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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I don't feel the need to buy like, 20 games a year. How many games did I own for N64? For Gamecube? Maybe 20 a piece. I already have half that for my Wii. I mean, I just bought GTA 4 on PC for 8 bucks. I bought Fallout 3 for 25. Killing Floor for 20. HoMM5 for 10. Titan Quest Gold for 10. These are mostly old games, but meh - I am still playing TF2 and that game is old as well. I was playing WC3 up to a few months ago and that game was old.

    I play old games I've missed as well (just picked up God of War 2 and Front Mission 4 for example) but every game you listed was seriously already I game I've already owned and I'm tired of playing or have played a version of that is very similar and I am tired of playing.

    Inquisitor on
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    RonaldoTheGypsyRonaldoTheGypsy Yes, yes Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Eh, I need to blow things up. Killing Floor time methinks.

    EDIT: Hey, no worries, man. Games is here to be enjoyed not argued about which is superior. I loves me some games and you loves you some games.

    RonaldoTheGypsy on
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    Irond WillIrond Will WARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!! Cambridge. MAModerator mod
    edited January 2010
    Ryadic wrote: »
    I don't see how they could infract me for this. Hopefully people will flip their shit, though. :D

    Yeah you will probably get infracted for that.

    Irond Will on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=13081565&postcount=91

    I think this post sums up why people play bayonetta. Though it does remind me I never beat dmc4... Hmmm.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    for not liking a game?

    Variable on
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    RyadicRyadic Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Ryadic on
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    electricitylikesmeelectricitylikesme Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Isn't the Wii about to be annihilated by Project Natal? That shit looks damn cool.

    Also like it might revolutionize the PC game modding industry, if every man and his dog will be able to do mo-cap with a suitable webcam.

    I'll believe the Project Natal shit when its in my living room. Also, I'm really not looking forward to it. If anything the Wii has shown me that motion controls are absolutely the wrong direction to take gaming in.

    The Wii has shown us that accelerometers are still utterly inadequate for body controls to computer games, and nothing else. Which is obvious - we're never going to have a cheap accelerometer so accurate it can pinpoint the 3D position of something in space.

    Natal interests me because it's taking absolute position coordinates. If it works, well then holy shit - it's basically real time mo-cap without sensors or anything.

    You must understand: a substantial portion of my commitment to computer games is focussed on making them physically exhaust me such that my gaming habit demands physical excellence from my body.

    electricitylikesme on
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    DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Co-op Tetris, a slew of other VC games (Mario World, Secret of Mana, Mario Kart 64, Toejam and Earl), Mario Galaxy, Smash Bros Brawl, New Super Mario Bros Wii, I recently replayed through both Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, Mario Power Tennis ... this is me, roommates, lady friend ... it's just a system to sit down and play with people. If I want to get on the internets I jump on my computer, because I have a long list of steam games and non steam games to play on it. When I play xbox 360 I end up just playing gta4 or GoW2. And the only thing to this day I have played on a PS3 is LBP.

    I see, so sadly my Wii will remain un-used as those are all old games I've played already or remakes of old game I've played already. Thanks for the informative post though.

    I sold my Wii uh in September about and picked up the PS3.

    I have been playing that fucker pretty much constantly since then. I actually have a gamefly queue now. When I had my Wii my queue mostly consisted of PS2 games and. . .well that's about it. The last Wii game I picked up was Mad World in MARCH of last year. The system pretty much sat in the living room of my apartment from that point onward and my roommates would play Wii Sports at parties or whatever. It became the wii sports machine. For wii sports. A three year old game. I absolutely loved Brawl (despite the terrible friend system) and Mario Galaxy was a fantastic experience but the Wii just has shit for games which is unfortunate because there really are some gems out there.

    I was upset that I was unable to play New Super Mario Bros but then I played

    Uncharted 2, Ratchet and Clank Future, Dragon Age, Borderlands, Street Fighter IV, RE 5, and Arkham Asylum. Which kind of made me not feel so bad about missing out on the Wii's one good game per quarter policy.


    i don't know where this rant came from.

    DasUberEdward on
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    DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Isn't the Wii about to be annihilated by Project Natal? That shit looks damn cool.

    Also like it might revolutionize the PC game modding industry, if every man and his dog will be able to do mo-cap with a suitable webcam.

    I'll believe the Project Natal shit when its in my living room. Also, I'm really not looking forward to it. If anything the Wii has shown me that motion controls are absolutely the wrong direction to take gaming in.

