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Difficult is Fun: Gothic

captainkcaptaink regularTexasRegistered User regular
edited February 2011 in Games and Technology
So I got Gothic 2/3 from the Steam sale. And I've had Gothic 1 from GOG, but I never really gave it a good go. The no-mouse thing was pretty rough.

I have played and really enjoyed Risen, so I figured it's time to go back to the source. I heard this game was tough, though, so I was hoping for some newbie tips.

Are any combat styles really good or really bad? All else being equal, I prefer magic with some melee combat mixed in.

Based on that, are any of the three factions better to join? I know one gets magic early, but not high level magic, and another gets it really late.

Any goodies hidden away that I might want to grab early on? Reading a bit of a GameFAQs guide, the smart thing seems to be Don't Explore, stay on the path or you will die.

captaink on
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Posts

  • captainkcaptaink regular TexasRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Also discuss Gothic 2 and 3, Risen, or whatever that new Gothic is supposed to be called.

    captaink on
  • Big ClassyBig Classy regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I played Risen on the 360 which left a really bad taste. It was one of the worst games I've played on that console.

    It took a huge leap of faith to get Gothic 2 in the sale. Took some getting used to, and still haven't quite got it but I'm enjoying it much, much more than Risen already.

    Big Classy on
  • FerrusFerrus regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    GameFAQs is right. You can be killed by a stiff breeze early on. Later on the other hand you'll massacre everything and everyone.

    As far as combat styles go, no there is not much difference. Two-Handed is slower but has greater reach, which can be very helpful. Just don't mess your swinging rythm up or else...!

    Basically you should do the quests you find in the various hubs first, follow the main storyline a little until you've been to all the camps and then decide who to join. The game opens up after that.

    Ferrus on
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    And Disney World is nowhere in sight.
  • DrakmathusDrakmathus regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I made a sword in gothic. it was a pain in the ass and the sword wasn't very good. Also I found a cave. There was a dead guy and some mushrooms in the cave.

    Drakmathus on
  • KazooKazoo Get in the van. I have candy.Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Big Isy wrote: »
    I played Risen on the 360 which left a really bad taste. It was one of the worst games I've played on that console.

    It took a huge leap of faith to get Gothic 2 in the sale. Took some getting used to, and still haven't quite got it but I'm enjoying it much, much more than Risen already.

    Risen was quite bad on the 360. On the PC, however, it was quite good.

    Kazoo on
  • HyperAquaBlastHyperAquaBlast regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    So when Gothic is mentioned I gotta tell my story how I got it.

    It was 2000 tickety. We had to use tickety cause the Taliban stole our word for "one". During this time I was poketing lunch money for the week in order to save up to feed my game addictions. I was strolling around Best Buy when sudddenly the Cheeto I had on my hat, which was the style at the time, fell out.

    As I pick it up I see the box for Gothic. I had read a review about it on IGN but all I remember was that being in prison and having to carry a torch to light areas were features in the game. I picked up the box and looked at the back and saw a few screenshots but what popped out at me was the main character had a sword on his back. Sold! As kid who only had access to a PC for the past 4 years and would be for the following 2, I had always wanted a PC cloneof Zelda 64. You know 3D open world and seeing a sword on you.

    So I install the game at home get brought into this game world. You are thrown into a land encased in a magic energy barrier and had become a prison. You enter the place and you meet the games version of Red from Shawshank Redemption and gives the low down on the situation and then the new game is to survive. Never before had I played a game were I felt very vunerable and must try to surrive rather then play because this world isn't going to give me any breaks.

    I stroll along a path in a canyon and scoff at the "open world" that was touted on the box but then you hit the end and are welcomed to a scenic view of the land with a large castle town in front of you that you gotta make your way to. As I enter I see NPCs go about real daily routines and follow schedules and they all have assigned homes. You can't just walk into one like other games or you get your ass kicked. Don't brandish your rusty sword you found or everyone will threaten you to put it away or else. And you will get you ass kicked at least once but you don't die, instead they take what money you have (ore) and your weapon and leave you on the floor humiliated and gasping for a life bar. I was so scared that I stayed up all night in game time cause I didn't want leave the walls but I had no where to sleep.

    Then you find a dude who will guide you to one of the two other gang camps in the prison. Then you witness again how big and detailed the world is. And then you have the forests. The game engine had this neat effect where from afar the forest look really thick bush and as entered its borders then the walls dissapear and you have this dark tree infested area with wolves and other creatures that at low levels will rape you easily. For this reason I was scared to go into the forest for a long time.

