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The Grand Unified Thread for [Game of Thrones] (Book spoiler guidelines in OP)

24567114

Posts

  • DelmainDelmain Registered User regular
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Now that I can say it:

    I like the stuff I've been hearing about Jaime in the books more than the show.

    I don't read the books, but my friends have told me about it, and the idea of
    Jaime becoming a commander mopping up Stark remnants and the Brotherhood of banners while learning how to be a solid leader and realizing his skill with a sword isn't everything sounds way, way better than Jaime and Bronn's Bogus Journey in the show.

    On Jon
    Also, wasn't the reason that the Watch stabbed Jon in the books was that he went a little crazy with power and wanted to send brothers to fight the Boltons?

    Jon/book spoilers
    Basically, Jon receives a letter purported to be from Ramsay that's commonly referred to as "the pink letter". It's extremely inflammatory and very rude. It alleges that Ramsay demolished Stannis' army. It alleges that Jon Snow has stolen Ramsay's bride. It alleges that he's stolen Reek, too (they both jumped from the castle in the same way they did in the show, except it's not Sansa with Reek). The letter writer demands that he return them, as well as Selyse and Shrieen (who are not dead) and a couple other people under the Watch's protection. Ramsay threatens to march his forces to the wall and eat Jon's bastard heart if he doesn't turn them over.

    Based on the possibility that letter is accurate, Jon musters the watch for a volunteer mission to Winterfell. After that, something plays out basically the same as how he was stabbed in the show.
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Now that I can say it:

    I like the stuff I've been hearing about Jaime in the books more than the show.

    I don't read the books, but my friends have told me about it, and the idea of
    Jaime becoming a commander mopping up Stark remnants and the Brotherhood of banners while learning how to be a solid leader and realizing his skill with a sword isn't everything sounds way, way better than Jaime and Bronn's Bogus Journey in the show.

    On Jon
    Also, wasn't the reason that the Watch stabbed Jon in the books was that he went a little crazy with power and wanted to send brothers to fight the Boltons?

    Yup.

    Show/Book divergence spoilers:
    Jamie basically has to grow up. He's never really been in command before, he always just executed what his father told him to do. When it came down to actually make decisions instead of standing idly by he found out he was fairly good at it and the readers saw he has a sense of fairness and justice.

    The Dorne plot from the book is completely different and much less stupid on the face of it and doesn't involve Jamie at all.

    Jon decided to lead the Wildling army south so completely forsook his vows to the Watch. So yeah, wildly different than him having let some Wildlings through last week.

    These actually sound like much better reasons than the show had for that event. Really wish they could have used them.

    Also, is Jon's hair white in the books? Someone told me that and with his name "Snow" that sounds like dumb anime bullshit that I'm glad they changed for the show.
    I'm not getting into the Rhaegar and Lyanna thing though

    Snow is just the bastard name for the North (Ramsay was Ramsay Snow before he was made Ramsay Bolton last season).

    All the kingdoms have one

    North: Snow
    Vale: Stone
    Riverlands: Rivers
    Stormlands: Storm
    Dorne: Sand

    I'm forgetting what the others are at the moment, but it'sn ot his appearance.

    Westerlands: Hill
    Reach: Flowers
    Crownlands (also probably Dragonstone): Waters
    Iron Islands: Pyke

    syndalis wrote: »
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  • KadokenKadoken see what me tell you, seen Registered User regular
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Now that I can say it:

    I like the stuff I've been hearing about Jaime in the books more than the show.

    I don't read the books, but my friends have told me about it, and the idea of
    Jaime becoming a commander mopping up Stark remnants and the Brotherhood of banners while learning how to be a solid leader and realizing his skill with a sword isn't everything sounds way, way better than Jaime and Bronn's Bogus Journey in the show.

    On Jon
    Also, wasn't the reason that the Watch stabbed Jon in the books was that he went a little crazy with power and wanted to send brothers to fight the Boltons?

