The new forums will be named Coin Return (based on the most recent vote)! You can check on the status and timeline of the transition to the new forums here.
The Guiding Principles and New Rules document is now in effect.
MOBA: I feel the need. The need to feed.
Sterica
YesRegistered User, Moderator mod
YesRegistered User, Moderator mod
I forgot about the bug for OP drafts, so I lost my work. This is just a placeholder for now.
A MOBA, for the sake of this post, is any PvP-oriented game where teams face off to destroy each other's macguffin that happens to be inside both teams' bases. There a typically multiple paths or "lanes" to each base, and AI-controlled NPCs (called minions) will automatically head down each lane. This will result in a stalemate, until the player characters come in to kill minions, crush towers, and eventually cut a bloody swathe to the enemy base. What sets apart MOBAs from similar games is currency and leveling. By doing well, you gain experience and levels that make your stats and/or skill better. You also can get currency that allows you to buy items that make you better (unless you buy the wrong item). This adds a natural slippery slope to the game: by doing poorly, you can eventually fall so far behind the other team that victory is almost impossible. HOWEVER, typically higher level enemies are worth dramatically greater amounts of exp and cash, allowing for exciting turnabouts if your team can work together and catch your opponents off guard. MOBAs are inherently about communication and teamwork, which makes their popularity a mystery given the asocial nature of the internet.
There's a vast garden of MOBA games out there, so which should YOU play? Here's a list of the games commonly played here along with HoN for some reason.
Who? Valve/IceFrog
Premise: The hippie Radiant protect their ancient while simultaneously trying to destroy the ancient of the evil Dire. But Radiant and Dire will be on the same team anyways because the story is just an artifact of the game being a Warcraft 3 mod. Boring, but the comics are pretty.
How it plays: THIS IS A REMAKE OF DOTA 1. It has denying, the same heroes, the same map, and the same goddamn everything. This is the granddaddy of the genre, and it has all the classic pieces. Whether that is a boon or a bust is entirely dependent upon tastes.
Pros: Massive playerbase, Steamworks support, built for eSports, lots of tools to help new players such as in-game hero guides that actually add guide tooltips to items and skills, weird holiday events, and the Bastion narrator can be the announcer.
Cons: Is the primordial toxic soup from which all asshole MOBA communities oozed out. Steep learning curve, and games tend to be on the long-side (40min) due to no surrender mechanic.
F2P? All 100+ heroes are FREE, and the only thing you pay for are cosmetic items like couriers, announcer packs, and of course hats.
Who? Riot
Premise: A world is so fucked up that it cannot afford any more wars, so disputes between nations are handled in arenas where champions fight on behalf of their nation except this is a MOBA and thus you can have champions from two bitterly hostile nations on the same side. Boring.
It's not a hero, it's a...: Champion
How it's not like Dota: Debatable faster pace, with some of the less intuitive mechanics removed (denying, runes/bottles, couriers) and other features like the ability to call a vote to surrender and tall grass that hides your character from the enemy. Champions have a passive skill in addition to the standard three skills + ult paradigm. Has the meta mechanics of runes and masteries, which are features that allow you to tweak the stats and performance of your champions before the game even begins. You also unlock summoner spells of which you can take two into games and work for all champion. For example, Flash lets you give any champion in the game a short teleport with a fairly long cooldown.
Pros: In case the lack of other moba titles didn't give you a hint, this has a disgustingly huge playerbase. Easier learning curve. Has some of the lighter system requirements, but that is changing as they update art assets. Copied Starcraft II's league system, freeing everyone from the phrase "ELO Hell." Tries very hard to police playerbase.
Cons: Has such a shitty community that Riot actually might be a government front to track the world's asshole population. Meta seems a bit more stale than Dota, following a pretty strict "1 Top, 1 Mid, 1 Jungle, 2 Bot) set up every game. Character design is pretty goddamn sexist. Based on champions, there are more yordles in Runeterra than black people.
F2P? Standard rotation of free champs every week, but you can get free champs by whoring yourself out on Riot's Facebook and YouTube accounts. You spend real currency on Riot Points, which buy champs, skins, IP/XP boosts, and similar goodies. You earn Influence Points by playing, which can buy champions and runes. Regular weekly deals on champs and skins.
Who? Hi-Rez Studios
Premise: The gods are pissed off at each other and fighting. There's some inkling of a conflict between Chaos and Order, but really it's an excuse for Zeus to beat up Thor. There's not even enough here to call it boring.
