Club PA 2.0 has arrived! If you'd like to access some extra PA content and help support the forums, check it out at patreon.com/ClubPA
The image size limit has been raised to 1mb! Anything larger than that should be linked to. This is a HARD limit, please do not abuse it.
Our new Indie Games subforum is now open for business in G&T. Go and check it out, you might land a code for a free game. If you're developing an indie game and want to post about it, follow these directions. If you don't, he'll break your legs! Hahaha! Seriously though.
Our rules have been updated and given their own forum. Go and look at them! They are nice, and there may be new ones that you didn't know about! Hooray for rules! Hooray for The System! Hooray for Conforming!

[Board games] I choose poorly.

1373840424385

Posts

  • jergarmarjergarmar inside your hollow manRegistered User regular
    MrBody wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    Did Seafall actually get an official recommendation from SUASD? I don't think it did, but could be wrong. I remember the review being one of many that was mainly a long sigh of disappointment, leading to it being available for like £20 a few months later because everyone was scared away by the bad reviews.

    They told people with enough money to buy it even if they didn't want to and never would play it.

    Ha, this is one of my favorite SU&SD quotes. It's the most left-handed compliment possible to a game they heavily criticized. But I get it. You buy the game, open all the packs, and then just admire the progression of the game space from one point to another. You can peel away, as it were, the skin and muscle of the game and examine the skeletal structure like a bemused coroner. Just like a corpse, the game might be dead and lifeless, but it's still fascinating to dissect.

    When I was a child, I had a fever...
    jswidget.php?username=jergarmar&numitems=7&text=none&images=small&show=hot10&imagesonly=1&imagepos=right&inline=1&domains%5B%5D=boardgame&imagewidget=1
    My BoardGameGeek profile
    Battle.net: TheGerm#1430 (Hearthstone, HotS)
    Duelyst: TheGerm
    (send PM if you send invite)
    Fry
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    Inis is best game.
    That said, it has a lot if overlap with Chaos In The Old world in that the game only actually functions when people understand it and what can happen within it. It's a game that - for example - is immediately thrashed by one player doing a dumb thing ("There were a bunch of guys there, so I thought it would be fun to make them fight."). Inis needs to be played with intent, but it's so damn rewarding because of the way the game is won and how you're never actually that far away from winning. I get why some people think it's random or king-makey, but those people are very wrong. :P
    Give it a shot!

    Evil MultifariousInquisitor
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    jergarmar wrote: »
    MrBody wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    Did Seafall actually get an official recommendation from SUASD? I don't think it did, but could be wrong. I remember the review being one of many that was mainly a long sigh of disappointment, leading to it being available for like £20 a few months later because everyone was scared away by the bad reviews.

    They told people with enough money to buy it even if they didn't want to and never would play it.

    Ha, this is one of my favorite SU&SD quotes. It's the most left-handed compliment possible to a game they heavily criticized. But I get it. You buy the game, open all the packs, and then just admire the progression of the game space from one point to another. You can peel away, as it were, the skin and muscle of the game and examine the skeletal structure like a bemused coroner. Just like a corpse, the game might be dead and lifeless, but it's still fascinating to dissect.

    So basically it's an owl pellet

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • ArcSynArcSyn Registered User regular
    I need to find Inis where I can borrow it to try it out. It's definitely one that keeps cropping up and being recommended here.

    jswidget.php?username=ArcSyn&numitems=5&header=0&text=none&images=small&show=recentplays&imagesonly=1&imagepos=center&inline=1&domains%5B%5D=boardgame&imagewidget=1og83npmjgeii.pngT298pV7.pngSteam:ArcSyn
    CaptainPeacockVyolynceElvenshae
  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    id recommend trying it before buying it. i ended up selling it because basically everyone i ever played it with hated it and i couldnt get anyone to play it. personally i thought it was really neat but yknow. its a divisive game is all im saying.

    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited April 14
    Inis is best game.
    That said, it has a lot if overlap with Chaos In The Old world in that the game only actually functions when people understand it and what can happen within it. It's a game that - for example - is immediately thrashed by one player doing a dumb thing ("There were a bunch of guys there, so I thought it would be fun to make them fight."). Inis needs to be played with intent, but it's so damn rewarding because of the way the game is won and how you're never actually that far away from winning. I get why some people think it's random or king-makey, but those people are very wrong. :P
    Give it a shot!

    This is very true. Individual players have a lot of impact on each other, but your ability to intervene is limited by your cards, so if someone needs to be cut down to keep them from winning, people need to be aware of it. Kingmaking will happen a lot as you learn the game

    But I like games with a decent skill floor if they have a high skill ceiling and don't take 6 hours.

    Evil Multifarious on
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    jergarmar
  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    i played a couple new (to me) games last night. some thoughts!

    A Feast for Odin: i dont know that ive been so conflicted about my feelings about a game in a long time. on the one hand, i had fun playing this and the actions i was taking were interesting consistently throughout the 4hr game which says something. on the other hand, i feel like theres just too much crap in this game that is all individually neat but that doesnt seem to adhere into a unified interesting game in the end. granted this was my first play but i think this style of everything and the kitchen sink design doesnt really work for me. that said i did have a pretty good time playing it, and would probably play it again. but i definitely didnt finish it with the glowing love that a lot of people at my game group have for it.