    Anyways until I started getting used to the wonky contols and learning the game exploits, this is the first game that I reall ever got immersed it until maybe Red Dead Redemption. So Gothic will always have a special place with me.

    I didn't get far in Gothic 2 and never touched Gothic 3. Weird.

    HyperAquaBlast on
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  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I've played all of the Gothic games each many times, yet have never completed one. I love the games and the immersion they create, yet for some reason I just can't ever get around to finishing them.

    Sir Carcass on
  • DarkWarriorDarkWarrior __BANNED USERS
    edited June 2010
    Goes GOthic 2 > Gothic 1 > Gothic 3 >>>>>>>>>>Risen.

    Risen is an abomination of a game.

    DarkWarrior on
    ...it's in the shape of a giant c**k.
  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I probably shouldn't have started with Gothic 3, but I went into it remembering that the control scheme was a bit better than its predecessors.

    Holy shit I get wrecked in melee combat so badly. I'm not quite sure what I'm doing wrong here, especially against beasts.

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
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  • captainkcaptaink regular TexasRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Risen is really great on PC.

    captaink on
  • Sorcha RavenlockSorcha Ravenlock regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I bought Gothic 3 in the Steam sale.

    Man, that battle at the start of the game is brutal. I got knocked down several times before I had even found out how to draw my sword. Once I drew it it got knocked out of my hand, so I got my bow out which I promptly lost as well. :D
    I ran out of town, only to be knocked down by a weird bird type thing.
    Then I got a message saying that we won the fight with the orcs (obviously not thanks to me). So that went well. :D

    I then remapped some buttons, closed the game, went looking for a bit of a guide on how to survive the first ten minutes in the game, hehe, after reading up a bit I went back in and proceded to get killed at least once every ten minutes or so.
    I normally don't like punising games, but despite the brutal difficulty it is a lot of fun. The danger adds a real sense of adventure to expolring the game. I just wished the game loaded quicker, I have this stubborn streak to try a fight a second (or even a third time) if I lose to see if I could have done things differently, only to promptly be looking at the loading screen for 3 minutes or so as a punishment for that silly behaviour.

    A word of advice: whatever you do, don't go into any of the caves at a low level. It is never a good idea. Also, dont' start liberating towns right away.

    Sorcha Ravenlock on

  • Alfred J. KwakAlfred J. Kwak Registered User
    edited June 2010
    It also helps that the games have a quick-save function, so dying isn't nearly as much of an annoyance as in console games.

    Wonder what is at the bottom of the canyon? *Quicksave* jump; death "oh, there's nothing" *quickload* proceed.

    Alfred J. Kwak on
  • KlashKlash regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Lets get this out of the way:

    If you played Risen on the 360, it was shit. Be clear about the fact it was on the 360.

    If you played Risen on the PC, it was great. Down right fantastic.



    I was playing Risen and G3/FG at the same time. G3 was just awful and awkward, it was also hideous and I couldn't bare to look at its malformed people. Everyone looked like a fucking Goomba out of the old Mario movie. Tiny heads and big bodies. It also felt like it was missing a lot of general features. Call them hand holding or whatever, I'd call them the basics. I guess its just old, because Risen didn't have those issues.

    Risen was just as tough, so I wouldn't say they were hand holding features. It took a while to learn the flow of the combat system, and it was very difficult for me, until I reached the Monastery. I went as a pure mage, Magic Bullets and Rune Magic all the way, with filled slots of crafting/thieving for good measure. Even then it wasn't a cake walk. I had to carefully manage my mana potions, as they were my offense, defense and even my healing abilities.

    The design of things was also really nice. Everything looked gorgeous, I liked that the island was one large, cohesive area, that only required loading when entering one of two towns or a dungeon. Despite my hard-on for open worlds, I was pleased Risen was on a relatively small island. It made adventuring and exploring less tedious and more manageable. The quests were rarely a chore, and I really liked the ones that decided if I would join the mages or the bandits.

    Exploring the caves and outter areas, where you can hear large beasts, and you know you're in danger was a blast. Just the burn of your torch to keep you safe, because you know if that Ogre takes offense to your being there, you are fucked.

    I also liked that going to far out from shore got my swallowed up and spit up by a gigantic rotworm. I found myself swimming out just for the hell of it, because it made me laugh.

    Also, and now, this is important: the game had Fred.

    Risen was down right fantastic.

    Edit: And that kill-move feature you use on human enemies is good times. I love being able to beat up folks/get beaten up, but not need to kill/die, or be really flowery about it with a final gut-stab from my blade.

