Just because all of that went down doesn't mean they can't be victims. They weren't victims in the fight, but in the ensuing legal case they're being railroaded and it seems to be because of their race.
No.
This right here is half the problem. People coming up with bullshit, unfounded reasons why this is racially motivated. A civil rights group pulls the race card, yet again, to make people feel like these shitheads are being hard done by. You bought it hook, line and sinker.
The fact is, 6 guys kicked the living crap out of 1 guy. He was beaten to the ground, at which point they decided to start kicking him in the head. Pretty common knowledge that you can kill somebody by doing that, thus the attempted murder charges. Seems fair to me.
I don't think anyone is saying they're innocent, nor have I heard any news implying they're innocent of any wrongdoing. The uproar is solely about the unwarranted charges that are being leveled at them for what appears to be racial motives.
Where exactly are these apparent 'racial motives' other than the ones some civil rights group has told you are there? I certainly dont see any. I'd think the charges being levelled at them were fair no matter what race they are. I'd say the racist part of whats going on here is basically accusing an entire justice system of being card carrying clansmen.
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. Did you read the wikipedia article? All the violence that took place was obviously racially motivated (i.e. it was white students fighting black students) and then the black kids get disproportionately large sentences by all white juries.
Indeed I did read it. You see no difference between the other fights that happened?
None of the other fights seemed to involve 6 white kids kicking the crap out of a black kid while he lay unconcious on the ground.
A fight between a couple of kids is assault at best. These 6 kids viciously attacked another kid who was clearly defenceless.
A civil rights group pulling the 'Oh no, racism!' defence is just bullshit. These 6 cockheads are so brave to attack 1 guy in that fashion. They deserve to have the book thrown at them.
Just because all of that went down doesn't mean they can't be victims. They weren't victims in the fight, but in the ensuing legal case they're being railroaded and it seems to be because of their race.
No.
This right here is half the problem. People coming up with bullshit, unfounded reasons why this is racially motivated. A civil rights group pulls the race card, yet again, to make people feel like these shitheads are being hard done by. You bought it hook, line and sinker.
The fact is, 6 guys kicked the living crap out of 1 guy. He was beaten to the ground, at which point they decided to start kicking him in the head. Pretty common knowledge that you can kill somebody by doing that, thus the attempted murder charges. Seems fair to me.
I don't think anyone is saying they're innocent, nor have I heard any news implying they're innocent of any wrongdoing. The uproar is solely about the unwarranted charges that are being leveled at them for what appears to be racial motives.
Where exactly are these apparent 'racial motives' other than the ones some civil rights group has told you are there? I certainly dont see any. I'd think the charges being levelled at them were fair no matter what race they are. I'd say the racist part of whats going on here is basically accusing an entire justice system of being card carrying clansmen.
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. Did you read the wikipedia article? All the violence that took place was obviously racially motivated (i.e. it was white students fighting black students) and then the black kids get disproportionately large sentences by all white juries.
Indeed I did read it. You see no difference between the other fights that happened?
None of the other fights seemed to involve 6 white kids kicking the crap out of a black kid while he lay unconcious on the ground.
A fight between a couple of kids is assault at best. These 6 kids viciously attacked another kid who was clearly defenceless.
A civil rights group pulling the 'Oh no, racism!' defence is just bullshit. These 6 cockheads are so brave to attack 1 guy in that fashion. They deserve to have the book thrown at them.
The book's too good for them. They outta be hanged.:roll:
The small towns I've been to in the South seem to place a huge premium on people staying to their "roles" and not upsetting the status quo. Part of the status quo, of course, is the racial separation and hierarchy that's persisted for centuries. I get the impression that these kids are being crucified less for whatever crimes they committed and much more for the fact that they "stepped out of bounds" and have shaken up what people saw as the proper order.
I agree; but, of course, white kids who step out of line and shake things up in these towns aren't going to be subject to the same level of retribution as they would if they weren't white.
Just because all of that went down doesn't mean they can't be victims. They weren't victims in the fight, but in the ensuing legal case they're being railroaded and it seems to be because of their race.
No.
This right here is half the problem. People coming up with bullshit, unfounded reasons why this is racially motivated. A civil rights group pulls the race card, yet again, to make people feel like these shitheads are being hard done by. You bought it hook, line and sinker.
The fact is, 6 guys kicked the living crap out of 1 guy. He was beaten to the ground, at which point they decided to start kicking him in the head. Pretty common knowledge that you can kill somebody by doing that, thus the attempted murder charges. Seems fair to me.
I don't think anyone is saying they're innocent, nor have I heard any news implying they're innocent of any wrongdoing. The uproar is solely about the unwarranted charges that are being leveled at them for what appears to be racial motives.
