Jacob - I generally agree with your post, but let's be honest here. The bulk of Western RPGs don't offer many opportunities to meaningfully impact the story either. The best ones do, and when you play those games it is spectacular and rewarding, but for every Torment or NWN2:MotB, there are ten Oblivions or Diablos. Not saying those can't be fun games, but they are just as lacking in meaningful choices as the most linear jRPG.
DIablo isn't an RPG either. There are no roles in it. You click to kill stuff. It's an action game. That's not bad - people always seem to take it weirdly personally when you point out that something called an RPG might not be - but it has nothing in common with the actual act of actual roleplaying.
The Elder Scrolls games give you tiny amounts of story choice but not much. The developers' philosophy seems to be "well, you can always choose NOT to do the main quest," which is technically true but also inspires me to make a jack-off motion with my hands.
I have had the "what is an RPG" debate far too many times to want to go down that road again. I don't think the answer ultimately matters. Oblivion honestly has more in common with Hexen than it does most RPGs (including Morrowind, which at least made you pick a noble house, and excluded you from the others). Suffice to say that an awful lot of Western RPGs, including most good box classics, are pretty deficient in the choices and consequences department. The games that really feature them are simply fantastic, and I wish there were more of them, but even Bioware's games which play up choices and consequences so much mostly feature illusory choices with a small number of true decision points. Real branching plot lines are expensive to implement, and most people only play a game once, so they will never realize the choices are smoke and mirrors. The great games that really do it, like Arcanum and VtM:Bloodlines literally have entire alternate scripts for different types of characters, and while I'd love more of that, it's just not the direction things are going in.
Incidentally, anyone who has never played a low intelligence character in Arcanum is really missing out. It is spectacular.
LA Noire was the best for that kind of tonal madness
you'd go from being like "Okay, that's fine" to "YOU MURDERED HER, DIDN'T YOU, YOU SON OF A BITCH?" with a flick of a stick
it was also the most arbitrary and primitive investigation/interrogation system ever
it game-ified it in all the worst possible ways
the mechanic of telling if the person was lying or not based on the actor's facial expression was genuinely cool. I liked that a lot.
but trying to figure out if one of your collection of napkins, tire irons, and insurance paperwork would be the thing to wave in their face at that moment, or whether to just yell at them, was absurd. the game really needed a simple "is this person lying y/n" check and then a separate "show a piece of evidence that contradicts this statement" thing a la Phoenix Wright.
Jacob - I generally agree with your post, but let's be honest here. The bulk of Western RPGs don't offer many opportunities to meaningfully impact the story either. The best ones do, and when you play those games it is spectacular and rewarding, but for every Torment or NWN2:MotB, there are ten Oblivions or Diablos. Not saying those can't be fun games, but they are just as lacking in meaningful choices as the most linear jRPG.
DIablo isn't an RPG either. There are no roles in it. You click to kill stuff. It's an action game. That's not bad - people always seem to take it weirdly personally when you point out that something called an RPG might not be - but it has nothing in common with the actual act of actual roleplaying.
The Elder Scrolls games give you tiny amounts of story choice but not much. The developers' philosophy seems to be "well, you can always choose NOT to do the main quest," which is technically true but also inspires me to make a jack-off motion with my hands.
So much money pissed away. So, so much money pissed away.
At least Jon Peters finally got the robot spider he always wanted.
I will always be equal parts amused and perplexed that there exists a guy who was obsessed with the idea of a giant robot spider being in a movie, who also had enough influence to make it happen. He could make his dreams literally come true on the screen, and his mission was robot spider.
kefka's success and climb to godlike evil from just kind of psycho evil is really fun, but i feel like any believable, sympathetic villain is much more interesting than "i'm eeeevil because i'm craaaazy, now i'm going to poison this river"
Kefka seems a bit more nuanced that that to me, but i agree with you. Tragic villains are way better than insane ones.
Who is a tragic villain? There can't be many of those in videogames.
