i once super-glued my hand to a mouse and had to get a bus to hospital. not fun.
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
Ouch.
I need to add a tac squad to my army list. It just doesn't seem right otherwise. I want to keep with the theme of a highly mobile force, though, so I plan to drop one of the scout squads. The big one. That will leave me with the one scout squad for the land speeder storm.
Which, in your esteemed opinion, would be better for a 5 man scout squad zipping around in a storm? A 5 man squad with sniper rifles, extra close combat weapons, or shotguns? Or some mix of those?
Why would you think sniper rifles WOULD be a good choice?
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
edited March 2012
I used them last Sunday and they seemed to work pretty well.
And the question was which would you use. I assume by your answer you would NOT use snipers. So which of the other two would you use. Or maybe, instead of those two, a squad with bolters and a heavy bolter would be better.
valhalla130 on
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
Heavy weapons don't exactly lend themselves to the mobility that you seem to be after with the landspeeder.
I haven't played a game with my sniper scouts (a 5 man squad with 4 rifles and a rocket launcher) and I may never. But if I do, I intend to use them to bunker down in cover on objectives and basically just suppress infantry from afar.
I used them last Sunday and they seemed to work pretty well.
And the question was which would you use. I assume by your answer you would NOT use snipers. So which of the other two would you use. Or maybe, instead of those two, a squad with bolters and a heavy bolter would be better.
Keen has the right of it. Heavy weapons and transports (devs with razorback, snipers with a storm) just don't make much sense. There are times when its your only option, but as a rule, its usually not a good way to go. Just trying to get you to think of these things as you look at units and options, so you don't have to post 40 times every 15 minutes :P
As for what I would do: Scouts with Bolters in cover make a pretty good cheap stand-in for Tacticals. Scouts with BP/CCW can take on IGEQ pretty well, or can clean up smaller squads you have shot to hell. I wouldn't recommend them as a dedicated assault element, though.
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
As someone who had an all-Scout and Assault Marine army from the traits era, I can tell you that snipers have only gone downhill since 3rd edition. Single shot heavy, BS-based, wounding on 4+, lackluster AP. Oh, and pinning?
If you're using them, like me and Keen, it's just because the models fucking rule.
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
I used them last Sunday and they seemed to work pretty well.
And the question was which would you use. I assume by your answer you would NOT use snipers. So which of the other two would you use. Or maybe, instead of those two, a squad with bolters and a heavy bolter would be better.
Keen has the right of it. Heavy weapons and transports (devs with razorback, snipers with a storm) just don't make much sense. There are times when its your only option, but as a rule, its usually not a good way to go. Just trying to get you to think of these things as you look at units and options, so you don't have to post 40 times every 15 minutes :P
:P
I hadn't even considered that I want these guys moving, and heavy weapons don't really work well for that. I really am a noob. Of course, this is the kind of stuff I never learned back in the day when I played every weekend. I just lost and couldn't figure out why. It's all these little things that add up. So maybe a mix of bolters and shotguns? Or are shotguns still as crap as they were in 3rd edition? I hear they have rending now?
If you're using 5 scouts in a storm, you want BP/CCW and a Sgt with CM and PF. This will allow you to alpha strike Land Raiders, Battle Wagons, Leman Russ, or small weak squads like Long Fangs, Devastators, Lootas, etc.
Long Fangs will wipe a squad of CC scouts before that fist even gets to swing :P
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
14 attacks. And hope the Sgt doesnt have a power weapon :P
I've charged LFs with the exact same scout squad many, many times. They will lose pretty much every time. Hell, I've charged Long Fangs with ASSAULT MARINES and they get wiped.
Nax on
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
The CCW scouts I used last week seemed to die pretty easily to regular vanilla marines. I don't have high hopes for them.
In other news, I don't understand the wording of a scout bike option. It says that up to 34 scout bikers can replace their boltguns with astartes grenade launchers for a specified point cost. Does that mean all three cost the same or is it that amt for each one? For that matter, in the regular bike squad it says that up to two models can replace their weapons with (meltas in my list). Does that mean each one pays the points cost? I assume so.
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
edited March 2012
If anyone is in NYC and they missed out on the 25th aniversary model, I was in the Compleat Strategist Tuesday and they had what looked like ten of the things. Which is funny because there were a whole lot of sad pandas at the GW store Saturday when the register dude announced that they were out of models.
And what's up with the troop+transport packages? Are they being sold anywhere, because they're not on the GW site. *grumble, grumble, GW sales strategy, grumble*
daveNYC on
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
I usually use 2x squads of sniper scouts with ML in my marine lists. Mostly because I painted them first, but also because I just like the idea of them. Plus Mantis Warriors are sneaky.
Also i like to keep a terminator with CML in my long fang squad.
