Real glad I decided to take the 200 weapon that showed up in my cache over the 212 whatever other piece now
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I mean with a small amount of time spent in BGs just existing you can get enough honor for a unrated PVP weapon. they can be upgraded to 197 at 22 renown which is next week
Not to mention if you just try to force out daily PVP wins in like a big or something, you can scrounge up the conq for it.
Unlike other methods, it has a 100% guaranteed ending and you know exactly how close you are to getting it.
7 mythic keystones at 12 or above, 13 raid bosses, and not a single piece of usable loot.
In the past 3 weeks of doing content, I've gotten 2 usable drops from the raid/dungeon itself. Everything else has been from the vault.
I know a lot of people aren't going to agree with me here, but I feel like it was better when loot came at a slow but steady pace back in the day. They never should've stopped the badge system, where if you were having bad drop luck you could at least fill gaps on a specific of gear you were missing every week or so. When you had the expectation of getting maybe one or two items unless you were incredibly lucky you could gauge your progress more reasonably based on that. Now loot comes from so many sources in so many half-step tiers completely randomly and it's not unrealistic to get mostly but not quite fully geared in a week or two, but completely unable to replace specific slots for months. The worst part of gearing up is ALWAYS when you can't quite get that last item you need, and folks are so much more likely to get to that point quickly now.
I will be around for m+ tonight if people still need to do something for the week, as big as my hunter can handle (maybe multiple keys if we got time). Shooting for some 200ilvl stuff before tues if I can otherwise I might grind some pvp or pug normal. I suspect I will enjoy pvping on this thing for a change
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Tynnanseldom correct, never unsureRegistered Userregular
I'm happy to tank for people who still need emplus stuff. I think we can bang out some 7 keys for people who need 200 gear, since my monk outgears that pretty substantially.
I mean with a small amount of time spent in BGs just existing you can get enough honor for a unrated PVP weapon. they can be upgraded to 197 at 22 renown which is next week
Not to mention if you just try to force out daily PVP wins in like a big or something, you can scrounge up the conq for it.
Unlike other methods, it has a 100% guaranteed ending and you know exactly how close you are to getting it.
Well PVP is a crap shoot, and also while it solves getting a weapon with higher weapon damage, Vers is an awful stat for my spec. Actually worse then anything else. So it would be like trading in one bad thing for a different bad thing.
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
Skragg feel free to sim it, but I guarantee that weapon damage + main stat increase will absolutely blow away the loss of going to vers as a worst stat.
also, PVP has consistent routes. I only do arenas because I want the mount, so I have no choice but to beat my face against a rusty metal grinder to get to 1400 and get wins. If you go for the weekly quests, do a BG win here or there, you can slowly but assuredly get conquest. Since cap is so high now, you can do the weapon as fast as you can find those surefire conquest points. Always be on the lookout for the Brawl weeks btw. It's usually good for 100 CP the first win between the 40 you get for a daily win and a quest that always comes up.
IMO the reason this is worth it is you know the end point. A 2h 200ilvl weapon is 1850 CP I think. It might take some time doing it the ways I mentioned but you would know exactly how far from it you were. Unlike doing M+ where you could get a weapon tomorrow or 6 months from now.
BTW I looked up Fury stats. I assume that is what you are gearing for since arms lists vers as the best secondary? Anyway these are the normalized values (keep in mind this is before taking your current values into account, the value of stats you have a lot of goes DOWN and the value of ones you don't goes UP)
So like, a higher ilvl weapon will trump the difference in ANY secondary. Like just looking at that, your worst stat is less than 20% worse. That is baseline. If you have a ton of haste that gap closes. Which FYI is what I keep saying about the diff. Just because a guide says your worst secondary is the worst, doesn't make seeing it on a piece of gear an immediate DPS loss.
