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[Hiberno-Britannic Politics] Yesterday, The Troubles Seemed So Far Away

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    AntinumericAntinumeric Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    My mum is 69 so isn't getting the vaccine yet, but she has a lot of pre-existing conditions. I'm more concerned for her than myself.

    In this moment, I am euphoric. Not because of any phony god’s blessing. But because, I am enlightened by my intelligence.
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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    So shitty
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-fish-trade-uk-eu-lorries-exports-b1784312.html

    Choice quotes
    Seafood is highly perishable and relies on a seamless flow across borders, but small test consignments sent to France and Spain that would normally take one day are now taking three or more days, if they get through at all.

    It is also taking five hours for firms to secure a health certificate from authorities, a document required to apply for other customs paperwork.
    ...
    David Noble, another exporter who buys from Scottish fleets to export to Europe, told the same agency that the new Brexit bureaucracy was costing between £500-£600 pounds a day and wiping out most of the profit.

    So looks like the fishing industry wasn't saved after all.

    On the plus side this is good for sealife.

    I haven't noticed any issues with food coming into the UK, which is an extremely pleasant surprise.

    Is this good for sea life? It's not like they throw the fish back and they get to live.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    AntinumericAntinumeric Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    klemming wrote: »
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-fish-trade-uk-eu-lorries-exports-b1784312.html

    Choice quotes
    Seafood is highly perishable and relies on a seamless flow across borders, but small test consignments sent to France and Spain that would normally take one day are now taking three or more days, if they get through at all.

    It is also taking five hours for firms to secure a health certificate from authorities, a document required to apply for other customs paperwork.
    ...
    David Noble, another exporter who buys from Scottish fleets to export to Europe, told the same agency that the new Brexit bureaucracy was costing between £500-£600 pounds a day and wiping out most of the profit.

    So looks like the fishing industry wasn't saved after all.

    On the plus side this is good for sealife.

    I haven't noticed any issues with food coming into the UK, which is an extremely pleasant surprise.

    Is this good for sea life? It's not like they throw the fish back and they get to live.

    Well I was hoping they'd fish less if they don't make a profit on it.

    In this moment, I am euphoric. Not because of any phony god’s blessing. But because, I am enlightened by my intelligence.
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    japanjapan Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-fish-trade-uk-eu-lorries-exports-b1784312.html

    Choice quotes
    Seafood is highly perishable and relies on a seamless flow across borders, but small test consignments sent to France and Spain that would normally take one day are now taking three or more days, if they get through at all.

    It is also taking five hours for firms to secure a health certificate from authorities, a document required to apply for other customs paperwork.
    ...
    David Noble, another exporter who buys from Scottish fleets to export to Europe, told the same agency that the new Brexit bureaucracy was costing between £500-£600 pounds a day and wiping out most of the profit.

    So looks like the fishing industry wasn't saved after all.

    On the plus side this is good for sealife.

    I haven't noticed any issues with food coming into the UK, which is an extremely pleasant surprise.

    Is this good for sea life? It's not like they throw the fish back and they get to live.

    Well I was hoping they'd fish less if they don't make a profit on it.

    I think that's the opposite of what happened last time

    Part of the reasoning behind the introduction of the quota system was that the falling price of fish was driving boat operators to pursue more and bigger catches to stay profitable

    Fishing needs a lot of up front investment, the risk that you're taking in the industry is that you can recover your outlay with a profit on top, sometimes over a period of years

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    ZiggymonZiggymon Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    So shitty
    So you know this whole, schools are closed right now to all except key workers kids and vulnerable children? to help control infections?

    Well due to our amazing Government, they slowly decided to change the requirements to be part of the KW & V students.

    This includes stuff like;

    "If your child doesn't have access to a laptop"

    You know that world beating scheme or giving all disadvantaged students a laptop and internet access to help with studies that never materialised? well instead, send them back to school.

    "If only 1 parent is a key worker" in a dual parent household.

    and work categories that include

    "Part time KFC staff" and "Part time car sales"

    Are now being told they can apply for full time education on the KW&V students.

    So what does this mean? Well, take my room mate who is a primary school teacher with a cohort of 500 children at her school. She gets an emergency meeting to say that her school now will have over 350 children who will be classed as KW&V and need to be educated in school lessons as normal. Last March her school had 30 children maximum.

    In addition to this there are cases that parents who are critical Key workers have had applications for their children to be educated at school rejected because school places are filled up to capacity now, with children who actually don't need to be there.

