Those stoneware/ceramic ones can be dishwashed usually.
Stainless steel are a pain if you ever burn anything, and they have a bit of a learning curve to them (IE, never cook sauce in them). Avoid them if you have an electric range.
Those stoneware/ceramic ones can be dishwashed usually.
Stainless steel are a pain if you ever burn anything, and they have a bit of a learning curve to them (IE, never cook sauce in them). Avoid them if you have an electric range.
What's the issue with cooking sauce in stainless?
I assume sugars sticking to the pan and burning.
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
i wouldn't say never cook sauce in a stainless pot/pan, just it requires a little more supervision
How do we feel about stainless steel for pots and pans? Looking to get away from non-stick coatings and gain the ability to toss pans in the dishwasher. Stainless steel looks like the only viable option?
Stainless steel is probably the most commonly used material for pots and pans. But you still generally want to avoid throwing most specimens in the dishwasher.
Stainless steel are a pain if you ever burn anything, and they have a bit of a learning curve to them (IE, never cook sauce in them). Avoid them if you have an electric range.
This is the first time I've ever heard of not cooking a sauce in a stainless steel pan given that both of my sauciers use the material as well as the skillets I use when making pan sauces.
However, you're never going to just throw stainless in the dishwasher, anything that does stick will absolutely not come off in the dishwasher.
It will however come off with when scrubbed with Barkeeper's Friend or Bon Ami. Serious stuck on stuff that doesn't respond to that will come off with oven cleaner if needed but that's exceedingly rare.
i wouldn't say never cook sauce in a stainless pot/pan, just it requires a little more supervision
Even then, not much. I make dry caramels in stainless steel on induction burners, often. Sometimes the only thing I have in the pot while cooking the sugar is regular old sugar. Sometimes I have some inverted sugar syrup or glucose syrup with it too. Either way, you just need to be careful not to crank the heat too soon.
As long as you regulate your heat properly and stir when needed, there shouldn't be any issues with sauces in stainless steel.
tomato based sauces are horrid because they get a really nasty taste when they burn too
I'm just really bitter about stainless steel pots/pans in general.
To be fair I'm pretty sure that any tomato sauce that's burning in a stainless steel pot is going to be bad in a non-stick one too, just tougher to clean out. It's still usually a steel or aluminum conducting the heat in a non-stick pan.
That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
I bought a set of ceramic coated non-stick pans a few years ago. Been VERY happy with em. The entire set has gone through the dishwasher more times than I can count and comes out perfect every time. They've got silicone handles so you can even put em in the oven. I've got a few other stainless steel pans, but these are my workhorses. My daily drivers.
I bought a set of ceramic coated non-stick pans a few years ago. Been VERY happy with em. The entire set has gone through the dishwasher more times than I can count and comes out perfect every time. They've got silicone handles so you can even put em in the oven. I've got a few other stainless steel pans, but these are my workhorses. My daily drivers.
What make and model did you go with? I looked around at some a few years back but it was still so new that no one seemed to have gotten it quite right and I went with a bog standard non-stick that's starting to wear down.
I bought a set of ceramic coated non-stick pans a few years ago. Been VERY happy with em. The entire set has gone through the dishwasher more times than I can count and comes out perfect every time. They've got silicone handles so you can even put em in the oven. I've got a few other stainless steel pans, but these are my workhorses. My daily drivers.
What make and model did you go with? I looked around at some a few years back but it was still so new that no one seemed to have gotten it quite right and I went with a bog standard non-stick that's starting to wear down.
I got this set back in Oct of 2013. It uses a titanium oxide ceramic coating.
ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
tbf teflon is only toxic if you have like an industrial coke oven for a stove top or you scratch it up because you're a dolt and used metal utensils in it
though ceramic is just better so there's really no need to use teflon
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
i've had a couple that i've used for four or five years now and they aren't showing any signs of wearing out
Allegedly a voice of reason.
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
ShivahnUnaware of her barrel shifter privilegeWestern coastal temptressRegistered User, Moderatormod
Oh! Oh! I have something to contribute!
(to the thread, not to the discussion re: nonstick pans)
Kung Pao Tofu!
The actual recipe is here, but the author did the most atrocious fucking job transcribing it (it refers to two other recipes that you're just supposed to.. follow... but with different ingredients and stuff and.. just forget it)
It does have a lot of ingredients/steps, and myself and Querry like to prepare everything first so you have it ready to go (good idea for this recipe specifically). So the recipe is organized based on what you can throw into a bowl together that will later get thrown in together. The parenthetical remarks are sort of my notes to myself/Querry, so I'm leaving them in because why not. You all deserve to know that I think gochujang is dope as fuck.
