Glad to hear it, I didn't care for GW2's aggro handling at all.
Plus, I enjoy tanking, balancing cooldowns and ability resources to keep my party alive without dying in the process myself is fun.
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
My first experience with GW2 dungeons soured me enough to never want to engage in them again. Everyone carrying a rock the entire time to get things done is funny but it didn't leave a good impression . I like GW2 fine. I think it's a well made and fun game but it just doesn't scratch the same itch other mmos do by comparison for me. I'm hoping Wildstar rectifies this.
PSN: Waybackkidd
"...only mights and maybes."
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
edited April 2013
deleted because editing from mobile still borked
Beezel on
PSN: Waybackkidd
"...only mights and maybes."
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
edited April 2013
(take 2)
So this is where we stand on confirmed information atm:
Confirmed features-
-action based combat and tell system with a customizable limited skill set
-2 factions, 8 races, 6 classes
-Player housing
-20 and 40 man raids
-Arena, Battleground and customizable 40 v 40 "warplot" pvp
-group benefit system for grouping with friends not in your guild
-dynamic events in the world scalable with the number of people participating
-custom content based on which of the four paths you choose
-content from paths stacking with other people's paths in a system they call "Crossing Paths" (groan)
-mix of voiced and text npcs, Voice talents secured include Tara Strong, Cam Clarke and Cree Summer (not so much a feature but pretty danged neat just the same)
The cards they're still playing close to their chest:
-Crafting system (They mentioned they want their crafting system to be a bit more involved than just throwing a bunch of stuff into a pot and hitting a button to make the item)
-Remaining 2 classes (They let slip that one of these classes is going to be a primary healer/dps rumored to be a staff user. The second has dodgy rumors of being some sort of rifle user, role unknown)
-Remaining 2 races (Aside from the actual name of the races, there's strong evidence pointing to what they are)
-Payment model (I'm expecting a sub model. Usually any plans to be f2p or b2p are tossed out there way before now)
EDIT: About the supposed healer- the brief snippets rumored to be the class showed a staff wielding male aurin laying down melee strikes. So maybe instead of space priest we get space monk?
I'm hoping for a B2P model, but I'm willing to sub, for a while at least. Provided they play their cards right I think B2P is my personal favourite (more TSW&TERA, less GW2 plz).
Corehealer has been kidnapped by Ash-Housewares and is being held for ransom! Solve the riddle to set em' free, or I'll hand em' over to Clamps!
Not a day goes by without a post from me I am a CANINE, but have no fur There's many COMICS for you to see I am synthetic, but also a CUR Which forumer am I?
Corehealer has been kidnapped by Ash-Housewares and is being held for ransom! Solve the riddle to set em' free, or I'll hand em' over to Clamps!<br />
<br />
Not a day goes by without a post from me<br />
I am a CANINE, but have no fur<br />
There's many COMICS for you to see<br />
I am synthetic, but also a CUR<br />
Which forumer am I?
Dog.
(Am I doing this right?)
Black lives matter.
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
With Chad’s mention of the intentional polarizing of factions, that word itself connotes two sides to the story. With a move toward three sided conflicts in a number of MMOs, I asked why the team had decided on two opposing factions for WildStar.
“The origins of that choice are more heavily grounded in the design systems, but I don’t really do that for a living so I would feel horrible trying to explain the specific reasons behind that. I would say personally, from a story standpoint, I enjoy having a simpler conflict. It’s nice to only have to deal with two perspectives, at least at the beginning. As the game progresses I have no idea what changes we will make, but at least for me, to begin with, it’s great that there’re two sides; pledge your allegiance, figure out which side you want then we will bring you some really interesting stories that will bring those things to light.”
With two opposing sides, one of the aspects of the game that naturally arises is whether Exiles and Dominion players will be able to communicate with each other. I asked Chad if he could shed any light on the subject.
“That isn’t something we’ve spoken about specifically, but what I can say is that as much as possible, from a story standpoint, I do not encourage any kind of cooperation, any hand holding or alliances of convenience, because for me I’ve tried to push as much as possible that this side doesn’t like that side, their philosophical and cultural differences are irreconcilable. As soon as you pledge your allegiance to The Dominion it immediately makes you an enemy of The Exiles no matter what your personal story happens to be.
I feel that intense and visceral conflict is one of the things that people enjoy about choosing a faction. As much as possible, I don’t want that to be diluted through content. The specific ways that’s done through our system that we’re talking about, philosophically that’s definitely the direction that we’re coming from.
I feel the less impactful that decision [choosing a faction] is, the less it means. So if it’s just a wrapper we put on at the beginning then if, by the end, you’re all doing the same things and doing them together it dilutes the idea of picking a side, we try to keep the purity of that conflict in place as much as we can.”
