The image size limit has been raised to 1mb! Anything larger than that should be linked to. This is a HARD limit, please do not abuse it.
Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

The [GNU/Linux] thread, where 'Windows' is always spelled properly.

145791035

Posts

  • FremFrem Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Seeks wrote: »
    Jesus christ we're stuck with games called "Alex the Allegator 4".

    If it wasn't for... a certain type of interactive video entertainment whose discussion on these forums is forbidden, you could count the number of linux games worth playing on one hand. Maybe two.

    Whatever happens, I really hope that Valve doesn't take the route that too many others do and assume that linux is just Ubuntu.

    Hmmm... maybe I could fuck around with the OP and include an extensive list of linux games worth playing.

    There's a reason for this. Programming games is a bitch. ;)

    Let me fix that for you. Every additional platform just adds more pain.

    As far as game audio goes, don't the majority of developers just use SDL Mixer or OpenAL anyway? It's not like they have to interact directly with Linux audio stuff.

    Also, I haven't had any issues with Pulse Audio in Ubuntu 10.04. I suspect a lot of the issues people have are (a) older games that need audio translated from an older framework and (b) Pulse trying to do things that buggy drivers support buggily. I'm pretty sure I read something similar in an exchange between you and an Ubuntu developer on a mailing list, actually.

    Frem on
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Frem wrote: »
    As far as game audio goes, don't the majority of developers just use SDL Mixer or OpenAL anyway? It's not like they have to interact directly with Linux audio stuff.

    Also, I haven't had any issues with Pulse Audio in Ubuntu 10.04. I suspect a lot of the issues people have are (a) older games that need audio translated from an older framework and (b) Pulse trying to do things that buggy drivers support buggily. I'm pretty sure I read something similar in an exchange between you and an Ubuntu developer on a mailing list, actually.

    The problem is SDL even has problems with PulseAudio, at least the some of programs I tested that used SDL did. ALSA is too complicated to be properly wrapped, as it's a messy mix of high-level and low-level code.

    Linux needs a stupid simple underlying audio API and PulseAudio/ALSA is not it. OSSv4 would be a much better alternative, though it's mixer GUI needs some work and some drivers need to be ported over to it. OSSv4 is also used by the other Unixes, such as the BSDs. ALSA is only used by Linux.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • WeretacoWeretaco Cubicle Gangster Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Quick GNOME question. I have a set of 3 commands to enable 2 finger scrolling for my laptop running ubuntu. I made a script file with the following

    #!/bin/bash
    synclient <command 1>
    synclient <command 2>
    synclient <command 3>

    did a chmod +x to it, then in the gnome startup applications i added the command for it as
    /home/<homedir>/Scripts/MouseSettings

    It doesn't seem to do anything when gnome starts though. If I run it manually after logging in it works fine and enables the scrolling. Any ideas?

    Weretaco on
    Unofficial PA IRC chat: #paforums at irc.slashnet.org
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Try giving it a short delay.

    re: Poulsbo, testing with an EeePC 901

    So after testing, 720p video runs flawlessly with Jolicloud, but it's incredibily choppy with Ubuntu. :( This makes me sad because I hate Jolicloud's 'walled garden' concept, but if it's what I need in order to get a better user experience...

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • WeretacoWeretaco Cubicle Gangster Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    how do you add a delay to the script?

    Weretaco on
    Unofficial PA IRC chat: #paforums at irc.slashnet.org
  • WeretacoWeretaco Cubicle Gangster Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    i guess

    sleep <seconds>

    Weretaco on
    Unofficial PA IRC chat: #paforums at irc.slashnet.org
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Try giving it a short delay.

    re: Poulsbo, testing with an EeePC 901

    So after testing, 720p video runs flawlessly with Jolicloud, but it's incredibily choppy with Ubuntu. :( This makes me sad because I hate Jolicloud's 'walled garden' concept, but if it's what I need in order to get a better user experience...

    What video chip? You could always try MPlayer.

    Here's the repo I use for MPlayer:
    https://launchpad.net/~rvm/+archive/mplayer

    darkphoenix22 on
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    http://www.osnews.com/story/23411/Apple_s_HTML5_Showcase_Isn_t_HTML5_Blocks_Other_Browsers

    Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-us) AppleWebKit/531.2+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Safari/531.2+ Debian/squeeze/sid () Epiphany/2.30.0

    Apple failed to block Epiphany. Chrome works perfectly using the default Epiphany user agent. Firefox fails.


