Wow, I finally caught up on seeing last season. Was pretty cool seeing Maul as a Sith Master type for Ezra. Watched the trailer for next season too.
I've never read a Thrawn book. Only thing I know about the character is what I've gleamed from these Star Wars threads, but even I gasped when it was revealed to be Thrawn as the antagonist next season!
I will make a list of the good stuff that came from the dumpster fire that was the old Star Wars Expanded Universe.
I Jedi at least had some humor about it. (Another reason I love the Wraith books.) And when your source material/goal is (fixing) the Jedi Academy stuff by KJA, you have nowhere to go but up.
Wow, I finally caught up on seeing last season. Was pretty cool seeing Maul as a Sith Master type for Ezra. Watched the trailer for next season too.
I've never read a Thrawn book. Only thing I know about the character is what I've gleamed from these Star Wars threads, but even I gasped when it was revealed to be Thrawn as the antagonist next season!
I will make a list of the good stuff that came from the dumpster fire that was the old Star Wars Expanded Universe.
I Jedi at least had some humor about it. (Another reason I love the Wraith books.) And when your source material/goal is (fixing) the Jedi Academy stuff by KJA, you have nowhere to go but up.
And somehow, when accusing Corran of being a Mary Sue especially in I, Jedi, they somehow conveniently forget that Corran was wrong.
I mean, he gives Luke that "I've seen the dark side and it's not always some grand cosmic thing and I know what I'm doing" speech, which is what most people focus on, and then later on - Oops! Almost goes right over the edge without realizing it because the dark side IS seductive.
Wow, I finally caught up on seeing last season. Was pretty cool seeing Maul as a Sith Master type for Ezra. Watched the trailer for next season too.
I've never read a Thrawn book. Only thing I know about the character is what I've gleamed from these Star Wars threads, but even I gasped when it was revealed to be Thrawn as the antagonist next season!
I will make a list of the good stuff that came from the dumpster fire that was the old Star Wars Expanded Universe.
Wow, I finally caught up on seeing last season. Was pretty cool seeing Maul as a Sith Master type for Ezra. Watched the trailer for next season too.
I've never read a Thrawn book. Only thing I know about the character is what I've gleamed from these Star Wars threads, but even I gasped when it was revealed to be Thrawn as the antagonist next season!
I will make a list of the good stuff that came from the dumpster fire that was the old Star Wars Expanded Universe.
I Jedi at least had some humor about it. (Another reason I love the Wraith books.) And when your source material/goal is (fixing) the Jedi Academy stuff by KJA, you have nowhere to go but up.
And somehow, when accusing Corran of being a Mary Sue especially in I, Jedi, they somehow conveniently forget that Corran was wrong.
I mean, he gives Luke that "I've seen the dark side and it's not always some grand cosmic thing and I know what I'm doing" speech, which is what most people focus on, and then later on - Oops! Almost goes right over the edge without realizing it because the dark side IS seductive.
Yeah as I reread the X-Wing Books the last time, like, I think the only one where Horn might have been a real Mary Sue was Isaard's Revenge. The rest of them he's consistently fucking up and being a bit of a dick (I mean, holy shit was he super wrong about Tycho multiple times). Like, not major fuck ups, but he's also in a goddamned uber-elite military group. If any of them are majorly fucking up they would have been in Wraith Squadron instead. Like, Stackpole still has a ton of issues, but Horn has definitely annoyed me less and less on rereads.
I suspect they gotta be careful though. You don't want fans more interested in Revan than the main Rebels characters. So I tend to think that if they ever do bring KOTOR in, it might just be a nod or a name drop and little more than that.
I suspect they gotta be careful though. You don't want fans more interested in Revan than the main Rebels characters. So I tend to think that if they ever do bring KOTOR in, it might just be a nod or a name drop and little more than that.
Not going to stop me from hoping for Disney to greenlight a KotOR series once Rebels has run it's course.
Once the new trilogy is hammered out I expect (and hope) to see a Disney series set in or just after that era. If you took the original trilogy as the only source text for Star Wars it would be pretty bare bones. The added joy is in the expanded universe.
