Across weekly and monthly you see the same thing. Graves and Ezreal have the highest win rates, with the largest sample sizes when paired with Taric. It's easy to see why too, because they're the 2 AD carries with the best ability to unload burst on the person who just got stunned. Sivir with boomerang blade is really good with him too, but her kit overall is nowhere near as safe and strong as those two.
Ezreal does have the highest win rate with taric, but the other carries have win rates just as high. Look at the actual numbers under the bubbles. The bubble size makes things look brighter.
For instance why do we see, on the monthly charts, 25k Graves/Nunu games and only 5.7k Sivir/Nunu games?
Why do we see 50k Ezreal/Blitzcrank games [53% win rate] and only 12k Miss Fortune/Blitzcrank games [55% win rate]? 12k games is enough to get a proper sample size so its not like we're much more certain of the Ezreal/Blitz strength.
All of the carries, except for Lulu, Karma, and Leona have good champion synergies and bad by those statistics. What is happening atm is that lots of people are playing Ezreal/Taric and Taric/Graves.
Truthfully i think its because fewer people know Leona as a counter to Taric.
You see Ezreal and Graves picked more because they're stronger champs than the other AD carries. Especially Graves, just has literally no weakness in his kit. tankiness, burst damage, mobility, aoe blind/slow, good AS steroid. Ezreal can trade autos with anybody and win because of his W, and has a nice AA reset in Q to enhance his strength in those trades. MF is just not as good as Graves and Ezreal. She's a fine pick, but why pick her when there are two carries(3 really with Corki) who are just stronger at all phases of the game, or others that are far stronger late game(Tristana). You can outplay people with a lesser pick, but it doesn't change that the only reason to pick MF is that you really like playing her.
How do those lolking charts account for champs that can be played in multiple roles? If Miss Fortune is bot and Nunu's top, is that still counted as an MF-Nunu game?
You see Ezreal and Graves picked more because they're stronger champs than the other AD carries. Especially Graves, just has literally no weakness in his kit. tankiness, burst damage, mobility, aoe blind/slow, good AS steroid. Ezreal can trade autos with anybody and win because of his W, and has a nice AA reset in Q to enhance his strength in those trades. MF is just not as good as Graves and Ezreal. She's a fine pick, but why pick her when there are two carries(3 really with Corki) who are just stronger at all phases of the game, or others that are far stronger late game(Tristana). You can outplay people with a lesser pick, but it doesn't change that the only reason to pick MF is that you really like playing her.
Not born out significantly by the data. [And the data actually suggests that Corki is kinda weak]. MF actually has very strong win rates with all supports[that have strong win rates] except Soraka.
The reason you see Graves/Ezreal played a lot is that they aren't countered by an opposing support pick. You can pick them early and not have to worry about someone counter picking your bottom lane hard.
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
Also Leona costs 6300 and Taric costs much less (1350?).
I have a question for you good folks. Which of these build orders do you like best on Mord mid, assuming you're against an AP? Or even a different one altogether.
I always build revolver into Wota, but at different times depending on how the game is going. I'm starting to think going abyssal as my first big item might be the best way, just to abuse the mid more having that MR and shred. I've had good success with all the builds, but I don't think I really like DFG all that much on him, even though it's obviously a good choice on him. I'm thinking about possibly going lichbane as a final item if I get that late game too just to make Qs ruin lives even more, but so far I haven't gotten that long of a game.
He's been carrying me nicely in ranked, but I'd appreciate the opinions of the fine people of this thread.
You see Ezreal and Graves picked more because they're stronger champs than the other AD carries. Especially Graves, just has literally no weakness in his kit. tankiness, burst damage, mobility, aoe blind/slow, good AS steroid. Ezreal can trade autos with anybody and win because of his W, and has a nice AA reset in Q to enhance his strength in those trades. MF is just not as good as Graves and Ezreal. She's a fine pick, but why pick her when there are two carries(3 really with Corki) who are just stronger at all phases of the game, or others that are far stronger late game(Tristana). You can outplay people with a lesser pick, but it doesn't change that the only reason to pick MF is that you really like playing her.
