* the pinkification of game stuff marketed to girls. Because really, fuck pink, and fuck the way pinkified products are often both crappier and more expensive than the 'normal' base product. You know, the product marketed to people. The fact that a lot of this stuff is marketed to really young kids is even worse.
I dunno if you were implying this, but I feel what is far worse is the games that go straight for gender roles. Who can forget Ubisoft's launching of the "Imagine" series as part of their efforts to target females? The whole thing was about cooking and childrearing.
I think there was a fashion designer and an ice skater, as well.
Oh, and if memory serves, most/all of them were shitty games.
* the pinkification of game stuff marketed to girls. Because really, fuck pink, and fuck the way pinkified products are often both crappier and more expensive than the 'normal' base product. You know, the product marketed to people. The fact that a lot of this stuff is marketed to really young kids is even worse.
I dunno if you were implying this, but I feel what is far worse is the games that go straight for gender roles. Who can forget Ubisoft's launching of the "Imagine" series as part of their efforts to target females? The whole thing was about cooking and childrearing.
Yeah, that stuff exactly. It points to such a narrow view of women, you wonder if anyone involved had actually met one. And its not like it works in the interest of gaming companies; they're basically throwing away an opportunity to massively expand their sales by refusing to even include adult women in marketing plans, let alone catering for them in an inclusive way.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
* the pinkification of game stuff marketed to girls. Because really, fuck pink, and fuck the way pinkified products are often both crappier and more expensive than the 'normal' base product. You know, the product marketed to people. The fact that a lot of this stuff is marketed to really young kids is even worse.
I dunno if you were implying this, but I feel what is far worse is the games that go straight for gender roles. Who can forget Ubisoft's launching of the "Imagine" series as part of their efforts to target females? The whole thing was about cooking and childrearing.
Yeah, that stuff exactly. It points to such a narrow view of women, you wonder if anyone involved had actually met one. And its not like it works in the interest of gaming companies; they're basically throwing away an opportunity to massively expand their sales by refusing to even include adult women in marketing plans, let alone catering for them in an inclusive way.
Not trying to be pedantic, but as a gamer and a woman, what would you like to see in a more "female oriented" gaming campaign?
To me, it seems like the lack of women gamers is more perception than reality.
* the pinkification of game stuff marketed to girls. Because really, fuck pink, and fuck the way pinkified products are often both crappier and more expensive than the 'normal' base product. You know, the product marketed to people. The fact that a lot of this stuff is marketed to really young kids is even worse.
I dunno if you were implying this, but I feel what is far worse is the games that go straight for gender roles. Who can forget Ubisoft's launching of the "Imagine" series as part of their efforts to target females? The whole thing was about cooking and childrearing.
Yeah, that stuff exactly. It points to such a narrow view of women, you wonder if anyone involved had actually met one. And its not like it works in the interest of gaming companies; they're basically throwing away an opportunity to massively expand their sales by refusing to even include adult women in marketing plans, let alone catering for them in an inclusive way.
Not trying to be pedantic, but as a gamer and a woman, what would you like to see in a more "female oriented" gaming campaign?
To me, it seems like the lack of women gamers is more perception than reality.
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
* the pinkification of game stuff marketed to girls. Because really, fuck pink, and fuck the way pinkified products are often both crappier and more expensive than the 'normal' base product. You know, the product marketed to people. The fact that a lot of this stuff is marketed to really young kids is even worse.
I dunno if you were implying this, but I feel what is far worse is the games that go straight for gender roles. Who can forget Ubisoft's launching of the "Imagine" series as part of their efforts to target females? The whole thing was about cooking and childrearing.
Yeah, that stuff exactly. It points to such a narrow view of women, you wonder if anyone involved had actually met one. And its not like it works in the interest of gaming companies; they're basically throwing away an opportunity to massively expand their sales by refusing to even include adult women in marketing plans, let alone catering for them in an inclusive way.
Not trying to be pedantic, but as a gamer and a woman, what would you like to see in a more "female oriented" gaming campaign?
To me, it seems like the lack of women gamers is more perception than reality.
