quick healadin question - holy shock or blessing of sanctuary? i've gone fairly heavy into prot for tank buffs and the possibility of tanking easier stuff myself. on the other hand an instant would be well worth having given the many limitations of vanilla pallys.
on the wpvp front everyone i know (ally, EU) has pulled the plug until the BGs drop. i am currently 50 and any kind of non-instance levelling is right out. gank squads waiting at every flight point and all zones fully untenable.
Holy Shock + Divine Favor is too good of an instant combo to pass up for when you're falling behind, IMHO.
To put it another way, Blessing of Sanctuary is really only good for fights where the tank needs block (which is not all fights), but Holy Shock is good for a lot of situations, up to and including providing some offense.
I mean if you've got three paladins it's certainly better than wisdom.
If you've got 3 paladins hopefully one of them is prot spec and just has it, though. It's not something the healadin should have to grab.
Though also after you've had a regular core of paladins only one of them should have Kings and only one of them should have improved Might/Wisdom, etc.
Yeah they should absolutely break the spy mod. It wouldn't even be really hard for them to do. Just limit combat log activity of addons to instances/raid.
I agree they should break spy, but with that method wouldn't they break DPS meters in the world? I can see that making people pretty upset.
You could just allow these mods to see things you do and not things other people do. Small price to pay.
I was putting some thought into this last night, as an addon author and thus as someone painfully familiar with the combat log and the info it provides.
The combat log just reports on things the game client knows about anyway. For instance, by the time a combat log event is generated for a spell cast, we already know the source and destination of that cast. Moreover, we know a lot about the source and destination. We know their name, their reaction (friendly, hostile, neutral), their type (player, pet, NPC, etc.), their distance, and so on.
So, to mostly break the Spy addon without breaking much else, the game client could avoid emitting combat log events when the source is a hostile player and they're more than, say, 50 yards away. Or... it could avoid emitting positive aura-change events for any hostile player, no matter the distance, which would cause the addon to fail to detect players mounting, eating/drinking, stealthing, changing stances/auras, and other things that only add or remove a buff. Or... it could report these events as today, but anonymize the name of the hostile player. Or...
My point is: they have options to break this functionality without harming (most) other addons. Most options do not require any more state than the game client already maintains. I suspect that they just don't see the addon as enough of a problem to warrant such a change.
Saeris on
+1
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Yeah they should absolutely break the spy mod. It wouldn't even be really hard for them to do. Just limit combat log activity of addons to instances/raid.
I agree they should break spy, but with that method wouldn't they break DPS meters in the world? I can see that making people pretty upset.
You could just allow these mods to see things you do and not things other people do. Small price to pay.
I was putting some thought into this last night, as an addon author and thus as someone painfully familiar with the combat log and the info it provides.
The combat log just reports on things the game client knows about anyway. For instance, by the time a combat log event is generated for a spell cast, we already know the source and destination of that cast. Moreover, we know a lot about the source and destination. We know their name, their reaction (friendly, hostile, neutral), their type (player, pet, NPC, etc.), their distance, and so on.
So, to mostly break the Spy addon without breaking much else, the game client could avoid emitting combat log events when the source is a hostile player and they're more than, say, 50 yards away. Or... it could avoid emitting positive aura-change events for any hostile player, no matter the distance, which would cause the addon to fail to detect players mounting, eating/drinking, stealthing, changing stances/auras, and other things that only add or remove a buff. Or... it could report these events as today, but anonymize the name of the hostile player. Or...
My point is: they have options to break this functionality without harming (most) other addons. Most options do not require any more state than the game client already maintains. I suspect that they just don't see the addon as enough of a problem to warrant such a change.
Or to put it another way "Warts and All"
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
If we were to argue from the perspective of #nochanges
There should be 4-5 times as many servers because the max populations are much higher since the servers can support it.
There have already been serious concessions over bringing the classic's universe to modern hardware and the battlenet/legion client, breaking addon functionality for opposite faction members like this is one of those good changes.