Where exactly are these apparent 'racial motives' other than the ones some civil rights group has told you are there? I certainly dont see any. I'd think the charges being levelled at them were fair no matter what race they are. I'd say the racist part of whats going on here is basically accusing an entire justice system of being card carrying clansmen.
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. Did you read the wikipedia article? All the violence that took place was obviously racially motivated (i.e. it was white students fighting black students) and then the black kids get disproportionately large sentences by all white juries.
Indeed I did read it. You see no difference between the other fights that happened?
None of the other fights seemed to involve 6 white kids kicking the crap out of a black kid while he lay unconcious on the ground.
A fight between a couple of kids is assault at best. These 6 kids viciously attacked another kid who was clearly defenceless.
A civil rights group pulling the 'Oh no, racism!' defence is just bullshit. These 6 cockheads are so brave to attack 1 guy in that fashion. They deserve to have the book thrown at them.
You're a fucking moron.
First off, let's not forget how all this started - black kids want to sit in shade, assert their right to do so, next day shade tree is decorated in nooses. Please, tell me that's not racist, so the rest of us can laugh in your face.
And when a white kid branished a weapon at a group of black kids, he was let off with a slap on the wrist.
Was the attack vicious? Yes. But so say that racism was not involved is to be so willfully ignorant of the whole matter that you should be written off entirely.
Just because all of that went down doesn't mean they can't be victims. They weren't victims in the fight, but in the ensuing legal case they're being railroaded and it seems to be because of their race.
No.
This right here is half the problem. People coming up with bullshit, unfounded reasons why this is racially motivated. A civil rights group pulls the race card, yet again, to make people feel like these shitheads are being hard done by. You bought it hook, line and sinker.
The fact is, 6 guys kicked the living crap out of 1 guy. He was beaten to the ground, at which point they decided to start kicking him in the head. Pretty common knowledge that you can kill somebody by doing that, thus the attempted murder charges. Seems fair to me.
I don't think anyone is saying they're innocent, nor have I heard any news implying they're innocent of any wrongdoing. The uproar is solely about the unwarranted charges that are being leveled at them for what appears to be racial motives.
Where exactly are these apparent 'racial motives' other than the ones some civil rights group has told you are there? I certainly dont see any. I'd think the charges being levelled at them were fair no matter what race they are. I'd say the racist part of whats going on here is basically accusing an entire justice system of being card carrying clansmen.
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. Did you read the wikipedia article? All the violence that took place was obviously racially motivated (i.e. it was white students fighting black students) and then the black kids get disproportionately large sentences by all white juries.
Indeed I did read it. You see no difference between the other fights that happened?
None of the other fights seemed to involve 6 white kids kicking the crap out of a black kid while he lay unconcious on the ground.
A fight between a couple of kids is assault at best. These 6 kids viciously attacked another kid who was clearly defenceless.
A civil rights group pulling the 'Oh no, racism!' defence is just bullshit. These 6 cockheads are so brave to attack 1 guy in that fashion. They deserve to have the book thrown at them.
I... what? Are you seriously that fucking stupid? This kid get examined by a doctor who finds a concussion and a black eye, but he's well enough to get up and go a school ceremony later that day, and you think it's alright that these kids are being charged with attempted murder?
No legal action against the white kid that pulls a gun, where the victim of that altercation is accused of disturbing the peace and theft of a firearm, and you say that racism isn't involved in this situation?
First off, let's not forget how all this started - black kids want to sit in shade, assert their right to do so, next day shade tree is decorated in nooses. Please, tell me that's not racist, so the rest of us can laugh in your face.
And when a white kid branished a weapon at a group of black kids, he was let off with a slap on the wrist.
Was the attack vicious? Yes. But so say that racism was not involved is to be so willfully ignorant of the whole matter that you should be written off entirely.
Wow. Somebody missing the point entirely calling me a moron? A bit rich really.
Sure, there was racism involved, between the kids. The point here is that the justice system of a town is being accused of racism for charging people who commited different crimes with different offences. Amazing how that happens....
The white kid brandishes a weapon at a group of black kids during a confrontation. Do you know the exact details of that confrontation? Can you say without a doubt that the white kid had no reason to fear for his personal safety, and no reason to pull a gun? Can you say with certainty that his life wasn't threatened? I very much doubt it.
I... what? Are you seriously that fucking stupid? This kid get examined by a doctor who finds a concussion and a black eye, but he's well enough to get up and go a school ceremony later that day, and you think it's alright that these kids are being charged with attempted murder?
No legal action against the white kid that pulls a gun, where the victim of that altercation is accused of disturbing the peace and theft of a firearm, and you say that racism isn't involved in this situation?