Yeah definitely stop thinking about stat weights Skragg. You keep laser focusing aspects of your damage that have a negligible effect on your overall dps. You should devote that headspace to other things! Let sims do the heavy lifting, they do it for me. In fact, I'll do it right now. I simmed the ilvl 200 conquest weapon with sinful revelation, versus a 200ilvl 2H from Theatre of Pain I guess. Let's toss in a Sire Denathrius weapon token and set it to ilvl 200 as well, just to get a variety of secondaries.
Yeah definitely stop thinking about stat weights Skragg. You keep laser focusing aspects of your damage that have a negligible effect on your overall dps. You should devote that headspace to other things! Let sims do the heavy lifting, they do it for me. In fact, I'll do it right now. I simmed the ilvl 200 conquest weapon with sinful revelation, versus a 200ilvl 2H from Theatre of Pain I guess. Let's toss in a Sire Denathrius weapon token and set it to ilvl 200 as well, just to get a variety of secondaries.
5dps. 5! That's nuthin'.
yeah well once he's choosing between 3 different ilvl 200 weapons in his bag instead of any of those vs. his 180 one he can worry about 5 DPS
Just to be clear, I have been collecting conquest to get a PvP weapon, and I will do so if I need to, but its very unsatisying to not get loot you need from the content paths you enjoy, is more the point I was trying to make.
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I love pvp.
But fucking doing it is killing me. It feels like no amount of effort made gets me anywhere. I have devoted so many hours into trying to get better. Research, character prep, fuck I even changed covenants JUST to do better. Yet I can’t even keep myself above 1400. I have it in 2v2 but it takes 4 fucking wins to get 1% toward the mount. In 3v3 can’t manage to break 1400.
I feel forced to heal since I have no background to convince people to invite me as dps. But healing 3v3 pugs is nearly the equivalent of trying to solo current mythic raids. Sometimes feels like I would take less damage vs a mythic raid boss than I do vs these openers.
So over 200 matches this week alone and not even 20% toward the mount I want so bad. I’m sure this season has plenty of time left but still feels like an impossible goal right now.
PvP in wow has been miserable garbage for a long time and no amount of gear makes that worthwhile.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I mean all that could be true, but it still exists and can be done. At the end of the day someone wins and someone loses and almost all of what you do affects the outcome. Even if dealing with it can many times be not fun.
And yeah it’s for the spider mount. I want that more than anything and will promptly be done with arenas possibly forever after I get it. If it doesn’t kill me first.
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
Everyone deletes everyone quick now. Though paladins seem to have this absurd burst cleave thing going if people start out grouped up. Seen something like 15k dps from them in openers. One time in 3v3 we went against a blood dk and ret. the blood pulled everyone in and the ret destroyed.
Just to be clear, I have been collecting conquest to get a PvP weapon, and I will do so if I need to, but its very unsatisying to not get loot you need from the content paths you enjoy, is more the point I was trying to make.
Also that PvP is poop, I do it, but its poop.
Yeah. To say I don't enjoy PvP would be an understatement, so if that means I have a lower ilvl weapon for longer, so be it. Not gonna do things that suck in a vidya game.
Hopped onto Ravenholdt for a minute and it looks like the Beasts (or what remained of them) moved to Cho'gall? Is this where everyone is playing these days? Also, people still play retail right? Not just classic?
are the beasts another PA-related guild? shambler milk has always been on cho'gall.
I think it was the Cata-era Alliance alt guild to play Worgen.
Horde guild on Ravenholdt. Just another group of PA folks. Looking at the log, it seems to have died years ago. I think some of the people that still play made their way over to the Cho'gall guild.
From the looks of it, Ravenholdt was connected to several other servers and classic might have been the nail in the coffin as people moved away to more populated servers.
Beasts seem to have dropped off before that, though.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited January 2021
A lot of the Beasts moved to the shamblers, yes. It was the MMO PA forum guild basically, and we played on an RP PvP server as horde where Sidely made the greatest mod known to man
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
are the beasts another PA-related guild? shambler milk has always been on cho'gall.