    The Wii has shown us that accelerometers are still utterly inadequate for body controls to computer games, and nothing else. Which is obvious - we're never going to have a cheap accelerometer so accurate it can pinpoint the 3D position of something in space.

    Natal interests me because it's taking absolute position coordinates. If it works, well then holy shit - it's basically real time mo-cap without sensors or anything.

    You must understand: a substantial portion of my commitment to computer games is focussed on making them physically exhaust me such that my gaming habit demands physical excellence from my body.

    go play DDR silly.

    DasUberEdward on
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    electricitylikesmeelectricitylikesme Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Also I'm just going to say it: anyone who is against haptic controls is a unfit nerd who should be welcoming them as a fun motivator to increase their chances of actually having sex.

    electricitylikesme on
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    JustinSane07JustinSane07 Really, stupid? Brockton__BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2010
    Bayonetta seems like the kind of game where they expect you to play through it more than once to get the longevitity. Like a New Game+ option. Ninja Giaden on the Xbox was like this and it was awesome. It's a very tough thing to pull off too. You have to make the gameplay and storyline engaging enough for someone to want to go through it 2-3 times. From what I'm reading, fanboys are jizzing themselves and beating it like 15 times while normal people are going "Meh, there's no reason to play this twice."

    JustinSane07 on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    The Wii has shown us that accelerometers are still utterly inadequate for body controls to computer games, and nothing else. Which is obvious - we're never going to have a cheap accelerometer so accurate it can pinpoint the 3D position of something in space.

    Natal interests me because it's taking absolute position coordinates. If it works, well then holy shit - it's basically real time mo-cap without sensors or anything.

    You must understand: a substantial portion of my commitment to computer games is focussed on making them physically exhaust me such that my gaming habit demands physical excellence from my body.

    The problem is that it will still be awful to do anything than simulate a naked human.

    Want to do sword fighting? Okay... now you have someone fighting with a sword that had no weight and doesn't stop when it hits other peoples swords. So you have sword flailing more than sword fighting and if the swords ever actually connect well there goes your 1:1 correspondence.

    The whole idea is just retarded for gaming, as far as I'm concerned.

    Inquisitor on
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    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Isn't the Wii about to be annihilated by Project Natal? That shit looks damn cool.

    Also like it might revolutionize the PC game modding industry, if every man and his dog will be able to do mo-cap with a suitable webcam.

    I'll believe the Project Natal shit when its in my living room. Also, I'm really not looking forward to it. If anything the Wii has shown me that motion controls are absolutely the wrong direction to take gaming in.

    The Wii has shown us that accelerometers are still utterly inadequate for body controls to computer games, and nothing else. Which is obvious - we're never going to have a cheap accelerometer so accurate it can pinpoint the 3D position of something in space.

    Natal interests me because it's taking absolute position coordinates. If it works, well then holy shit - it's basically real time mo-cap without sensors or anything.

    You must understand: a substantial portion of my commitment to computer games is focussed on making them physically exhaust me such that my gaming habit demands physical excellence from my body.

    The thing is, I don't want to flail my arms about in front of my TV, or jump around in front of my TV, or talk to my TV.

    I just want to hit some fucking buttons. When did this become so hard?

    SyphonBlue on
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    Dunadan019Dunadan019 Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Variable wrote: »
    new computer put together!

    new motherboard doesn't work!

    !!

    what doesn't work about it?

    Dunadan019 on
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    electricitylikesmeelectricitylikesme Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Isn't the Wii about to be annihilated by Project Natal? That shit looks damn cool.

    Also like it might revolutionize the PC game modding industry, if every man and his dog will be able to do mo-cap with a suitable webcam.

    I'll believe the Project Natal shit when its in my living room. Also, I'm really not looking forward to it. If anything the Wii has shown me that motion controls are absolutely the wrong direction to take gaming in.

    The Wii has shown us that accelerometers are still utterly inadequate for body controls to computer games, and nothing else. Which is obvious - we're never going to have a cheap accelerometer so accurate it can pinpoint the 3D position of something in space.

    Natal interests me because it's taking absolute position coordinates. If it works, well then holy shit - it's basically real time mo-cap without sensors or anything.

    You must understand: a substantial portion of my commitment to computer games is focussed on making them physically exhaust me such that my gaming habit demands physical excellence from my body.

    go play DDR silly.

