Frank O'Hara is great, but he wasn't a Beat at all. Obviously influenced by them, but he basically constructed the entire first wave new york school from that semi-ironic personism manifesto
Yep. Just for chat, I'll post one of his lesser known poems, about his friend John Ashbery, whom he had nicknamed Ashes.
Ashes on Saturday Afternoon
The banal machines are exposing themselves
on nearby hillocks of arrested color: why
if we are the anthropologists canopé
should this upset the autumn afternoon?
It is because you are silent. Speak, if
speech is not embarrassed by your attention
to the scenery! in languages more livid than
vomit on Sunday after wafer and prayer.
What is the poet for, if not to scream
himself into a hernia of admiration for all
paradoxical integuments: the kiss, the
bomb, cathedrals and the zeppelin anchored
to the hill of dreams? Oh be not silent
on this distressing holiday whose week
has been a chute of sand down which no
factories or castles tumbled: only my
petulant two-fisted heart. You, dear poet,
who addressed yourself to flowers, Electra,
and photographs on less painful occasions,
must save me from the void's eternal noise.
The last line is like the last blow of a hammer on the nail he's pounding. So satisfying.
I know! This is one of my favorite O'Hara poems. He's clearly writing it in imitation of Ashbery, in my opinion. Too bad like no one ever talks about it. It was written around 1952, I think.
O'Hara's collected works are a mess. They don't go in any particular order, which means lots of awful shit is next to lots of brilliant shit.
O'Hara himself kept terrible records if memory serves... he'd write on cocktail napkins and then throw the poems in drawers in his house, unorganized and often undated.
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surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
im actually in cahoots with david nutt at imperial london and were trying to get apomorphine patches tested for nicotine addiction, then cross-license it for alcoholism lol
but good luck getting any drug company to touch it otherwise, its parkinsons or nothing and even then a lot of the variants are orphan drugs
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surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
hmm
scientists up ins. Someone tell me what this drug in the news does? Conexisomething, a pain med that Pfizer settled with BYU over, some patent thing?
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VanguardBut now the dream is over. And the insect is awake.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
Frank O'Hara is great, but he wasn't a Beat at all. Obviously influenced by them, but he basically constructed the entire first wave new york school from that semi-ironic personism manifesto
Yep. Just for chat, I'll post one of his lesser known poems, about his friend John Ashbery, whom he had nicknamed Ashes.
Ashes on Saturday Afternoon
The banal machines are exposing themselves
on nearby hillocks of arrested color: why
if we are the anthropologists canopé
should this upset the autumn afternoon?
It is because you are silent. Speak, if
speech is not embarrassed by your attention
to the scenery! in languages more livid than
vomit on Sunday after wafer and prayer.
What is the poet for, if not to scream
himself into a hernia of admiration for all
paradoxical integuments: the kiss, the
bomb, cathedrals and the zeppelin anchored
to the hill of dreams? Oh be not silent
on this distressing holiday whose week
has been a chute of sand down which no
factories or castles tumbled: only my
petulant two-fisted heart. You, dear poet,
who addressed yourself to flowers, Electra,
and photographs on less painful occasions,
must save me from the void's eternal noise.
The last line is like the last blow of a hammer on the nail he's pounding. So satisfying.
I know! This is one of my favorite O'Hara poems. He's clearly writing it in imitation of Ashbery, in my opinion. Too bad like no one ever talks about it. It was written around 1952, I think.
O'Hara's collected works are a mess. They don't go in any particular order, which means lots of awful shit is next to lots of brilliant shit.
O'Hara himself kept terrible records if memory serves... he'd write on cocktail napkins and then throw the poems in drawers in his house, unorganized and often undated.
This is true. He did date a lot of his work though. I just don't know why it couldn't be organized like, "The Harvard Years", "Working at MoMa", and then into his three books: Meditations in An Emergency, Lunch Poems, Love Poems, etc.
