I suppose they could, hypothetically, create a sort of mini-hard drive that plugs in through the GBA slot, has the DSi's browser and store pre-loaded, and can be used to save games onto. However, I wouldn't want to begin to imagine the premium price that would have to have, and whether it would be worth it to do that instead of just buying the DSi.
Or they could, hypothetically, create a GBA slot accessory that has an SD reader, and bundle it with a DS game card that overwrites your old DS firmware. This is a lot more likely than a mini-HDD add-on, and could easily be priced around $50.
I don't think either will happen.
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Also, I think it's assinine in that the DSi isnt different enough from the DS to require the distinction.
That's bullshit. The DS Lite is far less different from the regular DS, but people ate that motherfucker up.
They didn't call the lite a third pillar either.
It isn't different enough to be considered a new line, it's just a DS with a few extras. So no, not bullshit.
It's bullshit if anyone says the added features are less than the added feature jump the DS Lite made. I don't care about whether or not they are useful to you. The point is the upgrade is bigger than what the DS Lite's upgrade over the original DS.
So the PS3s that don't have PS2 BC are new devices. Gotcha.
No, but PS3s that could play new games that - say -the 20GB and 60GB models could not play would be new devices.
So why isn't the BC-less machines new devices? By your definition, new devices are hardware revisions that make some games incompatible. Your hypothetical version of the DSi does that. The BC-less PS3 does that. So what's the difference? Technically speaking, of course.
Because PS2 games are not PS3 games. They bear different brands for a reason. BC is a bonus, and at least for me, not an expected or required feature of the device (in my opinion). When I pick up a PS2 game I expect it to play in a PS2. When I buy a SNES game I expect it to work in a SNES. I don't buy NES games and expect them to work in my SNES (although it would be pretty neat).
These downloadable games are not DS games. These are games previously released on a different platform, available for purchase on your DS. Essentially, just like the VC, they are digitally distributed Backwards-compatibility. Therefore, in your arguement, that would not make this a new device. It's simply a different means of obtaining the backwards compatible titles.
Now, if they start releasing DSi games, then it is indeed, a new device.
My Wii VC games are Wii games. You know why? Because I have to use my Wii to play them. Similarly any games available via the DSi store will be DSi games. You know why? Because you will need a DSi to play them.
Hell, my copy of Streets of Rage 2 is a 360 game. Sure there's a version of it on the Genesis, but I can't play it on that. Because I bought the 360 one. The simple fact that I have to turn on my 360 in order to play it makes it a 360 game. Just because Gradius was originally released on the NES doesn't magically make my copy on the Wii a NES game. It's a Wii game that plays only on the Wii system.
Bearing in mind a new WarioWare game has traditionally been all about showing off a new input device, I wouldn't be suprised if this new game is 'WarioWare:Camera Crazies!!!' or something similar. An idea I for one, quite like.
But enough about this DSi nonsense. New Picross? 3D PICROSS?? Someone please link me to details ASAP.
Also, I think it's assinine in that the DSi isnt different enough from the DS to require the distinction.
That's bullshit. The DS Lite is far less different from the regular DS, but people ate that motherfucker up.
They didn't call the lite a third pillar either.
It isn't different enough to be considered a new line, it's just a DS with a few extras. So no, not bullshit.
It's bullshit if anyone says the added features are less than the added feature jump the DS Lite made. I don't care about whether or not they are useful to you. The point is the upgrade is bigger than what the DS Lite's upgrade over the original DS.
Except I didnt say that. I said it isnt different enough to warrant the distinction of being a "third pillar". This is what happens when you quote single sentences out of context.
These downloadable games are not DS games. These are games previously released on a different platform, available for purchase on your DS. Essentially, just like the VC, they are digitally distributed Backwards-compatibility. Therefore, in your arguement, that would not make this a new device. It's simply a different means of obtaining the backwards compatible titles.
Now, if they start releasing DSi games, then it is indeed, a new device.
Do we have an official source yet on what the downloadable games are going to be? Things I've been reading haven't said officially anything about the content, only that there's going to be some kind of app store.
Also, I think it's assinine in that the DSi isnt different enough from the DS to require the distinction.
