[League of Legends] 08/21 PAX 5v5 tournament announced!

Fizban140

unintentional wrote:

at that elo it can work
just play better and win

Yeah but playing better in this game isn't just like a skill or a fighting game, if someone has better gear it doesnt matter how good you are they will beat you. You have to get more CS, get more ganks, have better map awareness, traget priority.

Drool

Yeah that's what he said. Play better and win.

ChaosHat

I have kind of a silly question. Is there a specific trick to last hitting? I normally just try to use my normal attack and that works pretty okay for Lux, but LeBlanc's range and attack speed seem worse (they could totally be the same since this is anecdotal) so it's a lot harder to get that last hit, and sometimes you get the ALMOST either a tenth of a second earlier or later. Is there something I'm missing or is this something I just get better at over time.

Fizban140

Drool wrote:

Yeah that's what he said. Play better and win.

Yeah but taht is a long term thing, you have to get a little lucky as well. And even then you can still lose. It is very situational. It isn't like an FPS where you can just win because you are better, you have to do a lot more and hope your team isnt too bad.

unintentional

yup

i DEFINITELY had a ranked game where my team (i was first pick) was evelynn (me), twitch, sivir, miss fortune, and leblanc

and we won
decisively
because we played better than the other team

unintentional

ChaosHat wrote:

I have kind of a silly question. Is there a specific trick to last hitting? I normally just try to use my normal attack and that works pretty okay for Lux, but LeBlanc's range and attack speed seem worse (they could totally be the same since this is anecdotal) so it's a lot harder to get that last hit, and sometimes you get the ALMOST either a tenth of a second earlier or later. Is there something I'm missing or is this something I just get better at over time.

get better at over time
the things that vary from champ to champ are the reaction time (between clicking and firing a projectile), the projectile speed, and their actual attack speed (which is affecting the time between last hits, or if you miss, the time between your miss and your next attempt)

Dunxco

I will never trust pubby junglers.

We had an absurdly bad jungle WW last game. The other team had a jungle Nocturne who just outdid him in every aspect. He got ganks, WW didn't. He invaded our jungle and stole creeps, WW didn't. He had map awareness, and when a Talon/Taric combo go off to steal our blue while I head off to stop them? WW showed he had no map awareness as he happily sits just one wall across in top lane and very slowly kills off minions while I die.

Then he goes in for the gank.

Securing Talon a double kill. On 20 health.

Fuck pubby junglers.

unintentional

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

Yeah that's what he said. Play better and win.

Yeah but taht is a long term thing, you have to get a little lucky as well. And even then you can still lose. It is very situational. It isn't like an FPS where you can just win because you are better, you have to do a lot more and hope your team isnt too bad.

so you're saying that because you're bad at this game, there is no skill component

Fizban140

unintentional wrote:

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

Yeah that's what he said. Play better and win.

Yeah but taht is a long term thing, you have to get a little lucky as well. And even then you can still lose. It is very situational. It isn't like an FPS where you can just win because you are better, you have to do a lot more and hope your team isnt too bad.

so you're saying that because you're bad at this game, there is no skill component

No just that some games you will still lose, a skill in this game is teamwork and if you think some team mates will think or do a certain thing that can mess you up and you will get punished for it.

shalmelo

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

Yeah that's what he said. Play better and win.

Yeah but taht is a long term thing, you have to get a little lucky as well. And even then you can still lose. It is very situational. It isn't like an FPS where you can just win because you are better, you have to do a lot more and hope your team isnt too bad.

I don't think "playing better" means what you think it means.

FightTest

Years later people still bother arguing with Fizban.

That said, all Garen does is murder people. That's pretty much what he's about.

mr_mich

I know it's against AI, but as a noob I'm proud of this round I just played with Teemo:

unintentional

FightTest wrote:

Years later people still bother arguing with Fizban.

That said, all Garen does is murder people. That's pretty much what he's about.

i cannot believe they buffed garen

Fizban140

FightTest wrote:

Years later people still bother arguing with Fizban.

That said, all Garen does is murder people. That's pretty much what he's about.

You still trolling this thread? Cool story bro.

I just think playing better in this game is a very nebulous and broad phrase that doesn't have much relevance in a game like that. You can't simply play "faster" like you would in SC2 with more APM or even more strategic, you just "play better". There isn't advice in this game, just a slew of random builds for 100 or so champions.

Drool

I win most often when I do well. I lose most often when I do poorly. Either because I let my team drag me into dumb plays, make dumb decisions on my own, or get matched with someone better than me in a lane, or am in the wrong spot when jungling too often to make a difference. The games where I lose because my entire team is so bad I can't make a difference and pull them together for a win are actually pretty rare.

Therefore I conclude that if I play better I will win more and it has proved true because I used to be lower ELO and now I am higher because I play better. It's pretty simple really. You should play better too.