Ingredients
For frying tofu
1 1/2 quarts vegetable or peanut oil
1/2 cup plus 2 teaspoons cornstarch, divided
1/2 cup all-purpose flour
1/2 teaspoon baking powder
Kosher salt
1/2 cup cold water
1/2 cup vodka
1 pound extra-firm tofu, cut into 1/2- by 2- by 1-inch slabs, carefully dried (see note above)
For seasoning oil
1/3 cup peanut oil
12 hot Chinese dry chili peppers, seeded
(one half of) 1 to 2 tablespoons Sichuan peppercorns toasted in hot skillet for 30 seconds until fragrant
For sauce
4 teaspoons soy sauce, divided
4 teaspoons Shaoxing wine, divided (or dry sherry, if unavailable - we've used mirin and it turned out great)
2 teaspoons cornstarch
1 tablespoon Chinese black vinegar (or distilled white vinegar if unavailable)
1 tablespoon Sichuan fermented chili-bean paste (or generic Asian chili-garlic sauce if unavailable (a couple of tablespoons gochujang acceptable))
2 teaspoons sugar (though gochujang is sweet - when using it, we've never used sugar and it turned out dope as fuck)
To throw in with third portion of oil
2 small leeks, white and light green parts only, cut into 1/4-inch slices (about 1/2 cup total)
To throw in with fourth portion of oil
1/2 cup fried fresh peanuts or roasted unsalted peanuts
Any remaining tofu
Reserved chilis from oil seasoning
To throw in during fourth portion of oil
3 scallions' worth whites, finely minced
2 cloves minced garlic (about 4 teaspoons)
1 tablespoon minced fresh ginger
To throw in at end
3 scallions' worth of greens, finely sliced
(other half of) 1 to 2 tablespoons Sichuan peppercorns toasted in hot skillet for 30 seconds until fragrant, ground in a mortar and pestle
Instructions
For Tofu
Heat oil in a wok to 350°F. Whisk together 1/2 cup cornstarch, flour, baking powder, and 1 teaspoon kosher salt. Add water and vodka and whisk until a smooth batter is formed, adding up to 2 tablespoons additional water if batter is too thick. It should have the consistency of thin paint and fall off of the whisk in thin ribbons that instantly disappear as they hit the surface of the batter in the bowl.
Add tofu slices and carefully turn to coat. Working one at a time, lift one piece and allow excess batter to drip off. Carefully lower into hot oil. Repeat with remaining tofu until wok is full. Fry, using a metal spider or slotted spatula to rotate and agitate pieces as they cook until evenly pale golden and crisp all over, about 6 minutes. Transfer to a paper towel-lined plate. Repeat until all tofu is fried. Carefully pour all but 1 tablespoon oil out of wok and reserve for another use.
For seasoning oil
Set fine-meshed strainer over small heat-proof bowl. Heat the 1/3rd cup peanut oil in wok over high heat until shimmering. Add half of Sichuan peppercorns and dried chiles and cook until fragrant, about fifteen seconds. Drain in strainer. Pick out chiles and reserve. Discard peppercorns.
Other preparation
Grind other half of Sichuan peppercorns in mortar and pestle. Combine with scallion greens and reserve. Combine scallion whites, garlic, and ginger in small bowl. Combine four teaspoons soy sauce, four teaspoons Shaoxing wine, two teaspoons corn starch, black vinegar, chili-bean paste, and sugar in small bowl and mix until cornstarch is fully dissolved.
Cooking
Return wok to high heat until smoking. Add 1/4 of oil and immediately add half of deep fried tofu. Spread in even layer with spatula. Cook without moving for 1 minute, then cook, stirring and tossing constantly until barely cooked through, about 1 minute longer. Transfer to a medium metal bowl.
Wipe out wok with paper towel, add another 1/4 of oil, and repeat with remaining tofu.
Wipe out wok with paper towel, add another 1/4 of the oil, and cook leeks until charred in spots but still slightly crisp, about 1 minute.
Add peanuts, reserved chiles, reserved tofu, and remaining oil to wok and push to side to make spaaace in the center of the wok. Add garlic/ginger mixture and cook, stirring mixture constantly until aromatic, about 15 seconds.
Toss entire contents of wok together and add sauce. Cook, stirring and tossing constantly until tofu is coated in glossy layer of sauce.
Stir in scallion greens and ground Sichuan pepper. Transfer to serving plate and serve immediately with steamed white rice.