Makes for a nice roadblock to assaults by weak back-units. I've had that lone terminator run around like a madman because he's the only guy left in the squad just relentlessly missile launching shit and assaulting bitches.
And what's up with the troop+transport packages? Are they being sold anywhere, because they're not on the GW site. *grumble, grumble, GW sales strategy, grumble*
My understanding is that these are only available through your FLGS (or Internet plastic monger).
And what's up with the troop+transport packages? Are they being sold anywhere, because they're not on the GW site. *grumble, grumble, GW sales strategy, grumble*
I think someone said that those are only being sold at brick and mortar stores. I know my flgs has them in stock.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
If you're using them, like me and Keen, it's just because the models fucking rule.
They sure do. I really wish tactical marines could take snipers, or even better, stalker pattern bolters or even silenced bolters.
@valhalla130 I am also bored at work. When these threads don't move I sart to get annoyed because I want to read about warhams without going to BoLS or any of that shit.
And what's up with the troop+transport packages? Are they being sold anywhere, because they're not on the GW site. *grumble, grumble, GW sales strategy, grumble*
I was told they were made FLGS exclusives so they can have something not available in the GW stores.
If you're using them, like me and Keen, it's just because the models fucking rule.
They sure do. I really wish tactical marines could take snipers, or even better, stalker pattern bolters or even silenced bolters.
@valhalla130 I am also bored at work. When these threads don't move I sart to get annoyed because I want to read about warhams without going to BoLS or any of that shit.
I'm right there with you. There are only two places I can get to at work, Bolter and Chainsword and here. I'd rather be here.
In other news, man, math is hard. My eyes are swimming from trying to rework things to get a tac squad in. Turns out, if I do that, I'm pretty much losing the attack bike squad or a predator. And I want to keep those for the anti-tank shots. I'm also pretty much dropping the sniper scouts. I have a land speeder storm with HB and a 5 man scout squad with three bolters and two shotguns. That will be objective grabber, along with my bikes. I could drop a 5 man bike squad with attack bike for 235 points for a 240 ten man tactical squad, but I am in love with the idea of the bikes. As much as I feel it's right and proper to have a tac squad in a space marine army, and I think the Imperial Fists scheme looks great on tac marines, it looks like I'm leaving out the tac squad.
EDIT: I'm downloading Army Builder when I get home.
valhalla130 on
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Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
Battlescribe Mobile is pretty sweet. Got it on my Android Tablet for messing around with stuff when Im away from my computer.... but for my desktop, Army Builder all the way
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
Oh man, once I can get Mobile AB, Battlescribe is getting BALEEEETED
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
FYI: The latest newsletter says Army Builder is going to be releasing mobile and Mac versions in the next few months.
Mac version and they'll have my money, no question. Until then, I've been doing pretty good with Battlescribe; although it has required a lot of editing to get the army lists to really look/function the way I want them to.
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
Ya know... if I have the 2 preds ToT and I were discussin, one with.... ya know... it might be better for me to just list it again.
Captain w/ bike, relica blade, storm shield
Chaplain w/ termie armor and stormbolter
terminator squad w/ 2 LC and 3 TH/SS and Land Raider
Dreadnought with assault cannon
bike squad w/ two meltas, sgt w/ power fist, 2 extra models, attack bike w/ multi-melta
bike squad w/ two meltas, sgt w/ power fist, 2 extra models, attack bike w/ multi-melta
predator w/ autocannon, and heavy bolter side sponsons
predator w/ autocannon and lascannon side sponsons
That comes to 1835 points. Lots of room for wargear, maybe something small. Or.... I could fit in a small 5 man tac squad w/ power fist, plasma gun and rhino for a total of 1995 points. Then i could throw melta bombs on someone.
What say you? The tac squad or some other 165 point unit to round out this list?
He's redoing the Battlescribe Mobile interface as well to be less...obnoxious. The guy's really good at taking and incorporating feedback; he's earned my donations.
FYI: The latest newsletter says Army Builder is going to be releasing mobile and Mac versions in the next few months.
Mac version and they'll have my money, no question. Until then, I've been doing pretty good with Battlescribe; although it has required a lot of editing to get the army lists to really look/function the way I want them to.
"If the beta testing goes as well as we expect, we’ll be releasing Army Builder for the Mac in May!"
He's redoing the Battlescribe Mobile interface as well to be less...obnoxious. The guy's really good at taking and incorporating feedback; he's earned my donations.
Once you figure out how redundant it can be sometimes, its not bad. Certainly works well enough for what it offers you. Still though... AB all the way
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
I used them last Sunday and they seemed to work pretty well.
And the question was which would you use. I assume by your answer you would NOT use snipers. So which of the other two would you use. Or maybe, instead of those two, a squad with bolters and a heavy bolter would be better.