    Rattus: at the other end of the spectrum, we played this short and brutal area control game which i thought was pretty great. definitely on the lighter and randomer end of the spectrum, but the special role cards were a pretty great mechanic i thought. they give you special powers, but also make your cubes more vulnerable to getting killed off by the plague. also they trade hands constantly which made the whole thing pretty dynamic. also i liked that it was won by straight up whoever has the most cubes survivingon the board at the end. no points or anything. so yea, if you like lighthearted games about being very mean to each others cubes definitely check this one out.

    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
    ArcticLancer
  • jergarmarjergarmar inside your hollow manRegistered User regular
    edited April 14
    Inis is best game.
    That said, it has a lot if overlap with Chaos In The Old world in that the game only actually functions when people understand it and what can happen within it. It's a game that - for example - is immediately thrashed by one player doing a dumb thing ("There were a bunch of guys there, so I thought it would be fun to make them fight."). Inis needs to be played with intent, but it's so damn rewarding because of the way the game is won and how you're never actually that far away from winning. I get why some people think it's random or king-makey, but those people are very wrong. :P
    Give it a shot!

    This is very true. Individual players have a lot of impact on each other, but your ability to intervene is limited by your cards, so if someone needs to be cut down to keep them from winning, people need to be aware of it. Kingmaking will happen a lot as you learn the game

    But I like games with a decent skill floor if they have a high skill ceiling and don't take 6 hours.

    Both quotes also remind me a bit of Tigris & Euphrates, which has the highest skill floor of any Knizia game I can think of. Like the others, you sort of need just one rough game, and then it springs to life. I own and thoroughly enjoy Inis and T&E, what others in this category would you recommend?

    jergarmar on
    When I was a child, I had a fever...
    jswidget.php?username=jergarmar&numitems=7&text=none&images=small&show=hot10&imagesonly=1&imagepos=right&inline=1&domains%5B%5D=boardgame&imagewidget=1
    My BoardGameGeek profile
    Battle.net: TheGerm#1430 (Hearthstone, HotS)
    Duelyst: TheGerm
    (send PM if you send invite)
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    I love Tigris & Euphrates and it is the Platonic ideal of the game that everyone hates the first play through and then asks for on the next board game night, because they looked it up and played it on their phones a bunch

    Cthulhu Wars is also a game in that vein. In general, tightly designed area control games work this way, I think. CW also has the benefit of making players eventually realize that stomping the weaker players is actually counterproductive--if they're too weak, they can't afford to spend resources taking bites out of the leader, so you never want to just crush anyone too hard.

    I'd also recommend both other games from the Inis team, Cyclades for the vicious bidding wars over actions and Kemet for a crunchier, more aggressive war game where you're attacking multiple times each turn

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    just a note that cyclades, kemet, inis, and giants are all designed by different people, and are all pretty different mecahnically and gameplay wise. their only link is being published by the same publisher and having the same sized boxes. not to say you shouldnt check the other ones, but theyre not really "the other games from the inis team".

    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
    ArcticLancer
  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    We did a 4 player run through of Exit: Polar Station. I'm a big fan! This one had 3/5 difficulty rating and we definitely needed to use some cards.

    Aether
  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    Oh man also if you have 6 Nimmt or any other deck of cards numbered 1-100 you HAVE TO try the game The Mind. It's a fantastic night cap game for 2-4.


    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
    Darric
  • ArcticLancerArcticLancer Best served chilled. Registered User regular
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    just a note that cyclades, kemet, inis, and giants are all designed by different people, and are all pretty different mecahnically and gameplay wise. their only link is being published by the same publisher and having the same sized boxes. not to say you shouldnt check the other ones, but theyre not really "the other games from the inis team".
    And for what It's worth here, Inis actually is my favorite game, but I really don't like Cyclades (best auction mechanism ever, but the game attached to it is incredibly bland). I want to try Kemet to have the full range of opinions on the set, but haven't gotten there yet. Definitely to be considered separate entities though~

  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    Huh, I thought they were designed by the same people. There are definitely thematic and mechanical similarities in the three games, I guess that's why

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
  • GvzbgulGvzbgul no thank you, I prefer my hat Registered User regular
    Alrighty, got Inis, but after reading the rules I still don't quite "get" it*. I guess that's why they insist on a starter game.


    *you can know the rules of a game, but the game is really in how the rules/players fit together and interact with each other. What the arc of the games is etc. I love that "aha!" moment when it clicks and it's why I love simple games like Skull. I'll often get a "is that it?" for that one when I explain the rules to new players, they often don't understand the game until they play it.

  • StragintStragint Do Not Gift Always DeclinesRegistered User regular
    I've done two haunts in Betrayal at Baulders Gate and both were incredibly easy to accomplish. So far I'm leaning towards liking the Betrayal at House on the Hill haunts but I've also done like 7 or 8 different scenarios for that one compared to the 2 for Baulders Gate.

    PSN: Reaper_Stragint, Steam: DoublePitstoChesty
    What is the point of being alive if you don't at least try to do something remarkable? ~ Mario Novak

    I never fear death or dyin', I only fear never trying.
    Ivellius
  • DashuiDashui Registered User regular
    edited April 15
    Gvzbgul wrote: »
    Alrighty, got Inis, but after reading the rules I still don't quite "get" it*. I guess that's why they insist on a starter game.


