Roadmap got fixed, the exotic quest weapon is actually Xenophage, the previously unnamed super-slow magic bug MG that was seen at PAX: https://i.imgur.com/S8LaOeg.jpg
i'm pretty excited and the vidoc was a typical marketing vidoc but had a bunch of cool stuff in it
we had a big conversation in friendslack today about shadowkeep and I think my only like, huge concern right now is the seasonal artifact. having something that provides a ton of power and utility for what you do for only a very specific period of content-time and then being GONE is what WoW did with legendary weapons in legion and that team has discovered that that actually wound up being a bad idea because being very powerful at the end of a season (flipping back to destiny terminology) and then suddenly having all that gone the next day and content that you'd done the day before having a difficulty spike is...jarring is probably the word
the only way I feel like you can mitigate that is to have those mods be value-adds that don't dramatically affect your overall gameplay but then you run the risk of it just feeling boring and inconsequential
The "temporal valuation of content" is my biggest concern with Shadowkeep.
It's also been my biggest concern with Destiny pretty much every release/expansion/DLC. I should be used to it at this point but I will still complain about it every time.
I think the artifact is more a matter of a tool to tweak your class/character sheet that gets modified each season, coupled with a way to increase your power so that they can seasonally adjust power level gating without throwing off the curve for a whole year.
So the first component gives players the chance to focus around seasonally themed builds by trying out perks in a sandbox that doesn't persist forever (Season 8 is my SMG/Melee build, Season 9 is my Scout/Grenade build, Season 10 is my Sword/Super build). I think this is super neat, and may cause some adjustment once the season goes away, but since you're already going to be able to respec the artifact, it seems like it's more a case that players may be more aware that their builds will shift regularly.
As for the power curve, I enjoy the notion that they can do something crazy to power level curves that are also seasonal, and is treated as a modifier on your actual gear-based power level. I think the types of players who invest as heavily as they would need to in order to engage in those experiences don't strike me as those who would be confused when at the end of the season their power level goes from say 1000/1450 to 1000/1000 again until they rank up their new artifact.
I guess my point is - the players who will go hard on the Artifact are the players who already understand the progression scheme enough to not get totally confused once the season rotates.
Seasonal power curve is kind of a smart idea. It allows you to have a much bigger power progression with each new seasonal activity without blowing up the power level. We are already approaching ridiculous 4 digit levels.
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Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
Seasonal power curve is kind of a smart idea. It allows you to have a much bigger power progression with each new seasonal activity without blowing up the power level. We are already approaching ridiculous 4 digit levels.
i'm pretty excited and the vidoc was a typical marketing vidoc but had a bunch of cool stuff in it
we had a big conversation in friendslack today about shadowkeep and I think my only like, huge concern right now is the seasonal artifact. having something that provides a ton of power and utility for what you do for only a very specific period of content-time and then being GONE is what WoW did with legendary weapons in legion and that team has discovered that that actually wound up being a bad idea because being very powerful at the end of a season (flipping back to destiny terminology) and then suddenly having all that gone the next day and content that you'd done the day before having a difficulty spike is...jarring is probably the word
the only way I feel like you can mitigate that is to have those mods be value-adds that don't dramatically affect your overall gameplay but then you run the risk of it just feeling boring and inconsequential
Don't worry! Seasonal Activities can't have a weird difficulty spike when a Seasonal Artifact expires if the Activities expire with it :snap:
i'm pretty excited and the vidoc was a typical marketing vidoc but had a bunch of cool stuff in it
we had a big conversation in friendslack today about shadowkeep and I think my only like, huge concern right now is the seasonal artifact. having something that provides a ton of power and utility for what you do for only a very specific period of content-time and then being GONE is what WoW did with legendary weapons in legion and that team has discovered that that actually wound up being a bad idea because being very powerful at the end of a season (flipping back to destiny terminology) and then suddenly having all that gone the next day and content that you'd done the day before having a difficulty spike is...jarring is probably the word
the only way I feel like you can mitigate that is to have those mods be value-adds that don't dramatically affect your overall gameplay but then you run the risk of it just feeling boring and inconsequential
Don't worry! Seasonal Activities can't have a weird difficulty spike when a Seasonal Artifact expires if the Activities expire with it :snap:
but non-seasonal activities will, right? master level nightfalls will (obviously haven't actually played so semi-)objectively get harder if you lose your artifact power bonus + any additional mods on December 1st (made up date) vs November 30th
I guess my point is - the players who will go hard on the Artifact are the players who already understand the progression scheme enough to not get totally confused once the season rotates.
