He is going to let more actively bigoted people in government be more actively bigoted while he pretends to care. This is his bog standard response to being asked about things he doesn't care about.
Couscous on
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
A more pressing question constitutionally would be what do you do about trans people who have already had that stuff changed? Your gender doesn't have a fucking asterisk.
Hmm. So I think that this part is super duper double complicated.
Like, I had my birth cert changed. It's an NYC cert and they have great rules; when it's changed for gender reasons they consider it original after the correction. So there's nothing indicating that the cert was ever heavily modified.
But other jurisdictions are totally different, and I've helped others change their info before, so it does sometimes say there is a corrected version.
But we already know that this policy wasn't thought out in any realistic way.
Exactly. That's why if they try to implement this, it might go to SCOTUS
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
See my post above about how businesses and a state like Indiana responded to those types of discriminatory laws
I feel like the GOP and the fundie parts of their base might try this shit, but I don’t think the rest of the country is going to go along with them.
We’re probably mostly in agreement, Viskod, I just have a lot of faith in our people that they won’t let the GOP get away with this.
There are a bunch of reasons why this is going to face lawsuits from day one, and there may not actually be a 5 SCOTUS justice majority.
That's not even getting to the part where saying they are going to do some bastard thing does not mean they are actually going to accomplish said thing.
Evil takes work
I think that Lesbian and Gay marriage etc is safe, BUT, I do worry that transgender rights is in a more fragile state. Hell, its a more complex state of affairs to start with because there are real concerns in relation to biological gender which there aren't in relation to being gay or straight. None of these concerns actually add up to say "Transgender people should not be allowed to express the outwards gender which is right for them and be treated as such", but you can throw real issues into the mix like "If your drivers license says you are a woman, but you are biologically male, won't that be dangerous if you go into surgery at a hospital after a car accident?" and so on. Or, "If you are being patted down at the airport for security, you can request someone of the same gender to do the patdown. What do we do about transgender TSA agents?"
Things like this are actually real things which should be sorted out in a real discussion but they will blunt the outcry from the business community.
Oh, I don't trust any of these fuckers on anything. But the specific issue they've picked here is essentially birth certificates and IDs, which are both state run. This specific policy decision runs into enough interstate law questions that it has to go to SCOTUS (if it is implemented), and the outcome is in doubt, even with Kavanaugh on the court.
The next thing they try could be more heinous, I'm just saying for this one, it was an illconsidered primal scream of stupid bigotry. Which obviously, for this admin.
Also, the answers to your questions are only actually bad faith questions for bigots, and fuck them.
Passports aren't state run though!
The other thing I forgot to say is that Passports collect information based on Birth Certificates and the like, so the tension is still there.
If you think "oh, don't worry about X, they would never do X because it would be so unpopular" then you haven't been paying attention to the last two years.
If you think "oh, don't worry about X, they would never do X because it would be so unpopular" then you haven't been paying attention to the last two years.
Alternately, if you think trump has any grasp of subtlety or nuance so that he can pull this off in a way that actually makes people who aren't utter morons happy...
If you think "oh, don't worry about X, they would never do X because it would be so unpopular" then you haven't been paying attention to the last two years.
Alternately, if you think trump has any grasp of subtlety or nuance so that he can pull this off in a way that actually makes people who aren't utter morons happy...
Doesn't matter if he upsets people if it becomes new established law. The damage is done.
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
If you think "oh, don't worry about X, they would never do X because it would be so unpopular" then you haven't been paying attention to the last two years.
That line of thinking also demonstrates belonging to a group of people who aren't affected by shit like this. That, or you're somehow isolated & protected enough (like through wealth) to not feel the impact.
Even with just the announcement of this, there is damage done. Even if the administration doesn't follow through, the damage is done. Bigots across the country have been signaled by the government that continuing to be bigots is acceptable now.
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
If you think "oh, don't worry about X, they would never do X because it would be so unpopular" then you haven't been paying attention to the last two years.
It's not that it would be unpopular, it's just there's no way this isn't going to court.
So I am worried about it, and angry about it. Because eventually he got his fucking Muslim Ban. It's just that by the time it gets through, we may have a new president.
I will be amazingly sad if there is a 5-4 decision pretending to be based on an originalist interpretation of the Constitution and totally not bigotry.