    *you can know the rules of a game, but the game is really in how the rules/players fit together and interact with each other. What the arc of the games is etc. I love that "aha!" moment when it clicks and it's why I love simple games like Skull. I'll often get a "is that it?" for that one when I explain the rules to new players, they often don't understand the game until they play it.

    When learning a game, I've found it best to just not read the rule book on its own, but to set everything up and simulate a few turns. That's really helped me get to that "aha!" moment faster.

    Dashui on
    Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis 3DS: 2638-0037-166
    CaptainPeacock
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo All the world's a meat raffle, And all the men and women merely players Registered User regular
    edited April 15
    Not really a pandemic legacy 1 January spoiler, but using tags anyhow
    Just realised we missed the fact we had cards to draw after the second epidemic in January. So ended up doing it after losing January twice and beginning February

    Shit was still intense.

    Mojo_Jojo on
    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    edited April 15
    We have a Blood Rage PbP game going on right now and from what I've read so far it looks like it's going to knock Kemet and Cthulhu Wars out of the "dudes on a map area control" top spot. Definitely don't see a reason to go back to Chaos in the Old World.

    I'm finishing up a forum game of Kemet right now. I'm not sure I would ever play it tabletop. The downtime and AP seems like it would be insane with people constantly asking "what powers do you have again?" and triple checking their own powers for combos to pull off. It doesn't come through in a forum game where you have tons of time to think about turns and all the information right in front of you. It's one of those games where you HAVE to print out reference sheets for everyone because the textless hieroglyphics approach is super user unfriendly, possibly moreso than Race for the Galaxy.

    Anyone have thoughts on Rising Sun compared to Blood Rage?

    MrBody on
  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    Rising sun is pretty complicated and counterintuitive. The theme is cool and it feels very different from other games. My group abandoned it after about four games because there's no real comeback mechanic if you screw up, you're just out of the running for however many hours are left.

    sig.gif
  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    It also suffers from the same problem as blood rage wrt broken combos that are hard to predict, if you're the sort of cackling homunculus who objects to such things

    sig.gif
    Elvenshae
  • WearingglassesWearingglasses Of the friendly neighborhood variety Registered User regular
    How true is it that you can get a lot of points by, just before a battle, telling most/all of your samurai to off themselves?

  • GlaziusGlazius Registered User regular
    Ah_Pook wrote: »
    A Feast for Odin: i dont know that ive been so conflicted about my feelings about a game in a long time. on the one hand, i had fun playing this and the actions i was taking were interesting consistently throughout the 4hr game which says something. on the other hand, i feel like theres just too much crap in this game that is all individually neat but that doesnt seem to adhere into a unified interesting game in the end. granted this was my first play but i think this style of everything and the kitchen sink design doesnt really work for me. that said i did have a pretty good time playing it, and would probably play it again. but i definitely didnt finish it with the glowing love that a lot of people at my game group have for it.

    It's going to come down to how excited you are to play Nordic Inventory Tetris, ultimately. There are a lot of routes to get pieces for the puzzle, and a lot of optional bonus challenges to take on, but they all feed into the same destination. (With one slight variation - if you can pull it off, only covering the negative points on your homeboard and getting income from elsewhere.)

    If you're not interested in exploring different ways to approach the spatial puzzle, there's not a lot else in the game for you. But if you are, there's a lot to get excited about.

  • DarricDarric Santa MonicaRegistered User regular
    A Feast for Odin's amazing. It should not take four hours.

    CaptainPeacockVyolynce
  • BogartBogart Kneel before Mod Registered User, Moderator mod
    Boardgames over the weekend. We played Alchemists, Quantum, case five of the Consulting Detective expansion and Biblios.

    ye82l825kb2b.jpeg

    After learning last time we played that it's important to sell potions to get money, I learned this time that it's important to publish a lot and also not test the same potion twice on a student because you weren't paying attention. At some point I will learn enough to actually be competitive at this game.

    Quantum remains good tactical maths fun. Biblios is a decent, quick auction game about collecting the most valuable illuminated manuscripts while hobbling your opponents. We skipped the remaining three Ripper cases after the first one left us underwhelmed and were much more pleased with the standalone case of Dr Goldfire. We were scrabbling around for a while there but the new cases seem slightly more intent on
    you using the permanent contacts, such as Somerset House or the cabbies, to fill in vital information without actually pointing you towards them via a clue. With Dr Goldfire you have no other way of discovering his mother's maiden name beyond looking at her marriage certificate and no way of knowing where the fake Doctor is beyond tracing the cab he took when he left 221b.

    MNC DovermysticjuicerCaptainPeacockHahnsoo1Zombie HeroDarric
  • BursarBursar Hee Noooo! Registered User regular
    How true is it that you can get a lot of points by, just before a battle, telling most/all of your samurai to off themselves?