Showing women playing games in commercials is a fantastic start. Nintendo's been doing this, and it's paying off for them.
Last time I checked, there are a good number of females playing games these days, but I believe the distinction is that there tend to be fewer "gamers" that are hobbyists like men.
Just having a woman in the commercial can make an ad campaign more female oriented. The product itself doesn't have to be altered.
Yeah. I also think online gaming providers need to toughen up and actually boot people who go out of their way to abuse other players. Free speech doesn't apply; these exchanges occur in a privately owned commercial space which people pay to access. I think sales and participation would increase if that reputation for choadery disappeared.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
Are you saying more Cooking Mama and less Imagine Cooking?
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
It feels like 18-34 males is less a demographic and more a standard for the video game industry, wherein everyone else is treated like strange and alien outliers that must be tricked into picking up a controller and trapped by simple waggle movements and bright colors.
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
It feels like 18-34 males is less a demographic and more a standard for the video game industry, wherein everyone else is treated like strange and alien outliers that must be tricked into picking up a controller and trapped by simple waggle movements and bright colors.
Such a pity that actually worked on retirees. Damn you, Wii!
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ElldrenIs a woman dammitceterum censeoRegistered Userregular
edited December 2009
Simply pandering less to the already-in-the-bag male demo would be great.
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fuck gendered marketing
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
Are you saying more Cooking Mama and less Imagine Cooking?
I don't know, I haven't played either.
But for example, my wife wants Gordon Ramsay's game because it has some of his actual recipes, and we're both bigtime foodies. But she also loves MarioKart and Little Big Planet, and is better than me at MarioKart. But she can't play fighters or FPS to save her life.
My wife doesn't really appear to have interest in a game's "female" appeal, just how much fun it looks and whether or not she might be good at it.
I don't think there's really a "womens'" demographic at all, past a certain age. Either you like games or you don't.
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
It feels like 18-34 males is less a demographic and more a standard for the video game industry, wherein everyone else is treated like strange and alien outliers that must be tricked into picking up a controller and trapped by simple waggle movements and bright colors.
Such a pity that actually worked on retirees. Damn you, Wii!
I think the hostility of the entrenched gaming culture, those 18-34 males we're talking about, against the Wii and the people getting into the hobby is REALLY INTERESTING. When the system first came out, there was a lot of nerd rage in G&T directed towards "soccer moms" who were buying the systems out because they didn't deserve the honor of playing Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy, as they weren't real gamers. And now that the fanboys are backlashing against the Wii, a lot of the nerd rage is still directed towards girls and women. People are genuinely angry that Nintendo are not marketing towards them and making games suitable for them. Meanwhile, this is working amazingly well for Nintendo, who have the most female primary owners this generation.
Thing is, there are actually some good cooking 'games' out there, where you can actually learn to make awesome food. And they tend to be marketed quite well; its just that there's also cooking Mama out there, which is stupid and useless and marketed poorly. And it kind of poisons the well, I think.
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
It feels like 18-34 males is less a demographic and more a standard for the video game industry, wherein everyone else is treated like strange and alien outliers that must be tricked into picking up a controller and trapped by simple waggle movements and bright colors.
Such a pity that actually worked on retirees. Damn you, Wii!
I think the hostility of the entrenched gaming culture, those 18-34 males we're talking about, against the Wii and the people getting into the hobby is REALLY INTERESTING. When the system first came out, there was a lot of nerd rage in G&T directed towards "soccer moms" who were buying the systems out because they didn't deserve the honor of playing Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy, as they weren't real gamers. And now that the fanboys are backlashing against the Wii, a lot of the nerd rage is still directed towards girls and women. People are genuinely angry that Nintendo are not marketing towards them and making games suitable for them. Meanwhile, this is working amazingly well for Nintendo, who have the most female primary owners this generation.
The anger and defensiveness is really the thing that drives discussions like this, too. I mean, who are these people who can't live with the thought of someone in elasticised jeans liking something they like? Get a job awrfgjhrgrffklgskj.
In fairness development for the Wii has been incredibly weak overall.
