-Loki-Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining.Registered Userregular
Couple of rules queries that are bugging me.
Genestealers have a stratagem’Telepathic Summons’ that summons a unit with the power level equal or less than you roll on 3D6. It says nothing about upgrades - can the summoned unit have upgrades?
Timing - a Biophagus can augment an Aberrant unit at the end of the movement phase. Deploying from Underground happens at the end of the movement phase. Can a Biophagus deploy from Underground and then augment a squad in the same turn?
My main opponent plays Drukhari, and I see Archons still get their Shadowfield. How to you roll saves for this thing considering it can pop and be removed from the model? One wound at a time until it pops?
I feel it's like a field gun breaking down in a few and setting up as just quick
So the one techmarine breaks it down, shoves it over 3" and then sets it right back up again? At least the thunderfire gun or rapier batteries have little tank treads to move them 3".
Timing - a Biophagus can augment an Aberrant unit at the end of the movement phase. Deploying from Underground happens at the end of the movement phase. Can a Biophagus deploy from Underground and then augment a squad in the same turn?
I'm not sure the exact wording of the rule or the faq, but in 9th ed, units coming in from reserve happen in the "reserve step" of the movement phase, and not "at the end of the movement phase", so they should be fair game for those interactions.
Also, any interactions that do conflict with timing are resolved by the current-turn player, I'm pretty sure (too lazy to track down the source though... I think its in the advanced rules)
My main opponent plays Drukhari, and I see Archons still get their Shadowfield. How to you roll saves for this thing considering it can pop and be removed from the model? One wound at a time until it pops?
Yes, one at a time. That's how they've always been. It's equal parts exciting and infuriating.
Part of the issue with the way GW releases rules is that it's impossible to see the full scope of their ideas until you get several supplements down the road. It's the curse of being tied to print media but it's hard to understand some of their design choices when we don't have the full breadth of their plans. I'm sure they have most of 9th ed. planned out internally and how it will all fit together as new books release...but that's a black box to us.
I'm iffy about any statement that GW has a plan on how things are going to fit together. They probably do, but their plans tend to not survive contact with the players. Which is how you get Iron Hands crushing people and the resulting change to how Doctrines work (among other things) because GW didn't imagine that a chapter that gained a larger advantage in one doctrine would want to stay in that doctrine.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
Part of the issue with the way GW releases rules is that it's impossible to see the full scope of their ideas until you get several supplements down the road. It's the curse of being tied to print media but it's hard to understand some of their design choices when we don't have the full breadth of their plans. I'm sure they have most of 9th ed. planned out internally and how it will all fit together as new books release...but that's a black box to us.
I'm iffy about any statement that GW has a plan on how things are going to fit together. They probably do, but their plans tend to not survive contact with the players. Which is how you get Iron Hands crushing people and the resulting change to how Doctrines work (among other things) because GW didn't imagine that a chapter that gained a larger advantage in one doctrine would want to stay in that doctrine.
Yeah, the tail end of 8th really didn't give me much faith that GW have a cohesive long term plan for how they want to update their rules. Between specialist detachments being introduced then removed, the Psychic Awakening campaign being bizarrely inconsistent, and a single faction receiving Codex supplements as well as a general outrageous level of power creep, it's not been great.
It's good that they're being reasonably reactive to issues that arise, but it also very much feels like they've just been throwing new things at the wall and seeing what sticks.
If that means a horribly balanced game for 6 months, oh well
Space Marines sucked for a long stretch in 8th, so unless the plan then was "sell Eldar" I think a more realistic explanation is that GW is simply bad at balancing the game.
If that means a horribly balanced game for 6 months, oh well
Space Marines sucked for a long stretch in 8th, so unless the plan then was "sell Eldar" I think a more realistic explanation is that GW is simply bad at balancing the game.
Really I feel after the Space Marine Necron codex it will either be the tyranids or the glut of the various flavors of eldar {As lelith hesperax being in plastic is a start as Drazzar got his last year so they leaves only urien rakarth for the Drukkari
THe Craftworlds need a ton converted over from finecast as I feel they are the worst ones doomed with it out of everyone }
I feel the problem with Balance is they are playing a few games with say a mix of assault marines and primaris for the Space Marines as the other side is can be anything from a horde of tyranids to CSM but it comes down to the fate of the dice and how you maneuvered your army
I don't think they are running computer sims of it but real games as someone might have a lucky streak with Reivers so GW says they don't need a buff
It's just a really complex issue with no easy answer
Part of the issue with the way GW releases rules is that it's impossible to see the full scope of their ideas until you get several supplements down the road. It's the curse of being tied to print media but it's hard to understand some of their design choices when we don't have the full breadth of their plans. I'm sure they have most of 9th ed. planned out internally and how it will all fit together as new books release...but that's a black box to us.