    Klash on
    We don't even care... whether we care or not...
  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I don't mind Gothic 3 looking kinda crappy, but good lord it runs like shit. I had to turn off pretty much every post-processing effect and crank the draw distance way down to keep it from hitching every fifteen seconds of travel.

    I should not have to do that in a four year old game on a nine month old PC.

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
  • Alfred J. KwakAlfred J. Kwak Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Before starting with Risen, I'd recommend playing Gothic 2 with the Night of Raven expansion first. It's so good that Risen copied almost everything from it.

    Alfred J. Kwak on
  • Big ClassyBig Classy regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Before starting with Risen, I'd recommend playing Gothic 2 with the Night of Raven expansion first. It's so good that Risen copied almost everything from it.

    Right down to the very first town layout! Seriously, it's like a carbon copy, I knew where the harbour was immediately along with the various different area.

    Big Classy on
  • Waffles or whateverWaffles or whatever Previously known as, I shit you not, "Waffen" Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I bought this recently only to discover that Nvidia Cards have a driver issue with Gothic 2 so I can't play it until they fix it. (Which apparently its been going seven plus months already)

    Waffles or whatever on
  • HyperAquaBlastHyperAquaBlast regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Oh and one huge thing that may have been fixed by now but Gothic 1 and I think 2 had the problem if you hit your quick save key once you are dead then it will allow it.

    Taught me many things about saves after that one time.

    HyperAquaBlast on
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  • AutomaticzenAutomaticzen regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I'm pondering picking up just Gothic II. This a good idea?

    Automaticzen on
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  • Sorcha RavenlockSorcha Ravenlock regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    korodullin wrote: »
    I probably shouldn't have started with Gothic 3, but I went into it remembering that the control scheme was a bit better than its predecessors.

    Holy shit I get wrecked in melee combat so badly. I'm not quite sure what I'm doing wrong here, especially against beasts.

    Oops, missed this one before.

    Animals are harder to fight then humanoids in this game. While humans tend to parry and block, animals don't. So if they get the first attack in, you get a short stun while they keep attacking. Having a group of animals attacking you at the same time makes this effect worse.
    As far as I can tell it's a good idea to avoid groups of animals, only take them on if you have a ranged attack of some sort, and then use hit and run tactics.

    Fighting humans in melee combat is a lot easier, even in groups, since they take turns attacking you. A bit like in those old martial arts movies, they take you on one at a time making the battle a lot easier.

    Also, right click seems to do a faster attack that does less damage, but gives enemies less of a chance to hit you because they get the short stun when hit too.

    Sorcha Ravenlock on

  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Right-click is an attack? All right-clicking does is block. Well, parry. Which does nothing against animals.

    Oh, so it is. How odd.

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
  • captainkcaptaink regular TexasRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Big Isy wrote: »
    Before starting with Risen, I'd recommend playing Gothic 2 with the Night of Raven expansion first. It's so good that Risen copied almost everything from it.

    Right down to the very first town layout! Seriously, it's like a carbon copy, I knew where the harbour was immediately along with the various different area.

    Well, they are both by Piranha Bytes.

    captaink on
  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    If you're playing Gothic 3, be sure you grab the Community Patch. I believe the latest version is 1.74. I'd link to it, but my work filters World of Gothic as a Sex site.... You really don't want to play without. I'm pretty sure it works with the Steam version, but not 100%.

    Sir Carcass on
  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I have the community patch installed, but I'm not entirely sure of what it does, aside from make the combat optionally harder, which I find baffling because it's already kind of rough.

    I also heavily suspect said community patch and all the graphics options it tweaks are why this game is running so poorly for me.

    So far I'm seriously regretting getting that patch.

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
  • l337CrappyJackl337CrappyJack Registered User
    edited June 2010
    I played Risen on the 360 and it was fantastic. Then again, I was already a huge fan of Gothic before then.

    l337CrappyJack on
  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    korodullin wrote: »
    I have the community patch installed, but I'm not entirely sure of what it does, aside from make the combat optionally harder, which I find baffling because it's already kind of rough.

    I also heavily suspect said community patch and all the graphics options it tweaks are why this game is running so poorly for me.

    So far I'm seriously regretting getting that patch.

    The Community Patch people were given the source code and fixed most of the outstanding bugs, as well as adding new features like rebalanced AI and skills.

