The point was to go straight up gun line as the antithesis of Altmann's Wolves. We would win on our strengths, or lose on our weakness.
He ate me in CC because I just couldn't kill enough as they approached, because I was rolling far below average. But, at the end, there were some intense moments, and it was a lot of fun
Don't worry, in larger serious games, all Fire Warriors will more than likely have a fish
I have to thank Nax though, because the sheer amount of models being removed from the table was cathartic. It was my first win.
On a slightly bigger battlefield he would have had the advantage, as it was, it was too easy to get from one squad to the next without taking many wounds and yes, the rolling was terribad for those warriors. Look at it this way, the tau collective has been culled of it's weaker members, for the greater good.
it was good times its got me thinking about the possibilities of a full 1850 gunline.... too bad i can only take 6 troops units. hmmm, planetstrike possibilities....
Nax on
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
Man I would be pissed if my berzerkers didn't wipe everything out they touched, though I have to see the stats for that Lone Wolf, I would still be livid that thing hadn't gone down.
@ the tau game, yeah my opponent was in the same situation, relatively small board, and even though he managed to shoot some berserkers down, it wasn't enough by the time they managed to reach out and gently caress him.
Man, just looking at your guys' models and those pro-painted ones has me all demoralized. I want to start painting my guys, but I just feel like I'd be fucking them up. I mean, is it worth it to fuck up scores of models until I learn to paint, or should I save the money I'd otherwise spend on supplies and ugly models, and just pay someone to do it for me? How long did it take for you all to get so good at painting?
If you're really worried, you can paint on metal ones, you can throw those into oven cleaner to clean it off and the model will be perfectly fine. I loved models as a child, from 6-10 years old I was making all sorts of nascars and airplanes to hang in my room. But I lost interest and only re-started modelling when I discovered some fantasy miniatures for d&d when I was 14.
I'm amazed I actually stumbled across things like drybrushing, washing, and highlighting entirely on my own for my first few tries. I've been putting together small kits of various anime things (fucking LOVE the Captain Harlock series of space-battleships and space-zeppelins) ever since. I chose to do gaming models now mainly because I realised NO ONE has any use or want for model cars and planes, whereas these can be sold for at-cost or better prices to people that just want to play but can't paint or model at all.
Anyways, in my circuitous fashion, I think my reply would be what most artists would say to you for how long it took them to get good at painting: A life time.
(that or really just a year or two of actually trying your best to improve and refine techniques we/magazines talk about)
Troops:
19 Sluggas, Nob w/PK, 'Eavy Armor, and Bosspole (full kit) x 2
12 Sluggas, Nob with full kit, Trukk with Reinforced Ram and Armor x 3
20 Shootas, Nob with full kit, 2 Big Shootas
15 Stormboyz, Nob with full kit
6 Warbikes, Nob with full kit
15 Lootas
Battlewagon with Deffrolla, Extra Armor, and 2 Big Shootas x 2
It's not too out of the ordinary really, but a full mech list is something I haven't tried with Orks before. I'll have to pick up the Battlewagons but I have enough boyz to proxy stormboyz with. Honestly though I just get tired of seeing Ork lists with big squads of Nobs in them - they're just asking to get tabled by a halfway decent IG player. Especially since I keep seeing lists without a KFF in it, which is just absolute madness. More boyz and less toys is the way to go.
I have to hand it to Nax, at first I was daunted by his 60!!! Tau models on the board in a 500pt game.
After the first turn though, it was pretty much meatgrinder time. Given, had he landed maybe 2-3 more wounds per round of shooting it could have easily gone his way. The highlite was my wolf priest single handedly charging and winning against 10 fire warriors then surviving a 15~ shot volley the next turn.
Also, in my first game, I went up against Chaos marines. It was an interesting tale if you want to read quickly:
I was running 2 packs of Grey Hunters, one with a wolf priest, and a Lone wolf with StormShield and Mark of Wulfen.