I have no skin in this game, I play PvE because I knew exactly what PvP was going to be, since I dealt with nearly the same shit, just instead of 3-4 raid groups it was a either 5 rogues or a small guild of people camping a whole zone instead. People tried to tell me I was nuts (here on PA specifically), but I remember before battlegrounds showed up and it was exactly 100% what it is now for farming honor and there was a big hullabaloo about DHKs fucking with your honor and having to be real picky who you invited to honor farm in raids. I breathed this shit, it's no different, just on a much larger scale, again, one of the many concessions that is definitely gamebreaking from #nochanges
bowen on
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
+3
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
what if they just permanently turn off pvp
Allegedly a voice of reason.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
they turned off pvp on retail, it's warmode and elective now
There are still goobers who will flag pvp and attack civilians and quest givers to be dickwads regardless, though it is worse because of the merged zones to make them feel more alive. Before they did that most server lowbie areas were relatively dead and you could quest with ease, once in a blue moon maybe someone would attack a quest giver, now dudes from any server will show up and be jerks.
I think flagging world pvp willingly should toss you into the warmode phase and you should have to return to a city to turn it off.
Still, this was one of the better changes they could do. What's funny is this "roving pvp squad" thing is still common in warmode and people wonder why the opposite faction (usually alliance who has a ~40% buff to entice them to flag) don't participate. Gee because getting ganked is fucking awful and it's always been like this on pvp servers unless your faction had the imbalance.
I think a lot of PAers have been relatively sheltered from the harsh reality of what pvp is like for the losing side because the PA alliance and Shamblers have been relatively insulated just by the sheer numbers of their factions on those servers.
bowen on
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
pvp server issues aside world pvp on imbalanced PVE servers would have been greatly aided if they had finished copying the world pvp system they had ripped off in the first place: Star Wars Galaxies
although I will say technically, War Mode does achieve that on some level
in SWG, if you complete the analogies between it and WoW... you were not allowed to use to what amounts to your Grand Marshal gear unless you were "permanently" flagged for PVP. "Permanent" in this case is largely what War Mode is. You declare in town, and when you leave town, you're stuck with it until you come back
This makes it harder for you to just turn it off when you don't like it, turn it on when you do, and reap the benefits at all times no matter what
You would have gotten much more organic world pvp on pve servers this way, with none of the ridiculously awful downsides of pvp servers
TBH they should put DHKs in for civilian units and make it punishing somehow. (edit in retail)
in retail as in not in classic? Does NPC camping happen in non-war mode retail now? I haven't really leveled anything since BFA launched so I wouldn't have seen it if it was happening in low level zones, which is where all the griefing usually happens, don't want to have to deal with players who could conceivable touch you while you're killing their flight masters and quest NPCs after all.
TBH they should put DHKs in for civilian units and make it punishing somehow. (edit in retail)
in retail as in not in classic? Does NPC camping happen in non-war mode retail now? I haven't really leveled anything since BFA launched so I wouldn't have seen it if it was happening in low level zones, which is where all the griefing usually happens, don't want to have to deal with players who could conceivable touch you while you're killing their flight masters and quest NPCs after all.
I was playing alts until classic's release, and yeah, they did, a lot. Westfall and Redridge* were pretty much camped every time I played to the point where I'd roll into the zone and get slammed with "under attack" messages... at which point I didn't even bother because in retail wow you can't move on to new hubs without following the breadcrumb quests, regardless of your level.
*(lol horde spy quest in redridge = good game design!)
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
I just got a little too bored starting a priest with no resources and I didn't have much luck selling start zones herbs and leather to fund him, so I think I'm gonna reroll a mage, throws fireballs and conjure water, then pay for my priest with the mage proceeds down the road. I'll give tailoring and enchanting a spin too since I'll at least be somewhat self sufficient for combat and travel.
It'll be interesting and somewhat fitting considering the last time I played a mage for more than a hot minute was WoW beta (and I never made it past Feralas on that guy - servers went down while I was killing Gordunnis).
enchanting is a money sink early on...about the only thing that was selling were the rods (might fluctuate based on people re-rolling cloth alts). Then again, with BGs coming soon, lots of people will be looking for twink gear enchants.
Earlier today, we deployed a WoW Classic hotfix to all regions:
The in-game combat log radius has been fixed, and now only displays information for units that are within 50 yards of the player.
This is closer to the original behavior of WoW 1.12, and should eliminate the ability for addons to extend players’ senses and detect enemy actions at a greater distance than intended.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Earlier today, we deployed a WoW Classic hotfix to all regions:
The in-game combat log radius has been fixed, and now only displays information for units that are within 50 yards of the player.