That's bullshit. The DS Lite is far less different from the regular DS, but people ate that motherfucker up.
They didn't call the lite a third pillar either.
It isn't different enough to be considered a new line, it's just a DS with a few extras. So no, not bullshit.
It's bullshit if anyone says the added features are less than the added feature jump the DS Lite made. I don't care about whether or not they are useful to you. The point is the upgrade is bigger than what the DS Lite's upgrade over the original DS.
Except I didnt say that. I said it isnt different enough to warrant the distinction of being a "third pillar". This is what happens when you quote single sentences out of context.
I was responding to your "So no, not bullshit" statement specifically. In any event, I hope you were as critical about the DS Lite as you are about this. But like you said, third pillar.
What the heck does "third pillar" mean? Never seen that phrase before now.
Also, I think it's assinine in that the DSi isnt different enough from the DS to require the distinction.
That's bullshit. The DS Lite is far less different from the regular DS, but people ate that motherfucker up.
They didn't call the lite a third pillar either.
It isn't different enough to be considered a new line, it's just a DS with a few extras. So no, not bullshit.
It's bullshit if anyone says the added features are less than the added feature jump the DS Lite made. I don't care about whether or not they are useful to you. The point is the upgrade is bigger than what the DS Lite's upgrade over the original DS.
Except I didnt say that. I said it isnt different enough to warrant the distinction of being a "third pillar". This is what happens when you quote single sentences out of context.
I was responding to your "So no, not bullshit" statement specifically. In any event, I hope you were as critical about the DS Lite as you are about this. But like you said, third pillar.
What the heck does "third pillar" mean? Never seen that phrase before now.
They used it when they were pretending that the Game Boy wasn't dead. At that point their 3 pillars were (I believe) GameCube, GBA, and DS.
These downloadable games are not DS games. These are games previously released on a different platform, available for purchase on your DS. Essentially, just like the VC, they are digitally distributed Backwards-compatibility. Therefore, in your arguement, that would not make this a new device. It's simply a different means of obtaining the backwards compatible titles.
Now, if they start releasing DSi games, then it is indeed, a new device.
Do we have an official source yet on what the downloadable games are going to be? Things I've been reading haven't said officially anything about the content, only that there's going to be some kind of app store.
I was going to say that hours ago but didn't want to be the guy to do it.
Someone's gotta take the bait, baby!
No, there's not been anything official that I've seen. This is why this arguement is going nowhere, because we are both going off speculation. All I was trying to say is that the DS will still be able to play DS games released after the release of the DSi. It probably doesn't help that in the course of our debate, I've changed how I see the handheld as a whole. I don't really see it as a slight upgrade, or new iteration. I truly do see it as more of a "DS 1.5." It has some whole new features that are not even capable of being done on the previous DS, and allows for, even if its not implemented, new gameplay features. That said, I believe that if it turns out that the DSi can play games that the DS can't, it's justifiable.
Hell, if nothing else, the $179.99 price point tells me its more than just a minor upgrade. If I'm not mistaken, didn't the DS Lite retail for very close to what the DS was at the time of the Lite's release?
And now they are trying to say the Wii, DS, and DSi are their three pillars. And I said it was assinine that they think the DSi is so vastly different than the DS to warrant the distinction.
I also said in my post that I like some of the features. It's definately a step up, just not as much as I would have liked. Seems like they are kind of jumping the gun and should just wait and release a DS2 down the road, with more graphical power in addition to the other things.
Is the screen's resolution bigger on the DSi? Because browsing the internet on a DS is clumsy at best. Can't see shit you constantly have to be zoomed in way too much.
And now they are trying to say the Wii, DS, and DSi are their three pillars. And I said it was assinine that they think the DSi is so vastly different than the DS to warrant the distinction.
I also said in my post that I like some of the features. It's definately a step up, just not as much as I would have liked. Seems like they are kind of jumping the gun and should just wait and release a DS2 down the road, with more graphical power in addition to the other things.
