I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
No they can't do to their superior position in society variable, men can never be raped, white men doubly so.
Preacher on
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
Well honestly Joss Whedon is a pretty terrible female character writers. Every one of his "strong" women need a man to be complete.
I thought Buffy got involved with Angel and Spike not because she needed to, but because she wanted to. That said, I despise both of them. Angel is all "gosh I'm emo and broken, don't you think I'm sexy" and Spike is a git.
David Boreanaz can be emo till the cows come home. The man is just hot.
But the character is fucking annoying. And somehow Buffy's panties just fly off for both of them.
And his character on Bones isn't any less annoying. But my boxers would go flying off if the opportunity just presented itself.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
But they have all the power and privilege in our society and if a woman rapes a man its only because she's acting within the patriarchy that men created in the first place.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
Indonesia's biggest rock star, Nazril ''Ariel'' Irham, has been sentenced to 3½ years in prison after personal sex videos were stolen from his laptop and went viral on the internet.
The two videos were not deliberately distributed, but the presiding judge, Singgih Budi Prakoso, said Nazril had shown no remorse and given ''an opportunity for others to spread, produce and prepare a pornographic video''.
The Penny Arcade D&D podcast is just sound, right? No video or anything like that? Because I find just the sound of them talking hard to understand, and I can't really follow what's happening in the campaign.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
Indonesia's biggest rock star, Nazril ''Ariel'' Irham, has been sentenced to 3½ years in prison after personal sex videos were stolen from his laptop and went viral on the internet.
The two videos were not deliberately distributed, but the presiding judge, Singgih Budi Prakoso, said Nazril had shown no remorse and given ''an opportunity for others to spread, produce and prepare a pornographic video''.
The best part about this case is the mistaken belief prior to pornography young boys weren't imagining ladies naked.
Preacher on
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
It is not however, something we are generally afraid of.
Like, I am afraid I might get robbed and stabbed in the process. But not robbed and raped.
I thought it was fear of saying it when someone present had been raped
I guess it would be a numbers game at that point but I figure if you're gonna censor yourself like that (I probably wouldn't but I am not at all saying it's a bad thing, I think it's a nice thing) you might as well go the whole 9
Just know that the next time you make a post that I feel denigrates anyone or anything, even in a joking manner, especially your bizarre and irrational hatred of rich white people, I will report you. Because I am also allowed that right to protest what I consider tasteless and wrong.
Sure
and the mods are free to ignore you because it's not breaking the rules
you're also free to express your discontent with me directly
I don't understand what you're trying to say here
like I think you think you've said something that was supposed to make me have eureka moment or something
...
nope
didn't happen
Man, does anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?
I just put you in the position of Mike and Jerry. And you just went "Well I didn't break any laws so I'll just keep on truckin'"
And you're outraged at those who have stated that same view regarding dickwolves
Eddy on
"and the morning stars I have seen
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
But they have all the power and privilege in our society and if a woman rapes a man its only because she's acting within the patriarchy that men created in the first place.
.......
I dunno if I want to laugh or cry
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
But they have all the power and privilege in our society and if a woman rapes a man its only because she's acting within the patriarchy that men created in the first place.
I see what was done here and I get ze reference, but my brain went "hnnnnnnghhhhhhhhhhh" anyway.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
I don't believe this is the case
It is, according to British law.
does the law literally like say "unless she's a lady"
while i am not directly refuting your point will, i must do two things
i must mention that i am kind of uncomfortable with this sentence
but then again, that shit is par for the course on many of those feminist sites, so i guess she's mostly preaching to the choir.
and i must also peace out for a bit before i get into trouble
I read a lot of feminist blogs, like, legitly, but I understand what he means. There was a blog on one of them a while back that talked about the outrage treadmill - how there's a pressure in activist blogs to blow up every issue into an even bigger outrage than the one before it to maintain readership. That there was a feedback loop to creating bigger and bigger blowups, and feel more and more righteous indignation.
Ultimately, though, this just perpetuates an us vs them mentality, and dehumanizes your opponents in the same way that you're trying to fight, rather than engaging them. It isn't communication.
The dickwolves shirt wasn't removed because someone yelled at Gabe loud enough, but because actual people engaged him in communication.
this goes along with my impressions. and your cartoon is fitting.
i used to read democratic websites back in the bush era and, i guess, kind of escalated my outrage to a point where i was probably one of the people clamoring for MORE DISSENT GODDAMNIT WE ARE GOING TO MAKE THOSE FUCKERS LISTEN until i kind of backed off and got a kind of distaste for not only the enterprise but the methods.
the feminist blogs i've read have entirely been things i've been linked to from this forum, generally by stalwarts like the cat or mythago or arch. and they are not for me, not are they intended to be for me.