    Actually I'm in the middle of figuring out a DDR-based system for playing shooters. Though evidence suggests I'd probably like DDR.

    electricitylikesme on
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    LeitnerLeitner Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    heh so all the gamers would make no fattie channels and exclude themselves;ves from playing games?

    Beautiful people only plz. Alternatively, all Greeper all the time
    (lol hypocrisy)


    The interesting stuff related to Natal is all unrelated to the motion sensing. I mean voice commands, scanning things in etc. All that could actually be fairly good.

    Leitner on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Also I'm just going to say it: anyone who is against haptic controls is a unfit nerd who should be welcoming them as a fun motivator to increase their chances of actually having sex.

    I am giggling at you so hard right now. Yes I am such an unfit nerd. I didn't lift weights yesterday and I'm certainly not going running today. And god knows I hate playing paintball! All that exertion is just TOO much. :P

    DUE: If I win those $500 I am considering picking up a PS3.

    Inquisitor on
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    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Also I'm just going to say it: anyone who is against haptic controls is a unfit nerd who should be welcoming them as a fun motivator to increase their chances of actually having sex.

    I have lots of sex and most of my free time is spent playing video games on my couch with a controller in my hand.

    SyphonBlue on
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    PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
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    RonaldoTheGypsyRonaldoTheGypsy Yes, yes Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I played Dragon Age, RE5, Borderlands and Arkham Asylum on the PC so I don't feel so bad.

    RonaldoTheGypsy on
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    Irond WillIrond Will WARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!! Cambridge. MAModerator mod
    edited January 2010
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Isn't the Wii about to be annihilated by Project Natal? That shit looks damn cool.

    Also like it might revolutionize the PC game modding industry, if every man and his dog will be able to do mo-cap with a suitable webcam.

    I'll believe the Project Natal shit when its in my living room. Also, I'm really not looking forward to it. If anything the Wii has shown me that motion controls are absolutely the wrong direction to take gaming in.

    Yeah I think it will almost certainly blow. And also my couch is like four feet away from my massive TV do it probably won't work for shit anyways.

    Will probably get it anyways because no one loves gimmicks like Frankie loves gimmicks.

    Irond Will on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Yeah I just like using a controller... I don't know why we have to do motion control or body control, because honestly I can't just chill and sword fight.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    OrganichuOrganichu poops peesRegistered User, Moderator mod
    edited January 2010
    Man, being cheated on at seventeen, eleven months into a relationship, didn't hurt nearly so bad as being cheated on at twenty two, five months into a relationship. Stupid Jew heart.

    Organichu on
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    GonmunGonmun He keeps kickin' me in the dickRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Also I'm just going to say it: anyone who is against haptic controls is a unfit nerd who should be welcoming them as a fun motivator to increase their chances of actually having sex.

    I have lots of sex and most of my free time is spent playing video games on my couch with a controller in my hand.

    Hand? Dare we ask what you're doing with the other one?

    Gonmun on
    desc wrote: »
    ~ * swole patrol flying roundhouse kick top performer recognition: April 2014 * ~
    If you have a sec, check out my podcast: War and Beast Twitter Facebook
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Dunadan019 wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    new computer put together!

    new motherboard doesn't work!

    !!

    what doesn't work about it?

    it doesn't post, no beep and no display. not the video card because we tried a different one. processor is seated fine, we took all the ram out and unhooked all the drives.

    can't say for sure what's wrong but it isn't working.

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
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    DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Preacher wrote: »
    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=13081565&postcount=91

    I think this post sums up why people play bayonetta. Though it does remind me I never beat dmc4... Hmmm.

    I wish they would put chicks in actual clothing in video games. That would be nice for a change. Like Mass Effect. There was a lady. She wore armor. Because shit was shooting at her.

    It's so fucking stupid to have the male cast decked out in walking fortresses and every lady is wearing no more than a cummerbund.

    DasUberEdward on
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    JustinSane07JustinSane07 Really, stupid? Brockton__BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2010
    Organichu wrote: »
    Man, being cheated on at seventeen, eleven months into a relationship, didn't hurt nearly so bad as being cheated on at twenty two, five months into a relationship. Stupid Jew heart.

    Technically you weren't cheated on.

    From your perspective you were.

    From an outsider perspective, you weren't.

    JustinSane07 on
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    RonaldoTheGypsyRonaldoTheGypsy Yes, yes Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    22 is a hell of a year.