I'm iffy about any statement that GW has a plan on how things are going to fit together. They probably do, but their plans tend to not survive contact with the players. Which is how you get Iron Hands crushing people and the resulting change to how Doctrines work (among other things) because GW didn't imagine that a chapter that gained a larger advantage in one doctrine would want to stay in that doctrine.
Yeah, the tail end of 8th really didn't give me much faith that GW have a cohesive long term plan for how they want to update their rules. Between specialist detachments being introduced then removed, the Psychic Awakening campaign being bizarrely inconsistent, and a single faction receiving Codex supplements as well as a general outrageous level of power creep, it's not been great.
It's good that they're being reasonably reactive to issues that arise, but it also very much feels like they've just been throwing new things at the wall and seeing what sticks.
Having watched a couple of the 9th edition battle reports from tabletop tactics, those guys have had access to stuff we haven't heard about for months now and have repeatedly stated that with the 9th core rules out we only have about 1/3rd of the whole picture for what 9th will look like.
They're pretty emphatic that, while everything won't be perfect, 9th will be substantially better (and better balanced) than 8th once more material gets released and the whole picture is there.
My biggest hope is that they flush out the Codices at least two a month, so all the armies can get up to speed with their new rules, and then focus 9th primarily on campaign content.
I keep hearing the claim that a lot of the points values make sense in light of unreleased Codexes, and that's a fucking puzzler to me considering that we know the very first 9th books are getting released in October.
Maybe don't balance the game so that you're paying for rules which don't exist for the next 3+ months?
If that means a horribly balanced game for 6 months, oh well
Space Marines sucked for a long stretch in 8th, so unless the plan then was "sell Eldar" I think a more realistic explanation is that GW is simply bad at balancing the game.
The point is that they've got a whole suite of new Marine models lined up but can't produce more than a wet fart in terms of the rules/app/balance being polished for release
Which one do you think is more important to them?
gt: Bobby2Socks | steam: Billy Boot-Snatcher
You talk clean and bomb hospitals, so I speak with the foulest mouth possible
I am probably wrong about this, but I really like the new Necron Royal Warden due to the objective oriented gameplay of 9th / the smaller maps. His ability seems strong.
I don't understand why he isn't an elite, though, and that basically kills him.
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
To add better content than dumb Biz musings, some alleged leaks for Necrons. Spiders might be good now and heavy destroyers look like they're getting replaced...? No special rules listed in the more normal codex looking ones, but apparently it's also like that on the leaked Marines bits. Theories abound as to the why, but, /shrug.
Bizazedo on
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
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No-QuarterNothing To FearBut Fear ItselfRegistered Userregular
Any Tau players here?
My buddy and I are playing a 500 pt Patrol and he's new to the hobby. I can walk him through gameplay including how Marker Lights work, but I'm not really familiar with how their list gets built, so I was wondering what you guys would think is decent for a Patrol. He has plenty of models to choose from, but no Stealth Suits.
For reference I'm taking my Deathguard- Lord of Contagion, 10 Plague Marines- Fist and Plasma gun on the Asp and 2 Blightlaunchers in the squad, and a Dred with a Fist/TL Heavy Bolter.
Idk about 500 points but Riptides were the backbone for the army in 8th, dunno about 9th. 500 pts sounds tough for an army that is supposed to be some very heavy platforms supported by a lot of chaff. Maybe some crisis suits kitted out with fusion blasters?
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No-QuarterNothing To FearBut Fear ItselfRegistered Userregular
Here's what I cooked up-
HQ- Cadre Fireblade
Troops- 2 Units of 10 Firewarriors with Pulse Rifles, 10 Kroot
Elite-3 Crisis Suits with a single Burstcannon each
Heavy Support- Broadside with the Rail Rifle and 2 Smart Missile Systems.
The only thing I don't like there are the lack of weapon options on the suits. I guess I could shave out like 3 or 4 Firewarriors to upkit the guns. Burst Cannons are good, but they're not ideal vs Deathguard. It seems a Plasma Rifle is the same price.
I fiddled with the points. I dropped 3 FW and gave all the Suits 2 Plasma guns. That seems pretty solid.
I don't have point costs in front of me... anything you can cut to add some drone support?
Get a couple of small screens in place to keep things off the infantry for a turn?
Thats what the Kroot do
+1
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No-QuarterNothing To FearBut Fear ItselfRegistered Userregular
I could dump the Kroot for 60 pts, is that enough???