It's not super pretty (if the forum didn't eat whitespace it'd be so much better...) but the two times we've made it we've both agreed it's been the best thing we've ever cooked, so.
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
No money shot. 5/10 try again. That does sound tasty though.
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
For serious, whatever they coat this with is like diamonds. I have been HELLA abusive and they have come out fine. I'm sure they also use an alloy that doesn't corrode like that. I know what you're talking about too. Had another pot do that on me. Not so with this set.
It is pretty hot, what with the dry chilis and the chili paste, of which we use more than we need to. You can totally alter those, though. I'm sure it'd be fine if you dropped them entirely, though you'd want something else to impart flavor to the sauce.
What is up with people cooking chili for hours and hours?
Is that totally necessary?
Usually a longer cook time means more water boiling off which concentrates the flavor or if using meat with a lot of connective tissue more time for that to break down so potentially useful but not maybe not necessary. And absolutely not needed if doing it in a pressure cooker. A lot of people make chili in slow cookers though so the lower temperature involved likely does require longer to cook.
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
For serious, whatever they coat this with is like diamonds. I have been HELLA abusive and they have come out fine. I'm sure they also use an alloy that doesn't corrode like that. I know what you're talking about too. Had another pot do that on me. Not so with this set.
If it's a ceramic coating, it's pretty close to diamonds in toughness. Ceramic knives are disliked for most uses since sharpening one of the usual ceramic stones or similar hardness equipment doesn't work and you have to go straight to diamond coated stones normally used to drastically reprofile knife blades, not just sharpen them.
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
For serious, whatever they coat this with is like diamonds. I have been HELLA abusive and they have come out fine. I'm sure they also use an alloy that doesn't corrode like that. I know what you're talking about too. Had another pot do that on me. Not so with this set.
What brand/set is that? I see some that look similar on Amazon, but just want to be sure.
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That_GuyI don't wanna be that guyRegistered Userregular
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
For serious, whatever they coat this with is like diamonds. I have been HELLA abusive and they have come out fine. I'm sure they also use an alloy that doesn't corrode like that. I know what you're talking about too. Had another pot do that on me. Not so with this set.
What brand/set is that? I see some that look similar on Amazon, but just want to be sure.
I posted the link farther up the page. I bought the 10 piece set.
I thought it was cast iron you didn't want to cook tomato sauces one?
You also don't want to cook anything acidic in any straight up uncoated aluminum pots/pans. Though, these days, I think the only pots you're going to find with straight aluminum interiors are budget pressure cookers.
On a side note, I will echo that I have This TFAL Pan with the same coating as That_Guy's and it's been one of the best nonstick pans I've ever owned. The one problem with the TFALs is that the bottoms aren't completely flat which can lead to pooling of oil. But if you use a towel and a mallet, one good tap is good enough to fix it.
My big nonstick is getting less so, and I'm thinking about replacing it. I wasn't aware of the ceramic ones... Are they more durable (ie. longer than 1-2 years of heavy use?)
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
For serious, whatever they coat this with is like diamonds. I have been HELLA abusive and they have come out fine. I'm sure they also use an alloy that doesn't corrode like that. I know what you're talking about too. Had another pot do that on me. Not so with this set.
What brand/set is that? I see some that look similar on Amazon, but just want to be sure.
I posted the link farther up the page. I bought the 10 piece set.
To add my two cents to the pan discussion: my wife and I splurged with gift card money when we got married three years ago and picked up a set of stainless All-Clad pots and pans. We use those every day, along with a small nonstick omelet pan, and my ancient Griswold cast iron skillet. The stainless still looks fantastic and I expect to use it for decades to come.
Unrelated to the topic at hand: it's getting cooler here and that means chili season. What is everyone's favorite recipe? My favorite ones are a posole i clipped out of Bon Appetit years ago which isn't technically a chili but still damn tasty and a chili verde that I love but my wife finds too spicy so I never make it anymore.
Just following up on the soup/sauce thickener thread. I just read a good article about Cheddar Broccoli soup, where Kenji tried all the normal thickeners, and ended up going with whipped potato to thicken. It was interesting seriouseats.com/2016/10/food-lab-broccoli-cheddar-cheese-soup.html
Just following up on the soup/sauce thickener thread. I just read a good article about Cheddar Broccoli soup, where Kenji tried all the normal thickeners, and ended up going with whipped potato to thicken. It was interesting seriouseats.com/2016/10/food-lab-broccoli-cheddar-cheese-soup.html
Part of the reason he went with the whipped potato because it was something you can pick up in the super market. Sodium citrate's been a favorite for mac and cheese for a while and easy to get on Amazon so I'd be very curious about how it performs in a soup. I suspect it would be a case where one would have to adjust liquid content after blending everything together as normally the ingredient is used for sauces much thicker than soup (though if you wanted to do a broccoli and cheddar dip . . .hmm . . .)
