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[WH40k?] Any info on Warhammer 40k MMO...
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Granted, environment can change, but that has no relevancy to the issue of implementing Gears of War-esque gameplay.
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Eldar ftw for me though
If you're going to all the effort of using the 40K universe, why would you do something so counter to the fluff? That sounds like a possibly fun game you described, but why wouldn't you make another setting that actually allowed for that sort of thing? Hell, I'd love to play a hero-based sci-fi MMO, with commanded NPCs and all that, but 40K's pretty rigid in what it allows setting-wise.
Gorkamorka and Necromunda throw this pretty much out the window, though, which is why I suggested those.
Of course theres always deathwatch, inquistors, grey knights, scouts, Tau stealth teams e.t.c These sorts of things MIGHT get a solo mission but a squad based mmo would be fantastic. Each guy having separate equipment classes and stats. Base the whole thing around pvp and youve got the making of some pretty tactics heavy pvp.
If they made a game set up like a cross between necromunda and inquistor where I can be a Kal Jerico type guy it would be amazing. The thing is that you'd pretty much never see an ork, real tyranid or most any major xenos. Maybe an eldar infiltrator here or a genestealer there, but nothing major from the tabletop game. And seeing a space marine would be an awe inspiring sight.
And thinking about it, if they made this I'd buy it twice.
I think it's more the SMs show up in a stalemate, then charge up and the guard follows behind them. It's not like the IG and Space Marines would really plan something in advance together sharing info and resources or anything.
I was thinking 40k a bit when playing Gears. Mainly because of the Gothic architecture and the chainsaw bayonets.
Ah, good, I was waiting for this. ;-)
First of all, there's nothing preventing that solo guy from getting together with a few buds in his "guild" and really making a s**tstorm happen. A full squad of SMs backed by about 5x as many IG scrubs would be a friggin' epic experience, IMHO.
Imagine that. 10 Chaos SMs vrs 10 Loyalist SMs is cool, but throw in a few hundred IG and traitor guard scrubs, it's pure awesome; you're fighting your way through the scrubs to come to grips with that Iron Guard guy over there, you're a SM, you're a hero.
For me, the coolest parts of HALO 1,2, and 3 where when I wasn't solo, when I had a squad of Marines with me, where I was the hero in a battle and, yes, having them be wowed by the presence of a SPARTAN in their midst.
You're a Space Marine. The average is about 1 Marine per Imperial world. You should cow others with your mere presence.
Also, post 13th crusade Cadia is chaotic in the extreme. I would imagine that unit cohesion is pretty much gone and the survivors are trying to organize themselves as best they can into semi-coherant units and squads.
Normally, Space Marines fight in chapters, companies, and squads, but what if it's just you and one other guy left? You do your best and if you happen to come across other survivors, even if they're from other chapters, you band up and fight on as best you can.
That right there is your "guild" in this game.
Also, since supplies are limited, they're reserved only for the strongest heroes. As in planetside, the higher you get, the more access to stuff you get as well.
Margaret Thatcher
True. Think of HALO.
Imagine being a Marine in a platoon locked in combat with a covenant force. You're pinned. Master Chief shows up, blows them all away, and says "follow me".
You'll follow Master Chief. ;-)
An Imperial Space Marine, fluff-wise, makes Master Chief look like a wuss. These guys are 400 lbs, 6-7 feet tall, can survive hard vaccume, can go withour food, water, or sleep for weeks, and can literally chew their way through steel.
Margaret Thatcher
That too.
You know, the *stasis* that SMs go into would be a good way to explain away death in-game as well.
Margaret Thatcher
Rogue Traders would be a good choice for a 40K MMO, but I also think it'd turn a lot of people away because it doesn't capture the spirit of the tabletop game very well--a Rogue Trader isn't going to start off leading any men at all, even in a pinch. Inquisitors? That's even worse than Space Marines. They're autonomous, no doubt, but they're also some of the most bad-ass non-Marine human warriors in the game, even in training. It could work, but it might also severely limit the level progression: just how much better are you going to let the player get?