    Jon/book spoilers
    Basically, Jon receives a letter purported to be from Ramsay that's commonly referred to as "the pink letter". It's extremely inflammatory and very rude. It alleges that Ramsay demolished Stannis' army. It alleges that Jon Snow has stolen Ramsay's bride. It alleges that he's stolen Reek, too (they both jumped from the castle in the same way they did in the show, except it's not Sansa with Reek). The letter writer demands that he return them, as well as Selyse and Shrieen (who are not dead) and a couple other people under the Watch's protection. Ramsay threatens to march his forces to the wall and eat Jon's bastard heart if he doesn't turn them over.

    Based on the possibility that letter is accurate, Jon musters the watch for a volunteer mission to Winterfell. After that, something plays out basically the same as how he was stabbed in the show.
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Now that I can say it:

    I like the stuff I've been hearing about Jaime in the books more than the show.

    I don't read the books, but my friends have told me about it, and the idea of
    Jaime becoming a commander mopping up Stark remnants and the Brotherhood of banners while learning how to be a solid leader and realizing his skill with a sword isn't everything sounds way, way better than Jaime and Bronn's Bogus Journey in the show.

    On Jon
    Also, wasn't the reason that the Watch stabbed Jon in the books was that he went a little crazy with power and wanted to send brothers to fight the Boltons?

    Yup.

    Show/Book divergence spoilers:
    Jamie basically has to grow up. He's never really been in command before, he always just executed what his father told him to do. When it came down to actually make decisions instead of standing idly by he found out he was fairly good at it and the readers saw he has a sense of fairness and justice.

    The Dorne plot from the book is completely different and much less stupid on the face of it and doesn't involve Jamie at all.

    Jon decided to lead the Wildling army south so completely forsook his vows to the Watch. So yeah, wildly different than him having let some Wildlings through last week.

    These actually sound like much better reasons than the show had for that event. Really wish they could have used them.

    Also, is Jon's hair white in the books? Someone told me that and with his name "Snow" that sounds like dumb anime bullshit that I'm glad they changed for the show.
    I'm not getting into the Rhaegar and Lyanna thing though

    Snow is just the bastard name for the North (Ramsay was Ramsay Snow before he was made Ramsay Bolton last season).

    All the kingdoms have one

    North: Snow
    Vale: Stone
    Riverlands: Rivers
    Stormlands: Storm
    Dorne: Sand

    I'm forgetting what the others are at the moment, but it'sn ot his appearance.

    I know the bastard names and conventions.

    I am just saying that if GRRM had done that, which has not apparently, and it wasn't just a coincidence, it would look like dumb anime bullshit.

    I am going to shoot this mystery with my pistol of deduction -Sherlock Holmes (Scott Benson)
    Mine TTRPG blog http://darkheresychainsofmalice.blogspot.com/
    DelmainAManFromEarth
  • MulletudeMulletude Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Mulletude wrote: »
    Have only seen the show
    what are the odds Dany forges an alliance with dorne? What with Rhaegar and Ellia, and current events being what they are, it would make sense

    I would say this is on the level of plot rumor/spoilers for future seasons so it should be [][/]

    It should be what?

    Edit-do you mean i should mark stuff like that as speculation? I can do that if that's what you mean.

    Mulletude on
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  • IncindiumIncindium Registered User regular
    I actually enjoyed the Movie only thread as I'm a couple books behind... Since I can't not read spoilers I guess I need to catch up on the books.

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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Kit Harrington is pretty spot on to Jon's physical description in the books.

    Maybe they got confused with his Direwolf? Ghost is also pretty accurate to the books as well.

    Except in the book Ghost was also silent. The showrunners tried it but apparently the snarling CG direwolf looked really bad without sound.

    Future book speculation stuff. Ultra spoilers:
    I wonder if that's gonna be the sign that Jon was gone all warg-y into Ghost.

  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    Honestly I think we should have a spoiler free-for-all now. There are only a few pitiful spoilers left in the books that haven't been in the show, no big shockers. People who want to remain pure and unsullied for the books are going to have to avoid all GoT discussion from now on, and frankly, I don't think the books are going to go the same way as the show.

