Yeah I thought the Shelby reveal was horrible. They should have at least put you in control of Lauren for a while so you have a sense that Shelby is doing his own thing, but you never lost control of him so it definitely felt like a lie. The fact that he actually did it with Lauren right in the next room distracted purely by chance was fucking stupid. Half his actions up until then didn't make sense - why did he let Lauren come with him? It's up to the player whether or not he resists her. The envelope was not that big a piece of evidence to be worth the trouble, and he never tried to kill her(even given the perfect opportunity later to let her die, you can make him save her). Most importantly though, I don't like the fact that I'm controlling this character on the assumption that he's acting for a certain reason, and then that all turns out to have been wrong. I think that's fundamentally opposed to what it means to be a player, especially in a game that's all about making decisions. After the reveal it no longer makes sense that Shelby acted the way I told him to without a lame plot device like multiple personalities.
When he was revealed I was honestly convinced that the killer could have been any number of people, and Shelby's name was pulled out of a hat based on what I did thus far. It felt just like that classic mystery game trick - the vagueness up until then and the sudden shift from good guy to psychopath was a dead giveaway. How can they explain Ethan's episodes anyway? Where did the origami figures he was holding come from? And were his visions of drowning bodies just a coincidence?
As for your last set of questions, those are all just unexplained red herrings. They exist for the sole purpose of casting doubt, and no. Not a single one of them makes sense or is in any way explained.
God I grew to hate this game while getting the trophies. Its soooooooooo god damn slow, nothings skippable, you realise, as you replay scenes that nothing you do really even matters. During Ethans escape from the hotel I didn't touch the keypad and he managed to make it onto the roof before he was caught. Its just a bad game that doesn't deserve the praise it got. It isn't even a shadow of a game that offers actual choice. Mostly I wish I'd read a guide first because having to replay almost the entire game to get almost all the trophies was a nightmare, honestly took about 3 days of playing for 4-5 hours to do it.
Purely because of unskippable cutscenes and pointless scenes that don't offer choice at all like the golf course.
God I grew to hate this game while getting the trophies. Its soooooooooo god damn slow, nothings skippable, you realise, as you replay scenes that nothing you do really even matters. During Ethans escape from the hotel I didn't touch the keypad and he managed to make it onto the roof before he was caught. Its just a bad game that doesn't deserve the praise it got. It isn't even a shadow of a game that offers actual choice. Mostly I wish I'd read a guide first because having to replay almost the entire game to get almost all the trophies was a nightmare, honestly took about 3 days of playing for 4-5 hours to do it.
Purely because of unskippable cutscenes and pointless scenes that don't offer choice at all like the golf course.
Plus of course teh plot holes left and right.
I think the game was only really meant to be played through once while trying for real and dealing with what you get. Once you start replaying it or goofing around and the mechanics become obvious, the illusion falls apart. Other than the handful of plot contrivances though it was pretty good for the first(short) playthrough.
God I grew to hate this game while getting the trophies. Its soooooooooo god damn slow, nothings skippable, you realise, as you replay scenes that nothing you do really even matters. During Ethans escape from the hotel I didn't touch the keypad and he managed to make it onto the roof before he was caught. Its just a bad game that doesn't deserve the praise it got. It isn't even a shadow of a game that offers actual choice. Mostly I wish I'd read a guide first because having to replay almost the entire game to get almost all the trophies was a nightmare, honestly took about 3 days of playing for 4-5 hours to do it.
Purely because of unskippable cutscenes and pointless scenes that don't offer choice at all like the golf course.
Plus of course teh plot holes left and right.
I think the game was only really meant to be played through once while trying for real and dealing with what you get. Once you start replaying it or goofing around and the mechanics become obvious, the illusion falls apart. Other than the handful of plot contrivances though it was pretty good for the first(short) playthrough.
I dont know, on the first play through it got pretty tedious. Replaying it though it becomes very obvious how little you matter in the grand scheme of things, it really is just a movie that requires the occasional input.
