Karelians weren't Rus, or related to them genetically, linguistically nor culturally. Russian Karelia is a development from the ending resolution of the Continuation War that ended in 1944.
The Karelian empire is probably the most interesting occurrence to me in this LP, as I've never seen it happen in my own games, and historically it didn't occur for several reasons(lack of manpower, central authority, drive to expand, technology yada yada yada). The entire alternate history angle is the most interesting thing about this LP, and trying to shoehorn some developments into the real historical events just seems a little pointless. We could've just as well taken a vanilla EUIII beginning and mod some equivalent country to be our Carolingian Empire in that case. Regardless, the idea of a northern pagan empire is something to add to the usual case of Christians vs. Muslims.
Venice probably should be restored, as it is an interesting power for many reasons.
Christian states as legacy of the crusader kingdoms are another interesting alternate history angle, and seeing whether they survive in the long run is something that we should keep an eye on.
Swapping the roles of Scotland and England is definitely intriguing, with much potential for implosion or glorious expansion.
Karelia/Finland
Despite the issues with Karelia, it'd likely be a very interesting addition to the area (but in all likelihood they'll steal the much more profitable provinces held by one province minors (Novogorod and Tver) in the early days of EU3). All but 3 of their provinces (those on the Baltic coast) have incredibly low manpower and wealth.
They probably conquered the area by having a sole cavalryman running around offering a bite from a loaf of bread if people swore allegiance to them. Unfortunately St. Petersburg as we know it won't exist for another 300 years (so alternatively, we may want to offer our Karelian Empire events towards centralization that promote the formation of a fairly profitable city on the Baltic coast ala Peter the Great and Russia.
I would be for having a Finland proper in the actual provinces claiming to be Finland, and then another Finnish (or Scandinavian of some sort since much of the area was still populated by Viking-esque ancestors to Russians in the area) land in the form of Karelia.
Having them as the sole (somewhat powerful) Pagan nation may make life difficult for them, but there's a substantial Pagan element near the Crimean peninsula (Ukraine-ish) that could potentially assist them.
Speaking of religion, I thought there was an EU3 defined nation to match the tiny Khazaria with a heavy Jewish population we've got on the Caspian at Itil.
Spain
Also for Spain, I was recommending we make our holdings of Catalonia into a vassal state of ourselves (but hypothetically making it an ally of ours and Castille-Aragon could work nicely as well). The thing with Leon was Pireneos - their collection of provinces separate from their main holdings in León.
Egypt
Unfortunately - yes, there is no Egypt. In EU3 the area is handled by the Mameluks, who controlled Egypt, portions of the Sinai, parts of Nubia/Sudan, Arabia and the traditional crusader states (historically controlled by the Ayyubids (...who never really materialized much in our LP) until they were overthrown by their Mameluk generals). Most of us are probably familiar with European history, but what has happened to North Africa and the Middle East has been ...an incredibly dramatic repositioning of historic kingdoms (i.e. there are no Turks, the North African (Moroccan) peoples of Zenata forced out the Mongols and control the Mid-East with small enclaves of other peoples). They've also left significant cultural presence in Italy (there are actually a handful of Arab Catholic rulers there).
Similarly to Egypt/the Crusader states, Scandinavia is only defined with Gotland (the island in the Baltic), Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Scandinavia, Slesvig (and Holstein if you count German minors).
Country Creation
Creating new countries in EU3 isn't too difficult (making comprehensive events for many nations would be more difficult), but the more countries that survive the more difficult it will be to transfer to Victoria and HOI2 (although if we used AoD they alleviated the country tag limit substantially). I could probably throw together base files for potential countries.
You can find a list of defined countries (and their base histories) at ...\Europa Universalis III\history\countries
Presuming there is no time bomb on this computer and it is actually fixed, we'll be starting to work on things tonight. We definitely need a Leon and Egypt flag and what not, so anyone who wants should start working on that.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Well, since independent Egypt historically formed from the Turks, we could just make them the Ottomans to avoid the hassle of creating a new country.
The Turkish flag is a golden Islamic crescent on a field of red...Not really fitting for our Christian crusader state of Egypt that has converted the population within the extent of its rule (in which case its status as Egypt would probably be more a formation of the Roman and Byzantine Aegyptus). The Ottoman tag would likely work best on the vast Zenatan empire in the Middle East.