Space Marines are right out. Completely. Your example sounds really cool in another setting, but not in 40K. Marines don't gang up with some of the friends and wade through 'scrubs'; they go where their chapter master tells them to, they take very direct orders from their sergeants and company masters, and they generally don't have a say in their lives. Even if they're cut off, they have specific things to do and a very definite progression of command. If you were unlucky enough to find any commanding officer nearby, you can kiss any chance of autonomy goodbye, and maybe even face punishment for certain things that occurred while you were by yourself. And if you have Space Marines, you can't have anything else. Say you're sitting at the character creation screen. You have the choice of a Space Marine and a Guardsman. Who is going to pick Guardsman? Will it be enough people to vastly overshadow the number of Marines chosen?
And your example is a chapter cut off from outside reinforcements. If that's true, what kind of level progression are you going to see in the game? You're going to end up being a Marine, with almost no chance to upgrade weapons or armor unless you scavenge off of your fallen (not something most Marines would be all about...), and no one to bestow rank or title on you anyway. Training could be done as a sort of on-the-fly field upgrade, but that still leaves the issue of changes in items. I just don't see, even as a Marine cut off, the wealth of progression necessary to sustain an MMO.
Believe me, I'd like to play a Marine in-game, but I think an MMO would be the worst sort of fit for it. Necromunda or Gorkamorka are the ways to go, or Rogue Trader if it can do a better job of recreating the experience of the main game.
There is no way GW can make a 40k game without having Space Marines, somehow (as major enemies or player-controlled). I will eat a 2nd edition boxed set plastic Grot (spike and all) if they ever do it.
MMOGs are overrated. A much better game could be made of Necromunda if it wasn't an MMOG.
Azulan Saul Tigh
War thread is that way.
I said it after watching the 1st Gears gameplay video: Gears of War is the best 40k game out there.
I also maintain that the first person to make a 40k mod for PC Gears will get fellated so hard.
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I didn't think you were wrong, it was just a question I expected. 8-)
A 40K MMO without Space Marines is like HALO without Master Chief. You're right in that they're needed.
I get your other points, but have you played Planetside? My ideas would make a lot more sense to you if you had that common point of reference, I think, but anyways:
Planetside is the first functioning MMOFPS. There are 3 sides, 20+ levels, and 5 command levels last I played. When you gain a level, you do *not* gain stats, you simply gain access to different gear. However, there's so many options, even a maxed-out guy can't be good in everything, they usualy gravitate twords a speciality, engineering, medic, Reaver pilot, 'Mech pilot, ect.
How this would work in my idea is that a more "veteran" space marine would have access to termie armor, heavy weapons, ect. I.E. the level progression is the same as Planetside, you get more gear options and this gear is relativly balanced also.
Planetside has their version of "terminator" armor. You can drop with it, it's got thick armor and heavy weapons, but turns like a battleship, not a good field of vision, and is a nice, big target.
Now the game ebbs and flows as the 3 sides fight over the, well, Planetside with each side having an unreachable "main" base. My idea is that 80% of the soldiers would be NPCs and the ebb and flow, the shifting fronts happens *on it's own* but can't be steered by the PCs in the ways outlined below.
FInally, I know the chain-of-command in 40K fluff is a bit....harsh, but with the absence of orders, Marines will still carry on as best as they can to kill chaos. The best RL analogy I can think of for a Cadia post 13th crusade is what the 101st and 82nd airborne went through behind enemy lines during Normandy + Stalingrad.
If you have the time, play Planetside for the free trial period and this might make more sense.
Margaret Thatcher
It could work if you started out with the SMs as part of a squad of PC/NPC scouts, eventually working your way to leading the group. Then as part of a PC/NPC goup of brothers. Progrssion might not neccessarily be up the chain of command after that as much as earning 'achievements' maybe studs and better implants unlocking access to better weapons for you and any NPC squad members you lead. The same would go for other races just tweaked enough to fit in with their background (As IG you start leading a squad and could eventually lead a company and as an Ork you could get bigger and bigger attracting smaller orks).
edit:Where's this podcast at?