Not born out significantly by the data. [And the data actually suggests that Corki is kinda weak]. MF actually has very strong win rates with all supports[that have strong win rates] except Soraka.
The reason you see Graves/Ezreal played a lot is that they aren't countered by an opposing support pick. You can pick them early and not have to worry about someone counter picking your bottom lane hard.
I agree that Graves and Ezreal aren't countered by an opposing support pick. Or an opposing AD carry pick. Because they're the strongest 2 AD carries right now.
How do those lolking charts account for champs that can be played in multiple roles? If Miss Fortune is bot and Nunu's top, is that still counted as an MF-Nunu game?
I think it is. For instance, Alistar and Malphite don't show up on the "jungler" stat page and there doesn't appear to be any overlap between tops and junglers or junglers and supports.
It should be possible to weed those out [If Alistar has smite he is a jungler] so long as they get the summoner spell data.
I have a question for you good folks. Which of these build orders do you like best on Mord mid, assuming you're against an AP? Or even a different one altogether.
I always build revolver into Wota, but at different times depending on how the game is going. I'm starting to think going abyssal as my first big item might be the best way, just to abuse the mid more having that MR and shred. I've had good success with all the builds, but I don't think I really like DFG all that much on him, even though it's obviously a good choice on him. I'm thinking about possibly going lichbane as a final item if I get that late game too just to make Qs ruin lives even more, but so far I haven't gotten that long of a game.
He's been carrying me nicely in ranked, but I'd appreciate the opinions of the fine people of this thread.
I think it really depends on the matchup and how much damage you're taking. Abyssal is much safer, but if you're stomping no reason not to deathcap.
Thanks for the input. That's kind of how I've been playing it too. I'm loving Mord. I used to just think i'm not going to play somebody who's that easy to gank. Then I realized I can clear every wave with impunity, because if the enemy farms at their tower I just get wraiths, wolves, their wraiths, or roam for kills in other lanes. If they push back hard to keep me in lane, they're taking away their chance to make me over extend. The shield means I can start farming wraiths/wolves easily by like level 4 or 5 with no health loss. Such a beast.
I had an amazing game last night. It was normal blind pick, most mid 20s level range. I end up going top with a feeding Xin who literally spawns and charges right into the enemy duo. I still end up breaking even on the lane as Diana. Then as we get into the first couple of team fights Xin is the first to die as he is under farmed and under leveled. Despite this we are holding our own and perhaps even coming out on top. After like his 11th death Xin calls a surrender vote which we promptly vote down. Xin quits.
I happen to be the only one who notices for a good 10 minutes. After we outright lose a few team fights I mention it. Everyone is like what we didn't even notice. But we struggle on mostly losing the team fights but still pushing towers and eventually inhibs we even get baron once which helps us clear out the final inhib. Finally neither side has any inhibs and the other team goes for baron. We engage them at baron and lose without killing any of them. I call a surrender vote. All they have to do is walk in our base drop two towers and the nexus and win. Surrender vote fails. Other team ports back... I am like ok there are a lot of super minions there. Instead of clearing them out all but one team member heads out to grab other stuff. They lose both their towers. Finally 4 of their members show up to attack our base but two of us are already up. We kill a couple while defending and then bang our super minions drop their nexus. Hilarious. I ended up being the only one on my team with more kills than deaths. This is why you never give up I suppose.
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
I have a question for you good folks. Which of these build orders do you like best on Mord mid, assuming you're against an AP? Or even a different one altogether.
I always build revolver into Wota, but at different times depending on how the game is going. I'm starting to think going abyssal as my first big item might be the best way, just to abuse the mid more having that MR and shred. I've had good success with all the builds, but I don't think I really like DFG all that much on him, even though it's obviously a good choice on him. I'm thinking about possibly going lichbane as a final item if I get that late game too just to make Qs ruin lives even more, but so far I haven't gotten that long of a game.
