Re: Warden stopping on an opportunity attack, I've been referring to Sudden Roots. They slow on an opportunity attack, and when the Warden is surrounded by difficult terrain that's the next best thing.
I dunno, I agree that it would be good, but I hardly think it would be broken. And I seriously doubt it would become the only serious option.
Fighter would be giving up four feats and losing the chance to take a PP for Font of Life, basically.
I'll flip this around a little. Every defender would have to be stone-cold retarded to not multi-class fighter. Combat challenge+superiority for the ultra win. Why yes, I'd love to warrior's urging to set up all sorts of swordmage AE and then not let people get away. Or even worse, to set up a demigod stunning smite loop.
A single power =/ class feature that does it all the time, every time and isn't dependent on conditions or a specific power
Sudden roots is a heroic feat. Your AOO's cause slow.
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MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
edited April 2009
Ah, that's where some of the misunderstanding is coming from. I've been talking about a hypothetical change in which paragon multiclassing would grant class features in exchange for all the stuff it gives up.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
Ah, that's where some of the misunderstanding is coming from. I've been talking about a hypothetical change in which paragon multiclassing would grant class features in exchange for all the stuff it gives up.
Oh no, I'm talking about the new Dual Class mechanic. It can't simply be multiclassing with another name or why would they be showing it off? At best it's something that lets you select powers from your new class as you wish, but has some cost/disadvantage.
At it's worst it works like 2E, you have X levels in one class and then switch to a second class. Where you then gain new class features and such or something else zany, then regain them at X level.
Or it lets you pick and choose a few class features or whatever to add to your own. Again, this means what defender won't choose fighter? Many strikers would pick avenger too I would bet (OoE). It just gets ridiculous too much and increases the gaps between classes with great class features and everyone else.
Ah, that's where some of the misunderstanding is coming from. I've been talking about a hypothetical change in which paragon multiclassing would grant class features in exchange for all the stuff it gives up.
No, I'm talking about the same thing. A fighter's combat challenge and combat superiority are, in my eyes at least, overpowered. The two features give him a level of stickiness that far outstrips any other defender, minus a warden MAYBE. If you could paragon MC and get class features, every single swordmage, paladin and warden I ever made would paragon mc for these 2 class features.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
Ah, that's where some of the misunderstanding is coming from. I've been talking about a hypothetical change in which paragon multiclassing would grant class features in exchange for all the stuff it gives up.
No, I'm talking about the same thing. A fighter's combat challenge and combat superiority are, in my eyes at least, overpowered. The two features give him a level of stickiness that far outstrips any other defender, minus a warden MAYBE. If you could paragon MC and get class features, every single swordmage, paladin and warden I ever made would paragon mc for these 2 class features.
Same. Actually, now I think of it this undermines my point from before but makes a new (and stronger) point. Other than the battlerager, I would just dual class fighter for those feats and otherwise have no reason to play a fighter.
I really REALLY hope they've carefully considered what Dual Classing is supposed to do.
Because you need to be consistent. You say "we grant X on a limited basis through MCing" and we are consistent about it. Not making exceptions is the absolutely BEST way of doing this and indeed, they have been very good with class features being granted through multiclass feats being limited and this is by far the only reason it works.
Well I have to say, its less of a concern for me now that PHB2 has come and I can play a gnome X and get prestidigitation with a feat, but I guess thats kind of shitting on your consistency theme.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited April 2009
Really? Never noticed that feat.
I wonder if there is a way of filtering out feats by book in the CB so I can read them all.
Fey Trickster its called, gnome only. Gets you prestidigitation and mage hand. Pretty nice really given gnomes can already Ghost Sound better than a wizard.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited April 2009
Indeed there IS a way of filtering feats in the CB.
This is a pleasing discovery (well it's more like filtering books, but you get the general idea).
Fey Trickster its called, gnome only. Gets you prestidigitation and mage hand as encounter powers. Pretty nice really given gnomes can already Ghost Sound better than a wizard.
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Mr_Rose83 Blue Ridge Protects the HolyRegistered Userregular
edited April 2009
Huh, feat filtering? Do you mean altering the campaign settings to remove specific feats?
Indeed there IS a way of filtering feats in the CB.
This is a pleasing discovery (well it's more like filtering books, but you get the general idea).
This is why I rarely use my books except to check the texts on class features or actual combat rules, because filtering by keyword, book, etc. makes the CB and the compendium so much easier to use than the actual books for powers, feats, monsters, equipment, etc.
So for funsies I sometimes make a quick character in the builder, just to see what sort of mechanical abortion it throws at me. I just got this monstrosity and I felt like sharing.