Azulan Saul Tigh
But after listening to you guys, I don't see how space marines can be a playable class in any 40k MMO. Supposedly they are individually superior to everything, right? And also pretty much bionic, brainwashed supersoldiers without a will of their own. So it makes more sense to have the imperial guard as the "human" race in an MMO, with Space marines as NPC's in the game world.
In any case, I seriously hope this turns out good. I always wanted a starcraft MMO, but this is even better.
I want to ride my squiggoth right into a regiment of eldar plx
A mindless killing machine that slays anything different from itself? How could that *not* be perfect for a playable class in a FPS? :P
Your main PvP enemies, in my idea anyways, would be Chaos Marines and Eldar Aspect warriors; a true match along side of the cultist/traitor guard/guardian squad meatshields you'll gun-down by the hundreds.
Potential Bioshock spoiler:
Margaret Thatcher
Imagine the biggest, most ripped guy you can imagine. Now put him on steroids and genetically modify him so he has two seperate hearts, an organ for detoxifying poisons, the abliity to obtain nutrition from almost anything, acidic spittle, and modified skin. Now put him in powered armor that's actually a part of his flesh, with 4 inch thick plating and its own servo motors. Now give him a gun that fires armor piercing rounds the size of tank shells that explode upon impact, and make it full auto.
And finally to top things off, make him a fanatical warrior priest with no room for anything but his own dogma.
Yep.
Unless they make it purely fps, as in, there are no real levels to gain, and everyone i at a relatively even footing, like in planetside. I guess it could work, if the space marines had equals? I don't know enough about 40k to know if they do.
THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN SAY...cough...ahem...that's what I've been saying, what you said in paragraph #2. :P
As for equals:
-Chaos Space Marines. Some are 10,000 years old.
-Eldar Aspect warrior. Their armor contains the accumulated wisdom of each and every warrior that's ever worn it, some of that stuff is over 10,000 years old.
-Orc mega-armored Nobz or a warboss. 15 feet tall and over 500 pounds of green fungaly anger.
-Tyrranid Hive Tyrrant. Think Queen alien off of Aliens only it can shoot acidic paracites at you that eat you from the inside out as well as a few that can fry your mind with psionics.
-Tau crisis suit. Think Gundam on 'roids.
That's the whole point, you're a hero amongst scrubs. You're not joe Imperial Guardsman or "one uf da ladz" you're the hero or "da boss".
Margaret Thatcher
A Spacemarine player would start as a scout and eventually earn terminator honors.
A guardsman would start at the equivalent of a scout, maybe a squad of 20 guys, and then eventually become as strong as a terminator space marine. You know, like a battle force of 10000 guardsmen.
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
[geek argument]
Oh *hell* no!
Watch Predator sometime to see what would happen. Now imagine the predator is 200 pounds heavier, 1 foot taller, has 4" thick armor, and a fully automatic rocket launcher, as mentioned below.
It's been reiterated by GW that Space Marines are not the "Navy Seals" of the Imperium, that equivilant is the Stormtroopers of the IG. Navy Seals are "normal grunts" compared to Space Marines.
A Space Marine would kill a Catchan before he ever was seen (jnfared helmet, augmented sight/smell, superhuman reflexes/aiming), and would put either his first through the chest of a Commissar or make his head explode if hit there.
A sanctioned psyker *might* have a chance if he was lucky enough to get close, but those guys are total physical/mental wrecks.
[/geek argument]
Margaret Thatcher
And I'd take that bet. :P
Anyways, what if they do some kind of RTS MMO? Hasn't been tried before, has it?
Margaret Thatcher
But the carcass still tears for every space marine that dies in combat for the Imperium!
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Shattered Galaxy is an RTS MMO. It can be a fun game. Totally depends on whose online and some luck but it can be a real blast.