He's been carrying me nicely in ranked, but I'd appreciate the opinions of the fine people of this thread.
You need a Rylais. Otherwise that's a super squishy build that people can just kite you through. I normally do Revolver, Kages Pick, Rylais. Then dependent on what we need, build. Double AP? Wota. Getting bursted by their mid? Abyssal. Legendary? Deathcap.
You guys are talking about ezreal here being able to trade
How I trade better with ezreal?
How I be better ezreal in general?
One of the regulars k0g (2000+ Elo) on this forum plays a really mean Ez. His stream link is: http://www.own3d.tv/Koguma. If you hang out in his IRC he could probably take you in a game and show you some stuff.
You guys are talking about ezreal here being able to trade
How I trade better with ezreal?
How I be better ezreal in general?
Hit your skillshots. That's seriously it, other than general AD carry stuff such as positioning, attack moving, kiting, but that's not exclusive to a single AD carry.
9-2 in my last 11 ranked solo Q. It's getting easier to do my part to win. I'm not single handedly carrying or anything, but I'm winning my lane every game, and that's a start, and some games I'm carrying pretty hard. Just finished a game as Ashe against a very good Trist/Sona bot lane. Did what I set out to do, which was out CS Trist while putting some points in E early and out golding her. It worked, because I ended the game with 6 kills and her with 4, but due to my E and a couple dragons and one baron I out golded her by like 3k+. I may have had more assists than her too. Our top lane actually got camped and lost, but our mid and bot won, and our Rammus jungle walked over their Lee jungle.
Sometimes team comp is the name of the game too. Our team was Irelia, Ziggs, Rammus, Ashe, Janna, versus Warwick, Mordekaiser, Lee Sin, Trist, Sona. They just didn't have a tanky front line to do anything. Irelia dived Trist every fight, Warwick would want to ult me or ziggs but we both just positioned too well and kited their WW, Lee, and Mord. Ashe with Flash/Ghost and 600 range and a perma slow is just too good for that team comp.
So, it is my goal to get as high an elo as possible by the time GW2 comes out, because then, LoL thread, fond of you guys as I am, I am likely to show up very rarely.
So far I've gone up over 100 points. 1366 and counting! Supports carry errday.
So, it is my goal to get as high an elo as possible by the time GW2 comes out, because then, LoL thread, fond of you guys as I am, I am likely to show up very rarely.
So far I've gone up over 100 points. 1366 and counting! Supports carry errday.
Gah I totally pre purchased GW2 and I hoping I can drag myself away from LoL a couple hours a week to get some time with it. It has been a damn long time since a game has got it's claws into me like LoL has.
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KogumaSpace Jam EnthusiastDunkmaciaRegistered Userregular
You guys are talking about ezreal here being able to trade
How I trade better with ezreal?
How I be better ezreal in general?
One of the regulars k0g (2000+ Elo) on this forum plays a really mean Ez. His stream link is: http://www.own3d.tv/Koguma. If you hang out in his IRC he could probably take you in a game and show you some stuff.
TehSlothHit Or MissI Guess They Never Miss, HuhRegistered Userregular
Tonight I need to do some experimenting to see if Support Star Heimerdinger is as awesome as he seemed or if I just lucked into laning against bads last night. Their team was really weird, vayne/zyra bot, blitz jungle, warwick was either mid or top, and.... don't remember who else, but it was weird. Maybe Vlad.
So, it is my goal to get as high an elo as possible by the time GW2 comes out, because then, LoL thread, fond of you guys as I am, I am likely to show up very rarely.
So far I've gone up over 100 points. 1366 and counting! Supports carry errday.
Gah I totally pre purchased GW2 and I hoping I can drag myself away from LoL a couple hours a week to get some time with it. It has been a damn long time since a game has got it's claws into me like LoL has.