Traveling through the dark I found a deer
dead on the edge of the Wilson River road.
It is usually best to roll them into the canyon:
that road is narrow; to swerve might make more dead.
By glow of the tail-light I stumbled back of the car
and stood by the heap, a doe, a recent killing;
she had stiffened already, almost cold.
I dragged her off; she was large in the belly.
My fingers touching her side brought me the reason--
her side was warm; her fawn lay there waiting,
alive, still, never to be born.
Beside that mountain road I hesitated.
The car aimed ahead its lowered parking lights;
under the hood purred the steady engine.
I stood in the glare of the warm exhaust turning red;
around our group I could hear the wilderness listen.
I thought hard for us all--my only swerving--,
then pushed her over the edge into the river.
William Stafford
for some reason the red exhaust line has always really resonated with me
im actually in cahoots with david nutt at imperial london and were trying to get apomorphine patches tested for nicotine addiction, then cross-license it for alcoholism lol
but good luck getting any drug company to touch it otherwise, its parkinsons or nothing and even then a lot of the variants are orphan drugs
I really need a coffee shop buddy. Someone you can sit with who will watch your stuff while you use the restroom or get another cup, and who you can have quick two-minute conversations with when you find something you want to share with someone.
hmm
scientists up ins. Someone tell me what this drug in the news does? Conexisomething, a pain med that Pfizer settled with BYU over, some patent thing?
Celebrex. It's a COX-2 inhibitor - a special class of NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) used primarily in arthritis patients.
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
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TavIrish Minister for DefenceRegistered Userregular
hmm
scientists up ins. Someone tell me what this drug in the news does? Conexisomething, a pain med that Pfizer settled with BYU over, some patent thing?
Celebrex. It's a COX-2 inhibitor - a special class of NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) used primarily in arthritis patients.
hmm
scientists up ins. Someone tell me what this drug in the news does? Conexisomething, a pain med that Pfizer settled with BYU over, some patent thing?
Celebrex. It's a COX-2 inhibitor - a special class of NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) used primarily in arthritis patients.
ahhhh
pointless for FM.
Eh, does she respond to aspirin or ibuprofen?
If so, she'd probably respond to Celebrex.
They have comparable mechanisms of action.
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
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Options
LudiousI just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered Userregular
This day gets better and better. My CCNA funding just got blown out of the water it looks like. God forbid they approve anything "career enhancing"
you won't even make me a status employee
I've given 7 years of my fucking life to federal service, you won't give me status, you're going to let me go within a year, and I can't compete for other federal jobs I am more than qualified for because YOU WON'T GIVE ME STATUS, and God FUCKING forbid you throw a few sheckles my way for some training because you think it might make me too valuable and I'll quit.
hmm
scientists up ins. Someone tell me what this drug in the news does? Conexisomething, a pain med that Pfizer settled with BYU over, some patent thing?
Celebrex. It's a COX-2 inhibitor - a special class of NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) used primarily in arthritis patients.
ahhhh
pointless for FM.
Eh, does she respond to aspirin or ibuprofen?
If so, she'd probably respond to Celebrex.
They have comparable mechanisms of action.
NSAIDS apparently do nothing for FM pain - it's not an inflammation.
NSAIDS apparently do nothing for FM pain - it's not an inflammation.
Right. Responding to SNRIs implies some etiology irrelevant to COX receptors. (IIRC, your wife takes an SNRI? Effexor or Cymbalta? Or maybe I'm thinking of somebody else.)
I'm still of the belief that fibromyalgia is an umbrella diagnosis and it may actually be caused by a different underlying unidentified disorder in different people.
