In this situation my oxygen mask is not practical.
And shit his teachers are miserable. Today the dad of one of the kids in class took the device away from his kid and just interrupted to ask a bunch of questions about their packets and also he couldn't find most of the papers in them for the last six weeks anyway and it took a LOT of time out of the like 80 minutes they get each day they get with her because that's the schedule the school set up. A bunch of kids aren't doing the work and it's holding up time in class so all she does is math anymore, which they're behind on because the kids don't do their work.
WTF. Shame she couldn't just mute him until he gave the device back to his kid.
I don't understand any of this opening up, let alone with schools, until.we.have a vaccine. I saw on CNN that air borne droplets can go 18 feet in 2 seconds with 5 mph winds. Yes we can all wear masks, but some people refuse to, and how do you get kids to? There is no way this doesn't spread in schools if they reopen.
I know we all want to get back to normal, but why are we rushing it when this thing is so deadly. Even if you get it and survive, there's evidence of nasty effects that stay with you. And we dont even know if you're able to get it a second time.
I mean there's a mystery illness in kids right now that's covid related. If I could I wouldn't leave my house for a year.
I cannot do that. I do not know what I'm supposed to do if I need to do this in August because I don't think I will be able to.
Form a quarantine pod with a few other families and rotate homeschooling duties?
edit: not trying to be flippant; I have no idea how feasible that is
Calica on
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
I mean, we should use this time as an opportunity to change the school year to be something more year round, less of a massive summer break and so on. That way, kids will have more time to catch up, and also we can start to address some of the logistical problems of what we have now.
I mean, we should use this time as an opportunity to change the school year to be something more year round, less of a massive summer break and so on. That way, kids will have more time to catch up, and also we can start to address some of the logistical problems of what we have now.
You better pay us like, 200% more. People who do not teach do not realize how fucking exhausting the job is. Going year round would drive us all insane and burn out would cause a ton of people to leave the profession, fast. And there's already a crisis where we do not have nearly enough new teachers to replace the retiring ones.
Though maybe this experience will instruct people as to the reality.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
I mean, we should use this time as an opportunity to change the school year to be something more year round, less of a massive summer break and so on. That way, kids will have more time to catch up, and also we can start to address some of the logistical problems of what we have now.
You better pay us like, 200% more. People who do not teach do not realize how fucking exhausting the job is. Going year round would drive us all insane and burnt out would cause a ton of people to leave the profession, fast. And there's already a crisis where we do not have nearly enough new teachers to replace the retiring ones.
Though maybe this experience will instruct people as to the reality.
I mean, you would have the same amount of time in breaks, just between each quarter instead of all at once.
I mean, we should use this time as an opportunity to change the school year to be something more year round, less of a massive summer break and so on. That way, kids will have more time to catch up, and also we can start to address some of the logistical problems of what we have now.
You better pay us like, 200% more. People who do not teach do not realize how fucking exhausting the job is. Going year round would drive us all insane and burnt out would cause a ton of people to leave the profession, fast. And there's already a crisis where we do not have nearly enough new teachers to replace the retiring ones.
Though maybe this experience will instruct people as to the reality.
I mean, you would have the same amount of time in breaks, just between each quarter instead of all at once.
Trust me, it does not work that way.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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KetarCome on upstairswe're having a partyRegistered Userregular
I mean, we should use this time as an opportunity to change the school year to be something more year round, less of a massive summer break and so on. That way, kids will have more time to catch up, and also we can start to address some of the logistical problems of what we have now.
You better pay us like, 200% more. People who do not teach do not realize how fucking exhausting the job is. Going year round would drive us all insane and burnt out would cause a ton of people to leave the profession, fast. And there's already a crisis where we do not have nearly enough new teachers to replace the retiring ones.
Though maybe this experience will instruct people as to the reality.
I mean, you would have the same amount of time in breaks, just between each quarter instead of all at once.
This is a little bit like arguing that if you give someone Monday and Thursday off each week that it's effectively the same as having a typical weekend since you have the same amount of time in breaks. Having done that schedule, it really, really isn't.
In this situation my oxygen mask is not practical.
And shit his teachers are miserable. Today the dad of one of the kids in class took the device away from his kid and just interrupted to ask a bunch of questions about their packets and also he couldn't find most of the papers in them for the last six weeks anyway and it took a LOT of time out of the like 80 minutes they get each day they get with her because that's the schedule the school set up. A bunch of kids aren't doing the work and it's holding up time in class so all she does is math anymore, which they're behind on because the kids don't do their work.
WTF. Shame she couldn't just mute him until he gave the device back to his kid.
I don't understand any of this opening up, let alone with schools, until.we.have a vaccine. I saw on CNN that air borne droplets can go 18 feet in 2 seconds with 5 mph winds. Yes we can all wear masks, but some people refuse to, and how do you get kids to? There is no way this doesn't spread in schools if they reopen.
I know we all want to get back to normal, but why are we rushing it when this thing is so deadly. Even if you get it and survive, there's evidence of nasty effects that stay with you. And we dont even know if you're able to get it a second time.
I mean there's a mystery illness in kids right now that's covid related. If I could I wouldn't leave my house for a year.
