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[PATV] Wednesday, September 5, 2012 - Extra Credits Season 5, Ep. 3: On Game Schools
Dog
Registered User, Administrator, Vanilla Staff admin
Registered User, Administrator, Vanilla Staff admin
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Great episode as always. Your show really goes a long way to helping budding designers and developers in finding their way and learning what is needed in this industry.
I'm aiming to write for the industry, but aside from building up a portfolio of potential scripts and writing everyday I'm really unsure of how to first practise the trade effectively, and then show my work off in a way that makes it clear that I have spent a lot of time thinking and unravelling the techniques. I feel like a level designer or artists get it easier in that regard.
Anyone else got a similar issue?
-D
Seeing aspiring game dev students having their dreams crushed by profit seeking fake and/or crappy educations really breaks my heart.
With that said I would like to extend the possibility of studying abroad in Sweden.
The Game Assembly in Malmö, Sweden, is a Vocational college education of 2.5 years and offers programs in Game Art, Game Programming and Level Design.
http://www.thegameassembly.com/
The education is high paced and teaches through both courses and various game projects through out the length of the education.
I found myself in a class with say... 20% of motivated, hard-working individuals and the rest were mediocre at best and full-time slackers at worst.
My education was only 2 years long, but in that time we completed a lot of projects and got an extensive internship at the end of the program. A lot of big developers here are working closely together with the schoolboard (and a lot of the members on the board are HR people from these studios), but what it comes down to is still the students.
Before you apply, do yourself AND your fellow future students a BIG favor and think about the application before sending it in. Are you willing to learn? Are you willing to realize that you don't know all about game development from the get-go (and that you probably won't at the end of the program either)? Are you willing to put in a lot of work and effort into the projects or will you call in sick, messing up the planning entirely?
Where I went the school gave us the proper tools to create great games and learn a lot in the process. The biggest disappointments unfortunately turned out to be the majority of the classmates.
It can be very rewarding. It can be great fun. But it can also be a massive source of frustration (generally caused by know-it-all designer students or artists/programmers who wants to be designers).
Don't sell your country short. South Africa is at least a 2nd world country.
All my life I wanted to be in the game industry. I have made many ideas and always imagined that it would be easy to get them made. I thought I would become a game designer, and pitch my ideas to people then cruse through with a good programming background. When it came to choosing a school, I first went to RIT... because it have a video game club like the one I founded in my high school. I quickly realized that was not the best way to choose a school, plus I realized while I cruised through high school with pretty decent grades without trying so hard, I could not do that at colleges, and quickly dropped out.
I realized I needed to learn how to succeed in a college life with my ADHD and my other learning disabilities, as well as to better prepare myself for life, so I went to Landmark College, a school for Learning Disabled students. It was pretty good, and I learned a lot when I got my Gen Ed degree, but I would not recommend it to everyone. It's very expensive and not for everyone.
After that I decided now I was ready for gaming school... but I wasn't. I was thinking about going to digipen, a place I went to for 2 summers in high school for their summer program. I loved it, and thought it was the best... but I didn't want to spend another 4+ years in college. I was 24 years old and wanted it to be down quickly... so I went to Full Sail.
I never should have wanted to speed up my degree, but I also quickly found out I was not putting my all into it all the time. I was good, but not great, and I wasn't doing what you guys said by focusing 100% all the time, and wanting to push myself. I cruised, and for the first 7 months I did ok, but then it started to catch up with me, and I dropped out after making some bad choices.
Now, at 27 and after a year of working at Gamestop, I work as an IT guy at my family's business. Been here almost a year and I have been doing good... but I still regret the mistakes I have done. I wish I pushed myself more, I wish I went to Digipen, I wish I didn't think everything was going to be easy. I have talked to game developers like Mike Z from skullgirls, and he has shown me that I still need to improve myself. Just dishing out game ideas, character movesets, just being an idea guy, is not the way, and a horrible way, to try and get into this business. You guys have covered this already in one of your earlier videos
Do I still want to be in? I don't know. It's a dream yes, but as I am right not I cannot handle the pressure of making games. I need to work on myself a lot before I can say I can handle that. Your video reminded me of this. It makes me want to warn people to not do what I did. Gaming is not an easy thing to get into, you cannot think you can cruise through, and never try to take the easy way. If you are not ready, mentally and emotionally, to give it 200%, and give up a lot of things that make you happy to focus more on your job… then do not get into this field. You need to set your house in order before you can venture in.
Sorry for the long post… but I am still troubled by all this. However, I did get good experiences from all this, so I guess that is something. Learned new things, met new people, had new adventures.
Definitely be aware of the enormous debt getting an education can rack up, but never be afraid to try and change your life for the better. Also, there are many different kinds of students; I was a "lots of potential, little work ethic" type when I enrolled as a young person, but being in intensely driven company changed me for the better from day one.
To anybody here thinking about furthering themselves, I wish you lots of motivation!
