I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
Perhaps it's because that argument is stupid and dumb and incorrect and she wanted to talk about the points that matter
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augustwhere you come from is goneRegistered Userregular
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
Perhaps it's because that argument is stupid and dumb and incorrect and she wanted to talk about the points that matter
I disagree.
I think there is an interesting discussion to be had about what defines a game, even if most of the people arguing Gone Home isn't a game are geese.
I also don't think claiming that the games industry has a specific obsession with finding "THE BEST" is accurate or insightful.
Whereas one can know without any further investigation that what the boyfriend did was incredibly shitty, so why is that barely focused on aside from a cursory "yeah he shouldn't have done that" before moving on to the specifics of what she allegedly did.
it's... it's been covered pretty explicitly and there isn't any real debate on the fact
like, I'm fairly certain everyone possibly involves agreed "this thing he did was a result of frustration and also immature and awful"
There have been some posts in this very thread that border on sympathizing with him.
and?
you can sympathize with him and still agree that what he did was shitty
they are not mutually exclusive
Of course that is true, I agree.
I just don't think that expressing sympathy with this person, who in the context of this situation is essentially an emotional terrorist, is an especially valuable or constructive contribution to this discussion. That said sure, I agree that people can and should feel however they want to about the situation/person (in relation to their own past experiences or whatever). It just weirds me out. What are you trying to get across by posting that? idgi
I'm not trying to indirectly talk shit, either (and I apologize if it's coming across that way). I just...it bugged me.
I think we might actually be looking for the word 'empathize'
I don't feel sorry for him or condone his actions
He's a shitheel
I do understand them though
Assuming he is being honest, he has my sympathy. It sounds awful to have your trust betrayed in that manner. I can't empathize as I've never (that I know of) been cheated on. I don't feel like what he did was reasonable, and I don't condone what he's done. Regardless of Zoe's actions he took a private matter and made it very public.
It certainly seems like there is plenty of blame to go around here though.
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
Perhaps it's because that argument is stupid and dumb and incorrect and she wanted to talk about the points that matter
but the article is just mostly a jumbled rant that doesn't really talk about anything other than that Capitalism is to blame and also supported by people liking things and comparing them to other things.
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
I have not played Depression Quest. Isn't it a choose-your-own adventure story? No luck, no puzzles, etc? I'd say that makes it interactive fiction. Either that or I read a lot of video games as a kid.
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PiptheFairFrequently not in boats.Registered Userregular
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
I have not played Depression Quest. Isn't it a choose-your-own adventure story? No luck, no puzzles, etc? I'd say that makes it interactive fiction. Either that or I read a lot of video games as a kid.
interactive fiction is a game, yeah. those books are games that you play with narrative.
my favorite part of that daredevil fight is how the kids just keep swinging in the background and don't even seem to be particularly interested in the fight
+1
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PiptheFairFrequently not in boats.Registered Userregular
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
I have not played Depression Quest. Isn't it a choose-your-own adventure story? No luck, no puzzles, etc? I'd say that makes it interactive fiction. Either that or I read a lot of video games as a kid.
the bigger "point" of the whole thing, unrelated to that jumbled rant of an article, is that whether or not something is a game is moot and does not affect the quality of the experience
like, look at PT, it's a demo and you barely actually interact with it other than moving and yet it is incredibly immersive and tense, same with gone home
the vast majority of people who are complaining about things like gone home and stanley parable not being games are grognards or people not comfortable with the notion of a medium changing or becoming inclusive
Whereas one can know without any further investigation that what the boyfriend did was incredibly shitty, so why is that barely focused on aside from a cursory "yeah he shouldn't have done that" before moving on to the specifics of what she allegedly did.
it's... it's been covered pretty explicitly and there isn't any real debate on the fact
like, I'm fairly certain everyone possibly involves agreed "this thing he did was a result of frustration and also immature and awful"
There have been some posts in this very thread that border on sympathizing with him.
and?
you can sympathize with him and still agree that what he did was shitty
they are not mutually exclusive
Of course that is true, I agree.
I just don't think that expressing sympathy with this person, who in the context of this situation is essentially an emotional terrorist, is an especially valuable or constructive contribution to this discussion. That said sure, I agree that people can and should feel however they want to about the situation/person (in relation to their own past experiences or whatever). It just weirds me out. What are you trying to get across by posting that? idgi
I'm not trying to indirectly talk shit, either (and I apologize if it's coming across that way). I just...it bugged me.
