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There Once Was A Man From Nantucket

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Posts

  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Yes of course I know the poem
    Hmmm. Does Columbo have two eyes or one is an exceedingly good point.

    Kinda like, does Scotty on Star Trek TOS have all his fingers?

    This coincidentally came up on Twitter over the weekend

    In "A Trace of Murder", Columbo remarks while asking somebody to help him look around, "three eyes are better than one". Therefore, I submit that Columbo only had one eye

    He's also talked about being a bad marksman, getting another officer to take the police shooting test for him, but admittedly a lot of people close one eye when shooting so it's not iron-clad evidence

    Anzekay on
    [Muffled sounds of gorilla violence]
  • OlivawOlivaw good name, isn't it? the foot of mt fujiRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    Hmmm. Does Columbo have two eyes or one is an exceedingly good point.

    Kinda like, does Scotty on Star Trek TOS have all his fingers?

    This coincidentally came up on Twitter over the weekend

    In "A Trace of Murder", Columbo remarks while asking somebody to help him look around, "three eyes are better than one". Therefore, I submit that Columbo only had one eye

    He's also talked about being a bad marksman, getting another officer to take the police shooting test for him, but admittedly a lot of people close one eye when shooting so it's not iron-clad evidence

    Columbo didn’t even carry a gun, if I remember right

    I’m not sure if that was because he was a bad shot or because he hated violence, though

    Anzekay on
    signature-deffo.jpg
    PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
  • PinfeldorfPinfeldorf Yeah ZestRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    Yes of course I know the poem
    Man, I'd be curious to see how Vic Mackie scores on this list. Can anyone get a legit -10?

    Anzekay on
  • WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    What about Jake Peralta

    very much a cop

    I'll give him a little bit of slack because he recognises the system is horribly broken. But not a lot of slack because he's still an enthusiastic part of that system.

    I'd give Jake Peralta about a -9 on the Cop Scale.

    Anzekay on
  • StronginthearmStronginthearm Hi, I'm Liam! with broken glassesRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    As a kid, I watched a priest and nun duo solving crime, and for the life of me, I can't remember the name of it.

    EDIT: Also, Rebus, Life on Mars, and Waking the Dead.

    Anzekay on
    my backloggery 3DS: 0533-5338-5186 steam: porcelain_cow goodreads
  • WeedLordVegetaWeedLordVegeta Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Kyle Hyde might be the highest scoring video game detective, I have to rank him later

    Anzekay on
  • WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    As a kid, I watched a priest and nun duo solving crime, and for the life of me, I can't remember the name of it.

    Cadfael? No, he wasn't a priest I believe, and I think I remember his sidekick being a novice.

    Anzekay on
  • SnicketysnickSnicketysnick The Greatest Hype Man in WesterosRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    As a kid, I watched a priest and nun duo solving crime, and for the life of me, I can't remember the name of it.

    Cadfael? No, he wasn't a priest I believe, and I think I remember his sidekick being a novice.

    Father Dowling

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nDjPiqIjPw

    iirc his sidekick was suspiciously good at things like lockpicking

    Anzekay on
    7qmGNt5.png
  • Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    would Phoenix Wright count as a detective?

    Anzekay on
  • StiltsStilts Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    would Phoenix Wright count as a detective?

    If you wanted to include the AA series then Gumshoe would be the guy you’d need to rate.

    I, uh, don’t think his score would be particularly good.

    Anzekay on
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  • Dex DynamoDex Dynamo Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    I also was unaware of the exact wording of the poem
    Here is where I break from the thread an GO TOO FAR, and say "a TV Detective is anyone who solves mysteries on a recurring basis"

    Anzekay on
  • MaddocMaddoc I'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother? Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Phoenix Wright is definitely a detective by the criteria laid out

    He solves crimes!

    Like Jessica Fletcher, Matlock, And Dr. Mark Sloan aren't technically detectives. But also they're totally detectives.

    Anzekay on
  • HoukHouk Nipples The EchidnaRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    I also was unaware of the exact wording of the poem
    I think I'm okay with classifying Phoenix Wright as a detective. He is technically a lawyer, but practically speaking half of his job is basically private eye work and pretty much every case comes down to him interviewing people, collecting evidence, and piecing everything together to unravel a mysterious death and expose the real killer against all odds.

    Gumshoe is basically the same as Lassiter from Psych - he's a detective in that setting, but not the detective.

