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Friend Turning Alcoholic
Henroid
Mexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
Mexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
I've got a problem on my hands, I don't know what to do about it. My friend who I was planning on moving in with recently got drunk this past week to the point of blacking out and having no memory of the night. The cause for alarm is that he's also recently broken up with his girlfriend (don't know who made the first move to make that happen), and his alcohol intake has gone up. I casually asked him after the blackout incident to not drink as much in the future, and he snapped at me with the, "I'm an adult and I can do what I want" sort of crap.
Now I'm terrified of the idea of moving in with him, to the point of just abandoning the idea and searching for apartments on my own. I don't want to abandon him as a friend, as he's the longest standing friend I've had in life, but I don't want to be under the same roof as him.
My history with people who drink and alcohol:
- My oldest brother has made plenty of family events or get-togethers awkward by getting black-out drunk. He's also encouraged drinking in another of my older brothers.
- That older brother has an extremely bad history of black outs and is a raging asshole when drunk. Leaving out the details for his sake.
- My friend, the point of this thread, has an alcoholic father. In some stroke of luck, he actually doesn't turn into a terrible person. It's mostly just a waste of money and bad considering his age and the fact he still works for a living.
- Two years ago I lost a coworker, who was 8 months pregnant, to a drunk driver here in Texas. The baby died too.
- I've had drinks every now and then, ever-so-casually, never having been drunk or going beyond 3 sissy-drinks (Mike's Hard Lemonade anyone?). When hopping into bed one night, I had a dizzy spell, and that resulted in a cutting down on drinking for me (which to begin with wasn't much). Resulted in like one drink every 4 months or something.
I feel like I'm turning into a MADD member because my tolerance for the act of drinking is going down the toilet faster than an unwanted pregnancy on prom night. Logically, I get that people have been responsible and are capable of it. I don't get the "Let's get SMASHED" mentality at all. But for now, my friend. I don't know how to approach him, I don't know who I should get involved, and I don't know what could make this worse if I take action.
Now I'm terrified of the idea of moving in with him, to the point of just abandoning the idea and searching for apartments on my own. I don't want to abandon him as a friend, as he's the longest standing friend I've had in life, but I don't want to be under the same roof as him.
My history with people who drink and alcohol:
- My oldest brother has made plenty of family events or get-togethers awkward by getting black-out drunk. He's also encouraged drinking in another of my older brothers.
- That older brother has an extremely bad history of black outs and is a raging asshole when drunk. Leaving out the details for his sake.
- My friend, the point of this thread, has an alcoholic father. In some stroke of luck, he actually doesn't turn into a terrible person. It's mostly just a waste of money and bad considering his age and the fact he still works for a living.
- Two years ago I lost a coworker, who was 8 months pregnant, to a drunk driver here in Texas. The baby died too.
- I've had drinks every now and then, ever-so-casually, never having been drunk or going beyond 3 sissy-drinks (Mike's Hard Lemonade anyone?). When hopping into bed one night, I had a dizzy spell, and that resulted in a cutting down on drinking for me (which to begin with wasn't much). Resulted in like one drink every 4 months or something.
I feel like I'm turning into a MADD member because my tolerance for the act of drinking is going down the toilet faster than an unwanted pregnancy on prom night. Logically, I get that people have been responsible and are capable of it. I don't get the "Let's get SMASHED" mentality at all. But for now, my friend. I don't know how to approach him, I don't know who I should get involved, and I don't know what could make this worse if I take action.
Henroid on
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If this was a one time event your friend is completely justified in snapping at you. Look up the warning signs of alcoholism and find out how many actually apply. If you don't want to live with him then don't, but if you get all over his case just because you're afraid of alcohol you're gonna lose a friend.
Edit - To clarify the bolded sentence, when I spoke to him I didn't call him that or I didn't use the word.
http://www.ctclearinghouse.org/topics/customer-files/warning-signs-of-alcohol-and-substance-abuse.pdf
Give that a read. If a lot of it applies to him then maybe you're right, and the next step is to either let him hit rock bottom or stage an intervention. Addicts don't generally listen to reason. How old is your friend?
Like, seriously, you seem like one of those people who couldn't live with people who like to get drunk, so don't. I know people who can't be around cigarette smokers, and people who don't want their roommates to store marijuana in their drawer even if they aren't smoking it in the place. Don't assume that being friends works out differences like these.
you can't mom your friends/people your age. which is basically what you did.