    Why is Apple blocking other web browsers in their "HTML5" Showcase?

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Try giving it a short delay.

    re: Poulsbo, testing with an EeePC 901

    So after testing, 720p video runs flawlessly with Jolicloud, but it's incredibily choppy with Ubuntu. :( This makes me sad because I hate Jolicloud's 'walled garden' concept, but if it's what I need in order to get a better user experience...

    What video chip? You could always try MPlayer.

    Here's the repo I use for MPlayer:
    https://launchpad.net/~rvm/+archive/mplayer

    Trust me, it doesn't have to do with the player. Jolicloud actually have a dev working on Poulsbo support. It really is the best distro for anyone who has it. I get really good performance. :)

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • FremFrem Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    The problem is SDL even has problems with PulseAudio, at least the some of programs I tested that used SDL did. ALSA is too complicated to be properly wrapped, as it's a messy mix of high-level and low-level code.
    Although SDL has had problems with Alsa in the past, I don't have currently have issues with SDL and PulseAudio. The sheer inconsistency of experiences people have had suggests driver issues.
    Linux needs a stupid simple underlying audio API and PulseAudio/ALSA is not it. OSSv4 would be a much better alternative, though it's mixer GUI needs some work and some drivers need to be ported over to it. OSSv4 is also used by the other Unixes, such as the BSDs. ALSA is only used by Linux.
    I'm in agreement that Alsa should die. However, I'm not sure that OSSv4 is the answer.

    BSD doesn't need PulseAudio because it's got a decent kernel level audio system. BSD doesn't use OSSv4 by default (or really need it for most things) for the same reason. I believe the exposed API is compatible with OSS, but it's not the same implementation. Because of this, what BSD does is slightly irrelevant.

    Switching something like Ubuntu over to OSSv4 by default would break compatibility with several sound cards (unless it supports legacy Alsa drivers?) and mean a lot of wasted work on a piece of software that's actually starting to shape into something usable.

    Frem on
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    It depends on how the application implements sound. If it uses sound for timing, it's toast with PulseAudio due to the higher latency. Unfortunately, this is the way many games are written. This barrier makes it much harder to port games over to Linux. Almost all the ports I tried in my testing do not work under PulseAudio or, at the very least, required a bit of configuration. These same games/programs work out of the box on Windows.

    I'm looking at making it ALSA/OSSv4 an install time choice or having two separate ISOs. OSSv4 isn't quite ready yet, mostly because of the mixer GUI and the need to update the drivers. There's also a nasty limitation in that it currently doesn't support suspend/resume, which would definitely need to be fixed before it is made default in any distribution. http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Open_Sound_System#Suspend_and_Hibernation

    All in all, though, I think it would take a lot less work to fix up OSSv4 than it would take to fix ALSA/PulseAudio.

    A good first step would be for distros to push OSSv4 to their repositories and begin testing. Arch and Debian already have it, but I don't believe Gentoo does. OSSv4 needs to be throughly tested before it can be adopted. We don't want another PulseAudio situation. :P

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    OK, trying out Meego once again. So fast. :D Although, Chrome OS is still faster, Meego does allow common applications to be installed, although it is all very obtuse at the moment as they intend to control app installation. The version I'm using uses yum/RPMs so it was fairly easy to install Opera's latest alpha version, which is the best way of having a web browser, bittorrent client, mail client, feed reader, and irc client all in one app. :P

    Anyway, the system is snappy, boots really fast, but unfortunately it's still not ready (this is after all a dev version). It's also a shame it doesn't have mp3 codecs and you need to compile them from source. Not fun at all. D: It even has Banshee for multimedia.

    Meego also has an app similar to Ubuntu's Software Center, called Garage but at the moment it only has a handful of apps.

    If you want more impressions let me know, I'd love to have this as my OS, although I'm still waiting for Google's take. :)

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • DratatooDratatoo Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Currently I am annoyed with Ubuntu again. I always wondered why is it so "complicated" to set a screen resolution in Linux for only one connected device. Of course the resolution I want to use isn't listened.

    My entries in the xorg.conf file are being ignored. I can't figure out from which ass this system pulls the current resolution info. The wiki and forums are full of conflicting information: "Xorg.conf is still being used". "No it is not." "Use xrandr to add a new modes". "Randr cannot be used with propertiery drivers". "2009 news entry: Nvidia plans to add randr support". "Delete a certain xml file in your user directory in order to do a refresh of the detected resolution info". "You have to invoke a randr command in one of the startup scripts of you login manager".