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ShivahnUnaware of her barrel shifter privilegeWestern coastal temptressRegistered User, Moderatormod
I will be amazingly sad if there is a 5-4 decision pretending to be based on an originalist interpretation of the Constitution and totally not bigotry.
Every decision on trans stuff is frustrating, because the textualist reading of almost any nondiscrimination law includes trans people implicitly when it includes discrimination based on sex. Textualists seem to be basically universally averse to this narrow reading of the text, though :rotate:
I will be amazingly sad if there is a 5-4 decision pretending to be based on an originalist interpretation of the Constitution and totally not bigotry.
Every decision on trans stuff is frustrating, because the textualist reading of almost any nondiscrimination law includes trans people implicitly when it includes discrimination based on sex. Textualists seem to be basically universally averse to this narrow reading of the text, though :rotate:
Textualists are actually Calvinballists in most cases.
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
My reps are backing Trump because I live in TN but it's cool cause I'm going to early vote tomorrow if I'm over this stomach bug and at least try to change that.
I will be amazingly sad if there is a 5-4 decision pretending to be based on an originalist interpretation of the Constitution and totally not bigotry.
Every decision on trans stuff is frustrating, because the textualist reading of almost any nondiscrimination law includes trans people implicitly when it includes discrimination based on sex. Textualists seem to be basically universally averse to this narrow reading of the text, though :rotate:
Textualists are actually Calvinballists in most cases.
According to this dictionary that I helped author...
I really don't see the point in this action beyond trying to score points with the base.
As with so many other horrible actions lately: The cruelty is the point.
Author Malka Older also had another angle, aside from the obvious Base Points+Cruelty Expression: the purposeful denial of reality to make administrating said reality "easier":
some tweets spoilered for "that's a lot of tweets to embed in a row"
This is also part of the "machismo" part of fascism, controlling women, and a backup method of demonizing someone who doesn't fit under any other minority category.
It's probably worth noting that one of the early acts of the Nazis was to burn down the Institut für Sexualwissenschaft, which had pioneered a lot of sex and gender research in the early 20th century, particularly involving transgender people.
That research, as you can imagine, has been literally lost to the flames.
And then, you know, they started tossing gay people and trans folks into the camps as well.
Should we consider someone a bigot if they support trans rights, but would never be in a relationship or even find a trans person attractive or as a valid mate simply because they are trans?
Should we consider someone a bigot if they support trans rights, but would never be in a relationship or even find a trans person attractive or as a valid mate simply because they are trans?
No one gives a shit who you find attractive, go away.
Should we consider someone a bigot if they support trans rights, but would never be in a relationship or even find a trans person attractive or as a valid mate simply because they are trans?
Why the heck does that matter when Republicans are oppressing trans people and trying to define them out of existence?
Are you trying for a “AHA! It is YOU who is the true bigot argument?”
Should we consider someone a bigot if they support trans rights, but would never be in a relationship or even find a trans person attractive or as a valid mate simply because they are trans?
You are in a relationship with an individual, not a population group. Strom Thurmond fathered a daughter with a black woman, but he was still Strom Thurmond.
The longer Trump remains in power, more darkly humorous (and depressing, and infuriating) all the "it's not the end of the world" type of downplaying of him becomming the president gets.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
Should we consider someone a bigot if they support trans rights, but would never be in a relationship or even find a trans person attractive or as a valid mate simply because they are trans?
No more than a straight person who supports gay marriage. Or a gay person who supports straight marriage. Or a white person who supports BLM. Or a man who supports equal pay. Or a gay man who supports womens' suffrage. Or a teetotaler who supports legalization. I could make this post very, very long. One need not have sex with somebody to understand their right to equal treatment under the law.
Edit: History would seem to suggest it's actual an impediment!
The longer Trump remains in power, more darkly humorous (and depressing, and infuriating) all the "it's not the end of the world" type of downplaying of him becomming the president gets.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
Even just looking at fairly recent history, Reagan didn't need to send gay people to literal death camps to do as little as possible about the AIDS crisis and get a lot of people killed as a result.
The longer Trump remains in power, more darkly humorous (and depressing, and infuriating) all the "it's not the end of the world" type of downplaying of him becomming the president gets.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
Even just looking at fairly recent history, Reagan didn't need to send gay people to literal death camps to do as little as possible about the AIDS crisis and get a lot of people killed as a result.
And there are now concentration camps, for children, stolen from their parents...
I'm expecting re education camps anyday now.