    Anzekay on
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Olivaw wrote: »
    Hmmm. Does Columbo have two eyes or one is an exceedingly good point.

    Kinda like, does Scotty on Star Trek TOS have all his fingers?

    This coincidentally came up on Twitter over the weekend

    In "A Trace of Murder", Columbo remarks while asking somebody to help him look around, "three eyes are better than one". Therefore, I submit that Columbo only had one eye

    He's also talked about being a bad marksman, getting another officer to take the police shooting test for him, but admittedly a lot of people close one eye when shooting so it's not iron-clad evidence

    Columbo didn’t even carry a gun, if I remember right

    I’m not sure if that was because he was a bad shot or because he hated violence, though

    Columbo was also a Lieutenant, which is above a rank and file kind of guy? So it could just be he didn't carry because he didn't need to?

    Anzekay on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • Librarian's ghostLibrarian's ghost Librarian, Ghostbuster, and TimSpork Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Dex Dynamo wrote: »
    Here is where I break from the thread an GO TOO FAR, and say "a TV Detective is anyone who solves mysteries on a recurring basis"

    All of us reference librarians then!

    Anzekay on
    (Switch Friend Code) SW-4910-9735-6014(PSN) timspork (Steam) timspork (XBox) Timspork


  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Preacher wrote: »
    Olivaw wrote: »
    Hmmm. Does Columbo have two eyes or one is an exceedingly good point.

    Kinda like, does Scotty on Star Trek TOS have all his fingers?

    This coincidentally came up on Twitter over the weekend

    In "A Trace of Murder", Columbo remarks while asking somebody to help him look around, "three eyes are better than one". Therefore, I submit that Columbo only had one eye

    He's also talked about being a bad marksman, getting another officer to take the police shooting test for him, but admittedly a lot of people close one eye when shooting so it's not iron-clad evidence

    Columbo didn’t even carry a gun, if I remember right

    I’m not sure if that was because he was a bad shot or because he hated violence, though

    Columbo was also a Lieutenant, which is above a rank and file kind of guy? So it could just be he didn't carry because he didn't need to?

    I see Columbo as a Bosch type. He gets that the LAPD is fucked up, and he deals with it by keeping to himself, staying clean, establishing his own identity, and fucking with his asshole coworkers when the opportunity comes up. He's not an outright rebel, but he's still an outsider.

    Anzekay on
  • Desert LeviathanDesert Leviathan Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Because we've got a lot of FFXIV players in here, and because it's the most recent detective fiction I've watched...

    Inspector Hildibrand Manderville

    Effective: 4, and that's being generous. Hildibrand has on occasion tripped and fallen face-first into a clue, but most of his success comes from his uncanny ability to draw much more competent people into his orbit, like Inspector Briardien, or the Warrior of Light. Unlike the typical "clueless boss, clever subordinate" dynamic, Hildibrand's assistant Nashu Mhakaracca is also rock-bottom stupid, and generally serves to enable his most chaotic impulses.
    Compassionate: 3. On the one hand, Hildibrand seems to hurl himself into other people's problems with no regard for personal safety, and I can't actually recall him ever asking for payment. On the other hand, his motivation for doing so is his overwhelming self-absorption. He cares about people's problems only because they provide him an opportunity to display his own (imagined) prowess.
    Cop: -7. In Hildibrand's defense, he is about as aware of cops as he is of anyone who isn't himself, which is to say he only notices them when he needs an audience to brag to. He thinks he's a valued ally to all law enforcement - they mostly forget that he exists, except when he's being an immediate nuisance. He loses additional points because in Kugane he goes to great lengths to help a young man enlist in the Sekiseigumi, the most Cop-ass Cops in the setting.
    Flexible: 3. A juggernaut of ignorant confidence, Hildibrand is just too damn dumb to realize how bad he is at everything. Mostly this leads to slapstick failures, but sometimes his sheer audacity is disorienting enough to be useful. At the very least, he never seems uncomfortable in changing circumstances. Unless his parents show up.
    Entertaining: 7. Look at this goofy asshole. I can't wait to see what he gets up to in Norvrandt. I think his shenanigans would wear thin as like a weekly TV show, but as a short quest line parceled out over each new game expansion, he's great.
    c5akx5l0jc0c.jpg

    Total: 10

    Anzekay on
    Realizing lately that I don't really trust or respect basically any of the moderators here. So, good luck with life, friends! Hit me up on Twitter @DesertLeviathan
  • WeedLordVegetaWeedLordVegeta Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Maddoc wrote: »
    Phoenix Wright is definitely a detective by the criteria laid out

    He solves crimes!