This is the result:
Turns 1 & 2 Chaos berzerkers killed ALL 19 OF MY GREY HUNTERS AND WOLF PRIEST.
Lone wolf proceeds to kill the remaining 3 berzerkers. Same turn 5 plague marines disembark a rhino.
Lone wolf is literally surrounded by 5 plague marines.
Lone wolf is flamered, then shot 4 times by pistol. lives.
Lone wolf is assaulted. Dealt one wound, kills one plague marine. draw.
Lone wolf lasts TWO MORE TURNS of close combat (four assault phases!) before the game is finally called on turn 7 with him alive and surrounded by 3 plague marines, one of which has a power fist. He killed one more plague marine without receiving any more wounds.
Holy crap was that awesome and at the same time completely demoralizing. I thought I'd do better but as it turns out, my lone wolf killed more models than 19 grey hunters could. The SS and wulfen make these units completely awesome at tying down units. Not to mention he gets to re-roll hit on models with T5 which the plague marines were. All in all, I learned that I need to get RHINOs.
Skyclaws are way more fun than I gave them credit for.
Oh and don't ask nax about his sniper scouts. I think he wants to sell them now, if he hasn't purged them with fire yet :P
Wow. Thumbs up on the Lone Wolf. I don't consider them too much, because they can't be transported.
Rhinos will help you out quite a bit. When you got a tanks, a dread or two, and transports walking down the field, your infantry seems to survive much longer.
I mean, is it worth it to fuck up scores of models until I learn to paint
This. Seriously, the only way you can learn. I actually bought and painted my entire space marines army, mainly for learning the hobby, painting, etc. Practice makes perfect, especially here.
As for how long? I doubt I'm a representative sample, but in 9 or 10 months, I went from...
Man, just looking at your guys' models and those pro-painted ones has me all demoralized. I want to start painting my guys, but I just feel like I'd be fucking them up. I mean, is it worth it to fuck up scores of models until I learn to paint, or should I save the money I'd otherwise spend on supplies and ugly models, and just pay someone to do it for me? How long did it take for you all to get so good at painting?
Raslin has the right of it. My first 25 models are basically garbage, though I kept at and kept trying things I read about (shading, washing, dry brushing, line highlighting), and now I feel I'm really damn good painter. I'm not as good as our new friend and his awesome models, but I think I'm hitting pretty close to the mark after 9 months.
Matrias on
3DS/Pokemon Friend Code - 2122-5878-9273 - Kyle
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Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
Seriously, you can't fuck up a model by painting it. Old paint jobs can be painted over or stripped off. The model doesn't get hurt in the process. You figure out what level of painting you're capable of, you do that, and then through experience you figure out how to improve on that.
Yeah no one starts out good. Its all about practice, practice, practice and always challangeing yourself. I've grown a lot as a painter over the last year just because I've been trying a lot of new things.
Asher on
I put models on Instagram now: asher_paints
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WulfDisciple of TzeentchThe Void... (New Jersey)Registered Userregular
it was good times its got me thinking about the possibilities of a full 1850 gunline.... too bad i can only take 6 troops units. hmmm, planetstrike possibilities....
I saw lances gunline army absolutely mow down masons ork army, i mean it wasnt even close the amount of firepower they were just dumping on the boyz.
My dice aren't trained to hit on 4s yet.. which is my major problem. They will learn in time
Nax on
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
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Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
That gives me hope. I guess I might as well start the long road to competency.
This was my very first 40k model from about seven years ago:
These are from this month:
And I don't have any special talent for painting, aside from the articles in White Dwarf magazine I never went out of my way to research or study painting techniques. Every advancement I've made has come from practice and observation.
Once you get started, advancement happens relatively quickly since it's something you very much learn by doing. There were only a couple years between that land raider, and these guys.
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
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Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
I didn't even realize there was one. I was just alluding to how it's not like the game comes with official rules of painting. You start with a bare model, you end with a painted one, and unless your creative method includes the fresh entrails of small children, whatever steps you used to get there is fine.