Yeah, it's neat on your first playthrough, but once you go through again and can see how all the bells and whistles function and realize how little what you do actually matters, it kinda kills it.
Yeah, it's neat on your first playthrough, but once you go through again and can see how all the bells and whistles function and realize how little what you do actually matters, it kinda kills it.
Plus, as others have mentioned, the blatant hints that point you at who might be the killer which are never investigated, Ethan being of course the worst since he actually has teh freaking evidence on him and Madison's dreams about being attacked and murdered by guys in army gear that are never investigated.
Cage really has been very lucky to get the support he did on Heavy Rain, and the reception it got. Honestly, replaying it I don't think I've ever been so angry with a game, if only because of the time it took to do nothing.
My biggest peeve is trying to do nothing and having something forced on me.
Try to let Scott die at any juncture of the story
edit: Also, that this game has a lot of juicy trophies I can't be arsed to get. You have to sit through the credits for each ending for it to count as you having gotten that particular ending. It's maddening.
Why the hell didn't Ethan start guessing the address earlier? After the second or third trial you have the full number and can make out "Roosevelt." He or the police would have had plenty of time to investigate all the possible addresses after that. I laughed when after not shooting the guy in the 4th trial, I drank the vial and all I got was a single H.
My biggest peeve is trying to do nothing and having something forced on me.
Try to let Scott die at any juncture of the story
edit: Also, that this game has a lot of juicy trophies I can't be arsed to get. You have to sit through the credits for each ending for it to count as you having gotten that particular ending. It's maddening.
If theres one thing that game is good at its wasting your time. Why do you have to sit through 10 minutes of credits every fecking time? Makes me angry just thinking about it.
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Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
Yeah I thought the Shelby reveal was horrible. They should have at least put you in control of Lauren for a while so you have a sense that Shelby is doing his own thing, but you never lost control of him so it definitely felt like a lie. The fact that he actually did it with Lauren right in the next room distracted purely by chance was fucking stupid. Half his actions up until then didn't make sense - why did he let Lauren come with him? It's up to the player whether or not he resists her. The envelope was not that big a piece of evidence to be worth the trouble, and he never tried to kill her(even given the perfect opportunity later to let her die, you can make him save her). Most importantly though, I don't like the fact that I'm controlling this character on the assumption that he's acting for a certain reason, and then that all turns out to have been wrong. I think that's fundamentally opposed to what it means to be a player, especially in a game that's all about making decisions. After the reveal it no longer makes sense that Shelby acted the way I told him to without a lame plot device like multiple personalities.
When he was revealed I was honestly convinced that the killer could have been any number of people, and Shelby's name was pulled out of a hat based on what I did thus far. It felt just like that classic mystery game trick - the vagueness up until then and the sudden shift from good guy to psychopath was a dead giveaway. How can they explain Ethan's episodes anyway? Where did the origami figures he was holding come from? And were his visions of drowning bodies just a coincidence?
As for your last set of questions, those are all just unexplained red herrings. They exist for the sole purpose of casting doubt, and no. Not a single one of them makes sense or is in any way explained.
DAVID CAGE.
Jesus H
I swear, this game relies on the most awful technique of any mystery novel or film: the idea that if it throws enough crazy shit at you for long enough, you'll forget about most of it by the end and not question the reveal
Why the hell didn't Ethan start guessing the address earlier? After the second or third trial you have the full number and can make out "Roosevelt." He or the police would have had plenty of time to investigate all the possible addresses after that. I laughed when after not shooting the guy in the 4th trial, I drank the vial and all I got was a single H.
Oh god, same here.
After the second trial it's so violently obvious what the word is. And hell, even if he just went to the cops before doing any trials, the number of numbers/letters in the address plus the fact that we now know the kid is in an outdoor grate would narrow things down enough to let the cops do a pretty effective search.
We never even got the flimsiest of "if you go to the cops, he dies now" to explain why he'd jump through all the hoops, did we?