    Like Jessica Fletcher, Matlock, And Dr. Mark Sloan aren't technically detectives. But also they're totally detectives.

    Phoenix is a lawyer who is also his own private investigator, rather than a lawyer who contracts out those services like Matlock

    Anzekay on
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Preacher wrote: »
    Olivaw wrote: »
    Hmmm. Does Columbo have two eyes or one is an exceedingly good point.

    Kinda like, does Scotty on Star Trek TOS have all his fingers?

    This coincidentally came up on Twitter over the weekend

    In "A Trace of Murder", Columbo remarks while asking somebody to help him look around, "three eyes are better than one". Therefore, I submit that Columbo only had one eye

    He's also talked about being a bad marksman, getting another officer to take the police shooting test for him, but admittedly a lot of people close one eye when shooting so it's not iron-clad evidence

    Columbo didn’t even carry a gun, if I remember right

    I’m not sure if that was because he was a bad shot or because he hated violence, though

    Columbo was also a Lieutenant, which is above a rank and file kind of guy? So it could just be he didn't carry because he didn't need to?

    I see Columbo as a Bosch type. He gets that the LAPD is fucked up, and he deals with it by keeping to himself, staying clean, establishing his own identity, and fucking with his asshole coworkers when the opportunity comes up. He's not an outright rebel, but he's still an outsider.

    Yeah anytime Columbo seems to have an interaction with other officers its always kind of terse to say the least, outside of like the patrol officers.

    Though I don't think he ever quit the LAPD like Bosch has.

    Anzekay on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Yes of course I know the poem
    Dex Dynamo wrote: »
    Here is where I break from the thread an GO TOO FAR, and say "a TV Detective is anyone who solves mysteries on a recurring basis"

    All of us reference librarians then!

    And us tax compliance officers!

    Back in the contact centre, I would solve The Case of the Incorrect Tax Code 20-30 times a day

    These days it's more The Riddle of the Incomplete Corporate Interest Restriction Form, or The Mystery of What the Fuck Is a Limited Liability Partnership Extra-Statutory Arrangement

    Anzekay on
    [Muffled sounds of gorilla violence]
  • tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited April 10
    I also was unaware of the exact wording of the poem
    Everyone in the lab regularly has to solve the mystery of "Where did Amazon deliver our packages?" It's like the worlds most irritating scavenger hunt.
    My favourite is the always-helpful clue: "Package was handed to a resident." Like, one of the mice?

    Anzekay on
  • HoukHouk Nipples The EchidnaRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    I also was unaware of the exact wording of the poem
    Okay, Phoenix Wright!

    Effectiveness: 12. I had to decide whether to rate just Phoenix, or include all of his friends and random helpers. I decided to stick to Phoenix, in which case his individual effectiveness is extremely hit or miss. Sometimes he's able to make incredible intuitive leaps of logic (which in gameplay terms is often total bullshit, that's the clue I was supposed to notice!?), sometimes the answer is obvious and he's stone-cold stupid and needs Mia or Maya or whoever else to pop in and be like hey dummy, how did you not notice this? But he always gets it in the end, so gets a slightly-above-average rating.
    Compassion: 10. As a defense attorney, he always fully believes his client is innocent (which conveniently they always are) and won't stop till he proves it. He's idealistic, passionate, and genuinely cares about the people around him.
    Cop: 0. In just about every case, he's actively fighting against a law enforcement force that's already decided his client is guilty. Gumshoe isn't his antagonist exactly, but Phoenix generally ends up having to do his job for him while the cops fumble around and get everything wrong.
    Flexibility: 5. This one's kind of tough, because most of his flexibility/improvisation happens in the courtroom, not in his role as detective. He regularly has crucial flashes of insight during trials that lead to dramatic revelations. That being said, when it comes to investigating he's pretty straightforward and timid, relying on the people around him to push him into taking the necessary steps to figure things out.
    Entertainingness: 7. This is more of a judgment of the games overall. A good portion of the games can be super tedious and frustrating, but when it's good, it's VERY good. Again though, all the most entertaining parts generally happen in court and not during his detective work.

    Final score: 34. He's dedicated and stubborn in a good way, but without an ensemble of smarties around him he wouldn't be nearly as successful. He's also one of the few detectives who has basically no connection to the cops, which helps bring his rating up.