    [rant] Every year is proclaimed as the year of the ultimate Linux Desktop for everyone. In every other OS I use a drop down menu, and klick OK change the resolution. In Linux I sometimes have to sacrifice a goat and read the Bible backwards to accomplish the simplest tasks. [/rant]

    What I try to do: Ubuntu 10.4, AMD Athlon XP 3.0GHz, Geforce 6600GT
    CRT -> desired resolution 1280x1024 @ 80Hz

    Xorg.conf:
    
    
    Section "ServerLayout"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Files"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Module"
        Load           "glx"
    EndSection
    
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #Section "InputDevice"
    #    Identifier     "Generic Keyboard"
    #    Driver         "kbd"
    #    Option         "CoreKeyboard"
    #    Option         "XkbRules" "xorg"
    #    Option         "XkbModel" "pc105"
    #    Option         "XkbLayout" "de"
    #EndSection
    
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #Section "InputDevice"
    #    Identifier     "Configured Mouse"
    #    Driver         "mouse"
    #    Option         "CorePointer"
    #    Option         "Device" "/dev/input/mice"
    #    Option         "Protocol" "ImPS/2"
    #    Option         "ZAxisMapping" "4 5"
    #    Option         "Emulate3Buttons" "true"
    #EndSection
    
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #Section "InputDevice"
    #    Identifier     "stylus"
    #    Driver         "wacom"
    #    Option         "Device" "/dev/input/wacom"
    #    Option         "Type" "stylus"
    #    Option         "ForceDevice" "ISDV4"# Tablet PC ONLY
    #EndSection
    
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #Section "InputDevice"
    #    Identifier     "eraser"
    #    Driver         "wacom"
    #    Option         "Device" "/dev/input/wacom"
    #    Option         "Type" "eraser"
    #    Option         "ForceDevice" "ISDV4"# Tablet PC ONLY
    #EndSection
    
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #Section "InputDevice"
    #    Identifier     "cursor"
    #    Driver         "wacom"
    #    Option         "Device" "/dev/input/wacom"
    #    Option         "Type" "cursor"
    #    Option         "ForceDevice" "ISDV4"# Tablet PC ONLY
    #EndSection
    
    Section "Monitor"
        Identifier     "SyncMaster"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Device"
        Identifier     "Generic Video Card"
        Driver         "nvidia"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Screen"
        Identifier     "Default Screen"
        Device         "Generic Video Card"
        Monitor        "SyncMaster"
        DefaultDepth    24
        Option         "AddARGBVisuals" "True"
        Option         "NoLogo" "True"
        Option        "AddARGBGLXVisuals" "True"
        SubSection     "Display"
        Depth       24
        Modes      "1280x1024"
        EndSubSection
    EndSection
    

    Dratatoo on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I really can't help you, I always used Ubuntu's default app for this purpose. When it failed I used xrandr, so yeah.

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Dratatoo wrote: »
    Currently I am annoyed with Ubuntu again. I always wondered why is it so "complicated" to set a screen resolution in Linux for only one connected device. Of course the resolution I want to use isn't listened.

    Are you using the official Nvidia drivers? If so, try setting it with in the nvidia-settings utility. Run the following in the terminal.
    sudo nvidia-settings
    

    Edit: It was "nvidia-settings" not "nvidia-config". ;)

    darkphoenix22 on
  • DratatooDratatoo Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Dratatoo wrote: »
    Currently I am annoyed with Ubuntu again. I always wondered why is it so "complicated" to set a screen resolution in Linux for only one connected device. Of course the resolution I want to use isn't listened.

    Are you using the official Nvidia drivers? If so, try setting it with in the nvidia-settings utility. Run the following in the terminal.
    sudo nvidia-settings
    

    Edit: It was "nvidia-settings" not "nvidia-config". ;)

    First thing I tried - the highest resolution listened is 1360x768 - nothing will change this and the utility hasn't an option to enter custom resolutions or refresh rates - because hey, who needs those anyways...

    Dratatoo on
  • SeeksSeeks Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Yeah, there are a few areas linux needs work in. Or more specifically, a lot of the linux-based OSes like Ubuntu. Easily setting screen resolutions is one of them. 99% of the time it sets what I want anyway and I don't even have to look at the settings, but whenever it doesn't work properly I'm ready to start punching babies before too long.

