Whenever it comes to weird or apparently mystifyingly complex innate behaviours I always try to remember that other animals do not necessarily perceive the world in remotely the same way we do.
I mean, cuttlefish can perceive the polarisation of light but not colour. There is no confortable way to try and empathetically visualise what that's like, and it's really difficult to fully grasp what that means in terms of how a cuttlefish interacts with the world.
stopppp ittttt
you know a very small subset of the population can see the plane of polarized light
and you know that a very small subset of the population can see into the far red spectrum
Whenever it comes to weird or apparently mystifyingly complex innate behaviours I always try to remember that other animals do not necessarily perceive the world in remotely the same way we do.
I mean, cuttlefish can perceive the polarisation of light but not colour. There is no confortable way to try and empathetically visualise what that's like, and it's really difficult to fully grasp what that means in terms of how a cuttlefish interacts with the world.
You can train your eyes to see the polarization of light. It's kind of weird/neat
Man, now I'm all out of wack. My brother believes, without evidence, that aliens explain world religions and I'm all upset because I might have hurt his feelings
seems to me you're being too harsh on yourself.
it depends how mean you were about it; i have felt guilty for flipping out on someone who was talking about creationism when really i looked like a fool because i should have been calm and reasonable
if you WERE calm and reasonable, then yeah you are being too harsh
I compared him to people who invent religions because they lack the capacity or will to more logically analyze the natural world.
Treat his beliefs no differently than you do any other story you do not believe in, unless his laser lotus cult leader is asking for 50,000 dollars or something.
Then it is your obligation and duty as a family member to try and save him.
until then, let him have his faith.
syndalis on
SW-4158-3990-6116
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
Man, now I'm all out of wack. My brother believes, without evidence, that aliens explain world religions and I'm all upset because I might have hurt his feelings
seems to me you're being too harsh on yourself.
I guess I'm just wondering what the best way to handle things like this, and the fact that it involves someone I really care bout it mixed things up even more. I mean, this is an asinine assertion and he's not even trying to be logical about it. On the other hand, he's a man now and he's entitled to believe as he wishes.
So what am I supposed to do when a man I care about tries to share, in earnest excitement, his beliefs about alien gods?
same thing you do when a person you care about tries to share, in earnest excitement, their beliefs about jesus?
Man, I'm way more passive with established religions. My dad is really into Jesus and with him I just kinda shrug and go "whatever, don't really want to hear about it."
it is interesting that when someone says they believe in alien gods you're all "make him see reason" but when someone says they believe in regular old gods doing that is bad
unless he's going to drink the spirit juice to pierce the veil just try to make him keep it more to himself
Abdhyius on
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JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
Man, crazy people have all the advantage in spreading ideas about the world. Real facts are dry and not everyone is Carl Sagan. Crazy stories make easy reading and people often want to believe them.
Silas Brown on
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syndalisGetting ClassyOn the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Productsregular
you dudes are way too PC about stupid stupid beliefs
smack him upside the head and tell him to stop being a twat
Why?
What does that accomplish aside from potentially ostracizing him from his brother?
chances are, he will pull his head out of his ass in the next few years. Having not treated him like a subhuman while he chased fairytales will make it easier for him to grab a beer and watch a game with you in your 30s and 40s.
syndalis on
SW-4158-3990-6116
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
you dudes are way too PC about stupid stupid beliefs
smack him upside the head and tell him to stop being a twat
I see no difference beetween his belief and that of any other religious person and I don't go around smacking people upside the head
The difference for me is I care a lot about my brother and I want him to develop an intellectually curious and honest mindset, but I also don't want him to feel disrespected. Problem is he's a very sensitive sort.