PSN: Waybackkidd
"...only mights and maybes."
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Hmuda"What other game lets you kill a Giant Spider and use its body to make soap?" - Dwarf FortressRegistered Userregular
Used the OP credentials for signing up for the beta.
Any news on the monetization by the way? Tried searching around to no avail. Since it's NCSoft, I would guess it's b2p at best, since monthly fees are suicide these days, and I highly doubt NCSoft of all people would go f2p on a new game, especially after CoX died.
Space Engine videos with appropriate music. Enjoy.
Unless your name is WoW or the incredibly niche EVE where there is literally nothing else like it I just don't see how any MMO could survive with a traditional sub model. It, IMHO, seems akin to suicide.
I always liked TSW's model (since they changed to it) where you pretty much buy digital dresses for your character and the actual "armor" was just something else. I've always wanted to see a fantasy style MMO go that route where players can buy all manner of armor pieces to deck out their character any way they see fit and to hell with class tropes! If you want a healer in full plate, go for it! Warrior tank wearing leather? Why the heck not! Mage rocking a chainmail vest? Rock on brother, rock on.
edit-
To clarify the armor pieces wouldn't have any stats or anything. The actual stats would be like TSW where you have to find/craft/buy sigils and such.
Axen on
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
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CorehealerThe ApothecaryThe softer edge of the universe.Registered Userregular
I would be willing to pay a sub again but the game in question would need to be beta tested first and shown to be something I can see myself playing for years, especially with the experience I have now with so many not WoW MMOs and games, like TSW, GW2, SW:TOR, Aion, LOTRO, DDO, Neverwinter, Defiance, etc.
Everything thus far has had it's moments and it's good parts but none of them has perfectly captured that lived in feeling and social connection that I have found in games like WoW and EvE. Stuff like that is harder to build, especially in the beginning, but is really a big part, an essential part, of creating a game that can last a long time.
Wildstar seems to leans more towards doing a lot of what WoW initially did to recapture some of the magic, but unlike a WoW clone of the last decade they are taking a lot of lessons from other MMOs, successes and failures, design advances and missteps, and stuff from other games and genres, and throwing it in a blender with humour and an even focus on core gamers and casuals.
We will only know if it's sub material when we try it and can actually see if we can become truly invested.
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
Pretty informative FAQ from wildstar central fansite
Used the info in the OP to sign up for Beta. Looking forward to this, as I've hit a lull in Tera, and GW2 was kind of meh after my first 80. I like to tank things. Why would you take that away GW2?
PSN: jfrofl
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
"Ha ha FEMBOT!" Aside I like that a lot of these head variations don't even have faces really
PSN: Waybackkidd
"...only mights and maybes."
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
Horn permutation concept art since my stupid phone won't let me edit it into the previous post
I've always wondered by female robots have breasts. Maybe it's because their waists are smaller and they needed some extra space for the electronics.
I think the general premise is for people to be able to differentiate a male and female robot, in a traditional "She's got tits, captain!" way.
Now, the real question is: Why the fuck do robots have gender in the first place? Do they just...want gender? If that's the case, I'm ok with it. I'd really like some cannon to answer the question as to why a life form that procreates through literally building a new body with physical goods needs something as banal as gender.
I've always wondered by female robots have breasts. Maybe it's because their waists are smaller and they needed some extra space for the electronics.
I think the general premise is for people to be able to differentiate a male and female robot, in a traditional "She's got tits, captain!" way.
Now, the real question is: Why the fuck do robots have gender in the first place? Do they just...want gender? If that's the case, I'm ok with it. I'd really like some cannon to answer the question as to why a life form that procreates through literally building a new body with physical goods needs something as banal as gender.
I think the best answer right now comes from the Meet the Mechari interview from the site.
Q: That sounds ominous. So you're a Mechari! I didn't realize they made robots quite so...shapely.
A: Rest assured, your reaction is perfectly normal. It merely confirms the effect of an appealing physique on those of diminished intelligence. Such as yourself.
In other words, they have genders because other races expect it and may react differently to a female form than a gender neutral shape.
In worlds where robots co-exist with humans, it makes sense for robots to distinguish themselves using human gender, because it will make the humans more likely to accept them if they feel like they're similar. If suddenly robots were running around doing shit tomorrow, you'd be more comfortable with one that looks like a human than one that just looks like a big metal monster.
I'm pretty excited about this game. It'll be interesting to see how it looks as more info is released and the beta testing begins.
I guess I'm in the minority of posters but I don't have an issue with a subscription. I will admit I don't have much experience with the pay models though. The idea just bothers me for some reason.
I've always wondered by female robots have breasts. Maybe it's because their waists are smaller and they needed some extra space for the electronics.
I think the general premise is for people to be able to differentiate a male and female robot, in a traditional "She's got tits, captain!" way.
