Quite frankly Velmeran, if you think that the imbalance lies on the SM's side then you need your head examined for signs of intelligence.
I don't like to insult like that, but seriously? The iron halo I've made use of against Tyranids falls in seconds to AG Warriors. That sprint you commented on? Uses energy, that's right, shield energy, and a good chunk of it too. Same goes for Battlecry, which is the only thing that could realistically keep two AG squads at bay and only for a short while.
An fully wargear'd tier 2 FC might be able to hold off two full hp AG Warrior squads, for a short while at least thanks to Battlecry, but it certainly isn't winning that fight by any means. Maybe if he were level 10 and the Warriors level 1, but I'd say that's still iffy.
God forbid the Space Marines have a single unique unit which can beat a single AG Warrior squad. It isn't the only hero who can do so, either.
Edit: Ugh I got trolled into a Tyranid balance debate again.
The Sprint ability is activated, but that gear also gives a default speed boost which is what I'm talking about. I was just saying that pulling a commander out of a fight like that with the flesh hooks (if it even fucking works) doesn't really counter anything cause he will be back in the fight quite fast.
Also, you think its balanced for 1 unit in T2 to be able to KILL 1240 req and 90 power worth of units with out his energy bottoming out? I don't want to be a terrible person and throw around insults either, but your in more need of getting your head checked then me it seems.
I could go on all day about how easy it is to counter melee nids with SM but I think you'd just put your fingers in your ears and prance about singing a tune.
Quite frankly Velmeran, if you think that the imbalance lies on the SM's side then you need your head examined for signs of intelligence.
I don't like to insult like that, but seriously? The iron halo I've made use of against Tyranids falls in seconds to AG Warriors. That sprint you commented on? Uses energy, that's right, shield energy, and a good chunk of it too. Same goes for Battlecry, which is the only thing that could realistically keep two AG squads at bay and only for a short while.
An fully wargear'd tier 2 FC might be able to hold off two full hp AG Warrior squads, for a short while at least thanks to Battlecry, but it certainly isn't winning that fight by any means. Maybe if he were level 10 and the Warriors level 1, but I'd say that's still iffy.
God forbid the Space Marines have a single unique unit which can beat a single AG Warrior squad. It isn't the only hero who can do so, either.
Edit: Ugh I got trolled into a Tyranid balance debate again.
The Sprint ability is activated, but that gear also gives a default speed boost which is what I'm talking about. I was just saying that pulling a commander out of a fight like that with the flesh hooks (if it even fucking works) doesn't really counter anything cause he will be back in the fight quite fast.
Also, you think its balanced for 1 unit in T2 to be able to KILL 1240 req and 90 power worth of units with out his energy bottoming out? I don't want to be a terrible person and throw around insults either, but your in more need of getting your head checked then me it seems.
I could go on all day about how easy it is to counter melee nids with SM but I think you'd just put your fingers in your ears and prance about singing a tune.
I think that's pretty balanced.
You know, considering how overpowered tyranids are. At least something can kill them.
Quite frankly Velmeran, if you think that the imbalance lies on the SM's side then you need your head examined for signs of intelligence.
I don't like to insult like that, but seriously? The iron halo I've made use of against Tyranids falls in seconds to AG Warriors. That sprint you commented on? Uses energy, that's right, shield energy, and a good chunk of it too. Same goes for Battlecry, which is the only thing that could realistically keep two AG squads at bay and only for a short while.
An fully wargear'd tier 2 FC might be able to hold off two full hp AG Warrior squads, for a short while at least thanks to Battlecry, but it certainly isn't winning that fight by any means. Maybe if he were level 10 and the Warriors level 1, but I'd say that's still iffy.
God forbid the Space Marines have a single unique unit which can beat a single AG Warrior squad. It isn't the only hero who can do so, either.
Edit: Ugh I got trolled into a Tyranid balance debate again.
The Sprint ability is activated, but that gear also gives a default speed boost which is what I'm talking about. I was just saying that pulling a commander out of a fight like that with the flesh hooks (if it even fucking works) doesn't really counter anything cause he will be back in the fight quite fast.