Feral on
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
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surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
edited May 2012
also there are several hypothetical treatments for fm that are anti-inflammatory in various ways, its not an out-there hypothesis at all
I'm still of the belief that fibromyalgia is an umbrella diagnosis and it may actually be caused by a different underlying unidentified disorder in different people.
to be fair this is a pretty safe bet for most "symptom syndromes" like fm :P
i was under the impression that literally nothing worked for most severe cases of fibromyalgia
Tramadol works OK, but often causes intense nightmares if you take it near bedtime, sooo... you get to have interrupted sleep from wtfhorror in your brain, or you get to have interrupted sleep from tossing and turning because everything hurts.
Hydrocodone helps OK but is habit forming.
That's pretty much it for things you can be prescribed, though cymbalta amazingly does cut the pain by a lot.
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TL DRNot at all confident in his reflexive opinions of thingsRegistered Userregular
NSAIDS apparently do nothing for FM pain - it's not an inflammation.
Right. Responding to SNRIs implies some etiology irrelevant to COX receptors. (IIRC, your wife takes an SNRI? Effexor or Cymbalta? Or maybe I'm thinking of somebody else.)
I'm still of the belief that fibromyalgia is an umbrella diagnosis and it may actually be caused by a different underlying unidentified disorder in different people.
Yeah, my mom has that diagnosis and she was (and may still be?) taking Celebrex.
also there are several hypothetical treatments for fm that are anti-inflammatory in various ways, its not an out-there hypothesis at all
I'm still of the belief that fibromyalgia is an umbrella diagnosis and it may actually be caused by a different underlying unidentified disorder in different people.
to be fair this is a pretty safe bet for most "symptom syndromes" like fm :P
that's the cough syrup treatment?
It's bunk. However, getting solid rest DOES help, so things that knock you the fuck out, like cough medicine or benadryl, do leave you feeling better in the morning.
i was under the impression that literally nothing worked for most severe cases of fibromyalgia
Treating it as though it's neuropathic using the drugs approved for diabetic neuropathic pain (like gabapentin or venlafaxine) seems to help a lot of patients, though not all.
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
NSAIDS apparently do nothing for FM pain - it's not an inflammation.
Right. Responding to SNRIs implies some etiology irrelevant to COX receptors. (IIRC, your wife takes an SNRI? Effexor or Cymbalta? Or maybe I'm thinking of somebody else.)
I'm still of the belief that fibromyalgia is an umbrella diagnosis and it may actually be caused by a different underlying unidentified disorder in different people.
Could be, could be. The brain fog bit is the thing that confuses me most, tbh.
surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
edited May 2012
cough syrup no - but actually, when i was looking into naltrexone (naltrexone everywhere today) some time ago it was a possible treatment due to how it interacts with microglia in some fm sufferers
This day gets better and better. My CCNA funding just got blown out of the water it looks like. God forbid they approve anything "career enhancing"
you won't even make me a status employee
I've given 7 years of my fucking life to federal service, you won't give me status, you're going to let me go within a year, and I can't compete for other federal jobs I am more than qualified for because YOU WON'T GIVE ME STATUS, and God FUCKING forbid you throw a few sheckles my way for some training because you think it might make me too valuable and I'll quit.
i was under the impression that literally nothing worked for most severe cases of fibromyalgia
Tramadol works OK, but often causes intense nightmares if you take it near bedtime, sooo... you get to have interrupted sleep from wtfhorror in your brain, or you get to have interrupted sleep from tossing and turning because everything hurts.
Hydrocodone helps OK but is habit forming.
That's pretty much it for things you can be prescribed, though cymbalta amazingly does cut the pain by a lot.
To play internet pharmacist, has she ever tried/talked to her doctor about gabapentin/neurontin? It some cases it seems to work incredibly well.
Posts
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
That's pretty interesting.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
I haven't read much Berryman. I know his big book is Dream Songs.
I don't think of Ashbery as being sad. I guess there is a melancholy undertone to his work, but it's not like, overtly sad.