confusion isn't my concern though, it's how that's going to feel - people weren't confused in WoW when that stuff happened, it just felt bad! And like I said, I don't know how it'll feel, but it's the only thing I'm truly skeptical on actually working out effectively
i'm pretty excited and the vidoc was a typical marketing vidoc but had a bunch of cool stuff in it
we had a big conversation in friendslack today about shadowkeep and I think my only like, huge concern right now is the seasonal artifact. having something that provides a ton of power and utility for what you do for only a very specific period of content-time and then being GONE is what WoW did with legendary weapons in legion and that team has discovered that that actually wound up being a bad idea because being very powerful at the end of a season (flipping back to destiny terminology) and then suddenly having all that gone the next day and content that you'd done the day before having a difficulty spike is...jarring is probably the word
the only way I feel like you can mitigate that is to have those mods be value-adds that don't dramatically affect your overall gameplay but then you run the risk of it just feeling boring and inconsequential
Don't worry! Seasonal Activities can't have a weird difficulty spike when a Seasonal Artifact expires if the Activities expire with it :snap:
but non-seasonal activities will, right? master level nightfalls will (obviously haven't actually played so semi-)objectively get harder if you lose your artifact power bonus + any additional mods on December 1st (made up date) vs November 30th
I guess my point is - the players who will go hard on the Artifact are the players who already understand the progression scheme enough to not get totally confused once the season rotates.
confusion isn't my concern though, it's how that's going to feel - people weren't confused in WoW when that stuff happened, it just felt bad! And like I said, I don't know how it'll feel, but it's the only thing I'm truly skeptical on actually working out effectively
I wouldn't be surprised if the harder difficulties re-locked at the beginning of a new season and unlocked as it progressed, just as they seem to be for the upcoming season.
EDIT: And just like Raid Challenges work now. Since those were also listed as something that you'd want to level up your Artifact to complete, it seems likely.
Okay I'm trying to prep for the steam turnover, is there any reason to buy the digital deluxe edition? It seems like you're gambling on the annual pass being for realsies this time?
Okay I'm trying to prep for the steam turnover, is there any reason to buy the digital deluxe edition? It seems like you're gambling on the annual pass being for realsies this time?
In what way were the previous ones not "for realsies"?
Okay I'm trying to prep for the steam turnover, is there any reason to buy the digital deluxe edition? It seems like you're gambling on the annual pass being for realsies this time?
In what way were the previous ones not "for realsies"?
I didn't realize the last annual pass started last october.
So I figure I need a power boost to properly grind menagerie probably
So I went in to iron banner at like 640 light. Bow and snipers get the job done though.
I also finally got frigid jackal and yeah... I like it a lot. Despite my tiny little power level I managed to stop a power play with a triple kill sniper which felt really nice
Ok so I had this Calusea Noblesse with outlaw and multikill clip in the vault, pulled it out last night for Iron Banner. Sumbitch does 86 per crit with MKCx1 and a staggering 97 with MKCx2 and I'm sold, it's a good gun. Scouts can reenter the meta, I'm ready
Calusea Noblesse just feels real real nice. I have one with Dragonfly and I think Outlaw, and it's real nice in when people forget Scouts exist and try to outrange you with pulse/HC. I'm gonna pair it with a nice Kinetic shotty or Imminent Storm and then just go to town post-buff.
I feel like that didn’t affect his case and just made Ikora look naive
The part I thought made him look bad was when he apparently was either loudly bitching about Eris so she could hear him, or spreading a whisper campaign enough about here that Eris caught wind and was like "fine you don't want me here anyway dad, I'm gonna go run away." Zavala could have at least been all "hey Eris knows best how to thwart the Hive, let's trust her because her success rate is high."
It's basically been building up since D2 that Zavala is pushing everyone away due to his PTSD over the Red War. I get the arc I guess, I just feel like "hey you can't bear this weight alone and in fact you'll fail more spectacularly by pushing everyone away" could be tragic, but they don't spend enough time on it. Instead it seems like Zavala is just strategically foolish. Which again, seems like it's been building since D1 Vanilla anyway - Zavala doesn't seem to really do anything to actually stop the threats to the city. Crota was Eris, Oryx was Eris/Cayde, SIVA was Saladin, the Red War was mostly Cayde and Ikora dragging Zavala along again, Xol was Ana Bray (with Zavala opting for "I'll just make things worse"), Uldren/Riven was Petra/Ikora, Savathun is gonna be Eris again....