Can you just make the Teutonic Order and Knights the non-historical Christian countries? I didn't see them on the map, and they are probably the best analog to a style similar to what happened in the game. The Knights in Egypt, and the Teutons for one of the large Russian catholic province states.
I still think you should create a few new countries, and not randomize EU3.
Wiz's Mega-LP was so great because of the new countries it has, you can still have a few of minors be vanilla countries, but stuff like Zenata should be a new country and all.
Although looking at the map, we have the most fractured europe ever. Its probably a mess to convert it to EU3 to begin with.
I still think you should create a few new countries, and not randomize EU3.
Wiz's Mega-LP was so great because of the new countries it has, you can still have a few of minors be vanilla countries, but stuff like Zenata should be a new country and all.
Although looking at the map, we have the most fractured europe ever. Its probably a mess to convert it to EU3 to begin with.
Volunteering to make me flags? I'm horrible artistically.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Leon has a historic coat of arms, but Egypt doesn't and since all of the non-Muslim rulers basically existed before the use of actual flags and heradlry...there's quite a bit of leeway in creating their flag.
The Teutonic Knights exist as a single province in the middle of Russia (the dark bluish one near Tver - not the two owned by Carinthia near Brunswick) after ketting kicked out of Prussia by Mazovia (which got kicked out of its spot by Poland). Poland owns Malta, and if you don't want to give it back to Knights, giving the Knights Damascus or Jaffa-Ascalon could work well.
I'd be all for creating new nations when something nearby doesn't fit. I mean, Zenata was the historic antecedent to the Almohad dynasty. They weren't so much a kingdom as an ethnic subdivision of the Berbers (i.e. it shouldn't really be the King of Zenata, but the King of the Zenatan People), but they historically formed Algeria and Tunisia, and both of those are defined in EU3 and there's no reason not to use them (unlike a legitimate reason not to use the Mamelukes for Egypt).
I'd recommend against doing something like using the SCA tag for Scandinavia to fill in a non-existent Kent in England with just a rename.
Leinster gets both provinces in the southeast.
Munster stays Munster
Scotland gets Northern Ireland, both provinces, but no cores on them (it was a recent conquest I watched happen). Their centralization score remains the same. +1 for being stronger, -1 for facing a sizable rebellion at the moment.
Northumberland is made an independent state. No cores on them, they've been independent for a while.
York gets both Yorkshire and Lincoln, which it owns at the end of CK. The Norwegians are kicked out. Unfortunately for him, England has a core on both.
Wales gets both Welsh counties, no English cores on them as England hasn't held them in forever.
Cornwall is made independent, gets Cornwall. English core on it.
England gets the rest, and a centralization hit.
I kept Norway as is thus far, giving it a centralization hit to 4 from 3. Thought about 5 for such a mess.
Sweden I have no friggin' clue and there's not really any replacement countries. Maybe split it into Lappland (more pagans), and then a massively decentralized Sweden? We'd need to make Lappland. I'm done for tonight though. We're on our way!
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Leinster gets both provinces in the southeast.
Munster stays Munster
Scotland gets Northern Ireland, both provinces, but no cores on them (it was a recent conquest I watched happen). Their centralization score remains the same. +1 for being stronger, -1 for facing a sizable rebellion at the moment.
Northumberland is made an independent state. No cores on them, they've been independent for a while.
York gets both Yorkshire and Lincoln, which it owns at the end of CK. The Norwegians are kicked out. Unfortunately for him, England has a core on both.
Wales gets both Welsh counties, no English cores on them as England hasn't held them in forever.
Cornwall is made independent, gets Cornwall. English core on it.
England gets the rest, and a centralization hit.
I kept Norway as is thus far, giving it a centralization hit to 4 from 3. Thought about 5 for such a mess.
Sweden I have no friggin' clue and there's not really any replacement countries. Maybe split it into Lappland (more pagans), and then a massively decentralized Sweden? We'd need to make Lappland. I'm done for tonight though. We're on our way!