You're a fucking moron.
Sorry champ, but I'd say the moron here is you.
It doesn't matter if the kid was ok afterwards. The fact is 6 guys kicked the shit out of him while he was defenceless. If I fire a gun at your head and miss, but you are still ok, is that not attempted murder? Since when has it not been pretty standard practice for somebody to be charged with the worst offence possible, and then be able to plea bargain it down?
As for your second gripe, see my reply above, then factor in that the black kid did indeed steal a firearm. Dont see a problem with that charge.
Looking at the situation in all your shock and outrage that these poor black kids are being horribly hard done by is amusing when we all probably know about a tenth of what actually went on.
Sorry champ, but I'd say the moron here is you.
It doesn't matter if the kid was ok afterwards. The fact is 6 guys kicked the shit out of him while he was defenceless. If I fire a gun at your head and miss, but you are still ok, is that not attempted murder? Since when has it not been pretty standard practice for somebody to be charged with the worst offence possible, and then be able to plea bargain it down?
As for your second gripe, see my reply above, then factor in that the black kid did indeed steal a firearm. Dont see a problem with that charge.
Looking at the situation in all your shock and outrage that these poor black kids are being horribly hard done by is amusing when we all probably know about a tenth of what actually went on.
In just about every state, a "deadly weapon" is considered to be a firearm, a knife over a certain length, or an explosive device or something like that.
Not a fucking Reebok. They should have been charged with assault and battery. Probably in the 2nd degree, even.
Sorry champ, but I'd say the moron here is you.
It doesn't matter if the kid was ok afterwards. The fact is 6 guys kicked the shit out of him while he was defenceless. If I fire a gun at your head and miss, but you are still ok, is that not attempted murder? Since when has it not been pretty standard practice for somebody to be charged with the worst offence possible, and then be able to plea bargain it down?
As for your second gripe, see my reply above, then factor in that the black kid did indeed steal a firearm. Dont see a problem with that charge.
Looking at the situation in all your shock and outrage that these poor black kids are being horribly hard done by is amusing when we all probably know about a tenth of what actually went on.
In just about every state, a "deadly weapon" is considered to be a firearm, a knife over a certain length, or an explosive device or something like that.
Not a fucking Reebok. They should have been charged with assault and battery. Probably in the 2nd degree, even.
And nobody has ever been kicked to death, or beaten to death with bare hands?
Maybe what they are being charged with is a bit harsh, but it may have been in the interest of as I mentioned in my last post, relying on plea bargaining. If they are charged with some pissy assault and battery, they'd probably end up getting off with probation or some shit. These 6 guys beat a guy in a way that has killed or brain damaged to the point of being a vegetable on many, many occasions. They shouldn't be getting out of it with nothing.
In American law, severity and duration do matter when determining lethality and intent. If their intention was to kill, they would have used a lethal weapon (A gun, maybe? Oh, but I guess the white kid that threatened them with one doesn't get any time, so they could have used one without being charged with anything.) as opposed to just beating him up. If the facts of the case supported attempted murder, there wouldn't be an outrage, but the facts just do not support an attempted murder charge.
I'm pretty sure wrestling and witholding a firearm from somebody that's threatening you with it is qualified as self defense. You're probably too fucking stupid to actually have any concept of that, though, so I'll leave it at that. And it's awfully ironic that you're trying to make a point about total knowledge of the situation, when your position requires tenuous assumptions to be made about intent and circumstances rather than just looking at the facts we do know and drawing conclusions from those.
These 6 guys beat a guy in a way that has killed or brain damaged to the point of being a vegetable on many, many occasions.
But that didn't actually happen. What the fuck are you doing, proposing that everybody be punished according to the zenith of severity in any instance ever in the history of American law?
So Im watching the news, specifically about the Jena 6. And Ive heard some people say that its only getting blown "out of proportion" because the people involved were black.
People are actually claiming that this is being blown out of proportion? WTF?
So Im watching the news, specifically about the Jena 6. And Ive heard some people say that its only getting blown "out of proportion" because the people involved were black.
People are actually claiming that this is being blown out of proportion? WTF?
I believe he means the legal reaction, not the attention it's been getting.
Well, his next two sentences were "These and many other people also have the opinion that racism no longer exists in America, or for the most part has faded away. Personally, I find the very notion rediculous. Im curious as to what all your thoughts on the subject are." So I can only assume that he was referring to people who thought this case was getting more attention than it deserved.
Schrodinger on
0
Options
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Well, his next two sentences were "These and many other people also have the opinion that racism no longer exists in America, or for the most part has faded away. Personally, I find the very notion rediculous. Im curious as to what all your thoughts on the subject are." So I can only assume that he was referring to people who thought this case was getting more attention than it deserved.