The longer Trump remains in power, more darkly humorous (and depressing, and infuriating) all the "it's not the end of the world" type of downplaying of him becomming the president gets.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
Even just looking at fairly recent history, Reagan didn't need to send gay people to literal death camps to do as little as possible about the AIDS crisis and get a lot of people killed as a result.
And there are now concentration camps, for children, stolen from their parents...
I'm expecting re education camps anyday now.
That would be too close to Federal control of education.
Best to sell the children to a bunch of fundamentalist families calling it adoption and let them be brainwashed under the guise of church approved home school.
The longer Trump remains in power, more darkly humorous (and depressing, and infuriating) all the "it's not the end of the world" type of downplaying of him becomming the president gets.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
Even just looking at fairly recent history, Reagan didn't need to send gay people to literal death camps to do as little as possible about the AIDS crisis and get a lot of people killed as a result.
And there are now concentration camps, for children, stolen from their parents...
I'm expecting re education camps anyday now.
That would be too close to Federal control of education.
Best to sell the children to a bunch of fundamentalist families calling it adoption and let them be brainwashed under the guise of church approved home school.
The longer Trump remains in power, more darkly humorous (and depressing, and infuriating) all the "it's not the end of the world" type of downplaying of him becomming the president gets.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
Even just looking at fairly recent history, Reagan didn't need to send gay people to literal death camps to do as little as possible about the AIDS crisis and get a lot of people killed as a result.
And there are now concentration camps, for children, stolen from their parents...
I'm expecting re education camps anyday now.
That would be too close to Federal control of education.
Best to sell the children to a bunch of fundamentalist families calling it adoption and let them be brainwashed under the guise of church approved home school.
I was thinking of re education camps for gays (those kinda laready exist, just in smaller scale), no need for federal government to run them, i'm sure there are plenty of good upstanding christian churches ready and willing to do what is necessary, as long as they are given permission.
The kids, i'm nowhere near optimistic enough to think they'd be given to any families, at all.
I really don't see the point in this action beyond trying to score points with the base.
As with so many other horrible actions lately: The cruelty is the point.
Author Malka Older also had another angle, aside from the obvious Base Points+Cruelty Expression: the purposeful denial of reality to make administrating said reality "easier":
some tweets spoilered for "that's a lot of tweets to embed in a row"
This is a pretty silly take. Making things easier to administer is just a bullshit excuse they are throwing out to justify why they want to discriminate against trans people. And that's mostly because gays are harder to go after these days, so trans people are the new easy target. It does not go beyond that.
I really don't see the point in this action beyond trying to score points with the base.
As with so many other horrible actions lately: The cruelty is the point.
Author Malka Older also had another angle, aside from the obvious Base Points+Cruelty Expression: the purposeful denial of reality to make administrating said reality "easier":
some tweets spoilered for "that's a lot of tweets to embed in a row"
This is a pretty silly take. Making things easier to administer is just a bullshit excuse they are throwing out to justify why they want to discriminate against trans people. And that's mostly because gays are harder to go after these days, so trans people are the new easy target. It does not go beyond that.
Indeed, the only slight point she could be making is that the style of assault they have chosen is shaped to cut off transgender people from their LGB allies and allow them to be assaulted alone.
I mean, I guess and there's a point to be made that there literally are more than 2 combinations of sex chromosomes. XXY exists as does XYY and I think even single X. There are people with XY chromosomes but their genitalia look female and so on. You just quite simply can't shove humans in two 'biological gender' boxes with a simple test because you'll need at least 3 boxes.
Our best hope at the Supreme Court level is Roberts again knowing the writing will be on the wall sooner rather than later on trans acceptance and not wanting this to be his legacy.
The man has abominable views but it does seem at his core he believes in dog whistling rather then doing his evil in the open.
RedTide#1907 on Battle.net
Come Overwatch with meeeee
I was thinking of re education camps for gays (those kinda laready exist, just in smaller scale), no need for federal government to run them, i'm sure there are plenty of good upstanding christian churches ready and willing to do what is necessary, as long as they are given permission.
The kids, i'm nowhere near optimistic enough to think they'd be given to any families, at all.
"Gay conversion" camps, where parents pay tens of thousands to send away their LGBT kids to be raped and tortured to 'cure' them in the name of trickle-down Jesus. Legal in most states in the US and Mike Pence is a supporter of them. Just like the ICE child internment camps and the evangelical adoption agencies they'd get massive government funding if the Dominionists could figure out how to get their way on it.