Also, you think its balanced for 1 unit in T2 to be able to KILL 1240 req and 90 power worth of units with out his energy bottoming out? I don't want to be a terrible person and throw around insults either, but your in more need of getting your head checked then me it seems.
I could go on all day about how easy it is to counter melee nids with SM but I think you'd just put your fingers in your ears and prance about singing a tune.
I'm going to go with my gut and experience and say you fucked something up royally for that to happen. I haven't even had that happen as Eldar.
Hive Tyrant has the exact same abilities to tank that the Force Commander does, as well as deal the damage. He's even better because he can not be suppressed either.
Hive Tyrant has the exact same abilities to tank that the Force Commander does, as well as deal the damage. He's even better because he can not be suppressed either.
His forceshield is crappier, but his Venom Cannon is pretty hot.
He kind of makes it up with more HP. And as Eldar.. he's really easy to deal with, the Force Commander. It's a lot easier to keep him down by suppressing him with rangers. I've always just seen my FC die whenever I use him against Nids. Had to stick to Apothecary to have any success.
You didn't. These freaking bugs and glitches are starting to annoy me. All night i've had problems with squads not retreating or my commander not responding. Its really getting annoying.
Quite frankly Velmeran, if you think that the imbalance lies on the SM's side then you need your head examined for signs of intelligence.
I don't like to insult like that, but seriously? The iron halo I've made use of against Tyranids falls in seconds to AG Warriors. That sprint you commented on? Uses energy, that's right, shield energy, and a good chunk of it too. Same goes for Battlecry, which is the only thing that could realistically keep two AG squads at bay and only for a short while.
An fully wargear'd tier 2 FC might be able to hold off two full hp AG Warrior squads, for a short while at least thanks to Battlecry, but it certainly isn't winning that fight by any means. Maybe if he were level 10 and the Warriors level 1, but I'd say that's still iffy.
God forbid the Space Marines have a single unique unit which can beat a single AG Warrior squad. It isn't the only hero who can do so, either.
Edit: Ugh I got trolled into a Tyranid balance debate again.
The Sprint ability is activated, but that gear also gives a default speed boost which is what I'm talking about. I was just saying that pulling a commander out of a fight like that with the flesh hooks (if it even fucking works) doesn't really counter anything cause he will be back in the fight quite fast.
Also, you think its balanced for 1 unit in T2 to be able to KILL 1240 req and 90 power worth of units with out his energy bottoming out? I don't want to be a terrible person and throw around insults either, but your in more need of getting your head checked then me it seems.
I could go on all day about how easy it is to counter melee nids with SM but I think you'd just put your fingers in your ears and prance about singing a tune.
I think that's pretty balanced.
You know, considering how overpowered tyranids are. At least something can kill them.
Looks like hes saying its imbalanced because something actually stands a chance against AG warriors.
so am i crazy or does the warpspider require a very different play style than the other eldar? it seems as though he Needs to stay in a group with another player, but maybe im just crazy here.
so am i crazy or does the warpspider require a very different play style than the other eldar? it seems as though he Needs to stay in a group with another player, but maybe im just crazy here.
All the tacky gold jewelry does weigh him down despite the light and airy silk hawaiian shirt he wears.
Anyone know a good place to start reading up on general strats and concepts?
I was actually pretty good in CoH eventually, but I'm definitely 1 for 6 in 1v1s so far in this... haha... .
Well replays are a good place to start, mostly at gamereplays.org, and if you play anything but Tyranids some people around here can give you some general advice regarding build orders and the like.
What's the general consensus on the Tech Marine hero?
I'm just trying to learn SM's first, so yeah any build order examples would be cool. I'll definitely check some replays right now, too.
I think I've fought 5 Eldar and 1 SM so far, and SM was the time I won... fucking Eldar...
The techmarine is decent in 3v3, but I wouldn't use him in 1v1. The other two are fine in 1v1.