It's kind of the ultimate slacktivism too, because it necessitates no engagement, immediately puts the reader in the right and the target (whatever that may be) in the wrong, and all they have to do is leave a comment with "That's so awful! Fuck them!*" You get to feel agentic all day.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
It is not however, something we are generally afraid of.
Like, I am afraid I might get robbed and stabbed in the process. But not robbed and raped.
I thought it was fear of saying it when someone present had been raped
I guess it would be a numbers game at that point but I figure if you're gonna censor yourself like that (I probably wouldn't but I am not at all saying it's a bad thing, I think it's a nice thing) you might as well go the whole 9
Don't be a jerk and all that.
As a rule it's a term I avoid like the plague outside of the internet, and on the internet it only has applicability to like, EVE Online and RTS's for me. And even then.
It's a simple analysis: how bad would I feel if I accidentally had someone in earshot for whom it was an issue? Coz randomly hurting people makes me feel terrible.
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Irond WillWARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!!Cambridge. MAModeratorMod Emeritus
i'm not really feeling the "war on christmas" thing. mostly i think that people do not react all that well to what they see as demands, especially from "outsiders".
Well, to the extent that "outsiders" modulates things like empathy and respect, I guess so.
But I guess I find it problematic that all these people find sexual assault victims to be "outsiders" making illegitimate demands.
I find that fundamentally problematic, because I think it speaks to privilege and a lack of awareness.
I think it should be easy to empathize with people from marginalized groups who get offended at stuff that doesn't bother you at all. It should be really easy to put yourself in their shoes and understand how this can be hurtful for them. Even if you end up standing by what you said, that very simple, very easy, very basic empathy should still occur and it should inform your response to their offense.
There was an article I read recently in some sociological or psychological journal about defining "humor" as "benign-rule breaking" and that this is one of the most comprehensive definitions of humor yet put forward. I particularly liked it, especially because it does a good job of explaining "offense." What is benign rule-breaking for one person is malignant to another, because of their frame of reference. Humor that tackles religion is hilarious to me, while it is not to someone else because they take religion seriously (so breaking its rules is a serious offense, not a benign one).
This is relevant to comedy because someone will always disagree with you on what is benign rule-breaking and what isn't. So, short of humor that really does advocate nasty stuff (i.e. there is a difference between rape jokes, and jokes that condone rape. I'm sure you can picture a Venn diagram here), comedy shouldn't be super concerned with self-censoring, except based on what the comedian themselves finds funny. Audiences will naturally coalesce accordingly.
I don't think rape is special in this way. At the end of the day, we're talking about words causing people pain. And that can happen for a multitude of reasons, as a result of all manner of perfectly defensible humor. I know some people attach perpetuating rape culture to rape jokes a priori, but I disagree with this, though that's another conversation really (personally I find the whole concept of language policing to be pretty stupid, which is very much at odds with most of feminism right now it seems like).
However, when people express discomfort or pain or offense with things you have said, you should not turn around and ridicule them -- because you yourself undoubtedly have rules that you would not consider benign to break. We're all capable of being offended, and it's all equally personal and mostly arbitrary and a result of our environment and our principles and we shouldn't try to generalize it out to moral truth. But we should have basic respect and decency for other people. Which means if people are offended at your jokes as a comedian, you should look at your humor and check it for something legitimately troubling (like condoning or trivializing rape, which I don't personally feel the original comic did, but the shirt definitely did), decide for yourself, and either apologize because it did cross a line, or say nothing, knowing that not everyone belongs in your audience and your comedy does not belong in everyone's brain.
But when people do voice their offense to you, there should be understanding and empathy, not anger. And in some forums and to some audiences, it is worthwhile to self-censor. Especially if you are, say, a politician, whose message is intended for roughly universal consumption within your district, or you are a broadcast network who reaches a wider swath than a niche cable network or web-comic. Because that self-censorship is an indicator of respect and empathy displayed towards other human beings. And that is something which should always be reasonably extended. It is not reasonable to tailor your humor to offend no one, because that is virtually impossible. It may be reasonable to tailor your humor if something you did suddenly offended a significant portion of your audience who otherwise enjoy your work. It may be reasonable to tailor your message to a very broad group if you are addressing a wide swath of people. And, again, it's always inappropriate to advocate hateful or bigoted viewpoints, even if your audience might not raise objection. That's a separate issue.
When people become angry because someone expressed offense, or asked to be accommodated -- well to me that displays a fundamental lack of empathy and respect that I find troubling, and significantly moreso when that lack of empathy is directed at a particular marginalized group, because I don't think you can detach a lack of empathy for oppressed group from the atmosphere of dehumanization and undeservingness that attends discrimination and bigotry and privilege.