Based on that, this is what I'm seeing:
(I've tried to label any province that may be of contention; if a one province minor occupies that province it is capitalized)
(I'll have to ask about Norway if you mean you're keeping it close to vanilla EU3 Norway or you're trying to keep it the same as the CK Norway split by Carolingian lands and then some random Neuchatal up north?)
Also possibility of note: (some of) the Norwegian/Italian lands (between Wales and York) can belong to the predefined country of Lancaster (whose capital is in Lancashire).
Also should I post a selection of potential flags for our nation again? Or are you going to just go with that cross?
(if you want I can try to throw together 1 or 2 country files for something like Kent or Essex for England and Inverness (Highlands) for Scotland so they have additional minors to free during war)
Alternative monogram with fleur-de-lis (which has a tenuous link with the Carolingians and late Middle Age/Renaissance paintings often depict him wearing):
Based on the famous 15th century painting of Charlemagne by Dürer (with the coat of arms of the HRE and France in the background):
Enlightendbum's favored Carolingian Cross (so named for its copious amounts of Cs and not anything Charlemagne-related):
Based on the French Oriflamme, which - like the spread of fleur-de-lis on a field of azure - has some links with Charlemagne (...and Byzantium):
I think I like the Vermandois+Valois for a starting flag that gets upgraded to the oriflamme when the empire is potentially reborn via event. I like the Dürer concept, but it feels somewhat unoriginal (since France will be running around with it and Germany could potentially form). Although the monogram or the cross would be easiest to imprint over our vassal's basic flag image.
Although technically there's no France anymore, so the Dürer option is more appealing.
Thinking about it, you may want to give somewhere (like Fife, which I think they've held more consistently than Aberdeen) another base tax or two and some population representative of the stability Scotland has had in the long term compared to England...who is going to have a fairly prosperous London. Otherwise Scotland's probably getting shafted prosperity-wise.
Carolingian Cross (tenuously associated with Charlemage, but pretty in a mathy sort of way)
French Oriflamme
Also, if you just want to vote for the base French flag or the base Burgundian flag you can do that. They're both lame and boring though. France is the fleur-de-lis, Burgundy is a couple red barbed curves on a white background.
2) In bold cyan vote for one of the following:
We are France! Will involve heavy editing of national decisions, as we are not historical France. Fair amount of work for me.
We are Burgundy! Will involve considerably less editing of national decisions, as most of theirs are pretty generic. Major removal would be the "form France!" event. Easy to do.
We are entirely new with a name to be suggested/voted on later! Like the Carolingian Empire. Would require an entirely new country file, which I'll be making a fair number of anyway.
We are France/Burgundy with a new decision that allows us to form the whatever new nation we would call ourselves if we meet certain conditions (I'm thinking good relations with the Pope, low infamy, cores on Paris, Milan, Marseilles, and something major in West Germany that I haven't decided yet).
Possibly more to come later, when we're figuring out some of the other stuff, like what to do with Sweden.
3) There is a Catholic Finland (currently ruled by...an Arab) at the moment. It has a couple provinces, and could conceivably also rule a couple other provinces on the west coast of modern day Finland.
In bold orange: do we make two Finlands? One Catholic and small on the Baltic Coast and the other the massive Pagan Karelia? Or do we just call Karelia Finland and have them be a pagan superpower from the Baltic to the steppes?
4) On a related note: the Mongols never established a European foothold in our universe. Should I just leave the Mongol presence outside of Europe as is? Should I give the major Mongol invasions that failed non-European territory to other Mongols? To someone else? What is to be done with the Mongols?
Also, flags requested so far: Leon, Lappland, Christian Egypt, Berber Persia (so, so very weird)
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
1) Stylized combination of Vermandois and Valois
2) We are Burgundy!
I don't know how feasible it is, but an alternative event chain for one of the other minors to form France might be nice, just to give us a potential major rival. If we have our capital in Paris, the existing event chains probably won't be much use.
3) Two Finlands
Though I don't know how viable a Pagan superpower would be, unless we given them a very easy path to westernization / catholicism.
4) The easiest way out would be to leave the rest of the world as-is, though I'm not sure how viable that will leave the golden horde, without their European-ish holdings.
1) Stylised combination of Vermandois and Valois
2) We are the Carolingian Empire! Surely you can just copypasta some of the national events from France and Burgundy into Carolingia?