I guess I have to choose. At this point I'm just suggesting that it would be more intellectually honest to suggest "I don't know how early history phenomena happened" than it would be to root his entire belief system to a hypothesis he can't test. But it might be time to drop it because I don't want to start shit.
it is interesting that when someone says they believe in alien gods you're all "make him see reason" but when someone says they believe in regular old gods doing that is bad
unless he's going to drink the spirit juice to pierce the veil just try to make him keep it more to himself
man that is completely wrong-headed
Old timey religions that have survived to this day have a certain amount of acceptability due to age and historical accident. There's no getting around this.
However, the take home message is not "therefore when some dullard starts spouting hippie-dippy alien crystal nonsense that would need 3 rewrites just to be a below-average episode of Stargate, treat him with respect and dignity because hey it's all cool man"
it's
"berate his stupid ass until he cries". Don't expand the privilege accorded to certain schools of sloppy thought to everything. That's just insane.
you dudes are way too PC about stupid stupid beliefs
smack him upside the head and tell him to stop being a twat
I see no difference beetween his belief and that of any other religious person and I don't go around smacking people upside the head
The difference for me is I care a lot about my brother and I want him to develop an intellectually curious and honest mindset, but I also don't want him to feel disrespected. Problem is he's a very sensitive sort.
I guess I have to choose. At this point I'm just suggesting that it would be more intellectually honest to suggest "I don't know how early history phenomena happened" than it would be to root his entire belief system to a hypothesis he can't test. But it might be time to drop it because I don't want to start shit.
Sorry, [chat]. I got kinda wacked out there.
it's kind of hard to change someone's way of thinking
I dunno, keep seeding intellectually curious thoughts in his head?
I mean even if he keeps the alien faith he'd be a better person
Man, now I'm all out of wack. My brother believes, without evidence, that aliens explain world religions and I'm all upset because I might have hurt his feelings
seems to me you're being too harsh on yourself.
I guess I'm just wondering what the best way to handle things like this, and the fact that it involves someone I really care bout it mixed things up even more. I mean, this is an asinine assertion and he's not even trying to be logical about it. On the other hand, he's a man now and he's entitled to believe as he wishes.
So what am I supposed to do when a man I care about tries to share, in earnest excitement, his beliefs about alien gods?
I had a friend in college like this. He was smart enough to question a lot of things about how the world works but not smart enough to reject the most stupid explanations in the face of monumental proof. My friends and I would stage interventions about certain beliefs of his. We would learn all we could about them, then have long discussions where we would tactfully hack away at the crazy from all sides while being absolutely certain we understood EXACTLY what it was. Because to someone who believes that alien god kings built the pyramids and showed us electricity, you have to get your criticism right or you will be dismissed as someone who just doesn't get it, man.
If you're alone trying to drag him back to reality, a lighter touch might be required. Possibly educating him though stealth comments, where you express doubts about [historical event X], which he will sympathize with, while simultaneously introducing details that make the whole aliens theory seem very unlikely.
Donkey Kong on
Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
it is interesting that when someone says they believe in alien gods you're all "make him see reason" but when someone says they believe in regular old gods doing that is bad
unless he's going to drink the spirit juice to pierce the veil just try to make him keep it more to himself
man that is completely wrong-headed
Old timey religions that have survived to this day have a certain amount of acceptability due to age and historical accident. There's no getting around this.
However, the take home message is not "therefore when some dullard starts spouting hippie-dippy alien crystal nonsense that would need 3 rewrites just to be a below-average episode of Stargate, treat him with respect and dignity because hey it's all cool man"
it's
"berate his stupid ass until he cries". Don't expand the privilege accorded to certain schools of sloppy thought to everything. That's just insane.
it is interesting that when someone says they believe in alien gods you're all "make him see reason" but when someone says they believe in regular old gods doing that is bad
unless he's going to drink the spirit juice to pierce the veil just try to make him keep it more to himself
man that is completely wrong-headed
Old timey religions that have survived to this day have a certain amount of acceptability due to age and historical accident. There's no getting around this.