It's not a hero, it's a...: God
How it's not like Dota: The game is in the third person, meaning ganking is significantly easier since you lack complete vision around your god. Practically every ability is a skill-shot, including your auto-attack, meaning you have to aim everything you do. Borrows League's buff system and runs it into the ground, providing jungle monsters with speed, cooldown reduction, attack, and mana buffs. Crowd control is much more common, and characters get their ultimate at level 5, which means aggression starts much earlier. Items do not "build" into anything, but just upgrade and give you their passive effect at the max upgrade. The item shop also contains "active" items which are similar to League's summoner spells but purchased via the in-game shop instead of grinding 15 Summoner Levels.
Pros: Very action based and fast-paced. Arguably more skill-oriented due to pervasiveness of skill shots. Item shop is way easier for newbies to get a handle on. Perverse pleasure in seeing Cupid get crushed by a belly-flopping Bacchus. Has one of the best communication systems out there, allowing you to call out missing or ganks with a quick series of key presses.
Cons: Relatively new, so smaller playerbase. Metagame is kinda weird since character roles are pretty fluid. Female character design manages to out-do League in eye-rolling pandering. Potentially blasphemous.
F2P?: Five gods are always free, and another five do the standard free rotation. Spend real cash on gems, earn favor through playing. Some skins (mainly recolors) can actually be earned for free via favor. Also has a $30 option to buy all gods for free (price expected to go up at launch, if they keep it in at all), including any future ones they release, making one of the few mobas to at least try and prepare to counter Dota 2's generous offerings. Gems can buy premium skins, voice packs, and things like name changes.
Who? Ronimo Games
Premise: Giant corporations hire mercenaries to aid their robot armies in attacking other giant corporations. No fucking factions, nations or other bullshit, and actually acknowledges that the other side might have your clone on it. It's all wrapped under the guise of a Saturday Morning Cartoon, complete with cheesy theme song. Holy shit, not totally boring!
It's not a hero, it's a...: Mercenary
How it's not like Dota: Features 3v3 fights with two lanes, and it's all in glorious 2-D. A bit more of a casual affair, even including the option to drop-in a game already in progress to fill in for a leaver. Tries to spice up certain elements by having the respawn timer replaced with a gold grabbing minigame, and multiple maps. Slight de-emphasis on getting gobs of exp and money, but a fed dude will still wreck your shit. Has meta elements for cutsomization.
Pros: A more light-hearted moba, which tends to ease some of the pressure. Games are much quicker. Fun, platforming and shooting that is kinda giving me Soldat flashbacks (KINDA). Character designs are pretty good. Can be played with a controller (on PC or X-Box 360).
Cons: Playerbase might be on the small side. Winding up in a half-finished game tends to suck more often than not. Might lack the depth that some seek in a moba. A lot of new mercs are voiced by YouTube personalities, testing your ability to endure TotalBiscuit's shitty gangster impersonation.
F2P?: Is NOT free-to-play, costing $10, but I swear it'll go on sale for like four bucks at least once a month. New mercs still get released every few months, and you can spend real money on DLC packs that are just skins. Recently had an expansion released which adds some new characters and maps for around ten bucks.
lol
The following games are on the horizon and may or may not have piqued our collective interest.
Who? Waystone Games, and notably published by EA
Premise: It's in beta, and I haven't heard much about the plot. It's probably boring.
It's not a hero, it's a...: Shaper
How it's not like Dota: One of the first games to really try and shake up the standards by adding a lot of stuff. You can pick a role which influences how your character plays (a carry role may get currency from last hits whereas a jungler characters may get bonuses for attacking other players) which in theory opens up more options for each shaper. There are also little NPC works much like in Starcraft that you can attack to hurt the enemy team's income and even take it over to bolster yours. Last I check it has only two lanes and a very different map layout, but the game is very much in beta.
Pros: Tries a lot of new shit in the genre, and some of it holds a lot of promise. Roles could make the meta more interesting than many other games, and EA will ensure the game sticks around for at least some duration. Very polished with a clean art style.
Cons: Run by EA, so brace yourself to be nickle-and-dimed when the game launches. Doing something new doesn't mean it's good or done right.
F2P?: Currently in closed beta.
Who? Blizzard Entertainment, which means this is Activision's attempt to cash in on the fad
Premise: Think Super Smash Bros., only it's a moba with Blizzard characters replacing Nintendo.
It's not a hero, it's a...: They're actually called heroes in this one.
How it's not like Dota: Another game that wants to shake things up, Heroes of the Storm is trying to be a more casual experience that is aiming for quicker (15 minute) matches and removing a lot of the overly complex stuff that scares off the new players. This means big changes like teams sharing an experience bar instead of individual team members leveling on their own, a focus on special objectives like getting a ghost pirate treasure so he'll bombard the map with cannons, multiple maps, and no item shop.