KoTor and 2 are still canon because it happens long before the current story that is why the online game can continue the story of it and not effect the ones in the movies
KoTor and 2 are still canon because it happens long before the current story that is why the online game can continue the story of it and not effect the ones in the movies
Afraid not.
Everything released prior to the 2014 canon purge is no longer canonical with the films no matter where in the internal chronology it sits, including KOTOR and SWTOR. They're now under the "Star Wars Legends" banner.
The earliest item in the current canon is Phantom Menace.
I thought KoToR and TOR were ambiguously canon. Which made sense to me, given the power of choice and branching narratives they had.
Yeah, there used to be levels of Canon, where everything written was considered canon until something with a higher level of canon said it wasn't. IIRC, it went Movies/Radio broadcasts > TV Shows > Novels > Comics > Games.
But then Disney bought Star Wars, said "Nope, this is all confusing and stupid" and declared that only the movies, tv shows and novels from that point forward would be canon. Everything else is non-canon until it's brought into canon (like Thrawn), but authors can pick and choose from the "Legends" to bring stuff back into Canon.
And if/when something is brought into canon, only the new material is considered canon. So in the case of Thrawn, all the old stories are still not canon, only whatever they do in Rebels and wherever else he shows up going forward will be canon.
Ugh, this canon talk is confusing, I'm kind of glad Disney wiped it all away the way the did. As much as I hope KOTOR gets brought in, having all of the books and everything over the past 30 years makes it incredibly inaccessible to the new audiences they are hoping to bring in.
Once the new trilogy is hammered out I expect (and hope) to see a Disney series set in or just after that era. If you took the original trilogy as the only source text for Star Wars it would be pretty bare bones. The added joy is in the expanded universe.
There is also the possibility that they will do it as one of their side movies like Rogue One.
I thought KoToR and TOR were ambiguously canon. Which made sense to me, given the power of choice and branching narratives they had.
Yeah, there used to be levels of Canon, where everything written was considered canon until something with a higher level of canon said it wasn't. IIRC, it went Movies/Radio broadcasts > TV Shows > Novels > Comics > Games.
But then Disney bought Star Wars, said "Nope, this is all confusing and stupid" and declared that only the movies, tv shows and novels from that point forward would be canon. Everything else is non-canon until it's brought into canon (like Thrawn), but authors can pick and choose from the "Legends" to bring stuff back into Canon.
With Rakata Prime and Malachor being brought into canon, the status of KotOR and KotOR2 is sort of ambiguously canon. Maybe all those stories are true, maybe they're just Legends... but the planets their finales take place on are now part of official Star Wars canon.
I thought KoToR and TOR were ambiguously canon. Which made sense to me, given the power of choice and branching narratives they had.
Yeah, there used to be levels of Canon, where everything written was considered canon until something with a higher level of canon said it wasn't. IIRC, it went Movies/Radio broadcasts > TV Shows > Novels > Comics > Games.
But then Disney bought Star Wars, said "Nope, this is all confusing and stupid" and declared that only the movies, tv shows and novels from that point forward would be canon. Everything else is non-canon until it's brought into canon (like Thrawn), but authors can pick and choose from the "Legends" to bring stuff back into Canon.
Actually, I thought all media is canon going forward. Including comics and games.
Ugh, this canon talk is confusing, I'm kind of glad Disney wiped it all away the way the did. As much as I hope KOTOR gets brought in, having all of the books and everything over the past 30 years makes it incredibly inaccessible to the new audiences they are hoping to bring in.
Once the new trilogy is hammered out I expect (and hope) to see a Disney series set in or just after that era. If you took the original trilogy as the only source text for Star Wars it would be pretty bare bones. The added joy is in the expanded universe.
There is also the possibility that they will do it as one of their side movies like Rogue One.
It's kinda the big reason I'm not into comics. Sometimes you just need a fresh jumping off point.
I just finished season 4 episode 14 of Clone Wars.
So, the season started off with an underwater adventure! I loved the aquatic planet story. The setting was really cool and seeing stuff like aquaclones and aquadroids was great fun, as well as the aquatic races getting to do their thing, even if it meant enduring Jar Jar.
This story was followed by... a Jar Jar story. Sigh. Ok. It wasn't hideous. Why is there so much torture in this show though?!