Two days ago I was at 1250. I am now at 1388! My peak from however long ago was 1396. If I win my next game I will beat my peak- and if I win another two games, I'm likely to achieve silver ranking and count myself among the top 10% of players.
[EDIT] Actually if I win my next game I'm likely to achieve silver then and there
If you set it up right with your ferocity stacks, his item, and your ult you can get 4 Q's off in about 2 seconds or so.
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eeSanGI slice like a goddamn hammer.Registered Userregular
edited August 2012
All this talk about Win Rates with bottom lane combos need to realize that this is the win rate for the game, not the lane. Once people know what they're doing, games will rarely last past 30 minutes because the winning team will end it. Late game AD's suddenly don't get to come back once they've behind or sometimes even equal.
Mid game strength is king in solo queue ranked so champions like Vayne, Tristana, and Caitlyn have lower win rates compared to the safer AD caster Carries.
I'm pretty sure my glorious win streak in ranked is about to be over. Got counter picked with Cassio against my Mord, and they have Ali jungle because in spite of us having first pick and him going unbanned, my team did not pick him. My only hope is our Rumble beats Singed, and our MF/Taric bot beats Blitz/Graves, because I am not going to be able to go as aggressive as I want, that's for sure.
I'm pretty sure my glorious win streak in ranked is about to be over. Got counter picked with Cassio against my Mord, and they have Ali jungle because in spite of us having first pick and him going unbanned, my team did not pick him. My only hope is our Rumble beats Singed, and our MF/Taric bot beats Blitz/Graves, because I am not going to be able to go as aggressive as I want, that's for sure.
How did Ali get through the bans?
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eeSanGI slice like a goddamn hammer.Registered Userregular
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You see Ezreal and Graves picked more because they're stronger champs than the other AD carries. Especially Graves, just has literally no weakness in his kit. tankiness, burst damage, mobility, aoe blind/slow, good AS steroid. Ezreal can trade autos with anybody and win because of his W, and has a nice AA reset in Q to enhance his strength in those trades. MF is just not as good as Graves and Ezreal. She's a fine pick, but why pick her when there are two carries(3 really with Corki) who are just stronger at all phases of the game, or others that are far stronger late game(Tristana). You can outplay people with a lesser pick, but it doesn't change that the only reason to pick MF is that you really like playing her.
Not born out significantly by the data. [And the data actually suggests that Corki is kinda weak]. MF actually has very strong win rates with all supports[that have strong win rates] except Soraka.
The reason you see Graves/Ezreal played a lot is that they aren't countered by an opposing support pick. You can pick them early and not have to worry about someone counter picking your bottom lane hard.
1) Revolver, DFG, Deathcap, Abyssal, GA
2) Revolver, Deathcap, Abyssal, GA, Zhonya
3) Revolver, Abyssal, Deathcap, GA, Zhonya
I always build revolver into Wota, but at different times depending on how the game is going. I'm starting to think going abyssal as my first big item might be the best way, just to abuse the mid more having that MR and shred. I've had good success with all the builds, but I don't think I really like DFG all that much on him, even though it's obviously a good choice on him. I'm thinking about possibly going lichbane as a final item if I get that late game too just to make Qs ruin lives even more, but so far I haven't gotten that long of a game.
He's been carrying me nicely in ranked, but I'd appreciate the opinions of the fine people of this thread.
when I tried this after they ruined shadow prince malz they told me no
I agree that Graves and Ezreal aren't countered by an opposing support pick. Or an opposing AD carry pick. Because they're the strongest 2 AD carries right now.
revolver
boots2
dfg
deathcap
remember you ought to upgrade wota i guess, whatevz
lololololololololololololololololololo
Your #3 route is situational for an AP heavy team
and imo always get hourglass before GA
and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
Another reason why Lulu is less common I think
I think it is. For instance, Alistar and Malphite don't show up on the "jungler" stat page and there doesn't appear to be any overlap between tops and junglers or junglers and supports.