He seems to be saying that racism is still a problem here. And seriously, when High School kids are hanging nooses from trees, there's a fucking problem.
"So Im watching the news, specifically about the Jena 6. And Ive heard some people say that its only getting blown "out of proportion" because the people involved were black. These and many other people also have the opinion that racism no longer exists in America, or for the most part has faded away. Personally, I find the very notion rediculous. Im curious as to what all your thoughts on the subject are."
People who claim that racism no longer exists claim that the story is getting blown out of proportion because the attackers were black. There are two ways to read this:
1) People who claim that racism no longer exists believes that the media is giving this more attention than it deserves, that the story is overblown, and wouldn't give it so much attention if they weren't black.
2) People who claim that racism no longer exists believe that the attackers were somehow the victims of racism, and that the punishment is overblown.
One of those statements doesn't make any sense.
Schrodinger on
0
Options
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
"So Im watching the news, specifically about the Jena 6. And Ive heard some people say that its only getting blown "out of proportion" because the people involved were black. These and many other people also have the opinion that racism no longer exists in America, or for the most part has faded away. Personally, I find the very notion rediculous. Im curious as to what all your thoughts on the subject are."
People who claim that racism no longer exists claim that the story is getting blown out of proportion because the attackers were black. There are two ways to read this:
1) People who claim that racism no longer exists believes that the media is giving this more attention than it deserves, that the story is overblown, and wouldn't give it so much attention if they weren't black.
2) People who claim that racism no longer exists believe that the attackers were somehow the victims of racism, and that the punishment is overblown.
One of those statements doesn't make any sense.
The very next word you didn't bold was (albeit misspelled) ridiculous. The notion that he finds ridiculous is the opinion that racism no longer exists in America. People who also hold this ridiculous notion also say that this is overblown. Which is also implied to be ridiculous. Now, I realize that my last argument was different, but that stemmed from giving the benefit of the doubt, this stems from grammatical analysis. I can use underlines and italics and bolds to diagram it more clearly, if you would like.
Do we really have to go over what the meaning of "these" is?
I think I'll wait for the OP to clarify.
He's effectively saying that the people who think it's overblown are either racists, or completely ignorant to the racism against the black students, which is effectively the same thing. So yeah, he's saying that some people think that the attention is undeserved, but he's also saying that those people are jerks.
Belketre, do you know what the charge is for threatening someone with a weapon? Generally it's aggravated assault. That's what the white kid did. The kid who wrestled it away from him was, in the eyes of someone who has an ounce of sense, defending himself. The white kid also got a beatdown from six black guys, but they clearly weren't trying to kill because they stopped well short of serious injury. Again, anybody with an ounce of sense would not say they were trying to kill him and the physical evidence would bear out the conclusion.
This is not some crazy out of town civil rights people playing the race card, some serious shit is going down and these kids are getting railroaded. You'd have to be either absurdly naive or incredibly stupid to think otherwise.
This has nothing to do with the whole jena 6 thing, but I feel it belongs in this thread anyway. I know for a fact that racism is alive and well in America. I have been a victim of it from my own family. I am married and my wife has a son from a previous relationship. My son (thats what I call him because I have raised him from 6mts and he is 4 now) is mixed (half black, half white). On Christmas eve I took him over to see my family for the holidays. When I arrived to the door my uncle looked unusually somber in my arrival which was strange because he usually is really happy to see me. As I walked in I heard some yelling, but I couldn't really make it out. I walked in and said my hellos, but everyone just stood there looking at me like I had 3 heads. I asked what is wrong and my aunt looked over at my son and said "what is he doing here?"
"Who my son?" I asked confused.
"WHY DID YOU BRING HIM HERE?!? Everyone is going to leave now that he is here!" My aunt replied.
My expression was one of complete and utter shock.
At that point I had a grasp on the situation and became to infuriated for words somehow I managed to get out "Fine then I guess I'll just then". I grabbed my son and flipped off my aunt.
As I was leaving she said "You welcome over here anytime but he cannot come over. I don't want any of the kids in this house thinking that what your doing is right (by what I'm doing she meant raising a kid who is not my race). I told her she was an idiot and her views are deplorable and that I'm glad that I'm adopted so I have no relation to her to begin with.
During this whole thing my great grandmother tried to come over to say hi to my son but my uncle pretty much carried her away. That night my great grandmother broke her hip, it got infected and she died. I couldn't even go to the funeral. I took my son to see her about 1 week after the funeral, because of them I had to introduce my son to a tombstone instead. It was by far the most horrible experience of my life.