Like the Zavala who led us in a war with the Cabal whether we wanted it or not continues to basically seem like he's holding everything back. And I'd like them to explore it more, but it feels like they'll stumble that execution.
i have played too much destiny over the past month
I've got it in my head to try and finish the grind for this before the season is up since I'm on my last valor reset for the season, It is going to be a grueling week and a half but I think I can finish out the last few steps.
I feel like that didn’t affect his case and just made Ikora look naive
The part I thought made him look bad was when he apparently was either loudly bitching about Eris so she could hear him, or spreading a whisper campaign enough about here that Eris caught wind and was like "fine you don't want me here anyway dad, I'm gonna go run away." Zavala could have at least been all "hey Eris knows best how to thwart the Hive, let's trust her because her success rate is high."
It's basically been building up since D2 that Zavala is pushing everyone away due to his PTSD over the Red War. I get the arc I guess, I just feel like "hey you can't bear this weight alone and in fact you'll fail more spectacularly by pushing everyone away" could be tragic, but they don't spend enough time on it. Instead it seems like Zavala is just strategically foolish. Which again, seems like it's been building since D1 Vanilla anyway - Zavala doesn't seem to really do anything to actually stop the threats to the city. Crota was Eris, Oryx was Eris/Cayde, SIVA was Saladin, the Red War was mostly Cayde and Ikora dragging Zavala along again, Xol was Ana Bray (with Zavala opting for "I'll just make things worse"), Uldren/Riven was Petra/Ikora, Savathun is gonna be Eris again....
Like the Zavala who led us in a war with the Cabal whether we wanted it or not continues to basically seem like he's holding everything back. And I'd like them to explore it more, but it feels like they'll stumble that execution.
I feel like that didn’t affect his case and just made Ikora look naive
The part I thought made him look bad was when he apparently was either loudly bitching about Eris so she could hear him, or spreading a whisper campaign enough about here that Eris caught wind and was like "fine you don't want me here anyway dad, I'm gonna go run away." Zavala could have at least been all "hey Eris knows best how to thwart the Hive, let's trust her because her success rate is high."
It's basically been building up since D2 that Zavala is pushing everyone away due to his PTSD over the Red War. I get the arc I guess, I just feel like "hey you can't bear this weight alone and in fact you'll fail more spectacularly by pushing everyone away" could be tragic, but they don't spend enough time on it. Instead it seems like Zavala is just strategically foolish. Which again, seems like it's been building since D1 Vanilla anyway - Zavala doesn't seem to really do anything to actually stop the threats to the city. Crota was Eris, Oryx was Eris/Cayde, SIVA was Saladin, the Red War was mostly Cayde and Ikora dragging Zavala along again, Xol was Ana Bray (with Zavala opting for "I'll just make things worse"), Uldren/Riven was Petra/Ikora, Savathun is gonna be Eris again....
Like the Zavala who led us in a war with the Cabal whether we wanted it or not continues to basically seem like he's holding everything back. And I'd like them to explore it more, but it feels like they'll stumble that execution.
The bolded is a really weird way to describe "Ran off to the outer reaches of the system to fuck up/navel gaze."
Yeah... Zavala has the big "I need my fireteam back!" moment on Titan and then you go off looking for Cayde and Ikora. Zavala then lead the mission to get the Vex Transporter in place to make the assault on Ghaul. *shrug*
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Zavala is all "I was wrong to bring us here to Titan" (which yeah, you were) and "without light are we even guardians anymore?" But that's before the end of Titan's arc.
I suppose I was a bit harsh on Red War Zavala, due to post-Red War Zavala. It's been approximately forever since I saw the cutscenes, and I mostly remembered mopey Zavala from mid-mission instead of "we fucking shit up Zavala." Similarly, I remember mid-mission Ikora saying "why didn't I try more" than hopeless Ikora. So yeah, I guess it shifts the balance a bit.
I'll chalk it up to having not played Red War in forever, and post-Red War Zavala disappointing me.
I feel like that didn’t affect his case and just made Ikora look naive
The part I thought made him look bad was when he apparently was either loudly bitching about Eris so she could hear him, or spreading a whisper campaign enough about here that Eris caught wind and was like "fine you don't want me here anyway dad, I'm gonna go run away." Zavala could have at least been all "hey Eris knows best how to thwart the Hive, let's trust her because her success rate is high."