3) Two Finlands Honestly I'm all for keeping the map the way it is and even hopefully keeping as many names the way they are. I don't want historical accuracy I want a fucked up fantasy version of olden times. The only exception would be maybe cleaning up Germany (but not too much) or snipping out some of the one province holdings that would just be a nuisance to create.
4) Fuck 'em. If you're looking for a gargantuan pagan blob we can just extend the power of Karelia beyond Europe. The Timurids should be a pressing issue coming in from Anatolia anyway, yes?
1) Carolingian Cross but maybe colored in gold/blue?
2) Burgundy with the ability to become the Carolingian Empire!
3) Pagan superpower!
4) Leave it as is.
I ended up getting EU3 + Expansions for myself for my birthday yesterday. I've only played Crusader Kings previously so I'm still just starting to figure stuff out and making a lot of bone-headed mistakes. Really looking forward to this part of the play-through so I can see how a game would more typically be played with some experience.
1) Stylized combination of Vermandois and Valois
2) We are the Franks/West Franks, with the option to form the Carolingian Empire by decision!
3) Pagan Superpower!
They will need an event chain to catholicism/orthodox however.
4) Leave it as is, let them be China's problem.
1. Vermandios + Valois
2. We are Burgundy (or Franks) with decision to form the empire. Maybe from holding the major areas of our empire from the game? We aren't France; we didn't hold that title until very late
3. Two Finlands
4. The muslims re-surged quite well on the eastern border of the map (at least when I was playing they were uite powerful). I would say reduce the mongol holdings in the western areas on the assumption that the muslim kingdoms would also have expanded east, split it between the middle east powers.
1) Carolingian Cross that changes to Oriflamme. See Lachrymite's post for the pics.
2) Burgundy with the ability to become the Carolingian Empire!
3) Pagan superpower!
4) Leave it as is. The pagan threat should come from the Karelians in the north instead of mongols from the east in our fantasy world.
1. Screw conformity, how about the oriflamme
2. Burgundy! It may have been incidental in our rise to power, but Burgundy was our first Kingship, and we should stick by that. History isn't what we plan, it's those things that pop up anyway.
3.Two Finlands I'm with the squid 100%. "Honestly I'm all for keeping the map the way it is and even hopefully keeping as many names the way they are. I don't want historical accuracy I want a fucked up fantasy version of olden times." I'd prefer to leave the map largely unchanged. If we sanitize it too much, it becomes more like a modified EU3 than a continued CK, if that makes any sense. I feel like the weirder bits will get normalized as time goes on, anyway, since those 1-province guys and weird countries will probably get gobbled up. Or become superpowers, I don't know.
4. Leave it as is.
1) Lachrymite's colored Carolingian Cross
2) Burgundy (preferably called something else) with the ability to become the Carolingian Empire (or Carolingia or whatever). (and then the Dürer flag)
3) Two Finlands
4) Leave the Mongols however the bordering Zenatan lands leave them.
There is already an event/decision in-game for the formation of France by French minors.
I would actually suggest we don't start as Burgundy either (something like Vermandois-Valois or Frankia or something else, since Burgundy is a bit of a mixed bag (we correspond somewhat to the historic location of Burgundy, so if we get conquered the AI should have the option of releasing actual Burgundy; the historical Kingdom of Burgundy (from the Kingdom of Arelat) was historically closer to Provence in Southern France). Plus if we separate ourselves off we can fill in our lands in Victoria and HOI with an extra nation instead of overwriting someone who may exist.
In case no one has played EU3 or wants to compare:
1) Lachrymite's gold/blue Carolingian Cross
2) Viva Carolingia!
3) Pagan superpower!
4) Screw the Mongols. I like the balance of power between the Pagan Finns and Muslim Zenata.
Posts
The Karelian empire is probably the most interesting occurrence to me in this LP, as I've never seen it happen in my own games, and historically it didn't occur for several reasons(lack of manpower, central authority, drive to expand, technology yada yada yada). The entire alternate history angle is the most interesting thing about this LP, and trying to shoehorn some developments into the real historical events just seems a little pointless. We could've just as well taken a vanilla EUIII beginning and mod some equivalent country to be our Carolingian Empire in that case. Regardless, the idea of a northern pagan empire is something to add to the usual case of Christians vs. Muslims.