The great big world of discrimination and bigotry exists, in my view, to deny people things. Resources, equality, opportunity, freedoms. To have privilege is, definitionally, to have an advantage others do not. Which, by itself, sounds like something most human beings desire (which is probably why privilege is appealing). To privilege oneself is to necessarily deny others. When people subscribe to views that are bigoted, it is generally (I feel -- and probably on an unconscious level; I think this is probably mostly sub-cortical behavior, evolved behavior) to rationalize a denial of resources/opportunity to a group for self-benefit.
Racism is bad because it creates and perpetuates a system where a socially-defined group of people are systematically and ruthlessly denied the resources and opportunities and freedoms and dignities that should be afforded to all people equally. The same goes for sexism and homophobia and transphobia and whatever else.
Discrimination does not exist in the mind of bigots as an end unto itself -- even if they are not fully aware of it, it exists to motivate them to privilege themselves over others. And this is always how discrimination plays out. I mean racism in America meant the destruction of post-war progressivism because people were uncomfortable with how many resources were being allocated to African Americans. Prejudice exists to establish and enforce inequality of rights, and of resources.
I say this because one cannot be prejudiced and empathetic simultaneously. Empathy is the opposite of discrimination. It is the thing we extend to the in-group, to the people we believe deserve our support and respect and who deserve the same slice of pie that we enjoy. It is the thing we extend first and most powerfully to our loved ones, then to our neighbors and friends, and then to our broadest in-groups. It is part of what defines the in-group. It is an evolved response compelling us to come to the aid of our brothers and sisters. There is a reason the great civil rights leaders of the 20th century spoke often and profoundly of love.
So when I see a distinct lack of empathy exhibited for marginalized groups -- I cannot, I will not dissociate it from the reality of prejudice and bigotry, whose heart pulses with alienation. To see another as human, as worthy of respect, is to begin to see them as part of the in-group. And for someone whose goal is to see all people as part of the in-group, I cannot help but be distressed when empathy is retracted from groups of people.
Yes, the feminist blogosphere responded with vitriol in turn, but mostly after the response strip, which was passive-aggressive and itself displayed a distinct and saddening lack of empathy. Anger engenders anger, hate engenders hate.
When the privileged display anger and hate for the oppressed, it should pain us all.
i'm in violent agreement with you for the first 10 paragraphs or so.
i guess i don't really see the critical parallels inherent in the racism tangent or really how this whole episode really applies to "privilege". it's hard for me to imagine internet neckbeards as a particularly privileged group. you might be a man with a hammer here is what i am suggesting.
none of us really know how kirby or whoever else approached mike and jerry about that strip. given kirby's tone on her blog (and not just that specific post either), i'm not really inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt here.
i don't really agree that prejudice and empathy are opposites that can't coexist, and i'm also not especially convinced by your narrative on the pushback against progressivism in the 70s. IIRC the left had really embraced strident militancy by that point and had really pushed away otherwise-sympathetic moderates and lefties, to say nothing of righties.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
But they have all the power and privilege in our society and if a woman rapes a man its only because she's acting within the patriarchy that men created in the first place.
.......
I dunno if I want to laugh or cry
Its a joke nexus, though a real poster holds a similar view.
Preacher on
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
I don't believe this is the case
It is, according to British law.
does the law literally like say "unless she's a lady"
they actually quote then entirety of the Tom Jones song
nexuscrawler on
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
edited January 2011
I wonder how hard Robert Khoo has to work when shit like this happens?
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
I don't believe this is the case
It is, according to British law.
does the law literally like say "unless she's a lady"
Australian law defines rape as penetration without consent.
If a women raped a man though then I imagine she'd be charged with aggravated sexual assault and probably some other things would would cumulatively balance out the sentencing.
electricitylikesme on
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
men can be raped too
It is not however, something we are generally afraid of.
Like, I am afraid I might get robbed and stabbed in the process. But not robbed and raped.
I thought it was fear of saying it when someone present had been raped
I guess it would be a numbers game at that point but I figure if you're gonna censor yourself like that (I probably wouldn't but I am not at all saying it's a bad thing, I think it's a nice thing) you might as well go the whole 9
Don't be a jerk and all that.
As a rule it's a term I avoid like the plague outside of the internet, and on the internet it only has applicability to like, EVE Online and RTS's for me. And even then.
It's a simple analysis: how bad would I feel if I accidentally had someone in earshot for whom it was an issue? Coz randomly hurting people makes me feel terrible.
yeah exactly, I totally get it I think it's respectful. I just meant you might happen to bump into a dude in the same scenario so maybe just don't use the term full stop (like you're saying) rather than just around women.
