There's basically no doubt in my mind that something like the allegations is true. Everything Trump does wrt Russia confirms it.
What, you mean like
Tillerson
Refusing to bad mouth Russia or putin and waiting far too long to say Russia was behind the hacks
Goibg so far as to lie about their actions in Crimea
Saying four years ago that he was close with putin
His son saying eight years ago that the family business had a lot of money coming from Russia
Being in Moscow for miss universe 2013
There's basically no doubt in my mind that something like the allegations is true. Everything Trump does wrt Russia confirms it.
What, you mean like
Tillerson
Refusing to bad mouth Russia or putin and waiting far too long to say Russia was behind the hacks
Goibg so far as to lie about their actions in Crimea
Saying four years ago that he was close with putin
His son saying eight years ago that the family business had a lot of money coming from Russia
Being in Moscow for miss universe 2013
Or is it something else?
Flynn is being chummy with Putin at parties. I'm sure there were other flunkies he's hired who are friendly to Russia, too.
Why won't he just say the words? We know from ISIS that just saying the right magical words clears up the problem. Hell, I have it on good authority (he's going to be a president) that saying the right words is like 90% of the solution, and this comes from someone who has the best words!
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
There's basically no doubt in my mind that something like the allegations is true. Everything Trump does wrt Russia confirms it.
What, you mean like
Tillerson
Refusing to bad mouth Russia or putin and waiting far too long to say Russia was behind the hacks
Goibg so far as to lie about their actions in Crimea
Saying four years ago that he was close with putin
His son saying eight years ago that the family business had a lot of money coming from Russia
Being in Moscow for miss universe 2013
Or is it something else?
You forgot him saying "These allegations aren't true, Russia told me so".
There's basically no doubt in my mind that something like the allegations is true. Everything Trump does wrt Russia confirms it.
What, you mean like
Tillerson
Refusing to bad mouth Russia or putin and waiting far too long to say Russia was behind the hacks
Goibg so far as to lie about their actions in Crimea
Saying four years ago that he was close with putin
His son saying eight years ago that the family business had a lot of money coming from Russia
Being in Moscow for miss universe 2013
Or is it something else?
You forgot him saying "These allegations aren't true, Russia told me so".
Taking the Ukraine stuff out of the Republican platform... as literally the only input he had.
+10
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ElJeffeRoaming the streets, waving his mod gun around.Moderator, ClubPAMod Emeritus
edited January 2017
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
ElJeffe on
I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
IMO, most of what would (and may be) protect(ing) Putin is Trump's automatic denial - possibly even to himself, depending on just how deep his narcissism goes - that he is not 100% responsible for his own successes, his own wins, which are of course bigger than anyone's. Hint, imply or outright state that he only got where he is because of other people and he'll shout even louder, "Nuh uh!"
Or, even simpler - if he is a puppet, has realized he's a puppet, he can't ever admit it, because that would mean that Putin is above him, pulling his strings. And again, his ego can't allow that.
If Putin is conspiring with Trump, it'll be in a "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" sort of way, rather than Putin making a big list of demands.
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
There's basically no doubt in my mind that something like the allegations is true. Everything Trump does wrt Russia confirms it.
What, you mean like
Tillerson
Refusing to bad mouth Russia or putin and waiting far too long to say Russia was behind the hacks
Goibg so far as to lie about their actions in Crimea
Saying four years ago that he was close with putin
His son saying eight years ago that the family business had a lot of money coming from Russia
Being in Moscow for miss universe 2013
Or is it something else?
Flynn is being chummy with Putin at parties. I'm sure there were other flunkies he's hired who are friendly to Russia, too.
Also Manafort. and the Poroschenko ... was it called the black folder?
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I think this has been mentioned before on one of these threads but it bears mentioning again here:
In the press conference, Trump talked about the two billion he'd been offered by one "Hussain Damac." The problem is, there is no "Hussain Damac." Hussain Sajwani is in charge of the company called "DAMAC." If you watch the tape of the press conference, you can see the weird pause where Trump realizes he can't remember the guy's last name.
Now, assuming that this two billion dollar offer actually happened (which it almost certainly didn't), it illustrates a key point: two billion dollars isn't a big enough offer for Donald Trump to remember what your last name is.
This may be the sole remaining silver lining: that Donald Trump is too scatterbrained and incompetent to be reliably bribed or blackmailed.
+1
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VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
+3
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TraceGNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam WeRegistered Userregular
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
Surely Taiwan?
Russia wants to grab a few countries that used to belong to it, too.
0
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TraceGNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam WeRegistered Userregular
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
Surely Taiwan?
Russia wants to grab a few countries that used to belong to it, too.
Russia has to deal with the fact that every single aggression it carries out anywhere -near- Europe is going to face giant backlashes from any countries near it. As scary as it sounds even I don't think Putin is very eager to take on the Scandinavian countries along with the Baltic States, Poland and a -super- pissed off Ukraine.