Pros: Appealing to those who have been intimidated by the genre. It's Blizzard, so it'll be polished as hell and crazy popular even if it sucks. Good potential for eSports if the formula works.
Cons: Runs the risk of being oversimplified to a detrimental degree, removing a lot of the deep strategy and mechanics that moba fans may enjoy. It's Blizzard, so your grandchildren may be waiting on beta (seriously, this was announced in 2010). None of the cool Blizzard characters have been announced yet. Nobody likes Thrall, Blizzard.
F2P?: Has a five-character free rotation (six once you level up you account high enough) and you can buy new ones via gold or real money. Has standard stuff like skins and custom mounts for real money, but is interesting in that color variations are unlocked instead of bought and even the real-money skins have unlockable alternate colors. Too early in alpha to bother breaking down prices, but right now the costs seem to have a Blizzard luxury tax added to them. Kotick gotta get paid.
Who? Turbine Games
Premise: Something is threatening the multiverse and five Batmans are fighting five Wonder Women. Eh.
It's not a hero, it's a...: Champion
How it's not like Dota: Focuses on an area control map instead of the classic three-lane map. Has multiple maps that feature events you can influence like meteor showers and whatnot. Lets you control a variety of DC characters from different universes.
Pros: Finally a game for people that love DC Comics and League's Dominion mode. Has the most Batmans of any moba.
Cons: Reeks of Warner Bros. trying to make a quick buck. Not exactly inspired gameplay mechanics or characters. Threat of Aquaman character looms over game. He has come, and the world trembles.
F2P?: Currently in open beta.
S2's "SECOND-GENERATION MOBA" and follow-up to Heroes of Newerth. It's in closed beta but impressing nobody. Features exciting character like an extra from Assassin's Creed II, and an ugly purple cat.
A MOBA, for the sake of this post, is any PvP-oriented game where teams face off to destroy each other's macguffin that happens to be inside both teams' bases. There a typically multiple paths or "lanes" to each base, and AI-controlled NPCs (called minions) will automatically head down each lane. This will result in a stalemate, until the player characters come in to kill minions, crush towers, and eventually cut a bloody swathe to the enemy base. What sets apart MOBAs from similar games is currency and leveling. By doing well, you gain experience and levels that make your stats and/or skill better. You also can get currency that allows you to buy items that make you better (unless you buy the wrong item). This adds a natural slippery slope to the game: by doing poorly, you can eventually fall so far behind the other team that victory is almost impossible. HOWEVER, typically higher level enemies are worth dramatically greater amounts of exp and cash, allowing for exciting turnabouts if your team can work together and catch your opponents off guard. MOBAs are inherently about communication and teamwork, which makes their popularity a mystery given the asocial nature of the internet.
There's a vast garden of MOBA games out there, so which should YOU play? Here's a list of the games commonly played here along with HoN for some reason.
Who? Valve/IceFrog
Premise: The hippie Radiant protect their ancient while simultaneously trying to destroy the ancient of the evil Dire. But Radiant and Dire will be on the same team anyways because the story is just an artifact of the game being a Warcraft 3 mod. Boring, but the comics are pretty.
How it plays: THIS IS A REMAKE OF DOTA 1. It has denying, the same heroes, the same map, and the same goddamn everything. This is the granddaddy of the genre, and it has all the classic pieces. Whether that is a boon or a bust is entirely dependent upon tastes.
Pros: Massive playerbase, Steamworks support, built for eSports, lots of tools to help new players such as in-game hero guides that actually add guide tooltips to items and skills, weird holiday events, and the Bastion narrator can be the announcer.
Cons: Is the primordial toxic soup from which all asshole MOBA communities oozed out. Steep learning curve, and games tend to be on the long-side (40min) due to no surrender mechanic.
F2P? All 100+ heroes are FREE, and the only thing you pay for are cosmetic items like couriers, announcer packs, and of course hats.
Who? Riot
Premise: A world is so fucked up that it cannot afford any more wars, so disputes between nations are handled in arenas where champions fight on behalf of their nation except this is a MOBA and thus you can have champions from two bitterly hostile nations on the same side. Boring.
It's not a hero, it's a...: Champion
How it's not like Dota: Debatable faster pace, with some of the less intuitive mechanics removed (denying, runes/bottles, couriers) and other features like the ability to call a vote to surrender and tall grass that hides your character from the enemy. Champions have a passive skill in addition to the standard three skills + ult paradigm. Has the meta mechanics of runes and masteries, which are features that allow you to tweak the stats and performance of your champions before the game even begins. You also unlock summoner spells of which you can take two into games and work for all champion. For example, Flash lets you give any champion in the game a short teleport with a fairly long cooldown.
