Which Presidents had military records before they were elected? The ones that saw actual fighting.
[...]I want to say Carter?
Yep. Graduated from the United States Naval Academy and served as an officer aboard a diesel electric submarine during the Korean War. Later on during that conflict, he won a post in the U.S. Navy's new nuclear submarine program and was transferred back stateside to learn how the new power plants worked. During that portion of his career, he was put in command of a U.S. military team that assisted in closing down a Canadian nuclear reactor which suffered a partial meltdown. He actually went inside the core to help disassemble the power plant.
It's certainly not taking a bullet in the chest and continuing to give a speech, and he's certainly not a combat veteran the way Jackson or Washington were combat veterans, but people who think that Jimmy Carter lacks testicular fortitude should go spend 30 seconds inside a nuclear reactor that's melting down and then come back and tell me what they think of ole' Jimmy's ballsack.
As much as I love Obama, the man is not a combatant. Sure, he's younger and in decent shape, but adrenaline fueled amateur attacks only get you so far among actual men of war and violence. Especially since the others are prepared for a melee, Obama would go down quickly if he didn't form an alliance.
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First to die: William Henry Harrison. The best shape of his Presidency was being on his death bed with pneumonia.
Dead in the water: Reagan (elderly, no combat experience), FDR (polio)
Round1:
McKinley would shock the world by killing TR. One was handed command as an adventure, the other worked his way up through the ranks from private to major in the thickest part of the Civil War. He'd align with his former unit-mate Rutherford B Hayes.
Jackson would murder JQAdams immediately, then align with Zachary Taylor to finish the first Adams. An enraged Jefferson would charge, and find himself run through by George W Bush. In his dying breaths he would mumble something about "the blood of tyrants" and make the W stand for "without a functioning heart."
Lincoln and Grant would combine to rip Andrew Johnson in half, stating "a President divided can not stand" and "whiskey!" respectively.
Nixon would slice the throat of the grieving Benjamin Harrison, mourning his grandfather, but find that JFK and LBJ had returned the favor.
Wanting to prove himself, Obama would use his speed to slash Buchanan (would thought it would all blow over), penetrate Pierce's throat and cut Cleveland into two non-consecutive terms. But then he was confronted by Gerald Ford and began to negotiate
First to die: William Henry Harrison. The best shape of his Presidency was being on his death bed with pneumonia.
I don't know why people keep saying this. He caught pneumonia at his inauguration. You don't instantly keel over dead from pneumonia. It's not like he'd have much time, but the arena is small enough that I'm assuming this battle is over in a few hours.
The rules state that they are cured of any malady that might have killed them, with exception of life long disabilities. So pneumonia is off the table either way.
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First to die: William Henry Harrison. The best shape of his Presidency was being on his death bed with pneumonia.
I don't know why people keep saying this. He caught pneumonia at his inauguration. You don't instantly keel over dead from pneumonia. It's not like he'd have much time, but the arena is small enough that I'm assuming this battle is over in a few hours.
He was literally killed by standing in the rain.
Even if he didn't have pneumonia to start, someone with a constitution that weak is gonna go down fast.
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adventfallsWhy would you wish to know?Registered Userregular
First to die: William Henry Harrison. The best shape of his Presidency was being on his death bed with pneumonia.
I don't know why people keep saying this. He caught pneumonia at his inauguration. You don't instantly keel over dead from pneumonia. It's not like he'd have much time, but the arena is small enough that I'm assuming this battle is over in a few hours.
He was literally killed by standing in the rain.
Even if he didn't have pneumonia to start, someone with a constitution that weak is gonna go down fast.
Yeah, just a reminder that the rules state all fatal maladies are cured. So Harrison doesn't have the flu when he's doing this, he's at his all. Still gonna die fast, but he's a military man and healthy. He might survive the first few minutes.
Most of them. Literally all of the post-Civil War Presidents except I think Cleveland. We elected a bunch of Mexican War vets immediately before the Civil War. And HW Bush.
