Biden should be loud and should be saying this is bullshit because he said he would codify Roe vs Wade and not let a Supreme Court that is dominated by justices that were nominated by presidents who lost the popular vote to determine the rule of law in the land. I don't want a calm measured response. I want gaffing Joe out there talking about wanting to fight somebody over women's rights. Or does he just want to yell at people who support immigration rights?
One of the chief powers POTUS has is being the bully pulpit
It’s why Trump, for all of his malignant incompetence, was effective - he understood the platform he had by virtue of his position
Even if it goes nowhere Biden signaling he would support any measure to enshrine a woman’s right to choose would be more useful than whatever this is
Trump wasn't effective at all.
Disagree. He got to nominate 3 Supreme Court justices who are why the Christian Death Cult is getting their wish list now, defrauded the American public for millions, and almost became dictator for life with no lasting consequences of note.
Was he presidential? Nah. Did landmark legislature get passed? Pfft, who gives a shit? Did a bunch of fucksticks find out they aren't alone and realized they could do more damage together than acting alone? You bet your ass.
Sure, it wasn't a successful administration by the measures most sane people would have, but when it comes to accomplishing the Republican's agenda, fucker is/was the next coming of Reagan and has been enshrined appropriately by them.
"Go down, kick ass, and set yourselves up as gods, that's our Prime Directive!"
That the Republican agenda has continued to progress despite a change in leadership in multiple branches of the federal government is not an accident and can actually be attributed to the actions of the Trump administration.
One of the chief powers POTUS has is being the bully pulpit
It’s why Trump, for all of his malignant incompetence, was effective - he understood the platform he had by virtue of his position
Even if it goes nowhere Biden signaling he would support any measure to enshrine a woman’s right to choose would be more useful than whatever this is
Trump wasn't effective at all.
Disagree. He got to nominate 3 Supreme Court justices who are why the Christian Death Cult is getting their wish list now, defrauded the American public for millions, and almost became dictator for life with no lasting consequences of note.
Was he presidential? Nah. Did landmark legislature get passed? Pfft, who gives a shit? Did a bunch of fucksticks find out they aren't alone and realized they could do more damage together than acting alone? You bet your ass.
Sure, it wasn't a successful administration by the measures most sane people would have, but when it comes to accomplishing the Republican's agenda, fucker is/was the next coming of Reagan and has been enshrined appropriately by them.
Trump packed the courts simply by winning the election so McConnell could do it while Trump just picked names off a list. It's exactly the same bare minimum you'd have gotten out of any Republican president. And, critically to the point I was responding to, had jack shit to do with the bully pulpit or effective messaging. It had nothing to do with the powers of the presidency beyond the president's ability to nominate people for the Senate to confirm.
shryke on
+14
Options
jungleroomxIt's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovelsRegistered Userregular
edited May 2022
Welp it's in the Twitterverse that DHS has teamed up with LAPD to suppress pro choice protests with the same love and care you'd expect.
And they dispersed it and declared it an "unlawful assembly."
It’s not that they’re babies, they just know a valid pretense to crackdown when they see one and know that whatever they do will never lead to negative consequences of any kind.
Idk people loudly wanted a presidential president and we got one, it was a big reason voters chose Biden.
It's hard to be surprised he is taking a quiet, "wait for official ruling" approach???
Harris is being more full throated about things, and she might as well be Biden.
Biden was the compromise candidate, nobody had him as his first choice. His milquetoast reaction to one of the biggest threats to peoples' rights in the nation's history is a good example of why.
+19
Options
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited May 2022
I don't hate Joe Biden, but he was 100% the "please god anything but Trump" choice. His measured "lets rely on good ole American democracy and decency" late 1990's era moderate democrat response to this is not shocking in the slightest.
I don't hate Joe Biden, but he was 100% the "please god anything but Trump" choice. His measured "lets rely on good ole American democracy and decency" late 1990's era moderate democrat response to this is not shocking in the slightest.
It's still goddamn disappointing as someone who cheerfully voted for him.