Pros: In case the lack of other moba titles didn't give you a hint, this has a disgustingly huge playerbase. Easier learning curve. Has some of the lighter system requirements, but that is changing as they update art assets. Copied Starcraft II's league system, freeing everyone from the phrase "ELO Hell." Tries very hard to police playerbase.
Cons: Has such a shitty community that Riot actually might be a government front to track the world's asshole population. Meta seems a bit more stale than Dota, following a pretty strict "1 Top, 1 Mid, 1 Jungle, 2 Bot) set up every game. Character design is pretty goddamn sexist. Based on champions, there are more yordles in Runeterra than black people.
F2P? Standard rotation of free champs every week, but you can get free champs by whoring yourself out on Riot's Facebook and YouTube accounts. You spend real currency on Riot Points, which buy champs, skins, IP/XP boosts, and similar goodies. You earn Influence Points by playing, which can buy champions and runes. Regular weekly deals on champs and skins.
Who? Hi-Rez Studios
Premise: The gods are pissed off at each other and fighting. There's some inkling of a conflict between Chaos and Order, but really it's an excuse for Zeus to beat up Thor. There's not even enough here to call it boring.
It's not a hero, it's a...: God
How it's not like Dota: The game is in the third person, meaning ganking is significantly easier since you lack complete vision around your god. Practically every ability is a skill-shot, including your auto-attack, meaning you have to aim everything you do. Borrows League's buff system and runs it into the ground, providing jungle monsters with speed, cooldown reduction, attack, and mana buffs. Crowd control is much more common, and characters get their ultimate at level 5, which means aggression starts much earlier. Items do not "build" into anything, but just upgrade and give you their passive effect at the max upgrade. The item shop also contains "active" items which are similar to League's summoner spells but purchased via the in-game shop instead of grinding 15 Summoner Levels.
Pros: Very action based and fast-paced. Arguably more skill-oriented due to pervasiveness of skill shots. Item shop is way easier for newbies to get a handle on. Perverse pleasure in seeing Cupid get crushed by a belly-flopping Bacchus. Has one of the best communication systems out there, allowing you to call out missing or ganks with a quick series of key presses.
Cons: Relatively new, so smaller playerbase. Metagame is kinda weird since character roles are pretty fluid. Female character design manages to out-do League in eye-rolling pandering. Potentially blasphemous.
F2P?: Five gods are always free, and another five do the standard free rotation. Spend real cash on gems, earn favor through playing. Some skins (mainly recolors) can actually be earned for free via favor. Also has a $30 option to buy all gods for free (price expected to go up at launch, if they keep it in at all), including any future ones they release, making one of the few mobas to at least try and prepare to counter Dota 2's generous offerings. Gems can buy premium skins, voice packs, and things like name changes.
Who? Ronimo Games
Premise: Giant corporations hire mercenaries to aid their robot armies in attacking other giant corporations. No fucking factions, nations or other bullshit, and actually acknowledges that the other side might have your clone on it. It's all wrapped under the guise of a Saturday Morning Cartoon, complete with cheesy theme song. Holy shit, not totally boring!
It's not a hero, it's a...: Mercenary
How it's not like Dota: Features 3v3 fights with two lanes, and it's all in glorious 2-D. A bit more of a casual affair, even including the option to drop-in a game already in progress to fill in for a leaver. Tries to spice up certain elements by having the respawn timer replaced with a gold grabbing minigame, and multiple maps. Slight de-emphasis on getting gobs of exp and money, but a fed dude will still wreck your shit. Has meta elements for cutsomization.
Pros: A more light-hearted moba, which tends to ease some of the pressure. Games are much quicker. Fun, platforming and shooting that is kinda giving me Soldat flashbacks (KINDA). Character designs are pretty good. Can be played with a controller (on PC or X-Box 360).
Cons: Playerbase might be on the small side. Winding up in a half-finished game tends to suck more often than not. Might lack the depth that some seek in a moba. A lot of new mercs are voiced by YouTube personalities, testing your ability to endure TotalBiscuit's shitty gangster impersonation.
F2P?: Is NOT free-to-play, costing $10, but I swear it'll go on sale for like four bucks at least once a month. New mercs still get released every few months, and you can spend real money on DLC packs that are just skins. Recently had an expansion released which adds some new characters and maps for around ten bucks.
lol
The following games are on the horizon and may or may not have piqued our collective interest.
Who? Waystone Games, and notably published by EA
Premise: It's in beta, and I haven't heard much about the plot. It's probably boring.
