I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Anyway I was never as big a fan of the King's Quest games as I was of QFG or Space Quest. The latter two had actual character beyond references to other media and cliches and far fewer annoying "I am Roberta Williams and I approve this death which you could not possibly have seen coming ahead of time" scenarios.
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
And you know what? The deaths in QFG and SQ were at least amusing pretty much every time, and also instantaneous. You could also tell ahead of time that something was going to be a really bad idea. The hovercraft in the first SQ (and the slot machines) were the exception there, but the Two Guys got a lot better about this.
Well, most point and click adventure games consist primarily of "this goes with this and does that". Advance.
No, not King's Quest though - the series in general is set up especially to punish you for that mentality. And that installment specifically was fucking stupid with the "dead man walking" traps that you can fully advance the game past and you don't get punished for until way after you have any chance to do anything about it(I.e. not feeding the eagle, not grabbing the locket in the Roc's nest, not swapping Mordak's wand), while also not giving you any real indication of which actions out of the ones you need to take are the ones that advance the story past the missables. Or better yet, the portions of the story that are timed so that if you don't figure out or think do it while you have the chance, the game forces you past the missable. (i.e. Roc's Nest)
And what's hilarious is that the game then has the fucking gall - the sheer sadism to hard limit the number of saves you can keep at once.
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AxenMy avatar is Excalibur.Yes, the sword.Registered Userregular
Do this Activision, and I will be your baby with its first hit of crack.
I totally agree. They could really flesh it out and make every ending have a video.
Nah, Sierra was just the publisher, Troika were the developers (a moment of silence, please).
Actually who the Hell owns the IP for Arcanum nowadays? Whoever it is should do the right thing and turn it over to Obsidian.
Unless it is Obsidian, in which case they need to do the right thing and give us Arcanum 2.
Activision does. Obsidian's CTO Chris Jones (who worked on Arcanum) has been trying for years to get to work on the license before he more or less gave up. IIRC.
Maybe Activision would be more inclined now? Who knows.
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AxenMy avatar is Excalibur.Yes, the sword.Registered Userregular
That would be marvelous if they did since Tim Cain is with Obsidian now and as I recall he was the lead for Arcanum.
But I'm not going to hold my breath.
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
Not sure how i feel about the winterbottom developer doing King's Quest. They haven't exactly wowed me yet with adventures.
Infamous Quests should get to work on old sierra properties, preferably Quest for Glory.
And Arcanum to Obsidian.
Infamous Quests already kind of did with Quest for Infamy. In every way that's good or bad, it feels like an old QFG game.
Hell, you never even really feel that infamous in the game. Mostly just "I'm doing good, but being a smartass to people." Like a tame Renegade playthrough.
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Not sure how i feel about the winterbottom developer doing King's Quest. They haven't exactly wowed me yet with adventures.
Infamous Quests should get to work on old sierra properties, preferably Quest for Glory.
And Arcanum to Obsidian.
Infamous Quests already kind of did with Quest for Infamy. In every way that's good or bad, it feels like an old QFG game.
Hell, you never even really feel that infamous in the game. Mostly just "I'm doing good, but being a smartass to people." Like a tame Renegade playthrough.
Not sure how i feel about the winterbottom developer doing King's Quest. They haven't exactly wowed me yet with adventures.
Infamous Quests should get to work on old sierra properties, preferably Quest for Glory.
And Arcanum to Obsidian.
Infamous Quests already kind of did with Quest for Infamy. In every way that's good or bad, it feels like an old QFG game.
Hell, you never even really feel that infamous in the game. Mostly just "I'm doing good, but being a smartass to people." Like a tame Renegade playthrough.
I just came to post exactly that. I actually think I'll start there, as all the reviews for QfI say it's extremely light on actual infamy and the voice acting is shite.
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ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
The voice acting is horrendous. Thankfully you can turn it right the fuck off.
And the writing itself had me laughing a few times.
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Look, Sierra got it from Infocom.
Sierra adventure games were a progression from the text games, and they were fun as hell at the time from someone who rose through the rise of gaming. I don't know how well they would go over today with a new audience however because unless they changed the game itself to be something more then just a point and click kind of adventure game people would probably find them pretty boring. From a nostalgia standpoint id love to play through updated versions of those old games....but i doubt it will be exceptionally profitable to remake the graphics without making the game itself more actiony.