Keen has the right of it. Heavy weapons and transports (devs with razorback, snipers with a storm) just don't make much sense. There are times when its your only option, but as a rule, its usually not a good way to go. Just trying to get you to think of these things as you look at units and options, so you don't have to post 40 times every 15 minutes :P
:P
I hadn't even considered that I want these guys moving, and heavy weapons don't really work well for that. I really am a noob. Of course, this is the kind of stuff I never learned back in the day when I played every weekend. I just lost and couldn't figure out why. It's all these little things that add up. So maybe a mix of bolters and shotguns? Or are shotguns still as crap as they were in 3rd edition? I hear they have rending now?
EDIT: And I post a lot because I'm bored at work.
It's absolutely worth noting that you can run the transport around autonomously as a light tank/mobile cover or let another (combat) squad hop in it.
Edit: Doesn't apply to Storms, though. This is what I get when I don't read the whole conversation!
The CCW scouts I used last week seemed to die pretty easily to regular vanilla marines. I don't have high hopes for them.
In other news, I don't understand the wording of a scout bike option. It says that up to 34 scout bikers can replace their boltguns with astartes grenade launchers for a specified point cost. Does that mean all three cost the same or is it that amt for each one? For that matter, in the regular bike squad it says that up to two models can replace their weapons with (meltas in my list). Does that mean each one pays the points cost? I assume so.
CCW Scouts exist solely as a Power Fist delivery vehicle.
predator w/ autocannon, and heavy bolter side sponsons
predator w/ autocannon and lascannon side sponsons
You're probably better off splitting the Attack Bikes into one unit of 2 and one unit of 1. Three multimeltas is overkill against, well, everything.
Costing this out I get 1825, although you may be running a Crusader rather than a Redeemer? Not sure. With the Redeemer:
Increase both Bike Squads to max size. This allows your meltas + Attack Bike to combat squad off and go hunt tanks while your Bolter bikes mow down infantry.
Buy a Powerfist for you Scout Sargeant, to give them the CC punch required if they're running in a Storm.
2000 points on the nose. Otherwise you'll have to drop 10 points somewhere. Solid, solid list. Eventually you may want to consider dropping the Storm and Scouts for a Bike Command Squad.
Salvation122 on
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
Anyone try out Battlescribe on the Android?
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
I think I had 7 scouts with CCW weapons and they died in the first assault phase both times I assaulted with them.
And what's up with the troop+transport packages? Are they being sold anywhere, because they're not on the GW site. *grumble, grumble, GW sales strategy, grumble*
My understanding is that these are only available through your FLGS (or Internet plastic monger).
How much are they and are they out now? few stores around here bother carrying 40k and such anymore
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valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
I'm running a regular land raider, not a varient. Ya know, I do like the idea of adding to the bike squads and making them bigger. I'll have to buy more bikes of course. What's the conventional wisdom on squad size for something like that? I've never been able to figure out exactly how big my squads should be when I'm given the choice.
My last 3 posts, on this page, have been about Battlescribe on the Android....
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
Posts
I need to add a tac squad to my army list. It just doesn't seem right otherwise. I want to keep with the theme of a highly mobile force, though, so I plan to drop one of the scout squads. The big one. That will leave me with the one scout squad for the land speeder storm.
Which, in your esteemed opinion, would be better for a 5 man scout squad zipping around in a storm? A 5 man squad with sniper rifles, extra close combat weapons, or shotguns? Or some mix of those?
And the question was which would you use. I assume by your answer you would NOT use snipers. So which of the other two would you use. Or maybe, instead of those two, a squad with bolters and a heavy bolter would be better.
I haven't played a game with my sniper scouts (a 5 man squad with 4 rifles and a rocket launcher) and I may never. But if I do, I intend to use them to bunker down in cover on objectives and basically just suppress infantry from afar.
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
Keen has the right of it. Heavy weapons and transports (devs with razorback, snipers with a storm) just don't make much sense. There are times when its your only option, but as a rule, its usually not a good way to go. Just trying to get you to think of these things as you look at units and options, so you don't have to post 40 times every 15 minutes :P
As for what I would do: Scouts with Bolters in cover make a pretty good cheap stand-in for Tacticals. Scouts with BP/CCW can take on IGEQ pretty well, or can clean up smaller squads you have shot to hell. I wouldn't recommend them as a dedicated assault element, though.
If you're using them, like me and Keen, it's just because the models fucking rule.
:P
I hadn't even considered that I want these guys moving, and heavy weapons don't really work well for that. I really am a noob. Of course, this is the kind of stuff I never learned back in the day when I played every weekend. I just lost and couldn't figure out why. It's all these little things that add up. So maybe a mix of bolters and shotguns? Or are shotguns still as crap as they were in 3rd edition? I hear they have rending now?
EDIT: And I post a lot because I'm bored at work.
What are you talking about?
