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Justice Dept. Releases Bush Administration Memos on Torture, Rendition, & Wiretapping
wwtMask
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The Department of Justice released nine legal opinions from the Bush administration (written by John Yoo and Jay Bybee) that were used as the legal framework for extraordinary rendition, torture, and warrantless wiretapping without consulting the FISA court. I haven't dug through them myself, but I understand some really convoluted and wrong reasoning was used to justify a lot of plainly illegal shit. I'd like to discuss that aspect, along with speculation on which, if any, the Obama administration might adopt, how Holder is going to go about cleaning up the mess caused by them, and also the reaction of both sides of the aisle to the release of these documents.
http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/documents/olc-memos.htm
It should be noted that the Freeper crowd apparently considers releasing the memos to be treason. Violating the Constitution and laws in order to torture brown people is okay, but shining a light on this illegal activity is treason, apparently.
http://www.usdoj.gov/opa/documents/olc-memos.htm
It should be noted that the Freeper crowd apparently considers releasing the memos to be treason. Violating the Constitution and laws in order to torture brown people is okay, but shining a light on this illegal activity is treason, apparently.
Twitter - @liberaltruths | Google+ - http://gplus.to/wwtMask | Occupy TallahasseeWhen he dies, I hope they write "Worst Affirmative Action Hire, EVER" on his grave. His corpse should be trolled.
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Wait a second, I'm brown!
Dammit!
Because we were watching The Bachelor.
I mean seriously did you SEE WHAT HAPPENED?
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To be fair, most of this stuff was undone by court challenges and legislation. One of the major things to take away from the memos, though, is that these were supposed to be very savvy lawyers, but their legal opinions were apparently laughably inadequate. It also says a lot about politicization of the Justice Department and how it lead to abuses, and that the Bush administration was pretty clearly seeking to not follow the law.
I'm not too sure about that bolded claim. In fact, I tried finding some public opinion polling data, and the closest I could find suggested the number was closer to 60% are okay with it, and that was when faced with a loaded question.
MWO: Adamski
Such questions would likely result in a 90%+ figure of people who do not care.
Its all in how its asked, "Is it okay for detainees to be held without trial" / "Should the US close down Guantanimo" / etc..
MWO: Adamski
If I were to witness an unprovoked act of cruelty against a minority on the street, you better fucking believe I would care. I would likely do what I could reasonably do to try to stop it.
But that's not the same as a piece of legislation that violates Constitutional rights from a distance; particularly in an manner as obfuscated as rendition. I don't see or hear about it happening, I just loosely know that it could legally happen. My faith is not questioned in a way that prompts me to immediate anger-based action. It does, however, make me vote a certain way in the next election.
Is that enough? Well, I don't know. It certainly seemed to help get Obama elected, given how much a re-establishment of the credibility of law was part of his rhetoric.
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Because the only people who were pointing it out at the time were "shrill" or "ultra-liberal" people like Marcy Wheeler, Glenn Greenwald, and Keith Olbermann. The traditional media didn't give a shit. And now it's "in the past" and the same traditional media members' stock portfolios are plunging so we have more important things to worry about.
Also you know, the laws were secret. And they're fucking terrifying. Especially the one about US troops on US soil against US citizens memo. That one is absolutely insane.
"Psh, we've done horrendous things in the past. Might as well repeat!"
Ugh. This is a pretty good example to the Canadian asking why people weren't flipping out; its because we're a nation of morons.
So that leaves the only real option is to vote the people you disagree with out of power, which requires someone to step up and run for office, which is no easy feat. It requires alot of funding and organization, and none of it will be effective until the next election, long after the outrage has left most peoples short term memory.
Judging by the current positions of the Republicans in the House and the Senate, where there is almost a filibuster proof majority of Democrats, I think the system is working fairly well.
MWO: Adamski
I am impressed, both by the Obama admin releasing the info and by the Bush admin's incredible arrogance. I really hope those in the Bush admin suffer the consequences of their unethical acts.
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I read about this last night in an AP or BBC article (can't remember which), so at least someone is reporting it.
What's a Freeper?
http://www.freep.com/ :?:
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Commenter on Free Republic, the right wing equivalent of Democratic Underground. They're pretty much scum.
We're too used to this shit by this point.
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Not exactly... you're referring to the October Crisis which took place in the early 70s, when War Measures act was invoked. The Canadian Charter of Rights & Freedoms didn't exist then, as it wasn't enacted until 1982. The previous federal statute, the Canadian Bill of Rights, was not an actual portion of the constitution, had significant limitations and was relatively simple to circumvent at the provincial level.
And the rioters in questions were essentially our own home-grown 'terrorists' who had been detonating improvised explosive devices though-out the 60s, then kidnapping a foreign official, amongst other things. (The FLQ, if you're interested; they were sort of a conglom of Marxism and the Black Panther Party, but French. :P)
/Amateur Canadian Politico-history
That's not to say it wasn't fucking cocked to haul in hundreds of suspected FLQ members without a duly processed warrant though. The action was supported fairly widely at the time, even in Quebec itself, but it did create an uncomfortable precident. The parallels to the current situation are there I suppose, though a bit loose and of a much smaller scale.
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If it was done the same way it was done in the US I highly doubt there'd be riots. Canada's only saving grace is a generally vocal opposition, and politicians that aren't 100% idiots. Post 9/11 US and Bush basically had a free card to do whatever he wanted, with no oversight. That would have a hard time happening in the US.
If there was a big attack on Canadian soil though, I'm sure Canadians would sell away their rights in exchange for some supposed security. Citizens of other countries have shown generally willing to in adverse situations.
And yes, I realize that arguing the point that freepers are stupid is a bit like getting up on a soapbox and ranting at people that the sky is blue and water is wet.
Would this also lead him to be fired from his position as Professor of Law at my school?
We can only hope.
NintendoID: Nailbunny 3DS: 3909-8796-4685