It's basically been building up since D2 that Zavala is pushing everyone away due to his PTSD over the Red War. I get the arc I guess, I just feel like "hey you can't bear this weight alone and in fact you'll fail more spectacularly by pushing everyone away" could be tragic, but they don't spend enough time on it. Instead it seems like Zavala is just strategically foolish. Which again, seems like it's been building since D1 Vanilla anyway - Zavala doesn't seem to really do anything to actually stop the threats to the city. Crota was Eris, Oryx was Eris/Cayde, SIVA was Saladin, the Red War was mostly Cayde and Ikora dragging Zavala along again, Xol was Ana Bray (with Zavala opting for "I'll just make things worse"), Uldren/Riven was Petra/Ikora, Savathun is gonna be Eris again....
Like the Zavala who led us in a war with the Cabal whether we wanted it or not continues to basically seem like he's holding everything back. And I'd like them to explore it more, but it feels like they'll stumble that execution.
This is a weird read on what's going on in that first entry imo.
Eris is all like "I'm leaving" and Ikora is all "No, you can't" and Zavala is basically "Let her go, you can't force her to stay and we must be able to survive without her". Eris notes she's heard that Zavala doesn't want her there from rumours and such.
I don't see much unsympathetic there really. He's basically just saying "If she wants to go, she can go".
Zavala is all "I was wrong to bring us here to Titan" (which yeah, you were) and "without light are we even guardians anymore?" But that's before the end of Titan's arc.
I suppose I was a bit harsh on Red War Zavala, due to post-Red War Zavala. It's been approximately forever since I saw the cutscenes, and I mostly remembered mopey Zavala from mid-mission instead of "we fucking shit up Zavala." Similarly, I remember mid-mission Ikora saying "why didn't I try more" than hopeless Ikora. So yeah, I guess it shifts the balance a bit.
I'll chalk it up to having not played Red War in forever, and post-Red War Zavala disappointing me.
The other part of it is that Zavala was adjusting from "I command a legion of self resurrecting space wizards" to "I command some folks who have no concept of their own mortality and broken guns."
His opinion changes pretty quick once he realizes you've switched back into magic bad ass mode.
If anybody had a PTSD plotline in Red War it was Holliday but it got abandoned when she went back to once a year vendor.
Zavala's entire plotline in the Red War campaign is basically:
Zavala: "We need to regroup and retake The City!"
/tons of people die on Titan
Zavala: "I fucked up bringing us to Titan, I'm a failure!"
Us: "No, we can do this shit. Look, we have space magic again!"
Zavala: "Ok, maybe this could work. Let's figure out what's going on."
Sloan: "Sir, Ghaul plans to blow up the Sun."
Zavala: "The Sun? Alright, fuck this guy. Get me Ikora and Cayde and let's start punching Cabal in the face till this is fixed!"
I viewed lines like "Zavala. Always has to weigh in." and "The brave commander can'te ven bring himself to look at me." and "Zavala's words ring hollow" in the least sympathetic light possible. Combined with his general tendencies recently to basically dismiss the opinions, decisions, and help of others recently, I just imagined a scene of Ikora pleading with trauma-survivor Eris to stay while Zavala's all "yes, she's getting out of my hair, I don't even care what she's looking into, just get out of my tower" which sure, may be an uncharitable read but Zavala's on the shit list in my book right now.
You could also read it as Zavala working with Eris to break the news to Ikora in his sullen way, but maybe it's because it was late at night, but I was in a place where I felt like Zavala couldn't read a room to save his life.
I feel like that didn’t affect his case and just made Ikora look naive
The part I thought made him look bad was when he apparently was either loudly bitching about Eris so she could hear him, or spreading a whisper campaign...
I think that "Your whispers carry throughout the Tower." might not be meant in a literal sense.
Eris was forever banging on about whispers in her mind and shit all the time in D1, she's probably just picking up on Zavala's distaste for her presence.
For his part he's definitely not making much effort to hold onto Eris, but he's always struck me as a very black and white world view kind of guy and Eris is all kinds of grey area that's way too complex for him to deal with.