I wlll say, that I've been playing warhammer games for almost 19 years now and I still suck at painting , its the most frustrating aspect of the game to me but also the most rewarding. Up until the last three years I really didnt have any patience for painting and refused to do it. Then I hit a point where I wanted beautiful armies vs the grey tide.
Probably the best advice I can give on painting, is take your time. Some people can knock out miniatures a dozen a night. For me it takes multiple days for even the simplest of models (may have something to do with an overbearing ovarian unit and multiple chaos spawns that live with me). But don't be afraid to show off your work. And don't get offended by criticism. I think what helped me the most was showing off a mini I was very proud of and then having very experienced painters tell me to try this or that and then seeing how those ideas and concepts changes the output. Also, BASE YOUR MINIS. A good base, or basing job on a shitty painted miniature makes that miniature look 10X better.
PS : Use washes, its like playing your kids spongebob game on easy mode (Real fun)
Some random pics of things I painted before I was emotionally crushed by my volume of miniatures triggering the sad but needed cleansing, you can see that my where my acquisition of miniatures skill is high, my ability to paint them is still very low:
Additionally I think I have decided on what forces I want to model and build out and get painted up I wanted opinions. My requirements are A) Lots of fun diverse things to paint and assemble and collect Strong forgeworld following so I can have a pretty army C) Fun to play
I think I've decided to go ahead and build my World Eaters army that I had originally planned, and then build my ork waagh out by finishing the painting that has to be done (relatively small task) and adding in alot of the new FW releases in small batches.
Related to yesterday's discussion of SW HQs: thunderwolf cavalry have a printed profile strength of five, which when combined with a powerfist yields S 10. What about characters on Thunderwolves? Since the bonuses from the Thunderwolf aren't conditional the way the S bonus from the frost blade or furious charge is, I would presume it's also 10. Thoughts?
Alqadim: That tyranid looks awesome, actually.
Counterspin on
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Librarian's ghostLibrarian, Ghostbuster, and TimSporkRegistered Userregular
edited October 2009
See, my model collecting skills are also high, but I know that it will all be painted at some point. My best accomplishment is having about a 5/6 ratio of painted models to total models, which when you consider the sheer number I have, that's pretty impressive.
Example:
Picture taken right before the new Guard Codex was released. That's just my Imperial Guard.
Of course if you add in my inability to play a game with an unpainted model, you'll see why I've managed to paint so much. I started this hobby to paint little soldiers. The fact that I can use those little guys in a game is pretty awesome.
By the way Gabe, did you get that thing I sent you? :winky:
See, my model collecting skills are also high, but I know that it will all be painted at some point. My best accomplishment is having about a 5/6 ratio of painted models to total models, which when you consider the sheer number I have, that's pretty impressive.
Example:
Picture taken right before the new Guard Codex was released. That's just my Imperial Guard.
Of course if you add in my inability to play a game with an unpainted model, you'll see why I've managed to paint so much. I started this hobby to paint little soldiers. The fact that I can use those little guys in a game is pretty awesome.
By the way Gabe, did you get that thing I sent you? :winky:
Gabe is about to get the things Im sending him, You you have to look at his army with airforce envy , and by the end of the next two weeks I will have to resign my title as reigning armor lord.
Probably the best advice I can give on painting, is take your time. Some people can knock out miniatures a dozen a night. For me it takes multiple days for even the simplest of models
This too. From start to finish, I can reliably paint a single infantry-sized figure in the course of an evening. Those broadsides were completed over the course of 3-4 days each. The Tigershark took about a week, but all my evenings were completely free giving me a lot of extra time to devote to it.
Gabriel_Pitt on
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Librarian's ghostLibrarian, Ghostbuster, and TimSporkRegistered Userregular
See, my model collecting skills are also high, but I know that it will all be painted at some point. My best accomplishment is having about a 5/6 ratio of painted models to total models, which when you consider the sheer number I have, that's pretty impressive.