    Darkewolfe
  • LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »
    I think Book stannis was way better then Show stannis.

    Was book Stannis also a grammar nazi? Because that's his most appealing trait on the show

    CaptainPeacockWraith260
  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    Honestly I think we should have a spoiler free-for-all now. There are only a few pitiful spoilers left in the books that haven't been in the show, no big shockers. People who want to remain pure and unsullied for the books are going to have to avoid all GoT discussion from now on, and frankly, I don't think the books are going to go the same way as the show.

    I disagree. There are many things not in the show so far that are sort of major things that might show up later.

    DehumanizedCanadianWolverineJragghenLanlaornThorn413Peter Ebeljakobaggershoeboxjeddy
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Now that I can say it:

    I like the stuff I've been hearing about Jaime in the books more than the show.

    I don't read the books, but my friends have told me about it, and the idea of
    Jaime becoming a commander mopping up Stark remnants and the Brotherhood of banners while learning how to be a solid leader and realizing his skill with a sword isn't everything sounds way, way better than Jaime and Bronn's Bogus Journey in the show.

    On Jon
    Also, wasn't the reason that the Watch stabbed Jon in the books was that he went a little crazy with power and wanted to send brothers to fight the Boltons?

    Jon/book spoilers
    Basically, Jon receives a letter purported to be from Ramsay that's commonly referred to as "the pink letter". It's extremely inflammatory and very rude. It alleges that Ramsay demolished Stannis' army. It alleges that Jon Snow has stolen Ramsay's bride. It alleges that he's stolen Reek, too (they both jumped from the castle in the same way they did in the show, except it's not Sansa with Reek). The letter writer demands that he return them, as well as Selyse and Shrieen (who are not dead) and a couple other people under the Watch's protection. Ramsay threatens to march his forces to the wall and eat Jon's bastard heart if he doesn't turn them over.

    Based on the possibility that letter is accurate, Jon musters the watch for a volunteer mission to Winterfell. After that, something plays out basically the same as how he was stabbed in the show.
    Kadoken wrote: »
    Now that I can say it:

    I like the stuff I've been hearing about Jaime in the books more than the show.

    I don't read the books, but my friends have told me about it, and the idea of
    Jaime becoming a commander mopping up Stark remnants and the Brotherhood of banners while learning how to be a solid leader and realizing his skill with a sword isn't everything sounds way, way better than Jaime and Bronn's Bogus Journey in the show.

    On Jon
    Also, wasn't the reason that the Watch stabbed Jon in the books was that he went a little crazy with power and wanted to send brothers to fight the Boltons?

    Yup.

    Show/Book divergence spoilers:
    Jamie basically has to grow up. He's never really been in command before, he always just executed what his father told him to do. When it came down to actually make decisions instead of standing idly by he found out he was fairly good at it and the readers saw he has a sense of fairness and justice.

    The Dorne plot from the book is completely different and much less stupid on the face of it and doesn't involve Jamie at all.

    Jon decided to lead the Wildling army south so completely forsook his vows to the Watch. So yeah, wildly different than him having let some Wildlings through last week.

    These actually sound like much better reasons than the show had for that event. Really wish they could have used them.

    Also, is Jon's hair white in the books? Someone told me that and with his name "Snow" that sounds like dumb anime bullshit that I'm glad they changed for the show.
    I'm not getting into the Rhaegar and Lyanna thing though

    Snow is just the bastard name for the North (Ramsay was Ramsay Snow before he was made Ramsay Bolton last season).

    All the kingdoms have one

    North: Snow
    Vale: Stone
    Riverlands: Rivers
    Stormlands: Storm
    Dorne: Sand

    I'm forgetting what the others are at the moment, but it'sn ot his appearance.

    I know the bastard names and conventions.

    I am just saying that if GRRM had done that, which has not apparently, and it wasn't just a coincidence, it would look like dumb anime bullshit.

    Which reminds me, the Japanese covers for the game of thrones books are pretty interesting, its fun to see different artists take on the same character.