I cannot do that. I do not know what I'm supposed to do if I need to do this in August because I don't think I will be able to.
Form a quarantine pod with a few other families and rotate homeschooling duties?
edit: not trying to be flippant; I have no idea how feasible that is
I mean, that is kind of the idea that some schools are looking where possible. Smaller classes and they are basically locked in those groups during the school day. Meaning no grade wide recess or something. Feasibility is of course a whole other issue.
I get that it's difficult to handle young kids/teaching and working and the whole world-changing global disaster of a pandemic all at the same time - it certainly sounds nightmarish and those of you handling it have my sympathies
But man does it make me uncomfortable when talk about how kids need to be back in school as soon as possible spares little to no thought for the teachers who would be thrown into the firing line to do so
Their safety needs to be seriously considered and taken into account, and if the children are physically safe and capable of doing at least some learning from home with future considerations for the school they're missing being adapted into the curriculum... It seems like a much better solution that doesn't put yet another group of drastically underpaid people at risk of death or long-term injury
Younger kids are not capable of doing some learning from home. Parents of younger children are incapable of working, even remotely with any effectiveness. A decent fraction of them are not physically safe at home, and, are being regularly left at home alone while their essential worker parents go to work. A huge fraction of American children are living in 1 bedroom apartments with extended family with no outdoor space.
If you don't think its safe enough to open schools, then you need to close other businesses until it IS safe enough to open schools.
In this situation my oxygen mask is not practical.
And shit his teachers are miserable. Today the dad of one of the kids in class took the device away from his kid and just interrupted to ask a bunch of questions about their packets and also he couldn't find most of the papers in them for the last six weeks anyway and it took a LOT of time out of the like 80 minutes they get each day they get with her because that's the schedule the school set up. A bunch of kids aren't doing the work and it's holding up time in class so all she does is math anymore, which they're behind on because the kids don't do their work.
WTF. Shame she couldn't just mute him until he gave the device back to his kid.
I don't understand any of this opening up, let alone with schools, until.we.have a vaccine. I saw on CNN that air borne droplets can go 18 feet in 2 seconds with 5 mph winds. Yes we can all wear masks, but some people refuse to, and how do you get kids to? There is no way this doesn't spread in schools if they reopen.
I know we all want to get back to normal, but why are we rushing it when this thing is so deadly. Even if you get it and survive, there's evidence of nasty effects that stay with you. And we dont even know if you're able to get it a second time.
I mean there's a mystery illness in kids right now that's covid related. If I could I wouldn't leave my house for a year.
I cannot do that. I do not know what I'm supposed to do if I need to do this in August because I don't think I will be able to.
Form a quarantine pod with a few other families and rotate homeschooling duties?
edit: not trying to be flippant; I have no idea how feasible that is
I mean, that is kind of the idea that some schools are looking where possible. Smaller classes and they are basically locked in those groups during the school day. Meaning no grade wide recess or something. Feasibility is of course a whole other issue.
Its certainly what every rich family will be doing. Hire private tutors, test them, and ship a group of kids off to an isolated country home to form a mini boarding school. Quarantine everyone till they get two negative tests in a row 4 days apart and then school can start, and then noone in for the term. Food delivery done in a couple of massive deliveries once a month.
edit - And the answer to any "This wont work!" comments is more testing. Likely everyone every 4 days if needs be. But, this was a huge part of WHY private boarding schools with live in teachers, cooks, and farms existed in the first place. Get all the kids out of the city, and safely ensconsed out in the country. To keep the rich kids safe from any number of horrible respiratory illnesses in cities. And it worked. And they did it WITHOUT testing support.
I mean, we should use this time as an opportunity to change the school year to be something more year round, less of a massive summer break and so on. That way, kids will have more time to catch up, and also we can start to address some of the logistical problems of what we have now.
You better pay us like, 200% more. People who do not teach do not realize how fucking exhausting the job is. Going year round would drive us all insane and burn out would cause a ton of people to leave the profession, fast. And there's already a crisis where we do not have nearly enough new teachers to replace the retiring ones.
Though maybe this experience will instruct people as to the reality.
Same time off but spread throughout the year works fine.
My wife's school was down to six weeks off for Summer but basically had the same number of days as schools on more traditional calendars.
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ceresWhen the last moon is cast over the last star of morningAnd the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderatormod
I get that it's difficult to handle young kids/teaching and working and the whole world-changing global disaster of a pandemic all at the same time - it certainly sounds nightmarish and those of you handling it have my sympathies
But man does it make me uncomfortable when talk about how kids need to be back in school as soon as possible spares little to no thought for the teachers who would be thrown into the firing line to do so
Their safety needs to be seriously considered and taken into account, and if the children are physically safe and capable of doing at least some learning from home with future considerations for the school they're missing being adapted into the curriculum... It seems like a much better solution that doesn't put yet another group of drastically underpaid people at risk of death or long-term injury
And I am 1000% with you on this. A thousand million billion percentages with you. But the problem is, I cannot do it. I cannot do this long term. I'm getting through it by the skin of my teeth as it is. They will need to never have any homework to do and everything taken care of under teacher supervision or I will need to leave them and be somewhere else.