    RonaldoTheGypsy on
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    GonmunGonmun He keeps kickin' me in the dickRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Organichu wrote: »
    Man, being cheated on at seventeen, eleven months into a relationship, didn't hurt nearly so bad as being cheated on at twenty two, five months into a relationship. Stupid Jew heart.

    I must have missed something early on Org, I had thought that you and your ex had just broken up. I didn't know she had cheated on you. Sorry dude. :(

    Gonmun on
    desc wrote: »
    ~ * swole patrol flying roundhouse kick top performer recognition: April 2014 * ~
    If you have a sec, check out my podcast: War and Beast Twitter Facebook
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    OremLKOremLK Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I think I'll just skip straight to the having sex part, works fine as a fun motivator and gets you just as much exercise.

    OremLK on
    My zombie survival life simulator They Don't Sleep is out now on Steam if you want to check it out.
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    ResRes __BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2010
    I wish real life allowed you to respec

    like

    you get 4 points for a Bachelor's

    later, if you want to reallocate those 4 points into welding, you can!

    During my mid-teenage years when I spent so much of my life on video games I constantly found myself, while thinking of my past, and future, falling into this line of thinking.

    I'd be thinking about something I did that didn't turn out like I had hoped and then I'd think something to the effect of "Ah, well, during my replay I'll just... Fuck."

    Res on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    Dunadan019Dunadan019 Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Variable wrote: »
    Dunadan019 wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    new computer put together!

    new motherboard doesn't work!

    !!

    what doesn't work about it?

    it doesn't post, no beep and no display. not the video card because we tried a different one. processor is seated fine, we took all the ram out and unhooked all the drives.

    can't say for sure what's wrong but it isn't working.

    do you have the 24 pin and the 4 pin power connectors plugged into the motherboard?

    Dunadan019 on
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    thisisntwallythisisntwally Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Preacher wrote: »
    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=13081565&postcount=91

    I think this post sums up why people play bayonetta. Though it does remind me I never beat dmc4... Hmmm.

    I wish they would put chicks in actual clothing in video games. That would be nice for a change. Like Mass Effect. There was a lady. She wore armor. Because shit was shooting at her.

    It's so fucking stupid to have the male cast decked out in walking fortresses and every lady is wearing no more than a cummerbund.

    shut it, you. I like those cummerbunds. or rather, whats underneath them.

    thisisntwally on
    #someshit
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    DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I played Dragon Age, RE5, Borderlands and Arkham Asylum on the PC so I don't feel so bad.

    Yeah I was previously PC + Wii (it's an awesome combo) but then I thought about Final Fantasy XIII and the desperate nerd in me decided to prepare for the future.

    (btw cokebottle if you are reading this. how is it?)

    DasUberEdward on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Preacher wrote: »
    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=13081565&postcount=91

    I think this post sums up why people play bayonetta. Though it does remind me I never beat dmc4... Hmmm.

    I wish they would put chicks in actual clothing in video games. That would be nice for a change. Like Mass Effect. There was a lady. She wore armor. Because shit was shooting at her.

    It's so fucking stupid to have the male cast decked out in walking fortresses and every lady is wearing no more than a cummerbund.

    Yeah I remember that cutscene in DMC 4 and I was thinking "holy shit this is beyond fan service." And then they went and made a whole game like that cutscene.

    To an extent Dragons Age also had this. I mean Morrigan is an evil witch, who apparently took that whole "colder then a witch's tit" thing a little too seriously.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    JustinSane07JustinSane07 Really, stupid? Brockton__BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2010
    Preacher wrote: »
    http://forums.penny-arcade.com/showpost.php?p=13081565&postcount=91

    I think this post sums up why people play bayonetta. Though it does remind me I never beat dmc4... Hmmm.

    I wish they would put chicks in actual clothing in video games. That would be nice for a change. Like Mass Effect. There was a lady. She wore armor. Because shit was shooting at her.

    It's so fucking stupid to have the male cast decked out in walking fortresses and every lady is wearing no more than a cummerbund.

    Part of the problem is differentiating between male and female. If everyone is dressed in same looking armor with no hints of body features then everyone becomes genderless. And that's just as bad as chicks wearing plate bikinis and guys looking like Iron Man.

    RvB manages to pull it off with their female characters and male characters all being in the same Halo armor because of good voice acting and writing.

    JustinSane07 on
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    RonaldoTheGypsyRonaldoTheGypsy Yes, yes Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I can't stand FF games anymore. If I owned FFXIII I would probably be sad.

    A dude with an afro with a chocobo that lives in it? Sigh.