I think we might actually be looking for the word 'empathize'
I don't feel sorry for him or condone his actions
He's a shitheel
I do understand them though
Assuming he is being honest, he has my sympathy. It sounds awful to have your trust betrayed in that manner. I can't empathize as I've never (that I know of) been cheated on. I don't feel like what he did was reasonable, and I don't condone what he's done. Regardless of Zoe's actions he took a private matter and made it very public.
It certainly seems like there is plenty of blame to go around here though.
Blame between the people involved, not us. There's only one person to be mad at here as casual observers, and that's this shithead who made a private matter public. Public in a way that could be dangerous to people's careers and lives.
He quite literally put Zoe in physical danger by doing this.
No I don't.
+3
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PiptheFairFrequently not in boats.Registered Userregular
I don't think that I really agree with this at all and it was written kind of crazily.
I agree with it as I read it as a criticism of people who try to push games like Depression Quest and Gone Home out of the medium instead of allowing them to be, and allowing other people to enjoy them.
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
I have not played Depression Quest. Isn't it a choose-your-own adventure story? No luck, no puzzles, etc? I'd say that makes it interactive fiction. Either that or I read a lot of video games as a kid.
Yeah, it's very much interactive fiction, with specific choices available to you in each scene, rather than an open text adventure. If you correctly manage your depression, more options become available to you (at first some things are crossed out).
my favorite part of that daredevil fight is how the kids just keep swinging in the background and don't even seem to be particularly interested in the fight
My favourite bit of the scene is just before the fight. Affleck pulls the most amazing face at about 34 seconds.
I can't get messages to work on my phone so fuck it
@unbreakablevow I'm super sorry dude that was shitty and I made assumptions and I suck and hope you can forgive me
It's cool
If you thought I was just having a blasé attitude about cheating then your response was totally justified
With my first post I was just trying to say, hey, none of us know Zoe Quinn personally, but seeing as she's someone that apparently suffered from depression enough to make an entire game based around the issue, I can understand if she's made some regrettable choices. It's not a magic erase button, it doesn't make that sort of thing immediately okay, but it at least adds context to it and I wouldn't be quick to judge her personally, mainly because who here knows any of the circumstances?
Did it happen? Does she regret it? What was going through her mind at the time?
It's not something I can ever really know, since she appears to be declining to speak on the matter, and if she declines to speak, then I don't deserve to know because it's not any of my business
Whereas one can know without any further investigation that what the boyfriend did was incredibly shitty, so why is that barely focused on aside from a cursory "yeah he shouldn't have done that" before moving on to the specifics of what she allegedly did.
it's... it's been covered pretty explicitly and there isn't any real debate on the fact
like, I'm fairly certain everyone possibly involves agreed "this thing he did was a result of frustration and also immature and awful"
There have been some posts in this very thread that border on sympathizing with him.
and?
you can sympathize with him and still agree that what he did was shitty
they are not mutually exclusive
Of course that is true, I agree.
I just don't think that expressing sympathy with this person, who in the context of this situation is essentially an emotional terrorist, is an especially valuable or constructive contribution to this discussion. That said sure, I agree that people can and should feel however they want to about the situation/person (in relation to their own past experiences or whatever). It just weirds me out. What are you trying to get across by posting that? idgi
I'm not trying to indirectly talk shit, either (and I apologize if it's coming across that way). I just...it bugged me.
I think we might actually be looking for the word 'empathize'
I don't feel sorry for him or condone his actions
He's a shitheel
I do understand them though
Assuming he is being honest, he has my sympathy. It sounds awful to have your trust betrayed in that manner. I can't empathize as I've never (that I know of) been cheated on. I don't feel like what he did was reasonable, and I don't condone what he's done. Regardless of Zoe's actions he took a private matter and made it very public.
It certainly seems like there is plenty of blame to go around here though.
Blame between the people involved, not us. There's only one person to be mad at here as casual observers, and that's this shithead who made a private matter public. Public in a way that could be dangerous to people's careers and lives.
He quite literally put Zoe in physical danger by doing this.
You're right, that's poor wording on my part. Assuming she cheated it's reasonable for him to be pissed at her. Regardless, it's reasonable for her to be pissed that he made things public and dangerous.