I knew him before he started drinking (which he started when - surprise - he was set into college for a couple of years). So I guess it is my fault for expecting something else of him.
There is 100% nothing you can do that will affect your friend's decision to drink, or not drink. The closest you can come is asking him to examine his own behavior, but if he is indeed an addict the last thing in the world he'll want to see is that he's drinking too much (and so, he won't see that).
If you don't want to live with someone who drinks too much, that's sort of the end of the conversation. Find yourself a little one-bedroom and tell him it's super-convenient for your work, or the price was too good to pass up, or you reckon you'll get more sex that way. I'd expect telling him that you found your own place because of his drinking won't come across as a warning sign that he should cut back, but as a condemnation of him. Again: he won't see it as a condemnation of his drinking, he'll see it as you not accepting him.
However:
I don't know that you had the grounds to say anything, to be honest. It would be different if you were already living with him and you said something like (for example) "Hey man, could you not drink so much because you were really loud and the neighbours complained" or like "you got so drunk you vomited all over the back seat of my car on the way home, do you mind toning it down a bit" but as it stands I'm not sure what reason you would have to ask him that - other than to assuage your own discomfort with his drinking.
Because it really wasn't your place to say anything, in my opinion.
Now, I don't know the guy, so I can't say this for certain, but it doesn't sound like he's an alcoholic. He broke up with his girlfriend and got hammered, lord knows it's common enough to drown your sorrows after a bad breakup. There's no indication from your OP that this is going to develop into a pattern which affects your living with him.
Don't move in with him and don't try to change him. Unless he does something that makes it clear he has a problem (this is not getting blackout drunk) you trying to change him isn't going to help him. It's only going to help you feel superior or whatnot. Some people like to drink. Some people like to binge drink. After a while they'll get tired of it. It's when they reach that point of getting tired of it and are unable to stop that they have a problem.
Second, he's been drinking excessively lately. If his regular drinking habits are not the problem and this is, keep in mind it might be a phase. You said he just went through a breakup. Binging is common after breakups because 1. it helps you cope and 2. you feel the need to get out and have single fun. I'm not saying it's the best or even a good response. I'm just saying, it's common, understandable, and probably won't last forever.
I certainly understand why you are being judgmental - it sounds like you've had some real family issues with alcohol in the past - but that's really not your friend's fault.
And for the record, I've blacked out two or three times in the last ten years, and I'm definitely not an alcoholic. It's something that happens. Sometimes you can drink very little, but mix two things you shouldn't mix, and boom - you can't remember anything the next day. Having blacked out once or twice or even a half-dozen times is not an indication of alcoholism. If he drinks nightly/daily at home or whatever, then yeah, he might be an alcoholic. Otherwise, I doubt it very much.
You can definitely add that since you're gonna be roommates you also don't want to potentially clean up barf or piss on shit around the apartment, as well ;D
I've got a few friends who have been known to get really drunk, not in a dependent way but in a "this party is going on too long" way. My own method has been to have quieter parties of my own and have relatively low-key alcohol consumption. For parties where booze is the focus, well, the party is gonna be about booze. For parties where something else is the focus, such as a movie night, a game night, or whatever, and booze is present, it's far easier to just have enough to feel good and enjoy the taste w/o getting shitfaced -- because you'd be likely to be the only one getting shitfaced.
It's worked pretty well -- friends of mine that tend to get super drunk at drinking parties get just a little drunk at my parties. That doesn't make me lame (at least not in my book), but shows that you can set a good example for people by being a host who isn't sloshed.
Do you yourself drink, or do you abstain from alcohol?
I've heard that blacking out isn't even from quantity, but simply the rate of consumption. If you drink quickly, or if you do it on an empty stomach, it's more likely to trigger a blackout even if the actual amount of alcohol isn't all that much.
Because really, you're right to be concerned both as his friend and possibly his future roommate. Friends don't necessarily like what another friend has to say, but it can help down the road. Just don't push it. You've brought it up once and that's enough.
As for as a roommate, does he currently live on his own and still make his rent payment or is he constantly broke and still buys booze? And you've said he isn't a jerk when he's drunk so I guess you can trust him not to bring home undesirable characters or host late parties that could cause you trouble?