Venice probably should be restored, as it is an interesting power for many reasons.
Christian states as legacy of the crusader kingdoms are another interesting alternate history angle, and seeing whether they survive in the long run is something that we should keep an eye on.
Swapping the roles of Scotland and England is definitely intriguing, with much potential for implosion or glorious expansion.
Despite the issues with Karelia, it'd likely be a very interesting addition to the area (but in all likelihood they'll steal the much more profitable provinces held by one province minors (Novogorod and Tver) in the early days of EU3). All but 3 of their provinces (those on the Baltic coast) have incredibly low manpower and wealth.
They probably conquered the area by having a sole cavalryman running around offering a bite from a loaf of bread if people swore allegiance to them. Unfortunately St. Petersburg as we know it won't exist for another 300 years (so alternatively, we may want to offer our Karelian Empire events towards centralization that promote the formation of a fairly profitable city on the Baltic coast ala Peter the Great and Russia.
I would be for having a Finland proper in the actual provinces claiming to be Finland, and then another Finnish (or Scandinavian of some sort since much of the area was still populated by Viking-esque ancestors to Russians in the area) land in the form of Karelia.
Having them as the sole (somewhat powerful) Pagan nation may make life difficult for them, but there's a substantial Pagan element near the Crimean peninsula (Ukraine-ish) that could potentially assist them.
Speaking of religion, I thought there was an EU3 defined nation to match the tiny Khazaria with a heavy Jewish population we've got on the Caspian at Itil.
Spain
Also for Spain, I was recommending we make our holdings of Catalonia into a vassal state of ourselves (but hypothetically making it an ally of ours and Castille-Aragon could work nicely as well). The thing with Leon was Pireneos - their collection of provinces separate from their main holdings in León.
Egypt
Unfortunately - yes, there is no Egypt. In EU3 the area is handled by the Mameluks, who controlled Egypt, portions of the Sinai, parts of Nubia/Sudan, Arabia and the traditional crusader states (historically controlled by the Ayyubids (...who never really materialized much in our LP) until they were overthrown by their Mameluk generals). Most of us are probably familiar with European history, but what has happened to North Africa and the Middle East has been ...an incredibly dramatic repositioning of historic kingdoms (i.e. there are no Turks, the North African (Moroccan) peoples of Zenata forced out the Mongols and control the Mid-East with small enclaves of other peoples). They've also left significant cultural presence in Italy (there are actually a handful of Arab Catholic rulers there).
Similarly to Egypt/the Crusader states, Scandinavia is only defined with Gotland (the island in the Baltic), Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Scandinavia, Slesvig (and Holstein if you count German minors).
Country Creation
Creating new countries in EU3 isn't too difficult (making comprehensive events for many nations would be more difficult), but the more countries that survive the more difficult it will be to transfer to Victoria and HOI2 (although if we used AoD they alleviated the country tag limit substantially). I could probably throw together base files for potential countries.
You can find a list of defined countries (and their base histories) at ...\Europa Universalis III\history\countries
The Turkish flag is a golden Islamic crescent on a field of red...Not really fitting for our Christian crusader state of Egypt that has converted the population within the extent of its rule (in which case its status as Egypt would probably be more a formation of the Roman and Byzantine Aegyptus). The Ottoman tag would likely work best on the vast Zenatan empire in the Middle East.
Wiz's Mega-LP was so great because of the new countries it has, you can still have a few of minors be vanilla countries, but stuff like Zenata should be a new country and all.
Although looking at the map, we have the most fractured europe ever. Its probably a mess to convert it to EU3 to begin with.
Volunteering to make me flags? I'm horrible artistically.
The Teutonic Knights exist as a single province in the middle of Russia (the dark bluish one near Tver - not the two owned by Carinthia near Brunswick) after ketting kicked out of Prussia by Mazovia (which got kicked out of its spot by Poland). Poland owns Malta, and if you don't want to give it back to Knights, giving the Knights Damascus or Jaffa-Ascalon could work well.