    Ziggymon on
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    SharpyVIISharpyVII Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    Yeah I've several similar stories.

    The roads are much much busier than the lockdown in March.

    Doesn't seem to be anywhere near as comprehensive as the March lockdown in reality.

    Which will only prolong things.

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    Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo We are only now beginning to understand the full power and ramifications of sexual intercourse Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    All the inconvenience, none of the benefit

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
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    Redcoat-13Redcoat-13 Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    Ziggymon wrote: »
    So you know this whole, schools are closed right now to all except key workers kids and vulnerable children? to help control infections?

    Well due to our amazing Government, they slowly decided to change the requirements to be part of the KW & V students.

    This includes stuff like;

    "If your child doesn't have access to a laptop"

    You know that world beating scheme or giving all disadvantaged students a laptop and internet access to help with studies that never materialised? well instead, send them back to school.

    "If only 1 parent is a key worker" in a dual parent household.

    and work categories that include

    "Part time KFC staff" and "Part time car sales"

    Are now being told they can apply for full time education on the KW&V students.

    So what does this mean? Well, take my room mate who is a primary school teacher with a cohort of 500 children at her school. She gets an emergency meeting to say that her school now will have over 350 children who will be classed as KW&V and need to be educated in school lessons as normal. Last March her school had 30 children maximum.

    In addition to this there are cases that parents who are critical Key workers have had applications for their children to be educated at school rejected because school places are filled up to capacity now, with children who actually don't need to be there.

    Yeah, my wife is a teacher. She was asked by her school to write the letter that her union recommended to, which effectively said "I don't feel safe, so I'm not coming in, but I'll be available to look after key worker and vulnerable childen".

    Her school exclusively deals with children with behavioural issues, so they're all vulnerable, so the school after getting all the letters went "right, you're all coming in". There's not been any risk assessment as far as she knows, so quite why they let the child come in who is known for spitting (yes, they came in the next day, and yes they spat, so got sent home for the rest of the week).

    It's farcical; when September started, this school of 90+ kids had one bubble, so when one staff member went down with symptoms, the whole school closed. Other highlights include my wife's teacher friend at the school being given a time table which said today she would be on her own. They emailed the admin the entire week about this, but got no response. They shouldn't be on their own even in normal times.

    Oh and if a child is violent towards a teacher, they're meant to get excluded. It doesn't work like that. My wife got sexually assaulted by one of these kids, and he was in the next day. Member of the board got headbutted one time; that child got excluded though. Not really sure how that works.

    Teachers aren't meant to teach; they're meant to babysit so both sets of parents go to work to fuel the economy. This government couldn't give a fuck about teachers.

    Redcoat-13 on
    PSN Fleety2009
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    PirateQueenPirateQueen Registered User regular
    So sorry to hear that @Redcoat-13 : (
    That's truly horrifying

    Over the past few months, I've written rec letters for several of my former dissertation students who got offered posts as teaching assistants in elementary schools

    I felt really happy for them for finding career opportunities during these chaotic times
    After reading your post, I kind of wish they were still unemployed : (

    So... if any of them get pushed into a dangerous situation like that, aren't there reporting procedures for that?

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    ZiggymonZiggymon Registered User regular
    So shitty
    Redcoat-13 wrote: »
    Ziggymon wrote: »
    So you know this whole, schools are closed right now to all except key workers kids and vulnerable children? to help control infections?

    Well due to our amazing Government, they slowly decided to change the requirements to be part of the KW & V students.

    This includes stuff like;

    "If your child doesn't have access to a laptop"

    You know that world beating scheme or giving all disadvantaged students a laptop and internet access to help with studies that never materialised? well instead, send them back to school.

    "If only 1 parent is a key worker" in a dual parent household.

    and work categories that include

    "Part time KFC staff" and "Part time car sales"

    Are now being told they can apply for full time education on the KW&V students.

    So what does this mean? Well, take my room mate who is a primary school teacher with a cohort of 500 children at her school. She gets an emergency meeting to say that her school now will have over 350 children who will be classed as KW&V and need to be educated in school lessons as normal. Last March her school had 30 children maximum.

    In addition to this there are cases that parents who are critical Key workers have had applications for their children to be educated at school rejected because school places are filled up to capacity now, with children who actually don't need to be there.

    Yeah, my wife is a teacher. She was asked by her school to write the letter that her union recommended to, which effectively said "I don't feel safe, so I'm not coming in, but I'll be available to look after key worker and vulnerable childen".