    Depending on your clan and perks, it can be a viable strategy.
    [detailed analysis below for anyone who wants to work out the combos for themselves]
    The actual battle steps are:
    1. Seppuku - whoever bids the most here gets to kill off all their units at this location, getting 1vp and moving up one honor position for each.
    2. Hostage - whoever bids the most here gets to take one figure (some limitations apply) from another player at this location, gaining 1vp while the player whose figure was taken loses 1vp.
    3. Ronin - whoever bids the most here gets to add their Ronin to their forces in this location.
    4. Total up the strength of all the players fighting at the location. Whoever has the highest total wins the battle, and all the figures from the other (non-ally) players fighting here die. (A single battle is worth 1-3vp depending on the season, and there are combo bonuses for winning battles in different regions.)
    5. Poets - whoever bids the most here gets 1vp for every unit that died during this battle, including units that offed themselves during step 1.
    6. Payment - all money bid during battle is lost. BUT: the player who won the battle takes all the money they spent and divides it among the players who lost.

    So what's this about killing all your own troops being a winning strategy? As the old Looney Tunes short about the talent agency says, "Well, I can only do it once."
    Obviously, in order to have your unit kill itself before battle it has to be present. Each season you're going to have at most three chances to drum up units, which doesn't mean that you'll even be able to get them to where the fighting is going to be from the your strongholds where you brought them out.

    However! Here comes the Fox Clan, with their special ability: At the start of the War phase, they can air-drop in one basic soldier into each area where they don't already have a unit. This does away without having to worry about getting enough Recruit / Move actions to be in the battle, because they can have at least one unit anywhere they want (as long as they have enough basic soldiers to do so [and you might not, because you will have at most 6 basic soldiers available and with 6 players there will be 8 battles]).

    Here's the combo: Win both the seppuku and poets auctions, which gives you 2vp for each of your own units that you killed off (plus vp for other players' units if you threw them into battles with more players). And, hey, if you had enough Ronin and managed to win that auction, you might just win the battle, too. If you lose the battle, then the winner has to pay you for the privilege of getting to watch your guy run onto the field and kill himself, which then gives you more money to do it again in the next battle.

    You may have the option of purchasing the ability which grants you 1 extra vp every time one of your units dies. This includes seppuku. If the other players aren't paying attention and let you snap both of these cards up, suddenly you're gaining 3 or 4vp every time one of your units commits seppuku, which is more VP than the battle itself was worth (barring the potential combo bonus at the end of the game).

    Here, then, is how you turn this into a winning engine:
    * Be the Fox clan. This negates the need for producing / moving soldiers, and you can still muster non-soldiers whenever the action comes up for you.
    * Get those bonus VP for unit death cards.
    * Drop soldiers into battle zones, preferably into areas with more than one non-allied player present so you can get more vp from the poets.
    * In battle, win Seppuku and Poets auctions.
    * Maybe throw a coin into the Hostage auction depending on what's present, as you might get a chance to steal a vp from another player while removing a nasty unit from the board -- and if they suspect you of trying to run the Suicide Engine, they might not have bothered to bid on Hostages since you can't kidnap a unit that's already dead.
    * Get the winning player to cough up money.
    * Repeat in the next battle.
    * [optional] Actually try to win the last battle of the season, because you'll lose all the money at the end of the season anyway.

    So far, our group's potential defenses against this are to:
    a) outbid the Fox player on Seppuku but not kill your guys, if you can win through strength anyway (and you probably will, because it's likely they only have one unit present through their clan ability).
    b) outbid the Fox player on Poets, which gets you a vp for each of their deaths.
    c) if you're facing just the Fox player who is using this strategy and you have to fight them multiple times that season, don't bid anything (unless you're worried about having a unit captured), because then you won't have to give them any money and they can't repeat this process as efficiently in the next battles.

    (tl;dr) Yes, it's a possible strategy, but really only for a particular clan and you can see it coming.

    It does, however, have the hilarious mental image of a battle about to commence between great armies when one person comes running out from the side and kills himself, to which the great scribes on a distant hill nod to one another and say, "The battle may be won by others, but that guy just had style."

    GNU Terry Pratchett
    3DS FC: 0810-0331-1324 | PSN: Wstfgl | GamerTag: An Evil Plan | Battle.net: FallenIdle#1970
    HedgethornElvenshaeFryJustTeeKristmas Kthulhu
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    It also suffers from the same problem as blood rage wrt broken combos that are hard to predict, if you're the sort of cackling homunculus who objects to such things

    rwurg92gev0x.gif

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    ElvenshaePowerpuppiesjergarmarjakobagger
  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    Darric wrote: »
    A Feast for Odin's amazing. It should not take four hours.

    I agree on one of those two points.

    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
  • azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
    Kristmas KthulhuAuralynxcrimsoncoyotenwrabeChiselphaneCantide
  • PowerpuppiesPowerpuppies Registered User regular
    Bursar wrote: »
    How true is it that you can get a lot of points by, just before a battle, telling most/all of your samurai to off themselves?

    Depending on your clan and perks, it can be a viable strategy.
    [detailed analysis below for anyone who wants to work out the combos for themselves]
    The actual battle steps are:
    1. Seppuku - whoever bids the most here gets to kill off all their units at this location, getting 1vp and moving up one honor position for each.
    2. Hostage - whoever bids the most here gets to take one figure (some limitations apply) from another player at this location, gaining 1vp while the player whose figure was taken loses 1vp.
    3. Ronin - whoever bids the most here gets to add their Ronin to their forces in this location.
    4. Total up the strength of all the players fighting at the location. Whoever has the highest total wins the battle, and all the figures from the other (non-ally) players fighting here die. (A single battle is worth 1-3vp depending on the season, and there are combo bonuses for winning battles in different regions.)
    5. Poets - whoever bids the most here gets 1vp for every unit that died during this battle, including units that offed themselves during step 1.
    6. Payment - all money bid during battle is lost. BUT: the player who won the battle takes all the money they spent and divides it among the players who lost.