I'm pretty sure "kick in the doors and the whole rotting structure will come crashing down" might actually be more meaningful today than it was during Hitler's time and a great big nasty land war would probably do just that when combined with the sanctions the rest of the world would probably slap it with. And the US too if we decide to continue to ship shit to Russia while this was going on.
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
Vietnam has a long history of being ruled by outside forces and seething over being so ruled.
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
Vietnam has a long history of being ruled by outside forces and seething over being so ruled.
There is a reason why worries over Vietnam voluntarily being ruled by China because both were Communist was utterly ridiculous.
+1
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DynagripBreak me a million heartsHoustonRegistered User, ClubPAregular
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I think this has been mentioned before on one of these threads but it bears mentioning again here:
In the press conference, Trump talked about the two billion he'd been offered by one "Hussain Damac." The problem is, there is no "Hussain Damac." Hussain Sajwani is in charge of the company called "DAMAC." If you watch the tape of the press conference, you can see the weird pause where Trump realizes he can't remember the guy's last name.
Now, assuming that this two billion dollar offer actually happened (which it almost certainly didn't), it illustrates a key point: two billion dollars isn't a big enough offer for Donald Trump to remember what your last name is.
This may be the sole remaining silver lining: that Donald Trump is too scatterbrained and incompetent to be reliably bribed or blackmailed.
or he has his mind set on pillaging the world for a trillion dollars.
@Giggles_Funsworth what do you think about this tweetstorm analyzing the credibility of Crowdstrike's analysis? http://electionado.com/canvas/1484508008585 It looks fairly convincing to me, but I don't really have the background to know about how credulous it is.
@Giggles_Funsworth what do you think about this tweetstorm analyzing the credibility of Crowdstrike's analysis? http://electionado.com/canvas/1484508008585 It looks fairly convincing to me, but I don't really have the background to know about how credulous it is.
That that guy needs to write a blog.
And that I've always been of the opinion that Crowdstrike was doing respectable work. It definitely looks like Russia. Which could also be somebody that wants it to look like Russia, in theory. Probably not though.
+4
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HakkekageSpace Whore Academysumma cum laudeRegistered Userregular
@Giggles_Funsworth what do you think about this tweetstorm analyzing the credibility of Crowdstrike's analysis? http://electionado.com/canvas/1484508008585 It looks fairly convincing to me, but I don't really have the background to know about how credulous it is.
That that guy needs to write a blog.
And that I've always been of the opinion that Crowdstrike was doing respectable work. It definitely looks like Russia. Which could also be somebody that wants it to look like Russia, in theory. Probably not though.
That should have been presented in the form of a blog. I'm very lenient on long-form Twitter essays but I have to put my foot down at 79-part tweet posts
I read the whole thing and he makes a super solid case but some the fuck on this isn't a tweetstorm this is a category 5 tweet hurricane
3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
NNID: Hakkekage
+10
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Giggles_FunsworthBlight on DiscourseBay Area SprawlRegistered Userregular
Strip ats Hakks!
+1
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SurfpossumA nonentitytrying to preserve the anonymity he so richly deserves.Registered Userregular
Giggles_Funsworth [yeah I forgot the @, fite me irl] what do you think about this tweetstorm analyzing the credibility of Crowdstrike's analysis? http://electionado.com/canvas/1484508008585 It looks fairly convincing to me, but I don't really have the background to know about how credulous it is.
That that guy needs to write a blog.
And that I've always been of the opinion that Crowdstrike was doing respectable work. It definitely looks like Russia. Which could also be somebody that wants it to look like Russia, in theory. Probably not though.
That should have been presented in the form of a blog. I'm very lenient on long-form Twitter essays but I have to put my foot down at 79-part tweet posts
I read the whole thing and he makes a super solid case but some the fuck on this isn't a tweetstorm this is a category 5 tweet hurricane
It's a tweester, it's a tweester!
And yeah it's not really a technical analysis so much as compiling a bunch of different sources to rebut the claims made in that Intercept article. Which it does seem to do a good job of doing.
Urgh, it's looking like even this is fading. If "trump is literally in the pocket of the Russians" isn't enough to keep the media excited, I don't know what will.
Giggles_Funsworth what do you think about this tweetstorm analyzing the credibility of Crowdstrike's analysis? http://electionado.com/canvas/1484508008585 It looks fairly convincing to me, but I don't really have the background to know about how credulous it is.
That that guy needs to write a blog.
And that I've always been of the opinion that Crowdstrike was doing respectable work. It definitely looks like Russia. Which could also be somebody that wants it to look like Russia, in theory. Probably not though.
