The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
tbloxham on
"That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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TL DRNot at all confident in his reflexive opinions of thingsRegistered Userregular
The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
I respectfully disagree. Just because there isn't a profit incentive to shoot up the police station because this is the USA and not Thunderdome doesn't mean that our petroleum, tobacco, and pharmaceutical companies would feel bad about it.
TL DR on
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KageraImitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered Userregular
edited March 2009
Haha, I'd like to see a drug cartel in power suits and with designer business cards.
The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Hard drugs will never be legalized in the US. It's moronic to really even discuss it.
No it's not, because ideas and people change. When enough people who've had this discussion rise to infuencial positions and lobby for this, it might get on the political agenda.
That doesn't mean it will automatically happen, but at least there's the possibillity of researching the idea and maybe even test it.
Its only not on the political spectrum now because the minority who support the war on drugs are more vocal than the majority who want it to end. Legal Marijuana is at most 10 years away.
Obama says he's not in favor of marijuana legalization.
So if Obama is in power for 8 years, and the next president after him is a Republican or a democrat who is not in favor of it, you have a snowball's chance in hell of legalization in the next 10 years.
Hard drugs will never be legalized in the US. It's moronic to really even discuss it.
No it's not, because ideas and people change. When enough people who've had this discussion rise to infuencial positions and lobby for this, it might get on the political agenda.
That doesn't mean it will automatically happen, but at least there's the possibillity of researching the idea and maybe even test it.
Its only not on the political spectrum now because the minority who support the war on drugs are more vocal than the majority who want it to end. Legal Marijuana is at most 10 years away.
Obama says he's not in favor of marijuana legalization.
So if Obama is in power for 8 years, and the next president after him is a Republican or a democrat who is not in favor of it, you have a snowball's chance in hell of legalization in the next 10 years.
Obama has to say this because he requires the support of powerful pressure groups who oppose drug use. These pressure groups have been weakening for years while advocates for legal drugs become stronger and stronger. Obama has admitted to using Marijuana, so did Bush, so did Clinton. The taboo is all but gone, the law becomes more insane each year.
The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
I respectfully disagree. Just because there isn't a profit incentive to shoot up the police station because this is the USA and not Thunderdome doesn't mean that our petroleum, tobacco, and pharmaceutical companies would feel bad about it.
Well of course they wouldn't corporations don't have emotions, they are engines which exist to make money for their shareholders and owners. They have morals only within the grounds it is profitable to do so. However, when was the last time Coca Cola corporation heavies came round and killed you for drinking Pepsi?
Corporations cannot be good or evil, which is why we have laws which apply to them and distinguish a responsible company from one who will be shut down by the government.
Hard drugs will never be legalized in the US. It's moronic to really even discuss it.
No it's not, because ideas and people change. When enough people who've had this discussion rise to infuencial positions and lobby for this, it might get on the political agenda.
That doesn't mean it will automatically happen, but at least there's the possibillity of researching the idea and maybe even test it.
Its only not on the political spectrum now because the minority who support the war on drugs are more vocal than the majority who want it to end. Legal Marijuana is at most 10 years away.
Obama says he's not in favor of marijuana legalization.
So if Obama is in power for 8 years, and the next president after him is a Republican or a democrat who is not in favor of it, you have a snowball's chance in hell of legalization in the next 10 years.
Obama has to say this because he requires the support of powerful pressure groups who oppose drug use. These pressure groups have been weakening for years while advocates for legal drugs become stronger and stronger. Obama has admitted to using Marijuana, so did Bush, so did Clinton. The taboo is all but gone, the law becomes more insane each year.
God damn you're insane.
Obs on
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MorgensternICH BIN DER PESTVOGELDU KAMPFAFFE!Registered Userregular
edited March 2009
The Coke delivery guy in our building gave me the evil eye when I walked by him drinking a Pepsi a few days ago. I think my days are numbered. I'll be taking a long walk off a short pier for sure!
Morgenstern on
“Every time we walk along a beach some ancient urge disturbs us so that we find ourselves shedding shoes and garments or scavenging among seaweed and whitened timbers like the homesick refugees of a long war.” - Loren Eiseley
Obama has to say this because he requires the support of powerful pressure groups who oppose drug use. These pressure groups have been weakening for years while advocates for legal drugs become stronger and stronger. Obama has admitted to using Marijuana, so did Bush, so did Clinton. The taboo is all but gone, the law becomes more insane each year.