Edit: Just wanted to add that I'm from Central Maryland which above the Mason Dixon line. So this stuff isn't confined in the south. It still exists everywhere imo.
Dude, that sucks pretty hard. I wish I could say that what you went through was abnormal, but it's not, not by a long shot. Good on you for standing up for your son and for what was right.
The idea that racism has disappeared in this country is just ridiculous. I mean, we have a thread about the crazy things family members say, and half of the crazy shit is just racism. This Jena 6 thing isn't happening in a vacuum, and just because it's happening in the South doesn't mean equally heinous shit isn't happening in Minnesota.
Belketre, do you know what the charge is for threatening someone with a weapon? Generally it's aggravated assault. That's what the white kid did. The kid who wrestled it away from him was, in the eyes of someone who has an ounce of sense, defending himself. The white kid also got a beatdown from six black guys, but they clearly weren't trying to kill because they stopped well short of serious injury. Again, anybody with an ounce of sense would not say they were trying to kill him and the physical evidence would bear out the conclusion.
This is not some crazy out of town civil rights people playing the race card, some serious shit is going down and these kids are getting railroaded. You'd have to be either absurdly naive or incredibly stupid to think otherwise.
He seems like one of those "there should be a White Entertainment Television station!" guys. Which, really, when they hear somebody call racism, they assume it's a knee-jerk reaction independent of the facts and act accordingly, bashing what they see as PC liberalism taking its toll on our society and weakening our judgmental capabilities. The simple fact that this has nothing to do with political correctness and everything to do with atrocious behavior flies over his head.
You get that way by watching Fox News too much.
Wonder_Hippie on
0
Options
Irond WillWARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!!Cambridge. MAModeratorMod Emeritus
So Im watching the news, specifically about the Jena 6. And Ive heard some people say that its only getting blown "out of proportion" because the people involved were black.
People are actually claiming that this is being blown out of proportion? WTF?
If they did in fact beat the hell out of the guy after disarming him they should get some kind of charge. However the guy who was threatening people with a fucking shotgun not being charged with anything is pretty ridiculous.
If they did in fact beat the hell out of the guy after disarming him they should get some kind of charge. However the guy who was threatening people with a fucking shotgun not being charged with anything is pretty ridiculous.
They were two seperate events. One happened in school, the other happened at a gas station or something. There was also another event in which two black kids went to a party, were told they weren't welcomed, and were trounced by two white guys as they were leaving. Guess who got charges in that one?
Yeah, they should definitely get charges, but it should be assault and battery, and they should be tried as juveniles. Getting charged as adults for attempted murder is beyond excessive.
This is the type of situation where absolutely no one is right.
Was it right for those kids to hang nooses on a tree in order to intimidate black students? No. Was it right for the "Jena 6" to beat the piss out of a kid in some form of retaliation? No. Is it right that those six boys should now be charged with attempted murder? No. I agree that they should be charged with battery...but not murder. I don't know enough about crazy Louisiana code to determine if the battery was "aggravated" or not.
No one wins in this situation, except for the talking heads looking to exploit the circumstances for their own benefit.
As for the morons who think racism doesn't exist in the United States anymore, I have very bad news for you. Racism is alive and well in the United States. It always has existed, and (unfortunately) it always will exist. But the same could be said for Europe, Asia, Africa, Australia, Antarctica, etc. Basically, all of planet Earth. Good news is that a majority of us understand that racism is inherently evil and tend to not tolerate it in our lives.
CoJoeTheLawyer on
0
Options
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
edited September 2007
Where are you guys getting all this info on the shotgun incident? I can't find any record of the eyewitness testimony and the wiki article doesn't say anything about 'brandishing or threatening'. I mean, there's soooo many ways to read it considering how vague it is and how little information there is. Either produce the eyewitness testimony or stop fucking editorializing.
Nova_C on
0
Options
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Where are you guys getting all this info on the shotgun incident? I can't find any record of the eyewitness testimony and the wiki article doesn't say anything about 'brandishing or threatening'. I mean, there's soooo many ways to read it considering how vague it is and how little information there is. Either produce the eyewitness testimony or stop fucking editorializing.
He took out a shotgun. While he was arguing with a group of black kids. The threat is barely implied, there.
Fencingsax on
0
Options
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
A student who had attended the party encountered Bailey and several friends. An argument ensued, after which the white student ran to his pickup truck and produced a pistol-grip shotgun.
So far as I can tell, we have no idea who started it, what was said, or how aggressive anyone was. All we know is that a group of people were arguing with a lone individual and that lone individual produced a weapon.
