The structure of your brain determines who you are thing.
Walter has his old bits added back in and he's slowly acting like his original asstastic self again
Peter introduces a highly advanced bit of tech into his and slowly but surely it's altering the way he interacts with the world around him, relying more heavily on logic, data and variables, etc. than emotion.
Wasnt there a little video from some comic-con or something
With Peter as an observer? Before last season. People thought hed come back from using the machine as one or some shit. Could be related to what were seeing now.
Overall, these season has been amazing. Honestly one of the best final seasons of a show I've seen. The atmosphere is awesome, but they are actually pulling off pretty great episodes that have weight to them every week as well.
By far my favorite thing has been
Then using the scar tissue weaponized gas to attack the observers. I absolutely love them using old Fringe event tech as a weapon. Almost has an Xcom vibe of "now we are turning the tide against you" even though it isnt observer tech. Just a really awesome moment. I hope to see more fringe event tech being used by the team.
Also super glad they brought back
The kid who was obviously an observer. I am guessing that kid is September, not Peter.
I do wonder what they are planning on doing with this new mystery.
Who this Donny or whatever guy is, helping Walt. They are building it like it is going to be some big twist. Which is the only reason it intreigues me, because what could be "shocking" about his identity?
The only outstanding plot hole that they might feel forced to tackle soon
Is the guy Olivia claimed was going to kill her after the episode where they went in her mind or whatever. That dud never did kill her, right?
replying to Distrpter's spoilers, so if you haven't read them/don't want to speculate beyond them, don't click 'show':
i agree that there's more chance of the junior observer being September than Peter. in fact with the way Peter's been acting i'd more expect him to become the this seasons lead bad guy than any other observer. the show has a theme of Walter being a terrible person when pushed to extremes and Peter has been shown to be no different.
beyond that, i think the next two points are connected. yes, the plot point of Olivia being killed(by someone she will recognize since she's seen/spoken to him) seems to have been forgotten and that usually means abandoned. however the fact that we've seen Donald, yet on each occasion his face has been hidden, as well as Walter forgetting ever having known him suggests there is a twist in his tale and i'm at least hoping that these two plot points will converge.[/spoiler/
Because if you're going to attempt to squeeze that big black monster into your slot you will need to be able to take at least 12 inches or else you're going to have a bad time...
So you'd think Peter with all his mega brain power would think up a few plans that involved his plans NOT going to plan (like maybe just shooting the damn guy from that balcony...) Maybe that's how it will go, since it obviously can go as planned as told...
I've been liking this season for what it is but I think the final plan as revealed is super dumb. They're going to fix everything by shipping this kid off to the future, and crossing their fingers and praying that the scientists will meet him and realize how cool he is and that emotions are too important to discard after all? To say that's a stretch would be putting it mildly. For all they know those guys are total pricks.
Also, I don't get the observer origin story. They seem to be grown in vats already being bald dudes with brain powers and no emotions. Then they get the chip that gives them crazy tech abilities I guess. But the chip also transforms you into a bald dude with no emotions? Why do they have to grow them in vats then?
I've been liking this season for what it is but I think the final plan as revealed is super dumb. They're going to fix everything by shipping this kid off to the future, and crossing their fingers and praying that the scientists will meet him and realize how cool he is and that emotions are too important to discard after all? To say that's a stretch would be putting it mildly. For all they know those guys are total pricks.
Also, I don't get the observer origin story. They seem to be grown in vats already being bald dudes with brain powers and no emotions. Then they get the chip that gives them crazy tech abilities I guess. But the chip also transforms you into a bald dude with no emotions? Why do they have to grow them in vats then?
Theory:
Perhaps the tech is relatively old, and it needs certain parameters to operate. If those parameters don't already exist, then it cultivates them in the user?
Alternately: The devices are implanted into the fetus, which explains the lack of scar tissue on the back of their necks. The observers are grown with the tech in place so that they're always that way from birth. The genetic manipulation they do doesn't make them bald or super-smart, it's just the machine.
Yeah I mean, there are possible small plot holes in the origin story, but nothing thats too difficult to explain away. Overall this has been the best season of Fringe, I believe. Im pumped for the finale. I have a feeling we are going to see a lot of deaths
which will be ultimately meaningless as the plan succeeds and a reset occurs
The one aspect of this show I never liked was the whole Peter goes to a universe where he doesnt exist and makes it his new home. I always imagine season 1-3 walt and olivia sitting around, depressed because peter just vanished. Meanwhile Peter is banging a fake olivia, AGAIN. I mean, a lot of Walt's character development should have been regressed with that story. But they didnt really, at all. And now they sort of handwave it all back in theory, but it doesnt mean anything, because Walt was already acting like he had that development.