Two rooms. Two rooms. Two kids, two schools, and if their dad ends up with a job somehow and needs to work from home, a whole lot of noise conflict. They will need to be quiet, which, on top of managing their classes and homework and making sure they attend and get the work they need done, I will need to ensure so their dad can do the work he will need to do. That will be much harder for the hours of fighting to get my son to do his work, made worse because I have no way to easily separate him from his sister without putting one of them in the bathroom, so they just distract each other and play. I am not capable of doing that long term. If we could isolate the school and everyone involved in a big commune I would do it, but it's not practical and there is no safety net in place for me otherwise.
I'm not trying to downplay the situation or say teachers should just suck it up and work because I don't feel like it. I am trying to do what I can to acknowledge my limitations as someone with some pretty rough pre-existing mental health issues. I worry for my own safety come August, because after a few days and staring down the barrel of a whole school year of this the kids will be fine and physically safe, but I may actually be a danger to myself. With my husband here to do a little of it while he's out of work I am hanging on by a single fraying thread, knowing that in 2 1/2 weeks I won't need to do this anymore. I'm borrowing against the month of June, but I can hold on. If we hit August and that is not the case I have absolutely no idea what I will do.
ceres on
And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
I'm relatively sure I've posted it before in one of these threads, but here is a comparison between our traditional scheduling for the school year and a more balanced year-round schedule for the school year.
So, you have cut summer vacation in half but in exchange you break up the huge blocks in the fall & the spring.
And I know some teachers may be opposed to giving up their extended summer vacation, but holy shit I have seen what the gauntlet of second semester looks like for educator and students and it ain't great! March through May is usually broken up a week off for Spring Break and a long week for Memorial Day, with some intense testing near the end of it. Its those huge stretches with no real time off that just grind you down.
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
All of this doesn't matter though if we don't have a vaccine or some vast, durable herd immunity.
You can't simply can't re-open schools because of the threat to the staff.
As a substitute teacher, the high school I primarily work at has at least two dozen teachers over fifty (and that's with us just replacing almost a dozen staff who retired in the last four years). The other substitutes I work with, who would fill in those positions when a teacher gets sick? At least 75% are retired teachers over fifty.
During a good year staff will joke that they hope they catch a weaker disease like the common cold over something like the flu or a stomach flu, because schools are just constantly flooded in diseases.
Unless you are going to have every adult wear an isolation suit with their own oxygen supply, you just can't re-open schools because it will kill the staff.
I'm relatively sure I've posted it before in one of these threads, but here is a comparison between our traditional scheduling for the school year and a more balanced year-round schedule for the school year.
So, you have cut summer vacation in half but in exchange you break up the huge blocks in the fall & the spring.
And I know some teachers may be opposed to giving up their extended summer vacation, but holy shit I have seen what the gauntlet of second semester looks like for educator and students and it ain't great! March through May is usually broken up a week off for Spring Break and a long week for Memorial Day, with some intense testing near the end of it. Its those huge stretches with no real time off that just grind you down.
That's more or less how it's done here in Switzerland, though I don't know about other European countries. I never had an extended summer break until I got to Uni - and it was already bad enough that we had five weeks off in summer when I was a kid, because I hated summer...
Thirith on
"Nothing is gonna save us forever but a lot of things can save us today." - Night in the Woods
I'm relatively sure I've posted it before in one of these threads, but here is a comparison between our traditional scheduling for the school year and a more balanced year-round schedule for the school year.
So, you have cut summer vacation in half but in exchange you break up the huge blocks in the fall & the spring.
And I know some teachers may be opposed to giving up their extended summer vacation, but holy shit I have seen what the gauntlet of second semester looks like for educator and students and it ain't great! March through May is usually broken up a week off for Spring Break and a long week for Memorial Day, with some intense testing near the end of it. Its those huge stretches with no real time off that just grind you down.
That's more or less how it's done here in Switzerland, though I don't know about other European countries. I never had an extended summer break until I got to Uni - and it was already bad enough that we had five weeks off in summer when I was a kid, because I hated summer...
You do realize that just because there are no kids doesn't mean teachers aren't expected to work, right?
Teachers could be expected to be at school the first and last school day of any break lasting more than just 2 days. Any break lasting more than a week could have professional development days the teacher is expected to attend. If you broke a single 6 week summer break into 6 single week breaks, that will easily turn into at least 1 less week of break for a teacher
Edit: removed the @, sorry for not seeing it sooner Phillishere
I get that it's difficult to handle young kids/teaching and working and the whole world-changing global disaster of a pandemic all at the same time - it certainly sounds nightmarish and those of you handling it have my sympathies
But man does it make me uncomfortable when talk about how kids need to be back in school as soon as possible spares little to no thought for the teachers who would be thrown into the firing line to do so
Their safety needs to be seriously considered and taken into account, and if the children are physically safe and capable of doing at least some learning from home with future considerations for the school they're missing being adapted into the curriculum... It seems like a much better solution that doesn't put yet another group of drastically underpaid people at risk of death or long-term injury
And I am 1000% with you on this. A thousand million billion percentages with you. But the problem is, I cannot do it. I cannot do this long term. I'm getting through it by the skin of my teeth as it is. They will need to never have any homework to do and everything taken care of under teacher supervision or I will need to leave them and be somewhere else.