I totally get the fact that you guys automatically default to 'obviously the white kid was lookin' to lynch himself some blacks', but without knowing what the eyewitness testimony was, we cannot judge the situation. For all we know, the black kids were threatening the white kid and he produced the shotgun because he felt himself in danger.
Nova_C on
0
Options
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
A student who had attended the party encountered Bailey and several friends. An argument ensued, after which the white student ran to his pickup truck and produced a pistol-grip shotgun.
So far as I can tell, we have no idea who started it, what was said, or how aggressive anyone was. All we know is that a group of people were arguing with a lone individual and that lone individual produced a weapon.
I totally get the fact that you guys automatically default to 'obviously the white kid was lookin' to lynch himself some blacks', but without knowing what the eyewitness testimony was, we cannot judge the situation. For all we know, the black kids were threatening the white kid and he produced the shotgun because he felt himself in danger.
You do not escalate arguments by producing firearms. Since he was obviously able to get to his truck, he could have just driven away. Also, it doesn't really matter who starts it. What matters is that a guy pulled a gun on a group of unarmed guys. That's a big no-no.
He seems to be saying that racism is still a problem here. And seriously, when High School kids are hanging nooses from trees, there's a fucking problem.
Holy shit, no kidding. I honestly can't believe that sort of thing is being taught to children these days. It's fucking disgusting.
Goatmon on
Switch Friend Code: SW-6680-6709-4204
0
Options
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
You do not escalate arguments by producing firearms. Since he was obviously able to get to his truck, he could have just driven away. Also, it doesn't really matter who starts it. What matters is that a guy pulled a gun on a group of unarmed guys. That's a big no-no.
I need a hypothetical here - I'm not saying this is what I believe happened, but okay...
Let's say for a minute that they were arguing. You know, just a bunch of teenage shouting. Then one of them balls up his fists and says "I'm gonna fucking kill you, man!" and all his friends also ball up their fists. Is it still a big no-no to pull a gun on a group of unarmed guys?
I'm not arguing the fact that there were many ways this could've gone down without a gun being involved, and that to me, too, it seems odd that the white kid wasn't charged. I have a question: Do you believe this specific result is a case of the cops being racist?
Nova_C on
0
Options
FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
You do not escalate arguments by producing firearms. Since he was obviously able to get to his truck, he could have just driven away. Also, it doesn't really matter who starts it. What matters is that a guy pulled a gun on a group of unarmed guys. That's a big no-no.
I need a hypothetical here - I'm not saying this is what I believe happened, but okay...
Let's say for a minute that they were arguing. You know, just a bunch of teenage shouting. Then one of them balls up his fists and says "I'm gonna fucking kill you, man!" and all his friends also ball up their fists. Is it still a big no-no to pull a gun on a group of unarmed guys?
I'm not arguing the fact that there were many ways this could've gone down without a gun being involved, and that to me, too, it seems odd that the white kid wasn't charged. I have a question: Do you believe this specific result is a case of the cops being racist?
Yes. Especially when you can run away. An overreaction like going from fists to shotguns, when there are clearly other options, is not approved of by the law. And I do think the fact he was not charged was the result of a racist justice department down there.
A student who had attended the party encountered Bailey and several friends. An argument ensued, after which the white student ran to his pickup truck and produced a pistol-grip shotgun.
So far as I can tell, we have no idea who started it, what was said, or how aggressive anyone was. All we know is that a group of people were arguing with a lone individual and that lone individual produced a weapon.
I totally get the fact that you guys automatically default to 'obviously the white kid was lookin' to lynch himself some blacks', but without knowing what the eyewitness testimony was, we cannot judge the situation. For all we know, the black kids were threatening the white kid and he produced the shotgun because he felt himself in danger.
You do not escalate arguments by producing firearms. Since he was obviously able to get to his truck, he could have just driven away. Also, it doesn't really matter who starts it. What matters is that a guy pulled a gun on a group of unarmed guys. That's a big no-no.
Bolded for "like, really."
Instead of exiting the situation, he produced a firearm and escalated it. And producing a firearm during an argument is almost certainly "brandishing," and self-defense is merely a defense against that. A defense he never had to make, since he was never charge.
Though the kid who took the gun fucked up pretty hard, too. Taking it home? Bad idea. While it might have necessitated some explaining of the situation, taking it to the police station to turn it in would have been a much better idea.
Also, amusing:
Much has been made of the fact that all members of the jury were white; however, an all-white jury was impaneled after none of the 350 blacks in LaSalle Parish who were called for jury duty showed up to participate in the trial.
Posts
Indeed I did read it. You see no difference between the other fights that happened?
None of the other fights seemed to involve 6 white kids kicking the crap out of a black kid while he lay unconcious on the ground.