Now, the real question is: Why the fuck do robots have gender in the first place? Do they just...want gender? If that's the case, I'm ok with it. I'd really like some cannon to answer the question as to why a life form that procreates through literally building a new body with physical goods needs something as banal as gender.
I think the best answer right now comes from the Meet the Mechari interview from the site.
Q: That sounds ominous. So you're a Mechari! I didn't realize they made robots quite so...shapely.
A: Rest assured, your reaction is perfectly normal. It merely confirms the effect of an appealing physique on those of diminished intelligence. Such as yourself.
In other words, they have genders because other races expect it and may react differently to a female form than a gender neutral shape.
Which is exactly what I said...
Always feels like a cop-out. An acceptable one, but there's a good opportunity for story there.
I've always wondered by female robots have breasts. Maybe it's because their waists are smaller and they needed some extra space for the electronics.
I think the general premise is for people to be able to differentiate a male and female robot, in a traditional "She's got tits, captain!" way.
Now, the real question is: Why the fuck do robots have gender in the first place? Do they just...want gender? If that's the case, I'm ok with it. I'd really like some cannon to answer the question as to why a life form that procreates through literally building a new body with physical goods needs something as banal as gender.
I think the best answer right now comes from the Meet the Mechari interview from the site.
Q: That sounds ominous. So you're a Mechari! I didn't realize they made robots quite so...shapely.
A: Rest assured, your reaction is perfectly normal. It merely confirms the effect of an appealing physique on those of diminished intelligence. Such as yourself.
In other words, they have genders because other races expect it and may react differently to a female form than a gender neutral shape.
Which is exactly what I said...
Always feels like a cop-out. An acceptable one, but there's a good opportunity for story there.
I guess that is what you did say, I confess to missing that first bit before crafting my reply.
Reading the quote from the interview, I take it to mean something a little different than the obvious. I interpret it as meaning that the Mechari don't need or want genders (and may not even be programmed to think in terms of gender.) But that the biological species expect male and female forms, so they build in different shapes.
I also read into it that the Mechari may be fully aware of the effect on a biological mind of a pleasing body shape (whether that be a female looking at male or male looking at female.) And so, the Mechari build themselves as different shapes in order to manipulate other races and get a favorable reaction. Plus, as the Mechari were first created by the Eldan to go out into the universe and interact with other races, maybe the Eldan created the Mechari with a more common male-female gender split and gender appearance. Thus, the Mechari would seem less alien when interacting with other races.
I fully admit this is me taking the one comment and looking for a deeper meaning. As far as I know, there isn't a more in-depth answer at this point. I'm just making conjecture.
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
Used the info in the OP to sign up for Beta. Looking forward to this, as I've hit a lull in Tera, and GW2 was kind of meh after my first 80. I like to tank things. Why would you take that away GW2?
They didn't, really. It's more difficult, but if you really want to it's not hard to hold a mob in one place for a while and have it wail on you while you do what you can to keep alive.
But they did make it so that you you couldn't have a healer in your group who just kept you at full health the whole time by spamming nothing but heal skills. And you couldn't spam "lol I don't die" skills all day and night so the hellbeast you're fighting could rip out your guts for 30 minutes while you stood there all "eh... whatever."
Trinity focused combat sucks a fat one, and so does everything it implies. Best thing Guild Wars 2 did was to limit tanking and healing so that the whole group had to think about doing it - continues to make every dungeon that's not Arah 2, 4, or Catacombs 3 an enjoyable run, even despite the simplistic enemy mechanics and bosses with way too much goddamn health. I can only hope that they give that consideration in WildStar, because if I see another entitled prick of a tank drop a group because the healer DC'd and my alt set isn't good enough, and the group has to wait 20 or so minutes looking for another tank with the right set... well, at least I'll feel vindicated. Then probably pop in Guild Wars 2 where I can tell role-oriented gear to fuck off, kick those whiners as long as I have a buddy in the group, and pick up whoever the fuck is interested in LFG before we finish the pull.
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BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
Used the info in the OP to sign up for Beta. Looking forward to this, as I've hit a lull in Tera, and GW2 was kind of meh after my first 80. I like to tank things. Why would you take that away GW2?
They didn't, really. It's more difficult, but if you really want to it's not hard to hold a mob in one place for a while and have it wail on you while you do what you can to keep alive.
But they did make it so that you you couldn't have a healer in your group who just kept you at full health the whole time by spamming nothing but heal skills. And you couldn't spam "lol I don't die" skills all day and night so the hellbeast you're fighting could rip out your guts for 30 minutes while you stood there all "eh... whatever."