I'd be all for creating new nations when something nearby doesn't fit. I mean, Zenata was the historic antecedent to the Almohad dynasty. They weren't so much a kingdom as an ethnic subdivision of the Berbers (i.e. it shouldn't really be the King of Zenata, but the King of the Zenatan People), but they historically formed Algeria and Tunisia, and both of those are defined in EU3 and there's no reason not to use them (unlike a legitimate reason not to use the Mamelukes for Egypt).
I'd recommend against doing something like using the SCA tag for Scandinavia to fill in a non-existent Kent in England with just a rename.
Leinster gets both provinces in the southeast.
Munster stays Munster
Scotland gets Northern Ireland, both provinces, but no cores on them (it was a recent conquest I watched happen). Their centralization score remains the same. +1 for being stronger, -1 for facing a sizable rebellion at the moment.
Northumberland is made an independent state. No cores on them, they've been independent for a while.
York gets both Yorkshire and Lincoln, which it owns at the end of CK. The Norwegians are kicked out. Unfortunately for him, England has a core on both.
Wales gets both Welsh counties, no English cores on them as England hasn't held them in forever.
Cornwall is made independent, gets Cornwall. English core on it.
England gets the rest, and a centralization hit.
I kept Norway as is thus far, giving it a centralization hit to 4 from 3. Thought about 5 for such a mess.
Sweden I have no friggin' clue and there's not really any replacement countries. Maybe split it into Lappland (more pagans), and then a massively decentralized Sweden? We'd need to make Lappland. I'm done for tonight though. We're on our way!
We may have to edit that continuously, along with decisions/events/what not.
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
Based on that, this is what I'm seeing:
(I've tried to label any province that may be of contention; if a one province minor occupies that province it is capitalized)
(I'll have to ask about Norway if you mean you're keeping it close to vanilla EU3 Norway or you're trying to keep it the same as the CK Norway split by Carolingian lands and then some random Neuchatal up north?)
Also possibility of note: (some of) the Norwegian/Italian lands (between Wales and York) can belong to the predefined country of Lancaster (whose capital is in Lancashire).
Also should I post a selection of potential flags for our nation again? Or are you going to just go with that cross?
And I didn't see Lancashire, I'll go ahead and make them a OPM.
(slightly revised map)
(if you want I can try to throw together 1 or 2 country files for something like Kent or Essex for England and Inverness (Highlands) for Scotland so they have additional minors to free during war)
[edit]
Quoted from page...something:
Although technically there's no France anymore, so the Dürer option is more appealing.
England keeps the core on Lancaster.
Maps -> missions/decisions -> income balance
Also, deciding where to put CoT or if I just keep them in their default areas.
1) In bold lime select a flag from this list, or suggest your own. Post it with a label, if anyone seconds it, it will join a runoff.
2) In bold cyan vote for one of the following:
We are France! Will involve heavy editing of national decisions, as we are not historical France. Fair amount of work for me.
We are Burgundy! Will involve considerably less editing of national decisions, as most of theirs are pretty generic. Major removal would be the "form France!" event. Easy to do.
We are entirely new with a name to be suggested/voted on later! Like the Carolingian Empire. Would require an entirely new country file, which I'll be making a fair number of anyway.
We are France/Burgundy with a new decision that allows us to form the whatever new nation we would call ourselves if we meet certain conditions (I'm thinking good relations with the Pope, low infamy, cores on Paris, Milan, Marseilles, and something major in West Germany that I haven't decided yet).
Possibly more to come later, when we're figuring out some of the other stuff, like what to do with Sweden.
3) There is a Catholic Finland (currently ruled by...an Arab) at the moment. It has a couple provinces, and could conceivably also rule a couple other provinces on the west coast of modern day Finland.
In bold orange: do we make two Finlands? One Catholic and small on the Baltic Coast and the other the massive Pagan Karelia? Or do we just call Karelia Finland and have them be a pagan superpower from the Baltic to the steppes?
4) On a related note: the Mongols never established a European foothold in our universe. Should I just leave the Mongol presence outside of Europe as is? Should I give the major Mongol invasions that failed non-European territory to other Mongols? To someone else? What is to be done with the Mongols?
Also, flags requested so far: Leon, Lappland, Christian Egypt, Berber Persia (so, so very weird)
2) We are Burgundy!