Build orders are hard because it can depend on the map, your opponent's race, and your opponent's strategy. It's best not to get stuck in a build order. The first two or three units, sure, but you do need to stay flexible.
Mix and match tac squads, ASM, and heavy bolters right out the gate, but you generally don't want two of anything but tacs. Double tac is pretty viable. Double ASM can be pretty iffy. Double heavy bolter would be pretty bad. Once you have two or three units built, not including your scouts and commander, t2 as soon as possible is usually good policy.
The Techmarine is pretty hard to work with, especially 1v1 and when you're still new to the game. The Apothecary and Techmarine are both pretty specialized and wargear dependent, so they can be kind of weak 1v1 especially early game. You're probably better off starting with the Force Commander at least until you get the basics down.
As for build order Tactical Marines -> Heavy Bolter Devastators and Tactical Marines -> Assault Marines are both pretty solid general-purpose starting builds. You want your first unit to be a Tactical Marine squad or a Scout squad, since you won't have the power for Assault Marines for a while and Heavy Bolter Devastators are really vulnerable if you build them first. Tacs give you a lot of general purpose strength, just remember to use their melee attack against other ranged units, while Scouts are good if you want faster initial capping or are planning to run multiple upgraded Scout squads (which can be strong especially vs Tyranids).
One thing is for sure, don't buy the techmarines plasma gun...because it blows. Unless it has some special ability I don't know about...it blows. And this is from someone being shot by it...not someone using it.
The Techmarine is pretty hard to work with, especially 1v1 and when you're still new to the game. The Apothecary and Techmarine are both pretty specialized and wargear dependent, so they can be kind of weak 1v1 especially early game. You're probably better off starting with the Force Commander at least until you get the basics down.
As for build order Tactical Marines -> Heavy Bolter Devastators and Tactical Marines -> Assault Marines are both pretty solid general-purpose starting builds. You want your first unit to be a Tactical Marine squad or a Scout squad, since you won't have the power for Assault Marines for a while and Heavy Bolter Devastators are really vulnerable if you build them first. Tacs give you a lot of general purpose strength, just remember to use their melee attack against other ranged units, while Scouts are good if you want faster initial capping or are planning to run multiple upgraded Scout squads (which can be strong especially vs Tyranids).
What what?
Apothecary weak and wargear dependent in the early game? Are you mad? Hell he is probably the best hero in the early game since his heal will pretty much double the life of a single squad making early encounters pretty one sided if it's one on one.
The Techmarine is pretty hard to work with, especially 1v1 and when you're still new to the game. The Apothecary and Techmarine are both pretty specialized and wargear dependent, so they can be kind of weak 1v1 especially early game. You're probably better off starting with the Force Commander at least until you get the basics down.
As for build order Tactical Marines -> Heavy Bolter Devastators and Tactical Marines -> Assault Marines are both pretty solid general-purpose starting builds. You want your first unit to be a Tactical Marine squad or a Scout squad, since you won't have the power for Assault Marines for a while and Heavy Bolter Devastators are really vulnerable if you build them first. Tacs give you a lot of general purpose strength, just remember to use their melee attack against other ranged units, while Scouts are good if you want faster initial capping or are planning to run multiple upgraded Scout squads (which can be strong especially vs Tyranids).
What what?
Apothecary weak and wargear dependent in the early game? Are you mad? Hell he is probably the best hero in the early game since his heal will pretty much double the life of a single squad making early encounters pretty one sided if it's one on one.
These are just my opinions of course, but he has the lowest health of all commanders (even lower than the Mek), and at level 1 his heal is doing 120 plus a bit from the heal over time (about 80 on Tac squads). A Tactical squad has 1050 health at level 1, so you're healing for about 1/5th (200ish health) with your heal. Then he has such low health himself that if he gets focused the heal isn't likely to be enough to buy him more than another couple seconds at best. His healing abilities were severely nerfed in the Beta balance patch.
Now with some wargear like the power axe, stims or rites he can be very strong, but early game he still feels extremely weak to me.