Trinity focused combat sucks a fat one, and so does everything it implies. Best thing Guild Wars 2 did was to limit tanking and healing so that the whole group had to think about doing it - continues to make every dungeon that's not Arah 2, 4, or Catacombs 3 an enjoyable run, even despite the simplistic enemy mechanics and bosses with way too much goddamn health. I can only hope that they give that consideration in WildStar, because if I see another entitled prick of a tank drop a group because the healer DC'd and my alt set isn't good enough, and the group has to wait 20 or so minutes looking for another tank with the right set... well, at least I'll feel vindicated. Then probably pop in Guild Wars 2 where I can tell role-oriented gear to fuck off, kick those whiners as long as I have a buddy in the group, and pick up whoever the fuck is interested in LFG before we finish the pull.
Wildstar is looking to make sure every class can fill at least 2 roles to cut down on tank monopoly. but I get what you're saying. The combat footage we've seen so far has been low level combat with half of the available skill slots enabled but from what the devs stated you're going to be able to customize combat and utility skills out of combat on the fly and tailor them to what you think you might be doing. At this stage the best thing to do is to wait and see how the systems shake down.
The Secret World proved you can have a trinity system and still have engaging dungeon encounters without it boiling down to straight cut "Tank tanks, healer heals, dps hits stuff" In fact they were some of the most thought out and engaging encounters I've ever experienced in an mmo and managed to tell a story coherently in the process. It's not impossible.
I can appreciate people liking what GW2 did, but to me it just felt like their solution to "two roles are fun, one role is boring" was "only have one role". Which, for me, ended up boring fairly quickly. It didn't really matter what class I brought, everyone played the same, ie "do your class' damage routine, dodge red circles, follow boss gimmick". Didn't help that most boss fights were super simplistic.
It's odd, because to a degree CoX did the same thing with their CoV expansion, yet there it felt a lot more meaningful. Don't get me wrong, I thought AV encounters in that game were shit, even more simplistic and boring than the most boring GW2 dungeons, but in group combat it felt like I had a role. And if I didn't play it, people died. I did damage and I played my group role.
It's probably just personal preference. Something person A feels is fun and crucial person B feels is irrelevant and vice versa. I've hopes the Wildstar two-roles mechanic means people in both camps can enjoy it.
Used the info in the OP to sign up for Beta. Looking forward to this, as I've hit a lull in Tera, and GW2 was kind of meh after my first 80. I like to tank things. Why would you take that away GW2?
They didn't, really. It's more difficult, but if you really want to it's not hard to hold a mob in one place for a while and have it wail on you while you do what you can to keep alive.
But they did make it so that you you couldn't have a healer in your group who just kept you at full health the whole time by spamming nothing but heal skills. And you couldn't spam "lol I don't die" skills all day and night so the hellbeast you're fighting could rip out your guts for 30 minutes while you stood there all "eh... whatever."
Trinity focused combat sucks a fat one, and so does everything it implies. Best thing Guild Wars 2 did was to limit tanking and healing so that the whole group had to think about doing it - continues to make every dungeon that's not Arah 2, 4, or Catacombs 3 an enjoyable run, even despite the simplistic enemy mechanics and bosses with way too much goddamn health. I can only hope that they give that consideration in WildStar, because if I see another entitled prick of a tank drop a group because the healer DC'd and my alt set isn't good enough, and the group has to wait 20 or so minutes looking for another tank with the right set... well, at least I'll feel vindicated. Then probably pop in Guild Wars 2 where I can tell role-oriented gear to fuck off, kick those whiners as long as I have a buddy in the group, and pick up whoever the fuck is interested in LFG before we finish the pull.
I understand that feeling. I think my issue was I never really felt like I was doing my job well in the group. Could've been my choice class (Gaurdian), or the few instances I did do felt like a giant question mark of what I'm trying to do. Every time I dps, I feel like I should be giving boons. Everytime I gave boons, I felt like I need to dps. Or I was dead. Shit was pretty rad.
Not saying GW2 wasn't fun. I had fun with it, and still log in occasionally. It just didn't grip me (which is possibly for the best), like Rift or Tera or a few others have.
Entitled tanks, I understand. I hate that, and enjoyed being a tank that loved taking in undergeared people and helping them out. I wish those guys weren't out there, but I don't think removing a trinity escaped that, or removed people being elitist pricks from the internets. I am eager to see how well the having multiple paths of tanking pans out. I don't like that people are waiting on that one guy to go have fun in the game and do the group content.
I had more written, but I don't really think it matters.
Still, looking forward to playing this and this is one of the few times I'm actually interested in a Beta.
It's entirely possible to have trinity encounter design that still demands good play out of all parties involved. Simplifying it down to omg tank just stands there and healer just spams 2 skills is just silly. Let me tell you, fighting hard mode Mimiron in ulduar in a 10 man raid was a million times more fun than anything GW2 will ever do. Why? Because even though 2 guys are the healers, one is the tank, and the rest are DPS, there were all very specific jobs those people had to do.