If I'd shelled out for one in good faith that Nintendo was going to do awesome stuff with motion control to take the sorts of games I already liked in really awesome new directions, and was instead presented mostly with waggle shovelware, I'd be pissed too.
Sure, the Wii is cheaper than either of the other consoles - significantly so - but a couple hundred bucks is still a couple hundred bucks.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
In fairness development for the Wii has been incredibly weak overall.
If I'd shelled out for one in good faith that Nintendo was going to do awesome stuff with motion control to take the sorts of games I already liked in really awesome new directions, and was instead presented mostly with waggle shovelware, I'd be pissed too.
Sure, the Wii is cheaper than either of the other consoles - significantly so - but a couple hundred bucks is still a couple hundred bucks.
I still think of the Wii as a bust, but not because I don't like who it's being marketed at. Because to me, it doesn't particularly seem to be marketed to anyone.
The top selling titles are all dodges, i.e., games that come with a gimmick, like a new controller, or adapter, or periphreal, or whatever the Wii board was trying to be.
After that, it's all old franchise rehashes, like Zelda, Metroid, and fifteen different Mario games.
What about female games in a competitive sense? I am (and have been) a part of many competitive communities and until quite recently the only reason you'd fine female players doing well (or doing anything) was because it was before the proliferation of Ventrilo and nobody had any idea how many of them were real. That is, there were many joke FPS clans, to take an example, composed of males posing as females. Didn't mean much, but some people got a kick out of how differently they were treated, especially when they did well.
Lack of female gamers in some competitive communities has lead to such stupid moves as creating female divisions or leagues, which only widens the gap. There is no physical reason that a girl can't do as well in a game as a guy. Well, there's the occasional problem of small hands, but that can easily be fixed with special pads, and isn't that big of a deal anyway.
Currently, in about 4 different fighting game communities, I can count the competitive women on 1 hand. In FPS there are like 2, but I don't follow some of the modern ones so I may be off there. In RTS there are less than 1. In DotA there are a fair number who play at competitive levels, but none that are on any sponsored teams (that I can think of right now).
There are these female only clans. Back when I was still playing FPS there was g0d (Girls of Destruction), who were only like 60% female and weren't terrible. Now theres, what, some Girls of Gaming clan who don't really do anything meaningful in competitions, but at least they're there. Keeping themselves nice and separate from the guys for whatever reason.
Now, some competitive communities are kind of abrasive, to put it mildly, but most aren't. Girls would and could be accepted easily enough. Why the numbers aren't there isn't something I can really speculate on, but I do see them going up, which is nice.
Point being: I can't even tell if sexism exists in competitive gaming anymore, on a player-to-player level. I feel that most people at those levels are mature enough to no be bothered, but I have so few examples to base things off of. I do know they've been almost universally positive, though.
PS. I got knocked out of my last two fighting game tourneys by the same girl. She used to suck, now I have to play really well to beat her. Everyone supports her and she has a great time, even though she's usually the only girl in a room with up to 80 rabid fighting game geeks. It took all of an hour for everyone to get used to her being there, though it might help that she comes with her boyfriend and most of us knew her before she started coming to the tourneys.
I know and have played with several very hardcore female WoW players.
Hell, my preferred healer, when I was a raiding MT, was a woman who played a druid, was always on the ball and had her shit ready, and didn't take crap from anyone.
I realize you probably don't count that as competitive, but on my (admittedly shitty) server, several of the notable players in the leading guilds were women.
I've never personally played MMOs, but I know from people who do that women are common enough and do whatever. Things seemed to have progressed from the early iRO days, at least.
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
It feels like 18-34 males is less a demographic and more a standard for the video game industry, wherein everyone else is treated like strange and alien outliers that must be tricked into picking up a controller and trapped by simple waggle movements and bright colors.
Such a pity that actually worked on retirees. Damn you, Wii!