A fight between a couple of kids is assault at best. These 6 kids viciously attacked another kid who was clearly defenceless.
A civil rights group pulling the 'Oh no, racism!' defence is just bullshit. These 6 cockheads are so brave to attack 1 guy in that fashion. They deserve to have the book thrown at them.
You're a fucking moron.
First off, let's not forget how all this started - black kids want to sit in shade, assert their right to do so, next day shade tree is decorated in nooses. Please, tell me that's not racist, so the rest of us can laugh in your face.
And when a white kid branished a weapon at a group of black kids, he was let off with a slap on the wrist.
Was the attack vicious? Yes. But so say that racism was not involved is to be so willfully ignorant of the whole matter that you should be written off entirely.
Not even a slap on the wrist. The guy he pulled a gun on was charged with fucking robbery.
Which just further supports my point that the poster was talking out of his ass. Newsflash, moron - things don't happen in a fucking vacuum.
I... what? Are you seriously that fucking stupid? This kid get examined by a doctor who finds a concussion and a black eye, but he's well enough to get up and go a school ceremony later that day, and you think it's alright that these kids are being charged with attempted murder?
No legal action against the white kid that pulls a gun, where the victim of that altercation is accused of disturbing the peace and theft of a firearm, and you say that racism isn't involved in this situation?
You're a fucking moron.
Wow. Somebody missing the point entirely calling me a moron? A bit rich really.
Sure, there was racism involved, between the kids. The point here is that the justice system of a town is being accused of racism for charging people who commited different crimes with different offences. Amazing how that happens....
The white kid brandishes a weapon at a group of black kids during a confrontation. Do you know the exact details of that confrontation? Can you say without a doubt that the white kid had no reason to fear for his personal safety, and no reason to pull a gun? Can you say with certainty that his life wasn't threatened? I very much doubt it.
Sorry champ, but I'd say the moron here is you.
It doesn't matter if the kid was ok afterwards. The fact is 6 guys kicked the shit out of him while he was defenceless. If I fire a gun at your head and miss, but you are still ok, is that not attempted murder? Since when has it not been pretty standard practice for somebody to be charged with the worst offence possible, and then be able to plea bargain it down?
As for your second gripe, see my reply above, then factor in that the black kid did indeed steal a firearm. Dont see a problem with that charge.
Looking at the situation in all your shock and outrage that these poor black kids are being horribly hard done by is amusing when we all probably know about a tenth of what actually went on.
In just about every state, a "deadly weapon" is considered to be a firearm, a knife over a certain length, or an explosive device or something like that.
Not a fucking Reebok. They should have been charged with assault and battery. Probably in the 2nd degree, even.
And nobody has ever been kicked to death, or beaten to death with bare hands?
Maybe what they are being charged with is a bit harsh, but it may have been in the interest of as I mentioned in my last post, relying on plea bargaining. If they are charged with some pissy assault and battery, they'd probably end up getting off with probation or some shit. These 6 guys beat a guy in a way that has killed or brain damaged to the point of being a vegetable on many, many occasions. They shouldn't be getting out of it with nothing.
So should every battery should be considered "assault and battery with a deadly weapon?" Why not, people have been killed by hands and feet?
Come back when you get a fucking clue.
I'm pretty sure wrestling and witholding a firearm from somebody that's threatening you with it is qualified as self defense. You're probably too fucking stupid to actually have any concept of that, though, so I'll leave it at that. And it's awfully ironic that you're trying to make a point about total knowledge of the situation, when your position requires tenuous assumptions to be made about intent and circumstances rather than just looking at the facts we do know and drawing conclusions from those.
But that didn't actually happen. What the fuck are you doing, proposing that everybody be punished according to the zenith of severity in any instance ever in the history of American law?
Have you ever sneezed, you murderous twat?
People are actually claiming that this is being blown out of proportion? WTF?
Case in point. But I bet you can us who Natalee Holloway was, right?
(More a failure of the media than anything else)
"So Im watching the news, specifically about the Jena 6. And Ive heard some people say that its only getting blown "out of proportion" because the people involved were black. These and many other people also have the opinion that racism no longer exists in America, or for the most part has faded away. Personally, I find the very notion rediculous. Im curious as to what all your thoughts on the subject are."
People who claim that racism no longer exists claim that the story is getting blown out of proportion because the attackers were black. There are two ways to read this:
1) People who claim that racism no longer exists believes that the media is giving this more attention than it deserves, that the story is overblown, and wouldn't give it so much attention if they weren't black.
2) People who claim that racism no longer exists believe that the attackers were somehow the victims of racism, and that the punishment is overblown.
One of those statements doesn't make any sense.
