[WARMACHINE & HORDES] 1+1=Cyriss is calculating... calculating... seven! And you're dead.

Echo

So, done playing 25p Skorne vs Cryx.

I don't think Morghoul works with two warbeasts at 25p - I felt that I'd rather have spent those 10 points on another unit of infantry.

And while Morghoul is pretty much a laser beam through butter against single-wound infantry blobs, he's a wet noodle against anything else. Considering trying Makeda or Hexeris next time.

admanb

Hordes in general is a mess below 35 and doesn't really shine until 50.

DragonPup

I always wondered why some colossal pieces are white and grey like Hyperion.

Speaking of Hyperion, I finally finished mine last week. Now I just need to actually play him...

Spoilers for Big

ArcticLancer

I approve of your Skorne dismemberment.

Arch

So I played two games last night with my dwarves. One was against Ossyan (sp?) and a Retribution army, the other was against Grayle and some wolves.

Both of these games were rough. My entire army is shooty, and both casters deny that with their feats.

I almost won vs Ossyan but I couldn't screen my caster well enough and the Imperators (I think?) shot him to pieces.

I did manage to destroy Eiryss and most of her unit with two attacks from the Arcanist Corp, who continue to be the MVP in every game.

The fight against Grayle would have been better if I had been able to handle the lord of the Feast. He got the argus animus and storm rager, then in one turn killed a unit of Arcanists and almost killed a unit of High shields. It was really frustrating. High points include a basher killing an entire unit of Wolves of Orboros with a Flak Field, and a Feral Warpwolf missing on a trample attack on my other arcanist corp unit and dying to free strikes. Get it Arcanist.

This battle ended with me camping 4 focus on Gorten and duking it out toe to toe with Grayle....and losing because I kept whiffing my attacks. I tanked two turns of Grayle hitting me while I made him transfer about 20 pts of damage. I had backed myself into some impassable terrain and put a rock wall up so only Grayle could reach me.

Also, we upgraded from floor machine and played on a table with some Lego terrain I made. I'll post pics in a bit.

Arch

Thoughts- I really hate line of sight rules in this game. It is the only part of the game I dislike.

I don't know what the alternative would be, but I just can't figure out how to keep people out of line of sight. I don't like the whole "if you can draw a line from a base to a base, you are good" thing.

Like I said, I don't know what the alternative is or would be, but I always feel cheated when I move a bunch of dudes aroundy caster and there is some weird angle a guy can run up and just peek around enough to shoot me in the toe and kill me.

Tips, suggestions, join me in my rant?

DragonPup

ArcticLancer wrote: »

I approve of your Skorne dismemberment.

Thanks. The GW blood paint worked really nicely for it. That was 2 applications to get that effect.

And the disintegrated Karax came out pretty well, too.

Echo

Arch wrote: »

Thoughts- I really hate line of sight rules in this game. It is the only part of the game I dislike.

I don't know what the alternative would be, but I just can't figure out how to keep people out of line of sight. I don't like the whole "if you can draw a line from a base to a base, you are good" thing.

Personally I like having a volume you occupy, rather than true LOS like 40k uses.

kaorti

LoS blocking is extremely powerful. You've got one of the more efficient options for it in dwarves too. Try the Tactical Arcanist Corps. Drop clouds in front of your caster. Huge bases like the earthbreaker also work.

Echo

It's why you see those gobbers and whatshisface Gorman in so many lists.

Arch

kaorti wrote: »

LoS blocking is extremely powerful. You've got one of the more efficient options for it in dwarves too. Try the Tactical Arcanist Corps. Drop clouds in front of your caster. Huge bases like the earthbreaker also work.

Yeah, I just need to remember to keep one unit back. I have been using them both as killing units, and they work great for that, but I need to remember to keep myself defended.

Inquisitor

So, my friends are wanting to get back into this game now that I have moved back stateside. Pushing pretty hard for it actually. I was playing Khador but I think I am pretty over them because the reason I like this game is jacks. And despite their fluff Khador (as a faction) sucks at running jacks.

Convergence didn't exist back when I played the game so I have been looking at them. I assuming if I want to go jack heavy that they will be the faction to roll with?

Arch

Inquisitor wrote: »

So, my friends are wanting to get back into this game now that I have moved back stateside. Pushing pretty hard for it actually. I was playing Khador but I think I am pretty over them because the reason I like this game is jacks. And despite their fluff Khador (as a faction) sucks at running jacks.