Two rooms. Two rooms. Two kids, two schools, and if their dad ends up with a job somehow and needs to work from home, a whole lot of noise conflict. They will need to be quiet, which, on top of managing their classes and homework and making sure they attend and get the work they need done, I will need to ensure so their dad can do the work he will need to do. That will be much harder for the hours of fighting to get my son to do his work, made worse because I have no way to easily separate him from his sister without putting one of them in the bathroom, so they just distract each other and play. I am not capable of doing that long term. If we could isolate the school and everyone involved in a big commune I would do it, but it's not practical and there is no safety net in place for me otherwise.
I'm not trying to downplay the situation or say teachers should just suck it up and work because I don't feel like it. I am trying to do what I can to acknowledge my limitations as someone with some pretty rough pre-existing mental health issues. I worry for my own safety come August, because after a few days and staring down the barrel of a whole school year of this the kids will be fine and physically safe, but I may actually be a danger to myself. With my husband here to do a little of it while he's out of work I am hanging on by a single fraying thread, knowing that in 2 1/2 weeks I won't need to do this anymore. I'm borrowing against the month of June, but I can hold on. If we hit August and that is not the case I have absolutely no idea what I will do.
Uh.
If he's out of work, why is he only doing "a little" of the childcare?
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ceresWhen the last moon is cast over the last star of morningAnd the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderatormod
I get that it's difficult to handle young kids/teaching and working and the whole world-changing global disaster of a pandemic all at the same time - it certainly sounds nightmarish and those of you handling it have my sympathies
But man does it make me uncomfortable when talk about how kids need to be back in school as soon as possible spares little to no thought for the teachers who would be thrown into the firing line to do so
Their safety needs to be seriously considered and taken into account, and if the children are physically safe and capable of doing at least some learning from home with future considerations for the school they're missing being adapted into the curriculum... It seems like a much better solution that doesn't put yet another group of drastically underpaid people at risk of death or long-term injury
And I am 1000% with you on this. A thousand million billion percentages with you. But the problem is, I cannot do it. I cannot do this long term. I'm getting through it by the skin of my teeth as it is. They will need to never have any homework to do and everything taken care of under teacher supervision or I will need to leave them and be somewhere else.
Two rooms. Two rooms. Two kids, two schools, and if their dad ends up with a job somehow and needs to work from home, a whole lot of noise conflict. They will need to be quiet, which, on top of managing their classes and homework and making sure they attend and get the work they need done, I will need to ensure so their dad can do the work he will need to do. That will be much harder for the hours of fighting to get my son to do his work, made worse because I have no way to easily separate him from his sister without putting one of them in the bathroom, so they just distract each other and play. I am not capable of doing that long term. If we could isolate the school and everyone involved in a big commune I would do it, but it's not practical and there is no safety net in place for me otherwise.
I'm not trying to downplay the situation or say teachers should just suck it up and work because I don't feel like it. I am trying to do what I can to acknowledge my limitations as someone with some pretty rough pre-existing mental health issues. I worry for my own safety come August, because after a few days and staring down the barrel of a whole school year of this the kids will be fine and physically safe, but I may actually be a danger to myself. With my husband here to do a little of it while he's out of work I am hanging on by a single fraying thread, knowing that in 2 1/2 weeks I won't need to do this anymore. I'm borrowing against the month of June, but I can hold on. If we hit August and that is not the case I have absolutely no idea what I will do.
Uh.
If he's out of work, why is he only doing "a little" of the childcare?
The really short answer is "talking to headhunters and dealing with the unemployment office, but he sits with the 3yo for hers when he can because she needs someone to sit with her, makes lunch sometimes, and helps the 7yo with his homework when he can." More to the point though, even if he weren't doing any of that I'd probably deal, the bigger problem will be keeping the two of them quiet enough for another human being to have a thought in their head 6ft away.
And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
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MayabirdPecking at the keyboardRegistered Userregular
Something I've noticed: there are lots of countries and cities where death statistics seem to be widely or openly available. That's how different journalists around the world have been able to figure out excess death spikes (or lack thereof) in many places recently, such as these trackers from the New York Times. A country I have not seen on this or any or listing? Japan.
I had been wondering if the drop in suicides in Japan was actually greater than the COVID-19 deaths. People know that the suicide rate is high, but it's actually even higher than what is known because due to various systemic cultural issues, it's underreported. But then, COVID-19 deaths could also be underreported for similar systemic problems. Just seeing some excess death chart for even just a small part of Japan might be useful, but I can't find anything anywhere. Anyone know where such information might be available (if it is at all)?
There isn't really any data available for this. Excess deaths haven't really become a topic taken up by the mainstream Japanese media yet and coverage from other outlets is essentially just experts making guesses based on what little information has been released by the National Institute of Infectious Diseases (this information is not particularly detailed and only goes up to early April, i.e., the time that a state of emergency was declared).
That would explain why I can't find any data for it. I guess the only way we'd know if SARS2 was much worse in Japan than we thought is if the census numbers end up being lower than what they 'should' be, eventually, whenever that happens.