+9
Options
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
I don't hate Joe Biden, but he was 100% the "please god anything but Trump" choice. His measured "lets rely on good ole American democracy and decency" late 1990's era moderate democrat response to this is not shocking in the slightest.
It's still goddamn disappointing as someone who cheerfully voted for him.
While I agree in principle, I guess my lack of abject disappointment is that I never expected a different reaction from him. This is going to take 20 to 30 years, a complete turn over of the American electorate and a lot of old white people dying off to fix. Joe Biden was never going to kill the filibuster for this and the current senate is never going to pass a codification of Roe in to law. It's why I'm focusing all my efforts on making sure my state stays pro-choice and becomes a safe harbor state because right now I think it's all that's honestly possible with how much the GOP has rigged American national politics for at least the next 20 years.
I don't hate Joe Biden, but he was 100% the "please god anything but Trump" choice. His measured "lets rely on good ole American democracy and decency" late 1990's era moderate democrat response to this is not shocking in the slightest.
It's still goddamn disappointing as someone who cheerfully voted for him.
While I agree in principle, I guess my lack of abject disappointment is that I never expected a different reaction from him. This is going to take 20 to 30 years, a complete turn over of the American electorate and a lot of old white people dying off to fix. Joe Biden was never going to kill the filibuster for this and the current senate is never going to pass a codification of Roe in to law. It's why I'm focusing all my efforts on making sure my state stays pro-choice and becomes a safe harbor state because right now I think it's all that's honestly possible with how much the GOP has rigged American national politics for at least the next 20 years.
I agree with your timeline, but I was expecting a bit more raging against the dying of the light, not rolling over and playing dead.
I guess I would like to see Biden be as visibly and vocally upset over this as he was about Ukraine.
It's a particularly unfortunate and painful irony that we may end up being able to do more to help them than ourselves.
If only Biden would tut-tut we would get what we want, today?
He can give the leak time to breathe and let the justices self own a little bit. Maybe give them 72 hours to gaffe.
If he does nothing, it's better than saying something that sucks the air out of the story.
It isnt like there are no expert knife wielders on the left ready to shred the right over this, and can do it better than Biden with less face to lose
Unlikely to happen. Way too many people are using the fact that there was a leak as a distraction Carnifex for the actual contents of the leak.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
0
Options
AbsalonLands of Always WinterRegistered Userregular
edited May 2022
Don't take it to the streets. Take it underground. Spread information about how to use VPNs etc. before searching for ways to get abortion pills or ways to get to other states. Tell smugglers of pills and people how to get armed for self-defense in the best cheapest way. Make it clear that the removal of unwanted fetuses and zygotes never ends and that the entire left-wing movement will make sure some freaks holding power in some states won't be enough.
Absalon on
+3
Options
HakkekageSpace Whore Academysumma cum laudeRegistered Userregular
Our system of checks and balances doesn't actually exist, if only one of the branches of government is able to check the others with impunity.
The check on the judiciary is, in theory, nomination by the President and confirmation by the senate. Rs spent two decades degenerating both of those routes
The other check is congress’ authority to reshape the court, to limit its appellate jurisdiction, and to pass laws that abrogate decisions short of constitutional ones. By the same mechanism, Rs have degraded this option as well
The antecedent right to all other rights is the right to vote. It is the right “preservative of all other rights.” Which is why it was important that the court dismantled the modern architecture of electoral politics first.
Your vote doesn’t matter because both parties are venal/corrupt/corporate stooges/feckless idiots/do-nothing wastrels. Your vote, especially if you are black or Hispanic and liberal, does not matter because the the court has approved of every ratfucking experiment to distort electoral representation along geographic and racial lines, has enshrined in constitutional law a perverse colorblind theory of the 14th amendment that says that even thinking about race in map-drawing to bring black voters representation something close to proportional (a filthy word) is tantamount to racist maps intentionally disenfranchising voters of “color” (that color is white). And separate from that, this coalition is aided by the distorted effects of the electoral college, which until Bush v. Gore seemed like a natural idiosyncrasy of our aging constitutional before the Court decided to nudge the outcome of a presidential election on its first opportunity to do so.