As much as I already know I'm going to buy this, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I really wish they would've just waited and actually created a whole new device with increased graphical power and resolution, while including all of the features of the DSi. As for the camera, I thought maybe it was to compete with the iPhone, but seriously, a 0.3 MP camera? What the hell kind of pictures are you going to take with that? Why even bother?
- DSi shop service bringing two redesigned Brain Age games
Well, it looks like the DSi will indeed have exclusive non-retro games!
- store songs on SD card, uses AAC format
Wait, no MP3 support?
EDIT: Here's what's here so far:
Denise Kaigler takes the stage
- information is embargoed until Monday, but live blog is permitted
- Reggie takes the stage
- event is all about core, classic, expanded audience, and Wii
- DSi shop service bringing two redesigned Brain Age games
- two cameras confirmed once again
- real time imaging software
- store songs on SD card, uses AAC format
- built-in software for controlling pitch, speed, audio filters, and more
- record voice through mic, and change playback speed and pitch
- all of these camera/music options are pre-loaded
- play sound in games at louder volume
- opera browser reconfirmed
- DSi will not hit North America until ‘well into’ 2009 because the DS Lite is still selling at phenomenal rates. Last year was the best year ever for DS in North America, and this year is going at a rate that’s 22% better.
- 22 million DS units sold in North America
- 23 million DS Units sold in Japan
- Purchase/download WiiWare/VC software directly to SD. Transfer process will become ‘dramatically easier’
- More DS units to be shipped in Oct. Nov, Dec
- More Wii units to be shipped in Oct, Nov, Dec
- Reggie doesn’t know if these allotments will be enough to satiate demand
Is the screen's resolution bigger on the DSi? Because browsing the internet on a DS is clumsy at best. Can't see shit you constantly have to be zoomed in way too much.
I didn't see anything about that, but I haven't been looking much. The 320x240 resolution is sticking in my head though, and I can see that being bad. 256x192 is the current resolution, and while it's a 4:5 scale to go there, I can see it being a major development headache trying to make sure your game supports and looks good on both.
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Camera on the hinge facing the player, 640x480 resolution. Camera on the outside of the system, 3 megapixels.
Presumably the hinge inside camera is so that there can be DSi software that allows the player to view and operate screens while taking images of themselves, or maybe sending photos of themselves or some shit. Kind of like a webcam.
The outer 3MP camera is probably more for taking actual photos rather.
Camera on the hinge facing the player, 640x480 resolution. Camera on the outside of the system, 3 megapixels.
Presumably the hinge inside camera is so that there can be DSi software that allows the player to view and operate screens while taking images of themselves, or maybe sending photos of themselves or some shit. Kind of like a webcam.
The outer 3MP camera is probably more for taking actual photos rather.
I thought that was mis-read and that it was only 0.3 MP. Thought I read that somewhere. If it is 3 MP, that's fucking fantastic.
Camera on the hinge facing the player, 640x480 resolution. Camera on the outside of the system, 3 megapixels.
Presumably the hinge inside camera is so that there can be DSi software that allows the player to view and operate screens while taking images of themselves, or maybe sending photos of themselves or some shit. Kind of like a webcam.
The outer 3MP camera is probably more for taking actual photos rather.
I thought that was mis-read and that it was only 0.3 MP. Thought I read that somewhere. If it is 3 MP, that's fucking fantastic.
The hinge camera is .3 megapixels, the outside camera is 3 megapixels.
640x480 resolution is 0.3 megapixels. That is the hinge camera, the inside one.
The outside camera is 3 mega pixels. Or appx. 2048x1536.
The miscommunication was about how many cameras there are, and what resolution each is. There are 2 cameras. .3 and 3.
Camera on the hinge facing the player, 640x480 resolution. Camera on the outside of the system, 3 megapixels.
Presumably the hinge inside camera is so that there can be DSi software that allows the player to view and operate screens while taking images of themselves, or maybe sending photos of themselves or some shit. Kind of like a webcam.
The outer 3MP camera is probably more for taking actual photos rather.
I thought that was mis-read and that it was only 0.3 MP. Thought I read that somewhere. If it is 3 MP, that's fucking fantastic.
The hinge camera is .3 megapixels, the outside camera is 3 megapixels.
