mail System, Favor system, badass arena style PvP as well as a Tavern Brawl area in some taverns where you can just hop in and start swinging. Its totally loads of fun and if any of you are on the fence about giving it a try I would definitely suggest it. I'm on Xoriat server, a fighter named Smilodon.
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It's not just that they need to fix, they really need to fix the environment of this game. Let's make a comparison between DnDO and Guild Wars, two games that rely completely on instancing. Guild Wars, while a free game, has massive, expansive environments that are readily available at any time. I can step out of LA and be in a huge wilderness zone created entirely for my enjoyment. In contrast to that is the claustrophobic corridors of DnDO. While it would work great for instancing if the atmosphere was pulled off properly, it wasn't. From the cookie-cutter hall-ways to the scripted encounters and monster attacks, it's glaringly obvious that i'm segmented off in my own little portion of the server. I'm by no means a fan of Guild Wars, but when I compare the two of them I can't help but notice that they're on a completely different level of quality environment-wise.
As for the loot/reward system thing, that just screams "incompetence" to me. Hell, they could do a dice rolling system (IE Player opens a chest, computer "rolls" a five, and the computer/server picks an item from the loot that's assigned to that number. You could even add secondary modifiers and variables to determine + bonuses and the like.) and it would at least look randomized.
Edit: I just remembered that one "outdoor" isle from the beginning of DnDO. If that's their idea of outdoor instancing then maybe it's for the best that they stick with dungeons. That thing was horrible looking, the textures bled together and there was no variation in the ground. It was basically a large green field with bumps (hills) keeping things seperated.
I... what? Have you seen the official forums? That place is one big hate-fest of Raiders vs. Plebeian Masses, and I swear to god I don't know which side is more idiotic.
I don't think I'm interested in DDO. I played the free trial and found the interface obnoxious, the dungeons banal, the quests poorly planned, and the D&D rules warped and stretched to fit the EQ model v1000.1. Not that I object to common MMO gameplay, in fact I like that FFXII (for example) incorporates that sort of thing, and neither do I object to changing the D&D rules... but what they did here, that just doesn't work.
On the other hand, I do need to make time for NWN2. I missed the prime of the first one I think.
That said, Wilford Brimley is invincible. Continue as normal.
I support the comparison to Guild Wars. They're both the extreme of instancing, but the instanced environments in Guild Wars are good--really good, in fact, and I only wish they came with the freedom of movement and exploration provided by jumping. Damn you, invisible walls...
DOO is like the sewer level in an RPG, except that it is an RPG.
There's a 10 day trial, too. Give that a shot if you want to see how it's changed since beta.
Also, the way they implemented the ruleset is utterly retarded. I don't know if it gets any better, but the trial surely convinced me never to touch the thing again. I don't like Guild Wars at all, but it was a lot better than this.
You fear my magic missile?
Spell casting, alignment restrictions and other components of the game seem limiting but they set a unique pace for the game. If you start taking that out of the game you get a watered down, generic experience, and though it's safer (god knows there's enough nerds to argue about alignment till the end of time) but it's what makes D&D unique and the reason why people choose to play it above others.
DDO was no where near as badly raped as SWG.
See, here's the thing... you HAVE to make changes to the rules in order to make the game work on PC. For instance, you have to do something about combat, wether it means increasing hit points, making spells more flexible, or what have you. Video game RPGs are built around combat, with less RP (for obvious reasons), so you have to make some changes to support that.
All this hate... DDO was a great game, that simply needed more combat. And Turbine has added a lot of combat. That certainly gives them props over certain other companies, I must say...
It's fast paced combat that requires teamwork, especially on the higher levels and difficulties.
PUGs do tend to do things over and over to maximize loot/exp, but if you find a decent guild, you probably won't have that problem.
There is incentive to do each dungeon at all three difficulty levels to accumulate patronage from the various factions. Patronage gives you access to different things (ex., buffs, cheaper healing, extra bank space, device to make you run faster in town).
They've revamped the loot tables so that higher lvl chests won't generate nearly so much crap (quantity went down, quality went up).
Personally, I prefer instanced adventuring over non-instanced. No random ganking, no waiting for another group to stop camping, etc. As for the dungeons being claustrophobic--DnD has always been about dungeons and not about running around outside (although the last DDO module did introduce a rather large outdoor instance).
If you can find a decent group to play with, I'd say it's a fun game. If you're only PUGing, then I'd say your experiences will vary greatly. DnD is designed for groups, so they've consciously designed mostly for groups rather than solo play.
Had it not been monthly fee, I wouldve thrown down 50 bucks for it in a heartbeat.
Shan To Kor, for example, felt like something straight from BG2, sidequests and all.
Not to mention the flaming room of spiky death.
The problem is that you figure you ought to be running quests like that every time you have a quest.
And some of the quests just blew.
Also, they are adding sharn?
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