The industry is still nacent and so I don't think there is a simple solution to this problem. My advice is to go to good school and get a degree that is relevant but applicable to more than game development. Degrees in computer graphics, software engineering, mathematics, economics, and the fine arts are all still very competitive in the gaming industry. Just make sure that while you're getting your degree you take any gaming relevant courses available to you.
Best of all, if you can't find a job in the gaming industry or you decide to change your career later you'll have a degree and skills relevant to other jobs.
I went to a game school and luckily it was a really good one (professor that all had large amounts of industry experience, masters level, 90%+ placement rate in the chosen field, etc) and it was a great experience. It was harder than I have ever worked in my life, but it was worth it. When I actually got in the industry, crunching was a breeze compared to what I did at school.
After graduating, I actually got offered an interview with a for-profit college (didn't bother with the interview, I was actually prepared to work for Gamestop before working for them) and that either says really good things about my college or really bad things about theirs.
With the Dare to be digital competition you'll have an excellent opportunity to show off the skills you have learned over the years of your course.
Abertay also has connections with games companies around the UK particularly in Dundee as a lot of companies there were founded by former Abertay Students.
There are no second world countries anymore. The USSR collapsed. Third world lingers because it still basically means a country so poor no major power has any real interest in it (barring, perhaps, mineral wealth).
More on topic, I have to agree with the sentiment of considering traditional colleges - there are just that many traditional degrees that are highly relevant.
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I learned more traditional software engineering at the university and I am currently working as a tools programmer. I have an interest in game design, so I figure I can write my own tools on my spare time and practice the art of game design to some degree using the tools I wrote without having to rely on anyone else. I don't look at the user experience design of the tools and the game designs that can be realized through those tools as distinct concepts. In the end you are writing software for humans and in order to create the software you must at some point understand the humans.
There are diminishing returns to focusing on game design or programming or art or whatever. Traditional schools require a variety of general education classes that, if fully appreciated by the student, can teach as much or more about the wisdom and human-centered foundations of design.
My wife and I have spent the last 10 years recovering from the damage that caused, and we still haven't been able to go back to school.
This episode came at a very good time for me as I'm currently a senior looking at colleges and universities with good game design programs. Right now I'm looking towards USC and DigiPen as my primary, with UTD and SCAD as other possible candidates. It's really nerve-wracking doing all the applications and essays, but I'm doing my best to slug through it and come out on top.
I'm a bit worried as I'm not quite sure where I want to focus on in the industry. I generally want to be the head in charge to get -my- ideas through, and while I know it's going to take a long time for me to get anywhere near that status, right now I'm sort of trying to learn a bit of everything and that worries me a bit. I keep hearing that I need to be able to learn all these things on my own, but I don't even know if i'm doing -that- correctly if that makes sense, like I'm not learning "correctly" or up to par with how quickly other people learn.
I know I'm interested in animation and maybe some programming (if I can get the hang of Java in AP Comp Science at least), though it's still daunting to sift through all this information. I won't lie, I'm scared shitless about college, but I'm also extremely excited to learn and do my best. I guess i'm mainly just scared that I won't do my best.
In fact it'd help if there was a games company near me where I can do an intern-ship.
I'm getting frustrated at everything.
I have a Degree in Fine Art but job vacancies ironically all require experience in the game industry. The only way to acquire this is to do an intern-ship.
Sadly as this essentially volunteering, I won't be paid. Meaning I won't be able to afford living expenses whilst I work for free at any Video Game company. I Googled local companies and the nearest one went into Liquidation a decade ago...
Basically I cannot follow my dream of being a Concept Artist for a video game studio.
1. No school can make you a game designer/ artist
Before you sign on the dotted line you have to be committed and talented. The best schools can teach you how to refine your talent and add to your skill set, but if you aren't an designer/artist to begin with you will not succeed. Game maker must be what you are now, and the degree turns that into a career.
2. You only get out what you put in.
Showing up to every class and getting an A will leave you working at game stop even at the best schools. From your very first day you should be working on some type of outside project. Good schools will have clubs dedicated to producing games for competition. Join a team on day one. I joined a project day one hoping to pick up on a few things, and not get in the way. Three months later I had done the majority of the game play programming for a GDC submission.
3. Consider what you might be missing
For anyone in or just getting out of high school the traditional college experience is something you might not want to miss out on. Even 2 year schools provide a wealth of resources and activities you won't get at most game schools, and save you a ton of money.
You mean like every other artistic industry ever?
This is hardly endemic to games. Movies, TV, music, comic books, novels... In fact, arguably, the game industry has just gotten big and successful and important enough that luck has become part of it. They're a big boy now and that comes with corporate malfeasance; political and social deathraps; boneheaded decisions being made by apparently no one; absolutely hideous uphill battles for start-ups, entry-level positions, and other newbies; inmates running the asylum; and all the other happy little symptoms...of an industry that's here to stay.
So yeah, making it in the industry is almost as hard and as not-up-to-you as winning the lottery, but that means that the industry isn't vulnerable like it was in the 80s.
edit - i am trying for programming