I think it was the Cata-era Alliance alt guild to play Worgen.
That was Puppy Parade!
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I remember the beasts being around in WOTLK. I thought it was one of the guilds that redid itself a few times based off of the Emerald Dream guild started in Vanilla? Some of us from Sargeras made that guild when the first PVP RP servers opened and attempted to RP. Some people ended up loving their new characters and needed to raid, so they pushed for that and as Vanilla did Vanilla, things happened and names changed. Not sure if that is the same story I was thinking about.
But yeah I think a lot of the Beasts faded off. I actually have no idea when Shamblers emerged as a guild. I didn't hear about us until WOD. But then again I stopped playing Cata within the first few months and missed the rest of it + all of MOP.
The Sargeras guild is still going on Thrall as far as I know. But only with a few actual PAers. A lot of it is the people they picked up to raid in Vanilla including an entire other guild and then people here and there. Amazing though they actually managed most of the same people since that time.
The biggest WTF for PA guild history for me is all the Dark Iron shenanigans. It was like 2 full guilds to start and then all those people splintered off into guilds of their own. I still remember standing in line to get invites at some point I think.
Talking about The Beasts made me want to dig out some old screenshots of nonsense pre Cataclysm Tomfoolery (unsurprisingly mostly Shirls related).
Old Mt Hyjal
I don't recall how exactly Shirls became able to walk through the sky...
Less impressive to be here now, but this was pre flying mounts in classic zones.
-SPI- on
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I thought I might have been in the beasts right at the end of WOTLK and the brief time I played Cata. I couldn't remember so I thought it might have been in one of the two only threads I ever created on this forum in 20 years. The Shaman main post when WoW had its own forum. Didn't find what I was looking for but now I found a post from MMO champ in early Cata beta and its entertaining me.
There is a post about Cata that talks about the new abilities gained from level 80 to 85 but still talks about 51 point talent trees. Also talks about the passive mastery stats you got per point in the tree which was 3 different stats per tree. I love that old stuff.
Lord DaveGrief CauserBitch Free ZoneRegistered Userregular
Shambler Milk was technically started by me, Montina, my sister and her husband when they lived with us for the summer in 2007.
It was then reborn later that year as an SE++ jerkwad guild.
Also the best mod is MilkGlass.
Posts
Not to mention if you just try to force out daily PVP wins in like a big or something, you can scrounge up the conq for it.
Unlike other methods, it has a 100% guaranteed ending and you know exactly how close you are to getting it.
I know a lot of people aren't going to agree with me here, but I feel like it was better when loot came at a slow but steady pace back in the day. They never should've stopped the badge system, where if you were having bad drop luck you could at least fill gaps on a specific of gear you were missing every week or so. When you had the expectation of getting maybe one or two items unless you were incredibly lucky you could gauge your progress more reasonably based on that. Now loot comes from so many sources in so many half-step tiers completely randomly and it's not unrealistic to get mostly but not quite fully geared in a week or two, but completely unable to replace specific slots for months. The worst part of gearing up is ALWAYS when you can't quite get that last item you need, and folks are so much more likely to get to that point quickly now.
Well PVP is a crap shoot, and also while it solves getting a weapon with higher weapon damage, Vers is an awful stat for my spec. Actually worse then anything else. So it would be like trading in one bad thing for a different bad thing.
also, PVP has consistent routes. I only do arenas because I want the mount, so I have no choice but to beat my face against a rusty metal grinder to get to 1400 and get wins. If you go for the weekly quests, do a BG win here or there, you can slowly but assuredly get conquest. Since cap is so high now, you can do the weapon as fast as you can find those surefire conquest points. Always be on the lookout for the Brawl weeks btw. It's usually good for 100 CP the first win between the 40 you get for a daily win and a quest that always comes up.