Example:
Picture taken right before the new Guard Codex was released. That's just my Imperial Guard.
Of course if you add in my inability to play a game with an unpainted model, you'll see why I've managed to paint so much. I started this hobby to paint little soldiers. The fact that I can use those little guys in a game is pretty awesome.
By the way Gabe, did you get that thing I sent you? :winky:
Gabe is about to get the things Im sending him, You you have to look at his army with airforce envy
I held a good part of his airforce in my hands. I even made sure all the parts were there. Also I still have six Valkyries and a Vulture, so hah. Besides Lt Raslin and his Thunderbolt are more than capable.
Ill post some pics of my first batch of terminators and let you compare them to my latest
And my sturnguard
thats in about 6 months of work, the thing is paintvagrants work is awsome but vagrants been painting since he was 13. He's also willing to give help for people with questions, he taught me a lot of cool tricks about how to make my guys look better. Thing is its simply time and work on painting, that being said id have my epic stuff painted in a heartbeat by pro's cause they look awsome!
Gabe is about to get the things Im sending him, You you have to look at his army with airforce envy ,
And as of yet, you guys don't even have an inkling about the pièce de résistance of Operation: Unfriendly Skies. And you're not going to for a long, long time. Man, I'm going to be painting for _months_ getting all these aircraft done.
Besides Lt Raslin and his Thunderbolt are more than capable.
Hmm, yes, but, should the unthinkable happen and we find ourselves on opposite sides of the battlefield, he'd be facing down a Thunderbolt, Lightning, Tigershark, Barracude, 2 Remoras, and that's just the stuff you already know about. He's good, but quantity has a quality all of it's own, especially when part of that quantity is a super-heavy packig Titan-killer railguns.
Gabriel_Pitt on
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Librarian's ghostLibrarian, Ghostbuster, and TimSporkRegistered Userregular
Gabe is about to get the things Im sending him, You you have to look at his army with airforce envy ,
And as of yet, you guys don't even have an inkling about the pièce de résistance of Operation: Unfriendly Skies. And you're not going to for a long, long time. Man, I'm going to be painting for _months_ getting all these aircraft done.
Gabriel_Pitt(effective against Russian warships)Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
I was tempted, but I couldn't justify the cost, not even in the deepest depths of my gamer's heart. I don't have _that_ much money to burn, and while it's an awesome model, it's at the scale where it's just not practical to actually _play_ with. I mean, look at the guy holding the thing in that FW picture. Now try picture transporting it and the rest of your stuff to a game store, actually fitting it on the table, actually moving it around in any capacity. Bleah.
The only thing I consider cheating in painting is buying a pre-painted army from so pro, then entering tourneys painting/modelling competition with them as your own. Fucking tools do it all the time, and I don't see how that's allowed when everyone knows it's not their own work.
I didn't even realize there was one. I was just alluding to how it's not like the game comes with official rules of painting. You start with a bare model, you end with a painted one, and unless your creative method includes the fresh entrails of small children, whatever steps you used to get there is fine.
I agree. But every few months it seems like there is a "its cheating if you don't paint it yourself' and "dipping isn't painting. You're cheating" argument that is always so pointless :P
Nax on
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
How can you POSSIBLY cheat at painting. Jees. It's a hobby. GW encourages the artistic side of it. Anyone who says otherwise is a tool.
Also, I was looking through the SW dex and my wolf priest can take the saga where he adds the # of models he killed in the previus turn to his attacks. I think I might try that...
I'm not saying not to hire someone else to paint it up for you if you like, but to enter a painting contest thereafter is really bullshit. I liken that as akin to having a gallery show, and using someone elses work and passing it off as your own.
Dipping...I would just say that's a bad plan on retaining any actual details on the model, the same coverage can be achieved with a heavy drybrushing and actually let you keep the details showing.