    RonaldoTheGypsy on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    OremLK wrote: »
    I think I'll just skip straight to the having sex part, works fine as a fun motivator and gets you just as much exercise.

    Not really, at best with strenuous hour long tantric fuck fests you'd burn about 100 calories. The sex as exercise myth is sadly just a myth.

    Preacher on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Organichu wrote: »
    Man, being cheated on at seventeen, eleven months into a relationship, didn't hurt nearly so bad as being cheated on at twenty two, five months into a relationship. Stupid Jew heart.

    What's that? A jew harp you say?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yx0nnZZVnd8

    DasUberEdward on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Dunadan019 wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Dunadan019 wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    new computer put together!

    new motherboard doesn't work!

    !!

    what doesn't work about it?

    it doesn't post, no beep and no display. not the video card because we tried a different one. processor is seated fine, we took all the ram out and unhooked all the drives.

    can't say for sure what's wrong but it isn't working.

    do you have the 24 pin and the 4 pin power connectors plugged into the motherboard?

    of course duna.

    I had my friend's brother come over, he's an IT dude which yeah they can be retarded but he really went through every possible mistake I could have made and I'm happy to say I didn't. deciding a part is bad is absolutely the last step, but I've been through every other step either I or he could think of.

    Variable on
    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
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    amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Alright, time to show my TMNT nerdiness.

    The first movie was based on the comic books more than the TV show. Just like how the early seasons of the TV show more closely resembled the comic books as well. That's part of the reason for Casey Jones playing a prominent role in the movie and in the early part of the show, as he has a big role in the comics. Now, what winds up happening is the second and third movies move away from the comics and create their own storyline. At the same time, the TV show does the same thing. So basically, there's 3 different TMNT story lines going at the same time. One's a comic, one's an animated show and the third is live action movies. Eventually, the movies peter out and the TV show comes to an end. An attempt is made at a live action TV show which also has it's own unique storyline and that bombs after one season. Then, after 6 years, a new show is started in 2003 that promises to follow the comic storyline. And it has done that pretty well and remained popular. I can't even believe it's been on the air almost 7 years now. The original TV show lasted 10 seasons, though the last two were only like 8 episodes a piece (at it's height, Season 5 was 35 episodes long).

    Unfortunately, Eastman and Laird had a falling out a few years back and I think Laird bought all the rights from Eastman (I might have that backwards).

    There's more to this.

    Eastman and Laird wanted to do Bebop and Rocksteady for the second turtles movie, and have that scientist be like Krangs brother or something, basically an alien in disguise, but at this point the comics and toys were much further ahead than the comic books, and the studio really put the clamps over the creators and that's why we had the ninja rap.

    That's when eastman and laird started falling out from the studios. Their original position was that "okay, we know that it's kid friendly, but we're keeping the comics our baby, and that's what matters..." but eventually that just wasn't the case.

    So onto TMNT3....

    Well, there's no official reasoning as to why it sucked, but basically Lloyd Kaufman (the toxic avenger fame) stated in his book that the studios only bought the rights to the toxic crusaders to strong arm eastman and laird into backing a third ninja turtle movie after the fallout from the second one, stating "we can always get another property"

    edit: according to wiki, when Kaufman discovered this, along with the fact that they were never going to make a toxic crusaders movie, he actually sued the studios and won. So go him.

    The other reason for "Go Ninja Go Ninja Go" and the stupid asian kid was because the first movie was seen by some parents as too violent, too gritty and too offensive to be a PG movie. So the studio wanted to tone it down and add in the kid-in-peril character. Remember in the first one that April, while not being a trained ninja or anything, is not a pussy. She stands up for herself quite a bit. Casey Jones is also a vigilante psychopath. The humans in the first movie can hold their own ground. But the studios felt that they needed some sort of kid in there to relate to the kid audience.

    For me, that's part of the reason why the first movie holds up so well and the second one doesn't. It's not dumbed down for the audience. It's actually a good movie.

    The scene when Donatello and Casey are trading childish insults inside the garage is exactly the same kind of shit we do to eachother here too.

    I can see that and top it..

    The "kid" was actually the stuntman who did all of the martial arts for Donatello.

    Also, Turtles 1 was the reason PG-13 was invented.

    Lastly, I rewatched the original a few months ago and I gotta say, the martial arts really hold up, They do some pretty damn impressive jump and spin kicks to be wearing 60 pounds of turtle

    amateurhour on
    are YOU on the beer list?
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