IMO the reason this is worth it is you know the end point. A 2h 200ilvl weapon is 1850 CP I think. It might take some time doing it the ways I mentioned but you would know exactly how far from it you were. Unlike doing M+ where you could get a weapon tomorrow or 6 months from now.
BTW I looked up Fury stats. I assume that is what you are gearing for since arms lists vers as the best secondary? Anyway these are the normalized values (keep in mind this is before taking your current values into account, the value of stats you have a lot of goes DOWN and the value of ones you don't goes UP)
Normalized Wdps 3.93 WOHdps 1.75 Str 1.00 Haste 0.4 Mastery 0.38 Crit 0.35 Vers 0.33
So like, a higher ilvl weapon will trump the difference in ANY secondary. Like just looking at that, your worst stat is less than 20% worse. That is baseline. If you have a ton of haste that gap closes. Which FYI is what I keep saying about the diff. Just because a guide says your worst secondary is the worst, doesn't make seeing it on a piece of gear an immediate DPS loss.
5dps. 5! That's nuthin'.
Even then I always sim the stat weights because they can shift quite a bit depending on what my current gear is.
The rest of the time I just use the top gear function on raidbots and use whatever gear that tells me.
yeah well once he's choosing between 3 different ilvl 200 weapons in his bag instead of any of those vs. his 180 one he can worry about 5 DPS
Also that PvP is poop, I do it, but its poop.
Except when Ohso makes me.
But fucking doing it is killing me. It feels like no amount of effort made gets me anywhere. I have devoted so many hours into trying to get better. Research, character prep, fuck I even changed covenants JUST to do better. Yet I can’t even keep myself above 1400. I have it in 2v2 but it takes 4 fucking wins to get 1% toward the mount. In 3v3 can’t manage to break 1400.
I feel forced to heal since I have no background to convince people to invite me as dps. But healing 3v3 pugs is nearly the equivalent of trying to solo current mythic raids. Sometimes feels like I would take less damage vs a mythic raid boss than I do vs these openers.
So over 200 matches this week alone and not even 20% toward the mount I want so bad. I’m sure this season has plenty of time left but still feels like an impossible goal right now.
And yeah it’s for the spider mount. I want that more than anything and will promptly be done with arenas possibly forever after I get it. If it doesn’t kill me first.
Yeah. To say I don't enjoy PvP would be an understatement, so if that means I have a lower ilvl weapon for longer, so be it. Not gonna do things that suck in a vidya game.
3DS: 2981-5304-3227
I think it was the Cata-era Alliance alt guild to play Worgen.
Horde guild on Ravenholdt. Just another group of PA folks. Looking at the log, it seems to have died years ago. I think some of the people that still play made their way over to the Cho'gall guild.
From the looks of it, Ravenholdt was connected to several other servers and classic might have been the nail in the coffin as people moved away to more populated servers.
Beasts seem to have dropped off before that, though.
That was Puppy Parade!
But yeah I think a lot of the Beasts faded off. I actually have no idea when Shamblers emerged as a guild. I didn't hear about us until WOD. But then again I stopped playing Cata within the first few months and missed the rest of it + all of MOP.
The Sargeras guild is still going on Thrall as far as I know. But only with a few actual PAers. A lot of it is the people they picked up to raid in Vanilla including an entire other guild and then people here and there. Amazing though they actually managed most of the same people since that time.
The biggest WTF for PA guild history for me is all the Dark Iron shenanigans. It was like 2 full guilds to start and then all those people splintered off into guilds of their own. I still remember standing in line to get invites at some point I think.
I don't recall how exactly Shirls became able to walk through the sky...
Less impressive to be here now, but this was pre flying mounts in classic zones.
There is a post about Cata that talks about the new abilities gained from level 80 to 85 but still talks about 51 point talent trees. Also talks about the passive mastery stats you got per point in the tree which was 3 different stats per tree. I love that old stuff.
It was then reborn later that year as an SE++ jerkwad guild.
Also the best mod is MilkGlass.