"I'd have to save up my vacation time for 4 years to get one school year worth of time off that a teacher gets!"
That's how people see it. It's not really correct, because time not at school isn't necessarily vacation time but it's going to be hard to explain otherwise. I've got no frame of reference other than two adult friends who now teach and one of them also does a continued education / job skills program for people with disabilities and while work isn't physically hard like roofing, it looks emotionally exhausting and doesn't appear to have set hours.
Hopefully several things come out of the way in which this extensive disruption of life totally fucks over those who were previously unappreciated. This is however The United States of Fuck You For Not Working To Death though, so it's probably going to just disappoint everyone in 3 months when the same arguments are made that "summer break is over, I don't want to daycare my kids anymore - open schools!"
Quarterly terms is how Australia and New Zealand run a school year and it works fine.
My elementary school in Texas did something similar and I loved it. When you're poor, three months in suburbia with nothing to do is Hell.
But what about the best games?
Jump off the shed.
Run around the neighborhood barefoot.
Throw the glass bottle.
Break the fluorescent lights behind the convenience store.
Get a note from mom to go buy smokes.
Use the hose.
Classics!
Edit: My school districts were switching to a year round schedule as I was getting out of gradeschool. It sounded pretty cool and friends at schools who rolled it out always seemed to be on a vacation or about to be on vacation.
All of this doesn't matter though if we don't have a vaccine or some vast, durable herd immunity.
You can't simply can't re-open schools because of the threat to the staff.
As a substitute teacher, the high school I primarily work at has at least two dozen teachers over fifty (and that's with us just replacing almost a dozen staff who retired in the last four years). The other substitutes I work with, who would fill in those positions when a teacher gets sick? At least 75% are retired teachers over fifty.
During a good year staff will joke that they hope they catch a weaker disease like the common cold over something like the flu or a stomach flu, because schools are just constantly flooded in diseases.
Unless you are going to have every adult wear an isolation suit with their own oxygen supply, you just can't re-open schools because it will kill the staff.
Why is this argument valid for teachers and not for water treatment plant workers, electrical line maintenance workers or farmers? School is an essential need for children and for the parents of those children. It’s not negotiable. A whole generation is being thrown onto the trash pile.
The question is not and cannot be “will schools open” is is and can only be “how will schools open”
If every teacher needs to be tested every 3 days, then do it. If every parent needs to be tested. Do it. If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it. If we need to commandeer private facilities to use as extra classrooms then do it. Even if all we can do is kids going to school 2 or 3 days a week in two groups then DO IT.
Parents set up secret schools to teach their daughters under the threat of death from the Taliban in Afghanistan. They will do the same here if there is no school.
@ceres, I know this isn't quite the same situation, but my husband was doing full-time childcare with our toddler for over a month in about the same amount of space (with me only able to help a few times a day) and he was in the same boat as you. Our daycare offered to take him back, and we gratefully accepted, but in the dark days before this happened I was making contingency plans with everything on the table. I was carefully calculating the point at which I would just hire a part-time nanny through the "black market" (anonymous solicitation on reddit or craigslist) and found some way to drop the kid off at their place (or had them come to our place, and just had my husband take a walk). There's plenty of people unemployed who have "enough" credentials for child-minding that I was willing to roll the dice on it - I figured I could probably even find someone who was otherwise isolated - and we have enough savings that I could have paid someone else's rent for a bit. Thankfully it didn't come to that, but arguably sending my child back to the daycare along with the kids of "essential" workers is putting all of us MORE at risk than any of that, so... there you are.
My brother and sister-in-law, who live with us, were quite put out that I was even considering this, but they never offered to help (not even after hearing what I was considering!!), and they don't have children of their own. They couldn't understand.
Do what you need to do.
kijunshi on
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
Plus you need a very specific set of skilks and a certain personality to work with kids all day. Its not something you can throw anybody into.
When I was tutoring kids for every hour I was with them, it was at least another hour of coming up with what the plan for that day was. And that was without me having to meet certain school guidelines.
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
I can guarantee you that as a woman who hates children, if I was conscripted and forced to 'teach' them, then I would teach them only things that no parent wants their children learning.
What would they do, fire me?
Come on kids, we're gonna learn how to say 'eat shit and die' in English, Spanish, and ASL! Then, we're watching a movie called 'Hellraiser'.
Before following any advice, opinions, or thoughts I may have expressed in the above post, be warned: I found Keven Costners "Waterworld" to be a very entertaining film.
We've tied childcare to school as much as we've tied school to education because a minimum of two full time incomes are required to survive.
Which puts private childcare in the favorable position of charging as much as possible while still making working a full time job only slightly more economically viable than being stay at home with one caregiver. They even price it in such a way that two kids with daycare often works out because of reduced rates.
It's not exactly a scam but it's part of the exploitive nature of our economic model constantly demanding more while slimming the margins.
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
I can guarantee you that as a woman who hates children, if I was conscripted and forced to 'teach' them, then I would teach them only things that no parent wants their children learning.
What would they do, fire me?
Come on kids, we're gonna learn how to say 'eat shit and die' in English, Spanish, and ASL! Then, we're watching a movie called 'Hellraiser'.