Magus? Chrono Trigger really is the best.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
LA Noire was the best for that kind of tonal madness
you'd go from being like "Okay, that's fine" to "YOU MURDERED HER, DIDN'T YOU, YOU SON OF A BITCH?" with a flick of a stick
it was also the most arbitrary and primitive investigation/interrogation system ever
it game-ified it in all the worst possible ways
the mechanic of telling if the person was lying or not based on the actor's facial expression was genuinely cool. I liked that a lot.
but trying to figure out if one of your collection of napkins, tire irons, and insurance paperwork would be the thing to wave in their face at that moment, or whether to just yell at them, was absurd. the game really needed a simple "is this person lying y/n" check and then a separate "show a piece of evidence that contradicts this statement" thing a la Phoenix Wright.
The mental image of Cole Phelps shouting, "Objection!!" in the middle of an interview does have appeal.
+2
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Rear Admiral ChocoI wanna be an owl, Jerry!Owl York CityRegistered Userregular
my favourite rpg is chex quest
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
So much money pissed away. So, so much money pissed away.
At least Jon Peters finally got the robot spider he always wanted.
I will always be equal parts amused and perplexed that there exists a guy who was obsessed with the idea of a giant robot spider being in a movie, who also had enough influence to make it happen. He could make his dreams literally come true on the screen, and his mission was robot spider.
A giant robot spider.
Also, it's such a Hollywood story.
Jon Peters was a hairdresser that became an executive producer at Warners because he knew hookers that were sleeping with the studio heads there and he blackmailed them with this knowledge.
Just so he could make a movie about giant robot spiders.
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spacekungfumanPoor and minority-filledRegistered User, __BANNED USERSregular
FF6 is much too easy. I have played it over 30 times, and recommend the following as actually fun challenge games:
1. Never open the menu except to save. This means no espers, no equipment, no using items outside of battle.
2. 1 + avoid all excess leveling (only walk where you would normally to progress the story and recruit characters.
3. 2+ don't let Gau use Stray cat.
I understand stuff like Skyrim isn't for everyone.
It is basically a world simulator with some light rpg elements.
It is all about making the world tell the story you want.
I played many days just pretending the main story line doesn't exist. This is just a world with dragons.
But who cares, I am too busy hunting for loot or fighting a civil war or explore for new spells. Maybe going slightly crazy and exploding a town because I am nuts.
kefka's success and climb to godlike evil from just kind of psycho evil is really fun, but i feel like any believable, sympathetic villain is much more interesting than "i'm eeeevil because i'm craaaazy, now i'm going to poison this river"
Kefka seems a bit more nuanced that that to me, but i agree with you. Tragic villains are way better than insane ones.
Who is a tragic villain? There can't be many of those in videogames.
Magus? Chrono Trigger really is the best.
Oh. I killed him in my playthrough. He seemed like a dick.
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Rear Admiral ChocoI wanna be an owl, Jerry!Owl York CityRegistered Userregular
the best way to say JRPG is to say "jurp" because the disgusting noise accurately reflects the integrity of the genre btw fyi hth ttfn god bless namaste
the best way to say JRPG is to say "jurp" because the disgusting noise accurately reflects the integrity of the genre btw fyi hth ttfn god bless namaste
Resident Evil never fails to have the stupidest, most perplexingly-motivated villains.
"I'm going to mutate the world!! Mwahahaha!"
oh god why on earth
Think of how much Umbrella Corporation could have made on zombies as weapons! All the problems of regular biological warfare except easier for an enemy to deal with than something like smallpox.
+1
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CorehealerThe ApothecaryThe softer edge of the universe.Registered Userregular
Resident Evil never fails to have the stupidest, most perplexingly-motivated villains.
"I'm going to mutate the world!! Mwahahaha!"
oh god why on earth
Think of how much Umbrella Corporation could have made on zombies as weapons! All the problems of regular biological warfare except easier for an enemy to deal with than something like smallpox.
The in game reason for that was the CEO was insane and trying to become immortal
Posts
I liked Wild Wild West.
Why do people hate it?