The Techmarine is pretty hard to work with, especially 1v1 and when you're still new to the game. The Apothecary and Techmarine are both pretty specialized and wargear dependent, so they can be kind of weak 1v1 especially early game. You're probably better off starting with the Force Commander at least until you get the basics down.
As for build order Tactical Marines -> Heavy Bolter Devastators and Tactical Marines -> Assault Marines are both pretty solid general-purpose starting builds. You want your first unit to be a Tactical Marine squad or a Scout squad, since you won't have the power for Assault Marines for a while and Heavy Bolter Devastators are really vulnerable if you build them first. Tacs give you a lot of general purpose strength, just remember to use their melee attack against other ranged units, while Scouts are good if you want faster initial capping or are planning to run multiple upgraded Scout squads (which can be strong especially vs Tyranids).
What what?
Apothecary weak and wargear dependent in the early game? Are you mad? Hell he is probably the best hero in the early game since his heal will pretty much double the life of a single squad making early encounters pretty one sided if it's one on one.
These are just my opinions of course, but he has the lowest health of all commanders (even lower than the Mek), and at level 1 his heal is doing 120 plus a bit from the heal over time (about 80 on Tac squads). A Tactical squad has 1050 health at level 1, so you're healing for about 1/5th (200ish health) with your heal. Then he has such low health himself that if he gets focused the heal isn't likely to be enough to buy him more than another couple seconds at best. His healing abilities were severely nerfed in the Beta balance patch.
Now with some wargear like the power axe, stims or rites he can be very strong, but early game he still feels extremely weak to me.
Using the heal is that amount to every single unit not just the squad and also buffs their regen rate by like 2500% for a couple seconds and fires off every 30 seconds increasing by huge amounts each level. So as long as you keep your apoth with the rest of the squad he can and will change the tide of battle.
I have pretty much used the apoth straight as he just has so much versatility compared to the other spess mehreens.
Not to mention plunking him into a squad of termies with advanced healing on and not even the god emperor himself could stop them.
randombattle on
I never asked for this!
0
kaliyamaLeft to find less-moderated foraRegistered Userregular
Anyone know a good place to start reading up on general strats and concepts?
I was actually pretty good in CoH eventually, but I'm definitely 1 for 6 in 1v1s so far in this... haha... .
Well replays are a good place to start, mostly at gamereplays.org, and if you play anything but Tyranids some people around here can give you some general advice regarding build orders and the like.
Watching hours of replays seems interminable though. Why hasnt wisdom been distilled down to text?
Good games tonight, thanks for dragging my noob ass along! :P
It seems like I was getting better as we went along, or everyone we started going up against really sucked. But I am getting better at retreating my marines before it's too late. And at least putting iron halo on my FC to scare people away. :P
So far I have been having good luck with building a HB squad first, then making a tact squad. As soon as they saw the HB they would run, buying me time to finish building up. Or the HB would get there and setup right as the melee started, and would swing the fight for my marines/FC.
Got my rare scout armor, woo?
Speaking of scouts, my dumb moment of the day, is forgetting I retreated my scouts after the first fight, and having them sit back at my base until I had 2 predators and went, "Oh I can put a sniper rifle on these guys now".
Posts
It was kind of a bad day for Velmeran tho... his units took it in the butt in a few games last night xD
Right.
I never asked for this!
BEEP BEEP ANSWER ME BEEP BEEEEEEEP
The Sprint ability is activated, but that gear also gives a default speed boost which is what I'm talking about. I was just saying that pulling a commander out of a fight like that with the flesh hooks (if it even fucking works) doesn't really counter anything cause he will be back in the fight quite fast.
Also, you think its balanced for 1 unit in T2 to be able to KILL 1240 req and 90 power worth of units with out his energy bottoming out? I don't want to be a terrible person and throw around insults either, but your in more need of getting your head checked then me it seems.
I could go on all day about how easy it is to counter melee nids with SM but I think you'd just put your fingers in your ears and prance about singing a tune.
I think that's pretty balanced.
You know, considering how overpowered tyranids are. At least something can kill them.