God damn you're insane.
Err, why? Clearly there is strong public demand for its legality, clearly that desire is spreading to more and more people, through more and more segments of the population. The forces opposing it become weaker, those demanding it become stronger. Obama is a servant of the people, in the end even if he truly was against the legalization he must answer to the people. Heck, 'stop the war on drugs' was the 1st and 3rd most popular suggestion in his online suggestions book.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
I respectfully disagree. Just because there isn't a profit incentive to shoot up the police station because this is the USA and not Thunderdome doesn't mean that our petroleum, tobacco, and pharmaceutical companies would feel bad about it.
Well of course they wouldn't corporations don't have emotions, they are engines which exist to make money for their shareholders and owners. They have morals only within the grounds it is profitable to do so. However, when was the last time Coca Cola corporation heavies came round and killed you for drinking Pepsi?
Corporations cannot be good or evil, which is why we have laws which apply to them and distinguish a responsible company from one who will be shut down by the government.
You do know that goons cost money, right? The second the stuff become legalized, the a legal producer will just load the stuff into a plane and ship it straight to the US. And the cartels would have no way to stop them short of laying the production site under siege, which would be such a large action that no police force, no matter how corrupt, would be able to look the other way, especially since an international company can turn something into an international incident.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
I respectfully disagree. Just because there isn't a profit incentive to shoot up the police station because this is the USA and not Thunderdome doesn't mean that our petroleum, tobacco, and pharmaceutical companies would feel bad about it.
Well of course they wouldn't corporations don't have emotions, they are engines which exist to make money for their shareholders and owners. They have morals only within the grounds it is profitable to do so. However, when was the last time Coca Cola corporation heavies came round and killed you for drinking Pepsi?
Corporations cannot be good or evil, which is why we have laws which apply to them and distinguish a responsible company from one who will be shut down by the government.
You do know that goons cost money, right? The second the stuff become legalized, the a legal producer will just load the stuff into a plane and ship it straight to the US. And the cartels would have no way to stop them short of laying the production site under siege, which would be such a large action that no police force, no matter how corrupt, would be able to look the other way, especially since an international company can turn something into an international incident.
Err, I think you might be meaning to argue with someone else, the whole 'Goons and Smugglers are useless to legitimate business' is a cornerstone of my argument as to why any legitimate company is better than a gang of criminals.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
It is illegal under federal law, which means Obama has the right to order federal agents to arrest producers and consumers of medical marijuana. It's a bit of a dick move, but fully within his rights.
The point is that we have existing evil corporations that would gladly crush the upstart cartels if it came to being able to legally sell drugs to americans.
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
I respectfully disagree. Just because there isn't a profit incentive to shoot up the police station because this is the USA and not Thunderdome doesn't mean that our petroleum, tobacco, and pharmaceutical companies would feel bad about it.
Well of course they wouldn't corporations don't have emotions, they are engines which exist to make money for their shareholders and owners. They have morals only within the grounds it is profitable to do so. However, when was the last time Coca Cola corporation heavies came round and killed you for drinking Pepsi?
Corporations cannot be good or evil, which is why we have laws which apply to them and distinguish a responsible company from one who will be shut down by the government.
You do know that goons cost money, right? The second the stuff become legalized, the a legal producer will just load the stuff into a plane and ship it straight to the US. And the cartels would have no way to stop them short of laying the production site under siege, which would be such a large action that no police force, no matter how corrupt, would be able to look the other way, especially since an international company can turn something into an international incident.
Err, I think you might be meaning to argue with someone else, the whole 'Goons and Smugglers are useless to legitimate business' is a cornerstone of my argument as to why any legitimate company is better than a gang of criminals.
Ah, I thought you were arguing that the companies wouldn't be able to crush them.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
I suggest you look up federal law and FDA regulations if you think medicinal marijuana isn't criminalized. There is no such thing as a "legally licensed" distributor of marijuana according to the federal government. Holder taking a stand on this is decriminalization. It is, in fact, the definition of "decriminalization."
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
It is illegal under federal law, which means Obama has the right to order federal agents to arrest producers and consumers of medical marijuana. It's a bit of a dick move, but fully within his rights.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
tbloxham on
"That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
It is illegal under federal law, which means Obama has the right to order federal agents to arrest producers and consumers of medical marijuana. It's a bit of a dick move, but fully within his rights.
He still reserves the right.