Convergence didn't exist back when I played the game so I have been looking at them. I assuming if I want to go jack heavy that they will be the faction to roll with?

My dwarf list has five jacks in it, but I don't know if that's what you meant....

Three are light jacks and one is marshalled to Thor, but STILL

Five. Jacks.

(Cygnar and Convergence can run pretty jack-heavy, and sometimes so can Retribution. They have cool light jacks as well!)

Echo

Convergence has a special feature where whenever a vector (their warjacks) spends a focus, it can hand that focus over to another vector within 6". So with some planning you can have the same one point of focus used by all your jacks.

Arch

FUCK THAT TIER 4 GORTEN GUNBUNNY SWARM

Faction: Gorten - The Hammerfall Irregulars
Casters: 1/1
Points: 35/35
Tiers: 4
Gorten Grundback (*7pts)
* Grundback Blaster (3pts)
* Grundback Blaster (3pts)
* Grundback Gunner (3pts)
* Grundback Gunner (3pts)
* Grundback Gunner (3pts)
Hammerfall High Shield Gun Corps (Leader and 5 Grunts) (5pts)
* Hammerfall High Shield Gun Corps Officer & Standard (0pts)
Hammerfall High Shield Gun Corps (Leader and 5 Grunts) (5pts)
Tactical Arcanist Corps (4pts)
Tactical Arcanist Corps (4pts)
Thor Steinhammer (2pts)
* Ghordson Basher (7pts)

*I am actually going to run this list next time I play for the fuck of it

PMAvers

Something I definitely hope happens in a Mk II remix or Mark III is a way to better run Jack heavy. Idea I've had floating around in my head is that the Warcaster's focus pool would be considered a "safe" pool of focus to allocate, but you could assign more after doling those out at some sort of penalty. Maybe redlining the boiler? D3 damage (or more) to the Jack per extra focus you hand it?

Arch

PMAvers wrote: »

Something I definitely hope happens in a Mk II remix or Mark III is a way to better run Jack heavy. Idea I've had floating around in my head is that the Warcaster's focus pool would be considered a "safe" pool of focus to allocate, but you could assign more after doling those out at some sort of penalty. Maybe redlining the boiler? D3 damage (or more) to the Jack per extra focus you hand it?

Or maybe the caster can pass out more focus than their stat at the cost of D3 damage to themselves?

admanb

Those are both things that everyone would do every turn until they died. The best way to make jacks more popular without completely revamping all the casters would be to buff jack marshals. It's already kind of happened with the new Jrs.

Inquisitor wrote: »

So, my friends are wanting to get back into this game now that I have moved back stateside. Pushing pretty hard for it actually. I was playing Khador but I think I am pretty over them because the reason I like this game is jacks. And despite their fluff Khador (as a faction) sucks at running jacks.

Convergence didn't exist back when I played the game so I have been looking at them. I assuming if I want to go jack heavy that they will be the faction to roll with?

Convergence is the best jack heavy faction. They're also probably the most complicated faction in the entire game, so get used to learning due to your own bad choices.

tzeentchling

Menoth is possibly the second best at running jack-heavy. None of our casters are specifically designed for Jacks, really - people would claim Amon but that's because that's really all he can do, and he's too squishy - but many of them can be very good with many jacks. High focus in general on casters, and with Choir, Vassals, and Reclaimers, even a low-focus caster like Reznik or eFeora can be quite effective running 3 or more jacks.

ArcticLancer

Arch wrote: »

Inquisitor wrote: »

So, my friends are wanting to get back into this game now that I have moved back stateside. Pushing pretty hard for it actually. I was playing Khador but I think I am pretty over them because the reason I like this game is jacks. And despite their fluff Khador (as a faction) sucks at running jacks.

Convergence didn't exist back when I played the game so I have been looking at them. I assuming if I want to go jack heavy that they will be the faction to roll with?

My dwarf list has five jacks in it, but I don't know if that's what you meant....

Three are light jacks and one is marshalled to Thor, but STILL

Five. Jacks.

(Cygnar and Convergence can run pretty jack-heavy, and sometimes so can Retribution. They have cool light jacks as well!)

We have one list. One. If you want warjacks, Retribution is arguably the second worst choice after Khador. Convergence and Protectorate are much better options, and Cygnar isn't a slouch either.

Inquisitor

Ah well my friend who doesn't like jacks but loves infantry was eyeing Retribution. I will be sure to let him know that he is on a good track.

Echo

New Skorne stuff. New multi-kit with Praetorian Swordsmen.