That’s it. That’s the story. There isn’t a magic way out of this. It’s not enough to vote for a 50% margin in the two houses of congress. The only way out is massive incontrovertible political victories that can’t be plausibly fiddled with or leave Manchins and Sinemas as the fickle kingmakers. Just “ok” wins are going to be insufficient. Obviously, that’s not going to happen.
PhD fellow at Freie Universität Berlin with a warning that our increased policing powers and surveillance capabilities that both parties have happily indulged will lead to inevitable tragedy against those seeking abortion and the queer community under this new legality regime:
last time abortion and sodomy were illegal local police departments led by wide-eyed mouth-breathing white supremacist yahoos did not have NSA-level surveillance equipment, given by bipartisan consensus, to enforce those bans
which is not to say that those bans were not enforced but that their enforcement now will make old forms of enforcement look cute
anyway the democratic party could with the current unified control of the federal government that it has remove that kind of surveillance equipment from the hands of local police departments! but instead Joe Biden will give a speech about Fund The Police
Don't take it to the streets. Take it underground. Spread information about how to use VPNs etc. before searching for ways to get abortion pills or ways to get to other states. Tell smugglers of pills and people how to get armed for self-defense in the best cheapest way. Make it clear that the removal of unwanted fetuses and zygotes never ends and that the entire left-wing movement will make sure some freaks holding power in some states won't be enough.
All I hear is excuses for the Republicans to put left-wing political activists in prison for aiding abortion. And it wouldn’t be a slap on the wrist like the insurrectionists got.
I'm not that knowledgeable on the interaction between states when it comes to their own laws so I'm curious how punishing people who go over state lines for abortions would work?
Would it be constitutional for Texas to imprison a woman who travelled to California for an abortion when she returned? What if the woman was from California and visited Texas just after having an abortion? Are states just allowed to punish citizens of other states where their laws differ?
0
Options
HakkekageSpace Whore Academysumma cum laudeRegistered Userregular
I'm not that knowledgeable on the interaction between states when it comes to their own laws so I'm curious how punishing people who go over state lines for abortions would work?
Would it be constitutional for Texas to imprison a woman who travelled to California for an abortion when she returned? What if the woman was from California and visited Texas just after having an abortion? Are states just allowed to punish citizens of other states where their laws differ?
Interstate travel is a fundamental constitutional right.
Edit: there is also the dormant commerce clause, although I suspect very strongly that this court will consider intrastate abortion regulations to be noncommercial activity having no economic effects, and so spillover effects onto other states will not offend the doctrine
The due process implications for anyone accused of a criminal violation for traveling out of state to get an abortion and traveling back will be enormous, but that was the state of things in the pre-Loving days (remember that the Lovings had to leave VA to be married and were charged upon reentry)
Rolling back privacy rights will have unpredictable consequences in the modern era
I'm not that knowledgeable on the interaction between states when it comes to their own laws so I'm curious how punishing people who go over state lines for abortions would work?
Would it be constitutional for Texas to imprison a woman who travelled to California for an abortion when she returned? What if the woman was from California and visited Texas just after having an abortion? Are states just allowed to punish citizens of other states where their laws differ?
Interstate travel is a fundamental constitutional right.
Edit: there is also the dormant commerce clause, although I suspect very strongly that this court will consider intrastate abortion regulations to be noncommercial activity having no economic effects, and so spillover effects onto other states will not offend the doctrine
The due process implications for anyone accused of a criminal violation for traveling out of state to get an abortion and traveling back will be enormous, but that was the state of things in the pre-Loving days (remember that the Lovings had to leave VA to be married and were charged upon reentry)
Rolling back privacy rights will have unpredictable consequences in the modern era
They’re already doing this with trans youth healthcare, so you can probably study that as their potential blueprint.
The comparison to increasing tensions between slave and free states is not one without merit. That is exact antebellum scenario the right is restoring, and I suspect they are fairly aware of this fact.
The implications of this shit get bad real quick. Logically, if you do something legal in one state you should not be able to be punished in the state you live in if they have a rule against it because your home state doesn’t have jurisdiction in the other state. Such as drinking in a wet county over the state line but living in the dry county. Or buying fireworks. However, I don’t think the logic would apply if the decision goes through as is because it targets Loving as something it thinks is wrong.