Having trinity means having healing classes that have cooldowns that need to be rotated to save people, tanks can get creative and use their cooldowns at the right time, and DPS classes that are hybrids can even save somebody's ass with a clutch heal and what not.
At the end of the day, getting rid of trinity sounds like a noble goal, but in the end just makes the combat have to be designed in a generic way. The dungeons in GW2 were largely boring as shit because of it too. The best parts of GW2 were playing my thief and blasting healing in an aoe for my party in water fields with my shortbow, but the problem is, because the game is designed on not needing that, it was just pointless unless the people I was playing with didn't know how to dodge shit.
The important change to make to the trinity is two fold:
First, they must reintroduce the fourth archetype. The dedicated support (not to be confused with healer). This class usually takes the form of a control specialized class, but can also be a dedicated debuffer/buffer. Allowing other classes access to these features is fine, but having one guy be really fucking good at it allows for combat complexity. There is no greater example of how well this works than the Enchanter in Everquest. It allowed for some pretty interesting encounters, and gives the group a crutch they can fall back on in desperate times. Without the fourth archetype, I fundamentally believe MMO combat will not change. You need a wildcard in order to mix things up. If you give the players access to a control spec'd class, you can also give the AI access to it. Allowing for further unknowns during combat, increasing the chances of "fun" happening.
Second, combat must be predicated on giving the players a "recovery" window. A moment when the encounter turns to shit and everything appears to be going pear shaped. But! Lo'! The DPS players have banded together and are providing a sort of temporary distraction! The controller has created a bubble of frozen time around the healer and the tank, allowing the healer to cast his Resurrection spell, and suddenly...all is back on track. Those moments are definitive. They are the things that keep us playing. Beating the boss for the tenth time does not excite anyone but the most masochistic of loot hunter. Narrowly beating the boss due to fancy playing is constantly exhilarating. GW2 had elements of this, and I often waxed philosophic for days with the guys I played with about fun encounters we almost lost. WoW was really good about it, in all honesty (Although, it did start to get a little easy and sloppily implemented. I have fond memories of recovering bad pulls and bad boss fights in Black Temple though).
Straight up disbanding the trinity (as GW2 tried to do) results in everyone just being DPS, as was referenced earlier. I sucks the fun out of the game because it's impossible to say:
"You know Jim, I'm a bad ass tank. I've invested literal days in becoming the best tank. Let us sally forth and you can hide behind my wall of HP and armor. I shall be your body guard."
"Well John, I am a bad ass healer. I'm so bad ass at it, you could have only one hitpoint and you'd still never die on my watch."
It's just a lot of:
"I have a bunch of HP and damage. Tra la la la la, la la, la, la."
It neuters the fun of actually playing a role. I can be Anon the Felon, alien dude who dudes his way around with his dudes.
But, I'd much rather be Anon the Felon, the best tank this side of Alpha Centuri. Known for recovering from any failed pull. Master of aggro.
I was also (as many were) excited by GW2's notion of disbanding the Trinity, thanks to how it freed up group combinations and eliminated wait times for groups... in theory... in practice it did none of those things. It was a noble experiment, but for many it failed.
In hindsight, I think the MMO that got class-based-design most-right and the real next step in that regard is actually Rift. Since you could cover multiple roles, and multiple roles well, you never felt trapped, it was pretty easy to find groups and you never felt like you really had to adopt "This Is The Only Way You May Set Up Your Healer/Tank/DPS Or GTFO" builds. Rift of course had the problem that the actual moment to moment gameplay was WoW, which is something GW2 did manage to fix and Wildstar is following it's example.
In a similar way GW2's content solution of "no quests, only what you find around the world" was exciting, but fell on the lack of a coherent story and way to push you forward into the world. Wildstar appears to be following GW2's example on lessening the reliance on quest hubs while still giving the tried-and-true ! quests to push you forward and tell the stories of the world.
MMOs need to evolve, is the point, in the Trinity idea, content and gameplay. Evolve doesn't mean throw everything out and try to start from scratch (GW2), Wildstar, to me, seems to realize that.
Posts
Plus, I enjoy tanking, balancing cooldowns and ability resources to keep my party alive without dying in the process myself is fun.
"...only mights and maybes."
"...only mights and maybes."