I decided to order some sodium citrate and agar. Unfortunately, Seattle is dealing with a heavy storm this weekend, so I'm afraid of the power going out if I try to cook anything.
I'm thinking about using the sodium citrate on Kenji's recipe for hasselback potatoes.
I decided to order some sodium citrate and agar. Unfortunately, Seattle is dealing with a heavy storm this weekend, so I'm afraid of the power going out if I try to cook anything.
I'm thinking about using the sodium citrate on Kenji's recipe for hasselback potatoes.
I'm not entirely sure how well it would work in the potato recipe since it looks like you toss the the potatoes in the cream and cheese mix while it's all cold while sodium citrate works its magic when melting cheese so it needs things to be hot. You could cool it down and then toss the potatoes in it I suppose. And you definitely can work in more cheese than in the recipe if using the citrate, more than double the original amount and close to triple.
But still, try it in a simpler recipe to get a feel for how the much higher cheese to liquid ratio you can get away with changes the flavor and texture.
To add my two cents to the pan discussion: my wife and I splurged with gift card money when we got married three years ago and picked up a set of stainless All-Clad pots and pans. We use those every day, along with a small nonstick omelet pan, and my ancient Griswold cast iron skillet. The stainless still looks fantastic and I expect to use it for decades to come.
Unrelated to the topic at hand: it's getting cooler here and that means chili season. What is everyone's favorite recipe? My favorite ones are a posole i clipped out of Bon Appetit years ago which isn't technically a chili but still damn tasty and a chili verde that I love but my wife finds too spicy so I never make it anymore.
I was looking at All Clad. How do they hold up in the dishwasher?
To add my two cents to the pan discussion: my wife and I splurged with gift card money when we got married three years ago and picked up a set of stainless All-Clad pots and pans. We use those every day, along with a small nonstick omelet pan, and my ancient Griswold cast iron skillet. The stainless still looks fantastic and I expect to use it for decades to come.
Unrelated to the topic at hand: it's getting cooler here and that means chili season. What is everyone's favorite recipe? My favorite ones are a posole i clipped out of Bon Appetit years ago which isn't technically a chili but still damn tasty and a chili verde that I love but my wife finds too spicy so I never make it anymore.
I was looking at All Clad. How do they hold up in the dishwasher?
The lines with stainless steel surfaces are supposed to be dishwasher safe with a note that the copper core stuff may have the copper band on the exterior tarnished. The lines with copper or aluminum exteriors require handwashing. I do not know of anyone that's stuck an All-Clad pan in the dishwasher though. The people that go for it are usually too anal about equipment maintenance to do anything but handwash and a bit of scrubbing with Barkeepers friend takes anything off anyway.
If you do choose to look more closely at their stuff, I'd recommend seeing if you can find a cosmetically imperfect specimen and save a good chunk of money while still having the lifetime warranty: https://www.cookwarenmore.com/all-clad-irregulars/
To add my two cents to the pan discussion: my wife and I splurged with gift card money when we got married three years ago and picked up a set of stainless All-Clad pots and pans. We use those every day, along with a small nonstick omelet pan, and my ancient Griswold cast iron skillet. The stainless still looks fantastic and I expect to use it for decades to come.
Unrelated to the topic at hand: it's getting cooler here and that means chili season. What is everyone's favorite recipe? My favorite ones are a posole i clipped out of Bon Appetit years ago which isn't technically a chili but still damn tasty and a chili verde that I love but my wife finds too spicy so I never make it anymore.
I was looking at All Clad. How do they hold up in the dishwasher?
Yeah, I don't run it through the dishwasher, primarily because our dishwasher is old and crappy and can barely take care of plates/cups, let alone stuck-on stuff, but also because I'd rather just hand wash. I'm sure they would do fine, but I don't really have the experience to tell you. A bit of soap and a blue scrubby usually takes care of 95% of my washing, and any really stuck on stuff or crud that burns on the outside of the pan gets hit with a bit of Barkeeper's Friend and some elbow grease takes care of the rest. The pans are heavy duty with out feeling overly weighty, there are no sharp edges anywhere, I have experienced no warping issues at all. The insides have some swirly marks from using metal utensils and the bottom outside of the pans have scratches from rubbing against the gas burner grates; both could be polished out if I really wanted to but I think it adds character and shows they are well-loved
It turned out I had forgotten to restock my San Marzano tomatoes though so I worked with a can of store brand whole tomatoes I originally picked up a few years back intending to mix with better tomatoes in soup before finding where the San Marzanos were located in stores.