The point of that exchange was that Medical Marijuana is technically criminalized. But law enforcement doesn't go out of its way to find it. Which is basically a de facto decriminalization.
Fencingsax on
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TL DRNot at all confident in his reflexive opinions of thingsRegistered Userregular
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
It is illegal under federal law, which means Obama has the right to order federal agents to arrest producers and consumers of medical marijuana. It's a bit of a dick move, but fully within his rights.
He still reserves the right.
...which has nothing to do with the conversation. Especially since it was the Obama administration that put a stop to the DEA raids.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
This is already happening, the only difference is law enforcement has its hands full with relatively harmless drugs.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
This is already happening, the only difference is law enforcement has its hands full with relatively harmless drugs.
Well then clearly the solution is to get more law enforcement. Not give the fuck up.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
This is already happening, the only difference is law enforcement has its hands full with relatively harmless drugs.
Well then clearly the solution is to get more law enforcement. Not give the fuck up.
That solution has about as much depth as the 'just decriminalize and everything will be fine' message you're ranting against.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
There is only so much demand for really hard drugs, if marijuana cartels suddenly shift operations to another drug, the cartels that primarily deal in that drug will take offense. They will devour each other similar to how the mob did.
Sure there would still be a net increase of "hard drug" sellers, however this would be at the expense of every cartel and criminal who sells marijuana illegally. You're talking a penny of meth labs for a pound of growers.
This is ignoring those going legit, you're really going to suggest someone like "Jimmy the Stabber" runs these operations? The individual organizations are generally run be competent individuals, if they see that selling pot illegally won't be good but they could profitably shift their operation to being a legal distributer, they would. They would see a huge hit in their bottom line, but then again no longer would they have to pay money launderers, crooked cops, smugglers, and enforcers.
Jimmy would be out of work, and competing with all the other out of work thugs in a much smaller market. This will lead to lots of dead thugs.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
The word medical there is significant, even if "medical" is a weak word in actual application.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
The word medical there is significant, even if "medical" is a weak word in actual application.
I didn't say it's the be-all and end-all of decriminalization. I said it's a small step. Which it is.
Well, the Obama administration has already taken one step towards decriminalization. It's certainly not the be-all and end-all, but I think a lot of smaller steps like this will basically turn into de facto legalization, with no one actually enforcing the laws against it.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
Stopping law enforcement from arresting & prosecuting people who sell something that is criminalized isn't decriminalization?
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
I know a pot dealer and I think he would be quite offended at your description of him.
Of course, he's 18, and an honors student, and probably one of many pot dealers who is frankly scared of people dealing the harder stuff and is completely uninterested in dealing anything other than weed. If weed is legalized, he's probably getting out of the business, maybe selling his excess stock to whatever store comes up. Hell, maybe he becomes the store.
In conclusion, Thanatos is right, you're nuts. Or your plan works, only now half the nation is in prison, which isn't really a solution at all.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
This is already happening, the only difference is law enforcement has its hands full with relatively harmless drugs.
Well then clearly the solution is to get more law enforcement. Not give the fuck up.
If we legalize Marijuana we have effectively created more law enforcement for free, even if we do keep the other drugs illegal (which I don't think we should).
A dangerous product exists which causes inherant harm to its users, and to noone else. The use of this product cannot be stopped, it is impossible. Attempting to prevent people using this product transmutes it from one which causes only personal harm to the user to one which causes unimaginable destruction to society, for an ever increasing cost and is destroying whole nations.
Should this product be made illegal?
Your analogy is also silly. People aren't taking Marijuana just because its the tamest illegal drug. They are taking it because they like it. Making it illegal doesn't make them switch to crack. In fact, it makes them more likely to stick with Marijuana. Furthermore, due to the utter failure of the war on drugs to impact anything but my taxes being spent on something useful, its trivial to get and use Marijuana. Other than the inconvenience and cost its no harder than buying a packet of gum.
The war on drugs is unwinnable, unaffordable, and achieves nothing good. Noone has not smoked, noone has not taken crack. All it has done is kill tens of thousands, destroy neighborhoods, and ruin lives.
My imaginary drug dealer Jimmy can't be a thug without cash. He can't impress young underprivilaged youth without cash. He can't buy guns, and pay his enforcers without cash. Remove his access to cash and you remove his access to power and influence.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization?
Someone who wants to make money selling drugs and who doesn't care how dangerous the drug is is already selling hard drugs, because pot has a much worse profit margin than crack, heroin, or meth. Hell, Jimmy would be making much better money selling black market OxyContin than he ever would selling pot.