Try guessing the wrong address. It's hilariously bleak.
I guessed the wrong address (I didn't listen long enough to hear the seagulls) but I got the right one with the reporter so I was able to call Ethan and get him to the warehouse anyway
Try guessing the wrong address. It's hilariously bleak.
I guessed the wrong address (I didn't listen long enough to hear the seagulls) but I got the right one with the reporter so I was able to call Ethan and get him to the warehouse anyway
I called Jayden cause...he was the most useful out of all them so far.
Try guessing the wrong address. It's hilariously bleak.
I guessed the wrong address (I didn't listen long enough to hear the seagulls) but I got the right one with the reporter so I was able to call Ethan and get him to the warehouse anyway
I called Jayden cause...he was the most useful out of all them so far.
I called Ethan because Jayden already knew to get there and also because there was no fucking reason for her to know who Jayden was
Try guessing the wrong address. It's hilariously bleak.
I guessed the wrong address (I didn't listen long enough to hear the seagulls) but I got the right one with the reporter so I was able to call Ethan and get him to the warehouse anyway
I called Jayden cause...he was the most useful out of all them so far.
I called Ethan because Jayden already knew to get there and also because there was no fucking reason for her to know who Jayden was
Try guessing the wrong address. It's hilariously bleak.
I guessed the wrong address (I didn't listen long enough to hear the seagulls) but I got the right one with the reporter so I was able to call Ethan and get him to the warehouse anyway
I called Jayden cause...he was the most useful out of all them so far.
I called Ethan because Jayden already knew to get there and also because there was no fucking reason for her to know who Jayden was
I knew I wasn't crazy when I thought that!
Why on earth does she even have his phone number?
Especially since it would have served the same purpose to have her just call "the police"
and have him be the one that goes to investigate her call
Cage's explanation for that was that Jayden's presence in town as the big shot FBI agent taking on a serial killer case was big news. Madison, as a journalist, was well aware of who Nahman Jayden was and how to contact him.
So yeah, my (2nd, after the worst ending) end game just involved Madison and Nahman.
In my playthrough, Nahman didn't have enough of the pieces to find the killer so he needed the phonecall.
Cage's explanation for that was that Jayden's presence in town as the big shot FBI agent taking on a serial killer case was big news. Madison, as a journalist, was well aware of who Nahman Jayden was and how to contact him.
So yeah, my (2nd, after the worst ending) end game just involved Madison and Nahman.
In my playthrough, Nahman didn't have enough of the pieces to find the killer so he needed the phonecall.
Yeah sorry you don't get to just make stuff up and stick in the story after the fact
Cage's explanation for that was that Jayden's presence in town as the big shot FBI agent taking on a serial killer case was big news. Madison, as a journalist, was well aware of who Nahman Jayden was and how to contact him.
So yeah, my (2nd, after the worst ending) end game just involved Madison and Nahman.
In my playthrough, Nahman didn't have enough of the pieces to find the killer so he needed the phonecall.
Yeah sorry you don't get to just make stuff up and stick in the story after the fact
either it's part of the story or it's not
and Madison knowing anything about Jayden is not
Hell, Madison knowing anything about Ethan. The game never went out of its way to have a newscast showing Ethan's face or anything that would indicate to her that this guy is big news.
Cage's explanation for that was that Jayden's presence in town as the big shot FBI agent taking on a serial killer case was big news. Madison, as a journalist, was well aware of who Nahman Jayden was and how to contact him.
So yeah, my (2nd, after the worst ending) end game just involved Madison and Nahman.
In my playthrough, Nahman didn't have enough of the pieces to find the killer so he needed the phonecall.
Yeah sorry you don't get to just make stuff up and stick in the story after the fact
I'm resurrecting this thread to ask if anyone has the answer to this question: How the hell am I supposed to play this Taxidermist DLC that I bought, downloaded and installed? I for life of me can't find any method to actually start it from anywhere within the menus.
e: Okay apparently you start it from the Extras->Downloaded Content menu, except.... all that does is send me to a page on the Playstation Store where it says content not found. WTF?