Ford as well. Antiaircraft officer and navigator on a carrier in the pacific.
First to die: William Henry Harrison. The best shape of his Presidency was being on his death bed with pneumonia.
I don't know why people keep saying this. He caught pneumonia at his inauguration. You don't instantly keel over dead from pneumonia. It's not like he'd have much time, but the arena is small enough that I'm assuming this battle is over in a few hours.
He was literally killed by standing in the rain.
Even if he didn't have pneumonia to start, someone with a constitution that weak is gonna go down fast.
He gave the longest inaugural address in history. And he did it in pouring rain. Granted, he was an old guy when he took office, but I don't think that it's fair to slap him with a weak constitution.
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Captain Ultralow resolution pictures of birdsRegistered Userregular
To make a few assumptions that pretty much everyone there is basically just as old as they were on their inauguration.
I think Andrew Jackson's chances are harmed by his age. He was just short of his 62nd birthday on his inauguration, the seven oldest. The body does lose some of its vigor as one ages. It is some 20+ years since the duel that he intentionally let himself be shot. A feat of badassery, sure, but the bullet gave him continual health problems later since it could not be retrieved.
From what I've read, the most athletic presidents we've had where Teddy, Gerald Ford, John Q. Adams and Dwight D. Eisenhower. Ford and Eisenhower were both old men by the time they took office. Eisenhower on his inauguaration was only a few years away from a massive heart attack. Ford, on the other hand, despite being thought of as a clumsy oaf was still in shape, especially for a 60 year old man. He may have fallen down a flight of stair from Air Force One, but he was able to pick himself back up and continue walking, something that I'm not sure I could do. Teddy and Adams both kept up heavy exercise routines throughout their presidency.
I'm going to say that Teddy, Ford and Adams are probably the biggest physical threats of anyone on the battlefield. Lincoln, Kennedy and maybe Obama, behind them. Lincoln was an accomplished wrestler and as the tallest presidents, he has reach, and while Kennedy had a chronic pain disorder, he had it for pretty much his entire life. He was good at coping with it. He played football and fought in a war with it. He can focus off it at least for the few hours it will take to fight. Obama is both extremely athletic (not a race thing, but he works out a lot.) and relatively young. (As opposed to Clinton, who's younger than Obama but struggling with weight.)
As for Obama's chances facing down the horde, while some or even most of the presidents were racists by today's standards, not all of them were. He actually would have a decent shot at making an alliance with Teddy, who was the first president to invite a Negro to dinner at the White House.
As for first blood? John Tyler, the one president who openly sided with the Confederacy during the civil war. Ain't nobody there who's gonna like a traitor president.
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AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
Speaking of Tyler, shouldn't Jefferson Davis be on the list?
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AManFromEarthLet's get to twerk!The King in the SwampRegistered Userregular
Speaking of Tyler, shouldn't Jefferson Davis be on the list?
Jefferson was never president of the United States. If he was counted in this company, he's dead first.
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
For the sake of arguement, the Trail of Tears seems at least somewhat comparable to the Japanese Internment by FDR (both were done for the country's best interests at a horrible cost to those abused)... I don't think Jackson's horrible racism/illegal actions were as bad at the time as they are now. FDR did something pretty similar in the last century.
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AManFromEarthLet's get to twerk!The King in the SwampRegistered Userregular
For the sake of arguement, the Trail of Tears seems at least somewhat comparable to the Japanese Internment by FDR (both were done for the country's best interests at a horrible cost to those abused)... I don't think Jackson's horrible racism/illegal actions were as bad at the time as they are now. FDR did something pretty similar in the last century.
For the sake of arguement, the Trail of Tears seems at least somewhat comparable to the Japanese Internment by FDR (both were done for the country's best interests at a horrible cost to those abused)... I don't think Jackson's horrible racism/illegal actions were as bad at the time as they are now. FDR did something pretty similar in the last century.
not even close
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AManFromEarthLet's get to twerk!The King in the SwampRegistered Userregular
As much as it is in vogue to compare internment and the holocaust or genocide, they're not anywhere near the same level.