I highly doubt it was a false flag. If it was, it was an extremely risky and strangely designed one, leaving Russian characters in MS Word metadata hoping that it'll get looked at, while covering up a lot of the easier tracks to follow? I mean, it could be an operation being performed by anti-Kremlin Russian actors or could be an incredibly prescient expert play, but....
Urgh, it's looking like even this is fading. If "trump is literally in the pocket of the Russians" isn't enough to keep the media excited, I don't know what will.
Some of it is probably, simply, the grim realization setting in:
"... So what can we do about it?"
"Nothing. Nothing whatsoever. We're all completely fucked."
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
Vietnam has a long history of being ruled by outside forces and seething over being so ruled.
There is a reason why worries over Vietnam voluntarily being ruled by China because both were Communist was utterly ridiculous.
The fact that Vietnam is our best friend in the area is bonkers
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
Vietnam has a long history of being ruled by outside forces and seething over being so ruled.
There is a reason why worries over Vietnam voluntarily being ruled by China because both were Communist was utterly ridiculous.
The fact that Vietnam is our best friend in the area is bonkers
To be fair, if it turns out that Trump is just being a Russian puppet because everyone keeps saying he shouldn't and he's a reflexive contrarian asshole, I would not be surprised.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
Vietnam has a long history of being ruled by outside forces and seething over being so ruled.
There is a reason why worries over Vietnam voluntarily being ruled by China because both were Communist was utterly ridiculous.
The fact that Vietnam is our best friend in the area is bonkers
Diplomacy works.
And Trump is gonna fuck us all.
Thanks America.
Sorry, did everything I could to stop it
+4
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Giggles_FunsworthBlight on DiscourseBay Area SprawlRegistered Userregular
Giggles_Funsworth what do you think about this tweetstorm analyzing the credibility of Crowdstrike's analysis? http://electionado.com/canvas/1484508008585 It looks fairly convincing to me, but I don't really have the background to know about how credulous it is.
That that guy needs to write a blog.
And that I've always been of the opinion that Crowdstrike was doing respectable work. It definitely looks like Russia. Which could also be somebody that wants it to look like Russia, in theory. Probably not though.
I highly doubt it was a false flag. If it was, it was an extremely risky and strangely designed one, leaving Russian characters in MS Word metadata hoping that it'll get looked at, while covering up a lot of the easier tracks to follow? I mean, it could be an operation being performed by anti-Kremlin Russian actors or could be an incredibly prescient expert play, but....
I just always throw that caveat in there because it makes me all kinds of nervous people talking about using digital attribution to justify kinetic wars. It should go without saying, but....
Urgh, it's looking like even this is fading. If "trump is literally in the pocket of the Russians" isn't enough to keep the media excited, I don't know what will.
Some of it is probably, simply, the grim realization setting in:
"... So what can we do about it?"
"Nothing. Nothing whatsoever. We're all completely fucked."
Nobody was applying that logic to the Clinton email 'scandal'
Every article about trump should be....
"Donald Trump, still dogged by scandal and commonly believed to be indebted to Russian interests, sat down with Martin Luther kings son today. It is unknown whether the president elect discussed his scandals and failing administration during the meeting, but the meeting was arranged after Trumps crude and disgusting attack on Rep Lewis.
Posts
What, you mean like
Tillerson
Refusing to bad mouth Russia or putin and waiting far too long to say Russia was behind the hacks
Goibg so far as to lie about their actions in Crimea
Saying four years ago that he was close with putin
His son saying eight years ago that the family business had a lot of money coming from Russia
Being in Moscow for miss universe 2013
Or is it something else?
Flynn is being chummy with Putin at parties. I'm sure there were other flunkies he's hired who are friendly to Russia, too.
You forgot him saying "These allegations aren't true, Russia told me so".
Come now, he wouldn't even recognize the phrase as a mistake.
Taking the Ukraine stuff out of the Republican platform... as literally the only input he had.
I also would not be surprised if he's just being nice to Putin because Putin says nice things about him sometimes and he craves the validation.
I think the strongest argument against Trump being an explicit puppet is that he is so easily manipulated that there's no reason be explicit about the quid pro quo. If I was Putin, there's no way I would trust Trump to be in on it.
(Note: I still think he's likely an explicit puppet.)
Or, even simpler - if he is a puppet, has realized he's a puppet, he can't ever admit it, because that would mean that Putin is above him, pulling his strings. And again, his ego can't allow that.
I am honestly very surprised that countries besides Russia aren't manipulating the heck out of Trump more worthless concessions that Trump would like and verbal fellatio, but that probably wouldn't play well internally in a lot of countries like China.
Maybe they could just openly tell everyone in the country to play along with it.
Also Manafort. and the Poroschenko ... was it called the black folder?
I really want this video to come out.