Posts
But the main criticism of Depression Quest, Gone Home, and others is that they "aren't games." Not that they're bad games, or objectively do not deserve to be labeled "THE BEST," but that they aren't games at all. And Cara Ellison's post doesn't really address that?
My Steam
Perhaps it's because that argument is stupid and dumb and incorrect and she wanted to talk about the points that matter
but the way it abruptly cuts off her arc makes the speech you gave her earlier that much less about her and that much more about you
and sarah only existing to benefit clem's arc is... bothersome to me
I disagree.
I think there is an interesting discussion to be had about what defines a game, even if most of the people arguing Gone Home isn't a game are geese.
I also don't think claiming that the games industry has a specific obsession with finding "THE BEST" is accurate or insightful.
My Steam
Assuming he is being honest, he has my sympathy. It sounds awful to have your trust betrayed in that manner. I can't empathize as I've never (that I know of) been cheated on. I don't feel like what he did was reasonable, and I don't condone what he's done. Regardless of Zoe's actions he took a private matter and made it very public.
It certainly seems like there is plenty of blame to go around here though.
video games aren't art
but the article is just mostly a jumbled rant that doesn't really talk about anything other than that Capitalism is to blame and also supported by people liking things and comparing them to other things.
I have not played Depression Quest. Isn't it a choose-your-own adventure story? No luck, no puzzles, etc? I'd say that makes it interactive fiction. Either that or I read a lot of video games as a kid.
what about frog fractions 2????
Remember 30 pages ago when the topic of Worst scene in movie history came up?
It's this:
The playground fight from Daredevil.
Let's not do the "is it a game" or "is it art" argument, even as a joke.
Pretty please?
nobody said frog fractions 2 would be a video game
interactive fiction is a game, yeah. those books are games that you play with narrative.
Arguing about games is an art.
oh Dan
you're so white and midwestern
the bigger "point" of the whole thing, unrelated to that jumbled rant of an article, is that whether or not something is a game is moot and does not affect the quality of the experience
like, look at PT, it's a demo and you barely actually interact with it other than moving and yet it is incredibly immersive and tense, same with gone home
the vast majority of people who are complaining about things like gone home and stanley parable not being games are grognards or people not comfortable with the notion of a medium changing or becoming inclusive
Blame between the people involved, not us. There's only one person to be mad at here as casual observers, and that's this shithead who made a private matter public. Public in a way that could be dangerous to people's careers and lives.
He quite literally put Zoe in physical danger by doing this.
MCD was perfect as kingpin and fucking squandered on this shitpile of a movie
Link if you want to check it out
Yeah, it's very much interactive fiction, with specific choices available to you in each scene, rather than an open text adventure. If you correctly manage your depression, more options become available to you (at first some things are crossed out).
My Steam
My favourite bit of the scene is just before the fight. Affleck pulls the most amazing face at about 34 seconds.
He is older than 14
He is a computer designed to pass the turing test that was made in the early 90s.
It's cool
If you thought I was just having a blasé attitude about cheating then your response was totally justified
With my first post I was just trying to say, hey, none of us know Zoe Quinn personally, but seeing as she's someone that apparently suffered from depression enough to make an entire game based around the issue, I can understand if she's made some regrettable choices. It's not a magic erase button, it doesn't make that sort of thing immediately okay, but it at least adds context to it and I wouldn't be quick to judge her personally, mainly because who here knows any of the circumstances?
Did it happen? Does she regret it? What was going through her mind at the time?
It's not something I can ever really know, since she appears to be declining to speak on the matter, and if she declines to speak, then I don't deserve to know because it's not any of my business
You're right, that's poor wording on my part. Assuming she cheated it's reasonable for him to be pissed at her. Regardless, it's reasonable for her to be pissed that he made things public and dangerous.
Batman vs Superman is frog fractions 2.
It all makes sense now.
I'm personally offended by this mr g
I'm from the Chicago suburbs and I've been here my whole life
you know I speak the truth
oh they're bnl now that's how fundamental they are
but it's a descriptor everyone is familiar with and complaining about something "not really being a game" is snot-nosed pedantry, at best
http://www.audioentropy.com/
Hey now, no finishing your own setup.
he just ruined it
http://www.audioentropy.com/