Just out of curiosity - anyone else went through a 'Japan-only' phase?
Aleph
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Were you heavily into manga and anime when you just discovered it back then? To an extent you would deride western comics with disdain only compareable to al-Qaeda's feelings for America? Attempted to learn Japanese?
Because I used to and now I look at that point of my life in sheer embarrassment. I remember praising Japanese comics for being 'darker' (LOL), adult (LOL), finite (LOL), having one singular writer (LOL) and aesthetically more pleasing (also a LOL). All of these are the usual baseless things most elitist Japanophiles thought western comics lack. The reason I'm asking this is because from the other forums I frequent, it seems like a common phenomenon for people to outgrow mangas, or at least their loyalty to it.
Because I used to and now I look at that point of my life in sheer embarrassment. I remember praising Japanese comics for being 'darker' (LOL), adult (LOL), finite (LOL), having one singular writer (LOL) and aesthetically more pleasing (also a LOL). All of these are the usual baseless things most elitist Japanophiles thought western comics lack. The reason I'm asking this is because from the other forums I frequent, it seems like a common phenomenon for people to outgrow mangas, or at least their loyalty to it.
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A lot of people will probably laugh at this and say "what do you think we do in America?" but I really think that 90% of manga is beyond cliche and caters to the lowest common denominator. What little of it I've seen is pretty much incomprehensible by anyone who isn't a creepy Japanophile.
Right to left?
NO BOOK.
I WILL TELL YOU HOW I AM GOING TO READ YOU.
This is pretty much true. I tried reading some of the mangas from my old collection and was pretty much ashamed that I used to think they were good. What can I say, I was around 12-16 back when I was still in that phase. I still dig some anime though.
this doesn't describe the US market at all
sure, superhero books are the most popular
but there are plenty of books that aren't about superheroes
and comics aren't for kids now
shit, they have to make comics specifically aimed at kids because the main ones aren't
The vast majority of American comics have been adult-oriented for probably 20 years or more, and I don't think I'm wrong to point out that the variety in manga simply changes up characters and settings from superheroes to doctors, lawyers, or high school students, while using the same tired plot devices.
I agree though that they are very similar in that both media probably contain their gems among the piles of junk books.
When over 90% of the market is dominated by super hero books, its hard to say it is diversified. Just because Fables and Sandman and Y: the last man and so on are excellent books does not mean they are the norm or standard for the market.
And despite the fact you might think that superhero comics are not marketed at children, they are (teens are children in my definition). If it was grown up in any way, I could read a book without seeing things like @$$ or #### for "naughty" words and more grown up themes in the books. Just because it can be enjoyed by any age group does not mean it is not targeted at younger audiences still. Hell, Marvel Adventures are some of Marvels better books and that is their "kids" line of books. If you honestly think Marvel and DC target grown ups with their offerings outside Max or Vertigo, you are sadly mistaken.
Akira, though, disappointed me. It was beautiful and unsettling to look at, but the plot was pretty minimal. And it also caters to the typical pseudo-mystical BS ending that seems omnipresent in manga/anime. I wonder if Japanese storytelling in general is so typically anti-climatic as half these manga. I'm hardly well-read in East Asian fiction mind you, so maybe I'm not the best person to to hand out observations.
Certainly, I haven't seen/heard of any manga to rival a work like, ooh, From Hell.
If they were aimed at children, they wouldn't have the censored expletives in there in the first place.
There's a difference between censorship and market demographics.
They target fanboys and obsessive collectors predisposed to shelling out ludicrous amounts of money to read a single story-line. Story arcs commonly run for 4-6 months. Comics themselves are priced way out of the range of a child's pocket money. The only reason that naughty words are still censored and full-blown nudity is uncommon is because the papers would have a field day if Spider-Man straight-out called the Green Goblin a twisted motherfucker. It's the public's perception of the industry as devoted to children that demands an element of restraint. Even though sex in comics has long since past any semblance of subtext. And there are plenty of gay superheroes. And incredible amounts of gore is apparent in even the most mainstream of titles, etc, etc.
The industry simply doesn't target children as its main audience. And that's one of the main reasons sales these days are so low.
I'd also put forth the argument that swearing is hardly grown up.
You're right that western comics need to move beyond men in tights. But have you read Love and Rockets, or From Hell, or (God help us) Blankets? Have you taken a long look at indy publishers or even the expanded catalogues of not-so-indy companies like Dark Horse? Have you even heard of stuff like Jimmy Corrigan?
There's plenty of non-superhero stuff available to read.
For a good while I stayed away from western comics, just because they didn't seem interesting at all. It wasn't until I started my first job and could read all the free comics I wanted that I got hooked.
It's funny, because now I don't even glance at manga/anime. I know it's stereotyping it, but too much of it seems really similar
As a librarian's assistant I'd end up filing a lot of stuff in the "graphic novel" category. Manga is placed there, and more often than not kids would flock to Marvel's Ultimate imprint instead of shit like Case Closed and Ah! My Goddess.
I'm just enthusiastic the Ultimate imprint is actually getting some of the readers it's aimed at instead of older readers looking for a new continuity.
I mean, kids were fuckin' hooked on the hardcovers of Ultimate Spider-Man we had.
Manga just didn't seem to attract anybody outside of the two or three kids who always eat the stuff up.
because there's a significant amount of non-superhero work out there.
as far as manga goes, i dig ghost in the shell. i also have the first book of blade of the immortal because someone gave it to me. it's not bad, but i haven't felt terribly compelled to drop the fifteen bucks apiece for the next five hundred and eighty trades of it.
Plus, I had one of those friends who was really into anime and manga for a while, and he kind of helped make sure I never got into it, for better or worse.
Micronauts and ROM are still my favorite series.
But most anime, now that the floodgates are open, strikes me as rather horribly bad, like anything else.
But it has some of best artsy stuff around.
you mean like...live action...movies don't have artistic value?
Also, it's been said ad nauseum, but there's no excuse for not checking out any of the Hayao Miyazaki/Studio Ghibli productions. Manga vs. comics, anime vs. cartoons, West vs. Japan, all of that shit doesn't matter when it comes to Miyazaki. It's just plain good storytelling that anyone can appreciate.
There just aren't that many movies like Amelie or What Dreams May Come.
And produced such things as the Breakfast Club. :P
this thread is full of terrible opinions.
Also, no, I never went through a Japan only phase because, well, I have taste
or Cowboy Bebop.
I didn't say YOUR opinion was terrible.
I was saying there is a high velocity of terrible opinions.
God.
I love Porco Rosso you don't even know.