Amazing the way this thread flits around like a moth with ADD. Are some states in the US more louche when it comes to the weed compared to others?
And also the real forthcoming problemos (which is Mexican for problems) will surely be resource and sex wars. The two emerging heavy hitters India and China have a massive hunger for the things we take for granted like plastic bags and a decent choice of whom we'd like to bang; whereas they have scant resources of both, due to their obsession with having lots of sons, very few daughters and fuck all oil.
Posts
Well, yes our corporations are quite evil, but they are not Drug Cartel evil for the most part.
I respectfully disagree. Just because there isn't a profit incentive to shoot up the police station because this is the USA and not Thunderdome doesn't mean that our petroleum, tobacco, and pharmaceutical companies would feel bad about it.
God bless America!
Obama says he's not in favor of marijuana legalization.
So if Obama is in power for 8 years, and the next president after him is a Republican or a democrat who is not in favor of it, you have a snowball's chance in hell of legalization in the next 10 years.
Obama has to say this because he requires the support of powerful pressure groups who oppose drug use. These pressure groups have been weakening for years while advocates for legal drugs become stronger and stronger. Obama has admitted to using Marijuana, so did Bush, so did Clinton. The taboo is all but gone, the law becomes more insane each year.
Well of course they wouldn't corporations don't have emotions, they are engines which exist to make money for their shareholders and owners. They have morals only within the grounds it is profitable to do so. However, when was the last time Coca Cola corporation heavies came round and killed you for drinking Pepsi?
Corporations cannot be good or evil, which is why we have laws which apply to them and distinguish a responsible company from one who will be shut down by the government.
God damn you're insane.
Err, why? Clearly there is strong public demand for its legality, clearly that desire is spreading to more and more people, through more and more segments of the population. The forces opposing it become weaker, those demanding it become stronger. Obama is a servant of the people, in the end even if he truly was against the legalization he must answer to the people. Heck, 'stop the war on drugs' was the 1st and 3rd most popular suggestion in his online suggestions book.
Man, stopping raids on legally licensed distributors of medical marijuana is hardly a step toward decriminalization. That's just correcting some stupid policies that didn't make sense. I'm not in favor of drug legalization or decriminalization and even I agree with that.
You're going to have to explain this to me more slowly.
You do know that goons cost money, right? The second the stuff become legalized, the a legal producer will just load the stuff into a plane and ship it straight to the US. And the cartels would have no way to stop them short of laying the production site under siege, which would be such a large action that no police force, no matter how corrupt, would be able to look the other way, especially since an international company can turn something into an international incident.
Medical Marijuana is not criminalized if it's to be used for medical use and the distributor is legally licensed to prescribe it to others for MEDICAL USE. Shit man, it doesn't make sense to make something legal if you're just going to get raided for it anyway.
Now if they are giving it out like candy to any pothead then they should be put with their hands on the wall and shot in the backs.
Err, I think you might be meaning to argue with someone else, the whole 'Goons and Smugglers are useless to legitimate business' is a cornerstone of my argument as to why any legitimate company is better than a gang of criminals.
It is illegal under federal law, which means Obama has the right to order federal agents to arrest producers and consumers of medical marijuana. It's a bit of a dick move, but fully within his rights.
Ah, I thought you were arguing that the companies wouldn't be able to crush them.
He still reserves the right.
Why? Since it is well documented that weed has no dangerous side effects beyond those possessed by Alcohol, Smoking, Prescription Drugs, Overeating or any of the other multitude of things we allow the only reason for it to be illegal is that 'drugs are bad'
Allowing medical use is a huge step towards decriminalization and legalization. Do you realize the sheer number of conditions marijuana is good for? The sheer number of Americans who could create a medical reason to take it for any number of chronic pain conditions? Allowing medical use allows the growth of a legal marijuana industry. Soon this industry will be making millions of dollars, and it will want to be making billions.
A 'pothead' can get his weed in 30 minutes from a drug dealer no matter where he is in the US. Whether he be in the White House or in a maximum security prison you could get drugs faster than getting a pizza. I'd rather he bought it from a doctor than from Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone and his gang of thieves and criminals in the local bad part of town, since Jimmy will use the money to fund extortion, prostitution and destruction of the local area and the doctor will pay his taxes and then spend the profits buying a Turkey or something.