It should be possible to weed those out [If Alistar has smite he is a jungler] so long as they get the summoner spell data.
I think it really depends on the matchup and how much damage you're taking. Abyssal is much safer, but if you're stomping no reason not to deathcap.
I happen to be the only one who notices for a good 10 minutes. After we outright lose a few team fights I mention it. Everyone is like what we didn't even notice. But we struggle on mostly losing the team fights but still pushing towers and eventually inhibs we even get baron once which helps us clear out the final inhib. Finally neither side has any inhibs and the other team goes for baron. We engage them at baron and lose without killing any of them. I call a surrender vote. All they have to do is walk in our base drop two towers and the nexus and win. Surrender vote fails. Other team ports back... I am like ok there are a lot of super minions there. Instead of clearing them out all but one team member heads out to grab other stuff. They lose both their towers. Finally 4 of their members show up to attack our base but two of us are already up. We kill a couple while defending and then bang our super minions drop their nexus. Hilarious. I ended up being the only one on my team with more kills than deaths. This is why you never give up I suppose.
Then again, you did have Soraka and Sona.
You need a Rylais. Otherwise that's a super squishy build that people can just kite you through. I normally do Revolver, Kages Pick, Rylais. Then dependent on what we need, build. Double AP? Wota. Getting bursted by their mid? Abyssal. Legendary? Deathcap.
We had to try really hard.
How I trade better with ezreal?
How I be better ezreal in general?
W all the things.
Yelling at butts will never NOT be funny. Thanks, Psy!
Also, Abby is awesome. Keep up with TLH because it's the tits!
I love League of Legends, but seriously...screw you, Teemo.
One of the regulars k0g (2000+ Elo) on this forum plays a really mean Ez. His stream link is: http://www.own3d.tv/Koguma. If you hang out in his IRC he could probably take you in a game and show you some stuff.
and blitz
Hit your skillshots. That's seriously it, other than general AD carry stuff such as positioning, attack moving, kiting, but that's not exclusive to a single AD carry.
Sometimes team comp is the name of the game too. Our team was Irelia, Ziggs, Rammus, Ashe, Janna, versus Warwick, Mordekaiser, Lee Sin, Trist, Sona. They just didn't have a tanky front line to do anything. Irelia dived Trist every fight, Warwick would want to ult me or ziggs but we both just positioned too well and kited their WW, Lee, and Mord. Ashe with Flash/Ghost and 600 range and a perma slow is just too good for that team comp.
So far I've gone up over 100 points. 1366 and counting! Supports carry errday.
None of you do.
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Auto, w, auto, q, auto
Gah I totally pre purchased GW2 and I hoping I can drag myself away from LoL a couple hours a week to get some time with it. It has been a damn long time since a game has got it's claws into me like LoL has.
STRONG ADVICE, THIS ONE GIVES
You can see me here playing stuff: http://www.twitchtv/mynameiskog
twitch.tv/tehsloth
Two days ago I was at 1250. I am now at 1388! My peak from however long ago was 1396. If I win my next game I will beat my peak- and if I win another two games, I'm likely to achieve silver ranking and count myself among the top 10% of players.
[EDIT] Actually if I win my next game I'm likely to achieve silver then and there
damn that guy needs some serious nerfs on his q
If you set it up right with your ferocity stacks, his item, and your ult you can get 4 Q's off in about 2 seconds or so.
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Mid game strength is king in solo queue ranked so champions like Vayne, Tristana, and Caitlyn have lower win rates compared to the safer AD caster Carries.
I wrote my request eloquently with a short story and everything.
Slice like a god damn hammer. LoL: Rafflesia / BNet: Talonflame#11979
Having to play out a game with your team down 0/10 before ten minutes is just a waste of everyone's time
Sure it is more effort, but there is a workaround at least.
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How did Ali get through the bans?
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
No. I wanted Riot to know that I didn't like it >:[
Slice like a god damn hammer. LoL: Rafflesia / BNet: Talonflame#11979