    Anzekay on
  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    TheStig wrote: »
    Someone needs to make a show about a detective whose just dog shit. Like they solve 1 in 20 crimes. Real obvious shit too where you're just screaming at the TV screen telling him the butler did it and he's like "welp, another unsolved mystery."

    "Eh, it is probably the black guy. Arrest him!"

    Anzekay on
  • DelzhandDelzhand Coin Return Admin Registered User, Transition Team regular
    edited April 10
    wandering wrote: »
    Are we allowed to talk about anime detectives in here

    ydghh71zapoa.jpg

    I don't know shit about Detective Conan but this cracks me up every time

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fh2u8gXX24U

    Anzekay on
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] regular
    edited April 10
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    Anzekay on
  • PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    https://youtu.be/tmsXPbyhPNQ

    Speaking of Columbo clowning on rich dudes.

    What I like highlighted by the conclusion is Columbo gets things wrong. It happens routinely on cases, he makes assumptions that facts don't bear out, and then moves on to new theories. Its something a lot of Sherlock based shows could serve to use.

    Anzekay on
    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
  • shalmeloshalmelo sees no evil Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    I want to change my poll answer to "he has his own boardgame", please

    Anzekay on
    Steam ID: Shalmelo || LoL: melo2boogaloo || tweets
  • ouzaruouzaru RIESLING OCEANRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    shalmelo wrote: »
    I want to change my poll answer to "he has his own boardgame", please


    “Can you draw Columbo?“

    “...I mean, I can draw MOST of Columbo.”

    Probably to avoid paying for Peter Falk’s likeness.

    Anzekay on
  • Rorshach BastardRorshach Bastard that crustache life Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Anzekay on
  • shalmeloshalmelo sees no evil Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    sarukun wrote: »

    “Can you draw Columbo?“

    “...I mean, I can draw MOST of Columbo.”

    Probably to avoid paying for Peter Falk’s likeness.

    Saves them money and also makes it look like he is just about to leave, which probably captures the essence of the character better than if that artist had taken a crack at Falk's mug

    Anzekay on
    Steam ID: Shalmelo || LoL: melo2boogaloo || tweets
  • Donovan PuppyfuckerDonovan Puppyfucker A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    edited April 10
    I wonder if it has some sort of "just one more thing" game mechanic, and how that would work.

    Anzekay on
  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Yes of course I know the poem
    Maybe as an interrupt card

    Anzekay on
    [Muffled sounds of gorilla violence]
  • Indie WinterIndie Winter die Krähe Rudi Hurzlmeier (German, b. 1952)Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Columbo has a relatively unique narrative structure.

    The murderer is the main character. You see them do it, watch them cover it up, and learn what they had to gain. They think they’ve won.

    Then Columbo arrives. He circles the killer, unassuming and apparently bumbling at first but always showing up at the worst time, asking questions about things he shouldn’t know, wearing down their certainty.

    The audience knows the whole time that Columbo knows and will never stop. The pleasure is watching the murderer figure this out too.

    This would, incidentally, be the perfect narrative structure for an Agent 47 focused tv show

    Anzekay on
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  • wanderingwandering Russia state-affiliated media Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    (Just one more thing...)

    So Columbo is free on Amazon (albeit with annoying and unblockable ads), and I watched the first episode. (Prescription: Murder. 1968.) I enjoyed it! Thoughts:

    -The psychedelic Rorschach test credits animation is very 60's

    -Peter Falk is very young in this, holy cow

    9WKzrVP.jpg?1

    -This episode spends a lot of time on the setup and execution of the murder. Like, Columbo doesn't show up until halfway through. My vague sense is that in future episodes he's going to be much more center stage, but I dig the structure of this ep. Reminds me of Dial M For Murder (although this episode suffers from that comparison somewhat because boy do I love Dial M For Murder.)

    -Making the killer a smug, successful psychotherapist very much plays into my own biases. (I was actually *just* arguing online with a smug, successful psychologist who is a big supporter of some discredited old theories about trans people.) (I know, not all psychologists, etc)

    -I watched the clip that was posted earlier in this thread from the end of the 90's episode Columbo Cries Wolf, and it bugged me how cavalier Columbo was about the murder. It ends with Columbo smiling and going "gotcha" while holding the dangling arm of a dead woman and I'm like what the heck is wrong with you, Columbo. This episode takes things more seriously and you get the sense that Columbo has a strong moral center and actually, you know, cares about people getting murdered. (Although I guess it's hard to know 100% what he's really thinking because his whole thing is that he's constantly putting on a bit of a show for the murderer.)