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No-QuarterNothing To FearBut Fear ItselfRegistered Userregular
I can get 2 units of 4 Drones by dumping the Kroot, and having one of the Firewarrior teams be a 5 man.
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StragintDo Not GiftAlways DeclinesRegistered Userregular
Damn, this reminds me that I need to remake my Tau list that runs the eight and then mechs. I wonder what I can do now with the new points.
I saw a picture of some Necrons painted up with blue kind of how I was planning it and it looked so boring, I'm not sure if it was stipp WIP progress but it didn't seem like it and I'm heavily questioning blue now. I bought the blue themed Necron playmat so I feel kind of compelled to do blue. I should stick to the multi dynasty thing but I feel like it will look too messy. Orange could be good, that is complimentary to blue.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
The best Necron paint scheme I've seen recently was all white with metallic joints and a bit of gold. Made them look like they were made of ceramic.
Probably an absolute pain to paint, but it looked good.
Yea, that was one of the paint schemes I was looking at when I was considering doing a multi dynasty super dynasty.
My new big hang up now that I've decided to not so the multi dynasty thing is the playmat. Since I bought the blue themed Necron playmat from frontline gaming I'm feeling compelled to match it and then I over think the whole thing.
I'm really awful at choosing a paint scheme. Since I'm never gonna do tournaments and I'm just gonna play with my friends I might just give up and not paint them so I can stop getting stress headaches.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
The best Necron paint scheme I've seen recently was all white with metallic joints and a bit of gold. Made them look like they were made of ceramic.
Probably an absolute pain to paint, but it looked good.
Its traumatic just reading that
Seems straight forward enough, black undercoat to bring out the metallics and get the black lining in, then just a few layers of White Scar over the top...
Has a good white coat ever been as simple as a few coats of white scar?
+2
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StragintDo Not GiftAlways DeclinesRegistered Userregular
So weird mail mishap it seems today.
I did that order through frontline gaming for the Necron terrain complete set and playmat in June and got the order in early July.
Got a package today that was a duplicate of that order, same playmat and complete terrain set.
I wasn't charged twice, my order only had 1 of the product so I'm not sure how it happened. My order shows awaiting shipment still so that is the only guess I have.
Either way I emailed them to see how I can send it back. I'm really hoping returning it wont be a hassle.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
I lucked out with Shadowspear; I bought a box from the local GW store just as I was moving overseas. I didn’t open it until Christmas and was missing two sprues including the suppressors and eliminators. When I called customer service they were a little skeptical and “wanted pictures of the missing sprues” which I figured was illustrated by lining up all the other sprues in a configuration matching the instructions. That was satisfactory enough for customer service who then sent me (in order) a Start Collecting: Primaris Vanguard, another Shadowspear box, and finally about a month after the two missing sprues wrapped in bubble-wrap. To be honest I felt a little guilty about all the extras. Not guilty enough to do anything other than paint the lot of them.
Actually I did give some of the extra infiltrators away to my buddy:
So if I have the Necron side of Indomitus and the new Szeras what would be a good addition for a 2k necron army?
Depends on how you want to play. Also hard to say until the new codex comes out.
If you plan on using the Warriors a lot then ghost arks are good.
Immortals are also a good choice, the same stat line as the old Space Marines with better leadership and some mean guns.
I love destroyers, they are real mean with some support.
Wraiths are also cool if you want to focus more melee. 3+ invul saves at all times with 3 wounds and they can tear stuff up in close combat. Still a little bummed out they lost the ability to fall back and still be able to shoot and charge.
Triarch Praetorians are apparently getting buffed which could make them good melee options, they are essentially jetpack infantry. The Lychguard are kind of gimmicky melee units, they can be fun but die pretty easily.
Tomb blades are a solid choice for moving around fast and putting the hurt on infantry models.
Those are the ones I've used throughout 8th and I doubt they would ever be bad purchases.
Doomsday arks and doom scythe are also good and for a while in 8th they seemed to be auto picks for competitive, I think it was 3 of either the ark or scythe or 3 of both, I don't remember. You can also magnetize the scythe to be a night scythe so it can drop off units from reserve.
Catacomb command barge is also a good pick for another HQ option, especially since it gives quantum shielding which is the bane of weapons that do high damage. It can be used as a ranged or melee option, I really enjoy the melee option.
So if you want to expand into shooting you want warriors, immortals, destroyers, and tomb blades.
Melee would be wraiths and potentially Praetorians.
For long range big hitters you would use the doomsday ark and doom scythe.
Transports would be ghost ark which can only carry Warriors and the night scythe which can transport any infantry.
PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
Finally getting around to build some Indomitus. Built an interssaulter sergeant last night who I'm going to prime and paint up as my test model, get my color journal written down and then paint the rest. I'm a little annoyed that GW included a helmeted option for the sergeant...but then forced you in to the heavy bolt pistol/chainsword at their side option to use it. Unless you want your dude to be carrying two chain swords or a spare helmet which makes no sense.
Finally getting around to build some Indomitus. Built an interssaulter sergeant last night who I'm going to prime and paint up as my test model, get my color journal written down and then paint the rest. I'm a little annoyed that GW included a helmeted option for the sergeant...but then forced you in to the heavy bolt pistol/chainsword at their side option to use it. Unless you want your dude to be carrying two chain swords or a spare helmet which makes no sense.
You need to kitbash him to carry two swords, helmeted, with a spare helmet.
Posts
Genestealers have a stratagem’Telepathic Summons’ that summons a unit with the power level equal or less than you roll on 3D6. It says nothing about upgrades - can the summoned unit have upgrades?
Timing - a Biophagus can augment an Aberrant unit at the end of the movement phase. Deploying from Underground happens at the end of the movement phase. Can a Biophagus deploy from Underground and then augment a squad in the same turn?
My main opponent plays Drukhari, and I see Archons still get their Shadowfield. How to you roll saves for this thing considering it can pop and be removed from the model? One wound at a time until it pops?
So the one techmarine breaks it down, shoves it over 3" and then sets it right back up again? At least the thunderfire gun or rapier batteries have little tank treads to move them 3".
I'm not sure the exact wording of the rule or the faq, but in 9th ed, units coming in from reserve happen in the "reserve step" of the movement phase, and not "at the end of the movement phase", so they should be fair game for those interactions.
Also, any interactions that do conflict with timing are resolved by the current-turn player, I'm pretty sure (too lazy to track down the source though... I think its in the advanced rules)
Yes, one at a time. That's how they've always been. It's equal parts exciting and infuriating.
I'm iffy about any statement that GW has a plan on how things are going to fit together. They probably do, but their plans tend to not survive contact with the players. Which is how you get Iron Hands crushing people and the resulting change to how Doctrines work (among other things) because GW didn't imagine that a chapter that gained a larger advantage in one doctrine would want to stay in that doctrine.
Yeah, the tail end of 8th really didn't give me much faith that GW have a cohesive long term plan for how they want to update their rules. Between specialist detachments being introduced then removed, the Psychic Awakening campaign being bizarrely inconsistent, and a single faction receiving Codex supplements as well as a general outrageous level of power creep, it's not been great.
It's good that they're being reasonably reactive to issues that arise, but it also very much feels like they've just been throwing new things at the wall and seeing what sticks.
If that means a horribly balanced game for 6 months, oh well
You talk clean and bomb hospitals, so I speak with the foulest mouth possible
Also, 500 point game maps are small.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
Space Marines sucked for a long stretch in 8th, so unless the plan then was "sell Eldar" I think a more realistic explanation is that GW is simply bad at balancing the game.
Really I feel after the Space Marine Necron codex it will either be the tyranids or the glut of the various flavors of eldar {As lelith hesperax being in plastic is a start as Drazzar got his last year so they leaves only urien rakarth for the Drukkari
THe Craftworlds need a ton converted over from finecast as I feel they are the worst ones doomed with it out of everyone }
I feel the problem with Balance is they are playing a few games with say a mix of assault marines and primaris for the Space Marines as the other side is can be anything from a horde of tyranids to CSM but it comes down to the fate of the dice and how you maneuvered your army
I don't think they are running computer sims of it but real games as someone might have a lucky streak with Reivers so GW says they don't need a buff
It's just a really complex issue with no easy answer
Having watched a couple of the 9th edition battle reports from tabletop tactics, those guys have had access to stuff we haven't heard about for months now and have repeatedly stated that with the 9th core rules out we only have about 1/3rd of the whole picture for what 9th will look like.
They're pretty emphatic that, while everything won't be perfect, 9th will be substantially better (and better balanced) than 8th once more material gets released and the whole picture is there.
My biggest hope is that they flush out the Codices at least two a month, so all the armies can get up to speed with their new rules, and then focus 9th primarily on campaign content.
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
Maybe don't balance the game so that you're paying for rules which don't exist for the next 3+ months?
The point is that they've got a whole suite of new Marine models lined up but can't produce more than a wet fart in terms of the rules/app/balance being polished for release
Which one do you think is more important to them?