If he's not going to make rent payments or cover his share of utilities or if he's a total slob sure, don't be his roommate, sometimes good friends make for shitty roommates, but I question the rationale "oh my friend is developing a serious problem that's harder to get out of than to stay out of, I'd better ditch".
Age is an additional factor. Early twenties? Not an alcoholic. Late twenties? Eh, he should know better, but we're all prone to bouts of irresponsibility at times. Thirties or higher? Maybe you're on to something.
Being young isn't an excuse to drink too much. While one black-out night isn't anything to get upset about if he starts suddenly boozing up til black-out pint regularly being 21-25 doesn't excuse that kind of irresponsibility.
Get another roommate.
Saying "I'm worried because I care about you" is one thing, but it doesn't sound like that's what you said. It sounds like you said "Please refrain from engaging in legal behavior because it makes me uncomfortable without even being there." That's pretty different, and if I were him I would wonder where you got off judging me. Did he get behind the wheel? Did he endanger others in any way? Those are the circumstances under which you might have grounds to ask him not to drink.
Because he's right.. he is an adult and he can do what he wants. You are not his mother, or his father. He needs to make the mistakes he's going to make, and well.. he's doing you a favor, here. If you don't want to live with someone who drinks sometimes then don't, and he'll most likely understand that in itself, but.. you're not really in the right here and for the sake of your friendship I think that beyond genuine concern for his wellbeing, you should let it go.
Self-destruct? Seems like people are being a little quick to judge if you ask me. There's a crucial bit of information being left out here, and that's whether his drinking is part of a pattern. A binge once or twice, especially in the wake of a break-up, isn't necessarily the onset of alcoholism some people are making it out to be.
The friend "fought back" when the poster "mentioned" it, saying that he's "an adult and can do what he wants", because, well, he's an adult and can do what he wants. As others have pointed out, it wasn't Henroid's place to criticize his behaviour after one night of excess.
That being said, I'm going to also agree with others that it looks like the OP has some pre-existing issues with alcohol, and probably shouldn't move in with someone who (reasonably) expects to be able to have a few drinks every now and again without criticism.
Edit: ceres just said it better.
So basically he's supposed to put up with bullshit that he's already had to deal with most of his life because his friend wants to commit suicide-by-bottle.
As I said. Don't move in with him. You don't have to force yourself into dealing with him. The only thing that's going to make him stop is waking up in jail.
edit: sometimes friends just can't be friends anymore.
there's a big difference between a bender after a break-up and killing yourself with booze.
A. People who have had bad experiences think that anyone who drinks is an alcoholic
B. People who have not had those same experiences think that it's a great way to enjoy a saturday night, and if you black out every now and again? eh, so what? it's fun!
Personally I'm in the camp of people who "get drunk; have fun" but I certainly can see the viewpoint of the other camp.
Drinking to extreme on occasion does not an alcoholic make. Getting drunk every Friday night and making an ass out of yourself regularly does not an alcoholic make.
Drinking yourself into oblivion after a serious break up is also extremely common amongst the non alcoholic set.
If that lifestyle does not fit, do not live with this friend.
if you think you have the right to tell your friend how to live his life; think again, he will only ever resent you for telling him he needs to change in order to maintain your friendship.
Based on the information we have (a one time bender after a serious breakup) you've painted this guy's friend as a raging alcoholic who is going to ruin the life of anyone with the misfortune of sharing a living space with him... if that isn't jumping to conclusions... what is?
It was embarrassing and sad, and as a result I was a bit like you when I was younger: uncomfortable with other people drinking. My attitude changed when I realized I can choose to stop being a victim of my dad's illness, start being more objective and less bothered by things that don't really affect me. It turns out that you can in fact go out and get really really drunk every once in a while without self-destructing.
I guess my advice is that you look into your own motives here, because being overly judgemental isn't necessarily a healthy trait in the long run.
I REALLY don't think anybody said that. I think lots of people DID say that the OP really shouldn't be telling people what to do on this front. Express concern? Great. Telling the guy what to do? No. He hasn't done anything wrong, just worrisome, at worst. The OP shouldn't have to live with it, but the OP DOESN'T have to live with it. He should be there for his friend, but that doesn't mean being bossy.
No, you're making assumptions. We don't know if this has happened before and if it has how often and why. Drinking til you've passed out, especially when younger, is far from uncommon.
Based on what?
Everyone else, stop responding to Fyrewulff.