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Look, Sierra got it from Infocom.
Sierra adventure games were a progression from the text games, and they were fun as hell at the time from someone who rose through the rise of gaming. I don't know how well they would go over today with a new audience however because unless they changed the game itself to be something more then just a point and click kind of adventure game people would probably find them pretty boring. From a nostalgia standpoint id love to play through updated versions of those old games....but i doubt it will be exceptionally profitable to remake the graphics without making the game itself more actiony.
Eh.
Theres been a lot of point & click adventures in recent years and people seem to enjoy them. Wadjet Games and especially Daedalic have seemingly be doing well for themselves. Of course, thats not going to give you AAA numbers, but its not like Activision goes all out here.
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jefe414"My Other Drill Hole is a Teleporter"Mechagodzilla is Best GodzillaRegistered Userregular
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Look, Sierra got it from Infocom.
Sierra adventure games were a progression from the text games, and they were fun as hell at the time from someone who rose through the rise of gaming. I don't know how well they would go over today with a new audience however because unless they changed the game itself to be something more then just a point and click kind of adventure game people would probably find them pretty boring. From a nostalgia standpoint id love to play through updated versions of those old games....but i doubt it will be exceptionally profitable to remake the graphics without making the game itself more actiony.
Telltale has been doing pure point n' click for a while now, and they've done extremely well for themselves.
The AAA "sell millions of copies or you have failed" model is finally coming to an end, now that it's easier and cheaper to make games than ever, and so more niche games can be profitable. There was an entire era of gaming where you essentially had to combine adventure game elements with other gaming conventions in order to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and I for one just like my calm, cerebral, storyline-driven adventure games unpolluted by other genres.
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Look, Sierra got it from Infocom.
Sierra adventure games were a progression from the text games, and they were fun as hell at the time from someone who rose through the rise of gaming. I don't know how well they would go over today with a new audience however because unless they changed the game itself to be something more then just a point and click kind of adventure game people would probably find them pretty boring. From a nostalgia standpoint id love to play through updated versions of those old games....but i doubt it will be exceptionally profitable to remake the graphics without making the game itself more actiony.
Telltale has been doing pure point n' click for a while now, and they've done extremely well for themselves.
What?
Edit: Don't get me wrong, but I'm not exactly solely using the mouse and the point and click maneuver (due to QTE's) in newer Telltale adventures. If we're talking Monkey Island and Sam & Max Telltale of course.
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jefe414"My Other Drill Hole is a Teleporter"Mechagodzilla is Best GodzillaRegistered Userregular
Hey look, I loved the live action adventure games from the 90's.
So did I.
But I don't think they aged well, and I'd be surprised if they were on anyone's list to be remade.
Yeah you're probably correct. Besides, kids these days would throw their computer out the window once they realized that at the end of the game, they were going to die because they forgot to grab the plunger in the first 2 minutes of Space Quest II.
Xbox Live: Jefe414
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NocrenLt Futz, Back in ActionNorth CarolinaRegistered Userregular
Hey look, I loved the live action adventure games from the 90's.
So did I.
But I don't think they aged well, and I'd be surprised if they were on anyone's list to be remade.
Yeah you're probably correct. Besides, kids these days would throw their computer out the window once they realized that at the end of the game, they were going to die because they forgot to grab the plunger in the first 2 minutes of Space Quest II.
Didn't Phantasmagoria actually give you the item you need in the final chapter during the opening in the first chapter without any player prompts? That little snowman thing?
The AAA "sell millions of copies or you have failed" model is finally coming to an end, now that it's easier and cheaper to make games than ever, and so more niche games can be profitable. There was an entire era of gaming where you essentially had to combine adventure game elements with other gaming conventions in order to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and I for one just like my calm, cerebral, storyline-driven adventure games unpolluted by other genres.
Wait, isn't your favorite one Quest for Glory/Hero's Quest? The one Sierra offering that's polluted by persistent stat progression (what most people call "RPG elements") that carries over into the next game? Or am I just projecting (because that's MY favorite one)?
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jefe414"My Other Drill Hole is a Teleporter"Mechagodzilla is Best GodzillaRegistered Userregular
Honestly, I can't remember I played those games so very long ago.