This is thanks to a poster on the Wizards of the Coast's Eberron forum by the name of Save vs DM. Eberron Cliff Notes
Are you interested in Eberron but don’t want to troll through dozens of reviews and posts just to find out a few basics? Then this thread is for you! This thread is designed to give players and dungeon masters who are new to the campaign setting a very brief overview of the setting.
Who Made It?
The Eberron Campaign Setting was the winning campaign setting in the 2002 Wizards of the Coast contest. It was conceived and created by Keith Baker.
Eberron in 150 Words
Eberron is new a pulp noir fantasy setting with a focus on lower level adventurers and action adventure. A hundred year civil war (The Last War) ended just two years ago and the world still struggles to recover from the massive conflict. It is a world of widespread but practical magic that has been studied and applied much like we use science. Deities have little to no actual presence in the world and religion is based around churches just as much as it is based around a deity. Alignments are grey, with many shades of grey, and clerics need not have the same alignment as their deity. It is a world where Indiana Jones and Captain Jack Sparrow might find themselves at home in, but where Same Spade also has a place. It is a campaign setting for anyone who wants to run adventures filled with action, intrigue, and suspense!
5 Unique Things About Eberron
1. The setting focuses on the characters as heroes – even a first level character has a lot to offer in a world where most NPCs are lower level and possess mostly NPC classes.
2. Religion is based around the church, not around the deity itself. Characters are free to interpret the gods as they best see fit. The gods do not walk the face of Eberron, and many even debate if they exist at all.
3. Magic is widespread but not powerful – you’re much more likely to see a town square lit with everburning torches than you are to see a wizard’s duel.
4. Adventures in Eberron are focused around action, adventure, and suspense. If you liked movies like King Kong or Indiana Jones, then this is the campaign setting for you.
5. Eberron is not connected to the Great Wheel cosmology – it instead has it’s own planar system. (Though you can reach the Great Wheel via the Plane of Shadow if you so choose.)
Eberron Races
* Changelings: A new race in Eberron, Changelings are descended from the mixing of humans and doppelgangers. They are now a true breeding race and possess a limited shape changing ability.
* Dwarves: Dwarves in Eberron are consummate bankers and businessmen in addition to being stout warriors. Dwarves can take the dragonmark of warding.
* Elves: Elves in Eberron generally either come from Valenar or Aerenal. The Valenar elves are fierce desert dwelling warriors who venerate and seek to emulate their ancestors. The Aerenal come from the island nation of Aerenal and are adept at necromancy. They worship their living deathless ancestors, who remain alive as positive-energy powered undead. Elves can take the dragonmark of shadow.
* Gnomes: Gnomes are the premier knowledge seekers and rumor traders in Eberron. They hail from the nation of Zilargo. Gnomes in Eberron are not to be trusted, as they are known for being sneaky information brokers.
* Goblinoids: The goblinoids of Eberron formed one of the first civilizations on the continent of Khorvaire, but have since fallen. They are suitable as player characters in this setting. They are very martial and disciplined, at least those that hail from Darguun.
* Half-Elves: Also known as the Khoravar, the half-elves of Eberron are a true breeding race. They are a force to be reckoned with, as they possess the ability to take both the mark of detection and the mark of storm. They are among the best detectives and sailors on the face of Khorvaire.
* Half-Orcs: Half-orcs are still the result of mixed heritage, but they suffer less social stigma than in other settings. They can possess the mark of finding.
* Halflings: Halflings in Eberron originated in the Talenta Plains, where many of them still live nomadic lives. The Talentan halflings often ride tamed dinosaur mounts into battle. Their more civilized brethren run most of the important inns, thanks to the mark of hospitality. They can possess the mark of healing and the mark of hospitality.
* Humans: Humans in Eberron (along with other races) are really defined by their nation. They are otherwise much the same as in other settings. They can posses the mark of finding, handling, making, or sentinel.
* Kalashtar: Kalashtar are the result of the melding of a humanoid host with a Quori spirit. They are compound psionic beings who are waging an unending war against the Dreaming Dark, an entity from Dal Quor, the realm of nightmares.
* Shifters: Shifters are the distant relations of lycanthrope and human cross-breeding, though now they only retain a small portion of their lycanthropic heritage. They look like slightly feral humans, though are much hairier. They can tap into their lycanthropic heritage by shifting, which is similar to a barbarians rage.
* Warforged: Warforged were created to serve in the Last War. They are living constructs, intelligent constructs with a constitution score. They are not robots, though they are created beings.
What Are Dragonmarks?