However, from a basic function standpoint Loving was ruled correctly because otherwise shit gets bad fast. If Texas makes it illegal to go across state borders, California could make it illegal to punish anyone for doing something legal in California. So if you arrest or sue someone for getting an abortion in California, you can no longer go to California or be charged with a crime.
Now obviously this court is playing with Calvinball rules, but it is a logical endpoint for what the court has decided, and could easily make shit real nightmarish and complicated to sort through.
"biden can't do anything" is not the compelling argument for being chill about the circumstances some people seem to think it is
I don't think I've seen anyone claim you should "be chill" about the situation because Biden can't do much about it. Rather the point is that the President has very limited means of doing stuff here. That you should be looking to other people with much more power over the situation if you want something to be done.
Specifically I would say the people who can stop this horror show are Senators.
He's the leader of the party and he should act like it even if he doesn't have the hard power we wish he did. Joe Biden is 79 god damn years old and his majority is falling apart. If he's not willing to go hard on a fundamental right now when the hell will he be? He's going to literally die on the hill of enabling permanent GOP rule.
"biden can't do anything" is not the compelling argument for being chill about the circumstances some people seem to think it is
I don't think I've seen anyone claim you should "be chill" about the situation because Biden can't do much about it. Rather the point is that the President has very limited means of doing stuff here. That you should be looking to other people with much more power over the situation if you want something to be done.
Specifically I would say the people who can stop this horror show are Senators.
He's the leader of the party and he should act like it even if he doesn't have the hard power we wish he did. Joe Biden is 79 god damn years old and his majority is falling apart. If he's not willing to go hard on a fundamental right now when the hell will he be? He's going to literally die on the hill of enabling permanent GOP rule.
What does "going hard" look like? All the solutions suggested rely on things like Joe Manchin suddenly becoming a Democrat and agreeing to nuke the filibuster (which he loves) for abortion rights (which he doesn't care about)
If he performatively "tries" to do something while knowing he will fail, everyone will be angry at him for "breaking promises" when he fails.
+7
Options
HachfaceNot the Minister Farrakhan you're thinking ofDammit, Shepard!Registered Userregular
edited May 2022
Liberals be like "We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!"
Threaten Manchin with an investigation of his crook daughter. Duh.
The easiest way to solve the problem is get an extra senator from some other state then kick Mr. Manchin out
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
+5
Options
HachfaceNot the Minister Farrakhan you're thinking ofDammit, Shepard!Registered Userregular
Liberals be like "We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!"
Threaten Manchin with an investigation of his crook daughter. Duh.
That's really "extra-legal". We could also get the legbreakers round, I suppose.
It's exactly as legal as the heinous shit cops do every day.
It's frankly comical how attached some people are to institutions and norms that 1) have very clearly failed them and 2) are already being disrespected and undermined at every turn by their enemies.
Edit:
Also, like, Manchin's family may very well be actually criminal. Let's not forget that!
The easiest way to solve the problem is get an extra senator from some other state then kick Mr. Manchin out
We, in truth, need 3 more senators.
We need to have 51 votes without having to rely on Manchin or Sinema for jack and/or shit.
Once we have that? I could absolutely see them removing the levers of power from him, get him off committees, etc.
Now, there is another absolutely bananas idea being floated around that if the two republican senators who really, truly claim to be pro choice joined with at least 48 other dems and kamala, they could make a carve out on the filibuster for privacy rights votes and use that to pass the codification of Roe V. Wade on an up/down vote.
The likelihood of that happening is actually much higher than Manchin coming to the table, but remains pretty damn small IMO. But it would make me less mad at Collins/Murkowski if they actually stood by what they claim to be their principles.
SW-4158-3990-6116
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
+11
Options
ButtersA glass of some milksRegistered Userregular
"biden can't do anything" is not the compelling argument for being chill about the circumstances some people seem to think it is
I don't think I've seen anyone claim you should "be chill" about the situation because Biden can't do much about it. Rather the point is that the President has very limited means of doing stuff here. That you should be looking to other people with much more power over the situation if you want something to be done.