Anyway.. the move edition patch is out now, so I tried playing it with my shiny new plastic ice-cream cone. But, for some reason the thing isn't responding to my motion controller AT ALL... The damn thing doesn't even light up
Anyway.. the move edition patch is out now, so I tried playing it with my shiny new plastic ice-cream cone. But, for some reason the thing isn't responding to my motion controller AT ALL... The damn thing doesn't even light up
Has anyone else tried the move edition yet?
Move works for me. Stupid question though, have you downloaded the Heavy Rain patch that enables Move support? The options menu has an option to switch to the wireless controller for me. Maybe yours has an option to switch to the Move controller? You'll need either a dualshock or a nav controller. Only the left half of the dual shock is used in Move mode which sucks for us lefties that like to use the Move controller with our left hand. There's a left/right handed setting, but I can't tell what it really does.
I just started playing this game last night, I was a really big fan of Indigo Prophecy, and this so far seems to be even better. It's just sometimes the control scheme annoys the piss out of me. It seems they took the worst part of movement from Resident Evil 1/2/3 (tank controls) and make them more complicated.
It also seems like either I'm not understanding how to do some actions, or the prompts aren't noticeable. The biggest offender so far for both of these things is:
(Early game spoilers with Jayden, when you go to the apartment)
When I was trying to walk between the kitchen and the living room, the change of camera angles and the analogue walking just lead me to turning around in the same space from probably a good 30 seconds before I simply got frustrated and walked through the rest of the house to get back to the living room. I thought I saw a prompt to leave through the front door, is it possible to leave before CrazyGuy (I'm sorry I don't remember his name) shows up?
Also, when Blake is interrogating him, Jayden's thoughts are all "I GOTTA DO SOMETHING!" and then I see no way to interrupt what's actually happening besides simply yelling "BLAKE STOP IT YOU BIG MEANY". Is there a way to push Blake or something? Or are you forced into the whole Mexican standoff? Stupid 'Blunder' Trophy, criminals should know you shouldn't reach into your shirt while someone is pointing a gun at you....that's just common sense!
I really do like the game, even though it's horribly depressing. I just hate having to fight with the control scheme.
Don't hold the analog stick in the direction you're walking. push it to point your character the right way, then release it and hold down R2.
Thank you, I'll try that later this evening when I have the opportunity to play again. I thought the concept was "Hold down R2" to enable walking, then you use the analogue stick like you would in a regular game. I appreciate the help!
Don't hold the analog stick in the direction you're walking. push it to point your character the right way, then release it and hold down R2.
Thank you, I'll try that later this evening when I have the opportunity to play again. I thought the concept was "Hold down R2" to enable walking, then you use the analogue stick like you would in a regular game. I appreciate the help!
Yeah, the idea is if you're walking around, you just hold down R2, and only touch the analog stick when you want to change directions. Takes some getting used to, just because we've been conditioned to hold a stick when we want to move.
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Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
It's basically a mix tape. David Cage thought of a lot of cliches he liked, like noir detectives, asshole cops and rookie FBI agents, plucky brunettes with short haircuts, and flashback sequences. Then he put them all together in one game.
It's fun when you can get lost in the joy of playing a cop movie or relishing in getting into a chase scene through a crowded market, but then you remember that the scene's just there because Cage liked it when it happened in a movie once.
Not that there's anything wrong with borrowing from other mediums, it's what games have been doing for years, and Cage has basically reached the apex. It's just that now we're gonna have to start actually getting writers involved and have things make sense in the future.
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Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
edited October 2010
Yeah, it's hard for me to think of a game that's stolen liberally from movies more than Heavy Rain
Have they added Move support to this yet? I've been wanting to try the Move controls out.