(all of this being said, I don't think it's inherently disrespectful to use the term in every day talk, and all of that is totally separate from using it in a piece/work/whatever you want to call it.... just since the other topic is floating around as well)
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
Australian law defines rape as penetration without consent.
If a women raped a man though then I imagine she'd be charged with aggravated sexual assault and probably some other things would would cumulatively balance out the sentencing.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH
Oh shit oh god damn thats hilarious. Maybe its different in aussie land, but in america that shits comedy my friend.
Preacher on
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
I will accommodate rape victims if they will sufficiently threatened by this shirt, just as I avoid saying the word rape in a flippant capacity around girls.
Posts
i am fat
that is what this is
when i talked about meeting you in the middle on your way down
i wasn't clowning
Legally? Only by other men.
Women are incapable of rape in the eyes of the law.
Dickwolves of London?
No they can't do to their superior position in society variable, men can never be raped, white men doubly so.
pleasepaypreacher.net
this too
But they have all the power and privilege in our society and if a woman rapes a man its only because she's acting within the patriarchy that men created in the first place.
Castle Dickwolfenstein
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
I don't believe this is the case
It is, according to British law.
The best part about this case is the mistaken belief prior to pornography young boys weren't imagining ladies naked.
pleasepaypreacher.net
I thought it was fear of saying it when someone present had been raped
I guess it would be a numbers game at that point but I figure if you're gonna censor yourself like that (I probably wouldn't but I am not at all saying it's a bad thing, I think it's a nice thing) you might as well go the whole 9
Man, does anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?
I just put you in the position of Mike and Jerry. And you just went "Well I didn't break any laws so I'll just keep on truckin'"
And you're outraged at those who have stated that same view regarding dickwolves
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
.......
I dunno if I want to laugh or cry
well hopefully you have a long way to go before that
if you need a mouth to force yourself to throw up into or anything, let me know, I'm available.
pleasepaypreacher.net
It's kind of the ultimate slacktivism too, because it necessitates no engagement, immediately puts the reader in the right and the target (whatever that may be) in the wrong, and all they have to do is leave a comment with "That's so awful! Fuck them!*" You get to feel agentic all day.
*Whether Bush or Obama or whoever
Don't be a jerk and all that.
As a rule it's a term I avoid like the plague outside of the internet, and on the internet it only has applicability to like, EVE Online and RTS's for me. And even then.
It's a simple analysis: how bad would I feel if I accidentally had someone in earshot for whom it was an issue? Coz randomly hurting people makes me feel terrible.
i'm in violent agreement with you for the first 10 paragraphs or so.
i guess i don't really see the critical parallels inherent in the racism tangent or really how this whole episode really applies to "privilege". it's hard for me to imagine internet neckbeards as a particularly privileged group. you might be a man with a hammer here is what i am suggesting.
none of us really know how kirby or whoever else approached mike and jerry about that strip. given kirby's tone on her blog (and not just that specific post either), i'm not really inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt here.
i don't really agree that prejudice and empathy are opposites that can't coexist, and i'm also not especially convinced by your narrative on the pushback against progressivism in the 70s. IIRC the left had really embraced strident militancy by that point and had really pushed away otherwise-sympathetic moderates and lefties, to say nothing of righties.
Its a joke nexus, though a real poster holds a similar view.
pleasepaypreacher.net
they actually quote then entirety of the Tom Jones song
I'll be that guy has an ulcer.
Nah he just looks at site hits going up and can give advertisers more raw numbers.
pleasepaypreacher.net
Australian law defines rape as penetration without consent.
If a women raped a man though then I imagine she'd be charged with aggravated sexual assault and probably some other things would would cumulatively balance out the sentencing.
yeah exactly, I totally get it I think it's respectful. I just meant you might happen to bump into a dude in the same scenario so maybe just don't use the term full stop (like you're saying) rather than just around women.
(all of this being said, I don't think it's inherently disrespectful to use the term in every day talk, and all of that is totally separate from using it in a piece/work/whatever you want to call it.... just since the other topic is floating around as well)
Guess who just got a raise, yeah baby.
yeah just do your best
i might have a coat around somewhere that would fit you. i'll check around.
if not maybe we can hit up a thrift shop while you're out here or something
Do they not realize how stupid and crass they sound?
Man you know what happens when kids don't have enough access to porn?
They become artists.
nuh uh
:^::^:
Grats dude.
You should celebrate by sending me money.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH
Oh shit oh god damn thats hilarious. Maybe its different in aussie land, but in america that shits comedy my friend.
pleasepaypreacher.net
Why do you assume nerds have the meta-cognitive ability to recognize their own disfunction
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
clearly an erection is consent.