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[TV]BINGPOT!

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    DJ EebsDJ Eebs Moderator, Administrator admin
    One of the biggest complaints about how Lost ended was that "they didn't solve any mysteries," and that the producers' insistence that the show was always about character was stupid. But it was 100% always about the characters. The mysteries were absolutely intriguing, and the show wouldn't have become what it did without them, but the show was special because they grounded everything in character.

    Think of the biggest twists in that show, the biggest reveals. Think of the craziest sci-fi stuff they threw out there. How many of those moments are irrevocably tied to some terrific character moment? One of the best episode closers the show had was someone asking for milk. And, with a few exceptions, because the show definitely wasn't perfect, they sent characters out of the show with purpose, rather than just as a way to bring home another shocking twist (and the final season even found ways to get closure for some of their fuck ups). The show worked because it worked to make the characters as human as they could make them, even the villains.

    There were plenty of shows that attempted to ape that formula. Most of them aired right after Lost on ABC, and were mostly forgettable. Heroes was probably the most successful attempt at being "the next Lost," but it was also the show that most obviously learned the wrong lessons. It was hell-bent on "solving its mysteries and answering questions," because most Lost complaints at the time were about "when am I going to find out the answer." I'm sure people who actively watch Westworld are aware of that phenomena, since it kicked in like, two episodes in. But Heroes forgot to build compelling mysteries. It spent half its time on ponderous voice-overs about "what it all means," without bothering to have anything mean anything. It had boring characters who did what the plot demanded. Its best episode, about its best character, was essentially structured like a Lost episode, where you learn exactly how a character became who they became as their actions in the present show the totality of who they are. (I'm talking about Company Man).

    I'll drop a brief note on the 100 here, by focusing on two episodes that kind of have similar...ideas, I guess, and that illustrate why season two of that show worked and why season three of that show absolutely didn't. I'll put these in spoiler tags, but I'm talking about Spacewalker from Season 2 and Thirteen from Season 3.
    These episodes were the big turning points of their respective seasons. They reshape the rest of the season, and bring everything into focus. They feature extensive flashbacks. They end with the deaths of Clarke's love interest.

    Spacewalker, throughout, is about Finn. About who he is, what he's done, what he means to the people who love him. The flashbacks show who he was before, before they fought in a war, before he got changed by all of the awful things around him, before he tried to murder a village. The entire episode is about trying to stave off what needs to happen, which is that he has to face justice for what he did. Everything there is built on the characters. The people who love him, risking a war to save him. Him turning himself in to save everyone, to own up to what he did. Clarke making a decision to kill him to save him from torture. It works because everything in the episode builds to the end of it. It works because it's earned, and even though Finn wasn't exactly my favorite character in the show, it makes him human enough to care, and it shows the very real impact he's had on characters we do care about.

    Thirteen is one of the more focused episodes of a season that was already muddled and riddled with poor storytelling choices, (their half-assed heel turn for Bellamy is some of the worst character work the show had ever done), but the episode is at war with itself, and in the end, the episode fails because the wrong half of it ultimately wins. Like Spacewalker, the episode is building to a major character death. But unlike Spacewalker, the episode isn't about Lexa. It's about the larger plot of the show. It's about the chip in Lexa's neck. It spends time with Clark and Lexa, yes, and it let's them have a moment, but the end of that episode isn't focused on the grief of the characters. The body's not even cold before someone is slicing in and revealing a new mystery.

    Like...just structurally, flashbacks are meant to bring home the point of an episode. Let's look at an episode of Lost as an example: Walkabout is about John Locke, and why he's the way he is on the island. The shocking reveal that he was paralyzed before he came to the island is the biggest takeaway from the episode, but what makes it work is that we see his frustration continue to build and build and build before we see why he's frustrated and angry, and we understand more of who he is now. This episode of the 100 spends its flashbacks on the history of characters we'd barely met, who have only tenuous connections to the characters we care about. They aren't about Lexa, who dies because the plot demands that she die so we can see the chip in her neck, which is the point of those flashbacks. She dies because of a stray bullet, because it needed to be shocking. It's a fundamental failure to understand what made the show work, and it's emblematic of what made the third season of the show such a tremendous disappointment.