I mean, Eris is throwing a bit of shade at Zavala in her head, but nothing seems particularly wrong or bad here. Eris wants to leave, Zavala doesn't really want her around anyway so he's ok with it. Eris thinks he's always got to have her say and notes that he's ashamed when she points out she's heard him talking to others that he doesn't really want her to stay in the tower, but none of that seems particularly egregious in any way. Zavala doesn't like having Eris around but he isn't gonna do anything to her other then not try to talk her into staying and Eris knows it and is basically whatever about it. They don't like each other, but they are adults.
Ikora clearly worries for her and wants her to stay though.
(D2) Zavala always does this thing where he doesn't care for or want to listen to the token NPC of a given expansion has to say about the latest looming threat over the galaxy/our sick above ground pool.
Here's a fun madlib, just insert any character and associated destination in here and it'll sound right coming from Zavala:
"______'s attitude and doctrine are dangerous. All that time spent on _______ probably changed them into something.... Different. Regardless, when humanity needed them the most, they disappeared and didn't even leave a note on the fridge. That's a level 10 No-No in the big book of Zavala's No-No's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll be hiding behind a door for when you finally do disobey me and help ______. See you in 20 minutes, guardian."
(D2) Zavala always does this thing where he doesn't care for or want to listen to the token NPC of a given expansion has to say about the latest looming threat over the galaxy/our sick above ground pool.
Here's a fun madlib, just insert any character and associated destination in here and it'll sound right coming from Zavala:
"Poop's attitude and doctrine are dangerous. All that time spent on Fart probably changed them into something.... Different. Regardless, when humanity needed them the most, they disappeared and didn't even leave a note on the fridge. That's a level 10 No-No in the big book of Zavala's No-No's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll be hiding behind a door for when you finally do disobey me and help Butt. See you in 20 minutes, guardian."
(D2) Zavala always does this thing where he doesn't care for or want to listen to the token NPC of a given expansion has to say about the latest looming threat over the galaxy/our sick above ground pool.
Here's a fun madlib, just insert any character and associated destination in here and it'll sound right coming from Zavala:
"______'s attitude and doctrine are dangerous. All that time spent on _______ probably changed them into something.... Different. Regardless, when humanity needed them the most, they disappeared and didn't even leave a note on the fridge. That's a level 10 No-No in the big book of Zavala's No-No's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll be hiding behind a door for when you finally do disobey me and help ______. See you in 20 minutes, guardian."
You know, I know we have talked about this before - but it does really bum me out that a lot of people didn't read any of the Warmind narrative preview stuff that led up to that DLC where it explains exactly why he was behind that door.
(D2) Zavala always does this thing where he doesn't care for or want to listen to the token NPC of a given expansion has to say about the latest looming threat over the galaxy/our sick above ground pool.
Here's a fun madlib, just insert any character and associated destination in here and it'll sound right coming from Zavala:
"______'s attitude and doctrine are dangerous. All that time spent on _______ probably changed them into something.... Different. Regardless, when humanity needed them the most, they disappeared and didn't even leave a note on the fridge. That's a level 10 No-No in the big book of Zavala's No-No's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll be hiding behind a door for when you finally do disobey me and help ______. See you in 20 minutes, guardian."
You know, I know we have talked about this before - but it does really bum me out that a lot of people didn't read any of the Warmind narrative preview stuff that led up to that DLC where it explains exactly why he was behind that door.
If you need a narrative dump outside of the game for the game's main cutscenes to make any sense, that's shit writing. I honestly don't care if there's some comic on a website somewhere that's not referenced anywhere in-game, the cutscene deserves all the grief it gets.
(D2) Zavala always does this thing where he doesn't care for or want to listen to the token NPC of a given expansion has to say about the latest looming threat over the galaxy/our sick above ground pool.
Here's a fun madlib, just insert any character and associated destination in here and it'll sound right coming from Zavala:
"______'s attitude and doctrine are dangerous. All that time spent on _______ probably changed them into something.... Different. Regardless, when humanity needed them the most, they disappeared and didn't even leave a note on the fridge. That's a level 10 No-No in the big book of Zavala's No-No's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll be hiding behind a door for when you finally do disobey me and help ______. See you in 20 minutes, guardian."
You know, I know we have talked about this before - but it does really bum me out that a lot of people didn't read any of the Warmind narrative preview stuff that led up to that DLC where it explains exactly why he was behind that door.
If you need a narrative dump outside of the game for the game's main cutscenes to make any sense, that's shit writing. I honestly don't care if there's some comic on a website somewhere that's not referenced anywhere in-game, the cutscene deserves all the grief it gets.