Yes. The Move patch happened about a day or two after the Move came out(or within the week). I tried them. They take some getting used to(but, I didn't go through the tutorial bit at the beginning where it would have actually taught me how to use them. I just jumped to some random scene half way through and was semi-lost). You do need the Navigation controller(or a DualShock3/SIXAXIS) as well.
Posts
As for your last set of questions, those are all just unexplained red herrings. They exist for the sole purpose of casting doubt, and no. Not a single one of them makes sense or is in any way explained.
DAVID CAGE.
Purely because of unskippable cutscenes and pointless scenes that don't offer choice at all like the golf course.
Plus of course teh plot holes left and right.
I think the game was only really meant to be played through once while trying for real and dealing with what you get. Once you start replaying it or goofing around and the mechanics become obvious, the illusion falls apart. Other than the handful of plot contrivances though it was pretty good for the first(short) playthrough.
I dont know, on the first play through it got pretty tedious. Replaying it though it becomes very obvious how little you matter in the grand scheme of things, it really is just a movie that requires the occasional input.
Plus, as others have mentioned, the blatant hints that point you at who might be the killer which are never investigated, Ethan being of course the worst since he actually has teh freaking evidence on him and Madison's dreams about being attacked and murdered by guys in army gear that are never investigated.
Cage really has been very lucky to get the support he did on Heavy Rain, and the reception it got. Honestly, replaying it I don't think I've ever been so angry with a game, if only because of the time it took to do nothing.
edit: Also, that this game has a lot of juicy trophies I can't be arsed to get. You have to sit through the credits for each ending for it to count as you having gotten that particular ending. It's maddening.
3DS Friend Code: 2165-6448-8348 www.Twitch.TV/cooljammer00
Battle.Net: JohnDarc#1203 Origin/UPlay: CoolJammer00
If theres one thing that game is good at its wasting your time. Why do you have to sit through 10 minutes of credits every fecking time? Makes me angry just thinking about it.
Jesus H
I swear, this game relies on the most awful technique of any mystery novel or film: the idea that if it throws enough crazy shit at you for long enough, you'll forget about most of it by the end and not question the reveal
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Oh god, same here.
We never even got the flimsiest of "if you go to the cops, he dies now" to explain why he'd jump through all the hoops, did we?
3DS Friend Code: 2165-6448-8348 www.Twitch.TV/cooljammer00
Battle.Net: JohnDarc#1203 Origin/UPlay: CoolJammer00
I guessed the wrong address (I didn't listen long enough to hear the seagulls) but I got the right one with the reporter so I was able to call Ethan and get him to the warehouse anyway
http://www.audioentropy.com/
I called Jayden cause...he was the most useful out of all them so far.
3DS Friend Code: 2165-6448-8348 www.Twitch.TV/cooljammer00
Battle.Net: JohnDarc#1203 Origin/UPlay: CoolJammer00
I called Ethan because Jayden already knew to get there and also because there was no fucking reason for her to know who Jayden was
http://www.audioentropy.com/
I knew I wasn't crazy when I thought that!
Why on earth does she even have his phone number?
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Especially since it would have served the same purpose to have her just call "the police"
and have him be the one that goes to investigate her call
http://www.audioentropy.com/
So yeah, my (2nd, after the worst ending) end game just involved Madison and Nahman.
In my playthrough, Nahman didn't have enough of the pieces to find the killer so he needed the phonecall.
3DS Friend Code: 2165-6448-8348 www.Twitch.TV/cooljammer00
Battle.Net: JohnDarc#1203 Origin/UPlay: CoolJammer00
Yeah sorry you don't get to just make stuff up and stick in the story after the fact
either it's part of the story or it's not
and Madison knowing anything about Jayden is not
http://www.audioentropy.com/
3DS Friend Code: 2165-6448-8348 www.Twitch.TV/cooljammer00
Battle.Net: JohnDarc#1203 Origin/UPlay: CoolJammer00
Hell, Madison knowing anything about Ethan. The game never went out of its way to have a newscast showing Ethan's face or anything that would indicate to her that this guy is big news.
e: Okay apparently you start it from the Extras->Downloaded Content menu, except.... all that does is send me to a page on the Playstation Store where it says content not found. WTF?