Praetorians stand as paragons of the warrior caste, their traditions irrevocably rooted in the hoksune code. These soldiers form the backbone of all house armies as well as the Army of the Western Reaches. Praetorian swordsmen require superlative skill to master their distinctive two-weapon fighting style. The keltarii wield their double-bladed glaives with unsurpassed speed and precision, able to deflect incoming projectiles as easily as they slice through flesh and steel.

PMAvers

You know, I would totally take a multi-kit Brigands box. <_<

Maybe with shotties instead of the rifles?

Echo

Keltarii speculation: they lose Combo Strike, they may or may not keep their two attacks, they possibly get Set Defense and according to that fluff line they get something defensive against ranged attacks.

Echo

Also, Xerxis2 and his new wheelchair.

kaorti

Almost certainly blade shield.

Echo

FLGS still has 20% clearance sale on Warmahordes, so I picked up Hexeris2 and Morghoul2.

Hexeris' pike thingie snapped off right away. Guess I'm doing a pinning job there.

edit: and the shaft just isn't long enough - both hands are modelled on the shaft, but they can't both fit in their respective sockets. So I guess I'm sticking a pin in the shaft to extend it a millimeter or two and then greenstuffing over the pin.

Norgoth

Echo wrote: »

and the shaft just isn't long enough

Said all the Skorne ladies.

So, my local store is running a journeyman. Last time I took every award with my khador so I've got a crown to keep. This time I'll also be playing khador, I thought about using the alt battlebox but the guys running the journeyman have stated you can use any non-epic caster and 10 point list in lieu of a battlebox and I'm thinking I can get some really horrible set ups like this, so far in thinking maybe Vlad or butcher + Kayzay and underboss. Any other ideas?

Arch

So I'm soliciting tips!

Particularly on Gorten's Rock Wall ability, I don't think I'm using it correctly. Right now all I do is drop it for cover (thus the +4 def). Is this all it is good for?

What else can I do with it? What are some neat tricks I may be missing?

PMAvers

Arch wrote: »

So I'm soliciting tips!

Particularly on Gorten's Rock Wall ability, I don't think I'm using it correctly. Right now all I do is drop it for cover (thus the +4 def). Is this all it is good for?

What else can I do with it? What are some neat tricks I may be missing?

Position it so that enemy stuff can't get into melee range so they can't charge your jacks?

Since things can't stand on it.

ArcticLancer

Non-pathfinders also can't charge over it. That matters a fair chunk of the time.

Arch

ArcticLancer wrote: »

Non-pathfinders also can't charge over it. That matters a fair chunk of the time.

Really now? I didn't know that.

Didn't think about it protecting my jacks from being charged, that might help a lot actually since my poor driller either gets shot to pieces or charged almost every game Q_Q

ArcticLancer

Yeah, you can't charge over linear obstacles (walls) if you don't have pathfinder. You also get +2 def against melee attacks if they attack you over it since it's still an obstruction.

Arch

ArcticLancer wrote: »

Yeah, you can't charge over linear obstacles (walls) if you don't have pathfinder. You also get +2 def against melee attacks if they attack you over it since it's still an obstruction.

!!!!!

ArcticLancer

Sorry, technically walls are obstacles, not obstructions. You still get the +2 in melee if they attack you over it though.
An enemy attacking you around an obstruction (think of fighting around the corner of a house, or a spire) will still give you the +2 cover bonus in melee as well. It's just an important differentiation in the rules between obstacles and obstructions, even though they both give the same benefit in this case. :p

Echo

I need to refresh my memory on those rules.

ArcticLancer

By and large it's obstructions being things you can't move through or onto, while obstacles you can. Linear obstacles are obstacles of a certain width (almost universally walls) which you can move across without it taking extra movement.

The rules with them providing melee cover are pretty straightforward. You do a LOS check the same as determining if a ranged attack will have cover or not (draw a column and if anything intersects appropriate terrain, bonus), and if the attack goes over an obstacle or around an obstruction, you get +2 defence.

Echo

Hexeris2 is a pretty darn cool model. Can't wait to paint him.

Arch

ANOTHER QUESTION

If my opponent uses an ability (say, Ossyan's feat), am I ever allowed to know the area?

Like, his feat says that any ranged attacks originating in his command range for a round lose a damage die. Is there a way for me to know where the edges of that feat are? Or am I supposed to guesstimate.

Similarly with things like "if a model advances within 2 inches it catches fire" are people allowed to know the radius of that?

admanb

Your opponent is not required to measure it until it's necessary information.