After that, we get some light and fluffy R2D2 / C3PO stories. Huh. Season 4 is a lot gentler than season 3 was.
Yeah... no.
The next arc is an absolutely brutal tale which sees the deaths of a messload of clone characters, and which finishes on a distinctly sour note, followed by a slavery arc which, while the overall story is pretty simple, takes casual violence to a whole new level as slaves are literally thrown away by their captors to prove a point or force someone else into submission. Oh, and there's lots more torture, because of course there is.
Episode 14? Oh that's just a one episode story in which Ahsoka decapitates four people in a single move!
Did nobody tell these people they were writing a cartoon?!
I just finished season 4 episode 14 of Clone Wars.
So, the season started off with an underwater adventure! I loved the aquatic planet story. The setting was really cool and seeing stuff like aquaclones and aquadroids was great fun, as well as the aquatic races getting to do their thing, even if it meant enduring Jar Jar.
This story was followed by... a Jar Jar story. Sigh. Ok. It wasn't hideous. Why is there so much torture in this show though?!
After that, we get some light and fluffy R2D2 / C3PO stories. Huh. Season 4 is a lot gentler than season 3 was.
Yeah... no.
The next arc is an absolutely brutal tale which sees the deaths of a messload of clone characters, and which finishes on a distinctly sour note, followed by a slavery arc which, while the overall story is pretty simple, takes casual violence to a whole new level as slaves are literally thrown away by their captors to prove a point or force someone else into submission. Oh, and there's lots more torture, because of course there is.
Episode 14? Oh that's just a one episode story in which Ahsoka decapitates four people in a single move!
Did nobody tell these people they were writing a cartoon?!
I just finished season 4 episode 14 of Clone Wars.
So, the season started off with an underwater adventure! I loved the aquatic planet story. The setting was really cool and seeing stuff like aquaclones and aquadroids was great fun, as well as the aquatic races getting to do their thing, even if it meant enduring Jar Jar.
This story was followed by... a Jar Jar story. Sigh. Ok. It wasn't hideous. Why is there so much torture in this show though?!
After that, we get some light and fluffy R2D2 / C3PO stories. Huh. Season 4 is a lot gentler than season 3 was.
Yeah... no.
The next arc is an absolutely brutal tale which sees the deaths of a messload of clone characters, and which finishes on a distinctly sour note, followed by a slavery arc which, while the overall story is pretty simple, takes casual violence to a whole new level as slaves are literally thrown away by their captors to prove a point or force someone else into submission. Oh, and there's lots more torture, because of course there is.
Episode 14? Oh that's just a one episode story in which Ahsoka decapitates four people in a single move!
Did nobody tell these people they were writing a cartoon?!
I really like that slaver arc, but you could tell it was kind of stuck by not allowing it to be Anakin's "I killed them all" moment.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
KoTor and 2 are still canon because it happens long before the current story that is why the online game can continue the story of it and not effect the ones in the movies
Afraid not.
Everything released prior to the 2014 canon purge is no longer canonical with the films no matter where in the internal chronology it sits, including KOTOR and SWTOR. They're now under the "Star Wars Legends" banner.
The earliest item in the current canon is Phantom Menace.
It seems pretty clear, at least to me, that Disney wants to write its own fiction for that era (apparently called the "Old Sith Wars") and not be beholden to an existing storyline (which includes the "canonical" path of KOTOR/KOTOR2).
It's not clear what they have in mind though. Obviously, 30 years after ANH is pretty damn different in the new media than the old one. 4,000 years before ANH could be a completely different than the circumstances that gave rise to Revan. Or they could be roughly the same, with new characters replacing old ones in a mirror-pattern. Seems like the literature leans more towards the former than the later.
The problem is that Revan is the main character of a game, which already occupied a slightly awkward (if awesomely entertaining) place in the lore. I kind of assume Disney doesn't want to commission two new Knights of the Old Republic games, which means importing Revan into the new storyline has to be handled differently. Thrawn, after all, is getting a book uncreatively called Thrawn. And it's hard to visualize Revan in anything but a central role in that era, basically Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-Droma--the bad and good guy in their own story--combined.