With a funding increase you could bring in substitute teachers to manage classes and keep the class sizes smaller with training from a full time teacher and their lesson plans, but funding for education is hard to come by.
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
I can guarantee you that as a woman who hates children, if I was conscripted and forced to 'teach' them, then I would teach them only things that no parent wants their children learning.
What would they do, fire me?
Come on kids, we're gonna learn how to say 'eat shit and die' in English, Spanish, and ASL! Then, we're watching a movie called 'Hellraiser'.
"Today, were gonna teach your parents a lesson!"
"This is how you operate a lighter! Have some matches!"
Also the real answer to that question is essential is not essential for society it's essential right now. Food is. Water is. Electricity is. School isn't.
With a funding increase you could bring in substitute teachers to manage classes and keep the class sizes smaller with training from a full time teacher and their lesson plans, but funding for education is hard to come by.
Most problems with all of this are funding(or timing) issues. Even with subs for smaller class sizes, you then need classrooms. Which basically means trailers, which means more janitorial staff. This is before how do you stop the cafeteria problems? You split the 3 lunch hours into 6 and you have some kids eating right as they get to school, and some right before they leave. Then you have to sanitize between each lunch period. Were not going to pay for hazmat suits for teachers.
This all ignores how long you think it will take before a kid brings an entire wing of a facility to its knees when he fake sneezes late in the day?
Realistically you could telepresence a teacher into multiple rooms to cut down on subs. But with subs I've never had any (short or long term) that gave an ounce of a shit. They range from the good end of not giving a shit, to the bad end of 'I can finally live out my authoritarian dream by giving suspensions to kids in homeroom for talking ohnowhyisariotstarting'
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
I can guarantee you that as a woman who hates children, if I was conscripted and forced to 'teach' them, then I would teach them only things that no parent wants their children learning.
What would they do, fire me?
Come on kids, we're gonna learn how to say 'eat shit and die' in English, Spanish, and ASL! Then, we're watching a movie called 'Hellraiser'.
Also WTF why just women? Men are incapable of teaching children apparently?
+37
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ceresWhen the last moon is cast over the last star of morningAnd the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderatormod
All of this doesn't matter though if we don't have a vaccine or some vast, durable herd immunity.
You can't simply can't re-open schools because of the threat to the staff.
As a substitute teacher, the high school I primarily work at has at least two dozen teachers over fifty (and that's with us just replacing almost a dozen staff who retired in the last four years). The other substitutes I work with, who would fill in those positions when a teacher gets sick? At least 75% are retired teachers over fifty.
During a good year staff will joke that they hope they catch a weaker disease like the common cold over something like the flu or a stomach flu, because schools are just constantly flooded in diseases.
Unless you are going to have every adult wear an isolation suit with their own oxygen supply, you just can't re-open schools because it will kill the staff.
Why is this argument valid for teachers and not for water treatment plant workers, electrical line maintenance workers or farmers? School is an essential need for children and for the parents of those children. It’s not negotiable. A whole generation is being thrown onto the trash pile.
The question is not and cannot be “will schools open” is is and can only be “how will schools open”
If every teacher needs to be tested every 3 days, then do it. If every parent needs to be tested. Do it. If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it. If we need to commandeer private facilities to use as extra classrooms then do it. Even if all we can do is kids going to school 2 or 3 days a week in two groups then DO IT.
Parents set up secret schools to teach their daughters under the threat of death from the Taliban in Afghanistan. They will do the same here if there is no school.
This is bonkers. We can't even test all the sick people, I don't think that's going to change much honestly, I don't think states will be allowed to have the test and where they are they won't do them. We can't do this to people, the kids will survive. I won't. I am the problem. I don't have an answer, but if state governments don't figure it out I'm in trouble. They probably will not figure it out and kids and parents and teachers will be in danger, or they will for different reasons. But you can't conscript people. It will not be a lost generation. Where are you getting this stuff? Cite your damn sources. How will an entire generation of children be cast to the wolves if they miss a few months of school? There are big problems to solve, but if we aren't addressing the right ones we can't have a good solution.
And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
+26
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I ZimbraWorst song, played on ugliest guitarRegistered Userregular
If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it.
Conscription has historically not been a great idea. Women aged between 20 and 35 might feel they have been profiled based upon their sex and age. They might also have other things to do, what with generally being part of the workforce otherwise. Being a woman aged between 20 and 35 does not involve having been trained for managing classrooms of children. It also puts these women at risk - and again we have no idea about personal circumstances; some might be shielding for parents or others at home - which, if you're conscripting them, is quite high on the unethical scale. I could go on...
I can guarantee you that as a woman who hates children, if I was conscripted and forced to 'teach' them, then I would teach them only things that no parent wants their children learning.
What would they do, fire me?
Come on kids, we're gonna learn how to say 'eat shit and die' in English, Spanish, and ASL! Then, we're watching a movie called 'Hellraiser'.
"Today, were gonna teach your parents a lesson!"
"Today we're going to learn about one of our greatest Americans: Soupy Sales. So what I want you to do is get your mom's purse..."
Posts
WTF. Shame she couldn't just mute him until he gave the device back to his kid.