Admittedly it's been a long time since I've seen it.
but I'm not sure I actually had much fun with it
I have had the "what is an RPG" debate far too many times to want to go down that road again. I don't think the answer ultimately matters. Oblivion honestly has more in common with Hexen than it does most RPGs (including Morrowind, which at least made you pick a noble house, and excluded you from the others). Suffice to say that an awful lot of Western RPGs, including most good box classics, are pretty deficient in the choices and consequences department. The games that really feature them are simply fantastic, and I wish there were more of them, but even Bioware's games which play up choices and consequences so much mostly feature illusory choices with a small number of true decision points. Real branching plot lines are expensive to implement, and most people only play a game once, so they will never realize the choices are smoke and mirrors. The great games that really do it, like Arcanum and VtM:Bloodlines literally have entire alternate scripts for different types of characters, and while I'd love more of that, it's just not the direction things are going in.
Incidentally, anyone who has never played a low intelligence character in Arcanum is really missing out. It is spectacular.
getting strong now
the mechanic of telling if the person was lying or not based on the actor's facial expression was genuinely cool. I liked that a lot.
but trying to figure out if one of your collection of napkins, tire irons, and insurance paperwork would be the thing to wave in their face at that moment, or whether to just yell at them, was absurd. the game really needed a simple "is this person lying y/n" check and then a separate "show a piece of evidence that contradicts this statement" thing a la Phoenix Wright.
http://www.whompcomic.com/2013/01/16/ron-with-the-wind/
Dawww...
role playing = filling bars
duh
I will always be equal parts amused and perplexed that there exists a guy who was obsessed with the idea of a giant robot spider being in a movie, who also had enough influence to make it happen. He could make his dreams literally come true on the screen, and his mission was robot spider.
A giant robot spider.
Magus? Chrono Trigger really is the best.
I think I hit about 75 hours when felt like I had accomplished very little despite struggling mightily to enjoy myself.
It's on the shelf, collecting dust next to Kingdoms of Amalur.
I don't know why.
But damn this movie still hilarious.
It did a good job of making almost no jokes I found funny.
The other half of the movie was showing off gadgets that I didn't find cool.
The mental image of Cole Phelps shouting, "Objection!!" in the middle of an interview does have appeal.
Also, it's such a Hollywood story.
Jon Peters was a hairdresser that became an executive producer at Warners because he knew hookers that were sleeping with the studio heads there and he blackmailed them with this knowledge.
Just so he could make a movie about giant robot spiders.
1. Never open the menu except to save. This means no espers, no equipment, no using items outside of battle.
2. 1 + avoid all excess leveling (only walk where you would normally to progress the story and recruit characters.
3. 2+ don't let Gau use Stray cat.
Wha... just tons.
It is basically a world simulator with some light rpg elements.
It is all about making the world tell the story you want.
I played many days just pretending the main story line doesn't exist. This is just a world with dragons.
But who cares, I am too busy hunting for loot or fighting a civil war or explore for new spells. Maybe going slightly crazy and exploding a town because I am nuts.
Oh. I killed him in my playthrough. He seemed like a dick.
Life stayed exactly the same.
What gives?
Resident Evil never fails to have the stupidest, most perplexingly-motivated villains.
"I'm going to mutate the world!! Mwahahaha!"
oh god why on earth
so much better.
jurpug
MONEY!!!
That is not a choice that is offered by the game.
Sarcastic Hawke is every dialogue choice.
I don't know if I would call getting a character to level 70 in Diablo living exactly.
Think of how much Umbrella Corporation could have made on zombies as weapons! All the problems of regular biological warfare except easier for an enemy to deal with than something like smallpox.
Nah, not every one, just most of them.
You could be the kind of person who kisses the Chantry's butt throughout and doesn't even blink at the chance to help the templars at the end.
have you heard about a game called Dragonfall
Apparently.
Step 1: mutate everyone
Step 2: [404 error: file not found]
Step 3: $$$$$
The in game reason for that was the CEO was insane and trying to become immortal
Ceaselessly spawning indefinite biohazard incubators.
I got a little excited when I saw your ship.
I had not
but, looking at it, I am totally dtdf (down to dragonfall)