    It's not even consistent with its resolution shittiness. For example, I've had situations where before playing a game (Wine, Dosbox, whatever) it will list the one available resolution (at the time, 1280x800)... but after the game crashes and keeps my desktop trapped in 640x480, the one resolution option has changed from 1280x800 to 640x480 and I have to restart the DE.

    Only takes like 5-10 seconds, sure, but it shouldn't happen regardless. What if I was in the middle of encoding 200 hours of audio, huh linux? Huh!?

    Not that any of this helps you, I guess.

    Seeks on
    userbar.jpg
    desura_Userbar.png
  • WeretacoWeretaco Cubicle Gangster Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Well.. this worked so yay two finger scrolling

    #!/bin/bash
    export DISPLAY=:0.0
    sleep 15
    synclient EmulateTwoFingerMinW=7
    synclient EmulateTwoFingerMinZ=20
    synclient VertTwoFingerScroll=1

    Weretaco on
    Unofficial PA IRC chat: #paforums at irc.slashnet.org
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Seeks wrote: »
    Yeah, there are a few areas linux needs work in. Or more specifically, a lot of the linux-based OSes like Ubuntu. Easily setting screen resolutions is one of them. 99% of the time it sets what I want anyway and I don't even have to look at the settings, but whenever it doesn't work properly I'm ready to start punching babies before too long.

    It's not even consistent with its resolution shittiness. For example, I've had situations where before playing a game (Wine, Dosbox, whatever) it will list the one available resolution (at the time, 1280x800)... but after the game crashes and keeps my desktop trapped in 640x480, the one resolution option has changed from 1280x800 to 640x480 and I have to restart the DE.

    Only takes like 5-10 seconds, sure, but it shouldn't happen regardless. What if I was in the middle of encoding 200 hours of audio, huh linux? Huh!?

    Not that any of this helps you, I guess.

    What, restarting the DE? Can't you just change the resolution back?

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • DratatooDratatoo Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Yeah, there are a few areas linux needs work in. Or more specifically, a lot of the linux-based OSes like Ubuntu. Easily setting screen resolutions is one of them. 99% of the time it sets what I want anyway and I don't even have to look at the settings, but whenever it doesn't work properly I'm ready to start punching babies before too long.

    Yeah, I want to know why Ubuntu needs to detect the resolution anyway. I mean I as user know it most of the time. Give me a dialog box and let me enter the values. Its like the Ubuntu dev team shrugs the shoulders at me - "Resolution not detected, dunno..." Well, I'll dig to the Wiki again and post my results here.

    Edit:

    So I finally found a solution. I had to enable TwinView Mode (for using two displays at once), had to disable the second screen - this allows me to feed the driver the desired resolution for the main screen:

    My Xorg.conf now:
    Section "ServerLayout"
    
    	# Uncomment if you have a wacom tablet
    	#	InputDevice     "stylus"	"SendCoreEvents"
    	#	InputDevice     "cursor"	"SendCoreEvents"
    	#	InputDevice     "eraser"	"SendCoreEvents"
        Identifier     "Default Layout"
        Screen         "Default Screen" 0 0
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #    InputDevice    "Generic Keyboard"
    # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used
    #    InputDevice    "Configured Mouse"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Files"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Module"
        Load           "glx"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Monitor"
        Identifier     "SyncMaster"
        HorizSync 30.0 - 82.0
        VertRefresh 50.0 - 75.0
        Option "DPMS"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Device"
        Identifier     "Generic Video Card"
        Driver         "nvidia"
    EndSection
    
    Section "Screen"
    Identifier     "Default Screen"
        Device         "Generic Video Card"
        Monitor        "SyncMaster"
        DefaultDepth    24
        Option         "AddARGBVisuals" "True"
        Option         "NoLogo" "True"
        Option        "AddARGBGLXVisuals" "True"
        Option "TwinView" "on"
        Option "TwinViewOrientation" "RightOf"
        Option "MetaModes" "1280x1024,1280x1024;1024x768,1024x768;800x600,800x600"
        SubSection     "Display"
        Depth       24
        EndSubSection
    EndSection
    

    Dratatoo on
  • SeeksSeeks Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Seeks wrote: »
    Yeah, there are a few areas linux needs work in. Or more specifically, a lot of the linux-based OSes like Ubuntu. Easily setting screen resolutions is one of them. 99% of the time it sets what I want anyway and I don't even have to look at the settings, but whenever it doesn't work properly I'm ready to start punching babies before too long.