Ingredients used:
One 28ish oz can of tomatoes
One medium sized onion
One carrot
A bunch of dried basil
A decent amount of dried oregano but not as much as the basil
An even smaller amount of dried red pepper flakes
2 glugs of fish sauce
Kosher salt
4 Tbsp unsalted butter
Onion was peeled, trimmed, and cut in half. Carrot was cut into 3 or 4 chunks. Tomatoes were dumped into a pressure cooker, then "chopped" by cutting them up with kitchen shears. Added a generous amount of basil to make up for the poor quality tomatoes (basil shares the chemical compound that makes good tomatoes taste good so it can help compensate for poor tomatoes), then the oregano and red pepper flakes. Added the fish sauce, eyeballing about 2 teaspoons worth. Added the onion and carrot and stirred. Added the butter. Turned on the heat until the butter was melted and stirred again.
Since I was using an electric pressure cooker, I put the lid on, set it to high pressure, and set the timer for 48 minutes, adding a few to Kenji's recommended 45 minutes as electric cookers are usually a bit lower pressure and lower temperature than stove top models. After it was done and had come back to normal atmospheric pressure, I noticed the result was really, really watery. I think it was a combination of the poor quality tomatoes (they were packed in a lot of runny liquid) and the amount of butter I added in. Without being able to boil off, all that water stayed around. So I removed the onion and carrot and threw the proto-sauce into a saucier and simmered it until the liquid had reduced (the saute setting on the electric cooker uses a higher temperature than I like for reducing sauces but would be an option if I was really lazy) and the result was a really deeply flavored sauce for about 3 entree sized servings of pasta.
Will see the results with using better tomatoes later this week but I'm keeping the butter for flavor reasons.
AbsoluteZeroThe new film by Quentin KoopantinoRegistered Userregular
On the advice of this here thread to try ceramic coated pans for non-stick and dishwasher survivability, I picked up a nice big Green Pan as sort of an audition piece before I go buying a whole set. Stainless steel with ceramic nonstick interior. Browned some sweet italian sausage and chopped garlic in it. Great googly moogly, this ceramic stuff is more than non-stick, it is the slipperiest pan I have ever used. Trying to bust up sausage chunks was a bit of a challenge because they'd slip right out from under my spatula, even had a couple chunks fly right out of the pan. That's going to take some getting used to.
Pan survived the dishwasher like a champ. Aside from some scratches on the bottom from the grates on my gas cooktop, it looks brand new. If it makes it through a few more uses and washes and still comes out looking and performing like new, I'll definitely be buying a set.
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What's the issue with cooking sauce in stainless?
I assume sugars sticking to the pan and burning.
Stainless steel is probably the most commonly used material for pots and pans. But you still generally want to avoid throwing most specimens in the dishwasher.
This is the first time I've ever heard of not cooking a sauce in a stainless steel pan given that both of my sauciers use the material as well as the skillets I use when making pan sauces.
It will however come off with when scrubbed with Barkeeper's Friend or Bon Ami. Serious stuck on stuff that doesn't respond to that will come off with oven cleaner if needed but that's exceedingly rare.
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
I'm just really bitter about stainless steel pots/pans in general.
fite me 1v1 mid stonewear only
Even then, not much. I make dry caramels in stainless steel on induction burners, often. Sometimes the only thing I have in the pot while cooking the sugar is regular old sugar. Sometimes I have some inverted sugar syrup or glucose syrup with it too. Either way, you just need to be careful not to crank the heat too soon.
As long as you regulate your heat properly and stir when needed, there shouldn't be any issues with sauces in stainless steel.
To be fair I'm pretty sure that any tomato sauce that's burning in a stainless steel pot is going to be bad in a non-stick one too, just tougher to clean out. It's still usually a steel or aluminum conducting the heat in a non-stick pan.
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What make and model did you go with? I looked around at some a few years back but it was still so new that no one seemed to have gotten it quite right and I went with a bog standard non-stick that's starting to wear down.