So this is where we stand on confirmed information atm:
Confirmed features-
-action based combat and tell system with a customizable limited skill set
-2 factions, 8 races, 6 classes
-Player housing
-20 and 40 man raids
-Arena, Battleground and customizable 40 v 40 "warplot" pvp
-group benefit system for grouping with friends not in your guild
-dynamic events in the world scalable with the number of people participating
-custom content based on which of the four paths you choose
-content from paths stacking with other people's paths in a system they call "Crossing Paths" (groan)
-mix of voiced and text npcs, Voice talents secured include Tara Strong, Cam Clarke and Cree Summer (not so much a feature but pretty danged neat just the same)
The cards they're still playing close to their chest:
-Crafting system (They mentioned they want their crafting system to be a bit more involved than just throwing a bunch of stuff into a pot and hitting a button to make the item)
-Remaining 2 classes (They let slip that one of these classes is going to be a primary healer/dps rumored to be a staff user. The second has dodgy rumors of being some sort of rifle user, role unknown)
-Remaining 2 races (Aside from the actual name of the races, there's strong evidence pointing to what they are)
-Payment model (I'm expecting a sub model. Usually any plans to be f2p or b2p are tossed out there way before now)
EDIT: About the supposed healer- the brief snippets rumored to be the class showed a staff wielding male aurin laying down melee strikes. So maybe instead of space priest we get space monk?
"...only mights and maybes."
I am a CANINE, but have no fur
There's many COMICS for you to see
I am synthetic, but also a CUR
Which forumer am I?
Dog.
(Am I doing this right?)
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
I'm so sick of the F2P model, I have sworn off playing them with any serious intent.
http://www.zam.com/story.html?story=31890
Couple of things stood out
With Chad’s mention of the intentional polarizing of factions, that word itself connotes two sides to the story. With a move toward three sided conflicts in a number of MMOs, I asked why the team had decided on two opposing factions for WildStar.
“The origins of that choice are more heavily grounded in the design systems, but I don’t really do that for a living so I would feel horrible trying to explain the specific reasons behind that. I would say personally, from a story standpoint, I enjoy having a simpler conflict. It’s nice to only have to deal with two perspectives, at least at the beginning. As the game progresses I have no idea what changes we will make, but at least for me, to begin with, it’s great that there’re two sides; pledge your allegiance, figure out which side you want then we will bring you some really interesting stories that will bring those things to light.”
With two opposing sides, one of the aspects of the game that naturally arises is whether Exiles and Dominion players will be able to communicate with each other. I asked Chad if he could shed any light on the subject.
“That isn’t something we’ve spoken about specifically, but what I can say is that as much as possible, from a story standpoint, I do not encourage any kind of cooperation, any hand holding or alliances of convenience, because for me I’ve tried to push as much as possible that this side doesn’t like that side, their philosophical and cultural differences are irreconcilable. As soon as you pledge your allegiance to The Dominion it immediately makes you an enemy of The Exiles no matter what your personal story happens to be.
I feel that intense and visceral conflict is one of the things that people enjoy about choosing a faction. As much as possible, I don’t want that to be diluted through content. The specific ways that’s done through our system that we’re talking about, philosophically that’s definitely the direction that we’re coming from.
I feel the less impactful that decision [choosing a faction] is, the less it means. So if it’s just a wrapper we put on at the beginning then if, by the end, you’re all doing the same things and doing them together it dilutes the idea of picking a side, we try to keep the purity of that conflict in place as much as we can.”
"...only mights and maybes."
Any news on the monetization by the way? Tried searching around to no avail. Since it's NCSoft, I would guess it's b2p at best, since monthly fees are suicide these days, and I highly doubt NCSoft of all people would go f2p on a new game, especially after CoX died.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Hmuda
"...only mights and maybes."
http://www.youtube.com/user/Hmuda
Unless your name is WoW or the incredibly niche EVE where there is literally nothing else like it I just don't see how any MMO could survive with a traditional sub model. It, IMHO, seems akin to suicide.
I always liked TSW's model (since they changed to it) where you pretty much buy digital dresses for your character and the actual "armor" was just something else. I've always wanted to see a fantasy style MMO go that route where players can buy all manner of armor pieces to deck out their character any way they see fit and to hell with class tropes! If you want a healer in full plate, go for it! Warrior tank wearing leather? Why the heck not! Mage rocking a chainmail vest? Rock on brother, rock on.
edit-
To clarify the armor pieces wouldn't have any stats or anything. The actual stats would be like TSW where you have to find/craft/buy sigils and such.
Everything thus far has had it's moments and it's good parts but none of them has perfectly captured that lived in feeling and social connection that I have found in games like WoW and EvE. Stuff like that is harder to build, especially in the beginning, but is really a big part, an essential part, of creating a game that can last a long time.
Wildstar seems to leans more towards doing a lot of what WoW initially did to recapture some of the magic, but unlike a WoW clone of the last decade they are taking a lot of lessons from other MMOs, successes and failures, design advances and missteps, and stuff from other games and genres, and throwing it in a blender with humour and an even focus on core gamers and casuals.
We will only know if it's sub material when we try it and can actually see if we can become truly invested.
http://wildstar-central.com/index.php?threads/the-wildstar-faq-or-how-i-learned-to-look-before-asking-updated-march-12-2013.73/
"...only mights and maybes."