640x480 resolution is 0.3 megapixels. That is the hinge camera, the inside one.
The outside camera is 3 mega pixels. Or appx. 2048x1536.
The miscommunication was about how many cameras there are, and what resolution each is. There are 2 cameras. .3 and 3.
Ah, I see. Am I mistaken, or does that make its camera better than the one on the iPhone?
Having done only a quick scan of the news, I'm seeing a VC-DS thing going on. Any chance of games that I've already purchased being usable on the new version?
Camera on the hinge facing the player, 640x480 resolution. Camera on the outside of the system, 3 megapixels.
Presumably the hinge inside camera is so that there can be DSi software that allows the player to view and operate screens while taking images of themselves, or maybe sending photos of themselves or some shit. Kind of like a webcam.
The outer 3MP camera is probably more for taking actual photos rather.
I thought that was mis-read and that it was only 0.3 MP. Thought I read that somewhere. If it is 3 MP, that's fucking fantastic.
The hinge camera is .3 megapixels, the outside camera is 3 megapixels.
640x480 resolution is 0.3 megapixels. That is the hinge camera, the inside one.
The outside camera is 3 mega pixels. Or appx. 2048x1536.
The miscommunication was about how many cameras there are, and what resolution each is. There are 2 cameras. .3 and 3.
Ah, I see. Am I mistaken, or does that make its camera better than the one on the iPhone?
I think the iPhone has a 2 megapixel camera, but I could be wrong. Megapixel isn't the only measure of a digicam's quality though, but at least 3 megapixels is pretty sufficient for resolution at least.
hm. I don't have a portable music player or a digital camera, I don't play many GBA games, and my current DS lite's hinge is cracked.
I think they made the new DS for me.
And I can keep the old DS lite around for anything that might pop up, it's not like you immediately have to sell your old DS just to buy the new one. Hell, I still have my old gray (yellow) brick gameboy.
hm. I don't have a portable music player or a digital camera, I don't play many GBA games, and my current DS lite's hinge is cracked.
I think they made the new DS for me.
And I can keep the old DS lite around for anything that might pop up, it's not like you immediately have to sell your old DS just to buy the new one. Hell, I still have my old gray (yellow) brick gameboy.
Yeah, I have full intentions of buying this on day one, but like hell will I sell my DS Lite. I'll keep it around to play the random GBA game, and because I tend to collect game systems anyway. Only one I've owned that I traded in and have not currently re-bought was the gamecube, and that's just because the Wii's BC was just so damned perfect, I saw zero need to hold onto the Cube.
9:19: As far as 2008 is concerned, the DSi story is strictly Japan-related. We will not see the product in North America until "well into" 2009, because there's still "huge demand"
9:19: As far as 2008 is concerned, the DSi story is strictly Japan-related. We will not see the product in North America until "well into" 2009, because there's still "huge demand"
Read: The American dollar is still crap vs. other nations. I'd put the cursory $5 bet that Europe will see this before NA. They straight up said that Europe is getting more Wii Fit because it's making Nintendo more money, right?
Alright, stop me if I'm wrong here guys, but if the hinge cam takes 640x480 pictures/videos... and is used to use those pictures in games or possibly streaming video chat with other DS owners... wouldn't it follow that the new screens will also be 640x480?
If so, why isn't it a bulletpoint? You'd think they'd at least mention how they cranked it up to SDTV resolution. And how that WOULD make DSi-exclusive games look quite a bit nicer.
9:19: As far as 2008 is concerned, the DSi story is strictly Japan-related. We will not see the product in North America until "well into" 2009, because there's still "huge demand"
I'm thinking of this as like a transitional system. Basically, just a final revision of the DS, with some features that are likely to be implemented in the true DS2 (namely the VC stuff, but maybe the camera as well). The DS will have been out what, 5 years when the DSi arrives? Sounds about right.
Basically, if you've had the DS since launch, and the extra crap appeals to you, buy the DSi. If not, just wait for the DS2. I'd wager the next "true" DS would be compatible with DS and DSi games (if there are any that are exclusive), anyway.
Yeah, I think I'm going to pass on this unless my current DS Lite dies between now and when this gets released. I already have a camera and an iPod, and I'm happy with the battery life and library of games for the DS.