I didn't even realize there was one. I was just alluding to how it's not like the game comes with official rules of painting. You start with a bare model, you end with a painted one, and unless your creative method includes the fresh entrails of small children, whatever steps you used to get there is fine.
I agree. But every few months it seems like there is a "its cheating if you don't paint it yourself' and "dipping isn't painting. You're cheating" argument that is always so pointless :P
Honestly, I'd rather see a 'cheated' army painted and playing against me then the gray tide.
certain shortcuts will always have their limitations in quality. I don't give a damn where a person decides to draw their line when I'm happy to see color on it.
Posts
Good.
I hate to see my little tau friends squished.
On a slightly bigger battlefield he would have had the advantage, as it was, it was too easy to get from one squad to the next without taking many wounds and yes, the rolling was terribad for those warriors. Look at it this way, the tau collective has been culled of it's weaker members, for the greater good.
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
@ the tau game, yeah my opponent was in the same situation, relatively small board, and even though he managed to shoot some berserkers down, it wasn't enough by the time they managed to reach out and gently caress him.
I'm amazed I actually stumbled across things like drybrushing, washing, and highlighting entirely on my own for my first few tries. I've been putting together small kits of various anime things (fucking LOVE the Captain Harlock series of space-battleships and space-zeppelins) ever since. I chose to do gaming models now mainly because I realised NO ONE has any use or want for model cars and planes, whereas these can be sold for at-cost or better prices to people that just want to play but can't paint or model at all.
Anyways, in my circuitous fashion, I think my reply would be what most artists would say to you for how long it took them to get good at painting: A life time.
(that or really just a year or two of actually trying your best to improve and refine techniques we/magazines talk about)
1,999
HQ - Mek, KFF, Burna
Troops:
19 Sluggas, Nob w/PK, 'Eavy Armor, and Bosspole (full kit) x 2
12 Sluggas, Nob with full kit, Trukk with Reinforced Ram and Armor x 3
20 Shootas, Nob with full kit, 2 Big Shootas
15 Stormboyz, Nob with full kit
6 Warbikes, Nob with full kit
15 Lootas
Battlewagon with Deffrolla, Extra Armor, and 2 Big Shootas x 2
It's not too out of the ordinary really, but a full mech list is something I haven't tried with Orks before. I'll have to pick up the Battlewagons but I have enough boyz to proxy stormboyz with. Honestly though I just get tired of seeing Ork lists with big squads of Nobs in them - they're just asking to get tabled by a halfway decent IG player. Especially since I keep seeing lists without a KFF in it, which is just absolute madness. More boyz and less toys is the way to go.
Rhinos will help you out quite a bit. When you got a tanks, a dread or two, and transports walking down the field, your infantry seems to survive much longer.
This. Seriously, the only way you can learn. I actually bought and painted my entire space marines army, mainly for learning the hobby, painting, etc. Practice makes perfect, especially here.
As for how long? I doubt I'm a representative sample, but in 9 or 10 months, I went from...
to
3ds friend code: 2981-6032-4118
Raslin has the right of it. My first 25 models are basically garbage, though I kept at and kept trying things I read about (shading, washing, dry brushing, line highlighting), and now I feel I'm really damn good painter. I'm not as good as our new friend and his awesome models, but I think I'm hitting pretty close to the mark after 9 months.
Automotive paint =/= a good idea!
scout sargent telion FTW!
I saw lances gunline army absolutely mow down masons ork army, i mean it wasnt even close the amount of firepower they were just dumping on the boyz.
And I don't have any special talent for painting, aside from the articles in White Dwarf magazine I never went out of my way to research or study painting techniques. Every advancement I've made has come from practice and observation.
Once you get started, advancement happens relatively quickly since it's something you very much learn by doing. There were only a couple years between that land raider, and these guys.