Or maybe Disney will prove me wrong and commission an entirely new game, or a series, that makes Revan a central figure of the era (it would be a convenient way to get rid of Exar Ku, etc.). Hell, they could even make Revan a little more interesting by going with the female rather than male Revan identity.
But I don't think the two beloved Bioware games, as they are, will be adopted full-stop--for the same reason the Thrawn Trilogy wasn't either. Even if KOTOR and its sequel don't have Han or Luke or Leia in it, they still references a pile of specific events and locations Disney probably doesn't care for.
Fun to speculate though.
Synthesis on
+1
Doctor DetroitNot a doctorTree townRegistered Userregular
I wonder how much is going to change in Thrawn's backstory. There's no serious continuity issues (off the top of my head) with anything leading up to ANH.
I wonder how much is going to change in Thrawn's backstory. There's no serious continuity issues (off the top of my head) with anything leading up to ANH.
Well, I can't imagine the Empire of the Hand still exists as it was described in the literature (or they'd have to explain what obliterated it before TFA).
The Chiss Ascendancy that exiled Thrawn in the first place might be problematic too, it's a large regional power that was autonomous from the Empire and didn't support the Rebellion. Thematically that clashes with the tendency towards removing all these little regional powers in the new literature, especially the neutral ones.
The Outbound Flight Project also sort of made Thrawn's new naval career, and the new writers might not like the idea of the project existing amid the prequel films. So there'd have to be some other catalyst for his commission into the Empire.
Three obvious things, but it's not like they wouldn't replace all three if convenient. Also, we know Thrawn's awesome career in TIE Fighter was dragged outside and shot in an alley along with the rest of that game, continuity-wise, so scrap that too.
I really like that slaver arc, but you could tell it was kind of stuck by not allowing it to be Anakin's "I killed them all" moment.
However, it did have Anakin force choking someone, which they pretty much slipped in there but which immediately struck me as kind of a big deal.
Honestly, Clone Wars is doing a far better job of showing Anakin slipping towards the Dark Side than the prequels ever did.
When I was watching it, I was kind of hoping that Anakin would murder the fuck out of a couple of slavers, admit it to the council and expect punishment... And then the council would say well we'll deal with it some other time, the separatists just invaded X shithole planet and we need your help there.
It would've been a pretty solid way to show how the jedi had fallen in the war and show both Anakin's growing dark side and his disgust with the council and the jedi.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
I really like that slaver arc, but you could tell it was kind of stuck by not allowing it to be Anakin's "I killed them all" moment.
However, it did have Anakin force choking someone, which they pretty much slipped in there but which immediately struck me as kind of a big deal.
Honestly, Clone Wars is doing a far better job of showing Anakin slipping towards the Dark Side than the prequels ever did.
When I was watching it, I was kind of hoping that Anakin would murder the fuck out of a couple of slavers, admit it to the council and expect punishment... And then the council would say well we'll deal with it some other time, the separatists just invaded X shithole planet and we need your help there.
It would've been a pretty solid way to show how the jedi had fallen in the war and show both Anakin's growing dark side and his disgust with the council and the jedi.
He threw two of them to their deaths at one point, didn't he?
I really like that slaver arc, but you could tell it was kind of stuck by not allowing it to be Anakin's "I killed them all" moment.
However, it did have Anakin force choking someone, which they pretty much slipped in there but which immediately struck me as kind of a big deal.
Honestly, Clone Wars is doing a far better job of showing Anakin slipping towards the Dark Side than the prequels ever did.
The episode when Ahsoka is buried in an explosion does a great job of actually showing us Anakin's problem with attachments and how it is a tragic flaw.
While racing light mechs, your Urbanmech comes in second place, but only because it ran out of ammo.
I really like that slaver arc, but you could tell it was kind of stuck by not allowing it to be Anakin's "I killed them all" moment.
However, it did have Anakin force choking someone, which they pretty much slipped in there but which immediately struck me as kind of a big deal.
Honestly, Clone Wars is doing a far better job of showing Anakin slipping towards the Dark Side than the prequels ever did.
The episode when Ahsoka is buried in an explosion does a great job of actually showing us Anakin's problem with attachments and how it is a tragic flaw.