    For example we have very anime Jon Snow:

    asoiaf-jon-snow-full.jpg

    And not anime at all Jon Snow:

    asoiaf-jon-snow-ken-sugawara.jpg

    Also there will always be something magical to me about the Japanese dub of the show:

    ShadowenKadoken
  • RhahRhah Registered User regular
    So It Goes wrote: »
    Honestly I think we should have a spoiler free-for-all now. There are only a few pitiful spoilers left in the books that haven't been in the show, no big shockers. People who want to remain pure and unsullied for the books are going to have to avoid all GoT discussion from now on, and frankly, I don't think the books are going to go the same way as the show.

    I disagree. There are many things not in the show so far that are sort of major things that might show up later.

    You'd have to have some modicum of faith in D&D for that to happen. Not to mention it would somehow have to be written from scratch why they happen on a different timeline/pacing than originally in the books.

    Fat chance, I say.

    Shadowen
  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    Rhah wrote: »
    So It Goes wrote: »
    Honestly I think we should have a spoiler free-for-all now. There are only a few pitiful spoilers left in the books that haven't been in the show, no big shockers. People who want to remain pure and unsullied for the books are going to have to avoid all GoT discussion from now on, and frankly, I don't think the books are going to go the same way as the show.

    I disagree. There are many things not in the show so far that are sort of major things that might show up later.

    You'd have to have some modicum of faith in D&D for that to happen. Not to mention it would somehow have to be written from scratch why they happen on a different timeline/pacing than originally in the books.

    Fat chance, I say.

    still, no reason to spoil it for other people

  • DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    DasUberEdward on
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  • DehumanizedDehumanized Registered User regular
    So It Goes wrote: »
    Honestly I think we should have a spoiler free-for-all now. There are only a few pitiful spoilers left in the books that haven't been in the show, no big shockers. People who want to remain pure and unsullied for the books are going to have to avoid all GoT discussion from now on, and frankly, I don't think the books are going to go the same way as the show.

    I disagree. There are many things not in the show so far that are sort of major things that might show up later.

    Along with that, I feel spoiler tagging stuff helps compartmentalize the show/books as different things. It's not necessarily about shocking events, either. Parts of the story that haven't happened (or been rewritten to clearly no longer be necessary) might still be depicted on the show, and I think it'd be respectful to let people choose whether or not to see discussion related to those events.

    LostNinjaCanadianWolverineKana
  • MulletudeMulletude Registered User regular
    The show writers have an outline from grrm to work from, so there is a good chance the show could easily spoil the books the next season or two

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  • IncindiumIncindium Registered User regular
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

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  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    I would like to keep casting spoilers marked appropriately. I like to stay in the dark on the behind the scenes stuff.

    Whippy wrote: »
    nope nope nope nope abort abort talk about anime
    Torchlight | Steam | ART
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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    EddyDelmainSiskaJragghenshrykeLanlaornDasUberEdwardShadowenJuliusmcdermottadejaanApothe0sisBlendtecAtlas in ChainsjakobaggerWraith260Elvenshae
  • a5ehrena5ehren AtlantaRegistered User regular
    Doodmann wrote: »
    I would like to keep casting spoilers marked appropriately. I like to stay in the dark on the behind the scenes stuff.

    I agree, and I've read the books.

    DevoutlyApatheticArbitraryDescriptor
  • IncindiumIncindium Registered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    That actually seems to be in line with the TV thread opinion which seems to be that Season 5 is not as good as previous seasons in many ways.

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  • FakefauxFakefaux Cóiste Bodhar Driving John McCain to meet some Iraqis who'd very much like to make his acquaintanceRegistered User regular
    LostNinja wrote: »
    Gaddez wrote: »
    I think Book stannis was way better then Show stannis.

    Was book Stannis also a grammar nazi? Because that's his most appealing trait on the show


    He is. He's also got a lot of great deadpan snark in the books, which never really seemed to make it into the show for some reason. In general he's a much greyer character in the books; he still does horrible things, but his sympathetic attributes are much more pronounced.