I think the hostility of the entrenched gaming culture, those 18-34 males we're talking about, against the Wii and the people getting into the hobby is REALLY INTERESTING. When the system first came out, there was a lot of nerd rage in G&T directed towards "soccer moms" who were buying the systems out because they didn't deserve the honor of playing Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy, as they weren't real gamers. And now that the fanboys are backlashing against the Wii, a lot of the nerd rage is still directed towards girls and women. People are genuinely angry that Nintendo are not marketing towards them and making games suitable for them. Meanwhile, this is working amazingly well for Nintendo, who have the most female primary owners this generation.
The sense of entitlement that 'gamers' have is hilarious, it's going to be so awful when they're old and the (western) world is full of people who could play video games without being ostracized.
This VGcats is a perfect example of it, actually:
There were quite a few girls in the competitive battlefield 42 community when I played here, but they were mostly the tomboy-ish types.
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
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HacksawJ. Duggan Esq.Wrestler at LawRegistered Userregular
I know and have played with several very hardcore female WoW players.
Hell, my preferred healer, when I was a raiding MT, was a woman who played a druid, was always on the ball and had her shit ready, and didn't take crap from anyone.
I realize you probably don't count that as competitive, but on my (admittedly shitty) server, several of the notable players in the leading guilds were women.
My guild was the same way. Our main tank was a middle aged house wife (in her late 40s, I believe), and several of our other notable members were women, as well. But really, given the way they acted, they were pretty much just one of the guys in our eyes.
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
Getting? I'm only in my early 20s, but they've been that way as long as I can remember. Let's not forget fast food kids meals having separate toys for boys and girls, too.
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
Getting? I'm only in my early 20s, but they've been that way as long as I can remember. Let's not forget fast food kids meals having separate toys for boys and girls, too.
Hah, they don't do that here. I was flabbergasted when I heard about it
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
Wait, moat? I always built a surprisingly complicated town that would be subsequently destroyed in a civil engineering disaster when the nearby dam for lava (tap water) burst because the engineer built it from a lava susceptible material (sand).
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
Getting? I'm only in my early 20s, but they've been that way as long as I can remember. Let's not forget fast food kids meals having separate toys for boys and girls, too.
Hah, they don't do that here. I was flabbergasted when I heard about it
I would like to add generic rage at random pinkification of things. Though I'd also say those things don't seem like they're targeted at actual thinking adolescents, teenagers or children so much as parents who definitely should know better. I mean, it's basically following the same trend as every god damn children's product that's supposed to be targeted at girls.
Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
So random nobody trolls D&D, then runs off never to be heard again? That's just rude.
Also, the obvious place to start with this discussion would be to examine game culture as a microcosm for the rest of society - looking at the questions the OP has asked, it strikes me as odd that she would assume games as different to other media in terms of content.
Newsflash: it's not.
Now whether or not you get to see the broad range of content is really up to you - if you are a connoisseur you will experience a broad and fulfilling range of styles and topics.
If you are a frothing-at-the-mouth Madden/Halo insecure white male teen "gamer" from suburbia... well I think the OP is well aware of that sub-group... of course it is more an indictment on her that she hasn't really experienced more than that... or at least is presenting such a facade.
Also a side note Cass. But using RE for non-sexualised male characters is probably not a great idea. Just look at the communities reaction to them. I doubt what they're loving is Weskers deep and complex characterisation :whistle:
My friend's mum was pretty much the one that introduced our group of friends to WoW. She also played ragnarok a lot before that.
I really don't know what it is about WoW that attracts so many more females than other games, or even if it just seems like it does for some reason.
Less overtly sexist than most games and appeals to an extremely broad audience.
Female blood elves.
Why are they an example of sexism? Because they're slender and pretty? I mean, they don't have massive boobs and their emotes, voice acting and body language is all about "arrogant bitch" which isn't a particularly dangerous sexist stereotype in this context.
As a side note, I've noticed the surprisingly large number of women who play WoW too, both among my RL friends and the people I meet in the game. Some of the most fanatic raiders I've played with have been women. But then, WoW appeals to a very broad audience so this isn't exactly surprising. It's easy to find your niche in a game that offers so much diversity in how you want to play it.
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I think there was a fashion designer and an ice skater, as well.
Oh, and if memory serves, most/all of them were shitty games.