You talk clean and bomb hospitals, so I speak with the foulest mouth possible
I don't understand why he isn't an elite, though, and that basically kills him.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
My buddy and I are playing a 500 pt Patrol and he's new to the hobby. I can walk him through gameplay including how Marker Lights work, but I'm not really familiar with how their list gets built, so I was wondering what you guys would think is decent for a Patrol. He has plenty of models to choose from, but no Stealth Suits.
For reference I'm taking my Deathguard- Lord of Contagion, 10 Plague Marines- Fist and Plasma gun on the Asp and 2 Blightlaunchers in the squad, and a Dred with a Fist/TL Heavy Bolter.
HQ- Cadre Fireblade
Troops- 2 Units of 10 Firewarriors with Pulse Rifles, 10 Kroot
Elite-3 Crisis Suits with a single Burstcannon each
Heavy Support- Broadside with the Rail Rifle and 2 Smart Missile Systems.
The only thing I don't like there are the lack of weapon options on the suits. I guess I could shave out like 3 or 4 Firewarriors to upkit the guns. Burst Cannons are good, but they're not ideal vs Deathguard. It seems a Plasma Rifle is the same price.
I fiddled with the points. I dropped 3 FW and gave all the Suits 2 Plasma guns. That seems pretty solid.
Get a couple of small screens in place to keep things off the infantry for a turn?
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
Thats what the Kroot do
I saw a picture of some Necrons painted up with blue kind of how I was planning it and it looked so boring, I'm not sure if it was stipp WIP progress but it didn't seem like it and I'm heavily questioning blue now. I bought the blue themed Necron playmat so I feel kind of compelled to do blue. I should stick to the multi dynasty thing but I feel like it will look too messy. Orange could be good, that is complimentary to blue.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Probably an absolute pain to paint, but it looked good.
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
Its traumatic just reading that
My Let's Play Channel: https://youtube.com/channel/UC2go70QLfwGq-hW4nvUqmog
Yea, that was one of the paint schemes I was looking at when I was considering doing a multi dynasty super dynasty.
My new big hang up now that I've decided to not so the multi dynasty thing is the playmat. Since I bought the blue themed Necron playmat from frontline gaming I'm feeling compelled to match it and then I over think the whole thing.
I'm really awful at choosing a paint scheme. Since I'm never gonna do tournaments and I'm just gonna play with my friends I might just give up and not paint them so I can stop getting stress headaches.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Seems straight forward enough, black undercoat to bring out the metallics and get the black lining in, then just a few layers of White Scar over the top...
I did that order through frontline gaming for the Necron terrain complete set and playmat in June and got the order in early July.
Got a package today that was a duplicate of that order, same playmat and complete terrain set.
I wasn't charged twice, my order only had 1 of the product so I'm not sure how it happened. My order shows awaiting shipment still so that is the only guess I have.
Either way I emailed them to see how I can send it back. I'm really hoping returning it wont be a hassle.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
Actually I did give some of the extra infiltrators away to my buddy:
Depends on how you want to play. Also hard to say until the new codex comes out.
If you plan on using the Warriors a lot then ghost arks are good.
Immortals are also a good choice, the same stat line as the old Space Marines with better leadership and some mean guns.
I love destroyers, they are real mean with some support.
Wraiths are also cool if you want to focus more melee. 3+ invul saves at all times with 3 wounds and they can tear stuff up in close combat. Still a little bummed out they lost the ability to fall back and still be able to shoot and charge.
Triarch Praetorians are apparently getting buffed which could make them good melee options, they are essentially jetpack infantry. The Lychguard are kind of gimmicky melee units, they can be fun but die pretty easily.
Tomb blades are a solid choice for moving around fast and putting the hurt on infantry models.
Those are the ones I've used throughout 8th and I doubt they would ever be bad purchases.
Doomsday arks and doom scythe are also good and for a while in 8th they seemed to be auto picks for competitive, I think it was 3 of either the ark or scythe or 3 of both, I don't remember. You can also magnetize the scythe to be a night scythe so it can drop off units from reserve.
Catacomb command barge is also a good pick for another HQ option, especially since it gives quantum shielding which is the bane of weapons that do high damage. It can be used as a ranged or melee option, I really enjoy the melee option.
So if you want to expand into shooting you want warriors, immortals, destroyers, and tomb blades.
Melee would be wraiths and potentially Praetorians.
For long range big hitters you would use the doomsday ark and doom scythe.
Transports would be ghost ark which can only carry Warriors and the night scythe which can transport any infantry.
What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak
I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
You need to kitbash him to carry two swords, helmeted, with a spare helmet.
Never be unprepared.
Gamertag - Khraul
PSN - Razide6
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
Was that the Made to Order figure they had in march or April?
Yeah, came as a set with Varus, which is why I ordered it. Mine hasn't shipped yet.