    Her school exclusively deals with children with behavioural issues, so they're all vulnerable, so the school after getting all the letters went "right, you're all coming in". There's not been any risk assessment as far as she knows, so quite why they let the child come in who is known for spitting (yes, they came in the next day, and yes they spat, so got sent home for the rest of the week).

    It's farcical; when September started, this school of 90+ kids had one bubble, so when one staff member went down with symptoms, the whole school closed. Other highlights include my wife's teacher friend at the school being given a time table which said today she would be on her own. They emailed the admin the entire week about this, but got no response. They shouldn't be on their own even in normal times.

    Oh and if a child is violent towards a teacher, they're meant to get excluded. It doesn't work like that. My wife got sexually assaulted by one of these kids, and he was in the next day. Member of the board got headbutted one time; that child got excluded though. Not really sure how that works.

    Teachers aren't meant to teach; they're meant to babysit so both sets of parents go to work to fuel the economy. This government couldn't give a fuck about teachers.

    Yeah the horror stories I can tell you in secondary schools where kids have assaulted, sexually assaulted attempted to murder teachers and basically nothing happens because school leaders are in fear of the repercussions or the press from events so they are sweeping them under the rug so to speak.

    Because of these new provisions it means teachers are teaching full time in schools on top of preparing delivering remote learning either live or pre-recorded, some paying huge sums of money to have the right equipment. This all includes the need to produce robust assessment. Staff are basically working two teaching jobs now.

    The whole announcement by Gavin Williamson about teachers determining grades this summer? Well they are still discussing with OFQUAL and exam boards about how that will work. SO the reality is that its most likely that schools will still have to be heavily moderated by outside sources.

    The icing on the cake? Announced today that OFSTED will still be doing school inspections during this lockdown.

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    BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    Ziggymon wrote: »
    The icing on the cake? Announced today that OFSTED will still be doing school inspections during this lockdown.

    Jesus fucking Christ. After the last twelve months everyone working in healthcare and education needs to have their salary doubled.

    Burnage on
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    japanjapan Registered User regular
    Burnage wrote: »
    Ziggymon wrote: »
    The icing on the cake? Announced today that OFSTED will still be doing school inspections during this lockdown.

    Jesus fucking Christ. After the last twelve months everyone working in healthcare and education needs to have their salary doubled.

    I think this is to do with Williamson

    He was encouraging parents not happy with their school's online provision to report them to Ofsted

    There is a social media counter movement of parents sending praise for their schools instead

    Teaching unions and schools have, of course, been telling anyone in government that will listen for literally months now that neither they nor their pupils are equipped or staffed for online provision, and the constantly changing position of the government as to what teaching arrangements are actually going to be from week to week means it is impossible to prepare any kind of workable curriculum

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    Redcoat-13Redcoat-13 Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    So sorry to hear that Redcoat-13 : (
    That's truly horrifying

    Over the past few months, I've written rec letters for several of my former dissertation students who got offered posts as teaching assistants in elementary schools

    I felt really happy for them for finding career opportunities during these chaotic times
    After reading your post, I kind of wish they were still unemployed : (

    So... if any of them get pushed into a dangerous situation like that, aren't there reporting procedures for that?

    It's going to depend on the school; my wife has been to many schools, and generally has gotten very little support. They might have a process to report it, but then who knows if anything gets done. I believe the "teaching world" is quite small, so if you kick up a fuss....then it gets around. That said, I know the local school near me is well run, and do a lot to look after their teachers.

    My very limited advice is to refer stuff to your union, which most teachers are in. The biggest one (the name escapes me), is the more militant and will fight your corner.

    I don't know why you'd be a TA unless you loved the idea; the pay is awful (barely minimum wage), stressful depending on the school, and you don't generally get paid for the holidays you have to take.

    PSN Fleety2009
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    PirateQueenPirateQueen Registered User regular
    TBH I think some of my former students chose this as something they can do at the moment while figuring out plans for MScs etc. : /
    Should I have encouraged them to pick safer ways to earn some money, like knife juggling and lion taming?

    TY for the advice @Redcoat-13
    Luckily, sounds like my former students have been doing OK thus far and won't need this, but I'm glad to hear there's help available just in case...
    I hope your wife will be in a safer situation soon (e.g. with the well-run local school you mentioned)
    Burnage wrote: »
    Jesus fucking Christ. After the last twelve months everyone working in healthcare and education needs to have their salary doubled.
    Hear, hear!