"Ha ha FEMBOT!" Aside I like that a lot of these head variations don't even have faces really
"...only mights and maybes."
Horn permutation concept art since my stupid phone won't let me edit it into the previous post
"...only mights and maybes."
Also for lasers.
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
I think the general premise is for people to be able to differentiate a male and female robot, in a traditional "She's got tits, captain!" way.
Now, the real question is: Why the fuck do robots have gender in the first place? Do they just...want gender? If that's the case, I'm ok with it. I'd really like some cannon to answer the question as to why a life form that procreates through literally building a new body with physical goods needs something as banal as gender.
I think the best answer right now comes from the Meet the Mechari interview from the site.
In other words, they have genders because other races expect it and may react differently to a female form than a gender neutral shape.
I guess I'm in the minority of posters but I don't have an issue with a subscription. I will admit I don't have much experience with the pay models though. The idea just bothers me for some reason.
Which is exactly what I said...
Always feels like a cop-out. An acceptable one, but there's a good opportunity for story there.
I guess that is what you did say, I confess to missing that first bit before crafting my reply.
Reading the quote from the interview, I take it to mean something a little different than the obvious. I interpret it as meaning that the Mechari don't need or want genders (and may not even be programmed to think in terms of gender.) But that the biological species expect male and female forms, so they build in different shapes.
I also read into it that the Mechari may be fully aware of the effect on a biological mind of a pleasing body shape (whether that be a female looking at male or male looking at female.) And so, the Mechari build themselves as different shapes in order to manipulate other races and get a favorable reaction. Plus, as the Mechari were first created by the Eldan to go out into the universe and interact with other races, maybe the Eldan created the Mechari with a more common male-female gender split and gender appearance. Thus, the Mechari would seem less alien when interacting with other races.
I fully admit this is me taking the one comment and looking for a deeper meaning. As far as I know, there isn't a more in-depth answer at this point. I'm just making conjecture.
http://wildstarradio.com/2013/03/29/episode-6-super-secret-guest-arrives/
"...only mights and maybes."
They didn't, really. It's more difficult, but if you really want to it's not hard to hold a mob in one place for a while and have it wail on you while you do what you can to keep alive.
But they did make it so that you you couldn't have a healer in your group who just kept you at full health the whole time by spamming nothing but heal skills. And you couldn't spam "lol I don't die" skills all day and night so the hellbeast you're fighting could rip out your guts for 30 minutes while you stood there all "eh... whatever."
Trinity focused combat sucks a fat one, and so does everything it implies. Best thing Guild Wars 2 did was to limit tanking and healing so that the whole group had to think about doing it - continues to make every dungeon that's not Arah 2, 4, or Catacombs 3 an enjoyable run, even despite the simplistic enemy mechanics and bosses with way too much goddamn health. I can only hope that they give that consideration in WildStar, because if I see another entitled prick of a tank drop a group because the healer DC'd and my alt set isn't good enough, and the group has to wait 20 or so minutes looking for another tank with the right set... well, at least I'll feel vindicated. Then probably pop in Guild Wars 2 where I can tell role-oriented gear to fuck off, kick those whiners as long as I have a buddy in the group, and pick up whoever the fuck is interested in LFG before we finish the pull.
http://m.soundcloud.com/inhisgroove/systematicdomination-7-25
Dominion theme from Jeff Kurtenacker's soundcloud
EDIT: Eldan theme as well http://m.soundcloud.com/inhisgroove/wildstar-the-cold-science-of
"...only mights and maybes."
Wildstar is looking to make sure every class can fill at least 2 roles to cut down on tank monopoly. but I get what you're saying. The combat footage we've seen so far has been low level combat with half of the available skill slots enabled but from what the devs stated you're going to be able to customize combat and utility skills out of combat on the fly and tailor them to what you think you might be doing. At this stage the best thing to do is to wait and see how the systems shake down.
The Secret World proved you can have a trinity system and still have engaging dungeon encounters without it boiling down to straight cut "Tank tanks, healer heals, dps hits stuff" In fact they were some of the most thought out and engaging encounters I've ever experienced in an mmo and managed to tell a story coherently in the process. It's not impossible.
"...only mights and maybes."
It's odd, because to a degree CoX did the same thing with their CoV expansion, yet there it felt a lot more meaningful. Don't get me wrong, I thought AV encounters in that game were shit, even more simplistic and boring than the most boring GW2 dungeons, but in group combat it felt like I had a role. And if I didn't play it, people died. I did damage and I played my group role.
It's probably just personal preference. Something person A feels is fun and crucial person B feels is irrelevant and vice versa. I've hopes the Wildstar two-roles mechanic means people in both camps can enjoy it.