    LanlaornShadowenElvenshae
  • DelmainDelmain Registered User regular
    a5ehren wrote: »
    Doodmann wrote: »
    I would like to keep casting spoilers marked appropriately. I like to stay in the dark on the behind the scenes stuff.

    I agree, and I've read the books.

    Yeah, this is pretty important I think.

    syndalis wrote: »
    Apple is a terrible company.
    LostNinja
  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Make. Time.
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  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    That actually seems to be in line with the TV thread opinion which seems to be that Season 5 is not as good as previous seasons in many ways.

    Season 5 was a dense rush of set-ups and piece moving. We saw so many new things in Season 5 but weren't allowed to just absorb them because they were gone in a heartbeat. Also, the entirety of the Dorne thing was just... fucking dumb.

    It was important, story-wise, but weak when it comes to the actual show.

    Make. Time.
    So It Goes
  • IncindiumIncindium Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    I quit reading the books because the TV show gave me all the pertinent bits without the boring slog... Also the show actually moves between multiple characters/sites in a single episode. The books sticking to a character/site for a massively long chapter that I don't like was one the reasons I haven't gotten back to rereading the books and catching up on them.

    And this is coming from someone who generally likes his fantasy novels the longer the better.

    Incindium on
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  • Sharp101Sharp101 TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Fakefaux wrote: »
    LostNinja wrote: »
    Gaddez wrote: »
    I think Book stannis was way better then Show stannis.

    Was book Stannis also a grammar nazi? Because that's his most appealing trait on the show


    He is. He's also got a lot of great deadpan snark in the books, which never really seemed to make it into the show for some reason. In general he's a much greyer character in the books; he still does horrible things, but his sympathetic attributes are much more pronounced.

    Another good example of the difference between show Stannis and book Stannis is this quote from the books from when he was stuck in the snow outside Winterfell:
    "Half my army is made up of unbelievers. I will have no burnings. Pray harder."

    Considering how it unfolds in the show, his reasons for not doing such in the book are pretty accurate. Smart guy that book!Stannis...


    edit: I also feel the need to mention how the show strips out so much of the nuance and hope the books have. Combine this with the showrunner's over reliance on coincidence and you are left with the show feeling both random and bleak. It's a real shame.

    Sharp101 on
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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Eh. The changes made in the early seasons were actually quite good. The Cersei/Robert conversation about their marriage? Nowhere in the books and it was excellent. This season has definitely felt different in regards to quality of the adaption.

    Most of the group recognize that some things are just unfilmable. That they want to avoid just shelving an actor/character for a season while they introduce a dozen new names nobody has heard about. The argument we're putting forward isn't that straying from the holy written word is a problem, it's that doing it poorly is a problem and the show has been doing it more and more poorly as the seasons have gone on.

    Like, there was genuine hope for the Jamie/Bronn Dorne Bro-ad trip. It could have gone great places. It did not. I'd love to hear what a show only person thinks the plot of that was.

    So It GoesGONG-00shrykeLanlaornBloodsheedShadowenForarAtlas in ChainsfugacityjakobaggerDarkewolfeWraith260Elvenshae
  • DehumanizedDehumanized Registered User regular
    I feel like the TV thread and books thread both had pretty similar opinions about the last couple seasons' overall quality, with maybe a bit more bitterness about it from the book thread. The adaptations/alterations that didn't work just as obviously didn't work if you hadn't read the books first. You could tell things like Yara Greyjoy's failed rescue of Reek or the Jaime/Bronn/Sand Snakes confrontation were shoddily conceived and executed just from looking at the high quality of all the parts of the show that did work in comparison.

    jungleroomxvaliance
  • ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    Honestly I think we should have a spoiler free-for-all now. There are only a few pitiful spoilers left in the books that haven't been in the show, no big shockers. People who want to remain pure and unsullied for the books are going to have to avoid all GoT discussion from now on, and frankly, I don't think the books are going to go the same way as the show.