Still, a good show, coming to an end. Should be a fantastic two hours. Not sure if Ill watch it tonight or sometime tomorrow.
I've been liking this season for what it is but I think the final plan as revealed is super dumb. They're going to fix everything by shipping this kid off to the future, and crossing their fingers and praying that the scientists will meet him and realize how cool he is and that emotions are too important to discard after all? To say that's a stretch would be putting it mildly. For all they know those guys are total pricks.
Also, I don't get the observer origin story. They seem to be grown in vats already being bald dudes with brain powers and no emotions. Then they get the chip that gives them crazy tech abilities I guess. But the chip also transforms you into a bald dude with no emotions? Why do they have to grow them in vats then?
They explained it on the show. Tech means no emotions. No emotions, no screwing, no screwing no babies so they need to reproduce. So vat babies.
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Donkey KongPutting Nintendo out of business with AI nipsRegistered Userregular
edited January 2013
So Fringe is over.
The ending wasn't bad but it wasn't particularly great either. Lots of callbacks to the best monster of the week type stuff. Some good banter. Hugging.
Mostly it was just unremarkable. There was no twist. The plan went off as intended after much tension and drama. We don't get to see what happened in the future with super emotion boy, no one remembers what happened back in the past. We get some emotional issues from season 4 resolved (OH NO OUR DAUGHTER I COULDN'T GRAB HER IN TIME BACK IN THE PARK!!). But season 5 was basically blinked out of existence. I think what it make me realize is that
I enjoy Fringe mostly as a banter, special effects and wacky shit delivery mechanism. The overarching plot was fun, it moved the show forward, but I was never all that attached to it. I'm sad that it's over.
Donkey Kong on
Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
Yeah, it was an okay enough finale but the ultimate conclusion was disappointing. Lots of "Are they gonna do it this way? Or that way? SURPRISE they're doing it the other way!" but in the end the plan was the plan and they did it, the end. If the climax was going to be so predictable I feel like they should at least have done something cool with the denouement, but instead it was just the best possible happy ending exactly as everybody expected would happen. A better twist would have been to do a real time reset - no Observers means none of their interference all throughout the series. September would never have interrupted Walternate in his lab resulting in him missing Peter's treatment, which is what caused Walter to cross over in the first place. And maybe some other weird stuff is different in the world too thanks to the butterfly effect.
Called it. Hell, a blind man who never saw the show before could have called it.
And was it just me or did they not even try to make Agent Lee look 20+ years older?
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Mike Danger"Diane..."a place both wonderful and strangeRegistered Userregular
edited January 2013
I have to admit that while the finale was
pretty much devoid of tension, I still enjoyed it as two hours of fanservice (osmium bullets! Olivia gets her Cortexiphan powers back!)/closing out the characters. I just wish there'd been more denouement (yeah, Peter, Olivia, Etta are all safe now but what about Walter, Michael, and Astrid?)
oh God now I'm imagining a scene where Broyles is putting together a new science team with Astrid as the Walter of the group :,(
Edit: @skeldare, wasn't he going gray? I thought he looked older, at least.
One question that has come up as I have been trawling other boards:
Did Olivia kill Windmark, or did Michael? I have seen some people saying it was Michael since he does the "shhh" thing again after (as in "don't tell anyone I did this")
Yeah, it wasn't anything great, but it was fairly good just by the fact they didn't screw anything up.
Olivia should have set Winmark on fire at the end, but you can't have everything. And Walter isn't gone, he went to the future with a Super Observer. You know, the guys that travel through time like it's nothing...that gets into the mess of time travel, but since they went with the upbeat ending I'll just assume the white tulip lead to more happy times.
Thought Lincoln was going to bite it there, as holding the hallway by himself served no other purpose. I guess they didn't want to hire any extras.
And yeah, Lincoln's HAIR looked like it was supposed to be older...
Yeah this was kind of an anticlimactic series end.
The ending felt pretty rushed, though there were some good connections made with the white tulip and the park scene, heavy-handed as they were.
This felt like a season ender, and a fairly humdrum one at that, not a series-ender.
But that's Fringe - there's a lot of good stuff in there, but the show is pretty weak on world-building and is chronically unable to make a coherent, compelling over-arching plot that isn't full of holes or so arbitrary that it's hard to get really attached to it.
I think it would have been neat if we had a hint at the end that things didn't go perfectly. Like perhaps the invasion happened anyways, or there were still observers with unclear motives caught out of focus somewhere in the background in the park.
In either case there's plenty of fodder for a movie, which wouldn't surprise me in the least.
A movie? Since you can count on 1 hand how many shows pull that off, you should be way surprised if that happened. We're lucky we got 5 seasons on TV...