Saying so is just magnificently incorrect and an insult to victims of all three.
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
For reference, the international definition of genocide. Trail of Tears: genocide! Japanese internment: terrible and un-American, but falls well short of genocide.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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spacekungfumanPoor and minority-filledRegistered User, __BANNED USERSregular
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
For reference, the international definition of genocide. Trail of Tears: genocide! Japanese internment: terrible and un-American, but falls well short of genocide.
Wait, what? How does the trail of tears fit that definition?
Also, does anyone think we could have really just let the Indians stay in that territory when our settlers wanted to take it? Conflict was inevitable, as was our victory, so one way or another, they were going to lose the land. I don't see why Jackson should be so reviled for it (he certainly isn't in wider US society, if polls are any indicator).
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
For reference, the international definition of genocide. Trail of Tears: genocide! Japanese internment: terrible and un-American, but falls well short of genocide.
Wait, what? How does the trail of tears fit that definition?
Also, does anyone think we could have really just let the Indians stay in that territory when our settlers wanted to take it? Conflict was inevitable, as was our victory, so one way or another, they were going to lose the land. I don't see why Jackson should be so reviled for it (he certainly isn't in wider US society, if polls are any indicator).
I am personally in the internment was worse camp, because we did that to US citizens and at a time where we really should have known better.
This is an idiotic opinion to have. The trail of tears was the forced migration of thousands and thousands of people, many of whom died on the way. And when they got to the end the rest were basically starved to death.
By contrast internment, while a gross violation of the civil rights of people and a horrible thing for us to have done, but it is in no way the same level as what we did to the Native Americans.
You're a goosefucking silly goose if you think otherwise.
adventfallsWhy would you wish to know?Registered Userregular
We're getting kind of off topic delving into Jackson's politics and not his apolitical fighting ability, but lemme just say this.
FDR's internment of the Japanese is probably the darkest part of his presidency, a gross violation of civil rights, and entirely unjustified given there was no evidence of Japanese saboteurs.
Jackson's forced relocation of the Native Americans was not only illegal according to teh Supreme Court of the time, but it would cause extreme mental anguish as they were forcibly marched to their new location. In the definition Ebum quotes, the only part that the Trail of Tears doesn't cover is (d). Everything else? Practically genocide, we just don't call it that because we don't like to think Americans are capable of it.
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Trail of tears was more an ethnic cleansing with genocidal tendencies
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KageraImitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered Userregular
Yeah the Japanese internment Was more a bloodless property grab it was horrible being forced into a camp then when you're released finding out hey white people own your home now but the trail of tears was a lot worse.
Smashed the Confederacy and the Ku Klux Klan - will smash Jackson. Also, real military experience rather than riding to the top of San Juan Hill with other New York gentlemen and reporters after it was taken by actual soldiers.
I read somewhere that Lincoln had some sort of glandular condition or something that made him freaky strong. It's why he's so gangly and his face looks weird.
spacekungfumanPoor and minority-filledRegistered User, __BANNED USERSregular
Truman dropped the bomb on the Japanese, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. But we don't call him the worst president for killing them, in part because they weren't American citizens. Neither were the Indians. The interment is the worst of these acts IMO because it was perpetrated by the US government against its people.
On topic, I think people may fear Truman because he made the choice to drop the bomb. If he could choose to kill all those people, who knows what he is capable of.
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AManFromEarthLet's get to twerk!The King in the SwampRegistered Userregular
Truman dropped the bomb on the Japanese, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. But we don't call him the worst president for killing them, in part because they weren't American citizens. Neither were the Indians. The interment is the worst of these acts IMO because it was perpetrated by the US government against its people.
On topic, I think people may fear Truman because he made the choice to drop the bomb. If he could choose to kill all those people, who knows what he is capable of.