I think the time when I finally realized how bullshit it was when I was a kid was during King's Quest V, when you have to go through the desert (an extremely dangerous endeavor) to pick up a random boot before you go into town and see a cat chasing a rat (mouse?) and you need to throw the desert boot at the cat on your first time seeing it or else the rat wouldn't come to save you from certain death later. You weren't given any indication that the game had just become unwinnable if you failed to do it exactly right or that the cat/rat would never appear again, or that you needed to do exactly what I just described to solve that future problem, or that running into the cat/rat too early in the game through simple exploration would make every other action you took until your inevitable demise pointless and futile.
I forgot all about this part. Holy shit.
The thing I always remember is needing to not eat the pie or give it to someone hungry later. Because you would need it to throw at an attacking Yeti, blinding him and making him fall off a cliff.
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Look, Sierra got it from Infocom.
Sierra adventure games were a progression from the text games, and they were fun as hell at the time from someone who rose through the rise of gaming. I don't know how well they would go over today with a new audience however because unless they changed the game itself to be something more then just a point and click kind of adventure game people would probably find them pretty boring. From a nostalgia standpoint id love to play through updated versions of those old games....but i doubt it will be exceptionally profitable to remake the graphics without making the game itself more actiony.
Telltale has been doing pure point n' click for a while now, and they've done extremely well for themselves.
The AAA "sell millions of copies or you have failed" model is finally coming to an end, now that it's easier and cheaper to make games than ever, and so more niche games can be profitable. There was an entire era of gaming where you essentially had to combine adventure game elements with other gaming conventions in order to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and I for one just like my calm, cerebral, storyline-driven adventure games unpolluted by other genres.
Niche games have always been profitable, it's just that a few AAA publishers are starting to realize that they could use them to make some money in the widening gaps between their AAA releases. Kinda surprised it took them so long to figure out. But hey! Sierra!
The AAA "sell millions of copies or you have failed" model is finally coming to an end, now that it's easier and cheaper to make games than ever, and so more niche games can be profitable. There was an entire era of gaming where you essentially had to combine adventure game elements with other gaming conventions in order to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and I for one just like my calm, cerebral, storyline-driven adventure games unpolluted by other genres.
Wait, isn't your favorite one Quest for Glory/Hero's Quest? The one Sierra offering that's polluted by persistent stat progression (what most people call "RPG elements") that carries over into the next game? Or am I just projecting (because that's MY favorite one)?
It is my favorite, but that doesn't mean I don't also really enjoy Space Quest, King's Quest, The Colonel's Bequest...
I mean, I grew up on all of those. And even in QFG, it's really just a different way of solving puzzles. Instead of weird esoteric "figure out the game designer's thought process" puzzles, everything flows logically (an open spell works on things that are closed/throwing a dagger at a candle to disrupt a ritual/barreling in to attack the bad guy makes sense if you're a big tough fighter), but you aren't just a badass from the start. The puzzles in QFG are in figuring out how to build your character to the point they can overcome the obstacles in their path.
Space Quest is probably my favorite of the non-hybrid stuff. I love me some Star Trek spoofing.
Well, since this is the only thread this really fits in...
I have beaten Heroine's Quest with all three classes. I highly recommend it! I had the most fun with the sorceress class, but the thief was a close second.
Since it's free on Steam, there's really no reason at all you shouldn't try it.
Posts
I always felt the Sierra was a little sadistic. They totally set you up to make mistakes.
Well, most point and click adventure games consist primarily of "this goes with this and does that". Advance.
No, not King's Quest though - the series in general is set up especially to punish you for that mentality. And that installment specifically was fucking stupid with the "dead man walking" traps that you can fully advance the game past and you don't get punished for until way after you have any chance to do anything about it(I.e. not feeding the eagle, not grabbing the locket in the Roc's nest, not swapping Mordak's wand), while also not giving you any real indication of which actions out of the ones you need to take are the ones that advance the story past the missables. Or better yet, the portions of the story that are timed so that if you don't figure out or think do it while you have the chance, the game forces you past the missable. (i.e. Roc's Nest)
And what's hilarious is that the game then has the fucking gall - the sheer sadism to hard limit the number of saves you can keep at once.
Nah, Sierra was just the publisher, Troika were the developers (a moment of silence, please).
Actually who the Hell owns the IP for Arcanum nowadays? Whoever it is should do the right thing and turn it over to Obsidian.