Dragonmarks are similar to magical birthmarks, though they appear after you are born. They allow the core races to produce spell-like effects. Each of the twelve marks (there were thirteen, but one has been lost, the Mark of Death) have a common theme that has resulted in twelve great dragonmarked houses. These houses are now mercantile powerhouses of the world. Each house has a specific niche that they filled depending on their dragonmark. Players can manifest dragonmarks by taking a feat. Dragonmarks are tied to a specific race and none of the new races can manifest a dragonmark.
Weird Things Explained
* Dinosaurs: Eberron never underwent an ice age, so dinosaurs have continued to flourish in the Talenta Plains, Xen’drik, Q’Barra, and Argonnessen. The halflings of the Talenta Plains have domesticated many breeds of dinosaurs and they use some of them as mounts.
* No Great Wheel: The lack of a great wheel cosmology connection was purposeful. The planes of Eberron orbit much like planets around the sun, and as such can become coterminous or distant. They have resulted in two near-catastrophic events in the world: the invasion of the Daelkyr (powerful and alien aberrations) and the Quori (nightmare outsiders). While it is different, it is also very unique.
* Warforged: Warforged were created for a very specific purpose: to be brutally efficient, tireless, and loyal warriors. They were produced by House Cannith during the end of the Last War, though since the fall of the war they have been declared free citizens. Though they might appear to look like robots or cyborgs, they have a lot more in common with golems. They are living constructs, meaning they have some of the traits of living beings and constructs. They are free willed and thinking beings, and are suitable for characters.
What Books Do I Absolutely Need?
The only book you really need to play is the Eberron Campaign Setting. While all the other supplements are good additions, you can get along just fine with the core rulebook, at least for a little while. Opinions about the other books vary from player to player, but this poster generally feels that the Player’s Guide to Eberron is a good catch-all book for players and that the Five Nations is a great investment for dungeon masters.
What Free Materials are Available?
* Dragonshards Archive: Dragonshards are free articles written by Keith Baker. They provide additional insight into the world about a variety of topic. They’re all free and can serve as a good source of additional information.
* Eberron Expanded: These articles tell you how to integrate other Wizards of the Coast products into Eberron.
* Sharn Inquisitive: The Sharn Inquisitive is an “in game” newspaper that can provide plenty of plot hooks for dungeon masters.
* Steal This Hook: A great list of plot hook ideas for use in Eberron.
Credit doesn't go to me, goes to Save Vs. DM and the guy at the other forum who reposted it, blah blah blah, keep in mind that adventures and supplements are for 3.5, and things may change with 4e.
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Too many people at WoTC have way too much time on their hands. A fake class, a fake dungeon delve, an MTG card, a bunch of articles on the MTG main site as well?
Someone needs to tell these people that a good April Fool gag is better when delivered subtly. When every frikkin' article on the company website on April 1st is a gag one (and mostly fairly low quality gags), it does make me wonder why I keep giving these people my money.
Sometime less is more, WoTC. Try doing some proper work. Like, actually balancing the next book that comes out.
/rant.
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JacobkoshGamble a stamp.I can show you how to be a real man!Moderatormod
edited April 2009
rpg.net is full of subhumans who deserve nothing but pain and death.
Also, the "Which Witchalok?" Utility 2 is depressing and I love it.
I enjoy that they threw in "Unburning coldfire" as a joke, even though I know I just read a power that's either out already or due out in Arcane Power that deals both cold and fire damage simultaneously.
Anyone else disappointed that WOTC didn't actually expand upon shifters to make them into an actual PC class? I was expecting them to be fleshed out like the PHB races, and instead, they just got a 2 page expansion to the MM entry.
Anyone else disappointed that WOTC didn't actually expand upon shifters to make them into an actual PC class? I was expecting them to be fleshed out like the PHB races, and instead, they just got a 2 page expansion to the MM entry.
Anyone else disappointed that WOTC didn't actually expand upon shifters to make them into an actual PC class? I was expecting them to be fleshed out like the PHB races, and instead, they just got a 2 page expansion to the MM entry.
Umm... the two pages is precisely how much most races got. What were you looking for?
Anyone else disappointed that WOTC didn't actually expand upon shifters to make them into an actual PC class? I was expecting them to be fleshed out like the PHB races, and instead, they just got a 2 page expansion to the MM entry.
Umm... the two pages is precisely how much most races got. What were you looking for?
They didn't add any racial abilities/bonuses like PHB races have.
The Eladrin entry, for example, have Eladrin Education, Eladrin Weapon Proficiency, Trance, etc.