War is hell. Far more people died in fire bombing campaigns throughout the war.
Truman dropped the bomb on the Japanese, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. But we don't call him the worst president for killing them, in part because they weren't American citizens. Neither were the Indians. The interment is the worst of these acts IMO because it was perpetrated by the US government against its people.
On topic, I think people may fear Truman because he made the choice to drop the bomb. If he could choose to kill all those people, who knows what he is capable of.
War is hell. Far more people died in fire bombing campaigns throughout the war.
What was America supposed to do about the Indians though? There was tremendous pressure from citizens who wanted the land, we were much more powerful than them, and we didn't risk facing real national censure for seizing the land from them, even though they were sovereign nations. We could have warred with them and taken the land, but we still would have had to force them to completely leave. I don't see why forcing them to leave without warring with them would be worse. Ultimately, manifest destiny meant our occupation of their lands was inevitable. By contrast, the Japanese were citizens entitled to protection by the US government, and that government not only failed to protect them, but actually affirmatively violated their rights.
Truman dropped the bomb on the Japanese, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. But we don't call him the worst president for killing them, in part because they weren't American citizens. Neither were the Indians. The interment is the worst of these acts IMO because it was perpetrated by the US government against its people.
On topic, I think people may fear Truman because he made the choice to drop the bomb. If he could choose to kill all those people, who knows what he is capable of.
War is hell. Far more people died in fire bombing campaigns throughout the war.
What was America supposed to do about the Indians though? There was tremendous pressure from citizens who wanted the land, we were much more powerful than them, and we didn't risk facing real national censure for seizing the land from them, even though they were sovereign nations. We could have warred with them and taken the land, but we still would have had to force them to completely leave. I don't see why forcing them to leave without warring with them would be worse. Ultimately, manifest destiny meant our occupation of their lands was inevitable. By contrast, the Japanese were citizens entitled to protection by the US government, and that government not only failed to protect them, but actually affirmatively violated their rights.
actually SCOTUS had decided that the Indians did enjoy protections and Jackson told the Supreme Court to suck it.
This is off topic, and making you sound like a crazy person.
I suggest we all drop it like the government drops treaties with natives.
Truman dropped the bomb on the Japanese, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians. But we don't call him the worst president for killing them, in part because they weren't American citizens. Neither were the Indians. The interment is the worst of these acts IMO because it was perpetrated by the US government against its people.
On topic, I think people may fear Truman because he made the choice to drop the bomb. If he could choose to kill all those people, who knows what he is capable of.
War is hell. Far more people died in fire bombing campaigns throughout the war.
Yeah. Atom bombs are horrible, but the deaths attributed to those are a drop in the bucket compared to how many died just from the normal bombing runs on Japan, let alone how many already dies up to that point in the way. Depending on how you interpret it, the A-bombs might have saved more lives than they took. US casualty estimates of a land invasion were over 500,000 and there was a good chance of millions of Japanese deaths in said invasion because of Japanese nationalism. Fuck, the only reason we stopped bombing them was that we ran out of both atom and normal bombs to drop for a couple of days and Japan came to the table in that time period. Reading the surrender of Japan made realize how close they came to being completely wiped off the planet.
"Fun" fact: The Purple Hearts that soldiers recieve today are a surplus from WW2, because they produced them based on invasion estimates.
Anyhow. I've always been a Washington fan. Dude was over 6 feet tall and a veteran of several wars.
Mild Confusion on
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Trail of tears was more an ethnic cleansing with genocidal tendencies
"ethnic cleansing" IS genocide.
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
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Yep. Graduated from the United States Naval Academy and served as an officer aboard a diesel electric submarine during the Korean War. Later on during that conflict, he won a post in the U.S. Navy's new nuclear submarine program and was transferred back stateside to learn how the new power plants worked. During that portion of his career, he was put in command of a U.S. military team that assisted in closing down a Canadian nuclear reactor which suffered a partial meltdown. He actually went inside the core to help disassemble the power plant.