I'm just saying - it is obviously a specific choice at this point. Same as the grimoire (in original D1 or new D2 form). The reality is that probably 90% of people who play Destiny don't engage with the lore in any meaningful way. Like at all. Period. These are the same people that play an RPG (or any other thing) and mash the button to spam rush through the cut scenes cause "I'm just here for the game, not this *insert choice derogatory statement* story". Knowing that a good portion of the traditional player base that plays an FPS is...stereotypically not a fan of slower paced narrative meanderings - I can't say I don't blame them for painting with the broadest of broad strokes within the game itself and leaving all of the interesting details tucked away either in the lore books in game or in some narrative story telling on the web occasionally. I mean I would love to have it all told through our characters actions and their interactions with those other NPCs and events as well. But even that wouldn't be able to convey some of the more nuanced styles of storytelling, styles, narrative flourishes and meta commentary that can be conveyed in text. In this brave new world of multimedia storytelling clicking on a story link on the company's website when we all check their weekly news update, games reddit page etc doesn't really seem a bridge too far.
I think that's unfair to a lot of people in this thread and elsewhere. I've read the Book of Sorrows, I've bought two Grimoire books. I enjoyed reading about Dreaming City and The Drifter. The Y1 writing for this game was subpar, and if you don't agree that's fine. But it's not something I feel I'm really missing out on. I'll read the lore when people assure me it's quality.
I think that's unfair to a lot of people in this thread and elsewhere. I've read the Book of Sorrows, I've bought two Grimoire books. I enjoyed reading about Dreaming City and The Drifter. The Y1 writing for this game was subpar, and if you don't agree that's fine. But it's not something I feel I'm really missing out on. I'll read the lore when people assure me it's quality.
It wasn't directed at anyone in the thread - just being in this thread means you arent the common destiny player. But they arent making those choices around people like us in general.
I agree the year 1 lore was lacking. What little there actually was (since it basically only existed as a few lore tabs and flavor text on items). Liking or not liking it has nothing to do with it existing. I'm merely stating it exists and it informs scenes.
Someone might not like the Star Wars Clone Wars cartoon but that doesn't mean the fact that Saw Guerrera shows up there and it helps set up who he is etc so that when he shows up in Rogue One "doesn't count because it is a different medium"
But you see how the dip in quality might lead someone to not engage with the supplemental materials, right? Like I didn't engage much with D1 lore until it was made easily readable online, and even then it was only on the recommendation of fellow clanmates. I'm sure there's plenty of people like me who had a decent interest in the plot threads D1 was setting up, especially starting with TTK. And those same people probably also experienced whiplash in quality from the last 2 years of D1, going into the first year of D2. CoO nearly broke me as a Destiny fan, and then Warmind hit, which wasn't as bad but still was far from righting the ship in terms of quality.
So the whole conversation spun out of not knowing the context for Zavala hanging out being a door. If it was important to know, then they should have told us, and not in the optional, side material they provide. If that plot detail is crucial to making that moment not seem hammy and dumb, they should have included that context! Some of the best moments in Destiny story in game are when they embrace the lore (like Dreaming City stuff and Forsaken's ending).
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we had a big conversation in friendslack today about shadowkeep and I think my only like, huge concern right now is the seasonal artifact. having something that provides a ton of power and utility for what you do for only a very specific period of content-time and then being GONE is what WoW did with legendary weapons in legion and that team has discovered that that actually wound up being a bad idea because being very powerful at the end of a season (flipping back to destiny terminology) and then suddenly having all that gone the next day and content that you'd done the day before having a difficulty spike is...jarring is probably the word
the only way I feel like you can mitigate that is to have those mods be value-adds that don't dramatically affect your overall gameplay but then you run the risk of it just feeling boring and inconsequential
It's also been my biggest concern with Destiny pretty much every release/expansion/DLC. I should be used to it at this point but I will still complain about it every time.
So the first component gives players the chance to focus around seasonally themed builds by trying out perks in a sandbox that doesn't persist forever (Season 8 is my SMG/Melee build, Season 9 is my Scout/Grenade build, Season 10 is my Sword/Super build). I think this is super neat, and may cause some adjustment once the season goes away, but since you're already going to be able to respec the artifact, it seems like it's more a case that players may be more aware that their builds will shift regularly.