I thought that this was an great way to finish out the series. No shocking twists or big reveals, just some great character moments and well done action scenes.
Yeah I mean it pretty much went 100% as they said it would.
No big twists or last minute shockers
This show was actually pretty straight forward and didn't rely on gimmicks too much. It was usually just "here is this cool idea, now watch us play with it for a bit. Wasnt that cool?"
Pretty much the opposite of Lost.
Also, I will never, ever get enough of the Fringe team using past Fringe events as a weapon against the observers. No matter how many times they went back to that well (not too often actually) I was ALWAYS like "oh fuck yeah, get them! GET THEM!"
So crazy to think how much the show changed since episode 1. Became much less "government agency defends against weird stuff like X-Files" and more "sci-fi"
Because if you're going to attempt to squeeze that big black monster into your slot you will need to be able to take at least 12 inches or else you're going to have a bad time...
Partly it was the cool way that the heroes go from a government agency to a bioterrorism cell but mostly it was great to see a serialized tv show just tell a straightforward story with no sudden twists.
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Mike Danger"Diane..."a place both wonderful and strangeRegistered Userregular
Looking back now, you know what was really cool? The red/palette-shifting/yellow/gray/retro/dystopian title sequences. I remember cheering with my friends every time there was a new one, 'cause you knew you were in for some shit.
I like Olivia, I guess, but Fauxlivia was way better, and demonstrated that what's-her-face the actress actually has some range and skill, it's just that she took Olivia in a weird, almost neurotic direction
I feel like a lot of sci-fi shows can't quite nail the feel of a federal agent, even a quirky one; the weight of experience and competence, the kind of mindset that engages in investigation but through the lens of a civil servant, etc.
A) Using past Fringe events as a weapon (FUCK YEAH HEAD ASPLODE) (GET HIM, BUTTERFLIES OF DEATH, GET HIM) Fauxlivia finally had non-stupid hair.
It was kinda bland but they delivered on their promises and didn't fuck anything up. I give it a B-.
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Partly it was the cool way that the heroes go from a government agency to a bioterrorism cell but mostly it was great to see a serialized tv show just tell a straightforward story with no sudden twists.
The Plan felt like a padded out fetch quest to burn time.
The whole setting kinda robbed the Observers of their mystery and turned them into generic villains
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Mike Danger"Diane..."a place both wonderful and strangeRegistered Userregular
I feel like as time went on, Olivia's level of...competence? seemed to go down. In season 1, she's the ex-Marine that escapes from being kidnapped without any help, but as time goes on she just seems to become less and less of that. (I know that this is a pretty weak statement/argument)
Deebaseron my way to work in a suit and a tieAhhhh...come on fucking guyRegistered Userregular
Season 5 was just a long slog to the reset button. I missed the significance of the White Tulip to Peter, but that's probably because I really stopped caring once the Peteserver arc ended and the Time Traveling Children of Men story picked up.
Season 5 was just a long slog to the reset button. I missed the significance of the White Tulip to Peter, but that's probably because I really stopped caring once the Peteserver arc ended and the Time Traveling Children of Men story picked up.
the white tulip was a callback to the season 2 ep with the time traveling professor.
walkter tells the guy about what he did and wanting to tell peter about where's he's from. Walter says he's looking for forgiveness in a sign from god. when the time traveling duder goes all the way back to save his wife and erasing all the team's memory of the case he sends Walter an anonymous envelope with just the white tulip drawing.
presumably since Walter got erased and the final season never happened Peter would have zero idea why he got the tulip
My problem is they took no chances with the finale
Even using their own internal logic the world should have
Reset so the show never happened. September never existed, never interrupted Walternate from curing his son and Peter was never kidnapped. Walter still fiddled with Fringe science but never actually crossed over and started the war. It wouldn't have been their happy ending though. But it feels like if they wanted that happy ending they should have come up with a plan that justified it.
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Deebaseron my way to work in a suit and a tieAhhhh...come on fucking guyRegistered Userregular
Yeah, I remember that episode and recognize the callback, but I don't see the connection with Peter. As I remember, he didn't even tell Peter about the White Tulip before or after the run in with Dr. Time Travel, PHD.
To Walter it was a synbol that he was forgiven, to the viewer it's a "Hey remember this?" callback, but to Peter it means... what exactly?