Yeah, that stuff exactly. It points to such a narrow view of women, you wonder if anyone involved had actually met one. And its not like it works in the interest of gaming companies; they're basically throwing away an opportunity to massively expand their sales by refusing to even include adult women in marketing plans, let alone catering for them in an inclusive way.
Not trying to be pedantic, but as a gamer and a woman, what would you like to see in a more "female oriented" gaming campaign?
To me, it seems like the lack of women gamers is more perception than reality.
Its more that I'd like to see less singling out of women as a special demographic, especially when said demographic is promptly re-labelled 'girls'.
Showing women playing games in commercials is a fantastic start. Nintendo's been doing this, and it's paying off for them.
Cut shit like this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QRApvFjJ0U (HAHA! SHE'S SO DUMB!)
http://kotaku.com/5322216/ea-provides-girls-asks-gamers-to-sin-to-win
More women writers and devs in gaming.
That's a good start, at least.
Yeah. I also think online gaming providers need to toughen up and actually boot people who go out of their way to abuse other players. Free speech doesn't apply; these exchanges occur in a privately owned commercial space which people pay to access. I think sales and participation would increase if that reputation for choadery disappeared.
I think that latter part is the biggest problem. It seems all too frequently that "female oriented" becomes "games for girls" becomes "pink pony party!"
But "18-34 males" is a demographic. Is not what's good for the gander not just as good for the goose? Can't women be treated as a demographic, just as long as it doesn't devolve into infantile stereotypes?
It feels like 18-34 males is less a demographic and more a standard for the video game industry, wherein everyone else is treated like strange and alien outliers that must be tricked into picking up a controller and trapped by simple waggle movements and bright colors.
Such a pity that actually worked on retirees. Damn you, Wii!
I don't know, I haven't played either.
But for example, my wife wants Gordon Ramsay's game because it has some of his actual recipes, and we're both bigtime foodies. But she also loves MarioKart and Little Big Planet, and is better than me at MarioKart. But she can't play fighters or FPS to save her life.
My wife doesn't really appear to have interest in a game's "female" appeal, just how much fun it looks and whether or not she might be good at it.
I don't think there's really a "womens'" demographic at all, past a certain age. Either you like games or you don't.
I think the hostility of the entrenched gaming culture, those 18-34 males we're talking about, against the Wii and the people getting into the hobby is REALLY INTERESTING. When the system first came out, there was a lot of nerd rage in G&T directed towards "soccer moms" who were buying the systems out because they didn't deserve the honor of playing Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy, as they weren't real gamers. And now that the fanboys are backlashing against the Wii, a lot of the nerd rage is still directed towards girls and women. People are genuinely angry that Nintendo are not marketing towards them and making games suitable for them. Meanwhile, this is working amazingly well for Nintendo, who have the most female primary owners this generation.
The anger and defensiveness is really the thing that drives discussions like this, too. I mean, who are these people who can't live with the thought of someone in elasticised jeans liking something they like? Get a job awrfgjhrgrffklgskj.
If I'd shelled out for one in good faith that Nintendo was going to do awesome stuff with motion control to take the sorts of games I already liked in really awesome new directions, and was instead presented mostly with waggle shovelware, I'd be pissed too.
Sure, the Wii is cheaper than either of the other consoles - significantly so - but a couple hundred bucks is still a couple hundred bucks.
I still think of the Wii as a bust, but not because I don't like who it's being marketed at. Because to me, it doesn't particularly seem to be marketed to anyone.
The top selling titles are all dodges, i.e., games that come with a gimmick, like a new controller, or adapter, or periphreal, or whatever the Wii board was trying to be.
After that, it's all old franchise rehashes, like Zelda, Metroid, and fifteen different Mario games.
Lack of female gamers in some competitive communities has lead to such stupid moves as creating female divisions or leagues, which only widens the gap. There is no physical reason that a girl can't do as well in a game as a guy. Well, there's the occasional problem of small hands, but that can easily be fixed with special pads, and isn't that big of a deal anyway.
Currently, in about 4 different fighting game communities, I can count the competitive women on 1 hand. In FPS there are like 2, but I don't follow some of the modern ones so I may be off there. In RTS there are less than 1. In DotA there are a fair number who play at competitive levels, but none that are on any sponsored teams (that I can think of right now).