I think we can expect to see more of it if it works. Right now, Russia hasn't gotten any return on investment yet, and until he's actually president there's no real telling how he'll take to this kind of manipulation once he actually has power worth manipulating. He could end up being so easily manipulated that nobody can actually get anything out of him because all it takes is him talking to somebody different before he can sign the orders for you.
But, yeah, if a pat on the head and a quick handie under the table works out for Russia, then it won't go unnoticed.
The best outcome, I think, is the whole pee party thing being false, but every two bit dictator in the world remembers it and figures it's a cheap way to curry his favor, so he keeps being welcomed into unannounced pee parties everywhere he goes. "Eh, see, Mr. President? We know what you like, and we bring it for you unasked!"
I think this has been mentioned before on one of these threads but it bears mentioning again here:
In the press conference, Trump talked about the two billion he'd been offered by one "Hussain Damac." The problem is, there is no "Hussain Damac." Hussain Sajwani is in charge of the company called "DAMAC." If you watch the tape of the press conference, you can see the weird pause where Trump realizes he can't remember the guy's last name.
Now, assuming that this two billion dollar offer actually happened (which it almost certainly didn't), it illustrates a key point: two billion dollars isn't a big enough offer for Donald Trump to remember what your last name is.
This may be the sole remaining silver lining: that Donald Trump is too scatterbrained and incompetent to be reliably bribed or blackmailed.
look at the polls of how republicans feel about Russia now vs a year ago. they've already gotten some return.
Plus Trump has upset America's relationship with China, which is going to get worse.
Depending on just how Trump and Putin together act towards China, one of my nightmare scenarios is China deciding that they really -don't- have anything really left to lose and they start throwing their weight around militarily. Not against Russia or the US but more against their neighbors.
I don't see Trump really giving two hoots if China goes and annexes Vietnam for example.
Surely Taiwan?
Russia wants to grab a few countries that used to belong to it, too.
Russia has to deal with the fact that every single aggression it carries out anywhere -near- Europe is going to face giant backlashes from any countries near it. As scary as it sounds even I don't think Putin is very eager to take on the Scandinavian countries along with the Baltic States, Poland and a -super- pissed off Ukraine.
I'm pretty sure "kick in the doors and the whole rotting structure will come crashing down" might actually be more meaningful today than it was during Hitler's time and a great big nasty land war would probably do just that when combined with the sanctions the rest of the world would probably slap it with. And the US too if we decide to continue to ship shit to Russia while this was going on.
They tried the Vietnam thing before.. It didn't go very well to say the least.
The chinese launched a 'punitive expedition' after the Vietnamese-Cambodian war towards Hanoi with about 200,000 troops. After going about 20 miles into Vietnam and taking one city, the chinese had lost over a quarter of their force and had to call in for reinforcements. It was at this point that China decided that Vietnam had been punished enough and went home.
Vietnam has a long history of being ruled by outside forces and seething over being so ruled.
There is a reason why worries over Vietnam voluntarily being ruled by China because both were Communist was utterly ridiculous.
or he has his mind set on pillaging the world for a trillion dollars.
something Trump will flush down the toilet I'm sure
That that guy needs to write a blog.
And that I've always been of the opinion that Crowdstrike was doing respectable work. It definitely looks like Russia. Which could also be somebody that wants it to look like Russia, in theory. Probably not though.
That should have been presented in the form of a blog. I'm very lenient on long-form Twitter essays but I have to put my foot down at 79-part tweet posts
I read the whole thing and he makes a super solid case but some the fuck on this isn't a tweetstorm this is a category 5 tweet hurricane
NNID: Hakkekage
And yeah it's not really a technical analysis so much as compiling a bunch of different sources to rebut the claims made in that Intercept article. Which it does seem to do a good job of doing.
I highly doubt it was a false flag. If it was, it was an extremely risky and strangely designed one, leaving Russian characters in MS Word metadata hoping that it'll get looked at, while covering up a lot of the easier tracks to follow? I mean, it could be an operation being performed by anti-Kremlin Russian actors or could be an incredibly prescient expert play, but....
Some of it is probably, simply, the grim realization setting in:
"... So what can we do about it?"
"Nothing. Nothing whatsoever. We're all completely fucked."
The fact that Vietnam is our best friend in the area is bonkers
Diplomacy works.
And Trump is gonna fuck us all.
Thanks America.
Sorry, did everything I could to stop it
I just always throw that caveat in there because it makes me all kinds of nervous people talking about using digital attribution to justify kinetic wars. It should go without saying, but....
Nobody was applying that logic to the Clinton email 'scandal'
Every article about trump should be....
"Donald Trump, still dogged by scandal and commonly believed to be indebted to Russian interests, sat down with Martin Luther kings son today. It is unknown whether the president elect discussed his scandals and failing administration during the meeting, but the meeting was arranged after Trumps crude and disgusting attack on Rep Lewis.
Etc