Specifically I would say the people who can stop this horror show are Senators.
He's the leader of the party and he should act like it even if he doesn't have the hard power we wish he did. Joe Biden is 79 god damn years old and his majority is falling apart. If he's not willing to go hard on a fundamental right now when the hell will he be? He's going to literally die on the hill of enabling permanent GOP rule.
What does "going hard" look like? All the solutions suggested rely on things like Joe Manchin suddenly becoming a Democrat and agreeing to nuke the filibuster (which he loves) for abortion rights (which he doesn't care about)
If he performatively "tries" to do something while knowing he will fail, everyone will be angry at him for "breaking promises" when he fails.
Call the filibuster what it is: a engine destroying our democracy. Call SCOTUS situation what it is: a constitutional crisis representing the will of a whopping 25%.
I am well aware it's performance, but that's literally all he has left. A lot of politics is performance and if he wants even a snowball's chance in hell at retaining let alone gaining any power in the future he needs to fucking perform.
Biden is getting blinded out at the table and would still rather fold.
The easiest way to solve the problem is get an extra senator from some other state then kick Mr. Manchin out
We, in truth, need 3 more senators.
We need to have 51 votes without having to rely on Manchin or Sinema for jack and/or shit.
Once we have that? I could absolutely see them removing the levers of power from him, get him off committees, etc.
Now, there is another absolutely bananas idea being floated around that if the two republican senators who really, truly claim to be pro choice joined with at least 48 other dems and kamala, they could make a carve out on the filibuster for privacy rights votes and use that to pass the codification of Roe V. Wade on an up/down vote.
The likelihood of that happening is actually much higher than Manchin coming to the table, but remains pretty damn small IMO. But it would make me less mad at Collins/Murkowski if they actually stood by what they claim to be their principles.
How about two senators and make an example of Mr. Manchin and see what Ms. Sinema thinks? Or vice versa
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
When people cheer for extralegal shit it makes it clear that their concerns with Trump and his corrupt bullshit and misuse of the DOJ wasn't the actual corruption. Just that he wasn't corrupt in the particular way they wanted.
Some people genuinely expect our leaders to, you know, not be corrupt criminals who abuse the power of their office. Doing things in the right and legal way. It's a bad look when that mask slips.
Edit - leaving this here but genuinely posted it thinking this was the party thread.
There are a lot worse things than losing Joe Manchin and the Senate Majority right now, and the smart play would be to sacrifice that chess piece and make it that much more important of a race going into November. Like if we're talking about smart politics and doing the smart political thing, the smart political thing would be to try to do something, let all the milquetoast D's find a side of the line in the sand to stand on, and make it imperative to the American public that if they want to maintain their rights, here's where we have to be to get them back/maintain them. We got our judicial appointments out of Manchin for 1.5 years, let's fucking cut him loose 5 months before mid-terms to minimize the damage. At worst, McConnell gets the gavel for 5 months and we see him and Biden duke it out for 5 months and the American public sees that a Republican Senate is, in fact, fucking suck-balls bullshit and we can't let it happen for another 2 years. At best, Joe Manchin might come to the realization that we don't really need him that much anymore now that we're so close to mid-terms and losing the Senate anyways.
We're already talking about how this loss is going to spur voting in November, so why not double down and make it fucking crystal clear to the public where we're at. Show the public that we don't have 50 D's in congress, we have 48+2. Tell them we want 60+. Beg them. And start getting fucking loud about what you want to do instead of bitching about how Republicans lied to you again at the water cooler.
Posts
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
It is when the most important thing is not preventing bad things from happening, but avoiding fault when they do.
Disagree. He got to nominate 3 Supreme Court justices who are why the Christian Death Cult is getting their wish list now, defrauded the American public for millions, and almost became dictator for life with no lasting consequences of note.
Was he presidential? Nah. Did landmark legislature get passed? Pfft, who gives a shit? Did a bunch of fucksticks find out they aren't alone and realized they could do more damage together than acting alone? You bet your ass.