    I know this is muddled, because I didn't exactly wake up with the idea that I was going to be writing an essay this morning, but what made Lost work is that it made everything, even its mysteries, revolve around its characters, and let those characters push back and grow and change and have closure, and shows that claim Lost as an influence failed when they forget to place its characters at the center of what's happening. The best mystery in the world doesn't mean shit if you don't ground it in humanity.

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    Raijin QuickfootRaijin Quickfoot I'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    NOT PENNY'S BOAT

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    AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    NOT PENNY'S BOAT

    And now i'm super sad again. Even after 10 years.

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    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    NOT PENNY'S BOAT

    And now i'm super sad again. Even after 10 years.
    You almost gave me a heart attack, Happy Endings is only 5 years old!

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    Raijin QuickfootRaijin Quickfoot I'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Any opinions on The Mick? I love Kaitlyn Olsen but the commercials just don't look great.

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    masterofmetroidmasterofmetroid Have you ever looked at a world and seen it as a kind of challenge?Registered User regular
    The biggest crime ever perpetuated on Lost's legacy is that i still can't watch another prime time TV show that gives it's character's time to be actual people

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    Rorshach KringleRorshach Kringle that crustache life Registered User regular
    Any opinions on The Mick? I love Kaitlyn Olsen but the commercials just don't look great.

    can't have an opinion until i see it, but i do not have high hopes

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    Raijin QuickfootRaijin Quickfoot I'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    The 100 is a great example of how to take an excellent show and ruin it.

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    SorceSorce Not ThereRegistered User regular
    Last Man on Earth
    Welp, I guess it's time to say goodbye to Gail.

    sig.gif
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    Raijin QuickfootRaijin Quickfoot I'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Any opinions on The Mick? I love Kaitlyn Olsen but the commercials just don't look great.

    can't have an opinion until i see it, but i do not have high hopes

    That's kind of what I meant. If anyone had heard anything positive or negative.

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    Grey GhostGrey Ghost Registered User regular
    The 100 is a great example of how to take an excellent idea for a show and then never do anything good with it at any point

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    SorceSorce Not ThereRegistered User regular
    Grey Ghost wrote: »
    The 100 is a great example of how to take an excellent idea for a show and then never do anything good with it at any point
    k0kr0qybk0r4.gif

    sig.gif
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    StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    The best things in The 100 get consistently ignored

    Gross deer! Giant snake monster! Weird glowing fungi!

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    SomestickguySomestickguy Registered User regular
    Sorce wrote: »
    Grey Ghost wrote: »
    The 100 is a great example of how to take an excellent idea for a show and then never do anything good with it at any point
    k0kr0qybk0r4.gif

    That's a very useful gif

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    Mr. GMr. G Registered User regular
    So the SNL appearance was actually leading to something, as Netflix just announced today that they've signed Dave Chappelle to make 3 brand-new stand-up specials for them

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    JimothyJimothy Not in front of the fox he's with the owlRegistered User regular
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    JimothyJimothy Not in front of the fox he's with the owlRegistered User regular
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Jimothy wrote: »
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

    Such a good show that no one watches. It was lucky to get two seasons.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    Grey GhostGrey Ghost Registered User regular
    I have never baited anyone in my life

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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    Mr. G wrote: »
    So the SNL appearance was actually leading to something, as Netflix just announced today that they've signed Dave Chappelle to make 3 brand-new stand-up specials for them

    Chappelle referred to his hosting of SNL as a sort of comeback, so it seemed pretty clear that he's decided to get back into doing more than just a bit of comedy club standup. That's cool he's doing some specials for netflix.

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    Mr. GMr. G Registered User regular
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kN2O5jW7mWw&feature=youtu.be
    I like everybody on this show a great deal but I think we need a moratorium on "shows about comedians and their lives!" for a few years

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    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    Grey Ghost wrote: »
    I have never baited anyone in my life
    Pretty sure you 'bate yourself frequently

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    Raijin QuickfootRaijin Quickfoot I'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Finished season 1 of Happy Endings. Amazing but the weird out of order episodes at the end were really weird and threw me out of it a little.