I don't know how feasible it is, but an alternative event chain for one of the other minors to form France might be nice, just to give us a potential major rival. If we have our capital in Paris, the existing event chains probably won't be much use.
3) Two Finlands
Though I don't know how viable a Pagan superpower would be, unless we given them a very easy path to westernization / catholicism.
4) The easiest way out would be to leave the rest of the world as-is, though I'm not sure how viable that will leave the golden horde, without their European-ish holdings.
2) We are the Carolingian Empire! Surely you can just copypasta some of the national events from France and Burgundy into Carolingia?
3) Two Finlands Honestly I'm all for keeping the map the way it is and even hopefully keeping as many names the way they are. I don't want historical accuracy I want a fucked up fantasy version of olden times. The only exception would be maybe cleaning up Germany (but not too much) or snipping out some of the one province holdings that would just be a nuisance to create.
4) Fuck 'em. If you're looking for a gargantuan pagan blob we can just extend the power of Karelia beyond Europe. The Timurids should be a pressing issue coming in from Anatolia anyway, yes?
2. As befits our flag, we are the Carolingian Empire!
3. Two Finlands are better than one.
4. Leave the Mongols as they are.
2) Burgundy with the ability to become the Carolingian Empire!
3) Pagan superpower!
4) Leave it as is.
I ended up getting EU3 + Expansions for myself for my birthday yesterday. I've only played Crusader Kings previously so I'm still just starting to figure stuff out and making a lot of bone-headed mistakes. Really looking forward to this part of the play-through so I can see how a game would more typically be played with some experience.
Maybe something like this for now:
And this for after changing names:
2) We are the Franks/West Franks, with the option to form the Carolingian Empire by decision!
3) Pagan Superpower!
They will need an event chain to catholicism/orthodox however.
4) Leave it as is, let them be China's problem.
2. We are Burgundy (or Franks) with decision to form the empire. Maybe from holding the major areas of our empire from the game? We aren't France; we didn't hold that title until very late
3. Two Finlands
4. The muslims re-surged quite well on the eastern border of the map (at least when I was playing they were uite powerful). I would say reduce the mongol holdings in the western areas on the assumption that the muslim kingdoms would also have expanded east, split it between the middle east powers.
2) Burgundy with the ability to become the Carolingian Empire!
3) Pagan superpower!
4) Leave it as is. The pagan threat should come from the Karelians in the north instead of mongols from the east in our fantasy world.
2. Burgundy! It may have been incidental in our rise to power, but Burgundy was our first Kingship, and we should stick by that. History isn't what we plan, it's those things that pop up anyway.
3.Two Finlands I'm with the squid 100%. "Honestly I'm all for keeping the map the way it is and even hopefully keeping as many names the way they are. I don't want historical accuracy I want a fucked up fantasy version of olden times." I'd prefer to leave the map largely unchanged. If we sanitize it too much, it becomes more like a modified EU3 than a continued CK, if that makes any sense. I feel like the weirder bits will get normalized as time goes on, anyway, since those 1-province guys and weird countries will probably get gobbled up. Or become superpowers, I don't know.
4. Leave it as is.
2) Burgundy (preferably called something else) with the ability to become the Carolingian Empire (or Carolingia or whatever). (and then the Dürer flag)
3) Two Finlands
4) Leave the Mongols however the bordering Zenatan lands leave them.
There is already an event/decision in-game for the formation of France by French minors.
I would actually suggest we don't start as Burgundy either (something like Vermandois-Valois or Frankia or something else, since Burgundy is a bit of a mixed bag (we correspond somewhat to the historic location of Burgundy, so if we get conquered the AI should have the option of releasing actual Burgundy; the historical Kingdom of Burgundy (from the Kingdom of Arelat) was historically closer to Provence in Southern France). Plus if we separate ourselves off we can fill in our lands in Victoria and HOI with an extra nation instead of overwriting someone who may exist.
In case no one has played EU3 or wants to compare:
France:
Burgundy:
2) Viva Carolingia!
3) Pagan superpower!
4) Screw the Mongols. I like the balance of power between the Pagan Finns and Muslim Zenata.
2. We are Burgundy with the decision to form the Carolingian Empire.
3. Two Finlands.
4. Leave it as is.