As for the power curve, I enjoy the notion that they can do something crazy to power level curves that are also seasonal, and is treated as a modifier on your actual gear-based power level. I think the types of players who invest as heavily as they would need to in order to engage in those experiences don't strike me as those who would be confused when at the end of the season their power level goes from say 1000/1450 to 1000/1000 again until they rank up their new artifact.
I guess my point is - the players who will go hard on the Artifact are the players who already understand the progression scheme enough to not get totally confused once the season rotates.
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Don't worry! Seasonal Activities can't have a weird difficulty spike when a Seasonal Artifact expires if the Activities expire with it :snap:
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
but non-seasonal activities will, right? master level nightfalls will (obviously haven't actually played so semi-)objectively get harder if you lose your artifact power bonus + any additional mods on December 1st (made up date) vs November 30th
confusion isn't my concern though, it's how that's going to feel - people weren't confused in WoW when that stuff happened, it just felt bad! And like I said, I don't know how it'll feel, but it's the only thing I'm truly skeptical on actually working out effectively
I wouldn't be surprised if the harder difficulties re-locked at the beginning of a new season and unlocked as it progressed, just as they seem to be for the upcoming season.
EDIT: And just like Raid Challenges work now. Since those were also listed as something that you'd want to level up your Artifact to complete, it seems likely.
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
In what way were the previous ones not "for realsies"?
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
What do I need to get started? I want me a perfect roll twilight oath
I didn't realize the last annual pass started last october.
https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/48149
I'm waiting for the "long con by Savathun" theories to start popping up at this point.
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
So I went in to iron banner at like 640 light. Bow and snipers get the job done though.
I also finally got frigid jackal and yeah... I like it a lot. Despite my tiny little power level I managed to stop a power play with a triple kill sniper which felt really nice
Frigid jackal lives up to the hype
i have played too much destiny over the past month
The part I thought made him look bad was when he apparently was either loudly bitching about Eris so she could hear him, or spreading a whisper campaign enough about here that Eris caught wind and was like "fine you don't want me here anyway dad, I'm gonna go run away." Zavala could have at least been all "hey Eris knows best how to thwart the Hive, let's trust her because her success rate is high."
It's basically been building up since D2 that Zavala is pushing everyone away due to his PTSD over the Red War. I get the arc I guess, I just feel like "hey you can't bear this weight alone and in fact you'll fail more spectacularly by pushing everyone away" could be tragic, but they don't spend enough time on it. Instead it seems like Zavala is just strategically foolish. Which again, seems like it's been building since D1 Vanilla anyway - Zavala doesn't seem to really do anything to actually stop the threats to the city. Crota was Eris, Oryx was Eris/Cayde, SIVA was Saladin, the Red War was mostly Cayde and Ikora dragging Zavala along again, Xol was Ana Bray (with Zavala opting for "I'll just make things worse"), Uldren/Riven was Petra/Ikora, Savathun is gonna be Eris again....
Like the Zavala who led us in a war with the Cabal whether we wanted it or not continues to basically seem like he's holding everything back. And I'd like them to explore it more, but it feels like they'll stumble that execution.
ANYWAY the new entry has some stuff in it as well which we should discuss but we would empower the Archentrope:
https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/48150
I've got it in my head to try and finish the grind for this before the season is up since I'm on my last valor reset for the season, It is going to be a grueling week and a half but I think I can finish out the last few steps.
Origin: theRealElMucho
The bolded is a really weird way to describe "Ran off to the outer reaches of the system to fuck up/navel gaze."
Yeah... Zavala has the big "I need my fireteam back!" moment on Titan and then you go off looking for Cayde and Ikora. Zavala then lead the mission to get the Vex Transporter in place to make the assault on Ghaul. *shrug*
Blizz ID - DoublySymm#1758
I suppose I was a bit harsh on Red War Zavala, due to post-Red War Zavala. It's been approximately forever since I saw the cutscenes, and I mostly remembered mopey Zavala from mid-mission instead of "we fucking shit up Zavala." Similarly, I remember mid-mission Ikora saying "why didn't I try more" than hopeless Ikora. So yeah, I guess it shifts the balance a bit.
I'll chalk it up to having not played Red War in forever, and post-Red War Zavala disappointing me.
This is a weird read on what's going on in that first entry imo.
Eris is all like "I'm leaving" and Ikora is all "No, you can't" and Zavala is basically "Let her go, you can't force her to stay and we must be able to survive without her". Eris notes she's heard that Zavala doesn't want her there from rumours and such.
I don't see much unsympathetic there really. He's basically just saying "If she wants to go, she can go".