Posts
Walter has his old bits added back in and he's slowly acting like his original asstastic self again
Peter introduces a highly advanced bit of tech into his and slowly but surely it's altering the way he interacts with the world around him, relying more heavily on logic, data and variables, etc. than emotion.
replying to Distrpter's spoilers, so if you haven't read them/don't want to speculate beyond them, don't click 'show':
beyond that, i think the next two points are connected. yes, the plot point of Olivia being killed(by someone she will recognize since she's seen/spoken to him) seems to have been forgotten and that usually means abandoned. however the fact that we've seen Donald, yet on each occasion his face has been hidden, as well as Walter forgetting ever having known him suggests there is a twist in his tale and i'm at least hoping that these two plot points will converge.[/spoiler/
Anna Torv is impersonating Leonard Nimoy
Fantastic.
Just wait until you see
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Fringeception was great, nearing the end of the season aaa can't wait to see how this Doomsday thing goes.
Astrid doesn't know about Cortexiphan, Jacksonville or Walt experimenting on kids? She's always right there when they discuss this stuff!
Also, I don't get the observer origin story. They seem to be grown in vats already being bald dudes with brain powers and no emotions. Then they get the chip that gives them crazy tech abilities I guess. But the chip also transforms you into a bald dude with no emotions? Why do they have to grow them in vats then?
Theory:
Alternately: The devices are implanted into the fetus, which explains the lack of scar tissue on the back of their necks. The observers are grown with the tech in place so that they're always that way from birth. The genetic manipulation they do doesn't make them bald or super-smart, it's just the machine.
The one aspect of this show I never liked was the whole Peter goes to a universe where he doesnt exist and makes it his new home. I always imagine season 1-3 walt and olivia sitting around, depressed because peter just vanished. Meanwhile Peter is banging a fake olivia, AGAIN. I mean, a lot of Walt's character development should have been regressed with that story. But they didnt really, at all. And now they sort of handwave it all back in theory, but it doesnt mean anything, because Walt was already acting like he had that development.
Still, a good show, coming to an end. Should be a fantastic two hours. Not sure if Ill watch it tonight or sometime tomorrow.
The ending wasn't bad but it wasn't particularly great either. Lots of callbacks to the best monster of the week type stuff. Some good banter. Hugging.
I enjoy Fringe mostly as a banter, special effects and wacky shit delivery mechanism. The overarching plot was fun, it moved the show forward, but I was never all that attached to it. I'm sad that it's over.
And was it just me or did they not even try to make Agent Lee look 20+ years older?
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oh God now I'm imagining a scene where Broyles is putting together a new science team with Astrid as the Walter of the group :,(
Edit: @skeldare, wasn't he going gray? I thought he looked older, at least.
One question that has come up as I have been trawling other boards:
That being said, maybe I missed something but was was the significance of the very last scene?
But at the same time, I'm very happy with it emotionally. It felt right.
With the white tulip? Don't you remember that episode?
Its a signifier of hope.
Thought Lincoln was going to bite it there, as holding the hallway by himself served no other purpose. I guess they didn't want to hire any extras.
And yeah, Lincoln's HAIR looked like it was supposed to be older...
This felt like a season ender, and a fairly humdrum one at that, not a series-ender.
But that's Fringe - there's a lot of good stuff in there, but the show is pretty weak on world-building and is chronically unable to make a coherent, compelling over-arching plot that isn't full of holes or so arbitrary that it's hard to get really attached to it.
I am sad it's over though!
In either case there's plenty of fodder for a movie, which wouldn't surprise me in the least.
This show was actually pretty straight forward and didn't rely on gimmicks too much. It was usually just "here is this cool idea, now watch us play with it for a bit. Wasnt that cool?"
Pretty much the opposite of Lost.
Also, I will never, ever get enough of the Fringe team using past Fringe events as a weapon against the observers. No matter how many times they went back to that well (not too often actually) I was ALWAYS like "oh fuck yeah, get them! GET THEM!"
So crazy to think how much the show changed since episode 1. Became much less "government agency defends against weird stuff like X-Files" and more "sci-fi"
Really? It was probably my favorite.
Partly it was the cool way that the heroes go from a government agency to a bioterrorism cell but mostly it was great to see a serialized tv show just tell a straightforward story with no sudden twists.
I feel like a lot of sci-fi shows can't quite nail the feel of a federal agent, even a quirky one; the weight of experience and competence, the kind of mindset that engages in investigation but through the lens of a civil servant, etc.
It was kinda bland but they delivered on their promises and didn't fuck anything up. I give it a B-.
The Plan felt like a padded out fetch quest to burn time.
The whole setting kinda robbed the Observers of their mystery and turned them into generic villains
the white tulip was a callback to the season 2 ep with the time traveling professor.
presumably since Walter got erased and the final season never happened Peter would have zero idea why he got the tulip
Even using their own internal logic the world should have
To Walter it was a synbol that he was forgiven, to the viewer it's a "Hey remember this?" callback, but to Peter it means... what exactly?