    It's not even consistent with its resolution shittiness. For example, I've had situations where before playing a game (Wine, Dosbox, whatever) it will list the one available resolution (at the time, 1280x800)... but after the game crashes and keeps my desktop trapped in 640x480, the one resolution option has changed from 1280x800 to 640x480 and I have to restart the DE.

    Only takes like 5-10 seconds, sure, but it shouldn't happen regardless. What if I was in the middle of encoding 200 hours of audio, huh linux? Huh!?

    Not that any of this helps you, I guess.

    What, restarting the DE? Can't you just change the resolution back?


    I can now, and most often it's been the case that I can, but in that example I couldn't. The only option to choose from was (the previously not even listed) 640x480.

    Not a big deal though, as even though now I can change it to whatever I want, it's often actually quicker to just restart X.

    Seeks on
    userbar.jpg
    desura_Userbar.png
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Personal Opinion:

    Ubuntu does not have direction. Quite a few of its organizers do not code and do not understand code. Because of this, they have no idea about the effects of their decisions. And the rest of the community has to deal with the consequences.

    Desktop Linux is in about the same place it was 2 years ago, at the time of Ubuntu 8.04 Hardy. This applies to Fedora and the other mainstream distributions as well. Desktop Linux needs direction to move forward because, at the moment, it is just spinning around in circles.

    Linux is not a toy, it is a production environment.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I didn't know that you needed to code in order to have an opinion.

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • Shorn Scrotum ManShorn Scrotum Man Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Non-programmers aren't real people, didn't you hear?

    Shorn Scrotum Man on
    steam_sig.png
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Non-programmers should have input and should be able to vote and influence those who program. But they shouldn't be making decisions. Mostly because they can't clean up the mess.

    You want to directly influence Linux? Pick up a copy of K&R and start programming. Only then can you take direct responsibility for your decisions.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    That's not how the real world works, though.

    If those who are running Ubuntu want to do X or Y and they actually end up doing it, it's because someone tells them that X or Y is feasible.

    You're making it seem like they ask for the Moon or something.

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • SeeksSeeks Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I like linux just the way it is, honestly. I'm not against coders doing their thing, but I'm also not against people who are better at design calling the shots. Luckily we can have either - pick one OS for strict function and modability, pick another that's better for 99.9% of everyone that uses a computer.

    Seeks on
    userbar.jpg
    desura_Userbar.png
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    That's not how the real world works, though.

    If those who are running Ubuntu want to do X or Y and they actually end up doing it, it's because someone tells them that X or Y is feasible.

    You're making it seem like they ask for the Moon or something.

    Umm. PulseAudio and Nouveau.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Non-programmers should have input and should be able to vote and influence those who program. But they shouldn't be making decisions. Mostly, because they can't clean up the mess.

    You want to directly influence Linux? Pick up a copy of K&R and start programming. Only then can you take responsibly for your decisions.
    If programmers can't take direction from management and not fuck things up then they're pretty shit, aren't they? If they can't sit down and come up with a clean road-map/spec/whatever for something that management's directed them to do then it's their issue. Maybe they should figure out how to write code for a large project instead of just fucking piddling around in OSS, thinking they're badasses when really no one in the real world wants them and their half-assed shit because they have no idea how to write anything that's usable outside of Neckbeardland.

    All I know is out here in the real world if my bosses tell me to do X Y or Z for a project then it's on ME to do correctly, and I don't get to fucking cop-out and say "well my bosses are at fault because I couldn't do my job and they made me to something mean or hard that I didn't want to do." Must be nice to work in the OSS world where you don't have to give a flying fuck because, hey, if it needs improved then it's on the poor sucker that thinks it needs improved and not the people who did a half-assed job in the first place.

    iTunesIsEvil on
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Seeks wrote: »
    I like linux just the way it is, honestly. I'm not against coders doing their thing, but I'm also not against people who are better at design calling the shots. Luckily we can have either - pick one OS for strict function and modability, pick another that's better for 99.9% of everyone that uses a computer.

    I'm taking direct advice from a professional designer in my branding and the UI tweaks we're making for 2.0. But does he ever have final say. God no. He can't program.
    If programmers can't take direction from management and not fuck things up then they're pretty shit, aren't they? If they can't sit down and come up with a clean road-map/spec/whatever for something that management's directed them to do then it's their issue. Maybe they should figure out how to write code for a large project instead of just fucking piddling around in OSS, thinking they're badasses when really no one in the real world wants them and their half-assed shit because they have no idea how to write anything that's usable outside of Neckbeardland.