Meanwhile, Miracle Hill is discriminating with impunity. Beth Lesser, a Jewish parent with 18 years of experience fostering children, was told that not only that she couldn’t foster children from Miracle Hill but she couldn’t even serve as a mentor.
“I’ve never felt that sort of discrimination before,” Lesser told The Intercept. Miracle Hill is also using the foster care system to program children, she said.
“What Miracle Hill does, is they scoop up these kids from foster care, and they have these group homes. And then once they get the kids in there, their whole objective is to indoctrinate them into their brand of Christianity,” Lesser said.
Meanwhile, Miracle Hill is discriminating with impunity. Beth Lesser, a Jewish parent with 18 years of experience fostering children, was told that not only that she couldn’t foster children from Miracle Hill but she couldn’t even serve as a mentor.
“I’ve never felt that sort of discrimination before,” Lesser told The Intercept. Miracle Hill is also using the foster care system to program children, she said.
“What Miracle Hill does, is they scoop up these kids from foster care, and they have these group homes. And then once they get the kids in there, their whole objective is to indoctrinate them into their brand of Christianity,” Lesser said.
“I think that if Trump knew about this in detail, he wouldn’t be for it,” Lesser said. “Because he’s not a religious nut.” She’s a proud supporter of the president — and, she offered, she wanted Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh to be confirmed.
Meanwhile, Miracle Hill is discriminating with impunity. Beth Lesser, a Jewish parent with 18 years of experience fostering children, was told that not only that she couldn’t foster children from Miracle Hill but she couldn’t even serve as a mentor.
“I’ve never felt that sort of discrimination before,” Lesser told The Intercept. Miracle Hill is also using the foster care system to program children, she said.
“What Miracle Hill does, is they scoop up these kids from foster care, and they have these group homes. And then once they get the kids in there, their whole objective is to indoctrinate them into their brand of Christianity,” Lesser said.
Meanwhile, Miracle Hill is discriminating with impunity. Beth Lesser, a Jewish parent with 18 years of experience fostering children, was told that not only that she couldn’t foster children from Miracle Hill but she couldn’t even serve as a mentor.
“I’ve never felt that sort of discrimination before,” Lesser told The Intercept. Miracle Hill is also using the foster care system to program children, she said.
“What Miracle Hill does, is they scoop up these kids from foster care, and they have these group homes. And then once they get the kids in there, their whole objective is to indoctrinate them into their brand of Christianity,” Lesser said.
“I think that if Trump knew about this in detail, he wouldn’t be for it,” Lesser said. “Because he’s not a religious nut.” She’s a proud supporter of the president — and, she offered, she wanted Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh to be confirmed.
She’s a proud supporter of the president
"I never thought these lions would eat my face!"
It's just as dumb every time I hear people say that...
Meanwhile, Miracle Hill is discriminating with impunity. Beth Lesser, a Jewish parent with 18 years of experience fostering children, was told that not only that she couldn’t foster children from Miracle Hill but she couldn’t even serve as a mentor.
“I’ve never felt that sort of discrimination before,” Lesser told The Intercept. Miracle Hill is also using the foster care system to program children, she said.
“What Miracle Hill does, is they scoop up these kids from foster care, and they have these group homes. And then once they get the kids in there, their whole objective is to indoctrinate them into their brand of Christianity,” Lesser said.
“I think that if Trump knew about this in detail, he wouldn’t be for it,” Lesser said. “Because he’s not a religious nut.” She’s a proud supporter of the president — and, she offered, she wanted Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh to be confirmed.
I did the bare minimum and voted Yes in MA on Q3 to keep the existing bathroom rights law. I don't think it's in danger of failing but fuck this society for even asking to repeal it.
Posts
He is going to let more actively bigoted people in government be more actively bigoted while he pretends to care. This is his bog standard response to being asked about things he doesn't care about.
Exactly. That's why if they try to implement this, it might go to SCOTUS
The other thing I forgot to say is that Passports collect information based on Birth Certificates and the like, so the tension is still there.
My governor
What's your rep saying? If it's nothing, maybe write them and demand a response and action.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Alternately, if you think trump has any grasp of subtlety or nuance so that he can pull this off in a way that actually makes people who aren't utter morons happy...