Yesss, that episode was great, and attachment is something that crops up a lot in the show. I think my favourite example is the episode where R2D2 is missing presumed destroyed and Anakin is left trying to come up with convincing reasons why the Republic need to expend their already dangerously overstretched resources looking for some random Droid.
Hey nerds, just saw that Celebration is going to be in Orlando again. There were too many posts for me to read through to see if anybody has spread the word yet. Luckily that is kind of a day trip for me if I have to rush.
I'd really like if KOTOR (and by assosiation, TOR) became canon again.
Gotta have my HK meatbag references.
I really want them to hook chopper up to a voice modulator at some point and have him sound exactly like HK-47, including calling them meatbags, without explanation
not permanently of course, he'd need to go back to beeping and booping by the end of the episode
Posts
I will make a list of the good stuff that came from the dumpster fire that was the old Star Wars Expanded Universe.
-Thrawn
-Rogue Squadron
-Wraith Squadron
-Lt. Kettch
Enlist in Star Citizen! Citizenship must be earned!
I Jedi was especially bad in that regard.
Kyle Katarn and the cast of KOTOR, both of which are reflected in Rebels due to their popularity.
Kanan is Katarn light, without the edge of being a true mercenary. There's a lot of easter egg references to KOTOR in rebels too.
Also I hope Cad Bane comes back, because he's literally Angel Eyes from Good, Bad and the Ugly.
I mean, he gives Luke that "I've seen the dark side and it's not always some grand cosmic thing and I know what I'm doing" speech, which is what most people focus on, and then later on - Oops! Almost goes right over the edge without realizing it because the dark side IS seductive.
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
+TIE Fighter and Defender of the Empire.
That is all.
Penny Arcade Rockstar Social Club / This is why I despise cyclists
Gotta have my HK meatbag references.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Yeah as I reread the X-Wing Books the last time, like, I think the only one where Horn might have been a real Mary Sue was Isaard's Revenge. The rest of them he's consistently fucking up and being a bit of a dick (I mean, holy shit was he super wrong about Tycho multiple times). Like, not major fuck ups, but he's also in a goddamned uber-elite military group. If any of them are majorly fucking up they would have been in Wraith Squadron instead. Like, Stackpole still has a ton of issues, but Horn has definitely annoyed me less and less on rereads.
I really think it will continue to be incorporated in. Revan is too interesting of a character in Sith mythology to not be included in canon.
Enlist in Star Citizen! Citizenship must be earned!
Not going to stop me from hoping for Disney to greenlight a KotOR series once Rebels has run it's course.
I want KOTOR and KOTOR 2 fully brought back into canon as a whole.
TOR can exist on the ash heap of history.
Afraid not.
Everything released prior to the 2014 canon purge is no longer canonical with the films no matter where in the internal chronology it sits, including KOTOR and SWTOR. They're now under the "Star Wars Legends" banner.
The earliest item in the current canon is Phantom Menace.
Yeah, there used to be levels of Canon, where everything written was considered canon until something with a higher level of canon said it wasn't. IIRC, it went Movies/Radio broadcasts > TV Shows > Novels > Comics > Games.
But then Disney bought Star Wars, said "Nope, this is all confusing and stupid" and declared that only the movies, tv shows and novels from that point forward would be canon. Everything else is non-canon until it's brought into canon (like Thrawn), but authors can pick and choose from the "Legends" to bring stuff back into Canon.
There is also the possibility that they will do it as one of their side movies like Rogue One.
Penny Arcade Rockstar Social Club / This is why I despise cyclists
I reaffirm my belief that Chopper has been repaired with parts from a certain HK unit.
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
Actually, I thought all media is canon going forward. Including comics and games.
It's kinda the big reason I'm not into comics. Sometimes you just need a fresh jumping off point.
So, the season started off with an underwater adventure! I loved the aquatic planet story. The setting was really cool and seeing stuff like aquaclones and aquadroids was great fun, as well as the aquatic races getting to do their thing, even if it meant enduring Jar Jar.
This story was followed by... a Jar Jar story. Sigh. Ok. It wasn't hideous. Why is there so much torture in this show though?!