    Sir Carcass on
  • Sorcha RavenlockSorcha Ravenlock regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    The Gothic 3 Steam version is assembled with patch 1.6 and I left it at that.
    I had read about the next patch, but I found the game hard enough as it was not to want to add more dificulty. Besides that it was said to limit skills, and since this is my first playthrough I'll probably pick some skills I'll regret so that didn't seem a good option either.

    My PC is an old beast, so I knew I'd have to deal with preformance issues. Funnily enough it doesn't seem to matter if I turn the graphics up or down, I seem to get the same lag no matter what I do so I'm running the game on high settings...

    Sorcha Ravenlock on

  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    The Gothic 3 Steam version is assembled with patch 1.6 and I left it at that.
    I had read about the next patch, but I found the game hard enough as it was not to want to add more dificulty. Besides that it was said to limit skills, and since this is my first playthrough I'll probably pick some skills I'll regret so that didn't seem a good option either.

    My PC is an old beast, so I knew I'd have to deal with preformance issues. Funnily enough it doesn't seem to matter if I turn the graphics up or down, I seem to get the same lag no matter what I do so I'm running the game on high settings...

    I have a new computer and still get pauses. It's just the game.

    But you really should get the patch just for the bug fixes. The combat and skills things are optional. I leave them off myself.

    Sir Carcass on
  • Sorcha RavenlockSorcha Ravenlock regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    If I didnt' have to restart I might have installed the patch if the combat options are optional, but it's too late now. I got 90 of the free AK points, a load of the travel stones, and have done a bunch of quests as well, so I'm a good amount of hours into the game (I've been playing a lot during the day :oops: ) and I really can't be bothered with starting all over again.

    Sorcha Ravenlock on

  • emnmnmeemnmnme regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Gothic 2 is great if you play as a ranged character. A mage or an archer work out great but swinging a sword will doom you to failure.

    emnmnme on
  • DashuiDashui regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I love the Gothic games and their spiritual successor. Their games just have a certain charm to them I can't resist. I imported Gothic 2 and 3 from Europe, at a time when the US version wouldn't be released for several more months.

    Although I never did beat Gothic 3. I played the first two to completion but only ever got to the desert in the third game. I wonder if I should re-install it and try to beat it.

    I don't know what to think of Arcania: Gothic 4, though, which isn't being developed by Piranha Bytes. It's being made by Spellbound. Apparently they've already got a sequel planned and will start working on it before the first one ships.

    Dashui on
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  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    So in Gothic 3 I've gotten the quest from Steve Blum to kill some shy deer to the "east" of his camp. I looked east and found nothing but bloodflies (whose poison I can't cure, so I avoid if I can) and bandits, but I finally went straight north of his camp and found four, which I proceeded to kill.

    Now I can't find a fifth and I've scoured the whole area, including inside that cave.

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    It took me forever but I finally found the last one.... east?, I think, of where he is. Basically, stand at him facing the force field, go towards it a bit, then head right.

    Sir Carcass on
  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I've gone over that whole section of land. I don't know if I managed to spook it and sent it past the orcs without realizing it or not.

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    I was almost to Ardea when I found it, but I guess it could have gone anywhere. You don't really get anything special for doing it, that I remember.

    Sir Carcass on
  • korodullinkorodullin What. SCRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    Well you can't get training from Steve Blum until you do the quest, so...

    korodullin on
    ZvOMJnu.png
    - The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse (2017, colorized)
  • LorkLork regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    So now that the dust has settled and the patches are out, hopefully I can get an unbiased opinion on this:

    Let's say I have both Gothic 2 and 3, but I'm only going to play one of them. Which one should I go with?

    Lork on
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  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited June 2010
    korodullin wrote: »
    Well you can't get training from Steve Blum until you do the quest, so...

    Yeah, but there's tons of people that offer hunting training. I don't remember him having anything that you can't get elsewhere.

    Sir Carcass on
  • JHunzJHunz regular Registered User regular
    edited June 2010
    emnmnme wrote: »
    Gothic 2 is great if you play as a ranged character. A mage or an archer work out great but swinging a sword will doom you to failure.

    You are mad. It's a little rough to start out with, but you can become an absolute powerhouse by the end of the game.

    JHunz on
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  • l337CrappyJackl337CrappyJack Registered User
    edited June 2010
    Lork wrote: »
    So now that the dust has settled and the patches are out, hopefully I can get an unbiased opinion on this:

    Let's say I have both Gothic 2 and 3, but I'm only going to play one of them. Which one should I go with?

    Gothic 2 is the best of the series, and Gothic 3 is arguably the worst.

    So 2, unless you're a big dummy.

    l337CrappyJack on
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