9:19: As far as 2008 is concerned, the DSi story is strictly Japan-related. We will not see the product in North America until "well into" 2009, because there's still "huge demand"
Which is funny, because with the numbers they showed, Japan technically outsold the US on DS units by about 1 million. I suppose I understand that they don't want to release it too early, and miss out on all of those potential DS purchases, it just doesn't seem like the demand here is any higher than it is in Japan.
You know what, the internet is so full of misinformation, I could be wrong about the outer camera. I thought the outer camera was 3MP but there's just as much chance of it not being 3MP.
It would make sense, to me, that with 2 separate cameras, they would opt for a 'good one' on the outside, and reserve the tiny hinge one for random shit.
But now I have no idea after looking over the web.
Wii U sucks, but my NNID is da66en. Steam is route66. 3DS is 2938-8099-8160.
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Oh snap—if you're not reading the Wired liveblog, Sin & Punishment 2 confirmed for '09 in North America, Rhythm Heaven first half '09...
9:54: Dunaway about to show four "hard-edge" games. First is Age of Empires Mythologies, due November 2008. Second is Tecmo Bowl, same release month. Castlevania: Order of Ecclesia, available October 21. Chrono Trigger, holiday 2008. "Thanksgiving week."
9:55: Last live demo of the day. Fire Emblem DS. 1st half 2009. It's called "Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon." Ha ha, get it? It's "DS" backwards.
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Or they could, hypothetically, create a GBA slot accessory that has an SD reader, and bundle it with a DS game card that overwrites your old DS firmware. This is a lot more likely than a mini-HDD add-on, and could easily be priced around $50.
I don't think either will happen.
It's bullshit if anyone says the added features are less than the added feature jump the DS Lite made. I don't care about whether or not they are useful to you. The point is the upgrade is bigger than what the DS Lite's upgrade over the original DS.
Hell, my copy of Streets of Rage 2 is a 360 game. Sure there's a version of it on the Genesis, but I can't play it on that. Because I bought the 360 one. The simple fact that I have to turn on my 360 in order to play it makes it a 360 game. Just because Gradius was originally released on the NES doesn't magically make my copy on the Wii a NES game. It's a Wii game that plays only on the Wii system.
But enough about this DSi nonsense. New Picross? 3D PICROSS?? Someone please link me to details ASAP.
Except I didnt say that. I said it isnt different enough to warrant the distinction of being a "third pillar". This is what happens when you quote single sentences out of context.
Do we have an official source yet on what the downloadable games are going to be? Things I've been reading haven't said officially anything about the content, only that there's going to be some kind of app store.
Someone's gotta take the bait, baby!
I was responding to your "So no, not bullshit" statement specifically. In any event, I hope you were as critical about the DS Lite as you are about this. But like you said, third pillar.
What the heck does "third pillar" mean? Never seen that phrase before now.
Nintendo originally claimed the DS was a 'third pillar' alongside the GBA and Cube. This makes it no clearer what it means.
They used it when they were pretending that the Game Boy wasn't dead. At that point their 3 pillars were (I believe) GameCube, GBA, and DS.
woooo
No, there's not been anything official that I've seen. This is why this arguement is going nowhere, because we are both going off speculation. All I was trying to say is that the DS will still be able to play DS games released after the release of the DSi. It probably doesn't help that in the course of our debate, I've changed how I see the handheld as a whole. I don't really see it as a slight upgrade, or new iteration. I truly do see it as more of a "DS 1.5." It has some whole new features that are not even capable of being done on the previous DS, and allows for, even if its not implemented, new gameplay features. That said, I believe that if it turns out that the DSi can play games that the DS can't, it's justifiable.
Hell, if nothing else, the $179.99 price point tells me its more than just a minor upgrade. If I'm not mistaken, didn't the DS Lite retail for very close to what the DS was at the time of the Lite's release?
I also said in my post that I like some of the features. It's definately a step up, just not as much as I would have liked. Seems like they are kind of jumping the gun and should just wait and release a DS2 down the road, with more graphical power in addition to the other things.