Shifters entry didn't change. Each kind has an encounter power and a stat bonus. (I don't have my PHBII in front of me)
Anyone else disappointed that WOTC didn't actually expand upon shifters to make them into an actual PC class? I was expecting them to be fleshed out like the PHB races, and instead, they just got a 2 page expansion to the MM entry.
Umm... the two pages is precisely how much most races got. What were you looking for?
They didn't add any racial abilities/bonuses like PHB races have.
The Eladrin entry, for example, have Eladrin Education, Eladrin Weapon Proficiency, Trance, etc.
Shifters entry didn't change. Each kind has an encounter power and a stat bonus. (I don't have my PHBII in front of me)
Their encounter power is pretty hefty though. And they did get feats. I'd say, mechanically, they are on par with the other races. (A Razorclaw Avenger, for example, would be pretty nice)
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Der Waffle MousBlame this on the misfortune of your birth.New Yark, New Yark.Registered Userregular
edited April 2009
Ahahaha, they managed to work in the gnome and francis.
Anyone else disappointed that WOTC didn't actually expand upon shifters to make them into an actual PC class? I was expecting them to be fleshed out like the PHB races, and instead, they just got a 2 page expansion to the MM entry.
Umm... the two pages is precisely how much most races got. What were you looking for?
Also, the "Which Witchalok?" Utility 2 is depressing and I love it.
I enjoy that they threw in "Unburning coldfire" as a joke, even though I know I just read a power that's either out already or due out in Arcane Power that deals both cold and fire damage simultaneously.
Well, I was just working on an idea for a campaign opening that involved a girl they had to escort. But now I kind of want to pull a sort of Alice in Wonderland using Fool's Grove, but that means I have to pad the opening enough to get them to level 2 before they even get there. Hrm.
I suppose I could just run it as a one-off for fun and not worry about it, as well.
Too many people at WoTC have way too much time on their hands. A fake class, a fake dungeon delve, an MTG card, a bunch of articles on the MTG main site as well?
Someone needs to tell these people that a good April Fool gag is better when delivered subtly. When every frikkin' article on the company website on April 1st is a gag one (and mostly fairly low quality gags), it does make me wonder why I keep giving these people my money.
Sometime less is more, WoTC. Try doing some proper work. Like, actually balancing the next book that comes out.
/rant.
I thought I was reading a post on the WoW forums for a second there. Which reminds me, I need to see what Blizzard announced today...
I'm going to pick a random PbP game on Mythweavers and apply as a Witchalok. I'll make it a 3.5 game, too, for shits and giggles.
Posts
PSN: SAW776
I'll flip this around a little. Every defender would have to be stone-cold retarded to not multi-class fighter. Combat challenge+superiority for the ultra win. Why yes, I'd love to warrior's urging to set up all sorts of swordmage AE and then not let people get away. Or even worse, to set up a demigod stunning smite loop.
Sudden roots is a heroic feat. Your AOO's cause slow.
LoL: failboattootoot
Oh no, I'm talking about the new Dual Class mechanic. It can't simply be multiclassing with another name or why would they be showing it off? At best it's something that lets you select powers from your new class as you wish, but has some cost/disadvantage.
At it's worst it works like 2E, you have X levels in one class and then switch to a second class. Where you then gain new class features and such or something else zany, then regain them at X level.
Or it lets you pick and choose a few class features or whatever to add to your own. Again, this means what defender won't choose fighter? Many strikers would pick avenger too I would bet (OoE). It just gets ridiculous too much and increases the gaps between classes with great class features and everyone else.
Man, I totally want to see half this shit. When is my PHB II reaching New Zealands far shores
(it's really easy to miss/overlook feats like this when you're trying to "read" a class in the CB)
No, I'm talking about the same thing. A fighter's combat challenge and combat superiority are, in my eyes at least, overpowered. The two features give him a level of stickiness that far outstrips any other defender, minus a warden MAYBE. If you could paragon MC and get class features, every single swordmage, paladin and warden I ever made would paragon mc for these 2 class features.
LoL: failboattootoot
Same. Actually, now I think of it this undermines my point from before but makes a new (and stronger) point. Other than the battlerager, I would just dual class fighter for those feats and otherwise have no reason to play a fighter.
I really REALLY hope they've carefully considered what Dual Classing is supposed to do.
I wonder if there is a way of filtering out feats by book in the CB so I can read them all.
This is a pleasing discovery (well it's more like filtering books, but you get the general idea).
LoL: failboattootoot
Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
This is why I rarely use my books except to check the texts on class features or actual combat rules, because filtering by keyword, book, etc. makes the CB and the compendium so much easier to use than the actual books for powers, feats, monsters, equipment, etc.