It's certainly not taking a bullet in the chest and continuing to give a speech, and he's certainly not a combat veteran the way Jackson or Washington were combat veterans, but people who think that Jimmy Carter lacks testicular fortitude should go spend 30 seconds inside a nuclear reactor that's melting down and then come back and tell me what they think of ole' Jimmy's ballsack.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Dead in the water: Reagan (elderly, no combat experience), FDR (polio)
Round1:
McKinley would shock the world by killing TR. One was handed command as an adventure, the other worked his way up through the ranks from private to major in the thickest part of the Civil War. He'd align with his former unit-mate Rutherford B Hayes.
Jackson would murder JQAdams immediately, then align with Zachary Taylor to finish the first Adams. An enraged Jefferson would charge, and find himself run through by George W Bush. In his dying breaths he would mumble something about "the blood of tyrants" and make the W stand for "without a functioning heart."
Lincoln and Grant would combine to rip Andrew Johnson in half, stating "a President divided can not stand" and "whiskey!" respectively.
Nixon would slice the throat of the grieving Benjamin Harrison, mourning his grandfather, but find that JFK and LBJ had returned the favor.
Wanting to prove himself, Obama would use his speed to slash Buchanan (would thought it would all blow over), penetrate Pierce's throat and cut Cleveland into two non-consecutive terms. But then he was confronted by Gerald Ford and began to negotiate
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
I don't know why people keep saying this. He caught pneumonia at his inauguration. You don't instantly keel over dead from pneumonia. It's not like he'd have much time, but the arena is small enough that I'm assuming this battle is over in a few hours.
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I wanted you to know precisely which part of your post made me snort hot coffee into my nasal cavity and out my nose.
Even if he didn't have pneumonia to start, someone with a constitution that weak is gonna go down fast.
Yeah, just a reminder that the rules state all fatal maladies are cured. So Harrison doesn't have the flu when he's doing this, he's at his all. Still gonna die fast, but he's a military man and healthy. He might survive the first few minutes.
Ford as well. Antiaircraft officer and navigator on a carrier in the pacific.
He gave the longest inaugural address in history. And he did it in pouring rain. Granted, he was an old guy when he took office, but I don't think that it's fair to slap him with a weak constitution.
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
I think Andrew Jackson's chances are harmed by his age. He was just short of his 62nd birthday on his inauguration, the seven oldest. The body does lose some of its vigor as one ages. It is some 20+ years since the duel that he intentionally let himself be shot. A feat of badassery, sure, but the bullet gave him continual health problems later since it could not be retrieved.
From what I've read, the most athletic presidents we've had where Teddy, Gerald Ford, John Q. Adams and Dwight D. Eisenhower. Ford and Eisenhower were both old men by the time they took office. Eisenhower on his inauguaration was only a few years away from a massive heart attack. Ford, on the other hand, despite being thought of as a clumsy oaf was still in shape, especially for a 60 year old man. He may have fallen down a flight of stair from Air Force One, but he was able to pick himself back up and continue walking, something that I'm not sure I could do. Teddy and Adams both kept up heavy exercise routines throughout their presidency.
I'm going to say that Teddy, Ford and Adams are probably the biggest physical threats of anyone on the battlefield. Lincoln, Kennedy and maybe Obama, behind them. Lincoln was an accomplished wrestler and as the tallest presidents, he has reach, and while Kennedy had a chronic pain disorder, he had it for pretty much his entire life. He was good at coping with it. He played football and fought in a war with it. He can focus off it at least for the few hours it will take to fight. Obama is both extremely athletic (not a race thing, but he works out a lot.) and relatively young. (As opposed to Clinton, who's younger than Obama but struggling with weight.)
As for Obama's chances facing down the horde, while some or even most of the presidents were racists by today's standards, not all of them were. He actually would have a decent shot at making an alliance with Teddy, who was the first president to invite a Negro to dinner at the White House.