    Nah, that's a terrible idea.

    smCQ5WE.jpg
    JragghenApothe0sisshoeboxjeddy
  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Eh. The changes made in the early seasons were actually quite good. The Cersei/Robert conversation about their marriage? Nowhere in the books and it was excellent. This season has definitely felt different in regards to quality of the adaption.

    Most of the group recognize that some things are just unfilmable. That they want to avoid just shelving an actor/character for a season while they introduce a dozen new names nobody has heard about. The argument we're putting forward isn't that straying from the holy written word is a problem, it's that doing it poorly is a problem and the show has been doing it more and more poorly as the seasons have gone on.

    Like, there was genuine hope for the Jamie/Bronn Dorne Bro-ad trip. It could have gone great places. It did not. I'd love to hear what a show only person thinks the plot of that was.

    As a show-only person, I found all the seasons continually stronger up until 5. I've never read the books but I felt the weight of the series just increase until this latest season.

    The point of the Dorne trip? There was no point. It was a poorly executed thing. It wouldn't have been so bad if OH THE DISASTER had never been written in there, but there it is. I felt like they could've gotten rid of the entire plotline and just replaced it with Tyrion and Dany waxing political and I would've been as happy as a pig in shit.

    Make. Time.
    JuliusKadoken
  • FakefauxFakefaux Cóiste Bodhar Driving John McCain to meet some Iraqis who'd very much like to make his acquaintanceRegistered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    It's a little more complex than that. Yes, books generally are better because they have more room to develop ideas and let you exercise your imagination. But the show has made changes to characters and plot that are deeply puzzling to many people who have read the books, as they seem like poor choices and the need for them is not obvious. It's quite possible there was a need for them. We often don't know the exact limitations of casting, budget and time that the show has. We are not privy to the discussions in their writers room, where they try to hash out how to adapt these very complicated books plots, nor are we privy to the conversations they have with GRRM about what he has planned for the future.

    And the show does sometimes improve on things. There are a number of scenes in the show, especially in the first season, that aren't present in the books, and are very, very good. This scene, between Cersei and King Robert, is fantastic, as it gives insight into the relationship between the two character that we don't really get to see in the novels:



    It's not simple snobbery because of the different mediums. It's confusion over a lack of understanding of why certain changes where made (or a very cynical interpretation of why they may have been made) that leads to disappointment and anger. That said, this absolutely should not overwhelm the thread, and I think extended digressions where people argue about this should perhaps be confined to spoilers.

    Fakefaux on
    Geth
  • ButcherButcher Registered User regular
    This is going to be a clusterfuck, IMO keeping two separate threads is better.

    shrykeLanlaornBloodySlothAtlas in Chainsbficky
  • Sharp101Sharp101 TorontoRegistered User regular
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Eh. The changes made in the early seasons were actually quite good. The Cersei/Robert conversation about their marriage? Nowhere in the books and it was excellent. This season has definitely felt different in regards to quality of the adaption.

    Most of the group recognize that some things are just unfilmable. That they want to avoid just shelving an actor/character for a season while they introduce a dozen new names nobody has heard about. The argument we're putting forward isn't that straying from the holy written word is a problem, it's that doing it poorly is a problem and the show has been doing it more and more poorly as the seasons have gone on.

    Like, there was genuine hope for the Jamie/Bronn Dorne Bro-ad trip. It could have gone great places. It did not. I'd love to hear what a show only person thinks the plot of that was.

    As a show-only person, I found all the seasons continually stronger up until 5. I've never read the books but I felt the weight of the series just increase until this latest season.

    The point of the Dorne trip? There was no point. It was a poorly executed thing. It wouldn't have been so bad if OH THE DISASTER had never been written in there, but there it is. I felt like they could've gotten rid of the entire plotline and just replaced it with Tyrion and Dany waxing political and I would've been as happy as a pig in shit.

    I'm so happy most show watchers picked up on this. That whole plotline was made up and was so terrible and unnecessary. Top to bottom just a mess.

    jefe414ShadowenKadokenBlendtecWraith260
  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    I know it's been said, but listening to Tyrion and Varys speaking to each other is ear candy. It's a delight. It's one of the best parts of the show.