Unless it is Obsidian, in which case they need to do the right thing and give us Arcanum 2.
Activision does. Obsidian's CTO Chris Jones (who worked on Arcanum) has been trying for years to get to work on the license before he more or less gave up. IIRC.
Maybe Activision would be more inclined now? Who knows.
But I'm not going to hold my breath.
I just want more good steampunk RPGs. I don't give a fuck what anyone says, I love steampunk shit and want to see more of it in games.
Infamous Quests already kind of did with Quest for Infamy. In every way that's good or bad, it feels like an old QFG game.
Hell, you never even really feel that infamous in the game. Mostly just "I'm doing good, but being a smartass to people." Like a tame Renegade playthrough.
A little?
That's exactly why they should be involved in this.
Wait! They put out Quest for Infamy?!
I thought it had been cancelled!
http://store.steampowered.com/app/264560/
You can also get it from gog and lots of other places.
I know what I'm doing the rest of today!
I don't know if you've seen/heard about this, but there is Heroine's Quest as well.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/283880
And the writing itself had me laughing a few times.
...who the hell is Gorath? I love the series and i dont know who that is.
Jimmy's death hit me hard, but i still finished the series and it was good.
Look, Sierra got it from Infocom.
Sierra adventure games were a progression from the text games, and they were fun as hell at the time from someone who rose through the rise of gaming. I don't know how well they would go over today with a new audience however because unless they changed the game itself to be something more then just a point and click kind of adventure game people would probably find them pretty boring. From a nostalgia standpoint id love to play through updated versions of those old games....but i doubt it will be exceptionally profitable to remake the graphics without making the game itself more actiony.
Eh.
Theres been a lot of point & click adventures in recent years and people seem to enjoy them. Wadjet Games and especially Daedalic have seemingly be doing well for themselves. Of course, thats not going to give you AAA numbers, but its not like Activision goes all out here.
Hey look, I loved the live action adventure games from the 90's.
Trying to do that stupid gemstone lore puzzle without the book of answers... and you couldn't learn the answers anywhere in game...
Robin Hood died many, many times.
Do... Re... Mi... So... Fa.... Do... Re.... Do...
Forget it...
But I don't think they aged well, and I'd be surprised if they were on anyone's list to be remade.
Telltale has been doing pure point n' click for a while now, and they've done extremely well for themselves.
The AAA "sell millions of copies or you have failed" model is finally coming to an end, now that it's easier and cheaper to make games than ever, and so more niche games can be profitable. There was an entire era of gaming where you essentially had to combine adventure game elements with other gaming conventions in order to make them appeal to as many people as possible, and I for one just like my calm, cerebral, storyline-driven adventure games unpolluted by other genres.
What?
Edit: Don't get me wrong, but I'm not exactly solely using the mouse and the point and click maneuver (due to QTE's) in newer Telltale adventures. If we're talking Monkey Island and Sam & Max Telltale of course.
Yeah you're probably correct. Besides, kids these days would throw their computer out the window once they realized that at the end of the game, they were going to die because they forgot to grab the plunger in the first 2 minutes of Space Quest II.
Didn't Phantasmagoria actually give you the item you need in the final chapter during the opening in the first chapter without any player prompts? That little snowman thing?
Niche games have always been profitable, it's just that a few AAA publishers are starting to realize that they could use them to make some money in the widening gaps between their AAA releases. Kinda surprised it took them so long to figure out. But hey! Sierra!
It is my favorite, but that doesn't mean I don't also really enjoy Space Quest, King's Quest, The Colonel's Bequest...
I mean, I grew up on all of those. And even in QFG, it's really just a different way of solving puzzles. Instead of weird esoteric "figure out the game designer's thought process" puzzles, everything flows logically (an open spell works on things that are closed/throwing a dagger at a candle to disrupt a ritual/barreling in to attack the bad guy makes sense if you're a big tough fighter), but you aren't just a badass from the start. The puzzles in QFG are in figuring out how to build your character to the point they can overcome the obstacles in their path.
Space Quest is probably my favorite of the non-hybrid stuff. I love me some Star Trek spoofing.
I have beaten Heroine's Quest with all three classes. I highly recommend it! I had the most fun with the sorceress class, but the thief was a close second.
Since it's free on Steam, there's really no reason at all you shouldn't try it.
That snuck up on me!