However, the take home message is not "therefore when some dullard starts spouting hippie-dippy alien crystal nonsense that would need 3 rewrites just to be a below-average episode of Stargate, treat him with respect and dignity because hey it's all cool man"
it's
"berate his stupid ass until he cries". Don't expand the privilege accorded to certain schools of sloppy thought to everything. That's just insane.
That's fine when it's some douche on the internet or some asshat at the state university.
it is interesting that when someone says they believe in alien gods you're all "make him see reason" but when someone says they believe in regular old gods doing that is bad
unless he's going to drink the spirit juice to pierce the veil just try to make him keep it more to himself
man that is completely wrong-headed
Old timey religions that have survived to this day have a certain amount of acceptability due to age and historical accident. There's no getting around this.
However, the take home message is not "therefore when some dullard starts spouting hippie-dippy alien crystal nonsense that would need 3 rewrites just to be a below-average episode of Stargate, treat him with respect and dignity because hey it's all cool man"
it's
"berate his stupid ass until he cries". Don't expand the privilege accorded to certain schools of sloppy thought to everything. That's just insane.
:^: :^:
DasUberEdward on
0
syndalisGetting ClassyOn the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Productsregular
Old timey religions that have survived to this day have a certain amount of acceptability due to age and historical accident. There's no getting around this.
I'm not sure why age should mean it is OK to believe something. If someone spouted off the miasma theory of disease, would that make it acceptable?
you dudes are way too PC about stupid stupid beliefs
smack him upside the head and tell him to stop being a twat
I see no difference beetween his belief and that of any other religious person and I don't go around smacking people upside the head
Cept one is indoctrinated into society and the other is a person willingly and individually making the choice to be loony.
I think saying that generally, christians et al haven't made an individual choice about their beliefs is being down on them more than the alien cult dude
Man, now I'm all out of wack. My brother believes, without evidence, that aliens explain world religions and I'm all upset because I might have hurt his feelings
seems to me you're being too harsh on yourself.
I guess I'm just wondering what the best way to handle things like this, and the fact that it involves someone I really care bout it mixed things up even more. I mean, this is an asinine assertion and he's not even trying to be logical about it. On the other hand, he's a man now and he's entitled to believe as he wishes.
So what am I supposed to do when a man I care about tries to share, in earnest excitement, his beliefs about alien gods?
I had a friend in college like this. He was smart enough to question a lot of things about how the world works but not smart enough to reject the most stupid explanations in the face of monumental proof. My friends and I would stage interventions about certain beliefs of his. We would learn all we could about them, then have long discussions where we would tactfully hack away at the crazy from all sides while being absolutely certain we understood EXACTLY what it was. Because to someone who believes that alien god kings built the pyramids and showed us electricity, you have to get your criticism right or you will be dismissed as someone who just doesn't get it, man.
If you're alone trying to drag him back to reality, a lighter touch might be required. Possibly educating him though stealth comments, where you express doubts about [historical event X], which he will sympathize with, while simultaneously introducing details that make the whole aliens theory seem very unlikely.
Damn, man, this is incredible. And I feel like you get it.
Because yeah, despite the evidence I've provided here, my brother is smart. He has the capacity for so much brilliance, but he's so easily tempted by cool "explanations."
Posts
stopppp ittttt
you know a very small subset of the population can see the plane of polarized light
and you know that a very small subset of the population can see into the far red spectrum
guess who cant
You can train your eyes to see the polarization of light. It's kind of weird/neat
http://www.polarization.com/haidinger/haidinger.html
Treat his beliefs no differently than you do any other story you do not believe in, unless his laser lotus cult leader is asking for 50,000 dollars or something.
Then it is your obligation and duty as a family member to try and save him.
until then, let him have his faith.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
Man, I'm way more passive with established religions. My dad is really into Jesus and with him I just kinda shrug and go "whatever, don't really want to hear about it."
...