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As much as I already know I'm going to buy this, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I really wish they would've just waited and actually created a whole new device with increased graphical power and resolution, while including all of the features of the DSi. As for the camera, I thought maybe it was to compete with the iPhone, but seriously, a 0.3 MP camera? What the hell kind of pictures are you going to take with that? Why even bother?
GoNintendo is liveblogging
Well, it looks like the DSi will indeed have exclusive non-retro games!
Wait, no MP3 support?
EDIT: Here's what's here so far:
Similar thing happened to Wii. Supported MP3, then later was removed via firmware update. Can't remember the reason....
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I'm betting licensing. I hear the company that has the rights to the MP3 format can be pretty bitchy.
I didn't see anything about that, but I haven't been looking much. The 320x240 resolution is sticking in my head though, and I can see that being bad. 256x192 is the current resolution, and while it's a 4:5 scale to go there, I can see it being a major development headache trying to make sure your game supports and looks good on both.
Can trade TF2 items or whatever else you're interested in. PM me.
Can trade TF2 items or whatever else you're interested in. PM me.
Camera on the hinge facing the player, 640x480 resolution. Camera on the outside of the system, 3 megapixels.
Presumably the hinge inside camera is so that there can be DSi software that allows the player to view and operate screens while taking images of themselves, or maybe sending photos of themselves or some shit. Kind of like a webcam.
The outer 3MP camera is probably more for taking actual photos rather.
edit: you know what I could be wrong on this
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I thought that was mis-read and that it was only 0.3 MP. Thought I read that somewhere. If it is 3 MP, that's fucking fantastic.
The hinge camera is .3 megapixels, the outside camera is 3 megapixels.
640x480 resolution is 0.3 megapixels. That is the hinge camera, the inside one.
The outside camera is 3 mega pixels. Or appx. 2048x1536.
The miscommunication was about how many cameras there are, and what resolution each is. There are 2 cameras. .3 and 3.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Ah, I see. Am I mistaken, or does that make its camera better than the one on the iPhone?
I think the iPhone has a 2 megapixel camera, but I could be wrong. Megapixel isn't the only measure of a digicam's quality though, but at least 3 megapixels is pretty sufficient for resolution at least.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I think they made the new DS for me.
And I can keep the old DS lite around for anything that might pop up, it's not like you immediately have to sell your old DS just to buy the new one. Hell, I still have my old gray (yellow) brick gameboy.
Yeah, I have full intentions of buying this on day one, but like hell will I sell my DS Lite. I'll keep it around to play the random GBA game, and because I tend to collect game systems anyway. Only one I've owned that I traded in and have not currently re-bought was the gamecube, and that's just because the Wii's BC was just so damned perfect, I saw zero need to hold onto the Cube.
Read: The American dollar is still crap vs. other nations. I'd put the cursory $5 bet that Europe will see this before NA. They straight up said that Europe is getting more Wii Fit because it's making Nintendo more money, right?
If so, why isn't it a bulletpoint? You'd think they'd at least mention how they cranked it up to SDTV resolution. And how that WOULD make DSi-exclusive games look quite a bit nicer.
I'm thinking of this as like a transitional system. Basically, just a final revision of the DS, with some features that are likely to be implemented in the true DS2 (namely the VC stuff, but maybe the camera as well). The DS will have been out what, 5 years when the DSi arrives? Sounds about right.
Basically, if you've had the DS since launch, and the extra crap appeals to you, buy the DSi. If not, just wait for the DS2. I'd wager the next "true" DS would be compatible with DS and DSi games (if there are any that are exclusive), anyway.
Which is funny, because with the numbers they showed, Japan technically outsold the US on DS units by about 1 million. I suppose I understand that they don't want to release it too early, and miss out on all of those potential DS purchases, it just doesn't seem like the demand here is any higher than it is in Japan.
It would make sense, to me, that with 2 separate cameras, they would opt for a 'good one' on the outside, and reserve the tiny hinge one for random shit.
But now I have no idea after looking over the web.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
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I have beat Rygar on the NES and many of you have not.
It's Treasure. Their music always rocks!
edit: wait, is Treasure developing S&P2?
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games