Sure, it wasn't a successful administration by the measures most sane people would have, but when it comes to accomplishing the Republican's agenda, fucker is/was the next coming of Reagan and has been enshrined appropriately by them.
Trump packed the courts simply by winning the election so McConnell could do it while Trump just picked names off a list. It's exactly the same bare minimum you'd have gotten out of any Republican president. And, critically to the point I was responding to, had jack shit to do with the bully pulpit or effective messaging. It had nothing to do with the powers of the presidency beyond the president's ability to nominate people for the Senate to confirm.
And they dispersed it and declared it an "unlawful assembly."
Cool.
Tweetter is Vishal P Singh, who does some video recording of local events
Tweet content: DHS officers shoving press and pro-choice protesters in Downtown Los Angeles.
Video is as described above
https://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/citywide-tactical-alert-ordered-during-abortion-rights-protest-in-downtown-la/2885093/
Citywide "everyone freak out" because one cop got what is almost certainly a bruise.
Biden was the compromise candidate, nobody had him as his first choice. His milquetoast reaction to one of the biggest threats to peoples' rights in the nation's history is a good example of why.
It's still goddamn disappointing as someone who cheerfully voted for him.
While I agree in principle, I guess my lack of abject disappointment is that I never expected a different reaction from him. This is going to take 20 to 30 years, a complete turn over of the American electorate and a lot of old white people dying off to fix. Joe Biden was never going to kill the filibuster for this and the current senate is never going to pass a codification of Roe in to law. It's why I'm focusing all my efforts on making sure my state stays pro-choice and becomes a safe harbor state because right now I think it's all that's honestly possible with how much the GOP has rigged American national politics for at least the next 20 years.
I agree with your timeline, but I was expecting a bit more raging against the dying of the light, not rolling over and playing dead.
This is absolutely something we must take to the streets.
I guess I would like to see Biden be as visibly and vocally upset over this as he was about Ukraine.
It's a particularly unfortunate and painful irony that we may end up being able to do more to help them than ourselves.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Unlikely to happen. Way too many people are using the fact that there was a leak as a distraction Carnifex for the actual contents of the leak.
The check on the judiciary is, in theory, nomination by the President and confirmation by the senate. Rs spent two decades degenerating both of those routes
The other check is congress’ authority to reshape the court, to limit its appellate jurisdiction, and to pass laws that abrogate decisions short of constitutional ones. By the same mechanism, Rs have degraded this option as well
The antecedent right to all other rights is the right to vote. It is the right “preservative of all other rights.” Which is why it was important that the court dismantled the modern architecture of electoral politics first.
Your vote doesn’t matter because both parties are venal/corrupt/corporate stooges/feckless idiots/do-nothing wastrels. Your vote, especially if you are black or Hispanic and liberal, does not matter because the the court has approved of every ratfucking experiment to distort electoral representation along geographic and racial lines, has enshrined in constitutional law a perverse colorblind theory of the 14th amendment that says that even thinking about race in map-drawing to bring black voters representation something close to proportional (a filthy word) is tantamount to racist maps intentionally disenfranchising voters of “color” (that color is white). And separate from that, this coalition is aided by the distorted effects of the electoral college, which until Bush v. Gore seemed like a natural idiosyncrasy of our aging constitutional before the Court decided to nudge the outcome of a presidential election on its first opportunity to do so.
That’s it. That’s the story. There isn’t a magic way out of this. It’s not enough to vote for a 50% margin in the two houses of congress. The only way out is massive incontrovertible political victories that can’t be plausibly fiddled with or leave Manchins and Sinemas as the fickle kingmakers. Just “ok” wins are going to be insufficient. Obviously, that’s not going to happen.
NNID: Hakkekage
All I hear is excuses for the Republicans to put left-wing political activists in prison for aiding abortion. And it wouldn’t be a slap on the wrist like the insurrectionists got.
Would it be constitutional for Texas to imprison a woman who travelled to California for an abortion when she returned? What if the woman was from California and visited Texas just after having an abortion? Are states just allowed to punish citizens of other states where their laws differ?