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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    Teachers should be paid Doctor level salaries even without a pandemic

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    BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    The closest I came to murdering someone in 2020 was being told by a well-meaning yet badly misinformed individual that "universities are closed and their staff are furloughed"

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    PirateQueenPirateQueen Registered User regular
    Mwahaha
    If you do happen to decapitate someone after such well-meaning comments @Burnage , I'll gladly testify at your trial and confirm all uni staff are a bit homicidal at the moment...

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    tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    The Oxford vaccine trial was botched pretty badly so I have my doubts about its final efficacy. Not that it doesn't work but one can't really tell because they fucked it up.

    Fortunately it has very clear effacacy against hospitalizations and deaths, which are the key thing that you (as a responsible individual who will not treat the vaccine as a permission slip to party) will want in the short term.

    The trial wasn't botched that badly. Effacacy is somewhere between 60 and 90% at preventing symptomatic infection.

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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    surrealitychecksurrealitycheck lonely, but not unloved dreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered User regular
    So awesome
    just endless stupid news

    46000 nhs staff have covid because gov immunisation priorities

    gov mysteriously being informed its deal is bad in the obvious ways it was bad

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/10/baffling-brexit-rules-threaten-export-chaos-gove-is-warned
    Amid mounting anger among UK firms at cross-border friction they were told would not exist, British manufacturing and trade organisations met Cabinet Office minister Michael Gove in an emergency session on Thursday to discuss problems resulting from the deal struck by Boris Johnson with the EU before Christmas.

    One leading figure involved in the talks with Gove described the new rule book as a “complete shitshow”. Another said Gove seemed “very concerned” at hearing reports of problems, after a week in which Marks & Spencer was among leading companies to warn that more bureaucracy would increase costs. The source added: “He [Gove] seemed to realise the full gravity of the situation that is unfolding and about to get worse.”

    Gove admitted on Friday that there would be “significant additional disruption” at UK borders as a result of Brexit customs changes in the coming weeks...

    obF2Wuw.png
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    AegisAegis Fear My Dance Overshot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered User regular
    Gove admitted on Friday that there would be “significant additional disruption” at UK borders as a result of Brexit customs changes in the coming weeks...

    Oh, you don't say.

    We'll see how long this blog lasts
    Currently DMing: None :(
    Characters
    [5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
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    evilthecatevilthecat Registered User regular
    So awesome
    honestly at this point we need a bot that responds to this sort of thing with one of the brexit slogans.

    so for this one, "we hold all the cards" seems appropriate.

    tip.. tip.. TALLY.. HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
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    japanjapan Registered User regular
    Whelp, Labour is now formally also a brexiteer party

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    klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    So shitty
    Matt Hancock can fuck all the way off. Not for the usual stuff this time, either:
    Trump Twitter ban 'raises regulation questions' - Hancock
    Bans imposed by Twitter, Facebook and Instagram on Donald Trump's accounts raise a "very big question" about how social media is regulated, Health Secretary Matt Hancock has said.

    The companies acted after supporters of the US president stormed Washington DC's Capitol building on Wednesday.

    Mr Hancock said the bans showed they were now "taking editorial decisions".

    Mr Hancock, a former culture secretary, told BBC One's Andrew Marr Show: "The scenes, clearly encouraged by President Trump - the scenes at the Capitol - were terrible - and I was very sad to see that because American democracy is such a proud thing.

    "But there's something else that has changed, which is that social media platforms are making editorial decisions now. That's clear because they're choosing who should and shouldn't have a voice on their platform."

    Mr Hancock said that development was likely to have "consequences".
    I can't muster the mental fortitude to go back and find cases of him complaining about twitter not moderating content that he disagrees with, but I'll willing to bet money that the former Culture Secretary will provide plenty of examples of hypocrisy.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
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    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    japan wrote: »
    Whelp, Labour is now formally also a brexiteer party


    What is the full quote. What is the context for the full response.

    If you quit a job in a very public manner and then days later wanted to come back, would that be realistic?

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    BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    I don't think there is a case for rejoining the EU, I've said that before, I think I've said that on your programme... But I think pretending to the British public that somehow, after four years of negotiation, that the treaty that has just been secured is going to be up for grabs and that the EU are going to start saying "let's start all over again" - that is not realistic, that is not going to happen.

    I'm not sure I exactly disagree?