...which has nothing to do with the conversation. Especially since it was the Obama administration that put a stop to the DEA raids.
And let me ask you, what do you think people like Jimmy 'the stabber' Malone will do when his marijuana business is now tits up thanks to legalization? You think he's just going to lay down and die? Or work some shit job at McDonalds or in a cubicle like a some kind of fucking pussy? Or maybe he'll try to go legit with his weed, even though the margins will be too low? Fuck no. He's going to move on to the bigger shit, the real shit. The kind of shit that destroys people. He's going to be selling crack cocaine like it's the new weed. He gets a hold of heroin and crystal meth, and the communities will be fucking wrecked. Gang wars will set the streets ablaze. And yet Jimmy will continue to make money until he pisses off the wrong guy and someone comes and puts a fucking bullet in his head and lays him to rest once and for all, leaving him and his posse face down dead in the rain for the police to find the next morning. His blood washing away into a sidewalk sewer drain.
This, will not do.
This is already happening, the only difference is law enforcement has its hands full with relatively harmless drugs.
If I'm insane, then I don't want to be sane.
Well then clearly the solution is to get more law enforcement. Not give the fuck up.
There is only so much demand for really hard drugs, if marijuana cartels suddenly shift operations to another drug, the cartels that primarily deal in that drug will take offense. They will devour each other similar to how the mob did.
Sure there would still be a net increase of "hard drug" sellers, however this would be at the expense of every cartel and criminal who sells marijuana illegally. You're talking a penny of meth labs for a pound of growers.
This is ignoring those going legit, you're really going to suggest someone like "Jimmy the Stabber" runs these operations? The individual organizations are generally run be competent individuals, if they see that selling pot illegally won't be good but they could profitably shift their operation to being a legal distributer, they would. They would see a huge hit in their bottom line, but then again no longer would they have to pay money launderers, crooked cops, smugglers, and enforcers.
Jimmy would be out of work, and competing with all the other out of work thugs in a much smaller market. This will lead to lots of dead thugs.
Like we did with prohibition?
No wait I think it's sad.
The word medical there is significant, even if "medical" is a weak word in actual application.
I know a pot dealer and I think he would be quite offended at your description of him.
Of course, he's 18, and an honors student, and probably one of many pot dealers who is frankly scared of people dealing the harder stuff and is completely uninterested in dealing anything other than weed. If weed is legalized, he's probably getting out of the business, maybe selling his excess stock to whatever store comes up. Hell, maybe he becomes the store.
In conclusion, Thanatos is right, you're nuts. Or your plan works, only now half the nation is in prison, which isn't really a solution at all.
If we legalize Marijuana we have effectively created more law enforcement for free, even if we do keep the other drugs illegal (which I don't think we should).
A dangerous product exists which causes inherant harm to its users, and to noone else. The use of this product cannot be stopped, it is impossible. Attempting to prevent people using this product transmutes it from one which causes only personal harm to the user to one which causes unimaginable destruction to society, for an ever increasing cost and is destroying whole nations.
Should this product be made illegal?
Your analogy is also silly. People aren't taking Marijuana just because its the tamest illegal drug. They are taking it because they like it. Making it illegal doesn't make them switch to crack. In fact, it makes them more likely to stick with Marijuana. Furthermore, due to the utter failure of the war on drugs to impact anything but my taxes being spent on something useful, its trivial to get and use Marijuana. Other than the inconvenience and cost its no harder than buying a packet of gum.
The war on drugs is unwinnable, unaffordable, and achieves nothing good. Noone has not smoked, noone has not taken crack. All it has done is kill tens of thousands, destroy neighborhoods, and ruin lives.
My imaginary drug dealer Jimmy can't be a thug without cash. He can't impress young underprivilaged youth without cash. He can't buy guns, and pay his enforcers without cash. Remove his access to cash and you remove his access to power and influence.
Someone who wants to make money selling drugs and who doesn't care how dangerous the drug is is already selling hard drugs, because pot has a much worse profit margin than crack, heroin, or meth. Hell, Jimmy would be making much better money selling black market OxyContin than he ever would selling pot.
And also the real forthcoming problemos (which is Mexican for problems) will surely be resource and sex wars. The two emerging heavy hitters India and China have a massive hunger for the things we take for granted like plastic bags and a decent choice of whom we'd like to bang; whereas they have scant resources of both, due to their obsession with having lots of sons, very few daughters and fuck all oil.
Sex wars.