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I got this set back in Oct of 2013. It uses a titanium oxide ceramic coating.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004KSN8XY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s04?ie=UTF8&psc=1
You really want to avoid teflon at all costs these days. Ceramic nonstick pans are not only more durable, but also a LOT less toxic.
though ceramic is just better so there's really no need to use teflon
i've had a couple that i've used for four or five years now and they aren't showing any signs of wearing out
Of the entire set, I've used this pan the most. With it I fry, saute and even do some light roasting. It sits with unrinsed foodstuff and other dishes on top of it for up to a week before being thrown in the dishwasher for a "pots and pans" cycle. I have used metal utensils on it more than a few times. That big gouge on the non-stick surface is from me dropping something metal on it a month after I bought the set. I've used is at least once a week for the last 3 years. The surface of this pan especially is rougher than it was when I got it. So far none of this has really hindered it's performance in any appreciable way. The gouge hasn't grown and has actually smoothed out a bit. Even eggs will slide out, yokes unbroken with a little initial coaxing.
https://goo.gl/photos/h6LJ6fLwv7ZE1Wbm6
As abusive as I have been to this set, it's held up marvelously over the years. I can categorically tell you that teflon would NOT have survived what I put this set though. At $100 the 12 piece set (what I got) is worth every penny. My only complaint is that none of the lids fit the pan. I had to buy one of those universal lids to fit it.
(to the thread, not to the discussion re: nonstick pans)
Kung Pao Tofu!
The actual recipe is here, but the author did the most atrocious fucking job transcribing it (it refers to two other recipes that you're just supposed to.. follow... but with different ingredients and stuff and.. just forget it)
It does have a lot of ingredients/steps, and myself and Querry like to prepare everything first so you have it ready to go (good idea for this recipe specifically). So the recipe is organized based on what you can throw into a bowl together that will later get thrown in together. The parenthetical remarks are sort of my notes to myself/Querry, so I'm leaving them in because why not. You all deserve to know that I think gochujang is dope as fuck.
Ingredients- For frying tofu
- For seasoning oil
- For sauce
- To throw in with third portion of oil
- To throw in with fourth portion of oil
- To throw in during fourth portion of oil
- To throw in at end
- For Tofu
- For seasoning oil
- Other preparation
- Cooking
1 1/2 quarts vegetable or peanut oil
1/2 cup plus 2 teaspoons cornstarch, divided
1/2 cup all-purpose flour
1/2 teaspoon baking powder
Kosher salt
1/2 cup cold water
1/2 cup vodka
1 pound extra-firm tofu, cut into 1/2- by 2- by 1-inch slabs, carefully dried (see note above)
1/3 cup peanut oil
12 hot Chinese dry chili peppers, seeded
(one half of) 1 to 2 tablespoons Sichuan peppercorns toasted in hot skillet for 30 seconds until fragrant
4 teaspoons soy sauce, divided
4 teaspoons Shaoxing wine, divided (or dry sherry, if unavailable - we've used mirin and it turned out great)
2 teaspoons cornstarch
1 tablespoon Chinese black vinegar (or distilled white vinegar if unavailable)
1 tablespoon Sichuan fermented chili-bean paste (or generic Asian chili-garlic sauce if unavailable (a couple of tablespoons gochujang acceptable))
2 teaspoons sugar (though gochujang is sweet - when using it, we've never used sugar and it turned out dope as fuck)
2 small leeks, white and light green parts only, cut into 1/4-inch slices (about 1/2 cup total)
1/2 cup fried fresh peanuts or roasted unsalted peanuts
Any remaining tofu
Reserved chilis from oil seasoning
3 scallions' worth whites, finely minced
2 cloves minced garlic (about 4 teaspoons)
1 tablespoon minced fresh ginger
3 scallions' worth of greens, finely sliced
(other half of) 1 to 2 tablespoons Sichuan peppercorns toasted in hot skillet for 30 seconds until fragrant, ground in a mortar and pestle
Instructions
Heat oil in a wok to 350°F. Whisk together 1/2 cup cornstarch, flour, baking powder, and 1 teaspoon kosher salt. Add water and vodka and whisk until a smooth batter is formed, adding up to 2 tablespoons additional water if batter is too thick. It should have the consistency of thin paint and fall off of the whisk in thin ribbons that instantly disappear as they hit the surface of the batter in the bowl.
Add tofu slices and carefully turn to coat. Working one at a time, lift one piece and allow excess batter to drip off. Carefully lower into hot oil. Repeat with remaining tofu until wok is full. Fry, using a metal spider or slotted spatula to rotate and agitate pieces as they cook until evenly pale golden and crisp all over, about 6 minutes. Transfer to a paper towel-lined plate. Repeat until all tofu is fried. Carefully pour all but 1 tablespoon oil out of wok and reserve for another use.