Interstate travel is a fundamental constitutional right.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_movement_under_United_States_law
Edit: there is also the dormant commerce clause, although I suspect very strongly that this court will consider intrastate abortion regulations to be noncommercial activity having no economic effects, and so spillover effects onto other states will not offend the doctrine
The due process implications for anyone accused of a criminal violation for traveling out of state to get an abortion and traveling back will be enormous, but that was the state of things in the pre-Loving days (remember that the Lovings had to leave VA to be married and were charged upon reentry)
Rolling back privacy rights will have unpredictable consequences in the modern era
NNID: Hakkekage
They’re already doing this with trans youth healthcare, so you can probably study that as their potential blueprint.
The comparison to increasing tensions between slave and free states is not one without merit. That is exact antebellum scenario the right is restoring, and I suspect they are fairly aware of this fact.
However, from a basic function standpoint Loving was ruled correctly because otherwise shit gets bad fast. If Texas makes it illegal to go across state borders, California could make it illegal to punish anyone for doing something legal in California. So if you arrest or sue someone for getting an abortion in California, you can no longer go to California or be charged with a crime.
Now obviously this court is playing with Calvinball rules, but it is a logical endpoint for what the court has decided, and could easily make shit real nightmarish and complicated to sort through.
They want a confederation again, and they want their states to be cavalier aristocracies again
He's the leader of the party and he should act like it even if he doesn't have the hard power we wish he did. Joe Biden is 79 god damn years old and his majority is falling apart. If he's not willing to go hard on a fundamental right now when the hell will he be? He's going to literally die on the hill of enabling permanent GOP rule.
What does "going hard" look like? All the solutions suggested rely on things like Joe Manchin suddenly becoming a Democrat and agreeing to nuke the filibuster (which he loves) for abortion rights (which he doesn't care about)
If he performatively "tries" to do something while knowing he will fail, everyone will be angry at him for "breaking promises" when he fails.
Threaten Manchin with an investigation of his crook daughter. Duh.
That's really "extra-legal". We could also get the legbreakers round, I suppose.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
It's exactly as legal as the heinous shit cops do every day.
It's frankly comical how attached some people are to institutions and norms that 1) have very clearly failed them and 2) are already being disrespected and undermined at every turn by their enemies.
Edit:
Also, like, Manchin's family may very well be actually criminal. Let's not forget that!
It's so simple!
We, in truth, need 3 more senators.
We need to have 51 votes without having to rely on Manchin or Sinema for jack and/or shit.
Once we have that? I could absolutely see them removing the levers of power from him, get him off committees, etc.
Now, there is another absolutely bananas idea being floated around that if the two republican senators who really, truly claim to be pro choice joined with at least 48 other dems and kamala, they could make a carve out on the filibuster for privacy rights votes and use that to pass the codification of Roe V. Wade on an up/down vote.
The likelihood of that happening is actually much higher than Manchin coming to the table, but remains pretty damn small IMO. But it would make me less mad at Collins/Murkowski if they actually stood by what they claim to be their principles.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
Call the filibuster what it is: a engine destroying our democracy. Call SCOTUS situation what it is: a constitutional crisis representing the will of a whopping 25%.
I am well aware it's performance, but that's literally all he has left. A lot of politics is performance and if he wants even a snowball's chance in hell at retaining let alone gaining any power in the future he needs to fucking perform.
Biden is getting blinded out at the table and would still rather fold.
How about two senators and make an example of Mr. Manchin and see what Ms. Sinema thinks? Or vice versa
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Some people genuinely expect our leaders to, you know, not be corrupt criminals who abuse the power of their office. Doing things in the right and legal way. It's a bad look when that mask slips.
Edit - leaving this here but genuinely posted it thinking this was the party thread.
We're already talking about how this loss is going to spur voting in November, so why not double down and make it fucking crystal clear to the public where we're at. Show the public that we don't have 50 D's in congress, we have 48+2. Tell them we want 60+. Beg them. And start getting fucking loud about what you want to do instead of bitching about how Republicans lied to you again at the water cooler.