Form a quarantine pod with a few other families and rotate homeschooling duties?
edit: not trying to be flippant; I have no idea how feasible that is
You better pay us like, 200% more. People who do not teach do not realize how fucking exhausting the job is. Going year round would drive us all insane and burn out would cause a ton of people to leave the profession, fast. And there's already a crisis where we do not have nearly enough new teachers to replace the retiring ones.
Though maybe this experience will instruct people as to the reality.
I mean, you would have the same amount of time in breaks, just between each quarter instead of all at once.
Trust me, it does not work that way.
This is a little bit like arguing that if you give someone Monday and Thursday off each week that it's effectively the same as having a typical weekend since you have the same amount of time in breaks. Having done that schedule, it really, really isn't.
I mean, that is kind of the idea that some schools are looking where possible. Smaller classes and they are basically locked in those groups during the school day. Meaning no grade wide recess or something. Feasibility is of course a whole other issue.
Younger kids are not capable of doing some learning from home. Parents of younger children are incapable of working, even remotely with any effectiveness. A decent fraction of them are not physically safe at home, and, are being regularly left at home alone while their essential worker parents go to work. A huge fraction of American children are living in 1 bedroom apartments with extended family with no outdoor space.
If you don't think its safe enough to open schools, then you need to close other businesses until it IS safe enough to open schools.
Its certainly what every rich family will be doing. Hire private tutors, test them, and ship a group of kids off to an isolated country home to form a mini boarding school. Quarantine everyone till they get two negative tests in a row 4 days apart and then school can start, and then noone in for the term. Food delivery done in a couple of massive deliveries once a month.
edit - And the answer to any "This wont work!" comments is more testing. Likely everyone every 4 days if needs be. But, this was a huge part of WHY private boarding schools with live in teachers, cooks, and farms existed in the first place. Get all the kids out of the city, and safely ensconsed out in the country. To keep the rich kids safe from any number of horrible respiratory illnesses in cities. And it worked. And they did it WITHOUT testing support.
Same time off but spread throughout the year works fine.
My wife's school was down to six weeks off for Summer but basically had the same number of days as schools on more traditional calendars.
Come Overwatch with meeeee
And I am 1000% with you on this. A thousand million billion percentages with you. But the problem is, I cannot do it. I cannot do this long term. I'm getting through it by the skin of my teeth as it is. They will need to never have any homework to do and everything taken care of under teacher supervision or I will need to leave them and be somewhere else.
Two rooms. Two rooms. Two kids, two schools, and if their dad ends up with a job somehow and needs to work from home, a whole lot of noise conflict. They will need to be quiet, which, on top of managing their classes and homework and making sure they attend and get the work they need done, I will need to ensure so their dad can do the work he will need to do. That will be much harder for the hours of fighting to get my son to do his work, made worse because I have no way to easily separate him from his sister without putting one of them in the bathroom, so they just distract each other and play. I am not capable of doing that long term. If we could isolate the school and everyone involved in a big commune I would do it, but it's not practical and there is no safety net in place for me otherwise.
I'm not trying to downplay the situation or say teachers should just suck it up and work because I don't feel like it. I am trying to do what I can to acknowledge my limitations as someone with some pretty rough pre-existing mental health issues. I worry for my own safety come August, because after a few days and staring down the barrel of a whole school year of this the kids will be fine and physically safe, but I may actually be a danger to myself. With my husband here to do a little of it while he's out of work I am hanging on by a single fraying thread, knowing that in 2 1/2 weeks I won't need to do this anymore. I'm borrowing against the month of June, but I can hold on. If we hit August and that is not the case I have absolutely no idea what I will do.
So, you have cut summer vacation in half but in exchange you break up the huge blocks in the fall & the spring.
And I know some teachers may be opposed to giving up their extended summer vacation, but holy shit I have seen what the gauntlet of second semester looks like for educator and students and it ain't great! March through May is usually broken up a week off for Spring Break and a long week for Memorial Day, with some intense testing near the end of it. Its those huge stretches with no real time off that just grind you down.
You can't simply can't re-open schools because of the threat to the staff.
As a substitute teacher, the high school I primarily work at has at least two dozen teachers over fifty (and that's with us just replacing almost a dozen staff who retired in the last four years). The other substitutes I work with, who would fill in those positions when a teacher gets sick? At least 75% are retired teachers over fifty.
During a good year staff will joke that they hope they catch a weaker disease like the common cold over something like the flu or a stomach flu, because schools are just constantly flooded in diseases.
Unless you are going to have every adult wear an isolation suit with their own oxygen supply, you just can't re-open schools because it will kill the staff.
"Nothing is gonna save us forever but a lot of things can save us today." - Night in the Woods
You do realize that just because there are no kids doesn't mean teachers aren't expected to work, right?
Teachers could be expected to be at school the first and last school day of any break lasting more than just 2 days. Any break lasting more than a week could have professional development days the teacher is expected to attend. If you broke a single 6 week summer break into 6 single week breaks, that will easily turn into at least 1 less week of break for a teacher
Edit: removed the @, sorry for not seeing it sooner Phillishere
https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/225683/education-where-silicon-valley-is-whats-the-matter-with-kansas/p1
"Nothing is gonna save us forever but a lot of things can save us today." - Night in the Woods
Uh.