This is closer to the original behavior of WoW 1.12, and should eliminate the ability for addons to extend players’ senses and detect enemy actions at a greater distance than intended.
But....but the warts!
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Mage feels good but I already feel like I'll regret not being able to heal, which is really my bag. I think I have to go back to the priest and just gut out the early levels: paladin has never appealed to me, and I play Mistweaver/Resto Shammy/Resto Druid in retail, all three of which aren't available to me in classic (I guess resto druid is but I've heard pretty mediocre things about it compared to priest heals).
Guess I'll just smite the crap outta defias wizards near goldshire for a while and build up some linen/copper to push onward.
Mage feels good but I already feel like I'll regret not being able to heal, which is really my bag. I think I have to go back to the priest and just gut out the early levels: paladin has never appealed to me, and I play Mistweaver/Resto Shammy/Resto Druid in retail, all three of which aren't available to me in classic (I guess resto druid is but I've heard pretty mediocre things about it compared to priest heals).
Guess I'll just smite the crap outta defias wizards near goldshire for a while and build up some linen/copper to push onward.
Get a good wand, seriously a wand is actually better than chain-smiting for a good while
For me, Priest felt so easy to level either solo or group.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
i’m actually not sure if wanding is ever a worse option than chain smiting
considering wanding requires no mana
slightly different because it’s my heal box and not solo but with my priest i just drop SW:P, holy shit or whatever that holy dot is called and then wand until my warrior needs to be healed
i never run out of mana and my DPS isn’t far behind the warrior’s
try holy fire first, then sw:p and wand for maximum chance of not getting interrupted. I believe macros can only have two actions so you need a button for holy fire, then:
I think the macro is:
/cast shoot
/cast Shadow Word:Pain
Wands are great - affording them not so much if you don't have an initial leg up. But it's a very short term problem. Just gotta grind a couple kobolds and defias.
Posts
Holy Shock + Divine Favor is too good of an instant combo to pass up for when you're falling behind, IMHO.
To put it another way, Blessing of Sanctuary is really only good for fights where the tank needs block (which is not all fights), but Holy Shock is good for a lot of situations, up to and including providing some offense.
If you've got 3 paladins hopefully one of them is prot spec and just has it, though. It's not something the healadin should have to grab.
Though also after you've had a regular core of paladins only one of them should have Kings and only one of them should have improved Might/Wisdom, etc.
I was putting some thought into this last night, as an addon author and thus as someone painfully familiar with the combat log and the info it provides.
The combat log just reports on things the game client knows about anyway. For instance, by the time a combat log event is generated for a spell cast, we already know the source and destination of that cast. Moreover, we know a lot about the source and destination. We know their name, their reaction (friendly, hostile, neutral), their type (player, pet, NPC, etc.), their distance, and so on.
So, to mostly break the Spy addon without breaking much else, the game client could avoid emitting combat log events when the source is a hostile player and they're more than, say, 50 yards away. Or... it could avoid emitting positive aura-change events for any hostile player, no matter the distance, which would cause the addon to fail to detect players mounting, eating/drinking, stealthing, changing stances/auras, and other things that only add or remove a buff. Or... it could report these events as today, but anonymize the name of the hostile player. Or...
My point is: they have options to break this functionality without harming (most) other addons. Most options do not require any more state than the game client already maintains. I suspect that they just don't see the addon as enough of a problem to warrant such a change.
Or to put it another way "Warts and All"
There should be 4-5 times as many servers because the max populations are much higher since the servers can support it.
There have already been serious concessions over bringing the classic's universe to modern hardware and the battlenet/legion client, breaking addon functionality for opposite faction members like this is one of those good changes.
I have no skin in this game, I play PvE because I knew exactly what PvP was going to be, since I dealt with nearly the same shit, just instead of 3-4 raid groups it was a either 5 rogues or a small guild of people camping a whole zone instead. People tried to tell me I was nuts (here on PA specifically), but I remember before battlegrounds showed up and it was exactly 100% what it is now for farming honor and there was a big hullabaloo about DHKs fucking with your honor and having to be real picky who you invited to honor farm in raids. I breathed this shit, it's no different, just on a much larger scale, again, one of the many concessions that is definitely gamebreaking from #nochanges
PvE servers exist.
Vanila had PVP. Vanilla is an as is experience.