Doesn't matter if he upsets people if it becomes new established law. The damage is done.
pleasepaypreacher.net
Even with just the announcement of this, there is damage done. Even if the administration doesn't follow through, the damage is done. Bigots across the country have been signaled by the government that continuing to be bigots is acceptable now.
It's not that it would be unpopular, it's just there's no way this isn't going to court.
So I am worried about it, and angry about it. Because eventually he got his fucking Muslim Ban. It's just that by the time it gets through, we may have a new president.
Every decision on trans stuff is frustrating, because the textualist reading of almost any nondiscrimination law includes trans people implicitly when it includes discrimination based on sex. Textualists seem to be basically universally averse to this narrow reading of the text, though :rotate:
Textualists are actually Calvinballists in most cases.
According to this dictionary that I helped author...
Author Malka Older also had another angle, aside from the obvious Base Points+Cruelty Expression: the purposeful denial of reality to make administrating said reality "easier":
some tweets spoilered for "that's a lot of tweets to embed in a row"
It's probably worth noting that one of the early acts of the Nazis was to burn down the Institut für Sexualwissenschaft, which had pioneered a lot of sex and gender research in the early 20th century, particularly involving transgender people.
That research, as you can imagine, has been literally lost to the flames.
And then, you know, they started tossing gay people and trans folks into the camps as well.
No one gives a shit who you find attractive, go away.
Why the heck does that matter when Republicans are oppressing trans people and trying to define them out of existence?
Are you trying for a “AHA! It is YOU who is the true bigot argument?”
You are in a relationship with an individual, not a population group. Strom Thurmond fathered a daughter with a black woman, but he was still Strom Thurmond.
Yes, it could have been worse, and it has gotten worse everyday since.
And it will keep getting worse until there is a congress willing to stop him.
No more than a straight person who supports gay marriage. Or a gay person who supports straight marriage. Or a white person who supports BLM. Or a man who supports equal pay. Or a gay man who supports womens' suffrage. Or a teetotaler who supports legalization. I could make this post very, very long. One need not have sex with somebody to understand their right to equal treatment under the law.
Edit: History would seem to suggest it's actual an impediment!
Even just looking at fairly recent history, Reagan didn't need to send gay people to literal death camps to do as little as possible about the AIDS crisis and get a lot of people killed as a result.
I'm expecting re education camps anyday now.
That would be too close to Federal control of education.
Best to sell the children to a bunch of fundamentalist families calling it adoption and let them be brainwashed under the guise of church approved home school.
MWO: Adamski
They can also decide to support adoption agencies that refuse to place children with non-Protestant families and gay families.
The kids, i'm nowhere near optimistic enough to think they'd be given to any families, at all.
This is a pretty silly take. Making things easier to administer is just a bullshit excuse they are throwing out to justify why they want to discriminate against trans people. And that's mostly because gays are harder to go after these days, so trans people are the new easy target. It does not go beyond that.
Indeed, the only slight point she could be making is that the style of assault they have chosen is shaped to cut off transgender people from their LGB allies and allow them to be assaulted alone.
I mean, I guess and there's a point to be made that there literally are more than 2 combinations of sex chromosomes. XXY exists as does XYY and I think even single X. There are people with XY chromosomes but their genitalia look female and so on. You just quite simply can't shove humans in two 'biological gender' boxes with a simple test because you'll need at least 3 boxes.
The man has abominable views but it does seem at his core he believes in dog whistling rather then doing his evil in the open.
Come Overwatch with meeeee
Maybe they thought that a survey that asked if you were Male, Female, or Other would have made there Othering a little too obvious?
"Gay conversion" camps, where parents pay tens of thousands to send away their LGBT kids to be raped and tortured to 'cure' them in the name of trickle-down Jesus. Legal in most states in the US and Mike Pence is a supporter of them. Just like the ICE child internment camps and the evangelical adoption agencies they'd get massive government funding if the Dominionists could figure out how to get their way on it.
https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2018/10/first-wanted-discriminate-gay-lesbian-parents-now-jewish-parents/
https://theintercept.com/2018/10/19/south-carolina-foster-parent-discrimination-miracle-hill-ministries/
"I never thought these lions would eat my face!"
Shows what you know, I'm not an orphan either!
It's just as dumb every time I hear people say that...
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-45834417
"Mexican man refuses to give up lions on his terrace"
Non-elliptical circles are now illegal.