As for first blood? John Tyler, the one president who openly sided with the Confederacy during the civil war. Ain't nobody there who's gonna like a traitor president.
Nope!
Jefferson was never president of the United States. If he was counted in this company, he's dead first.
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No, no he didn't.
Millions of Japanese Americans weren't murdered.
They're both horrible, but they're not "similar".
not even close
Saying so is just magnificently incorrect and an insult to victims of all three.
For reference, the international definition of genocide. Trail of Tears: genocide! Japanese internment: terrible and un-American, but falls well short of genocide.
Wait, what? How does the trail of tears fit that definition?
Also, does anyone think we could have really just let the Indians stay in that territory when our settlers wanted to take it? Conflict was inevitable, as was our victory, so one way or another, they were going to lose the land. I don't see why Jackson should be so reviled for it (he certainly isn't in wider US society, if polls are any indicator).
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States#section_2
I am personally in the internment was worse camp, because we did that to US citizens and at a time where we really should have known better.
This is an idiotic opinion to have. The trail of tears was the forced migration of thousands and thousands of people, many of whom died on the way. And when they got to the end the rest were basically starved to death.
By contrast internment, while a gross violation of the civil rights of people and a horrible thing for us to have done, but it is in no way the same level as what we did to the Native Americans.
You're a goosefucking silly goose if you think otherwise.
Though yes he's a goose.
FDR's internment of the Japanese is probably the darkest part of his presidency, a gross violation of civil rights, and entirely unjustified given there was no evidence of Japanese saboteurs.
Jackson's forced relocation of the Native Americans was not only illegal according to teh Supreme Court of the time, but it would cause extreme mental anguish as they were forcibly marched to their new location. In the definition Ebum quotes, the only part that the Trail of Tears doesn't cover is (d). Everything else? Practically genocide, we just don't call it that because we don't like to think Americans are capable of it.
Back to the presidential death match.
He's here huckleberry.
Smashed the Confederacy and the Ku Klux Klan - will smash Jackson. Also, real military experience rather than riding to the top of San Juan Hill with other New York gentlemen and reporters after it was taken by actual soldiers.
On topic, I think people may fear Truman because he made the choice to drop the bomb. If he could choose to kill all those people, who knows what he is capable of.
War is hell. Far more people died in fire bombing campaigns throughout the war.
He's got two fists, one for each of ya.
What was America supposed to do about the Indians though? There was tremendous pressure from citizens who wanted the land, we were much more powerful than them, and we didn't risk facing real national censure for seizing the land from them, even though they were sovereign nations. We could have warred with them and taken the land, but we still would have had to force them to completely leave. I don't see why forcing them to leave without warring with them would be worse. Ultimately, manifest destiny meant our occupation of their lands was inevitable. By contrast, the Japanese were citizens entitled to protection by the US government, and that government not only failed to protect them, but actually affirmatively violated their rights.
actually SCOTUS had decided that the Indians did enjoy protections and Jackson told the Supreme Court to suck it.
This is off topic, and making you sound like a crazy person.
I suggest we all drop it like the government drops treaties with natives.
Yeah. Atom bombs are horrible, but the deaths attributed to those are a drop in the bucket compared to how many died just from the normal bombing runs on Japan, let alone how many already dies up to that point in the way. Depending on how you interpret it, the A-bombs might have saved more lives than they took. US casualty estimates of a land invasion were over 500,000 and there was a good chance of millions of Japanese deaths in said invasion because of Japanese nationalism. Fuck, the only reason we stopped bombing them was that we ran out of both atom and normal bombs to drop for a couple of days and Japan came to the table in that time period. Reading the surrender of Japan made realize how close they came to being completely wiped off the planet.
"Fun" fact: The Purple Hearts that soldiers recieve today are a surplus from WW2, because they produced them based on invasion estimates.
Anyhow. I've always been a Washington fan. Dude was over 6 feet tall and a veteran of several wars.
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"ethnic cleansing" IS genocide.
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