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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    Mr. G wrote: »
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kN2O5jW7mWw&feature=youtu.be
    I like everybody on this show a great deal but I think we need a moratorium on "shows about comedians and their lives!" for a few years

    That's what you get when you give comedians development deals, and if we're getting Louie, Maron, Legit, etc. out of it then I'm cool with it.

    We'll just pretend Mulaney didn't happen and wait until he gets a shot on a better network.

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    scherbchenscherbchen Asgard (it is dead)Registered User regular
    would you rate season 1 as a-mah-zing?

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    PoorochondriacPoorochondriac Ah, man Ah, jeezRegistered User regular
    Finished season 1 of Happy Endings. Amazing but the weird out of order episodes at the end were really weird and threw me out of it a little.

    Season one is by far the weakest, so you are in for quite the ride!

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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    Preacher wrote: »
    Jimothy wrote: »
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

    Such a good show that no one watches. It was lucky to get two seasons.

    I'd watch it if it weren't on some obscure network and not available anywhere else

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    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    CW ain't really an obscure network

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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Jimothy wrote: »
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

    Such a good show that no one watches. It was lucky to get two seasons.

    I'd watch it if it weren't on some obscure network and not available anywhere else

    Doesn't help it, but its not the shows fault. Originally it was a showtime pilot but they passed and only CW was willing.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    OmnipotentBagelOmnipotentBagel floof Registered User regular
    Finished season 1 of Happy Endings. Amazing but the weird out of order episodes at the end were really weird and threw me out of it a little.

    I really liked the dynamic Alex and Dave developed as that season went on, so suddenly reverting to them being weird around each other toward the end was really frustrating. It's so rare for television to show a casual, comfortable friendship between two characters with a romantic history.

    cdci44qazyo3.gif

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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Jimothy wrote: »
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

    Such a good show that no one watches. It was lucky to get two seasons.

    I can't watch CEGF because I have extreme sympathetic embarrassment. It's too much for me.

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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Jimothy wrote: »
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

    Such a good show that no one watches. It was lucky to get two seasons.

    I can't watch CEGF because I have extreme sympathetic embarrassment. It's too much for me.

    It can be hard to watch like that, but at the same time Rebecca is so earnest in ignoring the mortifying things she does, so it makes it easier.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    MaximumMaximum Registered User regular
    edited November 2016
    I started watching Goliath last night, and I wanted to like it because I love me some Billy Bob.

    But it is not good.

    On the plus side I got to see what Alex from Lost looks like now, and Oh My God.

    Maximum on
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    OldSlackerOldSlacker Registered User regular
    Jimothy wrote: »
    Hey I started Crazy Ex-Girlfriend the other day and now I'm caught up and I am so in love with this show let's talk about it

    Now go on to Rachel Bloom's Youtube page and watch all the songs uncensored.

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    scherbchenscherbchen Asgard (it is dead)Registered User regular
    so, I have a guilty pleasure.

    it is called Pitch

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    WiseManTobesWiseManTobes Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Grey Ghost wrote: »
    I have never baited anyone in my life
    Pretty sure you 'bate yourself frequently

    I thought you promised to remove the cameras

    Steam! Battlenet:Wisemantobes#1508
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    Raijin QuickfootRaijin Quickfoot I'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    scherbchen wrote: »
    so, I have a guilty pleasure.

    it is called Pitch

    Yeah, I really enjoy it.

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    ZonugalZonugal (He/Him) The Holiday Armadillo I'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered User regular
    Mr. G wrote: »
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kN2O5jW7mWw&feature=youtu.be
    I like everybody on this show a great deal but I think we need a moratorium on "shows about comedians and their lives!" for a few years

    Yeah, but I really like Pete Holmes so this project is okay.

    Ross-Geller-Prime-Sig-A.jpg
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    JimothyJimothy Not in front of the fox he's with the owlRegistered User regular
    scherbchen wrote: »
    so, I have a guilty pleasure.

    it is called Pitch

    Guilty? Sepinwall makes that sound like it's one of the stronger new shows this year

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    Rorshach KringleRorshach Kringle that crustache life Registered User regular
    yo if ya'll ain't on that search party tip

    you really need to get on that search party tip

    the whole season is on demand on tbs right now

    it's fucking great

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