As others have said, if he is a heavy drinker then maybe you shouldn't live with him. Based on your differing attitudes towards drinking.
You need to apologize to your friend and tell him why you said that about the drinking. Tell him about your brother and said you overreacted. Explain yourself, and gauge his reaction. See if he understands, and tell him how you two living together might be rough considering your different lifestyles when it comes to drinking.
Basically, maybe if he understands why you're worried (which really has shit to do with him), he might cut down a little bit (if that's actually what you're after). Or, it could lead to a productive conversation about how living together might/might not work out. If he's one of your closest friends, talk to him about why you're freaking out about him. Don't say he's doing anything wrong however. Tell him these are things that bother you because of who you are and apologize for mothering him. That's not what friends are for man. It's really not.
What you did though (and you might not have wanted to but you did it anyway) was tell him not to drink and provided no good reason on why he shouldn't.
There are plenty of good reasons why not to drink, because he blacked out once is not a good reason to be worried about it.
Think about it this way, how did his drinking that night affect his life? He can't remember saturday night, who cares? If he couldn't remember tuesday at work because he started drinking on the job then yes this is a problem. If he drinks to blackout levels 4 times a week then this is a problem.
The information you have shown us does not show an actual problem.
They guy just broke up with his girlfriend and is a bit down, let him blow off some steam.
Satans..... hints.....
He breaks up with his girlfriend and goes on a bender. Bad move. It is also the move that 90% of the population would make.
You are terrified of moving in with him because he got excessively drunk after a break up? Really?
https://medium.com/@alascii
Most people over estimate how much they can drink every once in awhile. I've never blacked out from drinking...but I have been sick as hell a few times from misestimating how much I could handle at the time. Also, if I drink when I'm really tired and go to bed tipsy I have a hard time remembering what happened the night before. I don't think it's from "blacking out" my memory is just really shitty normally :-P
My stepfather drank, a lot. Often. It had very bad side effects I don't even want to get into here, but I hated anyone who drank through most of High School and College. It wasn't until I met nice people and dated guys who drank responsibly that I realized you could have a beer with dinner or a couple shots on your birthday and be just fine.
It was the same with weed. My younger brother used to steal my games and DVDs to pawn for weed money. He stole from my parents and even stole money out of birthday and christmas cards. I hated potheads because of this and others I met like him. However, once again, I met responsible adults who can smoke weed responsibly and not live with their parents or lose jobs.
The fact is, just because he had one bad night (completely understandably too!) is no reason to jump to conclusions and throw him into the pile with irresponsible people. Drinking can relax you. It can also make you temporarily forget the things which are causing you grief and distress. It doesn't have to be the thing that works for everyone, but it does work for some people. It's a choice, not a vice.
You may as well get upset with a friend for overeating after a bad break up and tell her she's obese.
One engagement in excessive activity does not equate an addiction.
Your friend just broke up with his girlfriend. So he got really drunk. Okay, and...? I've never blacked out, but my girlfriend did once (because she wasn't being careful and drank far more than she meant to, and she never wants do it again). I have drank so much that I have thrown up (once), and I am drunk probably every other weekend or so.
Your friend sounds like someone who enjoys drinking, and went on a bender during a tough time, but that doesn't make him an alcoholic. My younger sister used to call me an alcoholic if I got drunk with friends, until she started drinking herself, at which point she realized that it's one thing to enjoy drinking, and another to need alcohol.
Alcoholism does not mean you get really drunk because you're upset. It doesn't mean you get drunk often because you enjoy it. It means that you cannot survive without alcohol, and are physically uncomfortable without it.
Now, unless your friend has said that he wants to drink/be drunk constantly, and spends a considerable portion of his time drinking (including during the day, and alone), I highly doubt he's actually an alcoholic.
On another note, as others have said, it's not really your place to ask your friend to drink less (as a rule of thumb, stuff like that is really only appropriate with family members and people you've dated for a decent chunk of time/are married to). It's one thing to say "hey, you blacked out, are you okay? Were you just not paying attention?" jokingly and see how he reacts, or say "why did you drink so much, are you upset?" if you're really worried. But honestly, I would say nothing at all. If one of my friends (even my best friend) asked me to drink less the same way you did, I'd probably flip out too, and I don't exactly drink often, or have a dependency on alcohol.
I think you're overreacting, really. You can try talking to your friend about it and apologizing for what you said, but it doesn't sound like there's anyting to worry about.