    @Jacobkosh

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  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited April 10
    How had I missed this wonderful thread before!

    :stares intently at @wandering:

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  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited April 10
    So I've been catching up on the thread and
    Psykoma wrote: »
    Is columbo better or worse than morse?

    Better

    I never got on with Morse, and his informed flaw of alcoholism that never seemed to affect anything and the way that you could tell which woman dunnit by whether he fancied them or not

    Endeavour was good, though, mainly because Roger Allam is in it and he has a voice like sexy treacle

    ...I want to speak up for Morse here, because I really like his stories and I like the character and empathize with him.

    I feel like his alcoholism does affect things and have consequences. He's a functional alcoholic, which is a real thing, so he's not some kind of...dumpster fire of a person in imminent danger of collapse, but I feel like his life is visibly lonelier and shabbier than it could be if he wasn't drinking. I mean, he drinks because he's lonely, but he has a hard time getting along with people because he's constantly kind of irritable, impatient, and low-key bitchy and I feel like the drinking has to be at least a proximate cause of that.

    It never comes to a big dramatic head (at least in the ones I've seen) but that feels realistic to me. Lots of people seem to toddle along through life half-impaired but are lucky or conscientious enough to never reach full-blown crisis.

    But all that aside, I have feels for Morse because he's a romantic and an idealist who wants to see beauty and value in life and his impatience comes at least in part from the ways the people he's exposed to disappoint that hope. It's a quality he shares with Philip Marlowe, another one of my favorite detectives.

    Also his show has one of the best theme songs ever written

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u20sVtCxf_8

    (it's definitely true about the fancying ladies, though. lol)

    Anzekay on
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    edited April 10
    I also love Morse for how fiercely he clings to the things he loves and which define him - his old cars, his jazz, his art and poetry - in a police culture that is at best bemused by, or outright hostile to those things, and despite what it costs him in terms of people finding him aloof, stodgy, pretentious etc.

    Anzekay on
  • Rhesus PositiveRhesus Positive GNU Terry Pratchett Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Yes of course I know the poem
    Hmm

    You may have turned me around on Morse as a character to the point that I now empathise with him as well

    Oh shit, it’s too late in the day for an epiphany, I have to be up in eight hours to go to my job investigating wrongdoing and thinking the worst of people despite hoping that they’re basically good and honourable then come back to the isolation that is my house

    ...

    Fuuuuck


    Also if people like crime drama they should watch Guilt on the BBC

    Just four episodes but it’s completely gripping

    Anzekay on
    [Muffled sounds of gorilla violence]
  • wanderingwandering Russia state-affiliated media Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    And onto episode 2 of Columbo (or the second pilot, or the first pilot after the first TV movie, or whatever the heck it technically is): "Ransom for a Dead Man" (1971).

    9g873671v4j8.jpg

    I'm less fond of this one, though it has its moments. Like I was expecting (based on my limited exposure to the series) the focus has shifted away from the murderer and onto Columbo, a change I'm not sure that I like. Sure, the episode still begins with the murder, but it's over and done with quickly, and there isn't that fun-yet-uncomfortable sense of you-the-audience-member being a silent co-conspirator in the killing. Columbo also raises his suspicions about the killer way earlier here, which I think also makes things less interesting. I liked the slow burn in the first one: the fact that Columbo either didn't suspect the husband at first, or else kept his cards close to his chest.

    Also: boy is this episode sexist. Let's see: 1. The killer is an evil, money-grubbing, interloping female lawyer, who essentially steals an honorable male lawyer's rightful position in the workplace. 2. Columbo mentions that he doesn't think he could work for a woman, and there's no indication that he's being insincere. 3. The killer's step-daughter, who teams up with Columbo, mockingly calls the killer a "lady lawyer". I think the writers were maybe working through some anxiety about women in the workplace...


    Incidentally, I looked up the guest star murderer, Lee Grant, and she's had an interesting career. I added this to my to-watch list:
    Wikipedia wrote:
    What Sex Am I? is a 1985 documentary film directed by Academy Award winner Lee Grant. The film follows a group of transgender individuals in mid-1980's America. Originally aired on HBO, the film is notable for its educated and sympathetic treatment of its subject, more in line with 21st century sentiment than those of the 1980s.

    Anzekay on
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