Anyway.. the move edition patch is out now, so I tried playing it with my shiny new plastic ice-cream cone. But, for some reason the thing isn't responding to my motion controller AT ALL... The damn thing doesn't even light up
Has anyone else tried the move edition yet?
Move works for me. Stupid question though, have you downloaded the Heavy Rain patch that enables Move support? The options menu has an option to switch to the wireless controller for me. Maybe yours has an option to switch to the Move controller? You'll need either a dualshock or a nav controller. Only the left half of the dual shock is used in Move mode which sucks for us lefties that like to use the Move controller with our left hand. There's a left/right handed setting, but I can't tell what it really does.
It also seems like either I'm not understanding how to do some actions, or the prompts aren't noticeable. The biggest offender so far for both of these things is:
(Early game spoilers with Jayden, when you go to the apartment)
When I was trying to walk between the kitchen and the living room, the change of camera angles and the analogue walking just lead me to turning around in the same space from probably a good 30 seconds before I simply got frustrated and walked through the rest of the house to get back to the living room. I thought I saw a prompt to leave through the front door, is it possible to leave before CrazyGuy (I'm sorry I don't remember his name) shows up?
Also, when Blake is interrogating him, Jayden's thoughts are all "I GOTTA DO SOMETHING!" and then I see no way to interrupt what's actually happening besides simply yelling "BLAKE STOP IT YOU BIG MEANY". Is there a way to push Blake or something? Or are you forced into the whole Mexican standoff? Stupid 'Blunder' Trophy, criminals should know you shouldn't reach into your shirt while someone is pointing a gun at you....that's just common sense!
I really do like the game, even though it's horribly depressing. I just hate having to fight with the control scheme.
http://www.audioentropy.com/
Thank you, I'll try that later this evening when I have the opportunity to play again. I thought the concept was "Hold down R2" to enable walking, then you use the analogue stick like you would in a regular game. I appreciate the help!
Yeah, the idea is if you're walking around, you just hold down R2, and only touch the analog stick when you want to change directions. Takes some getting used to, just because we've been conditioned to hold a stick when we want to move.
But man, the story in this game
I don't know
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
The plot is nonsense
but if you look at each individual scene on its own I think they all do what they're trying to do really well
the problem only arises when you start trying to tie all those individual bits together
http://www.audioentropy.com/
Also when the game draws the identity of the Origami Killer out of a hat.
I think that's the best example of what I mean
for me anyway, the actual scene was a huge shocker and I was floored
it wasn't until I actually started thinking about it later that I realized that it was incredibly stupid
http://www.audioentropy.com/
Oh, the direction is pretty fuckin' good for individual scenes, especially some of the ones involving Shelby or the dad
But yeah, the overarching narrative is straight up nonsense, and a lot of the dialogue is kinda bad
You don't think about it when you're playing it the first time, though
Well, I did, but as a movie guy, I'm always thinking about it
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
It's fun when you can get lost in the joy of playing a cop movie or relishing in getting into a chase scene through a crowded market, but then you remember that the scene's just there because Cage liked it when it happened in a movie once.
Not that there's anything wrong with borrowing from other mediums, it's what games have been doing for years, and Cage has basically reached the apex. It's just that now we're gonna have to start actually getting writers involved and have things make sense in the future.
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
but he needed a writer to give him something worth directing
http://www.audioentropy.com/
Yes. The Move patch happened about a day or two after the Move came out(or within the week). I tried them. They take some getting used to(but, I didn't go through the tutorial bit at the beginning where it would have actually taught me how to use them. I just jumped to some random scene half way through and was semi-lost). You do need the Navigation controller(or a DualShock3/SIXAXIS) as well.