Tiefling, Warlord, Battle Captain, Eternal Seeker
Build: Inspiring Warlord
Commanding Presence: Inspiring Presence
Seeking Destiny: Trickster's Control
Pact Initiate: Pact Initiate (dark pact)
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 26, Con 13, Dex 12, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 24.
Starting Ability Scores
Str 18, Con 11, Dex 10, Int 10, Wis 8, Cha 14.
AC: 38 Fort: 40 Reflex: 36 Will: 39
HP: 185 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 46
TRAINED SKILLS
Athletics, History, Heal, Diplomacy, Bluff.
FEATS
1: Weapon Expertise (Heavy Blade)
2: Improved Inspiring Word
4: Toughness
6: Saving Inspiration
8: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blade)
10: Improved Initiative
11: Mounted Combat
12: Inspired Recovery
14: Pact Initiate
16: Lightning Reflexes
18: Distant Shot
20: Combat Commander
21: Shield Proficiency (Heavy)
22: Novice Power
24: Powerful Charge
26: Blood Thirst
28: Fiery Rebuke
30: Inescapable Force
POWERS
1, At-Will: Furious Smash
1, At-Will: Commander's Strike
1, Encounter: Guarding Attack
1, Daily: Bastion of Defense
2, Utility: Shake It Off
3, Encounter: Warlord's Strike
5, Daily: Stand the Fallen
6, Utility: Stand Tough
7, Encounter: Sunder Armor
9, Daily: Knock Them Down
10, Utility: Defensive Rally
13, Encounter: Beat Them Into the Ground (replaces Guarding Attack)
15, Daily: Renew the Troops (replaces Bastion of Defense)
16, Utility: White Raven Formation
17, Encounter: Thunderous Fury (replaces Warlord's Strike)
19, Daily: Break the Tempo (replaces Stand the Fallen)
22, Utility: Heroic Surge
23, Encounter: Ringing Clarity (replaces Sunder Armor)
25, Daily: Unstoppable Arrows (replaces Knock Them Down)
27, Encounter: Strengthen the Faithful (replaces Beat Them Into the Ground)
29, Daily: Immobilizing Strike (replaces Renew the Troops)
26, Utility: Strength From Pain
ITEMS
Berserker Longsword +6, Tactician's Chainmail +6, Wyrmtouched Amulet +6, Chainmail, Longsword, Light Shield, Adventurer's Kit
LoL: failboattootoot
If you want a paragon path and it doesn't fit with your MC then tough luck say I! You should have picked the appropriate main class at level 1 :P
Credit doesn't go to me, goes to Save Vs. DM and the guy at the other forum who reposted it, blah blah blah, keep in mind that adventures and supplements are for 3.5, and things may change with 4e.
In his defense, the Drizzt card made me want to set their server on fire.
LoL: failboattootoot
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
If you knock off half of a monster's hit points in one attack, does it auto-kill the monster?
I believe that only works if they're helpless. A Coup de grace kills if you deal their bloodied value in damage, doesn't it?\
Edit: Also, Ruuuu-Ruuuu-Ruuuuudddyyy!
PSN: SAW776
Only if you do it as part of a coup de grace.
LoL: failboattootoot
Azulan Saul Tigh
Also, the "Which Witchalok?" Utility 2 is depressing and I love it.
I enjoy that they threw in "Unburning coldfire" as a joke, even though I know I just read a power that's either out already or due out in Arcane Power that deals both cold and fire damage simultaneously.
Maybe we'll see that more in the Eberron book?
PSN: SAW776
Umm... the two pages is precisely how much most races got. What were you looking for?
They didn't add any racial abilities/bonuses like PHB races have.
The Eladrin entry, for example, have Eladrin Education, Eladrin Weapon Proficiency, Trance, etc.
Shifters entry didn't change. Each kind has an encounter power and a stat bonus. (I don't have my PHBII in front of me)
Their encounter power is pretty hefty though. And they did get feats. I'd say, mechanically, they are on par with the other races. (A Razorclaw Avenger, for example, would be pretty nice)
PSN: SAW776
They also got a pretty decent paragon path.
Francis is the best.
Spoiler for my players!
PSN: SAW776
I'm planning on it too. It seems legit (by which i mean runnable and appropriate for those levels).
I suppose I could just run it as a one-off for fun and not worry about it, as well.
PSN: SAW776
I thought I was reading a post on the WoW forums for a second there. Which reminds me, I need to see what Blizzard announced today...
I'm going to pick a random PbP game on Mythweavers and apply as a Witchalok. I'll make it a 3.5 game, too, for shits and giggles.