If he's out of work, why is he only doing "a little" of the childcare?
That would explain why I can't find any data for it. I guess the only way we'd know if SARS2 was much worse in Japan than we thought is if the census numbers end up being lower than what they 'should' be, eventually, whenever that happens.
Thanks!
That's how people see it. It's not really correct, because time not at school isn't necessarily vacation time but it's going to be hard to explain otherwise. I've got no frame of reference other than two adult friends who now teach and one of them also does a continued education / job skills program for people with disabilities and while work isn't physically hard like roofing, it looks emotionally exhausting and doesn't appear to have set hours.
Hopefully several things come out of the way in which this extensive disruption of life totally fucks over those who were previously unappreciated. This is however The United States of Fuck You For Not Working To Death though, so it's probably going to just disappoint everyone in 3 months when the same arguments are made that "summer break is over, I don't want to daycare my kids anymore - open schools!"
My elementary school in Texas did something similar and I loved it. When you're poor, three months in suburbia with nothing to do is Hell.
But what about the best games?
Jump off the shed.
Run around the neighborhood barefoot.
Throw the glass bottle.
Break the fluorescent lights behind the convenience store.
Get a note from mom to go buy smokes.
Use the hose.
Classics!
Edit: My school districts were switching to a year round schedule as I was getting out of gradeschool. It sounded pretty cool and friends at schools who rolled it out always seemed to be on a vacation or about to be on vacation.
Why is this argument valid for teachers and not for water treatment plant workers, electrical line maintenance workers or farmers? School is an essential need for children and for the parents of those children. It’s not negotiable. A whole generation is being thrown onto the trash pile.
The question is not and cannot be “will schools open” is is and can only be “how will schools open”
If every teacher needs to be tested every 3 days, then do it. If every parent needs to be tested. Do it. If we need to have conscription where women between 20 and 35 (lowest viral risk) are enlisted as classroom helpers with the kids while the older teachers call in via zoom to big video walls then do it. If we need to commandeer private facilities to use as extra classrooms then do it. Even if all we can do is kids going to school 2 or 3 days a week in two groups then DO IT.
Parents set up secret schools to teach their daughters under the threat of death from the Taliban in Afghanistan. They will do the same here if there is no school.
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My brother and sister-in-law, who live with us, were quite put out that I was even considering this, but they never offered to help (not even after hearing what I was considering!!), and they don't have children of their own. They couldn't understand.
Do what you need to do.
Plus you need a very specific set of skilks and a certain personality to work with kids all day. Its not something you can throw anybody into.
When I was tutoring kids for every hour I was with them, it was at least another hour of coming up with what the plan for that day was. And that was without me having to meet certain school guidelines.
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
I can guarantee you that as a woman who hates children, if I was conscripted and forced to 'teach' them, then I would teach them only things that no parent wants their children learning.
What would they do, fire me?
Come on kids, we're gonna learn how to say 'eat shit and die' in English, Spanish, and ASL! Then, we're watching a movie called 'Hellraiser'.
Which puts private childcare in the favorable position of charging as much as possible while still making working a full time job only slightly more economically viable than being stay at home with one caregiver. They even price it in such a way that two kids with daycare often works out because of reduced rates.
It's not exactly a scam but it's part of the exploitive nature of our economic model constantly demanding more while slimming the margins.
"Today, were gonna teach your parents a lesson!"
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
"This is how you operate a lighter! Have some matches!"
Also the real answer to that question is essential is not essential for society it's essential right now. Food is. Water is. Electricity is. School isn't.
Most problems with all of this are funding(or timing) issues. Even with subs for smaller class sizes, you then need classrooms. Which basically means trailers, which means more janitorial staff. This is before how do you stop the cafeteria problems? You split the 3 lunch hours into 6 and you have some kids eating right as they get to school, and some right before they leave. Then you have to sanitize between each lunch period. Were not going to pay for hazmat suits for teachers.
This all ignores how long you think it will take before a kid brings an entire wing of a facility to its knees when he fake sneezes late in the day?
Realistically you could telepresence a teacher into multiple rooms to cut down on subs. But with subs I've never had any (short or long term) that gave an ounce of a shit. They range from the good end of not giving a shit, to the bad end of 'I can finally live out my authoritarian dream by giving suspensions to kids in homeroom for talking ohnowhyisariotstarting'
Also WTF why just women? Men are incapable of teaching children apparently?
This is bonkers. We can't even test all the sick people, I don't think that's going to change much honestly, I don't think states will be allowed to have the test and where they are they won't do them. We can't do this to people, the kids will survive. I won't. I am the problem. I don't have an answer, but if state governments don't figure it out I'm in trouble. They probably will not figure it out and kids and parents and teachers will be in danger, or they will for different reasons. But you can't conscript people. It will not be a lost generation. Where are you getting this stuff? Cite your damn sources. How will an entire generation of children be cast to the wolves if they miss a few months of school? There are big problems to solve, but if we aren't addressing the right ones we can't have a good solution.
"Today we're going to learn about one of our greatest Americans: Soupy Sales. So what I want you to do is get your mom's purse..."