The other part of it is that Zavala was adjusting from "I command a legion of self resurrecting space wizards" to "I command some folks who have no concept of their own mortality and broken guns."
His opinion changes pretty quick once he realizes you've switched back into magic bad ass mode.
If anybody had a PTSD plotline in Red War it was Holliday but it got abandoned when she went back to once a year vendor.
Zavala: "We need to regroup and retake The City!"
/tons of people die on Titan
Zavala: "I fucked up bringing us to Titan, I'm a failure!"
Us: "No, we can do this shit. Look, we have space magic again!"
Zavala: "Ok, maybe this could work. Let's figure out what's going on."
Sloan: "Sir, Ghaul plans to blow up the Sun."
Zavala: "The Sun? Alright, fuck this guy. Get me Ikora and Cayde and let's start punching Cabal in the face till this is fixed!"
You could also read it as Zavala working with Eris to break the news to Ikora in his sullen way, but maybe it's because it was late at night, but I was in a place where I felt like Zavala couldn't read a room to save his life.
Anyway, here's more: https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/48151
I think that "Your whispers carry throughout the Tower." might not be meant in a literal sense.
Eris was forever banging on about whispers in her mind and shit all the time in D1, she's probably just picking up on Zavala's distaste for her presence.
For his part he's definitely not making much effort to hold onto Eris, but he's always struck me as a very black and white world view kind of guy and Eris is all kinds of grey area that's way too complex for him to deal with.
Ikora clearly worries for her and wants her to stay though.
Here's a fun madlib, just insert any character and associated destination in here and it'll sound right coming from Zavala:
"______'s attitude and doctrine are dangerous. All that time spent on _______ probably changed them into something.... Different. Regardless, when humanity needed them the most, they disappeared and didn't even leave a note on the fridge. That's a level 10 No-No in the big book of Zavala's No-No's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'll be hiding behind a door for when you finally do disobey me and help ______. See you in 20 minutes, guardian."
What, how do you guys play Mad Libs?
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
You know, I know we have talked about this before - but it does really bum me out that a lot of people didn't read any of the Warmind narrative preview stuff that led up to that DLC where it explains exactly why he was behind that door.
If you need a narrative dump outside of the game for the game's main cutscenes to make any sense, that's shit writing. I honestly don't care if there's some comic on a website somewhere that's not referenced anywhere in-game, the cutscene deserves all the grief it gets.
I'm just saying - it is obviously a specific choice at this point. Same as the grimoire (in original D1 or new D2 form). The reality is that probably 90% of people who play Destiny don't engage with the lore in any meaningful way. Like at all. Period. These are the same people that play an RPG (or any other thing) and mash the button to spam rush through the cut scenes cause "I'm just here for the game, not this *insert choice derogatory statement* story". Knowing that a good portion of the traditional player base that plays an FPS is...stereotypically not a fan of slower paced narrative meanderings - I can't say I don't blame them for painting with the broadest of broad strokes within the game itself and leaving all of the interesting details tucked away either in the lore books in game or in some narrative story telling on the web occasionally. I mean I would love to have it all told through our characters actions and their interactions with those other NPCs and events as well. But even that wouldn't be able to convey some of the more nuanced styles of storytelling, styles, narrative flourishes and meta commentary that can be conveyed in text. In this brave new world of multimedia storytelling clicking on a story link on the company's website when we all check their weekly news update, games reddit page etc doesn't really seem a bridge too far.
Edit - And just because - https://www.bungie.net/en/News/Article/46779
It wasn't directed at anyone in the thread - just being in this thread means you arent the common destiny player. But they arent making those choices around people like us in general.
I agree the year 1 lore was lacking. What little there actually was (since it basically only existed as a few lore tabs and flavor text on items). Liking or not liking it has nothing to do with it existing. I'm merely stating it exists and it informs scenes.
Someone might not like the Star Wars Clone Wars cartoon but that doesn't mean the fact that Saw Guerrera shows up there and it helps set up who he is etc so that when he shows up in Rogue One "doesn't count because it is a different medium"
So the whole conversation spun out of not knowing the context for Zavala hanging out being a door. If it was important to know, then they should have told us, and not in the optional, side material they provide. If that plot detail is crucial to making that moment not seem hammy and dumb, they should have included that context! Some of the best moments in Destiny story in game are when they embrace the lore (like Dreaming City stuff and Forsaken's ending).