Oooooooh
what if some spiders are like super smart
but only at making webs or catching prey
why did you link it
noooo
smack him upside the head and tell him to stop being a twat
unless he's going to drink the spirit juice to pierce the veil just try to make him keep it more to himself
:shock:
I want that ability that platypuses and hammerhead sharks have.
I see no difference beetween his belief and that of any other religious person and I don't go around smacking people upside the head
Why?
What does that accomplish aside from potentially ostracizing him from his brother?
chances are, he will pull his head out of his ass in the next few years. Having not treated him like a subhuman while he chased fairytales will make it easier for him to grab a beer and watch a game with you in your 30s and 40s.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
yeah see. i get this man. i have a lot of arguments with the lady who is way deep into psychology.
she is all "animals are super dumb etc."
and i am like
"well. but."
Rhythmic Gymnast. Which is about as flexible a sport as they get. But god damn.
Cept one is indoctrinated into society and the other is a person willingly and individually making the choice to be loony.
I do/did and I feel like it was/is a dumb way to go about it
So I am trying to be less acerbic about silly beliefs in general
but that doesnt mean i wont argue about them
just that i will try to be less of a goose about them
The difference for me is I care a lot about my brother and I want him to develop an intellectually curious and honest mindset, but I also don't want him to feel disrespected. Problem is he's a very sensitive sort.
I guess I have to choose. At this point I'm just suggesting that it would be more intellectually honest to suggest "I don't know how early history phenomena happened" than it would be to root his entire belief system to a hypothesis he can't test. But it might be time to drop it because I don't want to start shit.
Sorry, [chat]. I got kinda wacked out there.
because he doesn't pretend to be the alpha dog, he is the alpha dog
he could have as many he wanted, and that is still true no matter how many he has at the moment
poseurs would grab as many as they can to try to give that impression
i agree with you
i am like
yeah but
bees have a language of sorts
Unlike lesser men he doesn't have a short attention span.
man that is completely wrong-headed
Old timey religions that have survived to this day have a certain amount of acceptability due to age and historical accident. There's no getting around this.
However, the take home message is not "therefore when some dullard starts spouting hippie-dippy alien crystal nonsense that would need 3 rewrites just to be a below-average episode of Stargate, treat him with respect and dignity because hey it's all cool man"
it's
"berate his stupid ass until he cries". Don't expand the privilege accorded to certain schools of sloppy thought to everything. That's just insane.
it's kind of hard to change someone's way of thinking
I dunno, keep seeding intellectually curious thoughts in his head?
I mean even if he keeps the alien faith he'd be a better person
well I am from new jersey
I had a friend in college like this. He was smart enough to question a lot of things about how the world works but not smart enough to reject the most stupid explanations in the face of monumental proof. My friends and I would stage interventions about certain beliefs of his. We would learn all we could about them, then have long discussions where we would tactfully hack away at the crazy from all sides while being absolutely certain we understood EXACTLY what it was. Because to someone who believes that alien god kings built the pyramids and showed us electricity, you have to get your criticism right or you will be dismissed as someone who just doesn't get it, man.
If you're alone trying to drag him back to reality, a lighter touch might be required. Possibly educating him though stealth comments, where you express doubts about [historical event X], which he will sympathize with, while simultaneously introducing details that make the whole aliens theory seem very unlikely.
no
she is working toward her masters in psych. there is no getting through.
i just tell the cat she didn't mean it and watch him run into a wall.
That's fine when it's some douche on the internet or some asshat at the state university.
you got me reading ethology research which at the same time excites me and frustrates me
so i guess ?
:^: :^:
glad to be of frustrating help.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
the cat may run into a wall but can your girl sneak up on and catch a bird
i think not
at least i cant
i have tried
I think saying that generally, christians et al haven't made an individual choice about their beliefs is being down on them more than the alien cult dude
Damn, man, this is incredible. And I feel like you get it.
Because yeah, despite the evidence I've provided here, my brother is smart. He has the capacity for so much brilliance, but he's so easily tempted by cool "explanations."