Fizban140

Drool wrote:

I win most often when I do well. I lose most often when I do poorly. Either because I let my team drag me into dumb plays, make dumb decisions on my own, or get matched with someone better than me in a lane, or am in the wrong spot when jungling too often to make a difference.

Therefore I conclude that if I play better I will win more and it has proved true because I used to be lower ELO and now I am higher because I play better. It's pretty simple really. You should play better too.

That to me makes sense, I lose when I do well and sometiems i win when I do well. I can conclude that my team needs work.

Drool

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

wazilla

My team was 2-14 by the time I hit level 7.



I was mid. We had no jungle. Guess I should have ganked.

Fizban140

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

Transporter

unintentional wrote:

FightTest wrote:

Years later people still bother arguing with Fizban.

That said, all Garen does is murder people. That's pretty much what he's about.

i cannot believe they buffed garen

I have not lost a single game as Garen since the buff

NOT

A

SINGLE

ONE.

The last game I played with him was a 4v5

I did not notice this until 25 minutes in.

It was 21-7.

Drool

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

Getting kills in LoL isn't that hard, neither is not dying. Winning a lane isn't a grand feat. Making good plays that win games is much more difficult. Being in the right spot and knowing what to do, and when will make up for a lot of your teammates mistakes, but I kind of doubt you have the frame of mind to do those things when you play.

And I don't think you want to learn to be better, you just want an excuse for being an average player when you don't really need one.

Fizban140

Drool wrote:

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

Getting kills in LoL isn't that hard, neither is not dying. Winning a lane isn't a grand feat. Making good plays that win games is much more difficult. Being in the right spot and knowing what to do when will make up for a lot of kills/deaths, but I kind of doubt you have the frame of mind to do those things when you play.

I have good map awareness I think, but you could be right in that I don't make risky plays. I always respond to what I see in the minimap. I watch the minimap more than the screen.

Squidget0

I think Fizban's issues are less a problem with the game not requiring skill and more a problem with the nature of solo queue feeling random and out of your control at times. That is, it's not a problem with League of Legends so much as with solo queue being the 'main' game type in League of Legends. No matter your level of play, solo queue feels like shit the minute you start caring about it.

unintentional

Squidget0 wrote:

I think Fizban's issues are less a problem with the game not requiring skill and more a problem with the nature of solo queue feeling random and out of your control at times. That is, it's not a problem with League of Legends so much as with solo queue being the 'main' game type in League of Legends. No matter your level of play, solo queue feels like shit the minute you start caring about it.

100% of his posts are about this though
it gets grating

Moridin889

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

See what's happening is that people are saying things, and fizban doesn't hear them. There is most certainly a set of rules for getting better. Last hit better, harass better, have better map awareness, help your team more.

Say you are mid, and since you (fizban) are a golden god compared to your teammates, your opponent Is slain with minimal damage to yourself. What do you do? Well those teammates that are helpless by themselves, go lend your level and gold advantage to help them out.

Have one guy who overextends constantly? That's what we call bait. Set up a trap, take them out. Take a tower.

It's all about reading the situation. Mechanics can always be practiced, but adaptation to a fluid opponent is what this game is about

Also who wants to make the new thread? I'm calling not it

mr_mich

So, where'd my IP boost go? Suddenly I'm getting like 40-50 IP/game instead of like 80-100. Is this a patch thing? Or cause I just hit level 10?

unintentional

mr_mich wrote:

So, where'd my IP boost go? Suddenly I'm getting like 40-50 IP/game instead of like 80-100. Is this a patch thing? Or cause I just hit level 10?

it's a level thing, subtly encouraging you to stop playing bot games

mr_mich

Oh, so if I go to PvP I'll get more IP's again?

unintentional

pvp matches would've given you even more before level 10 too

but yeah a win in pvp is like 100-120 and a loss is 70-80 I think?

i haven't played all month

Bethryn

I can make a new thread if you give me a few minutes.

Fizban140

Moridin889 wrote:

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

See what's happening is that people are saying things, and fizban doesn't hear them. There is most certainly a set of rules for getting better. Last hit better, harass better, have better map awareness, help your team more.

Say you are mid, and since you (fizban) are a golden god compared to your teammates, your opponent Is slain with minimal damage to yourself. What do you do? Well those teammates that are helpless by themselves, go lend your level and gold advantage to help them out.

Have one guy who overextends constantly? That's what we call bait. Set up a trap, take them out. Take a tower.

It's all about reading the situation. Mechanics can always be practiced, but adaptation to a fluid opponent is what this game is about

Also who wants to make the new thread? I'm calling not it

But the problem is that things are never that simple. That guy constantly overextending? Well he is constantly dead and I have to cover the lane so I never get red or blue buff.

Transporter

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

Getting kills in LoL isn't that hard, neither is not dying. Winning a lane isn't a grand feat. Making good plays that win games is much more difficult. Being in the right spot and knowing what to do when will make up for a lot of kills/deaths, but I kind of doubt you have the frame of mind to do those things when you play.