There are these female only clans. Back when I was still playing FPS there was g0d (Girls of Destruction), who were only like 60% female and weren't terrible. Now theres, what, some Girls of Gaming clan who don't really do anything meaningful in competitions, but at least they're there. Keeping themselves nice and separate from the guys for whatever reason.
Now, some competitive communities are kind of abrasive, to put it mildly, but most aren't. Girls would and could be accepted easily enough. Why the numbers aren't there isn't something I can really speculate on, but I do see them going up, which is nice.
Point being: I can't even tell if sexism exists in competitive gaming anymore, on a player-to-player level. I feel that most people at those levels are mature enough to no be bothered, but I have so few examples to base things off of. I do know they've been almost universally positive, though.
PS. I got knocked out of my last two fighting game tourneys by the same girl. She used to suck, now I have to play really well to beat her. Everyone supports her and she has a great time, even though she's usually the only girl in a room with up to 80 rabid fighting game geeks. It took all of an hour for everyone to get used to her being there, though it might help that she comes with her boyfriend and most of us knew her before she started coming to the tourneys.
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Hell, my preferred healer, when I was a raiding MT, was a woman who played a druid, was always on the ball and had her shit ready, and didn't take crap from anyone.
I realize you probably don't count that as competitive, but on my (admittedly shitty) server, several of the notable players in the leading guilds were women.
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The sense of entitlement that 'gamers' have is hilarious, it's going to be so awful when they're old and the (western) world is full of people who could play video games without being ostracized.
This VGcats is a perfect example of it, actually:
There were quite a few girls in the competitive battlefield 42 community when I played here, but they were mostly the tomboy-ish types.
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Would be interesting to see the gender ratios for PvE versus PvP.
I really don't know what it is about WoW that attracts so many more females than other games, or even if it just seems like it does for some reason.
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Boy children's toys (and lets not forget children's clothes as well) are getting pretty ridiculously gendered too. Its even reaching into stuff that has no reason to be gendered at all, like sandpit toys. The plastic fucking spades don't need to be blue and pink, everyone digs a moat the same way >_<
Getting? I'm only in my early 20s, but they've been that way as long as I can remember. Let's not forget fast food kids meals having separate toys for boys and girls, too.
Hah, they don't do that here. I was flabbergasted when I heard about it
Wait, moat? I always built a surprisingly complicated town that would be subsequently destroyed in a civil engineering disaster when the nearby dam for lava (tap water) burst because the engineer built it from a lava susceptible material (sand).
I don't understand!
I think it's just McDonald's that does it.
EDIT:
Lava.
Hope you like miasma!
dwarf fortress is probably the least sexist modern game, even the different gendered nobility are equally useless
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Gendered ear plugs.
http://contexts.org/socimages/2009/01/21/pink-earplugs-for-your-beauty-sleep/
Really now.
Also, the obvious place to start with this discussion would be to examine game culture as a microcosm for the rest of society - looking at the questions the OP has asked, it strikes me as odd that she would assume games as different to other media in terms of content.
Newsflash: it's not.
Now whether or not you get to see the broad range of content is really up to you - if you are a connoisseur you will experience a broad and fulfilling range of styles and topics.
If you are a frothing-at-the-mouth Madden/Halo insecure white male teen "gamer" from suburbia... well I think the OP is well aware of that sub-group... of course it is more an indictment on her that she hasn't really experienced more than that... or at least is presenting such a facade.
Female blood elves.
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Why are they an example of sexism? Because they're slender and pretty? I mean, they don't have massive boobs and their emotes, voice acting and body language is all about "arrogant bitch" which isn't a particularly dangerous sexist stereotype in this context.
As a side note, I've noticed the surprisingly large number of women who play WoW too, both among my RL friends and the people I meet in the game. Some of the most fanatic raiders I've played with have been women. But then, WoW appeals to a very broad audience so this isn't exactly surprising. It's easy to find your niche in a game that offers so much diversity in how you want to play it.