12 attacks (2x4, 1x4)
9 hits
4 wounds
2 dead
Nevermind if any die from bolt pistols.
I've charged LFs with the exact same scout squad many, many times. They will lose pretty much every time. Hell, I've charged Long Fangs with ASSAULT MARINES and they get wiped.
In other news, I don't understand the wording of a scout bike option. It says that up to 34 scout bikers can replace their boltguns with astartes grenade launchers for a specified point cost. Does that mean all three cost the same or is it that amt for each one? For that matter, in the regular bike squad it says that up to two models can replace their weapons with (meltas in my list). Does that mean each one pays the points cost? I assume so.
And what's up with the troop+transport packages? Are they being sold anywhere, because they're not on the GW site. *grumble, grumble, GW sales strategy, grumble*
Makes for a nice roadblock to assaults by weak back-units. I've had that lone terminator run around like a madman because he's the only guy left in the squad just relentlessly missile launching shit and assaulting bitches.
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
My understanding is that these are only available through your FLGS (or Internet plastic monger).
I think someone said that those are only being sold at brick and mortar stores. I know my flgs has them in stock.
They sure do. I really wish tactical marines could take snipers, or even better, stalker pattern bolters or even silenced bolters.
@valhalla130 I am also bored at work. When these threads don't move I sart to get annoyed because I want to read about warhams without going to BoLS or any of that shit.
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
I was told they were made FLGS exclusives so they can have something not available in the GW stores.
Comics, Games, Booze
I'm right there with you. There are only two places I can get to at work, Bolter and Chainsword and here. I'd rather be here.
In other news, man, math is hard. My eyes are swimming from trying to rework things to get a tac squad in. Turns out, if I do that, I'm pretty much losing the attack bike squad or a predator. And I want to keep those for the anti-tank shots. I'm also pretty much dropping the sniper scouts. I have a land speeder storm with HB and a 5 man scout squad with three bolters and two shotguns. That will be objective grabber, along with my bikes. I could drop a 5 man bike squad with attack bike for 235 points for a 240 ten man tactical squad, but I am in love with the idea of the bikes. As much as I feel it's right and proper to have a tac squad in a space marine army, and I think the Imperial Fists scheme looks great on tac marines, it looks like I'm leaving out the tac squad.
EDIT: I'm downloading Army Builder when I get home.
Alternatively ...
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
Mac version and they'll have my money, no question. Until then, I've been doing pretty good with Battlescribe; although it has required a lot of editing to get the army lists to really look/function the way I want them to.
Captain w/ bike, relica blade, storm shield
Chaplain w/ termie armor and stormbolter
terminator squad w/ 2 LC and 3 TH/SS and Land Raider
Dreadnought with assault cannon
bike squad w/ two meltas, sgt w/ power fist, 2 extra models, attack bike w/ multi-melta
bike squad w/ two meltas, sgt w/ power fist, 2 extra models, attack bike w/ multi-melta
scout squad w/ 2 shotguns, 2 bolters, sg w/ combi-melta
landspeeder storm
attack bike squad w/ 3 bikes, and 3 multi-meltas
predator w/ autocannon, and heavy bolter side sponsons
predator w/ autocannon and lascannon side sponsons
That comes to 1835 points. Lots of room for wargear, maybe something small. Or.... I could fit in a small 5 man tac squad w/ power fist, plasma gun and rhino for a total of 1995 points. Then i could throw melta bombs on someone.
What say you? The tac squad or some other 165 point unit to round out this list?
"If the beta testing goes as well as we expect, we’ll be releasing Army Builder for the Mac in May!"
Once you figure out how redundant it can be sometimes, its not bad. Certainly works well enough for what it offers you. Still though... AB all the way
It's absolutely worth noting that you can run the transport around autonomously as a light tank/mobile cover or let another (combat) squad hop in it.
Edit: Doesn't apply to Storms, though. This is what I get when I don't read the whole conversation!
CCW Scouts exist solely as a Power Fist delivery vehicle.
You're probably better off splitting the Attack Bikes into one unit of 2 and one unit of 1. Three multimeltas is overkill against, well, everything.
Costing this out I get 1825, although you may be running a Crusader rather than a Redeemer? Not sure. With the Redeemer:
Increase both Bike Squads to max size. This allows your meltas + Attack Bike to combat squad off and go hunt tanks while your Bolter bikes mow down infantry.
Buy a Powerfist for you Scout Sargeant, to give them the CC punch required if they're running in a Storm.
2000 points on the nose. Otherwise you'll have to drop 10 points somewhere. Solid, solid list. Eventually you may want to consider dropping the Storm and Scouts for a Bike Command Squad.
How much are they and are they out now? few stores around here bother carrying 40k and such anymore
My last 3 posts, on this page, have been about Battlescribe on the Android....