I have good map awareness I think, but you could be right in that I don't make risky plays. I always respond to what I see in the minimap. I watch the minimap more than the screen.

I am by no means great at the game, however, I have noticed alot of people are not great at minimap approximation

i.e. You see a teamfight break out in a lane that's not yours.

Most people will

A.hall ass down there to try get a kill/assist

B. Business as usual

When they really should c, take advantage of your knowledge of the other teams position and know they are now can do nothing about you breaking that lane in half as they turret dance.

Bethryn

http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/147628/league-of-mundos-domundinion-mode-previewing-at-pax

New Thread

Going to try and fix that OP to be a bit nicer and grammatically superior.

Let's leave the ELO Hell discussion in this thread though, it's gotten rather personal!

programjunkie

Transporter wrote:

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

Fizban140 wrote:

Drool wrote:

I think maybe you lose when you think you do well, but maybe you aren't doing as well as you think. It's a pretty simple confirmation bias. You remember games you do well and lose because you are looking for those games, but I would bet you're right in line with your team most of the time. Also having a better KDR doesn't constitute as "doing better."

No but I mean I usually win my lane, get more CS and I don't usually die unless I at least get an assist. But that isn't good enough for this game I guess. If everyone did that well we would be ahead but some people do poorly and you have to pick up their slack. Being good isn't good enough, you have to be be much better to make up for your team, or get the lucky good team.

Getting kills in LoL isn't that hard, neither is not dying. Winning a lane isn't a grand feat. Making good plays that win games is much more difficult. Being in the right spot and knowing what to do when will make up for a lot of kills/deaths, but I kind of doubt you have the frame of mind to do those things when you play.

I have good map awareness I think, but you could be right in that I don't make risky plays. I always respond to what I see in the minimap. I watch the minimap more than the screen.

I am by no means great at the game, however, I have noticed alot of people are not great at minimap approximation

i.e. You see a teamfight break out in a lane that's not yours.

Most people will

A.hall ass down there to try get a kill/assist

B. Business as usual

When they really should c, take advantage of your knowledge of the other teams position and know they are now can do nothing about you breaking that lane in half as they turret dance.

No, it should generally be A. Split pushing is a good way to trade a tower kill for a tower loss and several deaths. There are exceptions to this rule, but people who aren't in the right place at the right time with the right uniform (er, items) cause 90% of all losses. A very large number of fights could radically swing in a different direction by the addition of a player with average items and average skill joining at the right time rather than too late / not at all.

Trading your teammate's death in river for a tower is almost always worth it, but when it comes to 4v5s, you are usually just fucking your team over.

21stCentury

Lord_Asmodeus wrote:

I am in loving of Shaco with the knives. I really kinda wish he had a Harley Quinn legendary skin so I could love em that much more

I love it when people run past me to get to more of my teams squishies, opening up their delicious backs for my knives.

Do you mean Harley Quinn the batman character or Arlecchino the Commedia Del'arte character?

Anon the Felon

Just had a lovely game where a Talon kicked me (trist) out of mid because "I rock as Talon, and you suck."

About level 11, I zipped up to mid lane while he was there, crushed the creeps and burnt down the tower in under 30 seconds.

He also went only 5/3/10 in a 40 minute game. Even our alister did better.

schuss

Fizban140 wrote:

FightTest wrote:

Years later people still bother arguing with Fizban.

That said, all Garen does is murder people. That's pretty much what he's about.

You still trolling this thread? Cool story bro.

I just think playing better in this game is a very nebulous and broad phrase that doesn't have much relevance in a game like that. You can't simply play "faster" like you would in SC2 with more APM or even more strategic, you just "play better". There isn't advice in this game, just a slew of random builds for 100 or so champions.

Yes, the game is nebulous. There are many skills that contribute to winning, and you need to emphasize what you're good at and de-emphasize what you're not. Bad at last hitting? Jungle. Bad at map awareness? Kill yourself, or be the bot carry so your support can ping for you/meatshield you.
There is a lot to pay attention to at all times. That's what makes it challenging, and why it's generally more fun than things like SC2. SC2 I feel you can overcome a lot of things with high APM and a locked up build order/reaction sequence. LoL is about understanding the flow and pattern of what your opponents are doing, and striking while they are exposed.

Kambing

Not my thread, but I'll help.

New discussion goes here:
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/147628/league-of-mundos-domundinion-mode-previewing-at-pax

Lord_Asmodeus

21stCentury wrote:

Lord_Asmodeus wrote:

I am in loving of Shaco with the knives. I really kinda wish he had a Harley Quinn legendary skin so I could love em that much more

I love it when people run past me to get to more of my teams squishies, opening up their delicious backs for my knives.

Do you mean Harley Quinn the batman character or Arlecchino the Commedia Del'arte character?

Batman character



Edit: I would not be opposed to the other one though.