    Make. Time.
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  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Sharp101 wrote: »
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Eh. The changes made in the early seasons were actually quite good. The Cersei/Robert conversation about their marriage? Nowhere in the books and it was excellent. This season has definitely felt different in regards to quality of the adaption.

    Most of the group recognize that some things are just unfilmable. That they want to avoid just shelving an actor/character for a season while they introduce a dozen new names nobody has heard about. The argument we're putting forward isn't that straying from the holy written word is a problem, it's that doing it poorly is a problem and the show has been doing it more and more poorly as the seasons have gone on.

    Like, there was genuine hope for the Jamie/Bronn Dorne Bro-ad trip. It could have gone great places. It did not. I'd love to hear what a show only person thinks the plot of that was.

    As a show-only person, I found all the seasons continually stronger up until 5. I've never read the books but I felt the weight of the series just increase until this latest season.

    The point of the Dorne trip? There was no point. It was a poorly executed thing. It wouldn't have been so bad if OH THE DISASTER had never been written in there, but there it is. I felt like they could've gotten rid of the entire plotline and just replaced it with Tyrion and Dany waxing political and I would've been as happy as a pig in shit.

    I'm so happy most show watchers picked up on this. That whole plotline was made up and was so terrible and unnecessary. Top to bottom just a mess.

    I kind of wish they had done it off-screen. Or not done it at all.

    Compare that to Arya's fumbling around, which I loved a lot. It shows she's still a little girl, despite her advanced maturity. Also, Maisie Williams is an incredible actress. Her scene with The Hound at the end of the last season, where she just stared, was a minor masterwork from this young lady. She's 18 in real-life, and it's crazy how well she pulls off being much younger.

    jungleroomx on
    Make. Time.
    Elvenshae
  • IncindiumIncindium Registered User regular
    I know it's been said, but listening to Tyrion and Varys speaking to each other is ear candy. It's a delight. It's one of the best parts of the show.

    Yeah the two of them meeting back up was the highlight of the season 5 finale.

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  • Sharp101Sharp101 TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Sharp101 wrote: »
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Eh. The changes made in the early seasons were actually quite good. The Cersei/Robert conversation about their marriage? Nowhere in the books and it was excellent. This season has definitely felt different in regards to quality of the adaption.

    Most of the group recognize that some things are just unfilmable. That they want to avoid just shelving an actor/character for a season while they introduce a dozen new names nobody has heard about. The argument we're putting forward isn't that straying from the holy written word is a problem, it's that doing it poorly is a problem and the show has been doing it more and more poorly as the seasons have gone on.

    Like, there was genuine hope for the Jamie/Bronn Dorne Bro-ad trip. It could have gone great places. It did not. I'd love to hear what a show only person thinks the plot of that was.

    As a show-only person, I found all the seasons continually stronger up until 5. I've never read the books but I felt the weight of the series just increase until this latest season.

    The point of the Dorne trip? There was no point. It was a poorly executed thing. It wouldn't have been so bad if OH THE DISASTER had never been written in there, but there it is. I felt like they could've gotten rid of the entire plotline and just replaced it with Tyrion and Dany waxing political and I would've been as happy as a pig in shit.

    I'm so happy most show watchers picked up on this. That whole plotline was made up and was so terrible and unnecessary. Top to bottom just a mess.

    I kind of wish they had done it off-screen. Or not done it at all.

    Compare that to Arya's fumbling around, which I loved a lot. It shows she's still a little girl, despite her advanced maturity. Also, Maisie Williams is an incredible actress. Her scene with The Hound at the end of the last season, where she just stared, was a minor masterwork from this young lady. She's 18 in real-life, and it's crazy how well she pulls off being much younger.

    The worst part is what was cut to have Jamie fumble around in Dorne. What we could have had instead would have been similar in tone to his journey with Brienne, something that causes actual character growth. (no details in case we still get that in future seasons)

    Instead we get him bumbling around in the sand with one coincidence after another. Yay.