    So what's this about killing all your own troops being a winning strategy? As the old Looney Tunes short about the talent agency says, "Well, I can only do it once."
    Obviously, in order to have your unit kill itself before battle it has to be present. Each season you're going to have at most three chances to drum up units, which doesn't mean that you'll even be able to get them to where the fighting is going to be from the your strongholds where you brought them out.

    However! Here comes the Fox Clan, with their special ability: At the start of the War phase, they can air-drop in one basic soldier into each area where they don't already have a unit. This does away without having to worry about getting enough Recruit / Move actions to be in the battle, because they can have at least one unit anywhere they want (as long as they have enough basic soldiers to do so [and you might not, because you will have at most 6 basic soldiers available and with 6 players there will be 8 battles]).

    Here's the combo: Win both the seppuku and poets auctions, which gives you 2vp for each of your own units that you killed off (plus vp for other players' units if you threw them into battles with more players). And, hey, if you had enough Ronin and managed to win that auction, you might just win the battle, too. If you lose the battle, then the winner has to pay you for the privilege of getting to watch your guy run onto the field and kill himself, which then gives you more money to do it again in the next battle.

    You may have the option of purchasing the ability which grants you 1 extra vp every time one of your units dies. This includes seppuku. If the other players aren't paying attention and let you snap both of these cards up, suddenly you're gaining 3 or 4vp every time one of your units commits seppuku, which is more VP than the battle itself was worth (barring the potential combo bonus at the end of the game).

    Here, then, is how you turn this into a winning engine:
    * Be the Fox clan. This negates the need for producing / moving soldiers, and you can still muster non-soldiers whenever the action comes up for you.
    * Get those bonus VP for unit death cards.
    * Drop soldiers into battle zones, preferably into areas with more than one non-allied player present so you can get more vp from the poets.
    * In battle, win Seppuku and Poets auctions.
    * Maybe throw a coin into the Hostage auction depending on what's present, as you might get a chance to steal a vp from another player while removing a nasty unit from the board -- and if they suspect you of trying to run the Suicide Engine, they might not have bothered to bid on Hostages since you can't kidnap a unit that's already dead.
    * Get the winning player to cough up money.
    * Repeat in the next battle.
    * [optional] Actually try to win the last battle of the season, because you'll lose all the money at the end of the season anyway.

    So far, our group's potential defenses against this are to:
    a) outbid the Fox player on Seppuku but not kill your guys, if you can win through strength anyway (and you probably will, because it's likely they only have one unit present through their clan ability).
    b) outbid the Fox player on Poets, which gets you a vp for each of their deaths.
    c) if you're facing just the Fox player who is using this strategy and you have to fight them multiple times that season, don't bid anything (unless you're worried about having a unit captured), because then you won't have to give them any money and they can't repeat this process as efficiently in the next battles.

    (tl;dr) Yes, it's a possible strategy, but really only for a particular clan and you can see it coming.

    It does, however, have the hilarious mental image of a battle about to commence between great armies when one person comes running out from the side and kills himself, to which the great scribes on a distant hill nod to one another and say, "The battle may be won by others, but that guy just had style."

    Combos aside, telling your samurai to off themselves is incredibly important because they are approximately forty opportunities for ties between battle phases, and in many games the only way to affect the tiebreaker is via seppuku. Giving up 10 points to suicide with 3 guys and get 3 points and 3 honor could be worth it, if it lets you set up for temple bonuses next round and you get temple bonuses twice for a total of 2 guys and 4 bucks, or 4 bucks and 2 card buys, or something.

    sig.gif
  • AuralynxAuralynx Thirty-Seven Keys Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I first touched 7th Continent when I dropped in for the second session after my friends were already completely lost. Oddly educational!

    Auralynx on
    Space... what is the point of it? You have no idea.
    og83npmjgeii.png

  • LykouraghLykouragh Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    MrBody wrote: »
    We have a Blood Rage PbP game going on right now and from what I've read so far it looks like it's going to knock Kemet and Cthulhu Wars out of the "dudes on a map area control" top spot. Definitely don't see a reason to go back to Chaos in the Old World.

    I'm finishing up a forum game of Kemet right now. I'm not sure I would ever play it tabletop. The downtime and AP seems like it would be insane with people constantly asking "what powers do you have again?" and triple checking their own powers for combos to pull off. It doesn't come through in a forum game where you have tons of time to think about turns and all the information right in front of you. It's one of those games where you HAVE to print out reference sheets for everyone because the textless hieroglyphics approach is super user unfriendly, possibly moreso than Race for the Galaxy.

    Anyone have thoughts on Rising Sun compared to Blood Rage?

    I really enjoy Blood Rage; it's fast and you get to make clever bold decisions and they feel meaningful without punishing you too harshly for losing.