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    PolarisPolaris I am powerless against the sky. Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    I mean, he's right, it's not realistic. The only way is if there is a sea change in attitude in the country and the major parties support it at the same time. What are we going to do ? Labour take us back in, Euro and all, and then the Tories/Brexit party take us back out ?

    It's done, all we can do in the short term is try and make the best of it, get some of the minor things back like ERASMUS etc, mobile phones sharing, law enforcement cooperation, etc. I mean it fucking sucks but what actually do we do about it that would stick ?

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    OldSlackerOldSlacker Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    Yeah, I think that the UK parties are at least ten years away from viably fielding a rejoin option to the public.
    And at that point, who knows what the UK will look like and which countries will form it.

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    altidaltid Registered User regular
    edited January 2021
    The absolute worst shower of bastards imaginable
    Yeah, I think that the UK parties are at least ten years away from viably fielding a rejoin option to the public.
    And at that point, who knows what the UK will look like and which countries will form it.

    A direct result of Labour entirely conceding the debate after the referendum vote. If they'd advocated for not brexiting then, it would be a viable option now. Instead they let any change of that go, but the leader then was a brexiteer after all.

    altid on
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    BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    LDs haven't made any comment on it that I can see, only other political comment is of Caroline Lucas who condemns it.

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    I don't really hold Labour responsible for Brexit and even if I did who cares

    It's done. We need to beat the Tories now.

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    Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo We are only now beginning to understand the full power and ramifications of sexual intercourse Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    Yeah, I think that the UK parties are at least ten years away from viably fielding a rejoin option to the public.
    And at that point, who knows what the UK will look like and which countries will form it.

    I don't think it needs to be a decade, but it needs to be at least as long as the vote till now

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
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    BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't really hold Labour responsible for Brexit and even if I did who cares

    It's done. We need to beat the Tories now.
    (I'm not even sure this announcement helps that though. As realpolitik goes, I think he'd have done better to just go on keeping schtum on Labour's plans re: Brexit and hammering them on COVID response and their shitty deal).

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
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    TastyfishTastyfish Registered User regular
    The absolute worst shower of bastards imaginable
    Bethryn wrote: »
    LDs haven't made any comment on it that I can see, only other political comment is of Caroline Lucas who condemns it.

    Lib Dems did it ages ago at their conference, with leadership intially saying that they can't be the Europe party and they need to accept that Brexit happened and move onto different priorities adn then the membership overwhelmingly voting to back "rejoin as a long term aspiration" and a hefty majority for "rejoin immediately".

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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    Bethryn wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't really hold Labour responsible for Brexit and even if I did who cares

    It's done. We need to beat the Tories now.
    (I'm not even sure this announcement helps that though. As realpolitik goes, I think he'd have done better to just go on keeping schtum on Labour's plans re: Brexit and hammering them on COVID response and their shitty deal).

    He does sort of need to say something on it, though, because it's a massive political issue still

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    altidaltid Registered User regular
    The absolute worst shower of bastards imaginable
    Solar wrote: »
    I don't really hold Labour responsible for Brexit and even if I did who cares

    It's done. We need to beat the Tories now.

    I don't hold Labour as a whole responsible. I hold Corbyn and his cronies complicit in brexit. They may not have been the primary drivers for brexit, but they helped it along as much as possible.

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    Mr.WangtangMr.Wangtang Registered User regular
    Labour, nor Corbyn, nor the Tories are responsible for Brexit. If anyone is to blame then it is the people who voted for it, twice. We can all bang on that they were lied to, blah blah, but it's easy to lie to someone when you are telling them what they want to believe.

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    BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Labour, Corbyn, and the majority of the Tories are all directly responsible for Brexit, along with UKIP and Leave.EU. They all contributed various lies to people who trusted them to tell the truth.

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
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    BurnageBurnage Registered User regular
    [hollow screaming intensifies]
    I think I missed when there was an actual second vote for Brexit.

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    PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies drinking coffee in the mountain cabinRegistered User regular
    Labour, nor Corbyn, nor the Tories are responsible for Brexit. If anyone is to blame then it is the people who voted for it, twice. We can all bang on that they were lied to, blah blah, but it's easy to lie to someone when you are telling them what they want to believe.

    I agree but there's plenty of blame to go around

    sig.gif
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    Mr.WangtangMr.Wangtang Registered User regular
    You think the last GE wasn't about Brexit?

This discussion has been closed.