Set fine-meshed strainer over small heat-proof bowl. Heat the 1/3rd cup peanut oil in wok over high heat until shimmering. Add half of Sichuan peppercorns and dried chiles and cook until fragrant, about fifteen seconds. Drain in strainer. Pick out chiles and reserve. Discard peppercorns.
Grind other half of Sichuan peppercorns in mortar and pestle. Combine with scallion greens and reserve. Combine scallion whites, garlic, and ginger in small bowl. Combine four teaspoons soy sauce, four teaspoons Shaoxing wine, two teaspoons corn starch, black vinegar, chili-bean paste, and sugar in small bowl and mix until cornstarch is fully dissolved.
Return wok to high heat until smoking. Add 1/4 of oil and immediately add half of deep fried tofu. Spread in even layer with spatula. Cook without moving for 1 minute, then cook, stirring and tossing constantly until barely cooked through, about 1 minute longer. Transfer to a medium metal bowl.
Wipe out wok with paper towel, add another 1/4 of oil, and repeat with remaining tofu.
Wipe out wok with paper towel, add another 1/4 of the oil, and cook leeks until charred in spots but still slightly crisp, about 1 minute.
Add peanuts, reserved chiles, reserved tofu, and remaining oil to wok and push to side to make spaaace in the center of the wok. Add garlic/ginger mixture and cook, stirring mixture constantly until aromatic, about 15 seconds.
Toss entire contents of wok together and add sauce. Cook, stirring and tossing constantly until tofu is coated in glossy layer of sauce.
Stir in scallion greens and ground Sichuan pepper. Transfer to serving plate and serve immediately with steamed white rice.
It's not super pretty (if the forum didn't eat whitespace it'd be so much better...) but the two times we've made it we've both agreed it's been the best thing we've ever cooked, so.
The aluminum on those pans didn't oxidize in the dishwasher? I was a dolt and put an aluminum quarter sheet pan through the dishwasher once, it came out really jacked up.
For serious, whatever they coat this with is like diamonds. I have been HELLA abusive and they have come out fine. I'm sure they also use an alloy that doesn't corrode like that. I know what you're talking about too. Had another pot do that on me. Not so with this set.
I refuse to give my valuable pixels up to strangers on the internet
It is pretty hot, what with the dry chilis and the chili paste, of which we use more than we need to. You can totally alter those, though. I'm sure it'd be fine if you dropped them entirely, though you'd want something else to impart flavor to the sauce.
Is that totally necessary?
Usually a longer cook time means more water boiling off which concentrates the flavor or if using meat with a lot of connective tissue more time for that to break down so potentially useful but not maybe not necessary. And absolutely not needed if doing it in a pressure cooker. A lot of people make chili in slow cookers though so the lower temperature involved likely does require longer to cook.
That's due to to acidity being bad for new cast iron. Bowen was more complaining that burned tomato sauce is unpleasant.
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If it's a ceramic coating, it's pretty close to diamonds in toughness. Ceramic knives are disliked for most uses since sharpening one of the usual ceramic stones or similar hardness equipment doesn't work and you have to go straight to diamond coated stones normally used to drastically reprofile knife blades, not just sharpen them.
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
What brand/set is that? I see some that look similar on Amazon, but just want to be sure.
I posted the link farther up the page. I bought the 10 piece set.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004KSN8XY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s04?ie=UTF8&psc=1
You also don't want to cook anything acidic in any straight up uncoated aluminum pots/pans. Though, these days, I think the only pots you're going to find with straight aluminum interiors are budget pressure cookers.
On a side note, I will echo that I have This TFAL Pan with the same coating as That_Guy's and it's been one of the best nonstick pans I've ever owned. The one problem with the TFALs is that the bottoms aren't completely flat which can lead to pooling of oil. But if you use a towel and a mallet, one good tap is good enough to fix it.
Whoops.
Thanks. I'll give it a shot. 1500 reviews and 4.5 stars is pretty good.
Unrelated to the topic at hand: it's getting cooler here and that means chili season. What is everyone's favorite recipe? My favorite ones are a posole i clipped out of Bon Appetit years ago which isn't technically a chili but still damn tasty and a chili verde that I love but my wife finds too spicy so I never make it anymore.
Part of the reason he went with the whipped potato because it was something you can pick up in the super market. Sodium citrate's been a favorite for mac and cheese for a while and easy to get on Amazon so I'd be very curious about how it performs in a soup. I suspect it would be a case where one would have to adjust liquid content after blending everything together as normally the ingredient is used for sauces much thicker than soup (though if you wanted to do a broccoli and cheddar dip . . .hmm . . .)