    That said, I don't think it replaces CitOW in my heart- by losing the asymmetry and adding a draft Blood Rage speeds itself up and reduces the learning curve, but for me the special thing about CitOW was always the delicate asymmetric balance. In Blood Rage you never get that sense of god's personalities and roles in the metagame that you get from CitOW, and this loses you a little of your sense of player immersion and agency.

    Lykouragh on
    InquisitorWolf of Dresdenjakobagger
  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    Bursar wrote: »
    How true is it that you can get a lot of points by, just before a battle, telling most/all of your samurai to off themselves?

    Depending on your clan and perks, it can be a viable strategy.
    [detailed analysis below for anyone who wants to work out the combos for themselves]
    The actual battle steps are:
    1. Seppuku - whoever bids the most here gets to kill off all their units at this location, getting 1vp and moving up one honor position for each.
    2. Hostage - whoever bids the most here gets to take one figure (some limitations apply) from another player at this location, gaining 1vp while the player whose figure was taken loses 1vp.
    3. Ronin - whoever bids the most here gets to add their Ronin to their forces in this location.
    4. Total up the strength of all the players fighting at the location. Whoever has the highest total wins the battle, and all the figures from the other (non-ally) players fighting here die. (A single battle is worth 1-3vp depending on the season, and there are combo bonuses for winning battles in different regions.)
    5. Poets - whoever bids the most here gets 1vp for every unit that died during this battle, including units that offed themselves during step 1.
    6. Payment - all money bid during battle is lost. BUT: the player who won the battle takes all the money they spent and divides it among the players who lost.

    So what's this about killing all your own troops being a winning strategy? As the old Looney Tunes short about the talent agency says, "Well, I can only do it once."
    Obviously, in order to have your unit kill itself before battle it has to be present. Each season you're going to have at most three chances to drum up units, which doesn't mean that you'll even be able to get them to where the fighting is going to be from the your strongholds where you brought them out.

    However! Here comes the Fox Clan, with their special ability: At the start of the War phase, they can air-drop in one basic soldier into each area where they don't already have a unit. This does away without having to worry about getting enough Recruit / Move actions to be in the battle, because they can have at least one unit anywhere they want (as long as they have enough basic soldiers to do so [and you might not, because you will have at most 6 basic soldiers available and with 6 players there will be 8 battles]).

    Here's the combo: Win both the seppuku and poets auctions, which gives you 2vp for each of your own units that you killed off (plus vp for other players' units if you threw them into battles with more players). And, hey, if you had enough Ronin and managed to win that auction, you might just win the battle, too. If you lose the battle, then the winner has to pay you for the privilege of getting to watch your guy run onto the field and kill himself, which then gives you more money to do it again in the next battle.

    You may have the option of purchasing the ability which grants you 1 extra vp every time one of your units dies. This includes seppuku. If the other players aren't paying attention and let you snap both of these cards up, suddenly you're gaining 3 or 4vp every time one of your units commits seppuku, which is more VP than the battle itself was worth (barring the potential combo bonus at the end of the game).

    Here, then, is how you turn this into a winning engine:
    * Be the Fox clan. This negates the need for producing / moving soldiers, and you can still muster non-soldiers whenever the action comes up for you.
    * Get those bonus VP for unit death cards.
    * Drop soldiers into battle zones, preferably into areas with more than one non-allied player present so you can get more vp from the poets.
    * In battle, win Seppuku and Poets auctions.
    * Maybe throw a coin into the Hostage auction depending on what's present, as you might get a chance to steal a vp from another player while removing a nasty unit from the board -- and if they suspect you of trying to run the Suicide Engine, they might not have bothered to bid on Hostages since you can't kidnap a unit that's already dead.
    * Get the winning player to cough up money.
    * Repeat in the next battle.
    * [optional] Actually try to win the last battle of the season, because you'll lose all the money at the end of the season anyway.

    So far, our group's potential defenses against this are to:
    a) outbid the Fox player on Seppuku but not kill your guys, if you can win through strength anyway (and you probably will, because it's likely they only have one unit present through their clan ability).
    b) outbid the Fox player on Poets, which gets you a vp for each of their deaths.
    c) if you're facing just the Fox player who is using this strategy and you have to fight them multiple times that season, don't bid anything (unless you're worried about having a unit captured), because then you won't have to give them any money and they can't repeat this process as efficiently in the next battles.

    (tl;dr) Yes, it's a possible strategy, but really only for a particular clan and you can see it coming.

    It does, however, have the hilarious mental image of a battle about to commence between great armies when one person comes running out from the side and kills himself, to which the great scribes on a distant hill nod to one another and say, "The battle may be won by others, but that guy just had style."

    Combos aside, telling your samurai to off themselves is incredibly important because they are approximately forty opportunities for ties between battle phases, and in many games the only way to affect the tiebreaker is via seppuku. Giving up 10 points to suicide with 3 guys and get 3 points and 3 honor could be worth it, if it lets you set up for temple bonuses next round and you get temple bonuses twice for a total of 2 guys and 4 bucks, or 4 bucks and 2 card buys, or something.

    Seppuku is useful also if you are in a battle with no hope of winning... You either get some points and honor for guys that were dead anyway , or force your opponent to outbid you on seppuku and get yourself more money when they win the battle etc. Opens up lots of mind game opportunities.