O'Hara himself kept terrible records if memory serves... he'd write on cocktail napkins and then throw the poems in drawers in his house, unorganized and often undated.
but good luck getting any drug company to touch it otherwise, its parkinsons or nothing and even then a lot of the variants are orphan drugs
YOUR BRAIN IS A NEUROTRANSMITTERFACE
scientists up ins. Someone tell me what this drug in the news does? Conexisomething, a pain med that Pfizer settled with BYU over, some patent thing?
This is true. He did date a lot of his work though. I just don't know why it couldn't be organized like, "The Harvard Years", "Working at MoMa", and then into his three books: Meditations in An Emergency, Lunch Poems, Love Poems, etc.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
dead on the edge of the Wilson River road.
It is usually best to roll them into the canyon:
that road is narrow; to swerve might make more dead.
By glow of the tail-light I stumbled back of the car
and stood by the heap, a doe, a recent killing;
she had stiffened already, almost cold.
I dragged her off; she was large in the belly.
My fingers touching her side brought me the reason--
her side was warm; her fawn lay there waiting,
alive, still, never to be born.
Beside that mountain road I hesitated.
The car aimed ahead its lowered parking lights;
under the hood purred the steady engine.
I stood in the glare of the warm exhaust turning red;
around our group I could hear the wilderness listen.
I thought hard for us all--my only swerving--,
then pushed her over the edge into the river.
William Stafford
for some reason the red exhaust line has always really resonated with me
Wait I need to hear more about this.
Like a lot more.
And maybe a little footsie. :winky:
Celebrex. It's a COX-2 inhibitor - a special class of NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory) used primarily in arthritis patients.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
ahhhh
pointless for FM.
Eh, does she respond to aspirin or ibuprofen?
If so, she'd probably respond to Celebrex.
They have comparable mechanisms of action.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
you won't even make me a status employee
I've given 7 years of my fucking life to federal service, you won't give me status, you're going to let me go within a year, and I can't compete for other federal jobs I am more than qualified for because YOU WON'T GIVE ME STATUS, and God FUCKING forbid you throw a few sheckles my way for some training because you think it might make me too valuable and I'll quit.
Fuck.
NSAIDS apparently do nothing for FM pain - it's not an inflammation.
It wasn't even a tier list, it was just a list.
Right. Responding to SNRIs implies some etiology irrelevant to COX receptors. (IIRC, your wife takes an SNRI? Effexor or Cymbalta? Or maybe I'm thinking of somebody else.)
I'm still of the belief that fibromyalgia is an umbrella diagnosis and it may actually be caused by a different underlying unidentified disorder in different people.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
to be fair this is a pretty safe bet for most "symptom syndromes" like fm :P
Tramadol works OK, but often causes intense nightmares if you take it near bedtime, sooo... you get to have interrupted sleep from wtfhorror in your brain, or you get to have interrupted sleep from tossing and turning because everything hurts.
Hydrocodone helps OK but is habit forming.
That's pretty much it for things you can be prescribed, though cymbalta amazingly does cut the pain by a lot.
Yeah, my mom has that diagnosis and she was (and may still be?) taking Celebrex.
Batman jumped into one of those owl transformation portals from the Seinfeld comic!
that's the cough syrup treatment?
It's bunk. However, getting solid rest DOES help, so things that knock you the fuck out, like cough medicine or benadryl, do leave you feeling better in the morning.
I know a whole lot about a friend's vagina thanks to all our discussions about that.
Treating it as though it's neuropathic using the drugs approved for diabetic neuropathic pain (like gabapentin or venlafaxine) seems to help a lot of patients, though not all.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Could be, could be. The brain fog bit is the thing that confuses me most, tbh.
but all quite out there
pilot study here
http://snapl.stanford.edu/research/ldn.html
i never followed it up
What you were saying about Apomorphine confused me at first because I didn't realize it's not an opioid.
To play internet pharmacist, has she ever tried/talked to her doctor about gabapentin/neurontin? It some cases it seems to work incredibly well.
Ha! Barely beaten by Feral.
but the pay sucks
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.