This is roughly the equivalent to disliking talent trees and saying "what if we just got rid of talent trees?"
yeah but still what if
they turned off pvp on retail, it's warmode and elective now
There are still goobers who will flag pvp and attack civilians and quest givers to be dickwads regardless, though it is worse because of the merged zones to make them feel more alive. Before they did that most server lowbie areas were relatively dead and you could quest with ease, once in a blue moon maybe someone would attack a quest giver, now dudes from any server will show up and be jerks.
I think flagging world pvp willingly should toss you into the warmode phase and you should have to return to a city to turn it off.
Still, this was one of the better changes they could do. What's funny is this "roving pvp squad" thing is still common in warmode and people wonder why the opposite faction (usually alliance who has a ~40% buff to entice them to flag) don't participate. Gee because getting ganked is fucking awful and it's always been like this on pvp servers unless your faction had the imbalance.
I think a lot of PAers have been relatively sheltered from the harsh reality of what pvp is like for the losing side because the PA alliance and Shamblers have been relatively insulated just by the sheer numbers of their factions on those servers.
although I will say technically, War Mode does achieve that on some level
in SWG, if you complete the analogies between it and WoW... you were not allowed to use to what amounts to your Grand Marshal gear unless you were "permanently" flagged for PVP. "Permanent" in this case is largely what War Mode is. You declare in town, and when you leave town, you're stuck with it until you come back
This makes it harder for you to just turn it off when you don't like it, turn it on when you do, and reap the benefits at all times no matter what
You would have gotten much more organic world pvp on pve servers this way, with none of the ridiculously awful downsides of pvp servers
in retail as in not in classic? Does NPC camping happen in non-war mode retail now? I haven't really leveled anything since BFA launched so I wouldn't have seen it if it was happening in low level zones, which is where all the griefing usually happens, don't want to have to deal with players who could conceivable touch you while you're killing their flight masters and quest NPCs after all.
I was playing alts until classic's release, and yeah, they did, a lot. Westfall and Redridge* were pretty much camped every time I played to the point where I'd roll into the zone and get slammed with "under attack" messages... at which point I didn't even bother because in retail wow you can't move on to new hubs without following the breadcrumb quests, regardless of your level.
*(lol horde spy quest in redridge = good game design!)
Don't usually have time to hit dungeons to level so I switched to my warrior alt.
Hmm. This warrior is way more fun than warlock. So, guess this warrior is now my main and lock is my alt/ sugar daddy.
I mained warrior throughout vanilla/TBC, so kind of shocked I'm not tired of it. Not at all. I just love smashing faces.
https://classic.wowhead.com/news=296442/warsong-gulch-and-alterac-valley-battlegrounds-open-week-of-december-10th
Origin: theRealElMucho
I'm happy BGs are coming however, since they are actually fun.
lel
It'll be interesting and somewhat fitting considering the last time I played a mage for more than a hot minute was WoW beta (and I never made it past Feralas on that guy - servers went down while I was killing Gordunnis).
Blizzard: Pailryder#1101
GoG: https://www.gog.com/u/pailryder
I think we pulled like 4 minutes after scheduled start, and the final boss died 1 minute after scheduled raid end.. 3 hours
Ony + everything in MC except Domo and Rag down
Inquisitor77: Rius, you are Sisyphus and melee Wizard is your boulder
Tube: This must be what it felt like to be an Iraqi when Saddam was killed
Bookish Stickers - Mrs. Rius' Etsy shop with bumper stickers and vinyl decals.
But....but the warts!
Guess I'll just smite the crap outta defias wizards near goldshire for a while and build up some linen/copper to push onward.
Get a good wand, seriously a wand is actually better than chain-smiting for a good while
considering wanding requires no mana
slightly different because it’s my heal box and not solo but with my priest i just drop SW:P, holy shit or whatever that holy dot is called and then wand until my warrior needs to be healed
i never run out of mana and my DPS isn’t far behind the warrior’s
I think the macro is:
/cast shoot
/cast Shadow Word:Pain
Blizzard: Pailryder#1101
GoG: https://www.gog.com/u/pailryder
usually one cast of greater healing is the most my warrior needs during a fight to basically never have any down time
What they described is the shadow rotation until like 45 +
Unless you wanna Oom all the time
I lasted like 6-8 pulls between drinks going full melty.