    The problem with Ubuntu is that we don't even have professional managers who have experience with code or even managing a business.

    Instead, we have these bloody arm-chair developers calling shots who have no clue about the consequences of what they're doing.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Seeks wrote: »
    I like linux just the way it is, honestly. I'm not against coders doing their thing, but I'm also not against people who are better at design calling the shots. Luckily we can have either - pick one OS for strict function and modability, pick another that's better for 99.9% of everyone that uses a computer.

    I'm taking direct advice from a professional designer in my branding and the UI tweaks we're making for 2.0. But does he ever have final say. God no. He can't program.
    Branding and UI tweaks are not programming. If *you* can't separate UI and background logic then you're even fucking worse than I thought.

    iTunesIsEvil on
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Branding and UI tweaks are not programming. If *you* can't separate UI and background logic then you're even fucking worse than I thought.

    I do, which is why my designer DOES NOT program.

    Go tell Ubuntu and Canonical that, because they clearly don't understand.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I think your problem has more to do with Ubuntu/Canonical than the way their distribution works. There are tons of other alternatives, why not turn to those instead of criticizing Ubuntu/Canonical for not doing things your way?

    You can't really expect to be able to control Ubuntu's goals when you're nothing more than a simple user. Do you think Microsoft takes cues from John Doe over there?

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    I just spent two hours yesterday trying to fix a friend's laptop with Ubuntu Netbook Remix. For some reason Compiz got installed, and it cause her screen to flash whenever she logged in. There was so many levels of hacks that I had to work through that I ended up telling her just to install Linux Mint 7 Xfce Edition.

    The thing is this isn't a just a Ubuntu problem. The other Desktop Linux distributions have all the same issues. Fedora and OpenSUSE are looked at as beta testing for RHEL and SUSE Enterprise. Mandriva just went out of business.

    This is not just a Ubuntu problem, it's a Desktop Linux problem. We need stability and we need direction.

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Have you honestly tried out both Fedora 13 and OpenSUSE 11.2?

    Because I can't read your statements as anything other than lies. Your arguments so forcibly try to defend your point of view that it's becoming very difficult to read what you write with a straight face.

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Have you honestly tried out both Fedora 13 and OpenSUSE 11.2?

    Because I can't read your statements as anything other than lies. Your arguments so forcibly try to defend your point of view that it's becoming very difficult to read what you write with a straight face.

    I used SuSE back in the day when it was still SuSE. I loved Yast and its configuration utilities. OpenSUSE is likely a sight better than Ubuntu in terms of stability. However, it's focus still is testing these components to be used in SuSE Enterprise. The desktop part is an aftereffect.

    Fedora is known for being buggier than Ubuntu. They were actually the ones who caused Nouveau's premature adoption into the kernel. Linus was forced to commit the driver as a major distribution insisted on using it, despite its incompleteness and instability. http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Nzc5MA

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    So you haven't used them. Thanks for clearing that up. :lol:

    What are you waiting for? With Unetbootin these days, it's as easy as pie.

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    I'm maintaining my own Linux distribution based on Ubuntu, HENCE my focus on the development problems with Ubuntu. Fedora and OpenSUSE don't concern me as I can't use their work as they use RPM.

    I'm also talking directly with Linux devs to get the audio situation on Linux fixed: http://www.phoronix.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24144

    I also help out people on the #debian chat room with their Debian AND Ubuntu problems daily, as a way of giving back.

    Not everyone has time to be a distro-hopper and try every shiny new distro under the sun. ;)

    darkphoenix22 on
  • ImpersonatorImpersonator Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    But look at Visti, man. He's such a hip danish guy because he's a distro-hopper at heart. There's nothing he values more than his mighty usb-stick and the countless Linux distributions that show up every couple of days.

    Impersonator on
    Bioptic wrote: »
    Lemmings was pro-Communist propeganda. All are created equal, sorted into specific jobs and roles that they will hold for the rest of their lives by a higher authority, and must sacrifice continuously for the good of the group. Success is measured by meeting quotas and nothing else. Also, nuclear holocaust.
  • darkphoenix22darkphoenix22 Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Maintaining and providing support for a Linux distribution is a lot more works that you realize. Ensuring external development will allow you to maintain your distribution's goals and functions is even more.

    darkphoenix22 on
145791035
Sign In or Register to comment.