    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
    Elvenshae
  • azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Auralynx wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I first touched 7th Continent when I dropped in for the second session after my friends were already completely lost. Oddly educational!

    your impression?

    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
  • AuralynxAuralynx Thirty-Seven Keys Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    azith28 wrote: »
    Auralynx wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I first touched 7th Continent when I dropped in for the second session after my friends were already completely lost. Oddly educational!

    your impression?

    Well, having now played that one out 'til we lost, been part of a second equally-doomed game, and then started the current two-man expedition that's led us to some kind of spooky alternate dimension...

    I don't think it's that good a game, honestly, as far as the mechanics go; play-wise there's not a lot to it. Your ability to affect what's going on is pretty steeply limited by the very-tight inventory space, need to tie up parts of that space with abilities that should probably be inherent to the character rather than on holding a particular card forever, and steeply limited availability of corrective measures when you have problems. Map sections do repeat across different missions and starting points, and if you remember them it'll influence your process some, which cuts both ways. See spoiler for example if you don't mind knowing a little bit about the content going in:
    We named one particularly-rude section of the map "Horrible Bug Island," which should give a pretty good idea what we encountered exploring it, and then did an immediate U-turn when it was a place we could've gone in our current game.

    On the other, way more important hand: It's an extremely successful merging of the Choose-Your-Own-Adventure genre with a big pile of cards and tiles to take it to a higher level than even the fancier ones from the 80s like the Lone Wolf series did. The item-use mechanics create tension and the use of the deck as a passive clock means that, as with most CYOA material, you're riding the story towards some sort of finish no matter what you do and the pressure is on you to steer it. It's a very successful experience, even if I don't think it's a great game. I'm glad I don't own it, because I enjoy gamier but loosely similar stuff like Mage Knight and Kingdom: Death more, but pretty pleased I know someone who does.

    Other thoughts: The author(s?) clearly know and respect old pulp adventure material and are re-using it quite successfully. The need to actually scrutinize the tiles to look for resources and clues improves the play experience substantially. I like that there are multiple outcomes for some of the more-significant things you might run into based on map position and not your particular quest. I think including a playable H.P. Lovecraft and Victor Frankenstein was a very silly decision and would not have, but I have to concede they do a good job with each of their character-specific cards. The Lovecraft ones are clever in the way they interact with the Curse mechanics but didn't need to be on him; while the Frankenstein ones are very Frankenstein-y.

    tl;dr: It's fun and I recommend it but it's a very different experience from playing something that's more-challenging mechanically, which most games are.

    Auralynx on
    Space... what is the point of it? You have no idea.
    og83npmjgeii.png

  • azith28azith28 Registered User regular
    Auralynx wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Auralynx wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I first touched 7th Continent when I dropped in for the second session after my friends were already completely lost. Oddly educational!

    your impression?

    Well, having now played that one out 'til we lost, been part of a second equally-doomed game, and then started the current two-man expedition that's led us to some kind of spooky alternate dimension...

    I don't think it's that good a game, honestly, as far as the mechanics go; play-wise there's not a lot to it. Your ability to affect what's going on is pretty steeply limited by the very-tight inventory space, need to tie up parts of that space with abilities that should probably be inherent to the character rather than on holding a particular card forever, and steeply limited availability of corrective measures when you have problems. Map sections do repeat across different missions and starting points, and if you remember them it'll influence your process some, which cuts both ways. See spoiler for example if you don't mind knowing a little bit about the content going in:
    We named one particularly-rude section of the map "Horrible Bug Island," which should give a pretty good idea what we encountered exploring it, and then did an immediate U-turn when it was a place we could've gone in our current game.

    On the other, way more important hand: It's an extremely successful merging of the Choose-Your-Own-Adventure genre with a big pile of cards and tiles to take it to a higher level than even the fancier ones from the 80s like the Lone Wolf series did. The item-use mechanics create tension and the use of the deck as a passive clock means that, as with most CYOA material, you're riding the story towards some sort of finish no matter what you do and the pressure is on you to steer it. It's a very successful experience, even if I don't think it's a great game. I'm glad I don't own it, because I enjoy gamier but loosely similar stuff like Mage Knight and Kingdom: Death more, but pretty pleased I know someone who does.

    Other thoughts: The author(s?) clearly know and respect old pulp adventure material and are re-using it quite successfully. The need to actually scrutinize the tiles to look for resources and clues improves the play experience substantially. I like that there are multiple outcomes for some of the more-significant things you might run into based on map position and not your particular quest. I think including a playable H.P. Lovecraft and Victor Frankenstein was a very silly decision and would not have, but I have to concede they do a good job with each of their character-specific cards. The Lovecraft ones are clever in the way they interact with the Curse mechanics but didn't need to be on him; while the Frankenstein ones are very Frankenstein-y.

    tl;dr: It's fun and I recommend it but it's a very different experience from playing something that's more-challenging mechanically, which most games are.

    My group didn't really encounter the limited inventory problem. you did know about item stacks right? playing 4 players we had the lowest max hand sizes, but me playing Frankenstein let me carry 3 skills, and another guy found an item that if merged into a stack let him have up to 3 extra items in the stack, so we had a decent amount of room. Most of us had a mostly full inventory by our stopping point, so maybe later its more of an issue.

    Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
  • AuralynxAuralynx Thirty-Seven Keys Registered User regular
    azith28 wrote: »
    Auralynx wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Auralynx wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I first touched 7th Continent when I dropped in for the second session after my friends were already completely lost. Oddly educational!

    your impression?

    Well, having now played that one out 'til we lost, been part of a second equally-doomed game, and then started the current two-man expedition that's led us to some kind of spooky alternate dimension...

    I don't think it's that good a game, honestly, as far as the mechanics go; play-wise there's not a lot to it. Your ability to affect what's going on is pretty steeply limited by the very-tight inventory space, need to tie up parts of that space with abilities that should probably be inherent to the character rather than on holding a particular card forever, and steeply limited availability of corrective measures when you have problems. Map sections do repeat across different missions and starting points, and if you remember them it'll influence your process some, which cuts both ways. See spoiler for example if you don't mind knowing a little bit about the content going in:
    We named one particularly-rude section of the map "Horrible Bug Island," which should give a pretty good idea what we encountered exploring it, and then did an immediate U-turn when it was a place we could've gone in our current game.

    On the other, way more important hand: It's an extremely successful merging of the Choose-Your-Own-Adventure genre with a big pile of cards and tiles to take it to a higher level than even the fancier ones from the 80s like the Lone Wolf series did. The item-use mechanics create tension and the use of the deck as a passive clock means that, as with most CYOA material, you're riding the story towards some sort of finish no matter what you do and the pressure is on you to steer it. It's a very successful experience, even if I don't think it's a great game. I'm glad I don't own it, because I enjoy gamier but loosely similar stuff like Mage Knight and Kingdom: Death more, but pretty pleased I know someone who does.

    Other thoughts: The author(s?) clearly know and respect old pulp adventure material and are re-using it quite successfully. The need to actually scrutinize the tiles to look for resources and clues improves the play experience substantially. I like that there are multiple outcomes for some of the more-significant things you might run into based on map position and not your particular quest. I think including a playable H.P. Lovecraft and Victor Frankenstein was a very silly decision and would not have, but I have to concede they do a good job with each of their character-specific cards. The Lovecraft ones are clever in the way they interact with the Curse mechanics but didn't need to be on him; while the Frankenstein ones are very Frankenstein-y.

    tl;dr: It's fun and I recommend it but it's a very different experience from playing something that's more-challenging mechanically, which most games are.

    My group didn't really encounter the limited inventory problem. you did know about item stacks right? playing 4 players we had the lowest max hand sizes, but me playing Frankenstein let me carry 3 skills, and another guy found an item that if merged into a stack let him have up to 3 extra items in the stack, so we had a decent amount of room. Most of us had a mostly full inventory by our stopping point, so maybe later its more of an issue.

    Yeah. My experience has been that you start out like "This'll be totally fine!" as far as carrying-space but then the item-stacking means you lose slots to build new stuff in and are maintaining forever. See how it goes for you!

    Space... what is the point of it? You have no idea.
    og83npmjgeii.png

  • Ah_PookAh_Pook Registered User regular
    I know there's some fellow Knizia fans here, so let me recommend seeking out a copy of Yangtze from a couple years ago. It's a set collection/auction game with the spending points to buy points of Medici and a little of the press your luck feeling it Ra, but the entire thing is wrapped up in the super tense puzzle of having to stay liquid to be able to bid in auctions when they come up but only being able to sell goods at the beginning of your turn. How long do you hold out making your sets better vs selling now for way less money but you need that money so badly oh no if an auction pops right now I'm screwed oh no oh no! It never came out in English, but you can import a copy from Amazon.de for pretty cheap ($35 shipped I think it was). Knizia still has some fire in him it seems, and I would definitely recommend checking this one out if you're a fan of his style.

    So how could I ever refuse
    I feel like I win when I lose
    jergarmarArcticLancer
  • DashuiDashui Registered User regular
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I'm going to end up sleeving the entire game, too. It's not difficult for these cards to get bent. I've already done it on accident to one card. I figure I'll just order sleeves in spurts over the next five months until the second expansion comes, in which case all of this nonsense will actually fit in the boxes.

    An additional plus is that the sleeves do make it easier to pick through the cards to get the one I need.

    Xbox Live, PSN & Origin: Vacorsis 3DS: 2638-0037-166
  • TimFijiTimFiji Registered User regular
    Dashui wrote: »
    azith28 wrote: »
    Got my 7th Continent core set last Thursday, and played it with my group this weekend. 5 hours went by very quickly. Everyone loved the game, and we cant wait to continue our play, even though we basically got completely lost and have to backtrack to even hope to get back to the objective path :)

    I just ordered a thousand card sleeves for my game. I've never done that before.

    I'm going to end up sleeving the entire game, too. It's not difficult for these cards to get bent. I've already done it on accident to one card. I figure I'll just order sleeves in spurts over the next five months until the second expansion comes, in which case all of this nonsense will actually fit in the boxes.

    An additional plus is that the sleeves do make it easier to pick through the cards to get the one I need.

    What kind of sleeves did you both get?

    Switch: SW-2322-2047-3148
    3DS: 5112-3442-2082
    Learn Japanese through video games!
    Steam: Archpriest
Sign In or Register to comment.