I think I'll wait for the OP to clarify.
This is not some crazy out of town civil rights people playing the race card, some serious shit is going down and these kids are getting railroaded. You'd have to be either absurdly naive or incredibly stupid to think otherwise.
"Who my son?" I asked confused.
"WHY DID YOU BRING HIM HERE?!? Everyone is going to leave now that he is here!" My aunt replied.
My expression was one of complete and utter shock.
At that point I had a grasp on the situation and became to infuriated for words somehow I managed to get out "Fine then I guess I'll just then". I grabbed my son and flipped off my aunt.
As I was leaving she said "You welcome over here anytime but he cannot come over. I don't want any of the kids in this house thinking that what your doing is right (by what I'm doing she meant raising a kid who is not my race). I told her she was an idiot and her views are deplorable and that I'm glad that I'm adopted so I have no relation to her to begin with.
During this whole thing my great grandmother tried to come over to say hi to my son but my uncle pretty much carried her away. That night my great grandmother broke her hip, it got infected and she died. I couldn't even go to the funeral. I took my son to see her about 1 week after the funeral, because of them I had to introduce my son to a tombstone instead. It was by far the most horrible experience of my life.
Edit: Just wanted to add that I'm from Central Maryland which above the Mason Dixon line. So this stuff isn't confined in the south. It still exists everywhere imo.
The idea that racism has disappeared in this country is just ridiculous. I mean, we have a thread about the crazy things family members say, and half of the crazy shit is just racism. This Jena 6 thing isn't happening in a vacuum, and just because it's happening in the South doesn't mean equally heinous shit isn't happening in Minnesota.
He seems like one of those "there should be a White Entertainment Television station!" guys. Which, really, when they hear somebody call racism, they assume it's a knee-jerk reaction independent of the facts and act accordingly, bashing what they see as PC liberalism taking its toll on our society and weakening our judgmental capabilities. The simple fact that this has nothing to do with political correctness and everything to do with atrocious behavior flies over his head.
You get that way by watching Fox News too much.
Nah - I don't watch TV news. Most of my news is NPR or internets.
They were two seperate events. One happened in school, the other happened at a gas station or something. There was also another event in which two black kids went to a party, were told they weren't welcomed, and were trounced by two white guys as they were leaving. Guess who got charges in that one?
Fucking nobody.
Was it right for those kids to hang nooses on a tree in order to intimidate black students? No. Was it right for the "Jena 6" to beat the piss out of a kid in some form of retaliation? No. Is it right that those six boys should now be charged with attempted murder? No. I agree that they should be charged with battery...but not murder. I don't know enough about crazy Louisiana code to determine if the battery was "aggravated" or not.
No one wins in this situation, except for the talking heads looking to exploit the circumstances for their own benefit.
As for the morons who think racism doesn't exist in the United States anymore, I have very bad news for you. Racism is alive and well in the United States. It always has existed, and (unfortunately) it always will exist. But the same could be said for Europe, Asia, Africa, Australia, Antarctica, etc. Basically, all of planet Earth. Good news is that a majority of us understand that racism is inherently evil and tend to not tolerate it in our lives.
So far as I can tell, we have no idea who started it, what was said, or how aggressive anyone was. All we know is that a group of people were arguing with a lone individual and that lone individual produced a weapon.
I totally get the fact that you guys automatically default to 'obviously the white kid was lookin' to lynch himself some blacks', but without knowing what the eyewitness testimony was, we cannot judge the situation. For all we know, the black kids were threatening the white kid and he produced the shotgun because he felt himself in danger.
Holy shit, no kidding. I honestly can't believe that sort of thing is being taught to children these days. It's fucking disgusting.
I need a hypothetical here - I'm not saying this is what I believe happened, but okay...
Let's say for a minute that they were arguing. You know, just a bunch of teenage shouting. Then one of them balls up his fists and says "I'm gonna fucking kill you, man!" and all his friends also ball up their fists. Is it still a big no-no to pull a gun on a group of unarmed guys?
I'm not arguing the fact that there were many ways this could've gone down without a gun being involved, and that to me, too, it seems odd that the white kid wasn't charged. I have a question: Do you believe this specific result is a case of the cops being racist?
Bolded for "like, really."
Instead of exiting the situation, he produced a firearm and escalated it. And producing a firearm during an argument is almost certainly "brandishing," and self-defense is merely a defense against that. A defense he never had to make, since he was never charge.
Though the kid who took the gun fucked up pretty hard, too. Taking it home? Bad idea. While it might have necessitated some explaining of the situation, taking it to the police station to turn it in would have been a much better idea.
Also, amusing:
Seriously people, show up for jury duty.