Probably the best advice I can give on painting, is take your time. Some people can knock out miniatures a dozen a night. For me it takes multiple days for even the simplest of models (may have something to do with an overbearing ovarian unit and multiple chaos spawns that live with me). But don't be afraid to show off your work. And don't get offended by criticism. I think what helped me the most was showing off a mini I was very proud of and then having very experienced painters tell me to try this or that and then seeing how those ideas and concepts changes the output. Also, BASE YOUR MINIS. A good base, or basing job on a shitty painted miniature makes that miniature look 10X better.
PS : Use washes, its like playing your kids spongebob game on easy mode (Real fun)
Some random pics of things I painted before I was emotionally crushed by my volume of miniatures triggering the sad but needed cleansing, you can see that my where my acquisition of miniatures skill is high, my ability to paint them is still very low:
Additionally I think I have decided on what forces I want to model and build out and get painted up I wanted opinions. My requirements are A) Lots of fun diverse things to paint and assemble and collect
I think I've decided to go ahead and build my World Eaters army that I had originally planned, and then build my ork waagh out by finishing the painting that has to be done (relatively small task) and adding in alot of the new FW releases in small batches.
Any dissenting opinions or a cooler army idea?
http://www.waronthetable.com
I SAY GOOD DAY TO YOU SIR, GOOD DAY!!!! hit on 4's trying hitting period!
Alqadim: That tyranid looks awesome, actually.
Example:
Of course if you add in my inability to play a game with an unpainted model, you'll see why I've managed to paint so much. I started this hobby to paint little soldiers. The fact that I can use those little guys in a game is pretty awesome.
By the way Gabe, did you get that thing I sent you? :winky:
Gabe is about to get the things Im sending him, You you have to look at his army with airforce envy
http://www.waronthetable.com
This too. From start to finish, I can reliably paint a single infantry-sized figure in the course of an evening. Those broadsides were completed over the course of 3-4 days each. The Tigershark took about a week, but all my evenings were completely free giving me a lot of extra time to devote to it.
I held a good part of his airforce in my hands. I even made sure all the parts were there. Also I still have six Valkyries and a Vulture, so hah. Besides Lt Raslin and his Thunderbolt are more than capable.
Ill post some pics of my first batch of terminators and let you compare them to my latest
And my sturnguard
thats in about 6 months of work, the thing is paintvagrants work is awsome but vagrants been painting since he was 13. He's also willing to give help for people with questions, he taught me a lot of cool tricks about how to make my guys look better. Thing is its simply time and work on painting, that being said id have my epic stuff painted in a heartbeat by pro's cause they look awsome!
Also, Scurvy and Nax, do you want to play a game on Sunday?
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
Oh god yes, it was beautiful, and _so_ big! I'm still trying to figure out how to handle it.
And as of yet, you guys don't even have an inkling about the pièce de résistance of Operation: Unfriendly Skies. And you're not going to for a long, long time. Man, I'm going to be painting for _months_ getting all these aircraft done.
Hmm, yes, but, should the unthinkable happen and we find ourselves on opposite sides of the battlefield, he'd be facing down a Thunderbolt, Lightning, Tigershark, Barracude, 2 Remoras, and that's just the stuff you already know about.
You're making a Manta, aren't you?
I agree. But every few months it seems like there is a "its cheating if you don't paint it yourself' and "dipping isn't painting. You're cheating" argument that is always so pointless :P
Also, I was looking through the SW dex and my wolf priest can take the saga where he adds the # of models he killed in the previus turn to his attacks. I think I might try that...
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
Ill be gone all weekend altmann, but im gonna be up next wed. Ill say this if you have him paint one it will look awsome, display level awsome.
Dipping...I would just say that's a bad plan on retaining any actual details on the model, the same coverage can be achieved with a heavy drybrushing and actually let you keep the details showing.
Honestly, I'd rather see a 'cheated' army painted and playing against me then the gray tide.
certain shortcuts will always have their limitations in quality. I don't give a damn where a person decides to draw their line when I'm happy to see color on it.