    Sharp101 on
    DelmainLanlaornShadowenDisrupter
  • GONG-00GONG-00 Registered User regular
    It feels like we were generally fine with stuff like Tywin instead of Roose at Harrenhal, Blackwater changed for obvious budgetary reasons, Barristan not hiding his identity from Dany, and Arya killing Trant in place of a Night's Watch deserter. It's those changes for changes sake that alter the essence of a character like Stannis that irked quite a few of us.

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  • SiskaSiska Shorty Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Aaand I've been dying to say this (for years) I don't understand why Sean Bean didn't wear a wig or dye his hair. Eddard was suppose to be dark haired, like Arya, Jon and Benjen.

    Siska on
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  • jungleroomxjungleroomx And I said, hol up Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Sharp101 wrote: »
    Sharp101 wrote: »
    Incindium wrote: »
    Oh man. The one thing I noticed after comparing the two threads.

    Is that there is a massive difference in opinion about the quality of the show between book readers and television viewers.

    This will be interesting.

    Could you expound on that? I have read the TV thread but not the book thread at all.

    There is a very vocal group that is not terribly pleased with the alterations the show has made this season. Practically none of them were positive compared to the book storylines.

    It's easier to say something is stupid when you have a better way laid out for you right over there.

    I've heard there were some positive changes in the shows from the books.

    But yes, they're different mediums and books are often superior because your imagination allows things to be as epic, scary, beautiful, bleak, or happy as you'd like given the words.

    I'd almost hope to see a minimum of book snobbery here. I'm guilty of it as much as anyone else, but if we're going to go the route of Printed Word Master Race it'll probably end up detracting from the thread as a whole.

    Would it be at all possible to declare, right now, that Books Are Almost Always Better as a universally known fact for everyone here so we don't have to slog through pages of it?

    Eh. The changes made in the early seasons were actually quite good. The Cersei/Robert conversation about their marriage? Nowhere in the books and it was excellent. This season has definitely felt different in regards to quality of the adaption.

    Most of the group recognize that some things are just unfilmable. That they want to avoid just shelving an actor/character for a season while they introduce a dozen new names nobody has heard about. The argument we're putting forward isn't that straying from the holy written word is a problem, it's that doing it poorly is a problem and the show has been doing it more and more poorly as the seasons have gone on.

    Like, there was genuine hope for the Jamie/Bronn Dorne Bro-ad trip. It could have gone great places. It did not. I'd love to hear what a show only person thinks the plot of that was.

    As a show-only person, I found all the seasons continually stronger up until 5. I've never read the books but I felt the weight of the series just increase until this latest season.

    The point of the Dorne trip? There was no point. It was a poorly executed thing. It wouldn't have been so bad if OH THE DISASTER had never been written in there, but there it is. I felt like they could've gotten rid of the entire plotline and just replaced it with Tyrion and Dany waxing political and I would've been as happy as a pig in shit.

    I'm so happy most show watchers picked up on this. That whole plotline was made up and was so terrible and unnecessary. Top to bottom just a mess.

    I kind of wish they had done it off-screen. Or not done it at all.

    Compare that to Arya's fumbling around, which I loved a lot. It shows she's still a little girl, despite her advanced maturity. Also, Maisie Williams is an incredible actress. Her scene with The Hound at the end of the last season, where she just stared, was a minor masterwork from this young lady. She's 18 in real-life, and it's crazy how well she pulls off being much younger.

    The worst part is what was cut to have Jamie fumble around in Dorne. What we could have had instead would have been similar in tone to his journey with Brienne, something that causes actual character growth. (no details in case we still get that in future seasons)

    Instead we get him bumbling around in the sand with one coincidence after another. Yay.

    I have to say I laughed out loud when they showed what the prince's "condition" was for Bronn's release.

    jungleroomx on
    Make. Time.
    ForarWraith260
  • RhalloTonnyRhalloTonny Of the BrownlandsRegistered User regular
    Butcher wrote: »
    This is going to be a clusterfuck, IMO keeping two separate threads is better.

    chaos is a ladduh

    !
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This discussion has been closed.