His forceshield is crappier, but his Venom Cannon is pretty hot.
Whoops!
Also, your Dread wasn't one shotted by mines, it was hit twice by tankbustas, twice by beamy deffgun and once with a stack of mines.
Wait what? I'm confused.
How do you get plasma devastators in tier1?
Or do you mean plasma tacs and HB dev's?
You didn't. These freaking bugs and glitches are starting to annoy me. All night i've had problems with squads not retreating or my commander not responding. Its really getting annoying.
Thats the joke.
Looks like hes saying its imbalanced because something actually stands a chance against AG warriors.
Man thats dumb, goomba your dumb.
All the tacky gold jewelry does weigh him down despite the light and airy silk hawaiian shirt he wears.
I was actually pretty good in CoH eventually, but I'm definitely 1 for 6 in 1v1s so far in this... haha...
Well replays are a good place to start, mostly at gamereplays.org, and if you play anything but Tyranids some people around here can give you some general advice regarding build orders and the like.
I'm just trying to learn SM's first, so yeah any build order examples would be cool. I'll definitely check some replays right now, too.
I think I've fought 5 Eldar and 1 SM so far, and SM was the time I won... fucking Eldar...
The techmarine is decent in 3v3, but I wouldn't use him in 1v1. The other two are fine in 1v1.
Build orders are hard because it can depend on the map, your opponent's race, and your opponent's strategy. It's best not to get stuck in a build order. The first two or three units, sure, but you do need to stay flexible.
Mix and match tac squads, ASM, and heavy bolters right out the gate, but you generally don't want two of anything but tacs. Double tac is pretty viable. Double ASM can be pretty iffy. Double heavy bolter would be pretty bad. Once you have two or three units built, not including your scouts and commander, t2 as soon as possible is usually good policy.
As for build order Tactical Marines -> Heavy Bolter Devastators and Tactical Marines -> Assault Marines are both pretty solid general-purpose starting builds. You want your first unit to be a Tactical Marine squad or a Scout squad, since you won't have the power for Assault Marines for a while and Heavy Bolter Devastators are really vulnerable if you build them first. Tacs give you a lot of general purpose strength, just remember to use their melee attack against other ranged units, while Scouts are good if you want faster initial capping or are planning to run multiple upgraded Scout squads (which can be strong especially vs Tyranids).
Apothecary weak and wargear dependent in the early game? Are you mad? Hell he is probably the best hero in the early game since his heal will pretty much double the life of a single squad making early encounters pretty one sided if it's one on one.
I never asked for this!
These are just my opinions of course, but he has the lowest health of all commanders (even lower than the Mek), and at level 1 his heal is doing 120 plus a bit from the heal over time (about 80 on Tac squads). A Tactical squad has 1050 health at level 1, so you're healing for about 1/5th (200ish health) with your heal. Then he has such low health himself that if he gets focused the heal isn't likely to be enough to buy him more than another couple seconds at best. His healing abilities were severely nerfed in the Beta balance patch.
Now with some wargear like the power axe, stims or rites he can be very strong, but early game he still feels extremely weak to me.
I have pretty much used the apoth straight as he just has so much versatility compared to the other spess mehreens.
Not to mention plunking him into a squad of termies with advanced healing on and not even the god emperor himself could stop them.
I never asked for this!
Watching hours of replays seems interminable though. Why hasnt wisdom been distilled down to text?
It seems like I was getting better as we went along, or everyone we started going up against really sucked. But I am getting better at retreating my marines before it's too late. And at least putting iron halo on my FC to scare people away. :P
So far I have been having good luck with building a HB squad first, then making a tact squad. As soon as they saw the HB they would run, buying me time to finish building up. Or the HB would get there and setup right as the melee started, and would swing the fight for my marines/FC.
Got my rare scout armor, woo?
Speaking of scouts, my dumb moment of the day, is forgetting I retreated my scouts after the first fight, and having them sit back at my base until I had 2 predators and went, "Oh I can put a sniper rifle on these guys now".
Also goomba, you say that like I don't already!