I understand that feeling. I think my issue was I never really felt like I was doing my job well in the group. Could've been my choice class (Gaurdian), or the few instances I did do felt like a giant question mark of what I'm trying to do. Every time I dps, I feel like I should be giving boons. Everytime I gave boons, I felt like I need to dps. Or I was dead. Shit was pretty rad.
Not saying GW2 wasn't fun. I had fun with it, and still log in occasionally. It just didn't grip me (which is possibly for the best), like Rift or Tera or a few others have.
Entitled tanks, I understand. I hate that, and enjoyed being a tank that loved taking in undergeared people and helping them out. I wish those guys weren't out there, but I don't think removing a trinity escaped that, or removed people being elitist pricks from the internets. I am eager to see how well the having multiple paths of tanking pans out. I don't like that people are waiting on that one guy to go have fun in the game and do the group content.
I had more written, but I don't really think it matters.
Still, looking forward to playing this and this is one of the few times I'm actually interested in a Beta.
Having trinity means having healing classes that have cooldowns that need to be rotated to save people, tanks can get creative and use their cooldowns at the right time, and DPS classes that are hybrids can even save somebody's ass with a clutch heal and what not.
At the end of the day, getting rid of trinity sounds like a noble goal, but in the end just makes the combat have to be designed in a generic way. The dungeons in GW2 were largely boring as shit because of it too. The best parts of GW2 were playing my thief and blasting healing in an aoe for my party in water fields with my shortbow, but the problem is, because the game is designed on not needing that, it was just pointless unless the people I was playing with didn't know how to dodge shit.
First, they must reintroduce the fourth archetype. The dedicated support (not to be confused with healer). This class usually takes the form of a control specialized class, but can also be a dedicated debuffer/buffer. Allowing other classes access to these features is fine, but having one guy be really fucking good at it allows for combat complexity. There is no greater example of how well this works than the Enchanter in Everquest. It allowed for some pretty interesting encounters, and gives the group a crutch they can fall back on in desperate times. Without the fourth archetype, I fundamentally believe MMO combat will not change. You need a wildcard in order to mix things up. If you give the players access to a control spec'd class, you can also give the AI access to it. Allowing for further unknowns during combat, increasing the chances of "fun" happening.
Second, combat must be predicated on giving the players a "recovery" window. A moment when the encounter turns to shit and everything appears to be going pear shaped. But! Lo'! The DPS players have banded together and are providing a sort of temporary distraction! The controller has created a bubble of frozen time around the healer and the tank, allowing the healer to cast his Resurrection spell, and suddenly...all is back on track. Those moments are definitive. They are the things that keep us playing. Beating the boss for the tenth time does not excite anyone but the most masochistic of loot hunter. Narrowly beating the boss due to fancy playing is constantly exhilarating. GW2 had elements of this, and I often waxed philosophic for days with the guys I played with about fun encounters we almost lost. WoW was really good about it, in all honesty (Although, it did start to get a little easy and sloppily implemented. I have fond memories of recovering bad pulls and bad boss fights in Black Temple though).
Straight up disbanding the trinity (as GW2 tried to do) results in everyone just being DPS, as was referenced earlier. I sucks the fun out of the game because it's impossible to say:
"You know Jim, I'm a bad ass tank. I've invested literal days in becoming the best tank. Let us sally forth and you can hide behind my wall of HP and armor. I shall be your body guard."
"Well John, I am a bad ass healer. I'm so bad ass at it, you could have only one hitpoint and you'd still never die on my watch."
It's just a lot of:
"I have a bunch of HP and damage. Tra la la la la, la la, la, la."
It neuters the fun of actually playing a role. I can be Anon the Felon, alien dude who dudes his way around with his dudes.
But, I'd much rather be Anon the Felon, the best tank this side of Alpha Centuri. Known for recovering from any failed pull. Master of aggro.
In hindsight, I think the MMO that got class-based-design most-right and the real next step in that regard is actually Rift. Since you could cover multiple roles, and multiple roles well, you never felt trapped, it was pretty easy to find groups and you never felt like you really had to adopt "This Is The Only Way You May Set Up Your Healer/Tank/DPS Or GTFO" builds. Rift of course had the problem that the actual moment to moment gameplay was WoW, which is something GW2 did manage to fix and Wildstar is following it's example.
In a similar way GW2's content solution of "no quests, only what you find around the world" was exciting, but fell on the lack of a coherent story and way to push you forward into the world. Wildstar appears to be following GW2's example on lessening the reliance on quest hubs while still giving the tried-and-true ! quests to push you forward and tell the stories of the world.
MMOs need to evolve, is the point, in the Trinity idea, content and gameplay. Evolve doesn't mean throw everything out and try to start from scratch (GW2), Wildstar, to me, seems to realize that.