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
I'm thinking about using the sodium citrate on Kenji's recipe for hasselback potatoes.
http://www.seriouseats.com/2013/12/the-food-lab-hasselback-potato-gratin-the-best-potatoes-ever-recipe.html
IMO your first use of sodium citrate should be mac and cheese to get a feel for how it behaves: http://modernistcuisine.com/recipes/silky-smooth-macaroni-and-cheese/
I'm not entirely sure how well it would work in the potato recipe since it looks like you toss the the potatoes in the cream and cheese mix while it's all cold while sodium citrate works its magic when melting cheese so it needs things to be hot. You could cool it down and then toss the potatoes in it I suppose. And you definitely can work in more cheese than in the recipe if using the citrate, more than double the original amount and close to triple.
But still, try it in a simpler recipe to get a feel for how the much higher cheese to liquid ratio you can get away with changes the flavor and texture.
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
I was looking at All Clad. How do they hold up in the dishwasher?
The lines with stainless steel surfaces are supposed to be dishwasher safe with a note that the copper core stuff may have the copper band on the exterior tarnished. The lines with copper or aluminum exteriors require handwashing. I do not know of anyone that's stuck an All-Clad pan in the dishwasher though. The people that go for it are usually too anal about equipment maintenance to do anything but handwash and a bit of scrubbing with Barkeepers friend takes anything off anyway.
If you do choose to look more closely at their stuff, I'd recommend seeing if you can find a cosmetically imperfect specimen and save a good chunk of money while still having the lifetime warranty: https://www.cookwarenmore.com/all-clad-irregulars/
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
Yeah, I don't run it through the dishwasher, primarily because our dishwasher is old and crappy and can barely take care of plates/cups, let alone stuck-on stuff, but also because I'd rather just hand wash. I'm sure they would do fine, but I don't really have the experience to tell you. A bit of soap and a blue scrubby usually takes care of 95% of my washing, and any really stuck on stuff or crud that burns on the outside of the pan gets hit with a bit of Barkeeper's Friend and some elbow grease takes care of the rest. The pans are heavy duty with out feeling overly weighty, there are no sharp edges anywhere, I have experienced no warping issues at all. The insides have some swirly marks from using metal utensils and the bottom outside of the pans have scratches from rubbing against the gas burner grates; both could be polished out if I really wanted to but I think it adds character and shows they are well-loved
It turned out I had forgotten to restock my San Marzano tomatoes though so I worked with a can of store brand whole tomatoes I originally picked up a few years back intending to mix with better tomatoes in soup before finding where the San Marzanos were located in stores.
Ingredients used:
One 28ish oz can of tomatoes
One medium sized onion
One carrot
A bunch of dried basil
A decent amount of dried oregano but not as much as the basil
An even smaller amount of dried red pepper flakes
2 glugs of fish sauce
Kosher salt
4 Tbsp unsalted butter
Onion was peeled, trimmed, and cut in half. Carrot was cut into 3 or 4 chunks. Tomatoes were dumped into a pressure cooker, then "chopped" by cutting them up with kitchen shears. Added a generous amount of basil to make up for the poor quality tomatoes (basil shares the chemical compound that makes good tomatoes taste good so it can help compensate for poor tomatoes), then the oregano and red pepper flakes. Added the fish sauce, eyeballing about 2 teaspoons worth. Added the onion and carrot and stirred. Added the butter. Turned on the heat until the butter was melted and stirred again.
Since I was using an electric pressure cooker, I put the lid on, set it to high pressure, and set the timer for 48 minutes, adding a few to Kenji's recommended 45 minutes as electric cookers are usually a bit lower pressure and lower temperature than stove top models. After it was done and had come back to normal atmospheric pressure, I noticed the result was really, really watery. I think it was a combination of the poor quality tomatoes (they were packed in a lot of runny liquid) and the amount of butter I added in. Without being able to boil off, all that water stayed around. So I removed the onion and carrot and threw the proto-sauce into a saucier and simmered it until the liquid had reduced (the saute setting on the electric cooker uses a higher temperature than I like for reducing sauces but would be an option if I was really lazy) and the result was a really deeply flavored sauce for about 3 entree sized servings of pasta.
Will see the results with using better tomatoes later this week but I'm keeping the butter for flavor reasons.
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3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
Pan survived the dishwasher like a champ. Aside from some scratches on the bottom from the grates on my gas cooktop, it looks brand new. If it makes it through a few more uses and washes and still comes out looking and performing like new, I'll definitely be buying a set.