After that, we get some light and fluffy R2D2 / C3PO stories. Huh. Season 4 is a lot gentler than season 3 was.
Yeah... no.
The next arc is an absolutely brutal tale which sees the deaths of a messload of clone characters, and which finishes on a distinctly sour note, followed by a slavery arc which, while the overall story is pretty simple, takes casual violence to a whole new level as slaves are literally thrown away by their captors to prove a point or force someone else into submission. Oh, and there's lots more torture, because of course there is.
Episode 14? Oh that's just a one episode story in which Ahsoka decapitates four people in a single move!
Did nobody tell these people they were writing a cartoon?!
The serious episodes made Clone Wars amazing.
"Live to fight another day, boys!"
Me:
It seems pretty clear, at least to me, that Disney wants to write its own fiction for that era (apparently called the "Old Sith Wars") and not be beholden to an existing storyline (which includes the "canonical" path of KOTOR/KOTOR2).
It's not clear what they have in mind though. Obviously, 30 years after ANH is pretty damn different in the new media than the old one. 4,000 years before ANH could be a completely different than the circumstances that gave rise to Revan. Or they could be roughly the same, with new characters replacing old ones in a mirror-pattern. Seems like the literature leans more towards the former than the later.
The problem is that Revan is the main character of a game, which already occupied a slightly awkward (if awesomely entertaining) place in the lore. I kind of assume Disney doesn't want to commission two new Knights of the Old Republic games, which means importing Revan into the new storyline has to be handled differently. Thrawn, after all, is getting a book uncreatively called Thrawn. And it's hard to visualize Revan in anything but a central role in that era, basically Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-Droma--the bad and good guy in their own story--combined.
Or maybe Disney will prove me wrong and commission an entirely new game, or a series, that makes Revan a central figure of the era (it would be a convenient way to get rid of Exar Ku, etc.). Hell, they could even make Revan a little more interesting by going with the female rather than male Revan identity.
But I don't think the two beloved Bioware games, as they are, will be adopted full-stop--for the same reason the Thrawn Trilogy wasn't either. Even if KOTOR and its sequel don't have Han or Luke or Leia in it, they still references a pile of specific events and locations Disney probably doesn't care for.
Fun to speculate though.
Well, I can't imagine the Empire of the Hand still exists as it was described in the literature (or they'd have to explain what obliterated it before TFA).
The Chiss Ascendancy that exiled Thrawn in the first place might be problematic too, it's a large regional power that was autonomous from the Empire and didn't support the Rebellion. Thematically that clashes with the tendency towards removing all these little regional powers in the new literature, especially the neutral ones.
The Outbound Flight Project also sort of made Thrawn's new naval career, and the new writers might not like the idea of the project existing amid the prequel films. So there'd have to be some other catalyst for his commission into the Empire.
Three obvious things, but it's not like they wouldn't replace all three if convenient. Also, we know Thrawn's awesome career in TIE Fighter was dragged outside and shot in an alley along with the rest of that game, continuity-wise, so scrap that too.
However, it did have Anakin force choking someone, which they pretty much slipped in there but which immediately struck me as kind of a big deal.
Honestly, Clone Wars is doing a far better job of showing Anakin slipping towards the Dark Side than the prequels ever did.
When I was watching it, I was kind of hoping that Anakin would murder the fuck out of a couple of slavers, admit it to the council and expect punishment... And then the council would say well we'll deal with it some other time, the separatists just invaded X shithole planet and we need your help there.
It would've been a pretty solid way to show how the jedi had fallen in the war and show both Anakin's growing dark side and his disgust with the council and the jedi.
He threw two of them to their deaths at one point, didn't he?
The episode when Ahsoka is buried in an explosion does a great job of actually showing us Anakin's problem with attachments and how it is a tragic flaw.
Yesss, that episode was great, and attachment is something that crops up a lot in the show. I think my favourite example is the episode where R2D2 is missing presumed destroyed and Anakin is left trying to come up with convincing reasons why the Republic need to expend their already dangerously overstretched resources looking for some random Droid.
I really want them to hook chopper up to a voice modulator at some point and have him sound exactly like HK-47, including calling them meatbags, without explanation
not permanently of course, he'd need to go back to beeping and booping by the end of the episode