It's not a hero, it's a...: Shaper
How it's not like Dota: One of the first games to really try and shake up the standards by adding a lot of stuff. You can pick a role which influences how your character plays (a carry role may get currency from last hits whereas a jungler characters may get bonuses for attacking other players) which in theory opens up more options for each shaper. There are also little NPC works much like in Starcraft that you can attack to hurt the enemy team's income and even take it over to bolster yours. Last I check it has only two lanes and a very different map layout, but the game is very much in beta.
Pros: Tries a lot of new shit in the genre, and some of it holds a lot of promise. Roles could make the meta more interesting than many other games, and EA will ensure the game sticks around for at least some duration. Very polished with a clean art style.
Cons: Run by EA, so brace yourself to be nickle-and-dimed when the game launches. Doing something new doesn't mean it's good or done right.
F2P?: Currently in closed beta.
Who? Blizzard Entertainment, which means this is Activision's attempt to cash in on the fad
Premise: Think Super Smash Bros., only it's a moba with Blizzard characters replacing Nintendo.
It's not a hero, it's a...: They're actually called heroes in this one.
How it's not like Dota: Another game that wants to shake things up, Heroes of the Storm is trying to be a more casual experience that is aiming for quicker (15 minute) matches and removing a lot of the overly complex stuff that scares off the new players. This means big changes like teams sharing an experience bar instead of individual team members leveling on their own, a focus on special objectives like getting a ghost pirate treasure so he'll bombard the map with cannons, multiple maps, and no item shop.
Pros: Appealing to those who have been intimidated by the genre. It's Blizzard, so it'll be polished as hell and crazy popular even if it sucks. Good potential for eSports if the formula works.
Cons: Runs the risk of being oversimplified to a detrimental degree, removing a lot of the deep strategy and mechanics that moba fans may enjoy. It's Blizzard, so your grandchildren may be waiting on beta (seriously, this was announced in 2010). None of the cool Blizzard characters have been announced yet. Nobody likes Thrall, Blizzard.
F2P?: Has a five-character free rotation (six once you level up you account high enough) and you can buy new ones via gold or real money. Has standard stuff like skins and custom mounts for real money, but is interesting in that color variations are unlocked instead of bought and even the real-money skins have unlockable alternate colors. Too early in alpha to bother breaking down prices, but right now the costs seem to have a Blizzard luxury tax added to them. Kotick gotta get paid.
Who? Turbine Games
Premise: Something is threatening the multiverse and five Batmans are fighting five Wonder Women. Eh.
It's not a hero, it's a...: Champion
How it's not like Dota: Focuses on an area control map instead of the classic three-lane map. Has multiple maps that feature events you can influence like meteor showers and whatnot. Lets you control a variety of DC characters from different universes.
Pros: Finally a game for people that love DC Comics and League's Dominion mode. Has the most Batmans of any moba.
Cons: Reeks of Warner Bros. trying to make a quick buck. Not exactly inspired gameplay mechanics or characters. Threat of Aquaman character looms over game. He has come, and the world trembles.
F2P?: Currently in open beta.
S2's "SECOND-GENERATION MOBA" and follow-up to Heroes of Newerth. It's in closed beta but impressing nobody. Features exciting character like an extra from Assassin's Creed II, and an ugly purple cat.
Sterica on
+1
This discussion has been closed.
Posts
we passed their studio on the highway (I thought it was weird a game studio was in nowhere michigan so I googled them)
Luna is fun but she doesn't have that boom blade
Is Sivir still a viable choice for lol
Last I remembered she have hella trouble keeping up or getting away from all the new fancy heroes popping up all over the place
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
Poros need their snax.
Steam: Chagrin LoL: Bonhomie
lol
LoL
They're trash and so is anyone who plays one
wow rude
sivir received buffs around october/november and became one of the top ADC picks, then she received a slight nerf and also characters she has a hard time dealing with received buffs, also indirectly nerfing her
but she's WAY more viable than she used to be and if you put the time into learning her you can do way great now
she also received a new model
meepo...
Meep meep
The Bastion announcer is my favourite thing in dota
e: everytime someone picks meepo I have to devote as much of my time as possible to shutting them down.
Because the only people who pick meepo are the people who win with meepo.
but the bastion one is a close 2nd
myself a burger
http://dota2.gamepedia.com/Pyrion_Flax_Announcer_Pack
they have the lich king, tyrael, and nova already
as the big smite fan who sings its praises to anyone he can and desperately tries to get more people into it at every turn,
you should play league
every
game
Plus, you get exposed to far more shitty puns in DotA than you do in League. Everyone knows that shitty puns are the foundation of MOBA greatness.